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UK Home Secretary Bans US Martial Arts Expert
Big Hairy Ian writes "An American expert in violent self-defense has been excluded from entering the UK by the Home Office. From the article: 'Tim Larkin tried to board a plane from his home in Las Vegas on Tuesday, but was given a UK Border Agency letter saying "his presence here was not conducive to the public good." Mr Larkin, who was due to host seminars, told the BBC the move was a "gross over-reaction." The Home Office said he was subject to an exclusion order. A spokeswoman said: "The home secretary will seek to exclude an individual if she considers that his or her presence in the UK is not conducive to the public good." Mr Larkin — who trained as a US Navy Seal — runs a company teaching combat to military and law enforcement clients in the United States.'"
Remember, this is the country where being "anti-social" is a crime. Yes, for real.
This is not the first time someone has been prevented from entering a country. While the US refuses people all the time, we're supposed to get indignant that this person is refused entry to GB?
I'm sure the mental train wreck in some peoples' minds regarding this is epic.
However, this is not news.
--
BMO
The UK has a different connotation for anti-social than does the US, and in UK law, the term has very specific meanings.
According to non-mainstream news sources including Benjamin Fulford (a former correspondent for Forbes Magazine) and a U.S. military official known as The Drake, both the U.S. and the U.K. are encountering a co-ordinated effort to remove, forcibly if necessary, corrupt political officials from power in compliance with the law. This effort has a lot of backing from significant numbers of U.S. military personnel, Interpol, the Pentagon, the Agencies, U.S. Marshals... and underground Asian societies.
Interesting that this piece is coming out at this juncture.
The Wolfpack Project: BitCoin + Crowdfunding = Political Accountability
This monster came and gave his hate-fest speech to a happy audience.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2126914/Sheikh-Raed-Salah-wins-appeal-UK-Governments-attempts-deport-him.html
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2012/04/party-in-london-to-celebrate-anti.html
The UK is going to hell.
This is the same woman who, upon learning that border control was overloaded and relaxing passport checks for low risk cases at peak time, decided to solve the problem by firing the guy in charge and forcing checks to never be relaxed. Result: planes stacking up in the sky because the queues at border control were too long. Prime Minister summons her and gives her a right ass-kicking and now risk-based enforcement is back on the table.
It will be tempting for Slashdot posters to over-generalize from this case to try and make sweeping statements about the entire UK or British people (just as it's tempting to do the same about Americans when the US Govt does something retarded). But the core problem in this case really boils down to one woman and her arbitrary and inconsistent management of the borders.
They've been excluding a lot of people recently for very silly reasons. Apparently someone have been given more power then they have wit to manage and they're basically going power mad. It's one thing if you're excluding people that present a public risk. It's another if the reasons are totally arbitrary.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
To be honest.
Special Ops training for cops?
I think the reason may have more to do with this (from TFA):
A visit in 2009 to Slough, in Berkshire, where Mr Larkin held a class intended to teach how to "maim and kill in self-defence", provoked widespread condemnation from the community.
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He is speaking in two areas that were affected by riots in 2011. In these riots, almost half of the rioters were Black (see wikipedia). Therefore in the twisted minds of the UK authorities, teaching people in areas affected by riots to defend themselves is equivalent to racism and extremism.
from TFA:
The section of TFA that you quoted shows not the slightest hint of a mention of racism or extremism.
Did you copy the wrong sentence, or are you just making shit up?
shouldn't they ban lady gaga too?
No, I am inferring how the UK authorities think based on my understanding of their left-wing authoritarian mindset. In their eyes, minorities rioting is not that bad, but people defending themselves from rioting is dangerous. You are free to disagree, but to classify all forms of inference as "making shit up" is not very smart.
Who's he kidding? The UK Border Agency would be irrelevant to Chuck Norris.
Boffoonery - downloadable Comedy Benefit for Bletchley Park
"making shit up" is not very smart.
Since thats exactly what you did...
Does your understanding include the fact that Labour got booted out over a year ago?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
it was actually Steven Seagal. The clues are all there:
violent self defence, US Navy Seal, his presence here was not conducive to the public good, dodgy hair
He advocated using force against the British police and he asks people to use lethal force despite it being illegal in the UK.
Yes, this kind of political correctness is universal in mainstream politics.
I clearly remember the mainstream reporting of the riots.
Even though the media never hinted that the majority of rioters were not white, when people organized to protect themselves from rioters, then they questioned whether the people organizing themselves were "racist".
Why should the conservative party think any differently?
They are turning him down because what he wanted to do something illegal in the UK.
This guy owes the Home Office bureaucrat who made this decision a percentage of his future revenues, because his career is *made*. "LEARN SELF DEFENSE FROM THE MAN JUDGED TOO LETHAL TO ENTER THE UK!"
Maiming and killing in self defence is sometimes necessary. Unprovoked violent attacks to happen. On the rare chance that such a situation were to occur, I would like to be able to defend myself or my friends and family. Yes, you can study many martial arts and sports in the UK already, but they are of limited use in an actual street fight. There are no tap outs, there's no "soft" canvas mat, no ref to tell the guy he can't use that broken bottle to gut you.
Ultimately, however, this is not the point. This man will teach a civilian how to cause serious injuries to a person, but we let these same people point 2 tonnes of motorised steel around our roads on a daily basis, operate plant machinery which can destroy whole buildings, run our healthcare infrastructure. Learning how to do something dangerous doesn't mean they will employ that knowledge improperly. These people are still culpable for their actions.
Ultimately all the government is done is prevent the spread of knowledge.
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
Nice dodge. So, if the problem is universal, why did your earlier comment include the words "left-wing authoritarian mindset"?
First, the word SEAL is an abbreviation and is therefore capitalized. Also, Tim Larkin was never a Navy SEAL according to real US Navy SEAL authenticators. He dropped out of BUD/S and therefore never qualified as a SEAL. He's been lying about his service for years.
Proof: http://www.socnet.com/showthread.php?t=47063
I do not think this guy could have received this much good advertising if he used all of his revenue of his company on it! I think he is pretty stoked, even if he cannot travel to the UK. I would be.
And the USA bans people from entering because they send tweets about partying. So what ?
Sovereign nations decide who gets to come in. Nothing new here.
Including the UK... even when I live there.
I'll just sit here and ignore the existence of the whole Earth.
Until someone pisses me off. Then they will be in for a world of pain not seen in a 50 thousand years.
That last ice age was just me slightly annoyed, only slightly.
> left-wing authoritarian mindset.
You're not from the UK, are you? Left-wing my granny's sagging tits.
So, If you are unlucky kill someone in selfdense (can happen) and you have attendent a course to kill someone in selfedefense, probaly the judge will consider this as murder, just because it's proven you have trained to reach this result.
At least for the Belgian Law and I believe the Bristh Law will be in sync
.
In cases of our own citizens being limited in travel, such as the ex-Marine who couldn't leave Indiana by plane, I would argue against these; as they are US citizens, with certain rights and liberties which cannot be limited without due process of law. In the case of Kung Fu Jones, here...well, it's a free country here, and you can say what you want. Just don't think those same freedoms will make you desirable as a visitor in a foreign country. He trying to go to a foreign country to make the Bobbies' jobs more dangerous. In ANY country, that is called Sedition, which, in any nation, confers a penalty of life in prison or death. Forget the "legalities", it's called common fucking sense! You want to go somewhere, don't say you're gonna teach its citizens how to beat up the police!
For a SEAL, he ain't too bright. Now, if he were a Marine...j/k
It doesn't really matter what you think on the subject. It is just plain illegal in the UK.
The Home Office is saying to Brits that they are to LIE DOWN AND DIE! No guns. No glass or bobbed wire on their walls, not even self defense training. You are not to defend your life or the lives of your love ones. We here in Texas are disgusted and appalled.
You don't mind violent nut jobs if he looks like you, and not "one of them".
Only an American would call the current UK Government "left-wing".
The last time the UK had an actual left-wing Government was sometime back in the '70s. Like most of the Anglosphere, it's been moving further and further to the right for decades.
> Theresa May is an idiot
For those who remember Imelda Staunton's character in Harry Potter.
Please try to make a minimum effort if you are going to insult our intelligence by defending a murderer. After all, we end up wasting time reading the blather.
Since you've been busted doing what you shouldn't, all murderers should be believed. I'm sure it's that failed logic that got you in trouble with those around you in the first place.
That'd show their stiff upper lips a thing or three because, as every american knows, if violence doesn't solve the problem it's only because you're not using enough.
Because what he defines as a left-wing authoritarian mindset is, in fact, simply an authoritarian mindset. If the poster considers himself 'right-wing' and most of the authoritarianism he encounters seems to be 'left-wing' then he will naturally start to equate left wing with authoritarianism, even if he consciously knows better.
Besides, what passes for 'right-wing' in the UK today is still quite left of centre by US standards.
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Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
This may be true. But the fact remains that you're making shit up, and recognising this doesn't imply any lack of smartness.
++ Say to Elrond "Hello.".
Elrond says "No.". Elrond gives you some lunch.
...in the deadly art of Llop-Gach per chance?
"Get off the cross - we need the wood" - Tori Amos
The first, and the one that he subscribes to, is that his name [...] is the same as another man with ties to terrorist organizations.
That was the same reason that got (now deceased) Senator Kennedy on the no-fly watch list. Likely every time that being on that list could have caused him to be denied entry the front-line DHS employees recognized his face or entourage and let him in anyway. For other less-recognizable folks, including aging singers who haven't had a hit in decades, it is little surprise that being on that list will sometimes block them from travel.
Wait, what? "It's the law, so shut your mouth, citizen"? If you're British, your country has more issues than I thought...
Great Intellect...
We want to keep our jobs, so we are not allowing an outside consultant for military expertise such as combat, come in and teach our military....
who knew?
People are being denied entry into the USA for silly reasons. People are being denied entry into the UK for islly reasons. Once you get on Homeland Security's "no fly" list it's almost impossible to get off.
I'm beginning to see what what's going on here. Pretty soon we'll be prisoners in our own homes, unable to even walk the streets. Travel of any type will be so restricted "for our own safety", that there will be a 6-month waiting list to go to the supermarket.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
It's about time that american terrorists are stopped at the border!
I'll say!
Situation:
You are somebody proficient in the use of lethal force as a form of self defense. You are walking somewhere, minding your own business, when somebody comes up to you quickly and by virtue of surprise manages to subdue you and steals your wallet. The person turns to leave while you recover. Serendipitously, you are able to recover from the attack relatively quickly, and if you can get to your feet soon enough, do you a) call the police to report the crime, b) engage him in a brawl where it is not known how quickly or how far it will escalate, or c) kill the son-of-a-bitch? Remember, your life at this point is in absolutely no danger. While you could certainly have been said not to know this while he was attacking you, the attacking has clearly stopped and you are being left alone. He attacked you, and then took your wallet. That's all. He is in the process of leaving you and not showing any obvious signs of returning. His willingness and ability to resort to using lethal force in another engagement if you should attack him with non-lethal force is not known. What do you do?
Bear in mind that any reservations he may have had against using lethal force to subdue you simply to get your wallet may have been based on the assumption that it would take you longer to recover than you did, and an argument certainly exists that it should not necessarily be taken as a general measure of his ability, willingness, or lack thereof to use lethal force if he is actually attacked.
Taking everything into consideration, and assuming you can actually deliberate this in your mind in the moments that it was taking you to recover and get back onto your feet... what do you do?
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Drink-driving is bad and must be placed under strict limits but it is by no means the only impairment to driving. The impairment from driving while using even a handsfree mobile is comparable to a 0.08 BAC. Having an alcohol limit 4 times lower that the limit which causes the same impairment as handsfree mobile use is inconsistent unless you ban them as well. So before getting on your high moral horse perhaps you could let us know why Norway has not banned handsfree mobiles? Perhaps because Norwegians would object strongly to that whereas, due to the massive taxes on alcohol, people are more willing to let that be banned because it affects them less?
Oh - and if you look at the stats you will see that Norway has a lower accident death rate than almost all the EU from all causes and does not report separate drink/driving stats. So the reason you have fewer road deaths has nothing to do with your drink-driving legislation and probably far more to do with population density.
I personally think it's good they're keeping out an obvious fraud like Larkin from shilling his snake oil bullshido. He's yet another in a long list of trumped up 'near SEALS' that make their way through the martial arts consulting world.
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=88358
Tim Larkin is an expert in violent self defense like Bruce Willis is an expert in defusing hostage situation.
Only an American would call the current UK Government "left-wing".
The last time the UK had an actual left-wing Government was sometime back in the '70s. Like most of the Anglosphere, it's been moving further and further to the right for decades.
That's ridiculous. If by left wing you mean ran the country into the ground and caved into the unions causing mass strikes and civil unrest, then no that hasn't happened since the 70's (although it almost certainly would have done if Gordon Brown had stayed in for another term).
Last I heard, the UK had a 50% top tax rate and the biggest, most bloated welfare state in the western world. How is that not left wing?
Maiming and killing in self defence is sometimes necessary.
After you've neutralised a threat, why is it utterly necessary to maim your attacker for life? Or kill him? That's pure adrenaline-fuelled barbarism, not a reasonable defence posture.
Certainly not a member of a Muslim-majority country, which make up 25% of the countries of the world.
Depending on the situation, it may be necessary to disable an attacker quickly. An aggressor who is mentally ill, or under the influence of narcotics, may not respond to verbal warnings or a well placed thump on the nose. In a situation where you are presented with a relentless, sustained, and vicious attack, a disabling blow may be the only outcome. The question is whether it is you applying or receiving it.
For what it's worth, I would have no problem popping the shoulder of a guy with a knife, or kicking the knees out of a man waving a bottle. I would say that, in a situation where there is an immediate, significant threat to your person, it would be "reasonable" to disable an attacker with one destructive blow to a joint than several sustained blows to the head. The result is the same; You are safe, they are no longer a threat.
Obviously the first thing any person should learn is de-escalation techniques (I've never been in a street fight, despite having been confronted a few times with violent people). Failing that, though, quickly ending a street brawl protects others as well as you.
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
Like in the Spiderman movie, with great power comes great responsibility, that includes not shooting your mouth off, the baddies may also learn to ‘maim and kill’ from this loud mouth guy. Best to leave it to the cops to handle the violence and have leaders to create a just and safe political-economy for all and educate your children.
I've been mugged twice. Once at college, once while walking to a friend's house. He wants money; Give it to him. You have more. You don't have any more eyes or livers; Don't risk them for trinkets.
What you can do to prevent this is to make yourself look less of a target; Walk with your head up and your shoulders back, don't walk too fast, don't play with your iPhone walking down a dark alley. Hell, roll up your jumper sleeves under your jacket to make it look like you have jock's biceps. With any luck it'll be enough.
New situation; You are confronted with a drunk man waving a knife. He thinks you stole his wallet. He's not listening to reason, and he's blocking your escape. Do you get stabbed? I don't, I employ one of those life-threatening-situation-only techniques this guy taught me. The drunk gets a hospital trip and I get a day in court, but at least I'm alive.
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
I believe that the analogous crime in the US is called disorderly conduct.
Given that we currently have a rather nasty millionaire toff right-wing government (not significantly tempered by the LibDems), I assume your definition of 'Socialist' is anyone to the left of the teabaggers and the KKK.
I just went to his website and I'm surely not alone.
Well done.
Self-defence courses are entirely legal in the UK. What this man is advocating is a form of self-defence that involves disproportionate, extreme violence. Under British law, defence has to be proportionate to the threat - you can kill a person who is attempting to kill you, but you don't have the right to kill a person who only slaps you. The British police have warned that these "self-defence" courses are teaching non-legal self-defence, and that the people who use these methods will be prosecuted and likely land up in jail.
Would the U.S. authorities actually allow a "celebrity" foreigner who advocates and teaches illegal violence to enter the country? It seems U.S. authorities routinely reject people for much lesser reasons, like a Twitter post, being friends with some bikers, minor drugs use etc. Heck, until Obama overturned it, even HIV sufferers couldn't enter the U.S.
What exactly is dangerous about this guy?
Is the UK crazy? They let in dangerous Muslims by boatload. Many of which live on welfare. Then they exclude normal people.
This is duh.
You run the other way, or toward a safe area. This is Standard Operating Procedure.
My Sifu always stresses this.
Even if you think you "could" take them:
1) They have picked the time and place.
2) They probably have less to lose than you do (making them more effective and more dangerous).
3) Have you ever heard of having friends?
This is besides the obvious, the contents of the wallet are worth neither your life nor theirs.
Maybe the UK government had suspicions on this guy. A former Navy Seal travelling the world teaching martial arts? Seems like a nice cover.
The section of TFA that you quoted shows not the slightest hint of a mention of racism or extremism.
Actually the articles from 2009 did include some mentions of the BNP (a racist British political party that advocates throwing all non-whites out of the country), suggesting that BNP members were either involved in arranging the visit/courses or has signed up en masse. It wasn't clear. This time, I suspect the authorities might be concerned that he has (again) chosen to tour areas where racial tensions are high, and that he has some kind of links to the more violent extremist factions of the BNP. Since the authorities don't comment on why they reject someone, we will never know the real reason.
The section of TFA that you quoted shows not the slightest hint of a mention of racism or extremism.
Apparently, back in 2009, he was contracted by the BNP to train their members. That is where the racist/extremist angle comes from. He may not or may not personally be a racist extremist, but he was contracted to advocate and teach extreme and illegal methods of "self-defense" to a bunch of racists who believe that non-whites should be forced from Britain or exterminated. Apparently the BNP training courses didn't actually happen due to adverse publicity, but it does seem odd that, once again, he is intending to tour areas where racial tensions are higher.
If I had attributed something to the article that wasn't in there, that would be "making shit up". If I had been unwilling to clarify my reasoning, that would be "making shit up". Please explain what exactly I "made up", or where in my reasoning I made an error.
You mean that other Louisiana, called Arkansas. If it didn't suck so hard, Louisiana would fall into the gulf.
Let's see those limey bitches try to ban Chuck Norris. They should count themselves lucky this was some no-name pansy they were messing with.
His training makes him a weapon. Remember, good public order is for all to be EQUALLY VULNERABLE.
Maybe, but in the end of the day, UK jails less people and have lower criminality - especially lower violent criminality. So maybe those laws actually do more good then bad and UK citizens are right to defend them.
Blanket "any government or law is bad" is as stupid as blanket "any law is good".
So next time I think WE have a police state... I guess it is not in the interest of the "public good" in Britain for its citizens to be able to defend themselves. I don't care what the pansies in the UN say, you have the right to kill the guy who's trying to kill you.
Grar II
You absolutely do NOT know your life is not in any danger. If he has chosen to attack me, he chooses to accept the possible consequences, which include his death.
Grar II
I've also been mugged. I've also been beaten. I've also beaten the living shit out of the next guy who attacked me. Messed up his car, too. I told him to go home and tell his friends he got messed up by a fairy. I guarantee you he will not be out gay-baiting again, now that he knows some of us can fight back. And WILL. If that means I can't go to the UK, I don't think I'm missing all that much.
Grar II
A terrorist imam, who's called for the annihilation of all infidels, who tied to Hamas, who SNEAKED into the country illegally, got caught, got arrested, SUCCESSFULLY sued to be allowed to stay in the UK
Yes, the ends justifies the means int he UK, we get it.
Ironic that you just supported your argument with something as specious as an equally blanket statement you implied tacit support of.
Big reason fail for the AC's in the UK right there.
He trains people how to respond to perceived life threatening situations WITH deadly force.
He's really THE perfect target.
Some people feel that people need to be protected from themselves, which is sometimes true, but no way to live your life, or run a government, or maintain a healthy society.
Some people believe that some information/knowledge/training should only be available to people that require it to preform a specific state-sanctioned function.
This whole issue is about a guy that gets paid to train people exactly how to respond to life threatening physical violence with methods that are THE most likely to save your life.
If you feel the state is going to protect you, and that you are incapable of responsibly using such methods, or don't feel the need or desire to learn them, don't.
But that's not enough for some people. Some people feel strongly that nobody should have such skills/knowledge/training.
This issue is a good representation of how people let their little political and idealistic agendas cloud their rational judgement.
The only reason this person should be judged as if he's fostering some sort of magical knowledge too dangerous for people to have, would be if he's imparting it intentionally upon people who use it to break the law. Since there's zero evidence of him EVER doing this, the ideologues here, as usual, resort to outright lying about him, and name-calling. And they get modded-up for doing so.
And he's the one being called "anti-social" by posters here for this.
You people are why chemistry sets now suck. I don't need your political ideals of protection, I need to be protected FROM you and your ideals, and the society of hypocrisy, cowardice, intellectual dishonesty, and victim-hood that you've created.