Slashdot Mirror
ACTA's EU Future In Doubt As Poland Suspends Ratification
superglaze writes "Poland has suspended its ratification process for ACTA, throwing the copyright crackdown into doubt for the whole European Union. ACTA is being handled as a 'mixed agreement' in the EU due to its criminalization clauses, so if a single EU member state (such as Poland) fails to ratify it, it is null and void across the entire union. If that were to happen, at least six of the remaining international signatories would have to ratify ACTA for it to apply anywhere in the world. Outside the EU, only eight countries — including the U.S. — have signed."
They forgot about Poland!
Let me be the first to say "BARDZO DOBRZA! ACTA JEST GUWNO!" ("Very well done! ACTA is shit!")
-73, de n1ywb
www.n1ywb.com
Thank you (again) Poland.
My UID is prime. Hah!
They should bribe every country in the EU, not just the US.
My thanks go out to the Polish people that are making enough of a stink about this that their government had to (maybe) reconsider.
Kick Poland out of the EU
For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
There's a great pic of about 15 Polish legislators, holding paper Guy Fawkes masks over their faces - as the vote is tallied.
http://static.arstechnica.net/2012/01/30/polish-mask-4f26f00-intro.jpg
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
There's an immense store of goodwill towards Poland in the US, despite the ludicrous actions of our corporations and government. When it counts, it will be repaid.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
There are not many opportunities to by proud of my countrymen, but now, for once, we have shown true citizenship and democratic backbone.
This day will hopefully be remembered just as September 17, 1939 is.
Because the RIAA and MPAA will get into tanks and perform a Blietzkreig on Poland?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tadeusz_Ko%C5%9Bciuszko
Poland is better representing its citizens rights on this issue than is my own country (USA). After seeing PIPA/SOPA fallout, I can't believe anyone in the US region of politics would want to attach their name to this. How do how do treaties work anyway? I don't remember having a vote on this.
ACTA, as it currently stands, in not binding on the U.S., because Congress has not ratified it.
The Executive branch has no Constitutional authority to enforce it as any kind of treaty without ratification by Congress. I know some are "debating" this, but the debate is nothing but BS. The Constitution spells it out pretty clearly.
big cudoes to you, peoples, your acting in this case put you all alot closer to my heart.
Because the RIAA and MPAA will get into tanks and perform a Blietzkreig on Poland?
MPAA's panzers are hollywood props. And this time the Polish Army won't be fighting on horseback like they did against the Nazis.
Better watch out for the zombie lawyer attack though.
Any insufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.
Remember, remember, the 5th of November...
Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
I guess that would be a "stateful packet".
I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
Has anyone else considered that the politicos in the U.S. aren't as stupid as we're making them out to be?
Perhaps they've pulled this ACTA thing together because they KNOW they it will never get fully ratified, and a bunch of this crazy copyright stuff is merely to get the RIAA/MPAA off their back? "Sorry! We did our best, looks like you'll have to compete in the open market..." Then they've fulfilled their duties to the companies they know are dying, and actually positioned themselves to buddy up to the online communities by saying "Hey! ACTA wasn't passed... you didn't REALLY think we meant it when this thing went through, did you? We've know for years that those dumb assholes at the recording industry are dead in the water... we just needed to get them off our backs to concentrate on you guys!"
I mean, it's a bit far-fetched,but I just can't shake the feeling that these people are not THIS stupid, because individually many aren't.
-
...and reason was also that agreement is too complex to be signed away so easily, so they have to discuss it first too. I highly doubt that they will hear nothing what happen in Poland and other countries with public opinion. This is country where government actually listens to people, using Internet extensively to collect comments about proposed laws.This is also a land where they elect their government using Internet and Skype was also started there.
user@ubuntubox:~$ stfu This server is going down for shutdown NOW!
According to reports, Tusk said on Friday that his government had made insufficient consultations before signing the agreement in late January, and it was necessary to ensure it was entirely safe for Polish citizens.
All they have to do is do some consultations (like on C-32 in Canada, now known as C-11) and totally ignore them (like C-11 in Canada) and then pass it anyway (with some bogus excuse).
Make sure when you get to get out on February 11. Let this strengthen your resolve. Massive outcries DO work. In order to make suspension into cancellation, this issue needs to stay 'alive'.
I'd like to thank my representatives. The problem is, I don't live in Poland or know any Polish... Can someone from there tell me who/where/how to send my thanks and perhaps who to donate a bit of money for next elections? (I feel somewhat betrayed by the far-left candidate I voted for, who actually became a minister of culture and one of the first things he did was to act like a good puppet of our RIAA-equivalent. He was the one guy I had hoped to protect my interests against those of multinational capitalistic corporations...)
Poland should have something like sixth-most weight to throw around in the EU but for some reason, they tend to act like one of the smaller countries. It's good that a lot of decisions are still made through consensus like this. And I feel a bit of pride that our own parliament likes it just the way it is.
Currently there is an enormous backlash against ACTA in Poland. If the ratification voting were held today, it would likely be rejected. But suspending means trying to push it later (or via EU channels) when it becomes forgotten. Now is the time for other EU citizens to stand up when it is still hot. Sadly, corporate lobbying is so strong nowadays that fighting it requires almost constant effort.
Save the bandwidth. Don't use sigs!
hats off to poland! you guys rock.
It would appear that the MPAA Forgot Poland...
From Soviet puppet state to sole voice of freedom and reason in Europe in the space of 20 years. Wow.
This just in:
Sources in Washington report the extraordinary rendition of 15 Polish politicians for copyright violation from the Parliament Building of the European Union early today. Acting on secret orders from the MPAA and RIAA, spokesmutants claimed yet another victory in the War Against Piracy and Terrorism. The sources added, an additional 4 British journalists were also captured when they pointed out that it was a British copyright that was infringed upon, not an American copyright. The journalists are said to be 'settling in quite nicely' at Guantanamo Bay's Camp X-Ray...
Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
Hey, lawyers: You Forgot Poland!
== Jez ==
Do you miss Firefox? Try Pale Moon.
Can the US get that law, too?
Plawski knew what he had to do – without the other destroyers Piorun couldn’t hope to face the Bismarck alone. Now that suprise was lost the Battleship was fast enough to keep Piorun out of torpedo range, the Piorun couldn’t stay in contact with her now. She should radio in Bismarck’s latest position and then, for want of another phrase, get the fuck out of Dodge.
They’d all just have to hope that another ship was close enough to make contact with her again before she managed to slip away again – although given the weather and the darkness Plawski realised that was increasingly unlikely.
It was frustrating and may ultimately mean the British missed their opportunity to intercept, but sadly, that was the only sensible option. Anything else was suicide.
Plawski though for a split second then sighed, smiled and gave his orders to his crew:
“Full speed ahead. All hands to battlestations. We attack.”
The gunpowder, treason, and plot...
Poland once again makes a stand against tyranny.
Yes. They do that a lot.
See! That's ONE difference between them and the Nazis!
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
What were the 15 Polish MPs doing in the European Parliament building?
And after you finish "Fiasco" give "The Invincible" a try. It's Lem's best vision of extraterrestial contact. IMHO of course.
Yeah, not a whole lot to be proud of. I see what you mean. /s
Plan My Week for iPhone
Why Guy Fawkes? That mask as a symbol is ridiculous. Guy Fawkes was a loser not a hero. Of course, I guess it's no more ridiculous than pacifists who wear Che Guevara tee shirts...
In all the pictures of people with these masks they are simple cut outs from printed paper. I don't think any Anon at all buys these from some one who pays any license to WB.
What he as a person did is no longer relevant, symbols gets new meanings all the time.
Priority is irrelevant (priority would only become an issue of a purported treaty violated a negative restriction in the Constitution, not if it merely extends beyond the other enumerated powers of the federal government in the Constitution.) And the issue was settled by the Supreme Court in Missouri v. Holland 252 U.S. 416 (1920).
The holding in Missori v. Holland states outright that the treaty power is itself a separate, positive grant of power in addition to the other positive grants in the Constitution, and that therefore legal rules which States might have grounds to challenge as intruding on the general reservation of non-enumerated powers to the States in the 10th Amendment had they been regular acts of Congress standing alone were exercises of an enumerated power (the treaty power itself) when done through ratified treaty, or when done by statute to support such a treaty.
That decision also, however, suggests that negative prohibition on government action within the Constitution are limits on the treaty-making power, a point made more directly in Reid v. Covert 354 U.S. 1 (1957), among other cases.
So, contrary to your argument that both the statement that the treaty power extends beyond the other enumerated powers of Congress and the statement that the Constitution constrains treaties are assumptions with little foundation, both -- with the proviso that the constraint placed on the treaty power by the Constitution does not constrain it only to the space defined by other positive grants of power -- are extremely well-established principles of law has ruled unequivocally.
True, but it's a silly symbol. And those who use the symbol seem to be oblivious to the fact that it makes them look foolish and is undermining their cause. I just think it's a big bizarre is all. Plus there's the whole Anonymous attachment to that symbol which further adds to the ridiculousness. (at least with Anonymous when they use that symbol it usually means "don't take us seriously, we're just here for the lulz")
And his main beef, the reason for trying to blow up the Parliament, was the fact that England wasn't ruled by Catholics. Yeah, he's come a long way in 400 years.
I'm having a hard time understanding why Guy Fawkes was a loser. Was it solely because he failed or because he broke under torture?
I'm not sure if most people associate it with that movie, in which case they are associating it with the plight of the character which is wholly different than that of the real Guy Fawkes.
He was a hero to some people. That would have depended on your religion and philosophy at the time. He was quite defiant and resolute but did ultimately break under torture. That is kind of hard to hold against him as every man breaks.
I don't find the symbolism strange because of Guy Fawkes being a loser or a hero, just that Guy Fawkes was never fighting for any noble cause, or the suffering of the people per se, but for Catholicism. That's it. I don't find that very impressive and quite unsuitable to what he is being used as a symbol for today.
Considering that Guy Fawkes and the whole incident is over 400 years old I would find it offensive if any licensing was required anywhere.
To copyright *that* or trademark it is completely ridiculous. Is that all it takes? Make a movie that uses a mask, out of context, about a guy that escaped disemboweling by hanging himself 400 years ago, and you get copyrights and trademarks over it?
Why is it said here that ACTA needs to be signed by 6 countries to apply worldwide? Sovereign nations are usualy not bound by international treaties they have not signed. There are a few exceptions but it would be surprising that they include ACTA.
At the time, fighting for Catholicism was probably considered noble by many people. Remember, England had two big uprisings during Henry VIII's time over his forcing of Protestantism on the people, and along with that seizing the monasteries and churches and making them Crown property. These uprisings were put down brutally, but the people participating were regular common people (with a few nobility); they obviously liked their Catholicism for whatever reason. They really believed you had to talk to a priest to talk to God, and Henry was taking that away from them.
To be fair, there's a lot of great American music (I'm American, BTW). However, almost none of it has been made in the last 15-20 years. You should make that law so it doesn't allow any American music from post-1995 on the radio at all.
Jazz music is very popular in Europe from what I read, especially France. It's American in origin, but not exactly new (one source says it became popular there in the 1920s).
It's mainly in the past couple decades that American culture has gone down the tubes.
thats fantastic.
Read radical news here
Greetings from Poland.
The whole thing stinks. Our whole political class was involved in an attempt to pass it as quietly as possible and ram this feudal law down our throats. Those 15 crooks were involved in this scam but - as they're formally an opposition - they weren't directly responsible for passing ACTA, so they could switch sides at any time and they did it as soon as they saw opportunity in it. Neverthless I'm happy to see they've helped raising (bad) publicity about ACTA fiasco with those masks. I'm definitely NOT happy with Tusk who ordered signing this crap despite huge protests and I'm not confident he really means to not ratify this - in my opinion he is a pathological liar. Just one day earlier one of his stooges (M. Dowgielewicz) acknowledged that they (government) are determined to ratify it despite of protests. In their (polish govt) opinion protests are "overreaction of manipulated young people". Geez. What a bunch of fucks (I told you they're all pathological liars).
Our media also didn't help much - media lied at first. Only later, as more and more known and respected persons took side of protesters - media acknowledged some of their concerns - but all reports in our mainstream media seems to be watered down and limited to internet/copyright issues. Not a single word about generic drugs or patented GMO crops - whole debate is as limited as possible.
And there is another thing that stinks even more than all things above combined. In the wake of these protests we had major hiccup in our parliament and reps in one of commision voted and issued a recommendation to suspend ratification process and start public consultations about ACTA. Next day some lady from US embassy started calling those representatives and asking why did they pass this and why party leaders did not enforce 'party discipline' to vote this recommendation down. While previous things did not impress me too much (as I'm used to our crappy political class), the last one made me really furious. If someone is still in doubt who is ruling my country - not President nor Prime Minister - It's some obscure lady from US embassy. (?!?) Few months ago (presumeably) the same lady in meetings of agriculture commision was pushing to legalize patented GMOs in my country ! It seems that we've got rid of Soviets but we haven't got our independence either. Our politicians stopped taking orders from Mockba but started taking orders from Washington and Brussels.
Last but not least I would thank everyone who attended anti-ACTA rallies regardless of cold weather we currently have. I was only on one of these and I feel I did too little. Thank you - all of you who made our lovely government reconsidering (or at least pretending to reconsider) this decision. My feeling is that we should not stop here. Every term our elected officials show disregard for us and do things that directly violate their fiduciary duties (at expense of citizens of course). I think that now as we've scored first meaningful success, we should go further and demand as many elements of direct democracy as possible. Technical means to cheaply perform referendums are in place, it's just politicians that are dragging their feet.
The mask as it is used everywhere has nothing to do with the real Guy Fawkes. It was designed for the comic V for Vendetta by DC
Furthermore with every mask bought and used by anyone some big, fat, ACTA-pushing corp earns $$$. Yes, I also see this ridiculous. Should we look for another symbol or is it too much effort to do this ?
Hey, I'm Polish, but I'm bad with languages. (Plus the Golden Child was one of Murphy's best movies)
Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
It's not used because of Guy Fawkes, it's used because a movie called "V for Vendetta".
No sig today...
A politician listening to the people is now "a PR move"...?
Let's hope some other politicians are paying attention.
No sig today...
The mask as it is used everywhere has nothing to do with the real Guy Fawkes. It was designed for the comic V for Vendetta by DC
I wouldn't say it has nothing to do with the real Fawkes. It was designed for the comic book character, yes, and is basically a pretty featureless grinning face with a mustache, but is somewhat similar to pictures of Fawkes that a quick google search will find.
I don't find the symbolism strange because of Guy Fawkes being a loser or a hero, just that Guy Fawkes was never fighting for any noble cause, or the suffering of the people per se, but for Catholicism. That's it. I don't find that very impressive and quite unsuitable to what he is being used as a symbol for today.
I'd have to disagree with you on that one. You can certainly take the view that he was "fighting for Catholicism". Fighting for any kind of religion is not something I'd be particularly interested in. I however would take the view that he was fighting against repression and persecution. Europe had all sorts of religious fun after the Reformation. In France, Spain and Italy, Catholics murdered Protestants. In the various germanic countries, they killed each other and eventually learned to live with each other. And in Britain and Ireland, the Protestants got to be the ones who did most of the murdering. And I think that is exactly the view that the comic character takes. He is someone fighting against repression who is planning to blow up the House of Parliament, and he wears a mask of someone who was fighting against repression and who planned to blow up the House of Parliament.
Thanks. This is valuable commentary, and a view not featured in any US or UK outlets.
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."