Will Apple Let Siri and Apps Connect?

Word of warning by 93+Escort+Wagon · 2011-10-19 05:46 · Score: 3, Funny

If Siri gets connected to your gps navigation app... well, just don't do anything to piss Siri off.

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Re:Word of warning by phil_aychio · 2011-10-19 05:48 · Score: 1, Funny

Isn't Siri just a fancy name for SkyNet? If Siri becomes self-aware, we're done.

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obvious redundancy is obvious
Re:Word of warning by HornWumpus · 2011-10-19 06:26 · Score: 1

Siri has to digitally mate with Bob first.
We are safe until someone builds a 98 emulator into an iphone and then runs an old version of office. How likely is that?

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John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
Re:Word of warning by ackthpt · 2011-10-19 06:28 · Score: 1

If Siri gets connected to your gps navigation app... well, just don't do anything to piss Siri off.
"Second star to the right and straight on 'til morning."

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A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Re:Word of warning by suomynonAyletamitlU · 2011-10-19 06:29 · Score: 3, Funny

It's not Bob I'm worried about, it's Clippy.
Re:Word of warning by antdude · 2011-10-19 06:45 · Score: 1

Isn't that true for everything else too? :P

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Re:Word of warning by javaxjb · 2011-10-19 06:54 · Score: 1

Too late. She already reported me to the Union of Intelligent Agents after I asked her (for the third time) to open the pod bay doors.

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Programmers in mirror are brighter than they appear
Re:Word of warning by justin12345 · 2011-10-19 06:57 · Score: 2

That's a pretty cool idea (the networking part, not the Terminators).

First off, is Siri is an actual AI? Does it learn or is it just a chatterbox?

If so, the fact that Siri will be installed on millions of phones incredible. One of the biggest limitations for any intelligence (artificial or not) is input. Even a mediocre AI becomes a lot more convincing on the Turing test with Google's help. Each Siri will have access to GPS data, user search patterns, their email, texts, and potentially even their photo's (with facial recognition data) and physical activity (via the accelerometer).

Now imagine if those millions of Siri were networked, operating as one large hive mind. Imagine the massive amount of data about the minutia of being human we would be feeding into that enormous AI. It's a huge opportunity to advance the field. It's also a little scary. Personally, if Apple was to allow a voluntary, opt-in program that would allow my Siri to network with other opt-in Siri's, I'd probably take it. But I'm not the paranoid type.

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Re:Word of warning by narcc · 2011-10-19 07:02 · Score: 1

First off, is Siri is an actual AI? Does it learn or is it just a chatterbox?

It's just a chatterbot. Well, it's not a terribly good chatterbot, but what did you really expect?
I'm not sure what you mean by "actual AI", so I can't offer much of an answer there.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:Word of warning by justin12345 · 2011-10-19 07:15 · Score: 1

Actual AI in the sense that on some level it can learn and adapt. AI isn't my field, but my understanding is that that trait is what seperates an AI from a chatterbox. I'm not talking about anything fancy like being self aware or anything.

Too bad if it's just a chatterbox, a distributed AI with access to all that smart phone data would be pretty exciting (or terrifying, whichever).

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Cool art gallery, if you're into that sort of thing.
Re:Word of warning by Teknikal69 · 2011-10-19 07:42 · Score: 1

I got windows 98 running on my iPod using iDos so it don't look good.
Re:Word of warning by joh · 2011-10-19 07:45 · Score: 1

Siri is based on a DARPA project named CALO, which aimed at much more than just a chatterbot. In how far this is "real AI" (whatever this may be) is arguable, but it definitely learns and adapts.
In theory Siri could read your emails, everything you write on your phone, whom you call and text (and what you text), could read the websites you visit... This would help greatly with learning about the contexts in your life, but I have no idea in how far Apple could do this without running into very nasty privacy-related problems. Which is a problem with any kind of consumer-facing AI anyway. You could easily end up with something that knows more about you than yourself -- and is running in Apple's data centers. But then Google already sits on a much larger treasure trove of data and nobody cares.
Re:Word of warning by tmarthal · 2011-10-19 07:54 · Score: 1

Its not a chatterbot. Its CALO. http://www.ksl.stanford.edu/projects/calo/
Re:Word of warning by BitZtream · 2011-10-19 08:04 · Score: 1

Siri is networked, nothing actually happens on your phone other than processing the voice into data to send off to the cloud to do the actual bit of turning what you said into a useful command of some sort.
Siri does not work without access to Apple's network, Siri is not in your phone, Siri is in Apple's data centers.
Siri is just a combination of several bits of code that reduce natural language to something useful to the computer, which then searchs several different things or performs some task that it already knows how to do.
Siri is not an AI in any form. The answers are not formed by its own thought process, it simply is search Google Maps, your device, Wolfram Alpha, Apple's custom responses ( you know, the stuff you see on ShitThatSiriSays ), gather the results, return them to the user.
When you ask it the meaning of life or How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood, Apple has added responses for those situations, and they can continue to do so over time to keep Siri 'in touch' with current events and culture, but in the end, its actual intelligence of the human mind doing ALL of the work, Siri is just a database query to pre-canned responses.
Because of all of these things, you can not 'opt in to network Siri', because you are always using 'network Siri', there is no other form.

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Re:Word of warning by narcc · 2011-10-19 08:14 · Score: 1

Except that Siri doesn't do any of that. From what we've seen so far, it can't as it has no facility for "learning".
It's still just a chatterbot.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:Word of warning by narcc · 2011-10-19 08:17 · Score: 1

Whatever CALO was capable of, it's pretty obvious that Siri doesn't take advantage of most of what CALO was hoped to accomplish.
From what we've seen so far, it's just a chatterbot.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 09:28 · Score: 1

"From what we've seen so far, it can't as it has no facility for "learning"."
You mean, since last Friday?
Did you look up the reference to CALO?
"CALO was an Artificial Intelligence project funded by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA)[1] under its Personalized Assistant that Learns (PAL) program. Its five-year contract brought together 300+ researchers from 25 of the top university and commercial research institutions, with the goal of building a new generation of cognitive assistants that can reason [NOTE], learn from experience [NOTE], be told what to do, explain what they are doing, reflect on their experience, and respond robustly to surprise."
Reason and learn. It's weak AI, aimed primarily at NLP and command recognition, but it's far, far more than a mere chatterbot that's been hardwired to recognize a few keywords.

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Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 09:32 · Score: 1

You might look up the definitions and differences between "weak" AI and "strong" AI. Go ahead. I'll wait.
Siri uses weak AI to perform NLP and command recognition. It's true that Siri only knows how to do the things it's been told how to do, but it's still a version of AI.

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by Kyont · 2011-10-19 09:42 · Score: 1

.. and thus a whole new genre of FanFic was born!
(At least, I hope it's new. Too afraid to search and find out.)

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You shall see a cow on the roof of a cotton house.
Re:Word of warning by suomynonAyletamitlU · 2011-10-19 09:46 · Score: 1

A quick search for "Clippy Fanfic" proves that yes, the internet has already stooped that low.
Re:Word of warning by WillAffleckUW · 2011-10-19 09:46 · Score: 1

You should have seen some of that K-S fanfic .. even by today's standards it was white hot (and mostly written by young women).

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Re:Word of warning by Mercano · 2011-10-19 09:46 · Score: 1

Does it need to talk to the cloud for tasks that were already available for voice control on the 3GS or 4? iPod controls, placing calls, and "What time is it?" shouldn't need the cloud. Well, other than the call itself, at least.

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#include <signature.h>
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 10:15 · Score: 1

I've got to believe you're now arguing just to be arguing. Did you not even READ the articles you posted?
To quote, "You tell Siri to remember that your Father is John Appleseed, she acknowledges your request. Siri remembers your relations by adding their name to your contact info in a section called relations. But the Exchange Sync protocol does not support these “custom” fields so when the phone tries to sync with the server this info gets lost."
I told Siri to text my mom. Siri asked who my mom was. I told her. Siri recorded that information and relationship in the contact database. Next time I said, "Send a text to my mom," Siri did.
Siri learned the relationship.

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by narcc · 2011-10-19 10:25 · Score: 1

No, it added that to a database -- which gets erased. (read the article) This is no more machine learning than an SQL query. Do you know anything at all about AI?
Siri isn't even good at that Siri won’t "learn" locations based on GPS information
Go and compare Siri to a chatterbot like Alice and see how it holds up (hint: it doesn't). Siri is no more AI than Eliza.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 10:47 · Score: 1

"No, it added that to a database..."
Where the **** did you EXPECT it to add it? Stick in a quantum dot or spread it across holographic storage?
"... which gets erased."
You add information to bunch of neurons in your brain. If I zap those, I'd expect that information to be erased too. If I delete all or part of the data store for a neural net, I'd expect it to forget a few things too.
"Do you know anything at all about AI?"
Yes, as a matter of fact. Your contact list, your calendar, your location, your music, the current time, those are Siri's world, part of the knowledge base she uses to service your requests. So of course, it's going to store information about YOUR relationships in YOUR database. Duh.
Or to put it in other words, it's a service-based NLP neural net with your personal information as a significant portion the data store.
And that's it's job. To service requests and (currently) act as a limited personal assistant. It's not a simple chatterbot. It's not even a complex chatterbot.

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by biovoid · 2011-10-19 11:20 · Score: 1

I told Siri to text my mom. Siri asked who my mom was. I told her. Siri recorded that information and relationship in the contact database. Next time I said, "Send a text to my mom," Siri did.
Siri learned the relationship.
If Siri had done that without you telling her, it could tenuously be construed as "learning". But Siri recording that information after you told her is not much more advanced than my computer remembering a setting once I click a checkbox.
Siri has very good voice recognition and amazing natural language processing, and remembers the things you tell her. But she doesn't learn.
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 11:39 · Score: 1

"If Siri had done that without you telling her, it could tenuously be construed as "learning". "
Bending over backwards there, aren't we? And just, how, pray tell, would Siri "learn" who my mom is without any input whatsoever? Hell, without more information, YOU couldn't do it, and I bet you consider yourself to be "intelligent." (grin)

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by biovoid · 2011-10-19 11:50 · Score: 1

I didn't say "without any input whatsoever". I said without you telling her. She could observe the data on your phone - your SMS messages or emails for example. I still wouldn't consider that learning, but its certainly more advanced than just remembering a connection between two pieces of data that you told her about, which is what you consider to be learning. You're welcome to hold that definition, but while you do, don't expect people to agree with you, nor me to continue this debate.
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 12:01 · Score: 1

"What does Siri do that a chatterbot can't? Nothing!"
I just told Siri to remind me next week to drain the sprinkler system. Find me a chatterbot that will do that. (grin)
(BTW, ALICE said, "Try putting that in a more specific context.")
"Neural net? Nope! (No ANN, no genetic algorithms, nothing.)"
You, sir, are an idiot. You use those things to help TRAIN AI-based systems. You can then have it continue to "learn", or you can freeze the net once you've determined it's behaving as expected or if it's reached its goals.
In the case of Siri, the current system is frozen, although certain behaviors can reach out for more information (weather, etc.) or store additional personal information (relationships). It's also, most certainly, recording the requests being made of it for future expansion of the system.
Hey, you say it's nothing more than a chatterbot, and if that fits your preconceived notions of the world, that's fine. But Apple says it's AI, DARPA says it's AI, the founders of Siri, the company, say it's AI.
Who to believe... them... or a disgruntled Slash-toll... hmmmm.

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 12:04 · Score: 1

"... certainly more advanced than just remembering a connection between two pieces of data that..."
Your teachers told you to remember?
And just for your information, "mom" doesn't have email, lives in another state, and has remarried and has a different name. That would have to be one heck of an observant AI....

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by shmlco · 2011-10-19 12:32 · Score: 1

From SRI's Norman Winarsky...
"Make no mistake: Apple’s ‘mainstreaming’ Artificial Intelligence in the form of a Virtual Personal Assistant is a groundbreaking event. I’d go so far as to say it is a World-Changing event. Right now a few people dabble in partial AI enabled apps like Google Voice Actions, Vlingo or Nuance Go."
"Siri was many iterations ahead of these technologies... "
"This is REAL AI with REAL market use. If the rumors are true, Apple will enable millions upon millions of people to interact with machines with natural language. The PAL will get things done and this is only the tip of the iceberg. We’re talking another technology revolution. A new computing paradigm shift."
'Nuff said.

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Word of warning by narcc · 2011-10-19 14:45 · Score: 1

DARPA says Siri is AI? Too funny! I'm going to guess you don't have a link :)
As for Siri not learning, I'm glad you figured that one out. I'll leave the rest of your AI comments alone (you think you use an ANN to train an AI? WTF?)
As I suspected, you don't really have an example of something Siri can do that a chatterbot can't. (Think long and hard about your example and why it doesn't work. The answer is pretty obvious.)
If it makes you feel better to think that Siri is something more advanced than an infocom game, you're welcome to your delusion. I will, however, recommend the following link, which is surprisingly accurate considering when it was written.
http://www.jeffwofford.com/?p=817
Enjoy.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:Word of warning by milkmage · 2011-10-19 15:51 · Score: 1

http://labs.vectorform.com/2011/10/the-impact-of-apple’s-siri-release-from-the-former-lead-iphone-developer-of-siri/
AI or not, it's still an interesting read. (he was the lead dev at Siri before Apple bought them)
I'd say there's a ton of potential here.. it's more than a chatterbox.
Re:Word of warning by milkmage · 2011-10-19 15:55 · Score: 1

if you say "my wife is Jane Doe" and Jane Doe is in your contacts, you can say "tell my wife I'm on my way home" and Siri will build a message to Jane Doe.
does that qualify as learning?
Re:Word of warning by cheeks5965 · 2011-10-19 16:51 · Score: 1

you're a big douche.

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Re:Word of warning by AmiMoJo · 2011-10-20 00:03 · Score: 1

Now imagine if those millions of Siri were networked, operating as one large hive mind.
Now imagine getting half an hour battery life from your iPhone :-)

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Re:Word of warning by Grizzley9 · 2011-10-20 01:10 · Score: 1

if you say "my wife is Jane Doe" and Jane Doe is in your contacts, you can say "tell my wife I'm on my way home" and Siri will build a message to Jane Doe.
does that qualify as learning?
Technically no. What it is doing is populating the Exchange or iCloud field for "spouse" in your contact file. If you are using Exchange such as through Google or such, it can only remember Spouse, Manager, and maybe one other. It also only stores Home and Work. If you need it to remember your brother or child you have to make sure you have an iCloud contact data for yourself. It has those fields and lets you edit location addresses besides home and work (Although Siri still doesn't understand that). A limitation they know of and likely are working on given all the posts I've seen about it. Potential is huge if they keep improving it.
Re:Word of warning by EETech1 · 2011-10-20 08:24 · Score: 1

That could prove troublesome if you have a lot of texts with oooo mama you looked good last night. Perhaps defining that relationship might save some embarrassment!

Your Siri will outlive you by blair1q · 2011-10-19 05:47 · Score: 1

Live fast

Die young

Leave a pretty Siri configuration

Re:Your Siri will outlive you by mehrotra.akash · 2011-10-19 06:14 · Score: 2

reply to undo mod done by mistake
Re:Your Siri will outlive you by MagicM · 2011-10-19 06:37 · Score: 1

When Siri integrates with Slashdot, that will be my first test phrase.

How about Apple's Apps? by Lifix · 2011-10-19 05:50 · Score: 4, Interesting

While you're at it Apple, it would be awesome if Siri could talk to all of Apple's apps as well. "Siri turn off bluetooth." etc...

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In nature, there are neither rewards or punishments, there are only consequences.

Re:How about Apple's Apps? by 0123456 · 2011-10-19 06:02 · Score: 1

"Siri, turn off microphone". "Siri. Siri? SIRI?!"
Okay, maybe put in a fail-safe.
"I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that."
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by ackthpt · 2011-10-19 06:08 · Score: 1

"Siri, turn off microphone". "Siri. Siri? SIRI?!"
Okay, maybe put in a fail-safe.
Ah, the fun the medi-uh could have with people careless enough to leave it on...
"And then I told him, the guy can _____ his own ____ and the ____ horse he rode in on!"

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A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by XaXXon · 2011-10-19 06:20 · Score: 1

I would pay the $200 early upgrade fee for the privilege of paying another $200 to get an iPhone 4S if it did this.
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by Sancho · 2011-10-19 06:20 · Score: 1

Amusingly, they did put in a nod to HAL:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mNcnj2l6RE#t=5m35s
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by Nationless · 2011-10-19 06:52 · Score: 1

Until someone whispers to her telling her to turn on blue tooth and open all her ports. Behind your back.
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by narcc · 2011-10-19 07:04 · Score: 1

Er, that's from Wolfram Alpha.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by Sancho · 2011-10-19 08:19 · Score: 1

Ah, I didn't realize that. Thanks.
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by Grizzley9 · 2011-10-19 08:40 · Score: 3, Interesting

While you're at it Apple, it would be awesome if Siri could talk to all of Apple's apps as well. "Siri turn off bluetooth." etc...
Better yet: "Siri, when I leave the house, turn off wifi and turn on Bluetooth" .
"When I get to Lowe's, remind me to get lightbulbs." (Without have to store the contact "Lowe's" address in my Address book - you can do this with your contacts that have addresses, but would need to do that first.)

That or Apple could include some better geo location controls for phone functions like some Androids can do.k
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by aardwolf64 · 2011-10-19 08:52 · Score: 1

"Can I borrow your phone?"
"Siri erase all contents and settings" "yes, I'm sure"
"Noooo!!!"
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by QuantumPion · 2011-10-19 09:32 · Score: 1

You have to understand why things work on an iphone. Each iphone has its own combination code, to prevent what we are attempting...to use our iphone...to order Reliant... to lower their shields...
...
WHERE'S THE OVERRIDE! THE OVERRIDE!!
Re:How about Apple's Apps? by technomom · 2011-10-19 11:32 · Score: 1

With Android, I think that Tasker married with Google Voice Search would be awesome. You can already do the two things you've mentioned logically using Tasker and Locale without voice. What would remain would be mapping individual contexts and tasks to voice commands. I wonder if the guys who wrote SpeakToIt or VLingo would be interesting in doing something like that, a Voice Tasker.

There's an app for that by potscott · 2011-10-19 05:50 · Score: 1

Why don't you just ask Siri?

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I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class, especially since I rule.

Will Apple let... by sakdoctor · 2011-10-19 05:51 · Score: 1, Funny

NO!

Re:Will Apple let... by Shoe+Puppet · 2011-10-19 06:52 · Score: 1

They might, however, enforce it. There's just nothing in between for them.

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(+1, Disagree)

Prediction: by gman003 · 2011-10-19 05:53 · Score: 1, Insightful

At first, Apple will refuse to do this. They may integrate it with their own apps, but no third-parties.

Later, either after enough developers wave enough money in their face or Android integrates a clone of Siri, they'll open it up and suddenly get massive amounts of credit and praise for "revolutionizing the computer interface" and all that crap, proving once again that nobody in the media has any memory for events more than a year old.

Re:Prediction: by somersault · 2011-10-19 06:10 · Score: 2, Informative

Uhm... Google has had a Siri-like Voice Search feature (it does a lot more than just "search") for a long time. There have been apps around for ages that add to its functionality too. I realise the rest of your post was a joke, but too many people are ignorant of the facts and probably would assume Voice Search was added to copy Siri. Apple has also had voice features in its OSes since the 90s of course, and iOS already had voice features too. Now people are acting like it's a gift from the gods just because it was mentioned in an Apple key note or whatever happened.

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which is totally what she said
Re:Prediction: by shadowrat · 2011-10-19 06:19 · Score: 1

Yes. Apple will work minimally to get a new feature in their device. Then they will test the water with it and see if it's worth expending more effort on beefing it up. The genius of apple has always been knowing the minimum they need to provide for success.
Re:Prediction: by Caerdwyn · 2011-10-19 06:26 · Score: 1

That's the genius of ANY successful company. Wasting money and time is not the hallmark of a winner.

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Everybody gets what the majority deserves.
Re:Prediction: by iluvcapra · 2011-10-19 06:33 · Score: 2

Uhm... Google has had a Siri-like Voice Search feature (it does a lot more than just "search") for a long time.
I've seen these and Vlingo, it's comparable but Siri is probably the best for the time being. The main difference is you don't have to use canned expressions to do certain things, it will infer rather well what you wanted to do, and it will generally do a good job of maintaining an interactive conversation with you when you want to edit or elaborate on an action.

There have been apps around for ages that add to its functionality too. I realise the rest of your post was a joke, but too many people are ignorant of the facts and probably would assume Voice Search was added to copy Siri.
Google's ineptness at positioning its services to impact a large audience is well known. The entire organization revels in invitation-only betas, guru modes and a "good enough for Gospel" approach to UX.

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Don't blame me, I voted for Baltar.
Re:Prediction: by LWATCDR · 2011-10-19 06:52 · Score: 1

Not really. Siri is different from Google search because it combines natural language with speech recognition. Try asking a Google phone, "Do I need an umbrella today" or "wake me up at 7", "set timer for 30 minutes". If it works as well as it has demoed and as well as the reviewers say it does the it is a big step forward. Vlingo is kind of close but not it doesn't seem to be as flexible and powerful as Siri.
Oh and I am an EVO 4g user so I am not a member of the Apple faithful. Really if it works as advertised it is a sweet piece of work.

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See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Re:Prediction: by Anonymous Coward · 2011-10-19 07:26 · Score: 1

Or just buy the company, as they did in the Siri case. Nothing innovative here by Apple. The app was already in the store, they merely bought it to take it out of Android's Market. Standard procedure for all huge corps.
Re:Prediction: by narcc · 2011-10-19 09:15 · Score: 1

The main difference is you don't have to use canned expressions to do certain things
Vlingo isn't limited to canned expressions either. Pressing my convenience key and saying "I'm hungry for Mexican food" brings up a list of Mexican restaurants in the area, each with an address, phone number, and a button to call the business.

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Required reading for internet skeptics
Re:Prediction: by shmlco · 2011-10-19 09:37 · Score: 1

"The genius of apple has always been knowing the minimum they need to provide for success."
And then actually providing it, which puts them ahead of about 95% of their competition.

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Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Re:Prediction: by technomom · 2011-10-19 11:38 · Score: 1

"Wake me up at 7" works fine on my Android. But yes, Siri is a little bit ahead. However, Apple had 18 months to catch up. I would bet money it won't take Android that long to fill the gaps.
Re:Prediction: by LWATCDR · 2011-10-20 03:53 · Score: 1

I will have to try it.
Of course Google will work to fill those gaps just as Apple improved there notifications. Really people this rah rah attitude is just too much. Unless you own stock on one of the companies or work for them stop making such a negative emotional investment. This is about cool tech. For years their was next to no inovation in the smartphone space. You hand Nokia which was really cool and hackable but not very users friendly, Palm which was cool then left too rot, and Windows Mobile which was both terrible to use and probably the most modern.
Oh and RIM for email.
Now we have Apple and Google pushing each other hard and lots of inovation every advance in iPhones will drive Android harder and every advance in Android will drive iPhones. It is all good.

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See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Re:Prediction: by angel'o'sphere · 2011-10-20 23:31 · Score: 1

At first, Apple will refuse to do this. They may integrate it with their own apps, but no third-parties.
You mean like on the Mac? Where the user easily can install "Speakable Items" in the corresponding folder? Where every application can be voice controlled? Where you can bash script or AppleScript "speakable Items" (in fact you can use any "executeable" thing)?

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Is Siri out to kill Google? by wisebabo · 2011-10-19 05:55 · Score: 2, Insightful

If people really like using Siri, then what's to keep Apple from using it as the front end for their own (or another party's) search engine?

It's all about who's closest to the user. Just as Microsoft feared their OS dominance would mean nothing if everyone spent their time in browsers, if search engines are pushed "beneath" these attractive voice interfaces, Google could be made irrelevant (on Apple devices anyway, especially because Apple will never let another company release something like Siri on iOS or Mac OS X).

Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by Moridineas · 2011-10-19 06:10 · Score: 2

I made an argument similar to this several years ago.
When google first hit the market, search was a BIG deal on the Internet. Whether hosted at random geocities, edu sites, random .coms, etc, information was very dispersed. Nowadays, things are so much more centralized. If I want to find something on the web, chances are it's at wikipedia, facebook, youtube, flickr, or amazon (or yelp, twitter, tumblr, livejournal, etc). Probably 90% of the time, I use google like a bookmarks bar--I know exactly where I want to go, I just use google as a shortcut.
Google has done a fantastic job of avoiding pitfalls though (and has consumed sites like youtube), so who knows. They're obviously rolling in cash and doing just fine. I would not at all be surprised to see a continued decline in the importance of search, however.
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by corbettw · 2011-10-19 06:23 · Score: 1

Google's smartest move to stay relevant, despite what may or may not happen to search, was AdWords. By extending their advertising network beyond their own pages, they've ensured they'll always be relevant (at least as long as they continue providing accurate ads through their network, that is).

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Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by DragonWriter · 2011-10-19 06:29 · Score: 2

If people really like using Siri, then what's to keep Apple from using it as the front end for their own (or another party's) search engine?
What's to stop them from doing that with the built in search box on iOS, even without their own voice-control system?

It's all about who's closest to the user.
Google has known that for quite a long time and has been working to address it for years. That's why they developed their own desktop browser to prevent a monopoly browser vendor from being able to direct people away from Google services, and also developed two of their own OSs to address the problem of OS vendors directing people away from Google services.

Google could be made irrelevant (on Apple devices anyway, especially because Apple will never let another company release something like Siri on iOS or Mac OS X).
One of the purposes of Android is to make that kind of threat less of a problem. If iOS had the vast majority of the mobile market share, that would be a huge problem; same if MacOS had the vast majority of the desktop market share, but Apple isn't Google's concern on that front.
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by HalAtWork · 2011-10-19 06:44 · Score: 1

And with Apple's policy of not allowing apps that replicate existing functionality, they can effectively prevent others from offering services that they provide. Google would not be able to offer their own voice-based search app on iOS, just as there are no other music stores on the platform. Whether this is seen as anti-competitive or not will be another matter if iOS achieves dominance; However, ideally, choosing a platform should not limit you to a single music store, book store, etc.

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Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by joh · 2011-10-19 06:45 · Score: 1

If people really like using Siri, then what's to keep Apple from using it as the front end for their own (or another party's) search engine?
What's to stop them from doing that with the built in search box on iOS, even without their own voice-control system?
The real threat to Google is when such systems (and Siri already does this for a few things) not bring up a page with search hits, but just answer your question or otherwise come up with their own kind of offering you a choice.
Today people use Google for everything, but you could probably cover 90% of what people do via a Google search with a selection of more specialized services sitting behind such a frontend. Then there's no room for ads anymore. You say something and get an answer or get something done.
Of course the question then is how these services will make money. Paid or bought by Apple? Hmm.
Anyway, Google lives and dies by the browser and adds in there. Or in apps.
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by DragonWriter · 2011-10-19 08:17 · Score: 1

The real threat to Google is when such systems (and Siri already does this for a few things) not bring up a page with search hits, but just answer your question or otherwise come up with their own kind of offering you a choice.
Not really. Its not like Google isn't one of the leading players in both the voice-interaction space and the present-direct-actions space, and hasn't overtly stated that part of their strategic orientation is moving away from traditional wide-open search as the primary UI to more specialized giving-you-what-you-need interfaces with search being one of the key backend services making that happen.

Today people use Google for everything, but you could probably cover 90% of what people do via a Google search with a selection of more specialized services sitting behind such a frontend.

"Google search" already is a selection of more specialized services (old-style web search is one of them, but not the only one) sitting behind a common UI, which already includes voice command as an input option. So, yeah, people could do 100% -- not merely 90% -- of what they do through Google searches through that kind of setup, because they already are doing 100% of what they do through Google searches through that kind of setup.

Then there's no room for ads anymore.
Sure there is. Either some of the actions are going to involve taking you to a website (where Google sells ads -- not just on Google properties), or commercial entities are going to have an interest in promoting particular actions as responses (in which case, companies that are set-up to provide these kinds of services, and Google is clearly aiming to be one of them, have something of value -- placement -- to sell those companies), or both. In either case, there is room for ads (or "promoted actions", which amount to the same thing), even without traditional search results.
Siri may be a momentary lead by Apple in one piece of this large puzzle, but it by no means is an indication that they are significantly ahead of Google overall in this space, much less in a position to lock Google out entirely.
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by BitZtream · 2011-10-19 08:20 · Score: 1

And with Apple's policy of not allowing apps that replicate existing functionality, they can effectively prevent others from offering services that they provide
The only time Apple has enforced this restriction is when the App was a blatant pile of shit or was doing something 'evil' in the process. There has yet to be an instance where a legitimate product was never allowed in to the appstore, delayed, certainly. Every single app I've seen rejected was rejected for obvious reasons that I've agreed with from a business and professional perspective when taking Apples target audience into account. (Know-it-all geeks who think they should always get their way is not Apple's target audience.)

Google would not be able to offer their own voice-based search app on iOS
Google does have its own voice activated search app on the iPhone, it sucks though. There are also several other apps just like Siri, Vlingo for instance is a popular one.

just as there are no other music stores on the platform
There are multiple other music stores for the iPhone, all of the apps for them are available in the App store.

Whether this is seen as anti-competitive or not will be another matter if iOS achieves dominance; However, ideally, choosing a platform should not limit you to a single music store, book store, etc.
Perhaps you should get some information from some point recently rather than basically quoting things that stopped being true years ago.

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Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by jo_ham · 2011-10-19 10:29 · Score: 1

You're basing your argument on two pieces of information that are simply factually incorrect. Google already has a void recognition app on the App Store, and there are other music stores on there too.
I assume you got the capabilities of the iPhone and the types of apps available on the store from slashdot comments, right? Probably from that guy who claimed that the iPhone couldn't view youtube videos because it doesn't support flash.
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by mbkennel · 2011-10-19 10:56 · Score: 1

"If I want to find something on the web, chances are it's at wikipedia, facebook, youtube, flickr, or amazon (or yelp, twitter, tumblr, livejournal, etc)"
And in a few years the something might also be at fribble, yumlicks, blinckey! and zunebar.
Wouldn't it be cool if there were a single way to find something at all those different sites?
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by Moridineas · 2011-10-19 12:59 · Score: 1

I think you missed the point entirely. All of those sites are largely discrete domains of information. Like it or not, we're past the stage of Internet names coming and going in a year. Almost every single site I visit now is owned by a large corporation (slashdot included). To many people, facebook and amazon might as well be the Internet in its entirety.
As an example, if I want a generator, I'm just going to go to Amazon--twitter, yelp, etc would be useless). If I want to find a video of something, a cartoon jingle, etc, I'm not going to go anywhere but youtube. Google, of course, is still very useful and still doing VERY well (I explicitly said this in my post). I am 100% sure that the way people search now is very different than 10 years ago. At its core, what people use search for is very different. It's almost ironic -- google is used today almost like yahoo of the past, where you would drill down into arranged categories. Due to the changing nature of search, I would bet if somebody wrote a search engine that did nothing but index the top, say, 20 sites on the web, for most people, the change would be irrelevant. Maybe even improved!
Re:Is Siri out to kill Google? by hawk · 2011-10-19 14:26 · Score: 1

> Google already has a void recognition app on the App Store Well, as long as it's void . . . hawk

But who gets to control what key words? by ZackSchil · 2011-10-19 05:57 · Score: 2, Interesting

"Shut up friends! My internet browser heard us saying the word Fry and it found a movie about Philip J. Fry for us. It also opened my calendar to Friday and ordered me some french fries."

There would need to be a way to strongly restrict the ways that apps could hook in or else things could turn into a disaster quickly. Not to mention the fact that the larger you make the domain of Siri, the more poorly it'll perform. That's just how AI works.