Android App Quality Pathetically Low Says Developer

Hugh Pickens writes "Christopher Mims writes at MIT Technology Review that Mika Mobile, developer of Battleheart, a big hit on both the iOS and Android platforms, says that 'a polished, high quality product is more likely to be embraced on Android than on iOS because the quality bar on the android market is so pathetically low.' Evidence to that effect comes from the fact that 'on iOS, user reviews for Battleheart average 4.5 stars (4000 total ratings), which is quite good. On Android it's a stunning 4.8, with 1000 ratings,' writes the developer. 'So not only is it reviewed more highly, it's also reviewed more often, with a huge percentage of android users taking the time to rate the app. I think the lack of competition makes quality apps really stand out, and generates a lot of enthusiasm from app-starved android users." Mika Mobile adds that the most frustrating part about developing for Android is dealing with the deluge of support e-mail, most of which is related to download and installation problems which have nothing to do with the app itself, and everything to do with the Android OS and market having innate technical problems. 'Do some googling for "can't download apps from android market" or similar wording, and you'll see that this is a widespread chronic issue for all devices and all OS versions,' writes the developer. 'Based on the amount of e-mails I get every day, download problems effect 1-2% of all buyers, or in more practical terms, somewhere between two and three s**t-loads.'"

Comments

99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[elrous0]

In other news:

• Film director reports that most movies suck ass.
• Musician reports that most music is subpar at best.
• Writer reports that most writers are not all that, much less a bag of chips.
• Person reports that most people are boring dipshits.
• Slashdot poster reports that most Slashdot comments are garbage, just fucking garbage.

Stay tuned for tomorrow's report: "Everything Was Better When I Was Younger, Reports Random Asshole on Street"

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[dziban303]

You should apply for a job at the Onion. Seriously, this bullshit is better than their bullshit.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[SnarfQuest]

FWIW: If carpenters built buildings like programmers write programs, then the first woodpecker to come around would destroy civilization.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[elrous0]

"Scientists Discover Onion Writer Who's Not Obnoxious, Cynical Prick"

"We were are surprised as everyone else," says lead scientist.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[elrous0]

Yeah, we went ahead and replaced your joists with spaghetti and your foundation with Jello...but we think we can make it work, with a few patches and bugfixes.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[GooberToo]

That's a popular myth. The simple truth is, programmers are typically not to blame.

If carpenters built buildings like companies and managers mandate programmers write programs (thanks Microsoft for getting the ball rolling), then the first woodpecker to come around would destroy civilization.

Fixed that for you.

So basically, if civilization falls, you can thank Microsoft for lowering the bar.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[MogNuts]

Hah ain't it the truth.

On a more serious note, this article should have been put in the Firehose. We've all just been trolled by this garbage. Most smartphone apps, regardless of platform, are crap. I have an iPhone. I'd venture to say that most apps that aren't games are:

1) Buggy and crash

2) Have majorly stripped down features or no features at all to make it worthless. For example: the Myspace app or the Google Voice app. They're simple web services, and therefore should easily be transported to a smartphone with all the features. Yet with the apps *you can't even do a simple delete a message or change an option in the settings.*

Honestly I've come to the conclusion that apps (unless they're good productivity ones like Google Maps, Apple Mail, or DataViz office thing) aren't the revolutionary useful thing they're touted, but just plain time wasters. Look at that article on Techcrunch recently. Like 72% of apps people use were games and social network apps. Only 9 percent were productivity that did anything.

Apps are the new "screw around with cuz im bored" crap.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Stay tuned for tomorrow's report: "Everything Was Better When I Was Younger, Reports Random Asshole on Street"

"Today's cantankerous curmudgeons aren't a patch on the cantankerous curmudgeons you got when I was a lad. You call that griping? That's not even mumbling discontentedly! If you want griping, you should have talked to old "Jawbone" Perkins. Now there was a man who could complain about falling standards! Why, I remember a time when he heard about this new car ...."

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[Altus]

That is an understandable way to feel, but if you really think about the level of complexity, nothing a carpenter does is nearly as complex as most applications. If you thought of ever line of code as a single piece of clockwork connected with other pieces of clockwork, an average application would be a clockwork construction about the size of a tractor trailer. The level of complexity is actually kind of staggering when you think about it. I'm often amazed that software works as well as it does.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[element-o.p.]

While the MS-bashing was perhaps a little gratuitous (and I can bash MS with the best of them), his point remains valid, at least in my admittedly limited experience. I personally have seen this happen to a friend of mine who is a very conscientious, very talented programmer. The sales department at a company where we both worked came to IT to ask if it was possible to provide a feature that a particular, high-dollar customer had requested. The IT manager asked my friend if it was possible to implement the feature, and if so, how long it would take to develop it. My friend analyzed the requirements and said three months, but don't sell the feature until they had a chance to lock down the requirements a little tighter. The manager went back to sales and told them yes it was possible, it would take at least three months to implement and DO NOT sell the feature until all the details had been ironed out. So what did the sales department do? You guessed it -- they sold the feature to the customer with a due date of something like two weeks.

When your sales department is focused exclusively on getting a signature on a contract, rather than making the customer happy long term, you get impossible deadlines and pure fantasy feature requests. And why not? Sales doesn't have to build the app since IT does that, they don't have to deal with customers who are pissed off because what they bought doesn't work because customer service gets those calls, and since they got the sale, they got their commission.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[mwvdlee]

If programmers wrote programs like carpenters built buildings, the program would just sit there with only a single button on screen that, when pressed, triggers the sound of a doorbell.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[BitZtream]

Yea, blaming someone else because you didn't do your job is always the sign of a winner.

The carpenter could refuse to build the house you know, he/she does have free will.

Blaming it on management is just an attempt to hide the fact that you were unable to show your manager why what they wanted was a bad idea.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[element-o.p.]

There are a few exceptions for the Android that I can think of off the top of my head: 1) Connectbot (SSH client) and 2) Wyse Pocket Cloud (RDP client). Both work pretty well and are tools I use at work on my Dell tablet. And, as you mentioned, the Google Maps/Navigator app is pretty useful. I've also been happy with Speedview, a GPS-based speedometer and odometer. I've got a mount for my HTC Hero on the handlebars of my motorcycle, and I use Speedview to give me an arguably more accurate speedometer than the analog gauge on my bike (the V-Strom speedometer is out by about 10% according to Internet wisdom and my own personal experience). Then, of course, I also added both the Kindle and Nook apps which seem to work pretty well. There are probably more apps, but those are the ones I can think of off the top of my head...but then, I tend not to be a games person.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[DarwinSurvivor]

Good lord, 2 +2 Trolls in a row!

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[s73v3r]

While I agree mostly, there are also a lot of crappy programmers that do crappy work all on their own.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[s73v3r]

Perhaps sales needs a reverse-commission as well. For every sale they get by promising things that just aren't possible, they also have to pay back the commission if the deadline is slipped.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[s73v3r]

The carpenter could refuse to build the house you know, he/she does have free will.

Yeah? He also has a family to feed, house, and clothe. Get off your fucking high horse.

Blaming it on management is just an attempt to hide the fact that you were unable to show your manager why what they wanted was a bad idea.

Because management always listens, right?

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[elrous0]

GOSUB "I also miss gosub"
EXIT

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[WitnessForTheOffense]

Then it was management's fault for hiring incompetent programmers. Hiring departments are frequently incapable of vetting the skills of candidates for highly technical positions, so it falls on the managers to do so. The managers rarely become managers due to their ability to do the job of their subordinates well. It's the Dilbert Principle.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[BeanThere]

you really think about the level of complexity, nothing a carpenter does is nearly as complex as most applications

That is true, but if you've ever actually worked in the programming industry, you would probably have to admit that the majority of bugs are not caused by programmers being 'overwhelmed by the awesome complexity of it all', but rather by plain old sloppiness. How many times do we see things like "oh I'm sure these few lines of code I've just written will work, I'll just commit them without even testing if the program still runs" or mistakes due to interruptions by "it's 5 o clock, I'm outta here" or "reading /. is more interesting than testing". These problems have nothing to do with the complexity of it all. An analogy would be if you 'blmaed' a typo like that, on the complexity of the English language. The English language may be complex, but typnig lke this is jsut sloppiness.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[Com2Kid]

Seriously dude. Tone down the anger some, and study history some more.

You might want to start off with the essay The Rise of "Worse is Better". It lays out a pretty consistent reasoning for why quick to release, flexible software wins the day. It doesn't have to have all the features that are possible, it doesn't have to be 100% stable. Software that is in users hands NOW and enables them to be productive is worth infinitely more than bug free (or even just "far less buggy") software that may be available some date in the future.

All large software projects have huge lists of bugs. Heck you can even take estimated metrics of Bugs/Line of Code. Even with really damn good coders, once you have millions of lines of code Bugs/LOC is going to bite you in the ass.

Managers and companies set schedules - not programmers.

This is true for everybody in a company. Their job and delivery schedule is based upon the needs of the company.

Marketing idiots says we need feature x because he has a hard-on and absolutely no basis to demand feature x.

Typically some large customer who is willing to pay large sums of money is requesting the feature. Those same large sums of money go to pay your salary. In some cases, especially for one off features, it may be the case that a large company will have a work stoppage if the feature isn't implemented. Or perhaps the software package is not nearly of as much use to them without that feature.

Your job is to make USABLE software. Software that isn't usable isn't worth anything to anyone.

Programmers do their best to create feature in y duration. Its buggy. This is known. The company releases it anyways.

If a company continues with that practice, eventually they will get a reputation for writing low quality software and they will find themselves in a poor financial situation.

In regards to how much Microsoft is to blame for this, have you taken a look at any other enterprise software vendors? Be it Java2 EE, SAS, or IBMs latest and greatest product, enterprise software development is an ugly picture no matter who is producing the tool chain.

(Actually J2EE can be done properly if you have the right people in charge, I am pretty sure SAS and LOTUS are always horrid horrid things to get close to however. :) )

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[psithurism]

I do work in the industry, and you're right that must bugs are caused by sloppiness and inattentiveness. Those bugs are easy to solve and show up in early testing and code reviews. It's the complexity ones that make you spend a whole week with something like "tried to fix bug #104: still 0% percent complete" as your team's current tasking. Or worse, show up a week after delivery. Those bugs are usually complexity related and half of the time deal with unpublished limitations of 3rd party libraries.

I've also done some amateur carpentry: I suck at it, but the nice thing is that usually you can look at something later and say, "That panel is crooked, why don't I pull it off and redo it?" You don't usually have to spend days testing and debating about which panel might be crooked and call vendors to find out whether your tools are working like they are supposed to.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[swalve]

Not to sheep who are too afraid to bleat, they don't.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[davester666]

> "We were are surprised as everyone else," says lead scientist.

Who cares what a chemical engineer thinks.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[BeanThere]

That is somewhat true, except I have found the reality to be more along the lines of "I am here at 3am and I'm supposed to be working on the complex 1-week bug, except I'm spending my time fixing various stupid little bugs because other asshats were sloppy and committed broken crap and left".

But that said, carpentry is probably indeed much simpler ... if you're busy making a chair, I imagine far less can go wrong if you interrupt your work at 5pm and continue the next day, and a missing semicolon can't break your entire chair.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[zeroshade]

They also don't listen to anyone who doesn't agree with their point of view, well...if they're a bad manager which is most likely the case.

Re:99% of everything is crap, says everyone

[Have Brain Will Rent]

"We were are surprised as everyone else," says lead scientist.

Heavy, man.

Title

[Ltap]

Android App Quality Pathetically Low SaysDeveloper

Title Quality Pathetically Low, Says Commenter.

Re:Title

[delinear]

I was thinking more "Developer figures out way to get plenty of eyeballs on his press release (by mentioning Android and iOS) which just happens to mention how highly his game is rated on the two systems", but I guess that was too long and not nearly inflammatory enough. Seriously, though, blatant slashvertisement wrapped up in flamebait language to generate lots of clicks - pretty much par for the course.

Re:Title

[meloneg]

Android App Quality Pathetically Low SaysDeveloper

Title Quality Pathetically Low, SaysCommenter.

FTFY

Re:Title

[Gaygirlie]

Android App Quality Pathetically Low SaysDeveloper

Title Quality Pathetically Low, Says Commenter.

Both are correct, though.

Re:Title

[iamhassi]

I was thinking more "Developer figures out way to get plenty of eyeballs on his press release (by mentioning Android and iOS) which just happens to mention how highly his game is rated on the two systems", but I guess that was too long and not nearly inflammatory enough. Seriously, though, blatant slashvertisement wrapped up in flamebait language to generate lots of clicks - pretty much par for the course.

finally someone figures it out. I also love how he has 4 times the reviews on iOS which probably means he has 4 times the downloads or more since he admits more people are writing reviews of android than they do iOS version, then says android support is a nightmare, but concludes developers should still write android apps because the quality bar is so low. WTH? Thanks, but I think I'll choose the platform with more sales and less support issues. He'd make a great iPhone salesmen.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Do people pay money for Android apps?

[timeOday]

My impression was iPhone users are more likely to pay (if only $1 or $2) for apps, whereas android users are less so - is there any truth to that? People making more money developing their apps surely work harder on them.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[OliWarner]

I don't have an iPhone but have spent around £50 on applications for my Android in the two months I've had it. Perhaps my behaviour is just a side-effect of being app-starved on my Nokia N900.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[BrokenHalo]

I have paid out for just a handful of Android apps, but only after having tried them out beforehand in demo or ad-supported versions. Since I've been a denizen of the Linux/BSD world for over 15 years, I find it goes against the grain to pay for software - not because I am a cheapskate, but because I prefer the Free model. But I figure that for an an application that I use several times a day, I can afford the modest cost to reward the developer for his efforts.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[AndyAndyAndyAndy]

I'm most likely to spend a few dollars on any app that's worth it and will be useful to me. Differentiating between users of two distinct but very similar marketplaces only opens up the conversation for flaming, fanboying, and stereotyping.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[jedrek]

Talk to any company that develops for both Android and iOS, ask them which platform makes them more money. See if you can compare income to phone market penetration.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Anonymous Coward]

This is largely an unknown and can't be known because of the current model.
 
A user in this thread mentions Angry Birds. We can't compare the culture since there is no pay version for Android. I'm not sure about an ad supported version for the iPhone. But I will say as an Android user that I would have been much more willing to pay for Angry Birds and have gotten rid of the ads. I think the price was 5 dollars on iTunes. I would have paid that with no issues. Instead I got a clunky version compared to what the iPhone users got. It was slower and jerky because of loading ads and the ads got in the way of game play. So, yes, Android got a lesser quality version of the same app because of ad support.
 
I hate to say it but I think this is the case in general. Ad support makes apps slower and takes up screen real estate compared to the same app that has no ad support. That's a no brainer. This is going to hurt Android apps as long as there is an idea that Android users are unwilling to pay for apps simply because of the culture that exists today. It has hurt it enough that I'm considering going with iPhone or even WinPhone soon. I have an upgrade to use from Verizon and I want to get it in before the tiered data plans come into effect and I'm really having a hard time saying yes to another Android phone because of the apps and their ad support. I know that won't get me any friends here but I have to come clean and say it.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Anonymous Coward]

Speaking as someone who developed for both and posting anon so as not 'spam'. I have some utilities for both iOS and Android available. The best selling one (a network utility, subnet calc, etc. all in one) had consistently pulled in ~$3k/month from the AppStore, that's after Apple's cut. Android, on the other hand, nets ~$150/month yet has approximately 3.5 times the installs. That's due to rampant piracy. The software still does auto-checks for versions which is how I know.

Guess where I'm concentrating my efforts for my next project....

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[tepples]

The other Anonymous Coward appears to want "guidance" in which "Google" keywords to try: rovio angry birds ad revenue

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Jahf]

That AC isn't making more shit up ... you, Mr. AC, are just too lazy to Google. A quick Google of "angry birds android ad revenue" pulled up a PAGES full of results similar to this one:

http://www.intomobile.com/2010/12/03/angry-birds-android-1-million-ad-revenue/

Is that black bomb egg on your face, or is it from a flock of blues?

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[gaspyy]

"dude"?

Rovio is not a one-man show, the team is pretty big.

Also, citation needed.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[KiloByte]

You mean, the entire Debian is too little for you?

Some GUI programs are unusable due to assumption that the vertical resolution is much bigger than 480, and some fail badly due to quirks of Hildon widgets, but in general, you can do everything you would be able to do on a Pentium III 256MB ram 32GB disk laptop. No graphic accelerator since it has OpenGLES while most 3D games/etc expect OpenGL, but that's mostly due to bad proprietary display drivers. In the future, even that won't be a problem even if no sane drivers pop up, since SDL 1.3 and Wayland have GLES backends.

Another annoying issue against N900 is the set of default keymappings. I wonder WTF Nokia was thinking, not assigning basics like PgUp, PgDn, Esc, [, ], <, >, etc, while leaving most shifted and Fn-ed combinations unbound. Fortunately, unlike closed systems, this is trivial to fix.

I found I no longer have any use for a laptop. Laptop keyboards and monitors are unfit for prolonged work, and when on the go, it is better to have a portable rather than merely luggable device that is almost as powerful.

I admit, most of my work involves command line, text editor or at most a browser, but I'd say more RAM and a slightly bigger screen would make laptops obsolete for most other tasks as well. Just please, never, ever, force a touchscreen UI when not needed, like most of Nokia's software does. The device has a keyboard for a reason.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[GooberToo]

Yes it absolutely is true. iPhone users don't have a problem coughing up some cash to support their developers. Android users typically complain like crazy - even when the application is free. One minor issue - 1 star and a flamed comment. Furthermore, because piracy is so high, adware is forced to be the primary source of revenue for developers. Which in turn, pirates and rooted users actively work to deny any and all possible source of income for developers.

As a result of piracy and selfish, dumb users, the quality of applications on the platform typically suffers. Its not exactly rocket science.

Here's an example application I knew of from some time back. ~2500 downloads from market. ~1500 purchases. ~250,000 pirate installs.The developer abandoned their application. But thankfully pirates assure us they are not the cause of the problems. After all, its dumb for the developer to believe he's entitled to a paycheck just like the hypocritical pirate live on. According to pirates, developers are only fit to live in the streets while they, themselves, demand additional features.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Mister Whirly]

Develop a free ad serving app for the Android. With selling an app, you get 99 cents, one time only. With ad revenue it is possible to make that dollar every month, and you will have a larger install base if it is free. Look at the Angry Birds revenue links above. They make way more on the free ad version than they do on the paid one.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Cajun Hell]

It sounds like the lesson here is that iPhone users are still willing to pay for what are essentially specialized Yellow Pages. I don't mean to knock your app (it actually sounds like something that I would like and maybe I'll check it out later today), but it's pretty amazing that users (rather than the businesses getting listed) would be willing to pay for something like that. (OTOH if the businesses pay, then the listings lose integrity so no users want to use it, so .. hey, it's a dilemma.)

Apple users are very special people and we should encourage them to stay that way. But I sure wouldn't want to be one.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[steelfood]

When all of your users are willing to pay the Apple tax, you know they're casual with how they spend money.

When you have a diverse device base, you likewise have a diverse user base. Of course percentage-wise, the iOS users will be more willing to spend money compared to Android as an ecosystem.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[SiB57]

Ad supported only work in games, as far as I can tell. Unless there is a compelling reason to open an app every day (and in travel apps and lifestyle apps, there just usually isn't) there's no way to make money on ads as you just won't get enough impressions. (P.S. I'm the original poster of this comment thread, didn't realize I wasn't logged in earlier.)

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[SiB57]

As a user and creator of these types of apps, I would rather pay for good data (which I think my app has) than data that only has what has been paid for by others. But that's just me, and apparently more of us Apple people :) (P.S. I'm the original poster of this comment thread, didn't realize I wasn't logged in earlier.)

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[NatasRevol]

So, they "made" $1M in ad revenue from android - per month, in the future, maybe. Assuming that it doesn't fall out of favor, or that people don't get sick of the ads.

From your article, there were 12M downloads on iOS. Which means $11.88M in app revenue from iOS. Already, as of December 2010 - before the iPad2. Which funded the ad revenue model on Android.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[NatasRevol]

They make way more on the free ad version than they do on the paid one

You might want to go look at those revenue links. They don't actually say that. They say them might, in the future, maybe.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[MrHanky]

Considering that the default Google search page has a link to local bars (with map and all), the idea of selling such an app for money is patently absurd.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[tlhIngan]

My impression was iPhone users are more likely to pay (if only $1 or $2) for apps, whereas android users are less so - is there any truth to that? People making more money developing their apps surely work harder on them.

Revenue wise, the Apple App Store makes hands-over-fist more money than the Google Marketplace rakes in, and it seems per-device app payments is higher on iOS than Android. (Apple has publicly said they paid out $2.5B to developers).

This ignores indirect revenue sources though. Some Android devs have reported making more money off Android apps than their iOS equivalents, mostly because of ads in the app. Rovio is one of them - which makes sense given they only get 70 cents per Angry Birds sale on iOS ($1.40 for the iPad version), but they get many ad impressions on Android - which is bound to make that amount up probably before finishing the first set of levels.

Also, those who buy into iOS know what they're getting into - "free" iPhones have only started cropping up (iPhone 3GS for $0 on contract), so most people were paying the $100-200 for an iPhone or the several hundred for an iPod Touch or iPad. These folk know they are buying it for the App Store and the apps inside.

Android phones though have been offered free practically from the start, so many people would get one over paying for an iPhone, but really only use it for email and web surfing. They may browse the Market out of curiousity and get a few free apps, but it's more of a side note rather than the main event. Either that or they think it's their carrier trying to make up for the "free" phone.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Mister Whirly]

An article from March said the revenues were roughly even at that point, and projected Android revenue to surpass the iOS revenue. So at the very least they are making the same, and Android is expected to make more. Seeing Android is selling on par or outselling iOS at this point, and the fact there are less apps for Android out now, I really can't see how Android won't pass the iOS version for revenue on Angry Birds. As the developer stated, selling the $1 iOS version nets them 70 cents (After Apple's 30% cut) one time. The ad version generates income every time the app is used.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[NatasRevol]

Since Rovio hasn't actually said what the revenues were, I doubt any of the numbers are verifiable or true.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Mister Whirly]

Rovio did say in the article that revenues were "roughly even". The headline for the article is "Angry Birds Revenue From Android, iOS Now Roughly Even, Rovio Say". Forgot to include it in my last post. Here you go

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Altus]

An application that quickly and easily does something for you is very useful. I didn't pay for it, but a few months ago while on the highway I wanted to find the closes wendys, I could have gone to wendys.com and entered a zip code I grabbed from Google maps and my current location and then looked for the closest one, but it was way faster to download an app that finds burger joints, set it to only look for wendys and let it go. In the time the first solution would have taken I would have driven well past the nearest wendys before I knew it was there. With the application I quickly and easily got what I needed.

Now, I probably would not have paid a buck for that but sometimes a specialized app to do exactly what you want, right now, is worth a little something. It may be a specialized yellow pages, but at least I got the burger I wanted.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[Sloppy]

I have an app on both iOS and Android (Find Craft Beer) for 99c. I recently updated it so the iOS is a bit more feature advanced than the Android version, but before the update, when the apps were identical, it was selling about 25 iOS copies to every 1 Android copy.

One of the touchy things about this kind of application is that you're sort of in competition with Google. Sort of.

As far as having (and attempting to monetize) the data itself, it's still yours and you can make a go of it. But the "find a place where condition x" part of the application is something that Google would prefer you use their maps service for. For specialized things like this, right now it is still possible to have a technically superior search than what Google offers, e.g. "Show me where I can get a good IPA within 4 miles of where I am." You can't count on this lasting forever, though, and the last-few-years push for better semantic markup (culminating in schema.org) is only going to hasten things.

If there's an advantage to being an app rather than website, it's that Google can't crawl your data. But that's also a disadvantage too. You're keeping your data out of their searches (so your search capability remains an attractive alternative to theirs) but you're also staying out of the view of the people who use their search.

So the question is: just how unique and special do you really think your data is? All it takes is for a good writer to visit the same microbreweries as you, and no matter how good your data is, it's marginalized.

A related aspect to all this, with regard to Android, is the "Google Experience." As a user I am not even slightly interested in the Google Experience, the gmail integration, etc, but nevertheless it's there and it's getting hawked to users as a feature of the platform. I think Android users are trained to use Google's searching for this kind of thing, so your observation matches predictions -- fewer of them should be paying for an App.

Yog-Sothoth help you if your iPhone users ever remember that they also have a web browser and Google Maps app. When iPhone users get around to rediscovering the web (yes, kids, the web is still there and bigger than ever), it's going to be a major blow to certain app developers.

I think the long-term outlook for these kinds of applications is grim. But good luck to you.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[brainzach]

99 cents is such a small amount of money for an app compared to the price of a beer at a bar. I don't see how it can be a bad value, especially if it provides a much better experience than using the Yellow Pages

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[MrHanky]

Or you could just type in 'Wendys' in Google Maps and get the address directly from there.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[ottothecow]

Here's an example application I knew of from some time back. ~2500 downloads from market. ~1500 purchases. ~250,000 pirate installs.The developer abandoned their application. But thankfully pirates assure us they are not the cause of the problems

You know...I think I agree with this here. back when the discussion was about things like photoshop and 3ds max, the pirates weren't the problem. Programs like that cost big money and a majority of the pirates would never ever pay for them--how many teenagers pirated modeling software (how may 15 year olds have hundreds or thousands of dollars for a software license) and honed their skills making cool shit and later got jobs that worked with paid versions of those programs.

With the world of $2 apps...everything is different. Anyone who can afford a smartphone and data plan can also afford a bunch of apps (and your phone would run out of memory before you bought enough apps to equal a creative suite license). The average iphone user doesn't know how to do this (and with new versions that required tethered boot...they don't want to do it) while one doesn't have to look very far to find out how to load non-store apps onto an android phone.

I'm not saying that anywhere near 250k of those pirates would have paid for the app but if less than one percent shelled out two dollars, it would have *doubled* the revenues.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[slapout]

"Guess where I'm concentrating my efforts for my next project...."

Windows Phone 7?

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

but in general, you can do everything you would be able to do on a Pentium III 256MB ram 32GB disk laptop.

Wow, soooooooo compelling. And to think for some reason it wasn't a success.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

and ofter don't install them after realizing that they want to access my contacts, phone status, full internet connection even if there is no apparent reason for them to do that.

Phone status permission is generally so they can tell when you're getting a call, and pause themselves appropriately. The other permissions are kinda weird, but I'm guessing internet connection is so they can download ads or additional content.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

Kinda, but not really. There was the article a ways back that said they were anticipating something like a million dollars of ad revenue a month through Android Angry Birds. However, that doesn't mean that it's "more successful" than the iPhone version, as the iPhone version sold a shitton of copies, and grossed something like $12 million dollars. They are two separate kinds of revenue: The iPhone has the immediate, pay for revenue, whereas Android relies on the "long tail" of revenue, for it to build up over time.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

The fact that software piracy is rampant on Android is not FUD.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

[Angry Birds on Android] was slower and jerky because of loading ads and the ads got in the way of game play.

I didn't notice it being much slower, but I did notice the ads getting in the way of gameplay. I remember a level where an ad was actually blocking the section of the field I needed to see.

That inspired me to install an ad-blocker on my phone, and I never looked back.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

They make way more on the free ad version than they do on the paid one.

That's not entirely true. They made several metric shittons on the paid version. The difference between the two is that with the iOS version, the revenue is more or less up front, whereas the Android ad revenue is sustaining over time. One isn't necessarily better than the other.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

Except that's a very well known, and very high profile developer and game. It can't really be used as a "standard" case.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

They make way more on the free ad version than they do on the paid one.

I wouldn't want that, and it probably would ruin the app. Having businesses pay to be listed means that the ones with the biggest ad budgets are going to be near the top of results, not the ones most relevant to my needs.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

Crap, I pasted the wrong comment. I meant to reply to this:

it's pretty amazing that users (rather than the businesses getting listed) would be willing to pay for something like that.

And while I'm at it, fuck you for insinuating that someone who pays for something that actually helps them out is an idiot.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

I'll be delighted to give it a try, maybe starting with ads

Because it's completely out of line to think that someone pirating the app isn't above blocking the ads. Not to mention that now you've made the experience worse for everyone else.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[sycorob]

You have to work pretty hard to install apps on an iPhone that DON'T come from the Apple App Store(tm). You have to use a security hole in the OS to root it and install a modified OS. You void your warranty, you open your phone up to potential security issues, and you have to battle with it each time Apple releases an iOS update. With Android, you select the "Allow install of 3rd-party apps" checkbox, and you can install an app from any old website. Super-easy!

So yeah, there's going to be a lot more piracy on Android; the barrier is really low. I don't think it has anything to do with the relative costs of the devices, they're pretty much the same. It's still ridiculous that people pirate a $2 app - just eat one less donut this week, jackoffs.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[AmazingRuss]

Which in turn has inspired me to not bother bringing games to Android. I wasn't aware there were ad blockers available, and I had been planning on bringing games over from iOS and using the ad supported model to get around the reluctance to purchase endemic in Android users. It's kind of a relief, actually I was not looking forward to dealing with the fragmentation and support issues.

It really looks like Android is doomed to apps made by hobbyists.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[node 3]

The Angry Birds dude is allegedly making more money from the ad-supported "free" Android Angry Birds app than the ad-free "paid" iPhone version.

In other words, yes, iPhone users are more likely to pay for apps.

Only on Slashdot would someone spin "more ads" as a good thing!

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[s73v3r]

They made something like $12 million on the iOS version. The iOS version sold very well.

As for your comparison, it's absolute shit without context. First, Angry Birds was more than a dollar. Second, how small is smaller? And how often is the app running?

Answer those questions, and you'll be able to figure out which model is better for your specific case.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[jkauzlar]

it's pretty amazing that users (rather than the businesses getting listed) would be willing to pay for something like that.

And while I'm at it, fuck you for insinuating that someone who pays for something that actually helps them out is an idiot.

He's clearly only expressing surprise at the vagaries of human nature. He even says he's not knocking your app and might even check it out. Get a grip

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[shutdown -p now]

pirates and rooted users actively work to deny any and all possible source of income for developers.

That's a strange way to put it. I'd understand if you said "rooted users which pirate", but there is an "and" there instead. What's that supposed to mean?

(For the record, I've owned 4 Android devices overall, with 2 of those rooted; none of them ever had any pirated apps on them.)

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[jrumney]

Now that Google finally opened up paid apps to my part of the world at the beginning of this month, I expect that might change.

Re:Do people pay money for Android apps?

[dswskinner]

So Apples "walled garden" approach seems to be a benefit to developers? I think i'll take the perceived limitation if it keeps new apps coming to the platform.

4000 1000?

[Anonymous Coward]

"on iOS, user reviews for Battleheart average 4.5 stars (4000 total ratings), which is quite good. On Android it's a stunning 4.8, with 1000 ratings," writes the developer. "So not only is it reviewed more highly, it's also reviewed more often

It does not seem to be rated that much more highly, and it is certainly not reviewed more often.

Oh the scales!

[achacha]

So from "quite good" to "stunning" is a 0.3 rating on a 1 to 5 scale? That's quite a non-linear scale.

Re:Oh the scales!

[vlm]

So from "quite good" to "stunning" is a 0.3 rating on a 1 to 5 scale? That's quite a non-linear scale.

Maybe its like the video game review website scale, where they call it 1 to 10 but oddly enough everything scores 8 to 10.

Re:Oh the scales!

[localman57]

.3 is a big difference. See my arguement in comment http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2260056&cid=36528384

Re:Oh the scales!

[jd2112]

So from "quite good" to "stunning" is a 0.3 rating on a 1 to 5 scale? That's quite a non-linear scale.

Maybe its like the video game review website scale, where they call it 1 to 10 but oddly enough everything scores 8 to 10.

So from "quite good" to "stunning" is a 0.3 rating on a 1 to 5 scale? That's quite a non-linear scale.

Maybe its like the video game review website scale, where they call it 1 to 10 but oddly enough everything scores 8 to 10.

Because anything under an 8 rating means you wont get that publishers next title for review.

Re:Oh the scales!

[AmiMoJo]

Also 20,000+ high quality fart and broken screen apps tend to be weighted fairly low in most people's assessment.

I find that there are loads of good, high quality Android apps. There are plenty of shitty wallpaper "apps" and just plain crap ones, but that is true of iOS too. Just having a fancy page turn effect does not make an app higher quality (but does piss away battery life quite efficiently).

Re:Oh the scales!

[BitZtream]

A 1 to 5 scale is really a 4-5 scale.

People are generally too pussy or to mad to rate properly.

In this day and age, where everyone wants to be nice to everyone, and most people have self-esteem issues so they want everyone else in the world to like them, no one gives accurate reviews. You'll get 4 starts for a shitty app just cause no one wants to make the developer feel bad.

This is a well known and established fact.

A 1-10 scale is more like a 6/7-10 scale if they are good about it, really its probably a 8/9 out of 10 scale.

Sure, SOME people rate accurately, but that one in a 100k gets drowned out immediately.

Re:Oh the scales!

[delinear]

The biggest disappointment with Android though is search. Sure both market places have their share of good and bad apps, but I would have hoped Google of all people would be able to help me sort the wheat from the chaff - it's what they do.

Re:Oh the scales!

[delinear]

Not the case on Android. In fact I regularly see people give out grossly unfair 1 star ratings. The number of times I've seen an app explicitly state "Does not work with handset X", only to receive a slew of 1 star ratings from handset X owners who didn't bother to read the description - even in cases where the app has cost them nothing to try! - is beyond ridiculous. However, I do think when people have paid for a product they are more likely to rate it higher, either because they've tried a free demo first and know they'll like it before they buy or else because they are trying to justify the purchase to themselves, so that could be the skewing factor here.

Re:Oh the scales!

[brainzach]

So from "quite good" to "stunning" is a 0.3 rating on a 1 to 5 scale? That's quite a non-linear scale.

The scale isn't linear

A 4.5 requires getting a 7 5-star ratings for every 1-star. A 4.8 requires getting 19 5-star ratings for every 1-star.

Re:Oh the scales!

[BitZtream]

In fact I regularly see people give out grossly unfair 1 star ratings.

Yes, and there are some white men who are good at basketball, some black men who aren't, and some asians who can actually drive and aren't math gods.

But just like what you bring up, they are exceptions to the generalization. There are always exceptions to the rule. One day you'll figure that out and learn to throw out the exceptions when you're trying to have a general conversation. Either that or you'll spend all your time arguing about exceptions and never get anywhere.

Re:Oh the scales!

[BitZtream]

Its perfectly linear. Do you not have any idea how averages work?

Re:Oh the scales!

[Richy_T]

Not true. I release an app before it was ready (because at the time, it would have been useful in its half-ready state) and I got some very bad ratings. Enough that it slowed uptake once the solid, full function version was out there (No problem for me since I wrote it for myself and it was free). People aren't afraid to slam stuff they don't like.

Re:Oh the scales!

[rsborg]

So from "quite good" to "stunning" is a 0.3 rating on a 1 to 5 scale? That's quite a non-linear scale.

Not only that, but 1000 reviews is a whole lot less statistically valid than ~5000. Some reviewers are just haters or idiots ("I'm rating this 1star until you add the new Ranger class! I love the game." - WTF?).

Re:Oh the scales!

[brainzach]

It is over 2.5 times harder to get a 4.8 vs a 4.5 in practice.

I guess it is all about perspective. To me, the score represents the ration of 5-star ratings compared to everything else which isn't a linear scale

Re:Oh the scales!

[tronbradia]

Rating space is actually highly non-linear at the ends, because of the ceiling effect. To simplify, assume everyone only gives 1 star or 5 stars. You need a 7:1 ratio of 5-stars to 1-star to get a 4.5. But 4.8 requires a 19:1 ratio, suggesting more than double the proportion of 5-star ratings. So yes, 4.8 is vastly better performance than 4.5.

Re:Really?

[somersault]

Yep. Everything I've seen recently says that there are more Android devices out there than iOS (though iPhones are the most successful handset type), so I don't see how 1000 Android users is a higher percentage users than 4000 iOS users..

Free Advertising?

[jboker]

Before this i had never heard of 'Battleheart'. /. advertising at it's best.

Re:Free Advertising?

[vlm]

Before this i had never heard of 'Battleheart'. /. advertising at it's best.

Eh, I'd argue that anyone into RPGs on ipods/phones/tablets probably already knew about Battlehart and already decided to either download it or skip it. Its not new. Its like complaining "John Carmack, of Id software" is a slashvertisement, maybe to people who still have not played Doom...

I had no idea who the author is, I like playing battleheart, so knowing the guy actually knows something about game design and programming makes his opinion somewhat more useful than the author of yet another fart app or one of those "ten PG-13 pictures of women for $1.99" spam-plications that were flooding the app store months ago.

Re:Free Advertising?

[Anonymous Coward]

The app is on the front page on Market for over a week now, at this point you have to be blind not to notice it.

Or maybe just not paying attention to "Market", because it's really not that important at all.

Re:Free Advertising?

[Cajun Hell]

People see the front page of Market? I thought the first thing someone did upon launching the Market app, was go into search and start typing whatever they're looking for.

Re:Free Advertising?

[DeathFromSomewhere]

If you don't care about the market then you don't care about this story. See ya.

Re:Free Advertising?

[Altus]

Its a fun little game. I would recommend checking it out.

Agree !

[Vulcan195]

I hate (really HATE) branding myself. I hate folks who say I am a "Liberal" or a "Conservative" ... an "Apple" guy or a "Microsoft" guy ... or a "Ford" or a "Chevy" dude. I take a stance on a case-by-case basis. I own a Samsung Galaxy S phone and love it. Most of my apps are utilities I use to make life easier (i.e. I am not one who aspires to play games on a tiny-screen footprint device). I really dig the phone (except for the crappy AT&T service). About two months ago .. I purchased my FIRST-EVER Apple product - An IPAD 2. About one month ago, I bought a Asus Transformer Tablet - which I promptly returned. The problem is not the device itself - its the lack of apps. APPS is the main driver. Don't own a boat if you don't live close to the water. To make full use of that boat ... you need water ! Not a small pond ... but a lake so you can enjoy your purchase. That's the problem with the Android Tablet world - not enough quality apps. Don't take my word for it - do a Google News search for "New Ipad App" and filter it to show the last one week. Just see the amazing number of apps. Yes, not all of them are great ... but its testament to the fact that software companies realize where the highest ROI is. I would never own an Android tablet until they standardize the hardware platform to ensure that apps work consistently. I agree with the article.

Re:Agree !

[beanpoppa]

I have an OG Droid, a Nook Color running CM7, and an iPad2. Whereas there are definitely a LOT more iPad specific apps available for the iPad than there are tablet specific apps available for the Nook, that's not a balanced equation. On the iPad, iPhone apps are barely usable. They scale horribly, and don't take advantage of the larger screen in any way. OTOH, apps that I use regularly on my small screen Droid, work just as well, if not better, on my large Nook. The Android platform simply does a much better job scaling to different screen sizes. (the 'fragmentation' of handset designs made this a requirement from the start, unlike the iPhone) As for tablet specific apps for Android, it's a matter of time. There haven't been a lot of tablets on the market until recently, and as I said, the phone apps fit the bill for 80% of the tablet users' needs anyway.

Re:Agree !

[PRMan]

I had exactly the opposite experience.

I played with the iPad 2, but felt limited by all it couldn't do. I like throwing DVDs on an SD card and having the kids watch movies in the car while on vacation. To do that on an iPad would have required an iPad 1, jailbreaking and an expensive camera kit option. Or, I can just pop a Micro SD in the Asus and watch movies. And when I get to the hotel, I can view them on the big screen with a simple HDMI cable. And with another card, I get another 16GB worth of movies. I can throw music and pictures on there without iTunes. And Asus included a great app (MyNet) which just sees your uPNP/DLNA servers and plays everything on them.

I can remote control my PCs without installing anything, because RemoteRDP is a great remote desktop program that uses Microsoft's built-in protocol. Most of the popular games and apps are on both anyway and there are more every day.

Re:Agree !

[BitZtream]

To do that on an iPad would have required an iPad 1, jailbreaking and an expensive camera kit option.

Or ... you could just sync the iPad with the laptop/desktop you used to put the movie on the SD card ... Its not like the movie magically appeared on the card, it got there because you put it there ... so instead of putting it there, you would have put it on the ipad.

When you get to the hotel, your ipad will be happy to play them over hdmi, mine certainly doesn't have a problem with it.

I can throw music and pictures on there without iTunes.

Okay, so you can use another app instead of iTunes, but you're still using an app.

I can remote control my PCs without installing anything, because RemoteRDP is a great remote desktop program that uses Microsoft's built-in protocol. Most of the popular games and apps are on both anyway and there are more every day.

Let me give you a hint, I was doing that on iOS before android was a thought in someones mind, I can't even think of an OS without RDP support.

Basically, your entire post wreaks of fanboy. Yes, you do have a couple legitimate things that your device can do over an iPad, but from a practical perspective those things are trivial and I'm not going to point out the things the iPad does better since it clearly won't matter to you, you've decided. Its just a shame you decided for the wrong reasons. Being a fanboy is a reason, but its a shitty one.

Re:Agree !

[Bucky24]

Okay, so you can use another app instead of iTunes, but you're still using an app.

But it's not iTunes. iTunes on windows runs terribly, and I could see someone who was using it on that platform desiring a substitute.

Re:Uhhh...

[localman57]

when my iPhone friends play with my phone they are pretty much always impressed.

When your iPhone friends play with a block of wood, they're pretty much always impressed too. Don't give that too much weight.

Is that...

[Simon Rowe]

a metric or imperial sh!tload?

Re:4000 1000?

[jaymz666]

yeah, I caught that too. Maybe there's a time scale that was missed here, i.e. being available for longer on iOS or something.

Re:4000 1000?

[localman57]

It is, though, if you look at the distribution. For most decent apps, people pick between 4 stars or 5 stars. A technically functional, resonably thought out app isn't going to get 1 or 2 stars. Occasionally you'll get a 3, but mostly 4 or 5s. Based on this, about half of iPhone users rate it a 5. But 80% of Android users do. The 4.8 gets even more impressive when you throw back in the 1,2,and 3 ratings.

Re:higher rated with LESS ratings?

[Stewie241]

The only thing I can assume is that he left out the number of downloads on each device. So it may be proportionally more. Maybe not. Who knows.

Re:Mind blowing

[larry bagina]

Perhaps he meant 1,000/number_of_android_sales > 4,000/number_of_iphone_sales, which only holds true if number_of_iphone_sales > number_of_android_sales * 4.

Is that a big difference?

[itchythebear]

Evidence to that effect comes from the fact that "on iOS, user reviews for Battleheart average 4.5 stars (4000 total ratings), which is quite good. On Android it's a stunning 4.8, with 1000 ratings," writes the developer. "So not only is it reviewed more highly, it's also reviewed more often, with a huge percentage of android users taking the time to rate the app.

4.5 vs 4.8, How is that a big difference on a scale of 0-5?

4,000 is less than 1,000? That must be a typo and either way it doesn't matter unless we also know how many downloads each version has had as well.

Apple users don't have install problems?

[jaymz666]

How do we know that Apple users aren't having similar issues but are asking in apple forums how to install stuff or at the genius bar, and those comments aren't deleted from the apple forums ?

Re:Apple users don't have install problems?

[spedrosa]

Because they don't. iOS app install works flawlessly.

Even if they didn't, Apple support takes care of it - while Google pushes the burden to the developer.

Re:Apple users don't have install problems?

[jaymz666]

So, iOS install is flawless, except when it isn't.

Re:Apple users don't have install problems?

[Phleg]

How do we know there isn't a teapot in orbit around the sun?

Re:Apple users don't have install problems?

[Tsingi]

How do we know there isn't a teapot in orbit around the sun?

You don't know, that's the point. Still, it's a ridiculous notion.

Re:Apple users don't have install problems?

[BitZtream]

And in that case, the phone tells you how to fix it ...

Delete the app thats failing to install from the start pages, and download it again again, or sync with a PC.

Theres no need to look elsewhere, they made the effort to deal with those problems to make users lives easier, and they know the apps will install because they try the apps first.

Android is an iOS copy, but its a copy of all the wrong shit, with a couple of exceptions where they copied the right shit but utterly failed to get the essence of what they were copying. Don't feel bad, Microsoft and RIM did the exact same thing, only they fucked the copying up even more than Android

Re:Apple users don't have install problems?

[2short]

There is definitely a teapot in orbit around the sun. I just made tea in it.

Why did I open this?

[iB1]

I knew as soon as I saw the title in my RSS feed that the summary would be a load of old bollocks. I didn't realise just how much old bollocks it was really going to be though...

Isn't 1000 Less Than 4800?

[thepainguy]

Or is this the new math?

Re:Is the summary FUBARed?

[localman57]

Yes. He understands numbers. More than that, he understands fractions.

1000 4000

[Black Parrot]

Evidence to that effect comes from the fact that "on iOS, user reviews for Battleheart average 4.5 stars (4000 total ratings), which is quite good. On Android it's a stunning 4.8, with 1000 ratings," writes the developer. "So not only is it reviewed more highly, it's also reviewed more often,

Or is he saying that there are more than 4x as many iOS users as Android users?

Thought I read very recently that Android was more prevalent.

Fear of android

[gad_zuki!]

Seriously, I'm not sure what the point of this article is. He dismisses higher ratings and then compains of technical issues. Err, okay.

From what I can tell, there's a real fear of the breaking of the Apple monopoly right now. Froyo and Gingerbread and Honeycomb are really on par with Apple's usually excellent mobile quality. Android phones are now moving into dual cores and with Gingerbread can do hardware acceleration. I think we're looking at a lot of people who have invested themselves into iOS and are now complaining that their customers are moving to Android. Now these developers have to learn a new mobile ecosystem and deal with its issues.

Christ, imagine if these people were as whiny about Windows as they are about Android. "OMG, one of my customers is using a slow Pentium 4!" Grow up, whiny devs. Either you move with the market or you fall behind. Someone else will make the next fart simulator or tip calculator. You're not some genius the world needs, you're 100% replaceable. If you can't code for my phone that fine because your competitors can.

Re:Fear of android

[Americano]

From what I can tell, there's a real fear of the breaking of the Apple monopoly right now.

There would have to be an "Apple monopoly" for it to be broken, or for there to be any fear that it "might" be broken at some point in the near future.

Since there isn't, is it safe to dismiss the rest of your post as insane rambling?

Re:Fear of android

[BitZtream]

OMG, one of my customers is using a slow Pentium 4!

That slow pentium 4 is still capable of actually being useful as 'slow' in PCs now days is still incredibly fast.

On a phone however the difference between fast and slow is trivial, so a slow phone is far more noticeable.

Of course, I could rant and rave about how the fact that someone notices their phone is slow already shows the whole thing is built wrong, but that'd take too long.

Froyo and Gingerbread and Honeycomb

Really? 3 different versions are as good as iOS ... then why are there 3 versions? The funny part is that you say froyo and gingerbread are on par ... then why did they make gingerbread?

Heres a hint, they aren't on par, they aren't even on the same course, though they are the only ones in the same state at the moment.

Just curious, how many apps have you written for multiple phone OSes?

I'm not the author of the story, but I have two OSes that I currently have active software for sale on, and a few others under my belt from past items. $200 says you don't even write code, and no, your little python script doesn't count.

Re:Fear of android

[medcalf]

This is slashdot. It's not merely safe but wise to dismiss effectively everything, including this, as insane rambling.

Re:Fear of android

[Americano]

There is no app store monopoly. Apple does not require you to not develop for other mobile platforms, nor do they refuse to let people use their app store if they already have an Android version of their app.

In fact, the very argument you make argues against the notion of "monopoly" in this space. How could an app developer be rendered obsolete by a competing app store, if Apple has a "monopoly" on app stores? The answer: There is no monopoly, and you are using the term improperly.

Pro tip: Monopoly does not mean, "I disagree with the policies under which a company offers their services, and prefer the policies of a competing service." It has a very specific legal meaning, and if you're going to use the word, you should probably know what it means.

So...what do you need to do exactly?

[Kupfernigk]

In the course of a working day I use maybe 4 or 5 programs, with a dozen others getting occasional use. Exactly what are all these things you need to do, that you can't and would expect to, on a tiny computer?

Re:So...what do you need to do exactly?

[Vulcan195]

On the Galaxy Android: I use "Business Calendar" every few hours (it syncs with multiple google accounts and allow setting multiple reminders for the same event). I use "Timeriffic" to turn off the phone in the night. I use "Shazam" to figure out songs playing on the car radio. I use "Tunein Radio Pro" to listen to BBC World News while driving. I DONT Use the Android phone to play games I DONT use the Android phone to browse the web (too small) I DONT use the Android phone to take videos or photos (I have fancy SLR)

Re:4000 1000?

[rbrausse]

funny - and it wasn't a copy&paste error of TFS but is a direct quote from the developer's blog.

and to blame the coder more: it seems he believe what he wrote; at the moment his game is rated in the Android market 1400 times...

Re:Uhhh...

[TheRaven64]

my iPhone friends

What is that a euphemism for?

Re:Really?

[jeremyp]

The article says he gets 80% of the revenue on Android that he gets on iTunes. On the assumption that the app is the same price on both platforms, and on the assumption that Google takes the same cut (30%) that Apple takes, he sells more iPhone copies than Android copies but nowhere near by a factor of four.

If Google takes a lesser cut he is probably selling more copies on Google.

However, I have just checked the game on iTunes and I see it currently has only 597 ratings for all versions of the game (453 for the current version). So I would think the blog post from which the 4,000 figure comes from has a typo in it.

That was my impression...

[IpSo_]

I purchased a Motorola Xoom (my first Android device) about a month after it came out... Wow was I ever disappointed. It would crash several times an hour just browsing the web (especially on Motorola's own Xoom website), but I chalked that up to "being an early adopter". Then I started downloading apps from the Android market and things got even worse, if the app even loaded without crashing, I felt like I was teleported back to the late 90's from a design / look & feel standpoint. Other than the rare exceptions ( Angry Birds ) every app I downloaded didn't even compare to a similar app on Apple's App Store, it felt like companies/developers were publishing an app for Android just to say they did it, without the intention of it actually being used. Many apps that did have an iOS counterpart (*cough* thinkorswim *cough*) hadn't been updated in almost a year and were pathetic at best.

Needless to say after two weeks of torture I took it back and purchased an iPad2, I've been quite happy with it.

Hopefully in a few years it will be a different story, I would much prefer if Apple had some decent competition.

Re:That was my impression...

[CFBMoo1]

I actually have a Motorola Xoom I purchased a few months ago. So far most of everything I snagged seems to work fine. I've been sticking to the free apps for downloads. The only thing I really don't like about touch tablets is selecting URL links and copy/paste operations. Both are annoyingly more difficult then they would be with mouse/keyboard.

I'm trying to pick up on Android development now so I can make my own Battlemech editor and play sheet for my Xoom.

Re:That was my impression...

[PRMan]

When I first got my Asus, it Force Closed a lot on 3.0. But when Android 3.1 came around, I think I have had 1-2 force closes since in a month or so, always on busy web pages (I run full browser mode instead of mobile, so probably my fault).

Yes, many of the apps are poor quality and unfinished. If there is an option, I choose the nicer looking one. But I would rather have functionality than not, even if it's sometimes ugly to look at.

Re:That was my impression...

[element-o.p.]

I have a Dell Streak 7, and while I initially had several apps force-close immediately upon launching them, my experience has otherwise been quite different than yours. Almost every app that I had problems with (Connectbot, I don't remember what all else) have been updated multiple times since install, and the only one that I still can't get to run on my Streak is Google Sky...not exactly mission critical, since I'm not a professional astronomer, and, FWIW, it works quite well on my Hero phone. As far as look and feel making you feel like you are back in the '90s...well, if you say so, but I didn't think so.

One other thing that I didn't expect, but with which I've been quite happy, is that my Streak 7 has a full size SD card slot that I've been able to use to upload images from my digital cameras to Picassa or to my blog while traveling...which was one of my requirements for a tablet. IIRC, the iPad doesn't have an SD card slot (source, but if I'm wrong, please correct me).

Re:That was my impression...

[R3d M3rcury]

The iPad does have an SD Card Slot--for an extra $29.

Re:That was my impression...

[shutdown -p now]

Your mistake was buying a device running Android 3.x. Right now, it is effectively a public beta (yes, even 3.1). I do own a Honeycomb tablet - Asus Transformer - though it's the second one now that I've got rid of my Xoom. And most stability issues are the same between the two, so it's definitely the core OS and not hardware or manufacturer mods (Xoom is vanilla Honeycomb, anyway).

On the other hand, Android 2.x - which all phones to date, and a good chunk of tablets, run - is a very stable OS. Ironically, it also works faster than Honeycomb, despite hardware being slower.

Re:Really?

[UnknowingFool]

I'm guessing it's not the percentage to overall users but the actual number of reviews is higher in that more Android users actually took the time to rate the apps.

Re:4000 1000?

[brainzach]

You can rate apps without writing a review. The developer was saying that a greater percentage of ratings come with reviews on the Android market.

Of course it is. And it's not just Android.

[thePowerOfGrayskull]

When you lower the barriers of entry sufficiently, you reap the rewards. All of the rewards. Not really news.

Re:Uhhh...

[jd2112]

when my iPhone friends play with my phone they are pretty much always impressed.

When your iPhone friends play with a block of wood, they're pretty much always impressed too. Don't give that too much weight.

Only if it has an Apple logo on it. Otherwise the fanbois will say that Apple could make superior wood blocks.

Paying for offline use

[tepples]

I don't understand why I should pay for an app on my Android phone when I can often do the same thing for free on my browser on my computer or even inside my phone.

Because not everybody has an Android phone. Some people have a Wi-Fi-only tablet and are paying for use of the application away from open-to-the-public Wi-Fi coverage.

phone status, full internet connection

An application that pauses multimedia playback when a call comes in needs to get notified of incoming calls through "phone status". An application that downloads advertisements or verifies the user's license to use the application requires "full Internet access", as does a game that publishes the player's high score or other achievements.

Re:Mind blowing

[nedlohs]

1. Ratings are 1-5, So 0.3 is 7.5% of the total scale. Not huge, but half the gap between a Pass and a Credit from my university days.

2. Way more copies have been sold on iOS than on Android, so on Android the game is reviewed more often when bought. Which is obvious in the original article, not so obvious when random snippets are pulled out of context in a summary.

Re:Sacrilege!!

[MaxBooger]

Don't worry, I'm sure the Apple drones will get out of bed sometime soon and balance things out.

It's LOG!!

[Sectoid_Dev]

When your iPhone friends play with a block of wood, they're pretty much always impressed too. Don't give that too much weight.

What rolls down stairs
alone or in pairs,
and over your neighbor's dog?
What's great for a snack,
And fits on your back?
It's log, log, log

It's log, it's log,
It's big, it's heavy, it's wood.
It's log, it's log, it's better than bad, it's good."

Everyone wants a log
You're gonna love it, log
Come on and get your log
Everyone needs a log
log log log

*whistle*
LOG FROM BLAMMO

Re:Sacrilege!!

[rbrausse]

morning? it's 5 pm before a public holiday - this is only a little bit of friday afternoon trolling

Video game artists still need to eat

[tepples]

Since I've been a denizen of the Linux/BSD world for over 15 years, I find it goes against the grain to pay for software - not because I am a cheapskate, but because I prefer the Free model.

One place where the free software model has tended to fall down over the past couple decades is video games that aren't of the single-screen-puzzle type. Even if a video game's program is released as free software, the 3D artists, level designers, etc. still need to eat, and single-player video games don't offer as much of an opportunity to sell support as business applications. What's the best way to involve artists in the production of free video games?

Re:Video game artists still need to eat

[Richy_T]

Perhaps a community website (or sites) where game writers can request assets and artists can submit (either in response to these requests or off their own bat) where using these assets requires prominent crediting so that the artist can build a name. You might even see some corporate involvement (Coke submitting characters wearing Coke branded clothing and the like). Possibly the development of some open-source skeletal models would need to come first (so artists would have something to develop skins around) for rendered games but sprites could be done with few prerequisites.

Re:Video game artists still need to eat

[index0]

Everyone needs to eat.

What about the 3rd party levels/textures for games like quake1+2, descent1+2, duke3d.

Re:Video game artists still need to eat

[tepples]

Perhaps a community website (or sites) where game writers can request assets and artists can submit

Does such a site exist? If not, and I make one myself, how do you recommend that I promote it?

Let me fix that link for you

[joelville]

"Can't download apps from the Android Market"

Re:4000 1000?

[BitZtream]

Yes, but has it been out for a year on the iPhone and 2 months on Android? If thats the cause, the android version IS selling faster at this point.

Statistics you don't understand aren't useful. Please try to understand the statistics you're looking at before you talk about how great/evil/right/wrong they are.

Re:Uhhh...

[rwven]

How is 4.8 vs 4.5 all that much of a difference? If android had just as many reviews, it could easily drop that .3 stars and be just as equally rated as the iphone version.

When apps on Android ARE truly lower quality than their iphone counterparts, it's usually because the developers saw android as a lower priority and only put a half-effort into developing the app. When i see this it seriously annoys the heck out of me. Tap Tap Revenge is a prime example of a pretty solid app on iOS that is a total piece of crap on Android, directly through the fault of the developer.

Also, the news item can't make up its mind what it's about. Are the apps low quality or is the android platform?

Android counterpart to iPod touch

[tepples]

Froyo and Gingerbread and Honeycomb are really on par with Apple's usually excellent mobile quality.

Unlike iOS, which has the iPod touch, Android doesn't appear to have a flagship pocket-size Wi-Fi tablet. Sure, there's the Archos 43 Internet Tablet, but its touch screen is resistive and thus incompatible with applications requiring multitouch such as Cordy. Archos 43 also doesn't come with Android Market, instead relying on AppsLib and Amazon Appstore and missing out on Market-exclusive applications such as my bank's check deposit app.

Re:Android counterpart to iPod touch

[tepples]

I have one cousin with an iPod touch and another with an Archos 43. Not everybody is willing to pay $70 per month for smartphone service.

Re:Android counterpart to iPod touch

[2short]

What are you talking about? I've got a great Android based pocket-sized Wi-Fi tablet. Is it supposed to be a negative that I could theoretically pay for service and use it to make phone calls? I can't see why.

Re:Android counterpart to iPod touch

[tepples]

I've got a great Android based pocket-sized Wi-Fi tablet. Is it supposed to be a negative that I could theoretically pay for service and use it to make phone calls?

It's a negative if the device cost you substantially more than 300 USD, the MSRP of the 32 GB iPod touch 4. A 3G and GPS radio shouldn't cost more than $50, but in the United States, phones are priced for the big three carriers to subsidize with a 2-year service plan, not for end users to purchase up front, and most smartphones end up with an MSRP of $500 to $600.

It's a negative if the applications you want to use require multitouch and your device doesn't support multitouch. A lot of applications, especially games that use on-screen buttons to simulate a gamepad, require multitouch. The iPod touch has it; Archos 43 doesn't.

It's a negative if your device doesn't come with access to the market that has the apps you want. The iPod touch has the App Store; Archos 43 doesn't come with Android Market.

Re:Android counterpart to iPod touch

[2short]

I've got a great Android based pocket-sized Wi-Fi tablet. Is it supposed to be a negative that I could theoretically pay for service and use it to make phone calls?

It's a negative if the device cost you substantially more than 300 USD,

I paid $200, which will buy your choice of various not-quite-latest Android phones. Mine is a Motorola Cliq.

It's a negative if the applications you want to use require multitouch

They don't.

A lot of applications, especially games that use on-screen buttons to simulate a gamepad, require multitouch.

I just suffer through using an actual d-pad, right next to the actual keyboard.

It's a negative if your device doesn't come with access to the market that has the apps you want.

I've got the Android Market.

Let's try across the road

[Flipao]

Can't download apps from app store

Re:Uhhh...

[EvilStein]

Stock Android that came with your phone? Or did you follow the most common path to fixing Android issues, which is "root your phone/install 3rd party mod?" ;-)

Re:Blame the Cheap Chinese Tablets

[Americano]

And who to blame for the existence and proliferation of cheap Chinese tablets? Right. Google.

By commoditizing the mobile OS with a "free" offering, they've ensured a race to bare minimum quality among the many handset / tablet manufacturers. You can't save much money by cutting your OS dev costs once you use Android, so you save money and shave margins by cutting testing & integration resources, while hoping that the raw horsepower you're cramming into the device will make up for its lack of detail finish.

Ad revenues über alles, after all - who cares if the consumers are faced with a minefield that's 80% full of half-functional devices? Google will serve ads to cheap, shitty hardware just as readily as they'll serve ads to expensive, thoughtfully designed hardware. And if people don't like the stuff Samsung, HTC, Nokia, et al. are putting out, Google can simply say, "How about a nice Chrome device instead? Or why not use our wonderful Google services on an Apple device? We'll serve you ads any which way you to access them!"

Re:1000 4000 ?

[BitZtream]

Because 4000 is a typo.

If anyone bothered to look at the App on the App store to verify it, they'd see that his current version has a little over 450 reviews, not 4000 ... making a typo and 400 sound much more correct.

Oh noes! It works for iPhone and toasters too!

[trippin_efnet]

Do some googling for "can't download apps for iPhone" or similar wording, and you'll see that this is a widespread chronic issue...

Do some googling for "can't download software to computer" or similar wording, and you'll see that this is a widespread chronic issue...

Do some googling for "can't stop vcr clock from blinking 12:00" or similar wording and you'll see that this is a widespread chronic issue...

Do some googling for "toast stuck in toaster" or similar wording and you'll see that this is a widespread chronic issue...

This post has got to be flamebait right?

Re:1000 4000

[daid303]

Read a bit better and you'll notice that he says:
4.5 > 4.8
4000 > 1000
or
4.5 < 4.8
4000 < 1000
Depending on what "it" is. Does not compute.

Re:Uhhh...

[grrrgrrr]

Typical blame the apple fanboy's for the lack of quality apps and the technical problems of android.. All you slashdot android fanboy's are such a sorry bunch of whiners. It is clear that in the mobile space the android users are the fanboy's not the apple users that is the big difference from the pc world where the apple users are the fanboy's

Is this an ad?

[Shivetya]

Because it sounds like one, look my app is rated very well on both markets, which means you should really buy i, but first I need to discover a round about means to get free advertisement. So lets start a flame war

Re:Is this an ad?

[drb226]

Hint: all /. articles are ads these days

Re:Uhhh...

[delinear]

You're missing the point - 4.8 and 4.5 are both great scores, and this guy's just managed to tell thousands of people about it online. The story is incidental to the outrageous self promotion.

Re:4000 1000?

[rbrausse]

yes, I read the later comments about "reviews per sold copy" may be a solution for the strange sentence. Maybe my wording was too harsh but I stick to my opinion: The meaning of the statement is not understandable without a high level of interpretation

Re:Uhhh...

[jedidiah]

No. It's "blame apple fanboys for FUD and rhetoric".

I enjoy the fact that I dumped Apple every time I need to manage media or clean out my SMS messages.

I am less interested in the store, or how much money Google is making, or how much money app developers are making.

I am more interested in the actual phone.

Proof that users are just stupid?

[c.r.o.c.o]

Go on the Android Market and check out any widget. Invariably you will see comments along the lines "I installed the widget, but now I can't open it. It sucks."

People can't even be bothered to understand that widgets and apps are different. You open apps but you add widgets to your screen. Is it intuitive? Probably not. But that doesn't change the fact that some people are unwilling or unable to understand anything about the devices they use.

Re:Proof that users are just stupid?

[bWareiWare.co.uk]

And how easy would it be for Google to change the 'open' button to a 'add to home' button instead of disabling it? Instead developers now include an 'app' just to tell you to install the widget, further clogging up the menus. This exactly the attention to detail which creates a sense of quality.

Re:Proof that users are just stupid?

[blair1q]

The app list is also a screen. It should do something useful there, too, if only to open a popup saying "place this on an ABC screen to get it to work right".

Re:Proof that users are just stupid?

[Sparton]

Stupid is everywhere, man. "Can't open app, it sucks, 1 star" is not an uncommon iTunes app review either.

Re:Proof that users are just stupid?

[c.r.o.c.o]

And how easy would it be for Google to change the 'open' button to a 'add to home' button instead of disabling it? Instead developers now include an 'app' just to tell you to install the widget, further clogging up the menus. This exactly the attention to detail which creates a sense of quality.

I have no idea how much more difficult your idea would be to implement. But as I've written in one of my previous posts I think the Android Market app is pretty crappy, so I do agree with you to an extent.

One reason developers include an app along with the widgets though is to allow people to edit the widgets. That's the case with Elixir and Minimalistic Text, and those are the only two widgets I settled on. Android does not seem to allow editing custom widgets once they're added to the screen, and you have to delete them then re-add them with different settings. The apps seem to be a workaround.

As to the attention to detail you speak of, can you give me an example of better implemented widgets? Apple does not allow them, Nokia's Maemo had its share of problems and I'm not familiar with BB, WebOS or Symbian widgets.

My experience

[93 Escort Wagon]

I've been using an Android phone (LG Thrive on AT&T prepay) for three months now, after having used an iOS device (iTouch) for a couple years along with a "dumb" phone. I mainly did this to consolidate devices - I got tired of carrying a phone and an iPod around. My conclusion thus far is: Android is a mixed bag.

Several of the apps Google itself offers are awesome (I love the beta Voice Navigation app! But, notably, the stock music player sucks). The mainstream commercial apps (read: "Angry Birds") are, as you'd expect, on par with their iOS counterparts. However the bulk of the apps do feel somewhat klunky and unpolished compared to similar apps available for Apple devices. Often they don't look as good, and expected features are not there - Google searches on the product will return a lot of "you've said that feature was coming for over two years now!" sorts of posts.

There are niggling issues in terms of integration with one's desktop environment, for those apps where that's relevant; but I don't think that's the developers' fault - I suspect Google doesn't do anything to make that easy because they want you to live in their ecosystem 100% of the time.

That said -

Re:My experience

[93 Escort Wagon]

You purchased a low end, under powered, 320x400 Android smartphone and you've come to the conclusion that the app experience isn't what you expect. Go figure.

My point of comparison was a 4-year-old 1st generation iPod Touch - not exactly cutting edge. And tell me what "low end" and "underpowered" have to do - AT ALL - with my specific complaints: expected features are missing and their visual inadequacies. Are you somehow claiming that, with a higher-end phone, apps magically add features and increase an apparent 50x100 resolution?

But hey, this is Slashdot. We don't read the articles, and we apparently don't even read the posts we're responding to.

Re:Uhhh...

[dmmiller2k]

when my iPhone friends play with my phone they are pretty much always impressed.

When your iPhone friends play with a block of wood, they're pretty much always impressed too. Don't give that too much weight.

Only if it has an Apple logo on it. Otherwise the fanbois will say that Apple could make superior wood blocks.

The people I know with iPhones tend to be more technologically challenged than those in my circle with Android phones, IMHO. While it may not be a statistically significant sample, the fact that someone went to the trouble of making this animation leads me to believe I might not be the only one who thinks so.

Big News!

[DaFallus]

I think the big news from the summary is that 1000 > 4000. Welcome to the future!

Consider the writer of TFA

[sl4shd0rk]

Rethinking Apps for the iPad By Christopher Mims
App Developers Sticking to iPhone By Christopher Mims
can the Creators of the iPhone Make Home Energy Management Sexy? Christopher Mims

No bias towards Apple there. Nope, none at all.

Re:Blame the Cheap Chinese Tablets

[EvilStein]

When I had an Android device, I was wanting to blame the cheap Chinese developers. Seriously. Some of the "apps" are just stupid soundboard apps and crap that shows you a picture when you finish a call. Completely worthless shit, but Chinese developers were just flooding the Android Market with stuff like that.

The iTunes app store has a similar problem. Look at all the Chinese shit in the Medical category.

Re:effect vs. affect

[santiagoanders]

Really... Only one person caught this usage error and commented? Damn. Read a book, people!

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Apple users are guilty

[PhilHibbs]

Not flaming: I am an iPhone4 and iPad2 owner, and I love them. But, I feel a little guilty about it. I an in a walled garden, my freedom is curtailed, etc. etc., and as a geek, I feel guilty about that. So, I don't spend any more money than I need to within this walled garden, and I don't speak up about it very often.

If I had an Android device, I would be much more vocal and enthusiastic about it, I would buy more apps, and probably be inclined to rate them more often and more highly, because I would be getting a "feel good" factor for being on a platform that has more "geek cred" than the iOS.

About a year ago, I told my brother that my next phone would probably be an Android, and I expected that it would be around about now that I would be looking for one. One week later I accidentally dropped and smashed my iPhone3 so I went out and got an iPhone4 the next day because I didn't have the luxury of a period of time in which to transfer my important habits and data over to the new platform. Since my new iPhone4 is likely to still be useful this time next year, I expect maybe I will get something else, maybe Android, around Christmas 2012.

Re:Apple users are guilty

[geekoid]

You're just making excuse for being Apple's bitch.

Didn't have time to move your data over, please.
Hos is getting it to an new iPhone faster or easier then getting to an android device?

Re:Apple users are guilty

[PhilHibbs]

Yup.

I restored my data using iTunes without even having to press any buttons, that's how it's faster and easier.

Re:Uhhh...

[SunTzuWarmaster]

Relevant Ren and Stimpy reference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP0kWqJJZa4

Re:Uhhh...

[Dunega]

Drop every apostrophe and move that extra period from the end of the first sentence to the end of the last one.

Re:Angry Birds for Android

[NatasRevol]

Wow, that's a perfect example of why people don't develop for Android - more ways not to get paid.

I also disagree

[notKevinJohn]

I have found many high quality apps for Android. I have developed for both platforms, and its no secret that I absolutely detest the process of building iPhone apps. For me to load a helloWorld program onto my iOS device took me $100.00 for the licensing fee, several hours to figure out Objective-C, and several days of reading blogs and tinkering to actually get the provisioning profile and app to sync up and ALLOW me to load code that I had written onto a device that I own. In contrast, it took me about 2 hours to get my development environment set up, download the SDK, write and load my program to my Android device. The moral of the story is that Android is a much more welcoming platform, and in my view quite superior.

Really, how shocking~

[geekoid]

A) The bar to entry is lower, so there are more apps, and more poor apps.

B) Who is app starved? What does the iPhone have that I don't have an equivalent of?

The iPhone was a great bar setter when it came out, now? not so much. It's been later with several feature then android was.
""Do some googling for "can't download apps from android market" or similar wording, and you'll see that this is a widespread chronic issue for all devices and all OS versions,""

I did, just last week, I found that a tiny number of users sometimes have problems.

Personal anecdote: The only time I ever had a problem was when I tried to use the amazon downloader on my G1. And it was pretty clearly Amazons fault.

Re:Really?

[david_thornley]

Actually, there's more Android phones than iPhones out there. There's a lot more iPads than Android tablets, and Android really has nothing comparable to the iPod Touch. Overall, last I looked there were more iOS devices than Android.

Re:Uhhh...

[iamhassi]

Did you miss the part of the story where he says Android users have more support issues? So much for being more tech savvy. In my experience it's been the opposite, iPhone users are tech savvy and went iOS because it has all the big developers and the good apps and the android users were not tech savvy but easily impressed by the whiz bang features (ohhh... 8mp!) and could not really afford an IPhone. I've never met a droid user who bought it because they wanted it, every smartphone argument includes "yeah but you paid $200+ for your iPhone and I only paid....".

Re:Uhhh...

[BitZtream]

I am more interested in the actual phone.

Really? Then why did you buy a device where the phone is a secondary function? Seems like it would have made sense to by a device where the phone was the primary function.

Re:Uhhh...

[element-o.p.]

Ditto, Dell Streak 7 and HTC Hero running 2.2 and 2.1-update1, respectively.

Re:Uhhh...

[iamhassi]

Don't blame tap tap revenge. Like the angry birds story on here a few months ago, the android market is horribly fragmented so developers have to develop games that will work on the lowliest of devices otherwise risk pissing off customers by telling them the game wont work on their new free droid (which is actually from 2009) and a support nightmare. Angry birds had to make two versions of the game for that reason, one for slower devices. Hence you get games that look like they're for the NES rather than developers making two versions of the same game. iOS avoids all that, if your device isn't fast enough it just won't show you those textures or lighting effects or whatever but the game still works.

Re:Uhhh...

[Cederic]

The thing I picked up from that is how well the Xtranormal voice synth copes with 'shitty ass'. Practically fluent!

(more work needed on 'motherfucking' though, alas)

Re:4000 1000?

[IrrepressibleMonkey]

"on iOS, user reviews for Battleheart average 4.5 stars (4000 total ratings), which is quite good. On Android it's a stunning 4.8, with 1000 ratings," writes the developer. "So not only is it reviewed more highly, it's also reviewed more often

It does not seem to be rated that much more highly, and it is certainly not reviewed more often.

From reading the developer's blog post, it's clear he's sold a lot more on iOS than Android. It's not clear from the linked article, but he's saying that Android users are more likely to give a rating for a purchased application. The 1000 Android ratings represent a larger proportion of sales he's had on Android, than the 4000 iOS reviews measured against the total sales he's made on that platform.

Re:Uhhh...

[thetoadwarrior]

So a phone users was impressed by a phone someone took the effort to set up, tweak and hand select good apps. That's no surprise. Give them a brand new Android phone and set them loose on the market themselves to wade through the shit.

I love Battleheart, but Mika Mobile is wrong

[rsborg]

They claim that Android is a great place to make money for decent apps, but what they fail to state is that if Battleheart hadn't had such a success on iOS, then their Android story might be completely different ... it's not just that their Android App looks great and plays nice, it's that it's had 6 months of free marketing on the Apple App Store, and Android users have been waiting for the game to be ported.

I would love to see a similar game come out only on Android and compare the sales.

Would Mika Mobile be willing to make their next game initially exclusive to Android just to test this theory?

Re:I love Battleheart, but Mika Mobile is wrong

[Sparton]

I would love to see a similar game come out only on Android and compare the sales.

Would Mika Mobile be willing to make their next game initially exclusive to Android just to test this theory?

And as an extension to that, Mika Mobile also claimed that you don't need to be free to make money. As interesting as their statistics are in that department, I wonder if they'd have more popularity and/or make more money if the app was indeed using a free-to-play model.

Re:Sacrilege!!

[prospectofdeath]

I don't know why, but the Android folks always seem to defend their platform with fiery passion whenever they encounter even the slightest insult.

There's an app for that.

Re:Really?

[IrrepressibleMonkey]

FUD much, Mr. Mika Mobile "developer"?

Don't take it so personally. There's no FUD from Mika Mobile. Read his blog post - linked in the article - he's pretty positive about Android and developing for the platform. It's still just one guy's opinion, but I think you'd be happier if you read the original post and not the posted article or the submitted summary. The Android Defence League can stand down... The guy is OK.

Re:Uhhh...

[s73v3r]

As a developer for both, I will say that making an elegant and attractive UI for iOS is exponentially easier than on Android. The Android gui designers suck ass.

Re:Uhhh...

[s73v3r]

Good for you. But if you were only interested in the phone, then perhaps you'd be better off with a dumbphone. For many of us, though, we are interested in the apps, and how much money people are making.

Re:Uhhh...

[s73v3r]

It's been a while since I've looked at doing higher end graphics stuff on Android, but doesn't the SDK give you a way to query the device to see if it supports the higher end features like the textures, shading/lighting effects and such?

Re:4000 1000?

[rsborg]

It is, though, if you look at the distribution. For most decent apps, people pick between 4 stars or 5 stars. A technically functional, resonably thought out app isn't going to get 1 or 2 stars. Occasionally you'll get a 3, but mostly 4 or 5s. Based on this, about half of iPhone users rate it a 5. But 80% of Android users do. The 4.8 gets even more impressive when you throw back in the 1,2,and 3 ratings.

The number is the big deal. At around 1000, you are mostly getting the folks who love the game and were waiting for it. At about 5000, you get some folks who were "hyped into buying" and end up disappointed for some reason. Also the haters and idiot reviews start piling up here. I'd say 4.8 at 1000 vs. 4.5 at 5000 is pretty much equivalent.

Re:Great Wall not Prison Wall

[PhilHibbs]

My original expectation was partly based on the scare stories I'd heard about Android malware, and the hope that they would do something to fix that.

Re:Sacrilege!!

[blair1q]

Someone has to roust the iPhone drunks.

Re:1000 4000

[Black Parrot]

Yeah, the ">" disappeared from my subject line. I should learn to pay attention to that 'preview' thingy.

Can you recommend some good ones?

[tepples]

I'm looking for some free total conversions for GPL Quake 1-3 to try on my computer. (Assets from retail Quake aren't free.) Which do you recommend?

Re:Uhhh...

[rwven]

There are only 1/4 the votes though. Quadrupling the votes could very easily drop it more than .2 points.

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

Apparently it's only pompous when Apple users say it. When Android fans say it, it's "+5 Reinforces My Preferences".

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

No. It's "blame apple fanboys for FUD and rhetoric".

You complain about "FUD and rhetoric", then immediately writes FUD and rhetoric. Why am I not surprised you got modded up?

I enjoy the fact that I dumped Apple every time I need to manage media or clean out my SMS messages.

I am less interested in the store, or how much money Google is making, or how much money app developers are making.

I am more interested in the actual phone.

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

It's been a while since I've looked at doing higher end graphics stuff on Android, but doesn't the SDK give you a way to query the device to see if it supports the higher end features like the textures, shading/lighting effects and such?

The problem isn't just whether it supports it, it's whether it supports it *well*.

App-starved? My Apple/Android experience

[Dennis Sheil]

I develop applications for Android, so I am most familiar with that. Recently I was using someone's non-jailbroken iPad, and wanted to put an free SSH application on it. I didn't find much for the iPad, I found a little more for iPhone apps that worked on iPad. The best one I could get conked out every 500 characters or so, and you'd have to close the app, open it again, and reconnect unless you bought the app for $1.99.

I would write an ad-supported SSH app for iPhone/iPad myself if I didn't need a Mac, a $99 a year App Store account, a knowledge of Objective C, a knowledge of the iPhone API, the ultimate application approval of Apple, and all the other hurdles.

Compare this to the myriad number of free SSH apps for the Android.

I don't have a lot of iPhone/iPad experience, but for the one thing I needed, Apple was app-starved in an area where Android is not.

Re:App-starved? My Apple/Android experience

[Dennis Sheil]

So why the hell are you suggesting that you need to buy a Mac and all the rest just to get an SSH app that works on the iPad?

There is a $1.99 SSH app for Apple, as I noted in my first paragraph. I said I'd need a Mac if I wanted to write an SSH app for iPad, not buy one.

Re:Uhhh...

[Bogtha]

As an android user, I don't feel this way in the slightest

I've been using Android phones since the first one came out. I'm also an iOS developer, so I've been using Android and iOS apps every day for years. There is a massive difference in quality. I choose Android because it's more open, it lets you do more, and because I prefer a hardware keyboard. But if I were to choose on quality alone, there would simply be no contest. Even the built-in apps on Android are terrible, it seems like even they were hastily slapped together. It is a perpetual disappointment.

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

As an android user, I don't feel this way in the slightest. Actually, when my iPhone friends play with my phone they are pretty much always impressed.

That's because Apple users aren't the "fanboys" you slashdot nerds seem to think they are. When you show a cool lock-screen widget or whatever, we don't get defensive like Android fans do. We're like, "hey, that's pretty cool", then happily continue using our iPhones. We don't feel personally threatened if some other product is nice or better in some way.

Just take a look at the posts and modding going on with this story. This is a perfect example of EVERYTHING negative you all claim about Apple "fanboys". Say what you will about fanboys, but Fandroids are the worst.

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[account_deleted]

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Re:Uhhh...

[flibuste]

Yes, you can discover some features of your device. But it still doesn't solve the problem of the big differences between devices. Trying to accomodate low-ends smartphones takes way too much development time. But you somewhat have to, or as your OP said, you piss off users.
That's in my opinion the ONLY area where IPhone apps win. Devs know exactly on what it's going to run, there is 0 possibility for surprises. With Android, you need to be ready for anything...

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

Right, because you didn't include "stupid" in your post? You're saying that's not pompous?

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

I never insulted apple actually.

Where did I claim you did?

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[account_deleted]

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Re:Really?

[Sparton]

However, I have just checked the game on iTunes and I see it currently has only 597 ratings for all versions of the game (453 for the current version). So I would think the blog post from which the 4,000 figure comes from has a typo in it.

I just checked as well, and a website was also reporting only a few hundred ratings, but the iTunes page for the game does indeed have over 4000 ratings. Not sure how this is reporting wrong; maybe old version of iTunes?..

Re:Uhhh...

[Mongoose Disciple]

Look, if you're not specific about what you mean, you can't get angry when it's not read the way you'd apparently like. It's your fault for not saying: "I don't like when they call me stupid."

Custom Rooted ROMs?

[w0mprat]

I have a custom ROM on my phone, lots of Apps mysteriously break on download from market, and sometimes don't even install when sideloading. I supsect many users harass developers about their Apps when they shouldn't. If its not their own fault for riding the bleeding edge of OSS software then they should harass their carrier for it's dodgy customized Android. In my case aftermarket ROMs run better than the stock carrier flakeware ever did.

I also blame the evergreen problem of OS and applications lacking a meaningful and useful error messages about what is going wrong. Thus leading users down the wrong path trying to find help.

"Installation failed" - no shit, but why? I know how to find the logs through the terminal (but command like work is torture on a touchscreen with my fat fingers), but most users wont.

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

Yes, that's what I wrote. Very good, you know how to copy and paste.

Now, which part talks about insulting Apple?

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

Nice try, but it doesn't make your comment any less pompous.

Re:Uhhh...

[jedidiah]

FUD and rhetoric eh?

Then you will tell me how to quickly delete all of my text messages on an iPhone then. The other joker whined "get a dumb phone". It's funny because after having used an iPhone for awhile I actually pined for my previous "dumb phone" because it at least got that part right.

Apple are great products for people that don't use them very seriously or in any creative sort of manner.

Re:Really?

[node 3]

Yep. Everything I've seen recently says that there are more Android devices out there than iOS (though iPhones are the most successful handset type), so I don't see how 1000 Android users is a higher percentage users than 4000 iOS users..

There are more iOS devices than Android. Approximately 2:1.

So, yup, FUD. Just not where you think you're seeing it.

If people even try them...

[Paul Fernhout]

https://market.android.com/details?id=com.evojazz (my app where you breed new music).

There are 200,000 apps or so out there (about half free). Even when you write something you think is good, who will try it, especially if you charge for it? I tried a model of "three years paid and then that verison goes under the GPL", but who even cares about that (except me)?

The good news is, in three years people will replace their fancy Android SmartPhones, and those old ones can go to materially poor children around the planet so they can join in the global conversation as well as have fun and learn from all the free apps out there. That's overall got to be a good thing. Something I wrote about that on the p2presearch list:
    http://listcultures.org/pipermail/p2presearch_listcultures.org/2009-November/006250.html

Anyone know of a foundation job I could get making more free educational software for the Android planning for that day?

Re:4000 1000?

[djrogers]

You're missing the time scale here - the iOS app has been out for a long time, sold far more copies, and has gathered 4000 reviews, while the newly released Android app already has 1000 reviews. The rate of reviews/sales and reviews/time are much higher on their Android app. Or you could have just read the whole article...

Re:Uhhh...

[shutdown -p now]

I've never met a droid user who bought it because they wanted it

Hi, a Samsung Galaxy S2 (and previously Nexus One) owner here, pleased to meet you. I paid more for both of these phones - for starters, because I couldn't buy them on contract, and also because I had SGS2 shipped from Europe since it's not out in US. I knowingly did so because I wanted specific features only available in an Android phone.

Oh yes, in between Nexus and SGS2, I had an iPhone for a few months. It's good overall, and excellent in some aspects (most notably, battery life), but it doesn't match up to high-level Android phones.

Re:Uhhh...

[Mongoose Disciple]

I give. I'm done trying to correct for your poor reading comprehension and writing skills.

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

But you're not done being pompous about Apple customers, like you complained about being done to you. Nitpicking to try and divert attention doesn't make you any less pompous.

Re:Uhhh...

[Mongoose Disciple]

I was never complaining about what was being done to me, as I own neither kind of phone and have no dog in this fight.

It's also not pompous to use the word stupid to describe the way someone else is describing people.

Look, I get that English obviously isn't your first language, and I'm positive I speak whatever your native tongue is a lot worse than you speak English, but you're missing really basic things here and that's making it impossible to have a real conversation.

Re:Uhhh...

[node 3]

Um, you called iamhassi's post pompous. I just pointed out that Android fans make similarly pompous posts about Apple users.

You can nitpick about the specific *details* of the pomposity all you want, it doesn't change the fact that the pomposity is there.

Re:Really?

[somersault]

I was thinking of figures from the phone market, but as someone else pointed out, the iPod Touch skews the figures well into iOS territory (unless whoever made up the figure you're referring to didn't include stuff like the Archos and all the cheap chinese tablets/phones out there).

Re:Really?

[node 3]

There are over 100 million iPhones. This happened around September of last year. Android hit 100 million sometime over the past month or so.

I don't want to make it sound like I'm putting down Android. I'm not. But there's a lot of misinformation going around with regards to market share, and has been for over a year now, on Slashdot.