The Gradual Death of the Brick and Mortar Tech Store

Cutting_Crew writes "As we all know brick and mortar stores have been closing left and right recently. We had CompUSA, Borders and Circuit City all close their doors within the last 4 years. According to an article on Forbes.com, it is spelled out pretty clearly why Best Buy is next in line to shut its doors for good. Some of the reasons highlighted include a 40% drop is Best Buy stock in 2011, lack of vision regarding their online services, management too concerned with store sales instead of margins and blatant disregard for quality customer service."

Comments

Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[n1ywb]

Thank god we still have Radio Shack. I went in recently and found they were even selling arduinos. I've bought a bunch of components there for my electronics projects. It's not Fry's, but at least there's one 10 minutes away from my home in Nowhereville Vermont.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Sorthum]

I've long thought that Radio Shack must be a front for the mob; there's no realistic way they could still be in business selling overpriced cell phones and inexpensive components to hobbyists...

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[twotacocombo]

Radio Shack these days is a shadow of it's former self. I went there with my dad as a kid, and remember shelves full of electrical and radio crap that I couldn't even comprehend. I went in there for the first time in ages about 3 years ago.. holy crap. It looked more like an AT&T store than the Radio Shack of old. People were lined up to pay their phone bills, and the walls were lined with cell phones and MP3 players and whatnot. Only in the back corner were any sort of electrical components, and nobody could really help me find what I was looking for. It's almost as if someone bought the Radio Shack name, and slapped it on a completely different store...

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[viperidaenz]

There is a franchise in Aus/NZ called Dick Smith. Same thing happened. Up until around 10 years ago they were an electronics store. 1/4 of the floor was components, 1/4 for audio, 1/4 for phones and 1/4 for computers.

Now its 1/4 cell phones, 1/2 computers and tvs, 1/5 audio and the last tiny section electronics.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[mjwx]

Thank god we still have Radio Shack. I went in recently and found they were even selling arduinos. I've bought a bunch of components there for my electronics projects. It's not Fry's, but at least there's one 10 minutes away from my home in Nowhereville Vermont.

Australia lost anything resembling radio shack years ago. Dick Smith Electronics was once a store where you could go in and buy capacitors, electronics kits (pre-arduino days) and just about anything else you need. Now days they sell phone plans, Norton AV and overpriced HDMI cables.

If I want electronics components I go online, especially if I dont want to pay a 400% mark up (this is not hyperbole, it's Australia).

But I figure this is the way all shops are going. Frontage is becoming less and less important with the advent of smart phones. An online business with a warehouse in an industrial district near the airport is just as competitive as a store-front in the CBD with millions walking past each day. If I see a PC component I want in a store, the first thing I'll do is look up prices on StaticIce to see how much cheaper it is if I order online. I dont think the traditional storefront is going to survive for too many more decades, rather we'll start to see kiosks attached to large automated warehouses (basically forklifts on rails). You buy what you want at the kiosk and it gets picked out and delivered to you shortly. We're already hallway there with Australian supermarkets providing an order online function and having that delivered to your house.

I think people are getting over the appeal of seeing a product and will happily give it up for some savings. Obviously this doesn't apply to all industries but to things we consider a chore like grocery shopping are the prime candidates.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Danieljury3]

Isn't 1/5 a bit generous. I went into one last year and the only electronics stuff they had was a soldering iron. I think at the time I was looking for some solder which they didn't have. Jaycar is the place to go for electronics stuff in Aus/NZ

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Pubstar]

Frys is good as long as: A) You know exactly what you want and B) You avoid the white sticker of doom. I went in, bought a Razer Lycosa keyboard from them. I kept getting phantom keystrokes from the keyboard. No problem, just update firmware? Didnt fix it. New drivers? Didn't fix it. Different computer? Didn't fix it. Okay, so the keyboard is obviously broken. After talking to someone at Razer, they told me that the keyboard was faulty and to return it instead of sending it to them for replacement. I get into Fry's, tell them its broken, and I watch them repack it, slap on a 5% discount sticker on it, and have someone go put it back on the shelf. Oh, and don't even get me started on how many DOA HDDs my dad and I bought from them that all had white stickers.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[lymond01]

Reality is that people don't need to build cool gadgets anymore. Cool gadgets are mainstream. And fixing digital circuit boards no longer requires colored resistors. You just toss it out and buy a new product.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Algae_94]

Awesome quality control. Rather than waste their time confirming your diagnosis, they waste the next guy that buys its time.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[symbolset]

Maybe you'll find this funny: Even the CEO can't figure out how Radio Shack is still in business.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[JWSmythe]

Funny, she didn't charge me a thing.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[number11]

What I don't get, however, is the projection of Best Buy going away. Would that be in favor of Walmarts and the like? Because I can't imagine somebody buying a a big screen TV or even a laptop based solely on online descriptions

They'll stay around a while for the TVs and refrigerators, you're not going to buy a refrigerator online (though the home improvement chains offer serious competition for appliance business). People will get their computers at places like MicroCenter, which gets the big box store stuff right, at least as it applies to computers.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[dgatwood]

I've never seen this, and I return defective products to Fry's at least three or four times per year. If you tell them the item is defective, they put a sticker on it, but the sticker says "Return to vendor". They only stick the rebate sticker on it if you tell them you changed your mind about it. So either you weren't clear enough when you told them that it was defective, or you went to a Fry's store that is poorly run compared with my local store.

I'm dubious about returns because I worry about parts being missing, and I'm dubious about returned hard drives because I wonder if the previous customer dropped them, but for most things, the sticker of doom doesn't bother me too much. Usually it just means that I saved a couple of bucks.

That said, it may depend on the store. Which Fry's store was this?

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Sorthum]

I really don't think that selling $3 packs of capacitors to hobbyists is sustainable in 2012...

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[n1ywb]

I agree RatShack has gone downhill, and it's especially unfortunate that they no longer sell amateur radio gear. But I think it's actually been improving of late. They carry way more components than they used to and they finally took my advice and put them in drawers. They still have solder, RF adapters, antennas, some basic computer parts, kits, books, arduinos, basic stamps, 100 in 1 electronics sets (I've already bought one for my 2 year old, can't get 'em started too early!) Radio Shack is a hell of a lot better than nothing and let's hope this positive trend continues.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[griffjon]

What Brick-and-mortar store can hope to compete with the internet for commodity-level components? It's not even fair to hope they would. I mean, cmon - Best Buy stocks even-further-overpriced Monster Cables as their entry-level cable. I don't fault the Shack for seeking higher rungs on the value chain. And I'm hardly a fan of either the Shack ("You have questions, we have blank stares") or Best Buy ("Best means most expensive!"). But, I do fear for the complete loss of generalist tech stores. A book is a book is a book, but when deciding between tablets or notebook PCs, or the like, actual interaction with the device answers a gazillion questions that don't seem to have answers on websites.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Anonymous Coward]

As someone in the Central Valley (California), with *2* Fry's stores, I can tell you this is SOP for their stores. 9/10 return stickered items are missing parts, many of them are faulty (not all, and occasionally you'll find swaths of items that were returned because customers often mistook what they were, good way to get a discount assuming everything is in the box!). But they'll have memory with bad sectors, cpus with bent pins (gotten both pre-LGA Intel, and all models of Athlons like that!), motherboards with missing accessories, etc. Basically anything with a sticker on it might turn out to be unusable giving you a 15-30 minute drive back to the store to replace it (although in their defense Fry's return policy is EXTREMELY flexible as long as you return it within 14 days (for most internal parts) or 30 days for everything else, assuming it's not your third time returning the item (They've had junk before that item in the batch was dead, think it was older MP3 players or something, but not a pleasant experience to have to come back 3 times to return something!)

Additionally: I had a friend working for them for 2 years who after a disagreement with their manager was told to sign a VQ rather than be fired (to avoid paying unemployment to him). Another employee I overheard after they set up electronic signins next to the sales board who had to quit and get rehired (thus losing seniority) in order to shift back from full time employment to part time due to schooling. Their employee handling is horrible, and the people who aren't constant turnovers fall into the categories of (career underachievers, mostly buerocratic, and older layoffs who can't find work anywhere else. The latter are often the nicest and most helpful people in the store, while the former make you really wish there was somewhere better to shop.) Sad, but another sign of the inexorable decline of American society (it's not even just business anymore.)

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[ColdWetDog]

My local Radio Shack (rural Alaska) sells:

- Batteries, lots of different kinds of batteries. Actually reasonable quality batteries.
- The standard bits of Junk Electronics - cordless phones, clock radios, a scanner or two, cheap marine band radios (a local favorite).
- RC airplane stuff.
- Junk electronic games.
- Cables, actually a reasonable selection of cables. Most 'normal' people can get what they want. (No 15 pin Amphenol waterproof bulkhead mounts).
- Junk electronic games.
- TVs.
- Hot tubs.
- Tanning booth in back.
- Espresso Bar in front.
- A rather odd selection of component parts - resistors, capacitors, LEDS, some surface mount stuff, some generic transistors, a couple of coils.

So, it appears that the owner has taken the core of Radio Shack inventory and overlaid it with stuff he thinks that the locals would want or just stuff he's interested in selling. Whatever works, I suppose.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Concerned Onlooker]

"After I went through isle by isle I found it between the printers and cordless phones."

Did you have to paddle very far?

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[ShanghaiBill]

you're not going to buy a refrigerator online

Why not? I bought a refrigerator online last year. It had good ratings, I read the reviews, made sure it had all the features I wanted, and then I clicked and bought it. It was delivered two days later.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[SydShamino]

I spend my days designing modern electronic devices, and I have seen other parts with plenty of defects. But...capacitors are generally crap. We as a company have decided to stop using tantalum electrolytics in our products because they fail far too often, and do so with flashy results. But ceramics while stable crack too often in the manufacturing process and still aren't always available in larger capacitance values. We're moving towards polymers for bulk use and ceramics for pretty much everything else, and have to design boards around protecting the ceramics from cracking.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[DigiShaman]

That's exactly what Dell does and I suspect others as well. Although it's not official. When a part is returned for RMA replacement, it will get trashed if the fault is obvious (bad fan, blown PSU, or clicking HDD). If its status is questionable, further soft diagnostics are ran. If they pass, the gremlin infested part with an intermittent hard failure goes back into circulation for the next poor sob.

I want to know if they track the serial number of the parts as they're cycled in and out of Dell. How many time must it come back and forth before they capture it for good and smash it with a sledge hammer?!

Honest to God. I once had a faulty RAID card get replaced three times in a PowerEdge 2950 in attempt to resolve a faulty PERC processor failure according to diags. Dell support thought the system board was killing them. Eventually everything except the chassis got replaced! Soon after a regional Dell rep for the Houston area decided to pull the whole damn server and replace it with a brand new one fully upgraded. Eventually word got out that other customers and techs were shorting out their RMAed RAID cards by not installing its cache memory battery in the proper (but critical) order.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[hairyfeet]

And I think you just nailed why these stores are going down, its a total crapshoot as to what kind of service you're gonna get. for electronics in my area we have two Best buys and a Staples. Now the first best buy, the farther away one naturally, actually has helpful staff, will help you find what you are looking for and if you seem interested in a new PC they will often throw in a little swag just to seal the deal, like a sleeve for that netbook or a little bookbag to carry your laptop, its just little stuff but it does make you feel better about buying there. Now the closer best buy is like a ghost town, if they didn't have RFID tags you could carry off half the store without ever seeing anybody. and if you do see an employee they do this almost comical trying to pretend they don't see you, this "Quick! look the other way and move at a brisk pace away from them!" kinda thing. And the staples? God that store is total crap. there is NOT A SINGLE THING on the shelves they will sell you, not one, its ALL bait and switch. that printer? that monitor? laptop? desktop? anything? all you get is "Nope outta stock, but we do have" and they will point out something that is nearly double the price. and that is of course not counting the fact that their prices sucked to begin with, but i guess a 40% markup isn't enough for the manager of that location, its 70% or nothing. No wonder their parking lot always looks like the place is abandoned.

So frankly i don't blame people for just not buying offline, frankly even if the price was a little higher I'd rather deal with amazon. with amazon i have a problem and its "No problem, we'll fix it" and its hassle free. When my sister bought some books and they just disappeared thanks to the thieving local post office (tracking showed it getting there then nothing, just gone) they never said a word other than "We're sorry we'll fix it" and had new replacements shot out there by fed ex in just two days. When i ordered a PC case that ended up looking like it was used as a tire chuck they said 'Don't bother sending it back, we'll send you another one" and there it was, no muss or fuss. Between them, Newegg and Tigerdirect I rarely even shop local for anything other than groceries anymore and even though the prices ARE cheaper online even if they were 20% higher I'd still buy thanks to hassle free shopping. Maybe if the shops would take a "customer is always right" attitude about service instead of having such high turnover and taking clueless workers because they are cheap maybe their business would go up.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[ceoyoyo]

Meh, I went in about fifteen years ago with a friend and asked for a flux capacitor, then watched the sales guy search for one for ten minutes.

It hasn't really been Radio Shack for a long time.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[TheLink]

Might be reflective of the USA's electronics manufacturing industry.

You want to see old school radio shack style stuff (and more), go to China (especially Shenzen). Of course there's a difference, in those places you may see people doing dubious stuff like assembling batteries in front of you and sticking the "original" holograms on them: http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=283 ;)

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[aXis100]

I dont have a Jaycar in my town and used to really miss it, but it's turned out to be far better to just buy stuff online, and you only have to be slightly organised.

Lately I get stuff from element14 (farnell), and with a $10 minimum credit card order you get free express courier shipping. The components are at my door within about 36 hours, even when it's just a few crappy components. The prices are good too - the other day I ran out of diodes and decided I should get a stack to avoid that situation again. 100 x IN4007's later my shopping basket was only $2 and I had to spend another half hour finding other fun stuff to bump up the total :)

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[hairyfeet]

Because reviews from actual geeks is usually worth more than hands on? I mean holding that Seagate 1.5Tb would have taught me nothing but over a dozen reviews that were 'Holy crap i bought a dozen of these and they all choked and died hard in less than two months!" tells me quite a lot. Take the new netbook I got, most places had it listed as having win 7 32 bit and with a max RAM of 4Gb, but Amazon had as its first review a guy that pointed out it was actually Win 7 X64 and oh it takes 8Gb and here is the link. it was only $6 difference between the 4gb stick and a matched pair at that time so I bought and can say i'm really happy with my EEE. Handling it frankly wouldn't have told me anything more than i already knew since i had handled 12 inch netbooks before and had already tried out a customer's older EEE so i knew what to expect. it was online where they had not only the info about it actually being 64 bit and a link to the matched pair but even a tutorial on how to take the unit apart if you'd like to change out the HDD for an SSD. The first reviewer had actually done that and according to him with 8gb of RAM and an SSD the EEE handles more like a CULV than a netbook.

so I can see wanting to do your shopping online because handling it only tells you about size and feel, it tells you nothing about whether the unit sucks power, or dies 5 minutes after you get it home, runs too hot to watch HD video or struggles with some kinds of content, all that you can find out from reviews. Hell I had a real nice back and forth on a review I did for a Deneb X4, I even ran a couple of programs for the guy and timed them just so he'd know what he was looking at, and i'd probably do the same thing for someone with my new Thuban if they asked on my review, you just can't get that kinda thing offline.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[SacredNaCl]

I don't know, but MicroCenter seems to be able to do it. I haven't looked at their books, but on price, they compete against the Newegg's, Amazon, and everyone else on the major items that matter. You pay a slight convenience fee for some items (1-2% above to have it today), but most things it works out in your favor even with the tax.

Now they could be bleeding money left, and right ... However, I don't think so. I think they are just making slightly less money on each sale.

 

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[DurendalMac]

I can see Best Buy going away. So many of those stores are run by inept morons and so much corporate policy is made by inept morons. If you're really lucky, you'll get an honest salesperson who actually knows what they're talking about. Otherwise it's brainless chunkheads throwing whatever they can at you. If you're really lucky, you'll get a Geek Squad tech who knows what he's doing and will fix it right. Otherwise, you get some idiot sales flunkie who can barely read the checklist of crap to do, a checklist that probably ends with "Just sell 'em a bunch of crap if you can't figure it out". Best Buy's reputation has been dwindling because they're bloody incompetent. People will go elsewhere for their goods if it continues and BB will tank. Any town big enough for a BB already has alternate stores.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[DigiShaman]

It's keyed so that's not the issue. Typically a PERC (RAID) card is assembled in three parts. The card itself, cache memory, and battery. The entire PERC card assembly can be removed and installed into the motherboard just fine as it's acceptable to do so. The problem is that when Dell ships an RMAed PERC card, it's just the card by itself. It's up to the customer or on-site tech to migrate the cache memory and battery over to it. This is where the problem begins. According to the service documentation, when removing the card you must first disconnect the cache battery before removing the cache. Reverse the steps when installing cache. If you leave the battery connected while adding or removing the cache, most certainly you will fry the module and potentially damage the PERC processor too.

I suppose the argument could be made both ways. On one hand, this card could have been designed better from an electrical engineering standpoint to be more robust and serviceable by adding additional checks and balances in place within the circuitry. On the other, if people would just RTFM and protect against ESD, this wouldn't have been a problem in the first place.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Grishnakh]

Same goes for Best Buy. I tried buying a laptop there for my wife; I really didn't want to, but she didn't want to wait for NewEgg to deliver, so we went to BB since it's local. Got a floor model Lenovo on sale. Took it home after refusing the extra warranty BS, started setting it up with all my regular software at the time (Firefox etc.), and it had some weird intermittent problem (I think it either reset spontaneously, or the screen blanked out, I forget exactly). Brought it back for a return, they said they'd have to charge us a restocking fee, as well as some big fee for Geek Squad to clean out the software I had installed, so they could resell it. I pointed out that it was faulty, but since they couldn't see any problem, they were going to resell it. Never mind how ridiculous it is that they want to resell a PC without wiping the HD first; you never know what I might have screwed up or planted there (keylogger, etc.). So I started removing the software myself to avoid the stupid fee, and the intermittent problem manifested itself, so the morons there actually got to see it and decided to give me a full refund.

We took the money and this time my wife let me order a laptop from NewEgg; it arrived a few days later and is still working years later. She refuses to buy anything from BB any more.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[compro01]

$80. The firmware would be for the macroing capability. The thing also glows and doesn't ghost, so you can press as many keys at once as you like.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[lord_mike]

Obviously a franchise. A company store would never sell that stuff. The franchise stores are great, 'cos you can still get all the discontinued and outdated Radio Shack items from years past that are still of interest.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Rakarra]

Because I can't imagine somebody buying a a big screen TV or even a laptop based solely on online descriptions (unless you're determined to get Apple gear in which case going to a store and poking at the laptop adds nothing to the decision-making process).

I don't see why you wouldn't buy a TV based on online descriptions. Unless you're at a high-end videophile store, the TV you see in a store will most likely be calibrated incorrectly, have the brightness turned Waaaaay up to match the bright store lighting, and an image split and shared with a hundred other TVs which may or may not be the display's native resolution. Seeing a TV at a store is usually a horrible way to get a judge of image quality and online ratings and tests are a more reliable way than your own eyes to get a good idea of the visual quality. Not a bad way of figuring out how the bezel will look to see if it'll match your den, though.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[DigiShaman]

Yes. Dell does run a full hardware diagnostic for all computers being resold.

It's been over 7 year since I've lasted worked for Dell. Back when I lived in Austin, they had a warehouse like facility where trucks could load and unload at the trucking dock. Anyways, my contracted job was to refurbish laptops and desktops. It was a simple matter of taking the unit in question and PXE boot them into hardware diagnostics. When a fault is found, we simply order a replacement part from a list available to us at our console. Within a few minutes, a parts running would search and deliver the part to me in person. Once installed, tests are re-ran. If the test passed, we could save the new hardware configuration to be updated with the service tag. That final configuration determined the new cost of the machine to be sold at. The last step was to PXE boot them again for re-imaging of the OS with drivers. How exactly did the right OS get chosen with the proper drivers slip streamed into them? Not sure, but Dell had the system down to a science. It worked.

Re:Thank god we still have Radio Shack

[Anonymous Coward]

My wife bought a cast iron tub online. I knew that she was looking for one, but didn't realize she was actually going to purchase one online.

Well the company drop shipped it to our house for free, and provided kick ass support for finding the correct hardware for the tub (I guess the faucets that she chose were European, so we needed adapters). I would certainly buy a big / bulky / large ticket item online again, as long as the firm was reputable.

Of course our plumber quit on the spot when he saw the tub. I guess you are supposed to buy from your plumbers so they can get the mark up. Oh well, no wonder the tub was so cheap compared to what the plumber was showing us -- my wife just thought that she was doing the plumber a favor by finding something better and less expensive than what he was selling. LOL

Stock Price is an Effect, not a Cause

[afabbro]

I thought this looked familiar...this article was published on the Forbes web site on January 2nd. It's also a bit ranty rather than well-researched, though there's no doubt that Best Buy is not doing well.

Cutting_Crew...because Best Buy is doing poorly, its stock is down 40%. Its stock price is not one of "the reasons highlighted" for why it's doing poorly. Stock price is an effect, not a cause.

On a related note...is Fry's having problems?

I used to work for best buy

[assemblerex]

They have no concept of the competition that Amazon represents. They think in store purchases will keep them alive. They need to:
1. Fire half the staff, and only hire professional sales people (Not 30 seventeen year olds)
2. Reduce the store size by half or more.
3. Reduce prices by having less selection but enjoy the bulk purchase price point.
4. Stop high pressure pushing of accessories and service plans on people.
5. Work with vendors to have exclusive items made for them not found online (like a white or pink dyson)
Still doomed by their horrible reputation.

Re:I used to work for best buy

[wanzeo]

As someone who has spent time as an electronics sales rep, I say good riddance.

I was always as honest and informative as I could be (much more so than my coworkers), but you really can't give meaningful advice in a 10 minute sales pitch. Half of the people are coming cold to the technology, they are not going to be educated in time to make a good decision. The other half have made up their minds because of marketing, and nothing you say will convince them otherwise. And then add to that the fact that most technology purchasing is rather subjective. Just look at the heated discussions on any tech website about which products are the right choice, they go on for pages and pages. And that is between people who are already very well informed about the basic principles.

Spending a few hours reading user reviews on amazon or newegg, and being able to google unfamiliar terms, is more valuable than the most tech savy and personable sales rep. And because most sales reps are subpar, internet shopping wins by a landslide.

Re:Apple

[LWATCDR]

Because you can not go online and buy an apple product for 60% price of buying it in the store.
It is that apple control thing working for them.

Re:Forgot to add older stores

[MightyMartian]

Margins are very low on electronics. You had to move a lot of product to keep a brick and mortar electronics store afloat even before the Internet and Walmart became such huge competitors. Quite frankly I rarely go into them any more. I find even taking shipping into account that I can find better deals online. I haven't bought an actual computer from a brick and mortar store in seven or eight years.

They've got longer than that

[damn_registrars]

Brick & Mortar will still serve a purpose for a while yet. There will always be times when you need some widget that day, and no amount of money will solve that problem through Amazon. It might not be Best Buy, but it certainly won't be WalMart either; we will have a large nationwide chain carrying electronics for people who need something now and don't mind paying a little more for it than they would online.

That said the complaints listed in the (over 1 month old) article are very similar to what was happening at CompUSA when they were in their death spiral; young kids were being hired with no knowledge of anything, and corporate suits with decision making power were being promoted who knew even less.

Re:They've got longer than that

[Doctor_Jest]

I think people will pay a little more if they have a better experience. Stores have forgotten that, and like the failure of all those who tried to compete with Wal Mart on price, they lost. Retailers can't compete on price with the online retailers, even with sales tax (which is a nightmare of logistical nonsense just waiting in the wings)..

Retailers need to stop focusing on price and margins and wonder if there is still such a thing as customer loyalty. I don't know if there is, but companies like Best Buy don't seem to give a shit about trying. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work... but for fuck's sake, how can these companies make the SAME EXACT mistakes that their dead competitors make and expect to come out on top, or even alive for that matter? It's like watching monkeys throw shit at each other. It's funny, but you don't want to get any on you.

Re:They've got longer than that

[damn_registrars]

I think people will pay a little more if they have a better experience

That same statement is made, instead ending with "to support a local business" or "to buy an American-made product" or "to support a good cause". But in the end it's just words, words that most often are not backed up by action.

Retailers can't compete on price with the online retailers, even with sales tax (which is a nightmare of logistical nonsense just waiting in the wings)..

The problem is though - and anyone who works in retail can tell you this - customers walk in to the store and if it isn't something they need right away (and even some times if it is) they'll say "I can buy it for less through [random fly-by-night online site that's been up less than a week]". So the retailers have to be aware of their online competition and at least put up a good fight on price.

Retailers need to stop focusing on price and margins and wonder if there is still such a thing as customer loyalty. I don't know if there is, but companies like Best Buy don't seem to give a shit about trying.

I'm moderately happy with their rewardzone program. Granted I live in a place where there is no alternative for electronics if I can't wait for them to be shipped, so they have me in somewhat of a bind.

If it doesn't work, it doesn't work... but for fuck's sake, how can these companies make the SAME EXACT mistakes that their dead competitors make and expect to come out on top, or even alive for that matter?

Because they all get lead down the same street. They all face the same customers.

The real tragedy, though, is that they all promote the same kind of shit-for-brains thinking to upper management. Not only do they push the stores to select for the least knowledgeable (and hence least expensive on payroll) employees, they also strive to give their employees as little power as possible when dealing with customers.

Quite honestly, many of the employees at Best Buy couldn't give you good customer service even if they wanted to, as they simply are not allowed to do such a thing. I saw the same thing as an employee at CompUSA and now I can see it in the employees at Best Buy with myself as a customer.

Why should I buy stuff from Best Buy?

[Peter Simpson]

When there's Newegg? I mean, honestly: $25 USB cables and re-boxed returns vs easy return, no tax and better prices (even including shipping).

Re:Why should I buy stuff from Best Buy?

[Sorthum]

The sole reason to go to a BestBuy is "I need this item today." That's about it.

Re:Why should I buy stuff from Best Buy?

[lymond01]

And Best Buy needs to consider that. Drop its online prices. Up its in-store service and knowledge. Work to maintain its employees for more than 6 months. Hire people at reasonable salaries, train them regularly, don't mess with their schedules without telling them. As it stands now, most of the employees in Best Buy are high school kids who stand around and chat with each other, don't know the answer to your questions, and will be gone in 3 months. This is no way to sustain a business where knowledge is useful. Let the transitive staff wait tables. Hire real employees and pay them real money and treat them like real company employees.

The only problem with Best Buy is that management doesn't see the company's role in the new age. And since they're lost, they feel their company is lost, so they treat all their employees like a 4 year old's goldfish.

Re:Forgot to add older stores

[SJHillman]

They're nice for when you need it NOW. A few times I've had a fan, PSU or video card die and for one reason or another, I couldn't wait for 3 day shipping (2 day and overnight shipping usually costs twice as much as the component is worth) so I headed down to Best Buy or Circuit City and grabbed it.

I never understood how they stayed in business....

[dgatwood]

With consistently higher prices and terrible customer service policies, I can't imagine how Best Buy has stayed in business as long as they have. There's a reason I've always called them "Worst Buy". They usually are.

To give you an idea of their customer service, I priced a product online with Google, and it told me that Best Buy had it for a great price. I went there, and found that they had just raised their price by nearly a hundred bucks. I knew this because they had a recently returned unit available for less than their previous price. I bought the returned unit.

Unfortunately, it was defective (flaky HDMI output). At most stores, when a product is DOA, you can go in and they'll swap it out with a working one. Not at Best Buy. Because they didn't have any more customer-returned products from when the price was lower, my only option (at their store) was to pay an extra $120 to get a working product.

I pointed out that their new, higher price was about thirty or forty dollars higher than Fry's, just two blocks away, and over a hundred dollars higher than Amazon. Needless to say, I opted for a refund.

I then drove to Fry's. They matched Amazon's price, so I ended up getting it for almost exactly what Best Buy had been charging two weeks earlier.

Why anyone ever darkens the door of Best Buy is beyond me. I could see buying stuff like DVDs from Best Buy online (where you can price compare easily), but just walking into the store, your odds of getting even an acceptable deal are right up there with winning the lottery.

Microcenter?

[iamhassi]

Ummm.... doesn't Microcenter count? Guess not according to Forbes, because in 2006 they had 19 stores, 20 in 2007, 21 in 2008, and in 2012 Microcenter has 23 stores. Sure that's slow growth, but still growth none-the-less, and they're much better than CompUSA, Circuit City (is Circuit City "tech"?) and Best Buy because Microcenter actually has competitive prices.

Want a new MSI Geforce GTX 580 video card? $500 from Newegg, $520 from Microcenter. Think I'd just pay that extra 4% to have the card TODAY and have a local shop to return/exchange it to if there's a problem and judging from the 13% 1-egg reviews I'd there is a good risk there could be a problem.

Re:Microcenter?

[iamhassi]

Need a drive in a hurry? 2tb for $130 at Microcenter, same price as Newegg. Gee, do I wanna wait a week or have the drive in my PC this afternoon? Decisions, decisions.... oh Newegg wants $7.86 shipping? Microcenter it is!

But I guess if the Forbes reporter included Microcenter that would have gone against his 5-page theory generating god knows how many banner ads. Best we just forget Microcenter exists so Forbes can make a few extra $$$ off ads. Selling out journalistic honesty to make a few bucks? You betcha!

Re:Microcenter?

[russotto]

Ummm.... doesn't Microcenter count? Guess not according to Forbes, because in 2006 they had 19 stores, 20 in 2007, 21 in 2008, and in 2012 Microcenter has 23 stores. Sure that's slow growth, but still growth none-the-less, and they're much better than CompUSA, Circuit City (is Circuit City "tech"?) and Best Buy because Microcenter actually has competitive prices.

They also tend to have stuff in stock, and for many items (printers, monitors) working items you can examine. Why would you go to a store when you could order online for much less? Three good reasons
1) You want it now
2) Shipping cost overwhelms the price difference
3) You'd like to take a look at it before buying it

But most brick and mortar retailers mess up _all three_. They won't carry much and what they carry they won't keep in stock, so you have a good chance of not finding what you want. For things where shipping cost is significant (e.g. cables), they'll carry only ridiculously-priced brands so they're STILL more expensive than ordering online + shipping (even for one lousy cable). And if they have any samples out, they're often obviously broken, and usually not actually working.

try to think like a Forbes reader

[decora]

you are probably a hedge fund guy, or friends with a hedge fund guy, or some other type of person who makes money by buying and selling big chunks of other people.

you see a story about an electronics retailer.

they see a story about an opportunity to short sell or buy credit default swaps against a company's debt. imagine if you are sitting at a poker table and instead of chips you are playing with coins that each say '1 million dollars'. you can start to get an inkling of the mindset here. you dont care if the other people at the table are nurses, waiters, hairdressers, authors, poets, politicians, soldiers, etc. all you care about is what is in their hand, and which way the game is going to go, because you can get rich off of it, but more importantly, you can get the high you get from winning. thats what the "their stock price is down" thing means. it doesnt pretend to have any intelligent commentary on cause and effect. its poker information for poker players.

Good riddance.

[Higgins_Boson]

Best Buy is a horrible, horrible place. Those stores are typically overpriced, asshole-filled warehouses with a stench I can only guess is dead animals hidden in the car audio department. Lump all that in with morons on the sales team and even bigger morons in management and you have the reason this place will not be missed by most people.

If you are a Best Buy idiot (read: employee), I apologize for offending you... but you deserve it. Last time I went to a Best Buy was to buy a family member a flat-screen LCD television. I asked for help from no less than 5 people before someone ACTUALLY came back "in a couple of minutes" as promised repeatedly. It was a mistake, especially since the same set was $70 cheaper online. Too bad it was too close to Christmas at the time to bother ordering it online.

Good riddance, assholes.

P.S.
I am sure this will be modded flamebait or troll or whatever... I simply do not care. Especially since those titles (flamer and troll) are used to say "I disagree with you" these days, instead of what they are really meant for. Which is to label someone who actually IS trolling.

Re:Apple

[greg1104]

TFA talks about loss of control over margins at Best Buy. Apple Stores are known to have some of the highest margins in retail. Their success demonstrate that people are willing to pay high margins for products if they feel they're getting good service for it--which is certainly not the Best Buy experience.

Also, it's rarely the case that there is a large advantage to purchasing an Apple product outside of their stores, due to their extensive price controls at all retailers. As you can also see from that chart, Apple makes an ever higher margin for the products they sell online. They could adjust their price to match the lower overhead and sell them cheaper direct. The fact that they don't is an interesting component to their overall strategy.

Re:Apple

[atriusofbricia]

Yet Apple can't seem to open stores up fast enough. Go figure.

That's because Apple stores are not electronics stores. They're fashion stores that happen to sell electronics.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

web vs. intranet site

[wjcofkc]

Let's not forgot that this is the same place where if you go in citing a price on their website they will pull up an intranet site that is a clone of bestbuy.com with different prices to "prove" you wrong. Getting busted for that was the end of me shopping there.

Best Buy? You mean....

[i_want_you_to_throw_]

"Amazon showroom" ?

This SHOULD NOT BE NEWS

[manual_tranny]

I guess I am one of the only ones that noticed the way Best Buy did business more than 15 years ago? As a child I remember them charging an exorbitant fee for diagnosing and repairing a radio, only to have replaced the batteries. Best Buy has always been a racket. In the early 00's, Monster Cables were apparently made out of Pixie dust and Myrrh, from the way their employees talked them up. The poor employees. They are hassled and forced to mess with customers, but they get no commission for being pushy salesman. Best Buy has an opportunity now to prevent failure. If they don't change, you can bet that someone is making money on their failure.

Best Buy is not dying! The article is WRONG!

[David_Hart]

The theory presented is that Best Buy is dying due to lower than normal sales and lower margins. This is presumed to be caused by poor customer service based on personal experience with the writer's local Best Buy store and some inventory issues for items that NO retailer had in stock during the Christmas season.

The truth is actually more boring. Best Buy sales are down because the economy has been in the toilet. Best Buy margins are down because margins are down for all electronics. In addition, the mad rush to 3D that electronics manufacturers were hoping for never happened. Very little of this has to do with customer service.

Personally, I have never had a problem with my local Best Buy. I've been able to return items without question and they have been very helpful when I am looking for a particular item. Anyone who knows me knows that I am a big proponent of Amazon. But there are many people like me who just don't feel comfortable buying appliances and expensive TVs over the Internet.

Re:I never understood how they stayed in business.

[TrekkieGod]

Priced a product online with Google, and it told me that Best Buy had it for a great price. I went there, and found that they had just raised their price by nearly a hundred bucks.

The thing about Best Buy is that the price their advertise online is always lower than the price at the store. I learned this a while back, and as a result I always buy at their online store and choose "pick up at the store."

Usually I'll just avoid them completely, but if they do have a competitive price, or if I can't wait for the shipping from Amazon or Newegg, then at least I save myself the annoyance of going over there expecting a price only to see it 50% more expensive than the price advertised online.

Circuit City had the same problem. Years ago I needed a wireless keyboard, and they had a pretty good deal advertised online. I showed up, saw their in-store price was significantly higher. I figured, "hey, I'll just price-match it at the register," only to have the cashier tell me that they couldn't price-match online offerings, even if they were their own. So I walked to the side to make sure I wasn't blocking anyone else in line, pulled out my PDA and logged on to their website using their public wifi right in front of her (blast from the past, huh? It was before the smartphones took over), ordered the keyboard with pick it up at the store, showed her the confirmation number and asked, "can I pick it up now?"

Re:Black Friday 2011: The Nightmare

[Anonymous Coward]

As a former employee at Best Buy, I can tell you exactly why they make it difficult to buy that stuff. The three big times in the year are Chirstmas, tax time, and back to school. The seasons around each of these events takes up around 70% of the year. In that part of the year, there is only a finite number of an item available at the store you are at any given time. Best Buy will sell out of the hot laptop that everyone wants. Frankly they don't want you buying it if you don't buy the additional warranty or accessories or whatever. If you don't buy it, someone else will. I'm convinced that corporate would just rather have you shop somewhere else. They get shipments twice a week, but there is a million different variations that the public demands so it's hard to keep all of the stock flowing to the exact right places, so it's easier to make it a difficult experience for the grab and go customer who just want to buy four of the laptop with a $5 markup and leave none for customers who might potentially want to buy other items to go with it. Contrast this with Amazon, where they can ship your item from anywhere and it makes little difference to the customer. Best Buy has a pretty decent store transfer and warehouse ordering system, but customers often refuse to wait as they have waited until the last second to buy a gift and only budgeted for the laptop that has been on sale the last six days.

Re:Apple

[bennomatic]

Huh? Basically everyone there can check you out. What's impossible to find is cash registers because they don't have them. Or maybe they have one tucked away. But most transactions are done via credit card, and every employee has mobile devices which can help you check out.

Not to mention the fact that if you have an iTunes account and their store app, you can actually self-check-out without talking to anyone, except to maybe show the electronic receipt to someone on the way out the door.

It's easy to shit on Apple, and clearly it's fun, because lots of people do it. But to say something like "actual sales are secondary" in the face of outrageous success on their part is just pure silliness. It's not like people are just pointing to foot traffic and calling them a success for that--although that is one of the metrics getting played up--it's about dollars per square foot, and love them or hate them, they are indeed making more dollars per square foot than pretty much any other retail establishment.

If actual sales are secondary, then their success at whatever you think their primary goal is must be absolutely stellar.