Big Brother Calls 'Shotgun' In Illinois

Reader kackle joins the army of free and accepted Slashdot submitters with this eyebrow-raising story: "I received a form letter from the Illinois State Toll Highway Authority saying that my first-generation 'IPASS' transponder needs to be replaced because the battery is old. I called them for clarification since the first-generation transponders obviously have user-replaceable batteries, and I wanted to keep this version because it beeps when a toll is paid. (This notifies drivers that their battery is still good, unlike the silent second-generation version, which informs them of a dead battery by sending a ticket in the mail.) The woman on the phone explained that they were replacing them just because the electronics are old. This uninformed answer made me research the device. I found that the manufacturer has recently filed a patent application for a new transponder that has a camera in it — a camera pointed inward at the occupants. How long before they make it illegal to cover that camera with tape?"

Comments

So don't cover it with tape

[Anonymous Coward]

Take a picture of the inside of your car, shrink it down, and attach it to the camera. They'll be so confused about the driverless car that they won't worry about what laws you might be breaking.

Re:So don't cover it with tape

[batquux]

What's the point, anyway? If the device is working, then the toll gets paid. If it's not, they aren't going to get an image from it.

Jolly.

[ackthpt]

So now you won't even be able to enjoy a beer in the front seat without being caught on video.

Are they even making the things yet?

[jandrese]

From what I can tell, they have not manufactured a single device with a camera on it. Until they're actually in use somewhere, I'm not going to get my panties in a bunch. For all you know the camera equipped model is for specific edge cases like maybe charging cabs more if they have an occupant or something and won't be used 99% of the time.

Re:Are they even making the things yet?

[tchuladdiass]

From the Illinois Tollway site:
The Tollway recommends that these transponders be replaced for two important reasons:

        The older transponder model is no longer being manufactured and, therefore, is no longer certified by the manufacturer.
        Our testing has shown that the older transponder model does not perform as well as the new transponders on the new open road tolling system.

The first point means that if the tollway were to update the receiver equipment on the roads, they are not guaranteed to work with the old transponders. And I can vouch for the second point personally -- many problems with the first generation of transponders.

The other main problem with the first gen transponders, is that the battery looks like a regular AA battery, but it is actually a 3.6 volt Lithium battery. Users were replacing them with a regular AA, and therefore getting the under voltage condition.

Re:Damn

[Skreems]

Yeah! On the bus, the only cameras recording me are the 3 or 4 little black domes mounted on the ceiling!

Wait...

Non-story

[OverlordQ]

The next abstract part:

and an evaluation unit connected down-line of the camera that detects and counts the passengers of the vehicle in the image recording.

Sounds like a company that makes toll devices, are patenting a toll device that can enforce HOV Tolls by detecting if you actually have more then one person in the vehicle . . . . imagine that.

which informs them of a dead battery by sending a ticket in the mail.

Nothing in that first page had *anything* to do with a battery, it had to do with their billing system and having invalid license plate data.

This uninformed answer made me research the device.

And come up with the completely wrong conclusion.

Jesus christ I know /. isn't what it used to be, but seriously is this the Daily Mail now?

Re:Non-story

[HeckRuler]

a toll device that can enforce HOV Tolls by detecting if you actually have more then one person in the vehicle . . . . imagine that.

I am imagining it. And it's horrible. Think about this. As you drive down the road, they take a picture of you in your car using a camera in your car which is required to use the service. They send that to someone to check to see if you're breaking the rules.... That's a 1984 telescreen snooping on you.

Now, of course, they only want to use it to enforce the commuter lanes. And as lame as it is, I'm going to invoke the slippery slope argument. If they can catch you for breaking one rule, you KNOW they're going to append the rules to bust drunks. Then video is going to be used as evidence in some horrible crash of a white male not paying attention as he slams into someone. It'll be contested. They'll win. And now you drive in a Panopticon.

I'm all for people following the rules, but this is putting WAY too much trust in the toll road operators.

Worst slashdot article ever?

[gad_zuki!]

There is no camera in any ipass system nor any intention of doing so. Camera tech is ancient, this could have been implemented 10 years ago. I know this is the kind of manufactured controversy that gets ad impressions for slashdot, but please, there are real problems in the world, and this isn't one of them.

carpool discount, possible reason for the camera

[joeaguy]

In the NYC area there are many toll discount programs for call pools with ezpass. In order to get the discount, you must use a cash lane even though you have an ezpass, so an attendant can confirm you are driving with the required number of people for the discount. So you pay less, but you get stuck in traffic with all the people paying cash. If a transponder had an inward facing camera then it could provide a way of letting you use ezpass only lanes and still get the discounts.

This application makes it no less freaky. I would only ever consider it if there were some technological privacy safeguard. For instance, a built in manually operated only door over the lens. When I approach a toll, I have to slide it open to allow the picture to be taken to get my discount. After the toll, I can slide it back closed.

There are lots of people who keep their ezpass in the metal coated bag and only mount it when they are near a toll, and there are non-toll ezpass readers all over the place, with the stated goal of monitoring traffic flow. Wanting to pay tolls faster and get discounts should not mean having to submit to random and capricious tracking and a total loss of privacy when traveling.

Re:One good thing about NY

[jonnythan]

This has never happened. They do not do this and the state has specifically said it will not.

Re:carpool discount, possible reason for the camer

[idontgno]

When I approach a toll, I have to slide it open to allow the camera to image the picture of a fully occupied car I hold in front of the lens to get my discount. After the toll, I can slide it back closed.

FTFY.

Still, an inward-viewing camera inside the car? Monitored by a State agency? The reason doesn't matter. It's still creepy and wrong.

Re:One good thing about NY

[djdanlib]

Ah, quite right, it appears. I had to ask again to make sure I got the story straight. The warnings they received were about speeding in the EZPass lane, not between the toll booths.

I went and looked it up... http://www.snopes.com/autos/law/ezpass.asp

And there is an image of the warning at http://www.nytrafficticket.com/blog/index.php/2009/04/17/speeding-in-the-ez-pass-lane/

Carry on.

Summary is WRONG

[LanMan04]

(This notifies drivers that their battery is still good, unlike the silent second-generation version, which informs them of a dead battery by sending a ticket in the mail.)

This is not correct when you sign up for an IPASS account, you give the toll authority your license plate numbers. If your vehicle goes through a toll and the IPASS unit doesn't work correctly, when the toll authority goes through the photos of supposed violators' plate numbers, yours will be cleared as a registered plate and they just deduct the toll as per usual. It shows up on your IPASS transaction list/invoice as a "Virtual Toll". I had a bunch of those on my statement from when I took the unit off of one car and put it on another for a week, and they didn't seem to care at all. Same regular toll price.

The summary links for a forum post that says

"Worse, the way they're sorting out motorcycles from cars is by doctoring the plate number in the system, so when they go to check your plate number, it won't come up even if it's linked to the account, and they assume that you're not an I-Pass customer even if you are."

So that's some issue with motorcycles and the way their goofy system works, and this was in 2005.

Now, since they can read your plate and determine if you're an IPASS user, and there is no penalty for not having an IPASS unit in your car if you're a registered user...why have IPASS units at all? I guess for when it's raining or the plate is obscured and they can't collect a toll by OCRing the plate?