Slashdot Mirror
Big Brother Calls 'Shotgun' In Illinois
Reader kackle joins the army of free and accepted Slashdot submitters with this eyebrow-raising story: "I received a form letter from the Illinois State Toll Highway Authority saying that my first-generation 'IPASS' transponder needs to be replaced because the battery is old. I called them for clarification since the first-generation transponders obviously have user-replaceable batteries, and I wanted to keep this version because it beeps when a toll is paid. (This notifies drivers that their battery is still good, unlike the silent second-generation version, which informs them of a dead battery by sending a ticket in the mail.) The woman on the phone explained that they were replacing them just because the electronics are old. This uninformed answer made me research the device. I found that the manufacturer has recently filed a patent application for a new transponder that has a camera in it — a camera pointed inward at the occupants. How long before they make it illegal to cover that camera with tape?"
I've found I can escape this by taking the fucking train or bus. #CTA
Take a picture of the inside of your car, shrink it down, and attach it to the camera. They'll be so confused about the driverless car that they won't worry about what laws you might be breaking.
So now you won't even be able to enjoy a beer in the front seat without being caught on video.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
The state that spawned Lincoln is not to be trusted.
From what I can tell, they have not manufactured a single device with a camera on it. Until they're actually in use somewhere, I'm not going to get my panties in a bunch. For all you know the camera equipped model is for specific edge cases like maybe charging cabs more if they have an occupant or something and won't be used 99% of the time.
I read the internet for the articles.
Land of the free, home of the brave ... my ass.
I'm stunned at how Americans would be so ready to roll over and take it up the ass for something like this.
Time was there's be a bunch of people talking about refreshing the tree of Liberty with the blood of patriots ... now they just want to super size their cokes.
Rise up America, you're rapidly turning into the most apathetic people around when it comes to your rights. Which means the rest of us are completely fucked.
You've gone from being the gold standard for the defense of personal liberties to embracing a police state with no rights.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely. indymedia
The police can already get your ezpass/fastpass/ipass records fairly easily, which makes it easy to see where you've been and when. The real solution is to not trade your privacy for a few seconds of convenience while driving.
I thought that such transponders used a passive-backscatter technology like RFID, not requiring batteries?
Tell them to f*ck off.
I have my own set of paranoia, one where some thief breaks the window of my car to steal my transponder. Unlikely, yes, but as a result, my transponder ends up in between the seats covered with paper. Can't you do something similar? Also, are you sure the transponder has a camera? Because that thing would run out of battery fast, and there's a difference (unfortunately) between patenting something and actually building it.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Seems like a little bit of black tape ought to fix the camera, no?
And how long will it be before somebody hacks it to transmit pictures of hentai (NSFW) back to the Illinois traffic HQ?
Or, more likely: how long before somebody hacks it to pick up the camera feed from unauthorized recievers?
Domains, shared and dedicated hosting, SSL certs, and more: ArrowBay.net
All you gotta do is put a camera on something? I'd like to patent Video Pants.
Someone flopped a steamer in the gene pool.
The next abstract part:
Sounds like a company that makes toll devices, are patenting a toll device that can enforce HOV Tolls by detecting if you actually have more then one person in the vehicle . . . . imagine that.
Nothing in that first page had *anything* to do with a battery, it had to do with their billing system and having invalid license plate data.
And come up with the completely wrong conclusion.
Jesus christ I know /. isn't what it used to be, but seriously is this the Daily Mail now?
Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
What if a baby (a baby) does a huge poop (they store that up for the car, I'm sure of it) and you have to change them in plain site of that evil camera. Why you would being filming and transmitting what is by all means scat child porn. I'd refuse on those grounds alone...
a bit silly I know; but the law is the law.
There is no camera in any ipass system nor any intention of doing so. Camera tech is ancient, this could have been implemented 10 years ago. I know this is the kind of manufactured controversy that gets ad impressions for slashdot, but please, there are real problems in the world, and this isn't one of them.
If it comes down to it Ill Just go get a couple rolls of dimes and call it a day... Ha found a flaw in you plan illinois.. And after living in IL my entire life I want out...
When I'm not using my EZPass transponder (SF Bay area), it's in a foil pouch in the glove box. I only take it out when I'm immediately passing though tolls.
Here in NY we have EZ-Pass, which is also used by several other states (though I hear some of the other states charge fees for them). NY doesn't charge for the transponder itself, and they provide a faraday cage bag to keep it in when not in use (showing they realize people don't want a permanent transponder). It doesn't beep when a toll is paid, instead you wait for the light to turn green as you go through the toll booth. The only privacy issue is that the state could theoretically measure how long it takes you to get from one booth to another and try to automatically issue speeding tickets.
I guess IPASS must be one of those "no-booth" systems where you don't have to slow down or stop (thus the need to beep), but I can't imagine why they would think they could get away with a camera. Though, just because the company filed a patent for the idea doesn't mean the transponder has one.
The right to protest the State is more sacred than the State.
Every day now I'm seeing conspiracy-theorist/libertarian/"angry white man" propaganda on what used to be a fairly useful IT news site.
Maybe this is government corruption. The government could have bought lots of new transponders from a manufacturer that made large political donations and in order to get rid of them they force folks to replace their existing, perfectly functional, transponders.
Not a shock to see this in the People Republic of Illinois
Has anyone been experiencing weird reboots with their augs lately? I got an email from the LIMB clinic saying I should get the control chip replaced, think I'm going to go...
Do you have any evidence that they are trying to replace your device with a new one that has a camera? Just because the manufacturer filed for some patent doesn't mean your state is using that technology, or that anyone would want to buy it for that matter. And then there's the tinfoil hat slippery slope conclusion that covering a camera might be illegal someday? Has anyone in your legislature proposed such an idea?
If you follow the link about the ticket by mail, you will read that the problem was a plate mismatch. Presumably they have cameras at the booth like other states do, so if your battery dies they can look at the photo, match the plate, and send you a letter telling you that your battery died.
1. Take the slow lane, get rid of transponder, don't let the gov't track your driving at all
- or -
2. Remove from cabin and store in metal lockbox in trunk when not in use
Or take transit, bike, telecommute, carpool...
This post is a series of unrelated facts that come together in a paranoid conclusion. Nowhere in here would I conclude that the state is adding cameras to their EZ-Pass, only that there is a company that COULD do that. Posting this was a really dumb editorial call, /.
In the NYC area there are many toll discount programs for call pools with ezpass. In order to get the discount, you must use a cash lane even though you have an ezpass, so an attendant can confirm you are driving with the required number of people for the discount. So you pay less, but you get stuck in traffic with all the people paying cash. If a transponder had an inward facing camera then it could provide a way of letting you use ezpass only lanes and still get the discounts.
This application makes it no less freaky. I would only ever consider it if there were some technological privacy safeguard. For instance, a built in manually operated only door over the lens. When I approach a toll, I have to slide it open to allow the picture to be taken to get my discount. After the toll, I can slide it back closed.
There are lots of people who keep their ezpass in the metal coated bag and only mount it when they are near a toll, and there are non-toll ezpass readers all over the place, with the stated goal of monitoring traffic flow. Wanting to pay tolls faster and get discounts should not mean having to submit to random and capricious tracking and a total loss of privacy when traveling.
From the Toll pass website:
I have one of the old display model transponders that beeps. Can I keep replacing the battery instead of swapping it out for a new transponder?
These older model transponders need to be replaced to ensure customers continue to receive the benefits of I-PASS and avoid toll violations. The Tollway recommends that these transponders be replaced for two important reasons:
1. The older transponder model is no longer being manufactured and, therefore, is no longer certified by the manufacturer.
2. Our testing has shown that the older transponder model does not perform as well as the new transponders on the new open road tolling system.
Put a picture of Anthony Wiener in front of the camera.
If someone is passing you on the right, you are an asshole for driving in the wrong lane.
Wait till they add GPS for real fun and excitement. Little store and forward of a picture of the driver's face once the GPS speed reading goes over the posted speed limit which is uploaded at the next toll plaza.
Companies submit patents for many things they don't have any plans of ever implementing. I see it for Apple all the time for example and most of these things aren't done. I for example have several patents I invented for Apple and few of them are used.
It's time to stop being alarmist. Don't get yourself overexcited over nothing.
The right thing to do would be to get the 2nd generation pass. When you got it you would have noticed there is no camera on it. There's no need to instead get overexcited by giving out info that isn't turns out not to be true.
Actually... based on how they do it just over the line in MA, I bet there is a more subtle play going on.
Here, if a transponder stops working, or there is an account problem (happened to me) they treat it just like any other unpaid toll. They take a picture, and send you a ticket in the mail. This part is key you see. Now you call them up, and the process is now dealing with a ticket. They can't help you, and have no incentive to because its not collected and dealt with by the same people.
So I could call up, pay the tolls, and fix my account. However, I still had to, seperately, appeal the ticket... which they get to send via snail mail and put an unreasonably short time period on, at which point they get to tack on penalties which were intended for fraudulent users of the service.... and just because the original ticket was an account error thats been taken care of is, in their mind, no good reason to do away with the penalties for not paying them within 21 days.
On top of all this, you must file a written appeal, and then.... call them back repeatedly to see if they have answered it yet.
Basically....they have designed the system for maximum bilk, and the last thing they want is you getting an early warning that there is a red white and blue cock locked onto your ass.
"I opened my eyes, and everything went dark again"
When I approach a toll, I have to slide it open to allow the camera to image the picture of a fully occupied car I hold in front of the lens to get my discount. After the toll, I can slide it back closed.
FTFY.
Still, an inward-viewing camera inside the car? Monitored by a State agency? The reason doesn't matter. It's still creepy and wrong.
Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
The British did the rise up thing in 1649... Didn't like it.
Deleted
America has a public statement of principles
This public statement of principles hasn't been worth the paper it's written on since the Supreme Court scratched "among the several states" from the commerce clause in Wickard v. Filburn in the 1940s.
This one guy on the internet got a ticket back in 2005 because his supposedly died. Wow. What fail-proof iron clad scientific evidence you have there. If there were a nobel prize for ground breaking research in the area of tollway transponders, you would have won several times by now.
Malory: Lana Kane, just because you're not the only black field agent... ...but that didn't stop J. Edna Hoover from prosecuting Martin Luther King, now did it?
Lana: Hey! That's not...
Malory: "Urban," whatever. You come in here and accuse Conway of...what, exactly?
Lana: OK, I can't prove anything right now, but that's
Malory:
Lana: What does that have to do with...wait, "J. Edna?"
Malory: You never heard? That J. Edgar Hoover was this huge crossdressing chicken-hawk?
Lana: I had not.
Malory: Well, that's exactly the kind of slanderous and unsubstantiated illogical conclusions that we will not tolerate at SLASHDOT.
whatever, replace battery ignore letter
You've paid your tax dollars to fund the construction of this infrastructure. Why pay a second tax to use it?
I have been known to drive 20 miles out of my way to avoid toll roads. They are a tax menace that need to be disposed of...quickly!
I'm just sick and tied of these Patent Tolls I keep heaing about. When will the govenment get thei act togethe and epeal these patents?
The old models only have a battery because they beep and some (perhaps all) have a display showing your I-PASS balance. The newer models are entirely sealed, and do not require a battery because they work by RFID chips. This post is a bit ridiculous.
If you want the reasoning... go no farther than the I-PASS website (quoted below):
I have one of the old display model transponders that beeps. Can I keep replacing the battery instead of swapping it out for a new transponder?
These older model transponders need to be replaced to ensure customers continue to receive the benefits of I-PASS and avoid toll violations. The Tollway recommends that these transponders be replaced for two important reasons:
The older transponder model is no longer being manufactured and, therefore, is no longer certified by the manufacturer. Our testing has shown that the older transponder model does not perform as well as the new transponders on the new open road tolling system."
Any toll plaza already has this ability. Point A at 9:12, Point B at 9:15, wait they are 6 miles apart....
People in cars cause accidents....accidents in cars cause people
Tape over the camera and/or microphone. Find the GPS antenna and disconnect or cut the lead, or just wrap it in aluminum foil and connect it to signal ground. Nobody should have to put up with this shit.
Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
I live in IL and have an IPASS on two of my vehicles (got the units about 6 months ago).
In addition to the ugly little units that you have to attach to the inside of your windshield with adhesive/plastic velcro-like stuff (UGLY), they offer "external" IPASS devices that attach to your front license plate with screws. Called a "License Plate Tag": http://www.illinoistollway.com/portal/page?_pageid=133,1392898&_dad=portal&_schema=PORTAL#mount_transponder
Ostensibly, these are to be used by people with special windshields that block the IPASS signal (no idea what causes that, but maybe some self-defrosting windshields have metallic stuff in them?), but they'll let anyone who wants to order one. The reason I got them is that I like my windshield clean, TYVM.
Of course, they could get stolen off your license plate with a screwdriver, but I haven't had that problem.
Anyway, this takes care of the "camera in my car" issue.
With the first link, the chain is forged.
What are the purpose of these, since infrastructure problems could/should generally be funded by their respective taxes?
(This notifies drivers that their battery is still good, unlike the silent second-generation version, which informs them of a dead battery by sending a ticket in the mail.)
This is not correct when you sign up for an IPASS account, you give the toll authority your license plate numbers. If your vehicle goes through a toll and the IPASS unit doesn't work correctly, when the toll authority goes through the photos of supposed violators' plate numbers, yours will be cleared as a registered plate and they just deduct the toll as per usual. It shows up on your IPASS transaction list/invoice as a "Virtual Toll". I had a bunch of those on my statement from when I took the unit off of one car and put it on another for a week, and they didn't seem to care at all. Same regular toll price.
The summary links for a forum post that says
"Worse, the way they're sorting out motorcycles from cars is by doctoring the plate number in the system, so when they go to check your plate number, it won't come up even if it's linked to the account, and they assume that you're not an I-Pass customer even if you are."
So that's some issue with motorcycles and the way their goofy system works, and this was in 2005.
Now, since they can read your plate and determine if you're an IPASS user, and there is no penalty for not having an IPASS unit in your car if you're a registered user...why have IPASS units at all? I guess for when it's raining or the plate is obscured and they can't collect a toll by OCRing the plate?
With the first link, the chain is forged.
This demands a rimshot!
I only pay cash. Sure they can still track me with license plate cameras, and sure they can still take (arguable less clear) pictures through the windows, but I will not enable (and pay for!) the privelege of making it easier of government to track me. So I pay cash at all tolls. I've heard rumblings of eventually ending cash lanes on some roads, but if that's teh case it just means the few longer drives I make in a year just get a bit longer, though perhaps more interesting from taking more back roads.
I have four degrees, and have read this story summary twice.
It makes no sense whatsoever to me.
Perhaps because I am not from the US and don't drive a car (I'm guessing it might be something to do with a car because the 'Highway Authority' is mentioned)?
Can someone post a plain-English paraphrase of the story? What is this "transponder" of which you speak?
First off, yes, we should all get pitchforks and ax handles to storm the Illinois Toll Authority over this. It is obscene that they think they can collect money for driving on roads, and roads that were promised to have the tolls removed from after they were paid for ... in like 1970. Here we are 41 years later and nobody is talking about discontinuing the tolls any longer.
The whole iPass thing is a criminal enterprise to begin with. The idea of untraceably collecting money from people as they drive. Where is my receipt? And everyone was assured that no records were kept - until a stubborn divorce lawyer subpoenaed the Toll Authority for the records and ... imagine that, they were able to produce the records. It is now common knowledge that the records exist.
But as far as a camera on the transponder is concerned, just exactly what do you think could happen with such a thing? The unit has an extremely short range so even if they could transmit a picture it could only be done at the point where the toll collection transceivers are. At 60Mph (a conservative speed for the 294 I would say) the total time the unit is in range to communicate with transceiver is less than a second, so the amount of data that could be transferred has to be very small. I can't see there being any ability to send even a 360x240 frame much less any saved frames. What do you think the minimum size for a crappy JPEG might be? 10K? The data rate available through this system can't be that high, so what do you think, maybe they could transfer 2K? Not going to be much of a picture, is it?
So thinking about this reasonably, what possible use would a camera attached to one of these things be? You aren't going to be able to get the pictures off it. I suppose you might be able to capture the driver's face - assuming the camera is pointed correctly - and only the driver's face at a fairly low resolution to document who was driving the car at the time. Why this might be interesting from a toll collection standpoint I can't imagine and the infrastructure to enable such a high speed burst of data being transferred has to be significant. And you are going to have significant collision negotiation problems which can be resolved today pretty easily but extending the data transfer time makes these problems much, much worse.
I don't see any practical application for such a camera, nor do I see it being possible to get any meaningful amount of data from the camera through such a system.
Consider that there are police cars that transfer their in-car video data wirelessly, but it takes quite a few minutes to do that with the car parked. Now if we were talking about toll collection consisting of parking the car for five minutes I would say that everyone has a reason to be concerned about what might be getting recorded. The way things work today, I can't see there being a problem. Not only is this a solution without a problem behind it, but it is hopelessly constrained by the physics of the system such that there is no possibility of it actually doing anything meaningful.
So we're back to the immorality and criminality of toll collection. We all know about toll collection from children's stories of ogres, trolls and the like. Where do these stories come from - history and myth. We should expect therefore to find the Illinois Toll Authority staffed by ogres and trolls, right?
There are lots of people who keep their ezpass in the metal coated bag and only mount it when they are near a toll
Those people are idiots. Few things are quite as annoying as driving behind someone fishing around in their glove compartment to find the ezpass, then going slack-jawed slowly as they hold it up to the windshield and gape at the sign. I propose that the cop at the toll confiscate the ezpass, put it in a sock, and then beat the fool with it. One hit for each car lined up behind you.
Wanting to pay tolls faster and get discounts should not mean having to submit to random and capricious tracking and a total loss of privacy when traveling.
This is NYC. You have 8 million neighbors. You're worried about privacy?
Well, if we all had an RFID implant, then it could communicate with the ez-pass to confirm the number of occupants in the vehicle...
ducks...
We show geeks how to get their dream girl at EyesOfOdessa.com
I have an ipass, and it's entirely hidden by the rear-view mirror; if there was in fact a camera, all it would capture is the back (front?) of the mirror. As I recall, the installation instructions specifically suggested that spot as being the most unobtrusive.
At least they are up front about what they want this for:
"16. The onboard unit according to claim 1, wherein the onboard unit contains an acceleration sensor, which in the event of an acceleration exceeding a threshold causes the camera to record an image.
17. The onboard unit according to claim 1, wherein the onboard unit contains a satellite navigation receiver to provide the image recording with the location and time data of its creation." Reminds me of this poster, except you'll be riding with a traffic cop 24/7. Nice! But why would I need this if my car already comes with On Star?
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
Then, when enough people realize that the banksters control the debt, and the credit and the financial intelligence (the last two items through their Regulatory DataCorp's G.R.I.D. -- Global Regulatory Information Database, the end result of Cheney/Poindexter's Total Information Awareness project) then they may finally realize they've been sitting on their butts watching TV/porn/sports/the Kardashians for far too long while everything has gone down the toilet.
The press had already successfully demonized Palin and Bachmann (some deservedly, some not, some stuff just made up) in the public's mind.
Those two late-comers to the Tea Party movement wanted Tea Party support to get votes, and the press was more than willing to put their faces on as the national face of the Tea Party in order to further demonize the Tea Party.
so... photos of your new transponder with a camera inside or it didn't happen
Where I live, all the tickets are electronic. Sure, you can buy single tickets from the driver but they cost more, aren't eligible for student discounts, etc... So everyone has a personal, electronic ticket to which you can either buy a period of time (e.g., a month) or value (e.g., 30 euros). When you get into the bus, you bring the ticket close to a device attached to the wall. If you have a period of time, it just beeps to inform the driver that he can get let you in and if you have value, you need to press some of the buttons to indicate how far you'll go (after which some of the value is reduced from your card, the device beeps, etc.).
The big brother doesn't need cameras to know about practically every distance longer than walking distance that I've traveled during the last few years. This includes the times I've taken a taxi as I use credit cards to pay for those.
So, if my daughter is changing out of her sweats and into her cheerleader uniform in back seat (and we have tinted windows), and this device just happens to snap a photo at the right time...
Someone needs to remind these iPass (can't Apple Sue?) people of the Penn. School Board people that were surreptitiously monitoring kids in their homes via laptop webcams.
I fail to see how kids can be prosecuted as adults to "sexting" themselves to other's cell phones, but the government is OK with taking photos at random everywhere and yet, they fail to see the potential for creating tons of kiddie porn, which will, no doubt, get itself distributed somehow. So America, which wants to stamp out kiddie porn, the government is the biggest producer of... go figure.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
Vodka in a water bottle still works. Gets a lot of people through their workday, should work in a car also.
http://cryptome.org/0005/ssl-broken.htm
(Correction: SRI is Stanford Research International. It was originally called Stanford Research Institute so as to suggest it was affiliated with Stanford University -- located nearby -- but after a lawsuit from Stanford, SRI changed the I to "International.")
No picture that way....and no tracking you at all that way.
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
As I'd mentioned earlier...why not just ditch the electronic toll pass altogether...and just pay cash?
Then, they don't have as easy a way to track you at all...
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Just to put some context around this, the "new" transponders were out 10 years ago. I've had an IPass hanging off my windshield since at least 2001 and it's always been the newer ones, no replaceable battery, no beep. They were fairly new at the time, because some of the instructions talked about stuff the new ones didn't have but the old ones did.
There's probably no evil conspiracy. He's just the IPass equivalent of an Windows 98 user and they don't want to support him any more. The old transponders may have a different protocol, or the failure rate among them may have hit a point where they just want them all out of the field.
You can tell if the toll has been paid if you go through the lanes that are like the coin collection lanes (where you're supposed to stop.) There's a light.
It's only the "open road tolling" where you can't tell, and if your transponder isn't working you don't get a ticket - because they know your license plate. So if you have a broken transponder, they look up the plate in their database and apply the normal IPass charge to your account. I went literally months before I realized my transponder had failed, and they didn't even mention it to me, much less send a ticket. I just finally realized that the light never lit up on the side of the road when I drove by.
Now, there have been rumors of tickets being issued based on the transponders - if I make it from toll point A to toll point B in an amount of time that indicates an average speed over the speed limit, I was clearly speeding. But so far I've never gotten a ticket, and I surely have deserved one many times. But a camera would make sense in that case - you want to be able to prove who was driving.
The preferred solution is to not have a problem.
1. You can face the transponder any direction you like. I keep mine in my center-console and it works just fine. If you think yours has a camera, rotate it to point out the front of the car: they already know you're at the toll-booth anyway.
2. I-Pass/EZPass transponders don't phone home: they are pretty much just like RFIDs. So, even if there were a camera in the transponder, it's not like it's going to send a live video feed back to I-Pass central.
3. If the transponder were to add some kind of cellular transmitter so it /could/ dial home and upload photos/video/GPS data, the cost of the network traffic would probably outweigh the amount of money collected in tolls.
So, if you see your tolls increase from $0.50 to $9.50, it's time to get some masking tape.
IL is on the EZ-pass system now IN needs get rid of the gates in I-Zoom (part of the EZ-pass system) only lanes they look like the I-pass only ones but have gates at the end. I also most hit one thinking the 15mph I-Zoom only lanes where like the IL ones with no gates and then saw the gate at the back and hit the brakes hard.
the $10 is fully refundable and you can link more then 1 Transponder to your account.
Buy your tolls with cash. Sure, it isn't as convenient, or in my state, cheap, but they can't surveil me through cash, yet... Besides, if everyone, or even some large minority of drivers would boycott the machines and stop at toll booths, it would actually result in tollbooth bottlenecks, put more people to work collecting tolls, costing the toll collectors money, slowing down commerce, making people late, and causing confusion and delay. The other alternative is don't take toll roads. When you already pay taxes, why are you paying tolls?
so, in reading only the first few comments, it appears that Illinois state is not using the camera in any way, has no intention to do so, never did, and this whole article, from it's catchy title to the contents, is largely in part speculative dribble stirring up fear. terrorism is what some people call it. can we just remove this garbage from the site? slashdot is a great new site but i don't want conspiracy theorists and fear mongering getting the better of what makes front page here... how was this useful for nerds? we know about big brother, yes? was there anything added to the cauldron of conspiracy here today that was newsworthy or is someone just looking for a soapbox in the limelight? sorry, i just don't get this new article...
Big Brother calls shotgun
Complete rubbish. The armed response module won't be included until the next version.
From the text of the patent, it sounds like they are trying to find a way to take a still, in order count passengers. I would guess so that they can charge per person in the vehicle, or at least have the option in the future. Not that it couldn't be used for something more nefarious. Either way it's cash for me thanks.
I art more snarky, and terse than thou. I art Slashdot!
What does this have to do with George Bush?
Which is funny, because Big Brother in Illinois is very much anti-shotgun.
Hoist Number One and Number Six.
Just mount the responder where the windshield meets the dash... with the camera facing up... it still reads when you go through the toll.. and all they see is the sky (and no tape used).
i'm sure they wont turn the camera on unless you report the car stolen or the govt subpoenas video evidence of something.
"all i wanted was a pepsi..."
ANOTHER article on Patent Tolls...
(This notifies drivers that their battery is still good, unlike the silent second-generation version, which informs them of a dead battery by sending a ticket in the mail.)
I followed the link and the word "battery" was nowhere. The problem was entirely a database problem. Is submitter trolling or just completely stupid?
I know that current generation TxTag toll tags in Texas are RFID stickers, and of course they won't beep. Is submitter really sure that the current generation I-Pass tags use batteries?
As for the camera, a patent is not a statement of what is actually going to be implemented, or even what is feasible to implement. I can't see why anyone would want to do it, other than nosiness on the part of the gummint, or under-the-table deals from someone wanting to sell them, especially when it is clear that a battery is no longer needed for toll tag transponders. 1) a camera would take a lot more power than a transponder, are they expecting people to hook it up to the lighter plug? 2) how exactly do they plan to get the data from the camera to Big Brother, especially on battery power? That's a lot of data, and a lot of battery drain.
#naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
why not pay the toll in cash? I dont live in USA so I dont fully understand the problem, here we have automated toll too, but you have the option to pay in cash, thing that I do. I dont even have a credit card, all my purchases are in cash.
You would accept removing the cover every time you paid a toll?
Christ, we are fucked.
expandfairuse.org
My wife and I have a new-style battery-free SunPass (Florida), and before I used it, I thought "No lights and beeping...how do I tell if it's defective or if I have a low balance?"
Simple.
As I enter a SunPass-equipped toll point, there's a traffic signal. Red means it didn't see a SunPass, and I'll probably be hearing from them. A green "THANK YOU" means I was tolled. Yellow means I was tolled, but the yellow light has the words "LOW BAL" in it, warning me to add money.
Some newer toll points in Florida allow SunPass to go through at full speed without stopping, and cash/receipt drivers have to take an exit, similar to a commercial truck weigh station. Not sure how this would work Re: failed SunPasses, but the way I'd hope it would work would be:
- I drive through a full-speed SunPass lane with a defective SunPass, so it doesn't register.
- Enforcement camera gets my license plate number.
- The SunPass database sees that my license plate number has a SunPass, and I get an e-mail explaining what happened with a link that will take me to a page, where checkboxes would (1) confirm the toll to be deducted from my SunPass penalty-free, and (2) have a new SunPass mailed to me free of charge if mine is, in fact, defective.
Once, in the Orlando area, before I had a SunPass, I accidentally went through a SunPass toll point without paying. Not wanting to take a $100 bath, I stopped at the next service plaza to speak to a SunPass sales person, and he said I most likely would not receive a ticket in the mail (I never did). Apparently, they're pretty forgiving with one-time offenders, and they mainly go after people who, say, use a toll road twice a day, every single day, with no SunPass (if a newcomer to central Florida decides to stick it to the state and not get a SunPass, that week of commutes to and from work will run up $1000 in fines).
Got that letter too, as well as two followups, each more insistent (ok, so I ignored the Toll Authority - it's not like they're Big Brother, er.. yet) I believe that the last letter stated that they would suspend my iPass and go after my licenses if I didn't go to the local grocery store and get it replaced!.. Sheesh.. sure let them put a camera inside. I can already see the long list of hardware hacks. Besides, if I mount it backwards.. well.. that solves that problem!
Well, the toll attendant at the toll plaza can see into my car to check that I qualify for the discount. Toll plaza already have a ton of cameras trained on your car. The transceiver camera provides an automated means to do the same thing.
I agree, its till really weird and creepy, just I think a cover would provide some balance in implementing a solution with the goal of car pool discounts. I also worry lots of people would just leave the cover open all the time. Also what is there to stop them from enforcing whatever else they feel like this way, like seat belts, etc?
An other choice might be to make each passenger carry an special ezpass transmitter, and the toll booth would count how many it detected in each car. That count could be randomly checked against photos of cars going through the tolls (something they do already) to spot cheaters.
The reality at the heart of all this is that owning a car is awful for your civil liberties, and it always has been, and that awful can creep into the rest of our lives. They need to be highly regulated so they don't kill people and all that massive infrastructure is paid for. It gives the government a huge excuse to intrude in your life that you don't get if you walk or bike everywhere.
Are the tolls somehow calculated per # of passengers? If not, its a violation of privacy, if it is, its f-ing insane.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
I don't know exactly how your iPass system works. But if its typical of many, a deduction isn't made from the transponder itself each time its read. Your serial number is simply looked up in a database from which your fee is deducted. Now here's the kicker: Not every transponder read needs to result in a toll. They can be used to track vehicle locations if readers are placed at strategic points in the city. But your's beeps. So if it starts beeping every block, you'll know something's afoot. So they need to silence the beepers.
Washington State is implementing a "Good To Go" pass system with RFID-like transponders. There will be no beep. But there are ways to detect when your transponder wakes up. And I'm looking forward to coupling a sniffer to mine just to see how and where they are tracking us.
Have gnu, will travel.
"Russia"
But I think you get the point.
Actually, the toll areas have speed sensors in the ground - they know how fast you pass through the lane (it's also used to count the axles, which is what the toll is based upon). And, if you've ever been to Illinois, you know that this fact does NOT slow anyone down! Granted, we're not as bad as some states, but a lot of people think those green signs with the big "I" on them are announcing the speed limit, NOT the route number!
An excellent application for my patent pending micro image tape which will be available with images of a wide range of characters including Johnny Cash, John Wayne, Elvis, Beavis & Butthead, Bugs Bunny and of course my preferred choice, Taz.
As a bit of an expert on the subject of Toll Roads (In my career I've been the IT director of 3 toll roads in 3 states, all of which use the same transponder IL uses) I can comfortably say that no toll road in the US is moving towards a transponder with a video camera in it. The old user replaceable transponders were popular when the technology first came out for tolling and customers wanted feedback when they paid. New Transponders dropped the feedback lights and went to a smaller footprint and battery. The old ones still technically work, and we use to run them through our lanes for testing but in general they failed at a higher rate then the new ones. The more transponders fail the more you have to have someone there to collect the toll or you lose revenue. IL uses video tolling to capture license plates when your transponder isn't read or when you don't have one, but if that happens too much you'll get a nice letter telling you to check your transponder.
While there is a future generation of transponders in the works the truth is using transponders is old fashion. Once you pay for the infrastructure video tolling is cheaper then transponder tolling as you don't have to buy the hardware up front (transponders are like $15 each, IL has something like 2 million users) plus you don't have to worry about people who don't have transponders. Plus no need for slowing down. If you want further proof just look at all the new miles or road in Texas. Man I miss toll roads...shame the economy crashed....
Hay ... there are a lot of horny Chink Shit Boys in New York and places like San Francisco who would take great offinse at being associated with NiggerHead Boy Obama.
One of these days soon I thinks NiggerHead Boy Obama is going to wake up, roll over, look at that ugly pice of shit Micheal and thinks to himself ... Why did I do this?!
Exactely!
NiggerHead Obama then realizes that he is really ... Chink Shit Obama!
Chink Shit Obama gona save the USA? ... No Hell No!
Chink Shit Obama gona save 'Orleans ... No Hell No!
Chink Shit Obama gona eradicate underarm odor? No Hell No!
Chink Shit Obama gona suck off Bernake and Buffet Boy? Yes Yes Yes. Obama Boy is look'n at Bernake's pinis and dooling at the sight of that weener. "Gotta win the next erectcum" Chink Shit Obama Boy says as he start suck'n that pinis like there is no tomorrow.
No tomorrow for Chink Shit Obama Boy that is.
==
Or, if you look around on their website, there's likely a more practical reason for it.
The IPASS system joined the EZ Pass association a few years back. When they did this they started replacing IPASS tags with newer models that were compatible with the new EZ Pass radios they had to install to become compatible with the rest of the EZ Pass system. They probably want to take the original IPASS radios down so they can save space/power/money.
That said, I recently had an issue where my EZ Pass transponder (Which is rather old. We got it back when New Jersey finished installing EZ Pass on the entire Garden State Parkway, which was probably back in like, 2003) wasn't fully registering with the tolls. We received several tickets in the mail despite receiving an "EZPASS PAID" message on the screen. Customer Service referenced the cameras to confirm it was my car and nullified the tickets, and retroactively billed our account for the tolls, but it's still a hassle. So No system is safe, but at the same time, the next time you blow through a toll booth in the New Jersey/New York area at 60 miles an hour through the new High Speed EZ Pass lanes, you'll realize how much of a time saver this really is compared to having to stop.
You know what SLAPSHOT slashdot has such a pathetic sick bunch of saddo ganja smoking coke taking doped out tossers as mods it is untrue i thought some of the British sites were bad but this is just the joke of the world really seriously is . This site needs a takeover by someone with a few straight Morals not the faggot supporting crap that is the present collection ..
Mexican border state presidents know a whole lot about Mexico because they have to deal with Mexico. Alaska has a lot of direct dealings with Russia, especially in gas and fishing, so the Alaskan governor would know a lot about dealing with Russia.
The "You can see" comment is to help the morons out there who don't know geography realize that the US and Russia are almost as close as Mexico.
I got one of these letters too. It is an obvious lie. The battery is replaceable. The device has a button you can press to determine that the battery is fine. Illinois is the most crooked state I've ever experienced. Bad state. Stay away if you can.
Governors, not presidents. Typing too fast.
BTW, don't take any of this as an endorsement of Palin or Bachmann. I can't stand either of them and wouldn't want to vote for them. However, that doesn't I can't recognize the unfair, absolutely biased treatment they've received at the hands of the press.
Palin's out of the running now -- yippie. I hope she's missed her chance forever. But Bachmann's still in. If she gets too high poll numbers I may have to finally register with a party, Republican, in order to vote against her in the primary (and also maybe to vote for Cain). I don't want the choice between her likely incompetence and the proven incompetence of the current office holder, between a religious nutjob and a leftist nutjob.
Even now, this is where I keep my Electronic Toll Collection device. I do this for a few reasons.
1. I hate anything obstructing the field of view out of my windshield.
2. I don't always use it when paying the toll.
3. I don't like the idea of it being always readable by road sensors.
As I approach the toll plaza, I reach into my center console grab the bagged device. Remove the device from the bag. Cross the toll plaza. Rebag the device and return to center console. Easier than when I retrieve paper money from my wallet because that is usually deep in my pocket.
For every benefit you receive a tax is levied. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
this + cloud facial recognition. how many abuses of human rights can we find. its not the device or its current listed use that is the issue for me. it what these things could and probably will lead to.
do government and private agencies 'really' need all this info on us? what happens when the data leaks or the servers get hacked, if there is one thing all large IT project should learn form the last few years is that if its stored digitally it can probably be hacked/sold/leaked...
EZ Pass provides discounts at numerous NYC bridges and tunnels connecting Manhattan to the outer boroughs and New Jersey, as well as on toll highways like the New York Thruway. It also allows you to minimize waiting time passing through tolls.
To get one, you need to agree to abide by the E-ZPass License Agreement Terms & Conditions including that you will approach and pass through E-Z Pass-only lanes at or below the posted speed limit. For a first EZ Pass speeding violation, the Violation Processing Unit will usually issue a warning letter with a 60-day probationary period.
For a second violation, you will likely be suspended for 60 days, and for a third violation your suspension can be extended or you can lose your EZ pass all together.
Note that these penalties are based on speeding while using any EZ pass tag assigned to your account (not just the one which resulted in the first letter).
The good news is that getting caught speeding through an EZ pass lane is not a moving violation and will not appear on your driver license or affect your auto insurance rates (except if a police officer actually issues you a traffic ticket for speeding and you are convicted of that charge).
Matthew Weiss, Esq.
www.nytrafficticket.com
LIKE ON MY FAN PAGE AND WIN!
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Tips-and-trics-how-to-make-money/207146829350851
That explains the drivers down here on I-10, slowest I've ever seen on an interstate.
"...And who wants to make buttprints in the sands of time?" ~Bob Moawad
Changer a kids nappy in the car (possible view of the
camera) and then troll for sex offenders.
Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't. Mark Twain.
"Metal coated bags" don't always work. I sometimes put my cell phone in a metal box. Imagine my surprise the first time my phone rang while in the box.
Social Credit would solve everything...
They don't need to count the axles every time you pass though every toll booth. Where I'm at, you're not allowed to move your toll tag from one vehicle to another. And of course, when you apply for a tag, you have to specify the license plate and number of axles for each vehicle you want a tag for.