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Feds Plan 'Fog of Disinformation' To Track Information Leaks

skipkent tips a story at Wired's Danger Room, according to which "Pentagon-funded researchers have come up with a new plan for busting leakers: Spot them by how they search, and then entice the secret-spillers with decoy documents that will give them away. Computer scientists call it it 'Fog Computing' — a play on today's cloud computing craze. And in a recent paper for Darpa, the Pentagon's premiere research arm, researchers say they've built 'a prototype for automatically generating and distributing believable misinformation and then tracking access and attempted misuse of it. We call this "disinformation technology."'"

263 comments

  1. aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Counterintelligence. Same game, new enemy. It worries me when the enemies start to become ourselves. It may be foreshadowing what's to come.

    1. Re:aka... by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      Counterintelligence. Same game, new enemy. It worries me when the enemies start to become ourselves. It may be foreshadowing what's to come.

      True, and I first thought this would have been more effective if they hadn't announced it. I guess given that they know there is a leak, the ones you don't want to know would know anyway.

    2. Re:aka... by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I figure it would send a message to the leakers. That is, be careful what you leak, we may just find you.

      --
      Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
    3. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Meh. Just be sure to grab someone elses copy and leak that. They;ll trace it back to the other person, not you.

    4. Re:aka... by demachina · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I'm curious how they are going to flood their own people with a "fog of disinformation" and not cause chaos. The information has to be believable but false, and once its out there how do they stop their own people from acting on it as though it is accurate?

      Maybe if they have someone who is already a suspect and target it only at them they can contain the self inflicted damage, but if they start to dessimate information on any scale the self inflicted damage they could outweigh the damage the leakers do.

      If someone is already a suspect I doubt they really need this tactic to nail them.

      Once it becomes a wide spread suspicion that there is intentional disinformation in the system, wouldn't everyone stop trusting all the information.

      Of course after the "missile gap, WMD's in Iraq and reading some of the stuff that came out of the State department and DOD through Wikileaks the quality of their information is already pretty shitty. Maybe this is just a way to thrown in the towel on intelligence and information gathering and admit its all garbage so they should just make it all up, because its cheaper.

      A possible ulterior motive is they actually want to flood leakers with disinformation, and in turn flood news channels with misinformation, so they can mislead and bombard the public with propaganda but have plausible deniability that thats what they are doing.

      --
      @de_machina
    5. Re:aka... by siddesu · · Score: 1

      AKA entrapment. It is "counterintelligence" when you do it to the bad guys, who live abroad and hate you for your freedomz, not to the good guys who point out the bad things your government does. BTW, "domestic counterintelligence" was one of KGB's most important departments. They did exactly the same thing -- go after the people at home who were dissatisfied with the politicians.

    6. Re:aka... by zill · · Score: 4, Funny

      and I first thought this would have been more effective if they hadn't announced it.

      This is actually all fake. They pretended there was a disinformation campaign when there wasn't so that the enemies would think there is a disinformation campaign going on.

      Of course if this were true there is no way such a secret will be revealed in a random /. comment.



      Unless, of course, said /. comment is also part of the disinformation campaign







      ...or maybe that's just what they want you to think.

    7. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe they should instead implement this by giving everyone documents that has unprintable characters embedded in it or missing spaces. Alter the bytes but not the words or the facts.

    8. Re:aka... by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      Of course if this were true there is no way such a secret will be revealed in a random /. comment.

      I'm pretty sure regardless of the quality of this article, there is still no way anything useful for purposes other than entertainment will be revealed in Slashdot comments.

    9. Re:aka... by 19thNervousBreakdown · · Score: 1

      That is a very, very good point.

      Although acquiring the information is going to be a crime in itself, it's generally not treason even to hack into a government computer. But releasing information can be much worse. So if they put this stuff up there, what about the person that exercises judgment? Even if I came by it through legitimate means, I'd never release information that didn't expose corruption of some sort, but I'd have to think long and hard about information that did. If it's bad enough, somebody who would have never released actual information may be enticed to release this fake information.

      Somehow though, I doubt anyone but the defendant will give a shit.

      --
      <xml><I><am><so><damn>Web 2.0</damn></so></am></I></xml>
    10. Re:aka... by Catbeller · · Score: 1

      "Same game, new enemy."

      WE THE PEOPLE are the enemy! They are fighting their own nation for the quiet right to lie to us. They are waging war against our ability to get the truth, and treating reporters and sources as terrorists. What few are left.

    11. Re:aka... by Forty+Two+Tenfold · · Score: 1

      No, it sends the message to the recipients of the leaks (e.g. /. readers) that the leak might be bogus, thus reducing the perceived reliablity of the leakers.

      --
      Upward mobility is a slippery slope - the higher you climb the more you show your ass.
    12. Re:aka... by detritus. · · Score: 1

      Who says it hasn't already been the status quo for a century? You honestly don't think they just came up with this idea... How else do you think they keep tabs on spies and double agents?

    13. Re:aka... by Catbeller · · Score: 1

      Bit redundant there... sorry, tired, hit reply too soon. Wish I could unpost. Good first post, tho. Well done.

    14. Re:aka... by detritus. · · Score: 1

      I'm curious how they are going to flood their own people with a "fog of disinformation" and not cause chaos. The information has to be believable but false, and once its out there how do they stop their own people from acting on it as though it is accurate?

      Exactly. People in the military or working on classified projects need to know all of the facts. Those facts have to be accurate. It won't change leakers, it will just mean they will have to proofread and verify the facts before they spill documents.

    15. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Remember, the goal is to trace large leaks to the source, no to make the public skeptical of anything as potentially false

      How much of the useless mundane is mixed up in the scandalous with these mass leaks?

      I think the goal is to do some sort of stenographic type fingerprinting using word choice or misspelling on quick-glance believable, , useless document that ends up included in a large Wiki-Leaks dump.

      Not a fake, "'evil master plan" smoking gun document, or even a document you would take action on. Something like a years-old status report on a quickly stale subject matter.

      This way you can track the leaker to the source, without causing internal operational trouble.

    16. Re:aka... by spazdor · · Score: 1

      True, and I first thought this would have been more effective if they hadn't announced it

      But announcing it in public allows them to cast doubt on the credibility of real leaks too.

      --
      DRM: Terminator crops for your mind!
    17. Re:aka... by budgenator · · Score: 1

      Unless of course it's just a clumsy attempt designed to be caught to distract the targets from the real honeypot.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    18. Re:aka... by demachina · · Score: 1

      Exactly how many major "Wiki-Leaks dump" events have there been in the U.S.. One?

      The overwhelming majority of damaging leaks are whistleblowers going to places like the NY Times to spill information on some secret program they think the public should know about, like Stuxnet/Flame, Abu Graib, NSA spying on Americans, government agencies wasting money on stupid classified projects etc.

      I don't see how this "fog of disinformation" program would even work in these numerous cases, the whistleblowers have an extensive knowledge of actual events, are describing it in detail to a reporter, aren't really dumping large quantities of verbatim documents like Manning did. or if they do pass on documents they would probably know if the jive with actual events.

      If you want to prevent dissemination of large quantities of secret diplomatic cables I think the first thing to try be would be to keep them on isolated classified networks, and keep them on computers that don't have writable/removable media, or USB. An iPad would be a pretty good choice in some respects :)

      As best I recall Manning used a DVD burner. Having a DVD burner on a computer full of secret documents is criminal negligence on the part of the IT people responsible. Why dont they put them in the brig instead of Manning.

      All things considered I think the "Fog of disinformation" "plan" is a self referential fog of disinformation itself. I see absolutely no value in actual implementing it that outweights the risks, and if you were going to implement it I see no value of leaking that you are planning to do it. Maybe they are trying to scare people who are leaking or thinking about it in to not leaking, out of fear of this program, although its unlikely to ever actually be implemented.

      --
      @de_machina
    19. Re:aka... by icebike · · Score: 3, Informative

      Meh. Just be sure to grab someone elses copy and leak that. They;ll trace it back to the other person, not you.

      Well then they would get the original leaker wouldn't they? That is the point.

      There is nothing new here, other than the apparent plan to plug leaks in government, (or should I say inconvenient government leaks).

      Copies of physical documents of sensitive information have often contained minor typos or subtle wording changes in critical and likely to be leaked passages. Churchill ordered this during WWII to see which of his subordinates was leaking.

      IBM applied for a patent on this process in the digital world back in 2009.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    20. Re:aka... by networkBoy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      We do that where I work. Certain documents are trade secret, and we want to make sure they don't become trade secrete(tions).
      if you get a copy of the document, it will have some very simple alterations (extra space here or there, couple more pixels per row in tables, etc.) This is along with the more normal markings that it was checked out to you etc.
      If the document leaks they can scan it in to the computer and it will calculate who the doc belonged to.
      Yes you can compare multiple copies, but this requires collaboration, which raises the bar.
      -nB

      --
      whois gawk date unzip strip find touch finger mount join nice man top fsck grep eject more yes exit umount sleep dump
    21. Re:aka... by __aaltlg1547 · · Score: 2

      No entrapment is when you actively encourage someone to commit a crime. Giving somebody opportunity is not the same thing. One of the purposes here is also to get foreign governments to doubt the veracity of whatever information their agents dig up. It's already suspect but if the foreign governments alsoknow the Pentagon is actively generating disinformation for them to "find" they'll be doubly doubtful.

    22. Re:aka... by rtb61 · · Score: 2

      It's already old tech, it's called creating a honey pot, nothing new here. When you create honey pots, you announce them, much the same as a mine field, it helps to keep away amateurs so that you can focus on professionals. This is of course similar to the reason professionals give away their hacking tools free, so that they can hide their attacks behind hundreds even thousands of amateurs.

      Taking into account the cost of computer equipment, any network where security is a real issue should be running a parallel and interleaved honey pot network, to draw in attacks, so that those attacks can be analysed and evidence produced for further prosecution. With a honey pot network, unlike a regular network, you know exactly what state it should be in and exactly what data should be entering or leaving, making any attack readily visible, the weak point in your network should always be a honey pot and they should be every where possible. An extension of the idea is that police, should be able to place honey pot networks in private enterprise, where an attack has occurred or where they suspect an attack will be likely to be a step ahead of attackers, especially foreign governments. There should be hundreds of thousands of honey pot network minefields scattered all over the place.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    23. Re:aka... by AmberBlackCat · · Score: 1

      I don't think leaking incorrect information is the primary goal. My guess is this would be a tool to make denial easier. That is, they want to say they're leaking misinformation so, when real information leaks, they can say it's all a lie and having it leaked was just an ingenious plan to provide you with security.

    24. Re:aka... by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      Who says it hasn't already been the status quo for a century? You honestly don't think they just came up with this idea... How else do you think they keep tabs on spies and double agents?

      Hopefully nobody thinks that. Particularly since there have been books, video games, and even wikipedia articles written long ago based on this concept. I'm not sure if anyone still prints paper encyclopedias anymore, but I bet if they do you could look it up there. It's called a Barium meal test .

    25. Re:aka... by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      True, and I first thought this would have been more effective if they hadn't announced it

      But announcing it in public allows them to cast doubt on the credibility of real leaks too.

      The more I think about this, the more I think you've hit the nail on the head.

    26. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Counterintelligence can be an effective tool in today's digital information age. Unless every government in the world is willing to publicize all of their decisions why should the US be called to open the their files to the world at large? And people really need to stop underestimating the US capabilities when it comes to defensive and offensive cyber actions. The government is probably one of the most dysfunctional organizations on the planet but that doesn't mean they have not built a very effective technology capabilities through DARPA, NSA, CIA, or the FBI. I know that every person in the US is considered an idiot today but nobody has ever explained how a bunch of idiots have manged to acquire the technology and economic power it has achieved. If the idiots in the US can do this what does that say about all the enlightened non-US internationals?

    27. Re:aka... by Surt · · Score: 1

      Of course if they are creating the situation by which the enemy would think there is a disinformation campaign going on, then there is one going on.

      --
      "Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
    28. Re:aka... by siddesu · · Score: 1

      Giving somebody opportunity is not the same thing

      Yeah? I fail to see the difference clearly. When you carefully create circumstances that would facilitate leakage, that's so close to entrapment in my book, that it is practically the same thing.

      to get foreign governments to doubt the veracity of whatever information their agents dig up

      You can lie to yourself about the real purpose as much as you like, but since TFA says it is expressly a measure to catch whistleblowers, I'll call it a measure to catch whistleblowers. Also, never forget that a framework for dissemination of disinformation works just as well against your own people as it does against the foreign enemy. I'll leave you to guess avoiding whose scrutiny is more relevant to your politicians.

    29. Re:aka... by lowieken · · Score: 2

      That's an old tactic used in political negotiations very often. It's very popular in scenarios where you don't trust al your negotiation partners. This makes it especially common in countries with coalition (multi-party) governments for example.

    30. Re:aka... by bryan1945 · · Score: 2

      How are they creating circumstances that facilitate leakage. Classified docs are not meant to be leaked. Saying that some docs may be altered so they can be tracked back to the source is not entrapment. You know if you leak something you could be tracked. This is the opposite of entrapment.
      If a cop says that the bartender just left $100 on the bar, and you go steal it, you're an idiot.

      --
      Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
    31. Re:aka... by flyneye · · Score: 1

      Foreshadowing what's to come?
      Disinformation on the part of the Repubmocrat government has been a staple for more than a century.
      Did the author just wake up? This is just more blather that means " business as usual'
      No informants will be hurt or caught in this operation, it seems you must be able to find your ass with both hands and a road map in a lit room as prerequisite to successfully performing any operation as complicated as wiping your butt. The federal government has no such skill.

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    32. Re:aka... by siddesu · · Score: 1

      Well, to start with a more obvious case, if a classified fake suggests serious government crimes have been committed, and a coverup is going on in a plausible manner, it creates an inducement to all moral people to leak it. Only sleazy cowards will keep quiet about things like war crimes or crimes against humanity, and even then they may be liable in front of the ICC anyway.

    33. Re:aka... by flyneye · · Score: 1

      It's a cheap way of denying any leaks as they could just be called bait.
      If it's corrupt, full of lies, control, stealing, murder, espionage, sabotage, it's probably a true leak about our government.
      If it's merely illegal, it's probably a planted leak.

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    34. Re:aka... by flyneye · · Score: 1

      I have a message to leakers everywhere!

      Be like dad and not like sis, lift the seat up, when you piss.

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    35. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, I have a friend/teacher who did this for a job in the Army about 12 years ago. It's not a new tactic, and is well-understood. For that matter, Samurai of ancient Japan were doing this 1200 years ago, just without the internet. Same thing, though; flood the "information market" (whatever that is for your time and location) with mis-information that seems true-enough, and wait to see how people react. Based on the reactions _outside_ the network, you know what path the information flowed along to the leak. It also creates deniability; "Oh is that what you heard? Well, we just told people that so we could gather evidence for an arrest of that guy."

      Police do it, too. It's somewhere between a dragnet "catch everyone that fits a profile" and a focussed undercover sting. Create an environment where the people you want to catch get attracted, and then catch them. We used to call it entrapment...

    36. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... inconceivable!

    37. Re:aka... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most Americans are idiots. But they are being led by non-idiots. And most of them don't even know it.

    38. Re:aka... by KingBenny · · Score: 1

      isnt it something like the first and biggest mistake of the fanatic? to become so obsessed with the enemy he becomes the enemy in the end. I wonder, does this count as a leak or is it just some disinformation so any leaked information gets scrutinized before it is released because it might be bogus?
      as if ... as if that doest already happen, no 'reporter' would just throw it out there unless it was for a tabloid and look where the english tabloid was last month.
      It's a win, win situation if it's true, only the smart and adaptable leakers will survive, if not, the information will be triple checked i.o. double.
      they forget they're up against the smart elite of the world there, not the ones with most degrees and certificates of accepted citizenship.
      the legion is many, it has twice as many eyes and twice as many arms to reach ... (barring a few people who had an unfortunate accident) it's all part of the same non-existing movement. It can not be stopped ... even the mayans predicted it :p

      --
      Free speech was meant to be free for all... how can anyone grow up in a nanny state ?
    39. Re:aka... by __aaltlg1547 · · Score: 1

      Giving somebody opportunity is not the same thing

      Yeah? I fail to see the difference clearly. When you carefully create circumstances that would facilitate leakage, that's so close to entrapment in my book, that it is practically the same thing.

      to get foreign governments to doubt the veracity of whatever information their agents dig up

      You can lie to yourself about the real purpose as much as you like, but since TFA says it is expressly a measure to catch whistleblowers, I'll call it a measure to catch whistleblowers. Also, never forget that a framework for dissemination of disinformation works just as well against your own people as it does against the foreign enemy. I'll leave you to guess avoiding whose scrutiny is more relevant to your politicians.

      The TFA calls them "leakers" which is a neutral term. You're using the term "whistleblowers" which is a loaded term. What I'm reading is between the lines, admittedly. They could create traceability of information by other means without generating intentionally misleading information. Using intentionally generated disinformation rather than just identifiable information implies that the distribution of false information is a desired effect.

      Note that this is an intentionally released document. The government wants you to know that it is flooding the channels with bullshit. Why would they want you to know that? They want to discourage leakers by making it clear to them that some of the information they have access to is intentionally traceable. I'm speculating that it is also because of the effect this is likely to have on the consumers of such information. The people who write these things and decide to distribute them are not idiots. They understand that what the public and foreign government perceives about what they are doing matters. They want it to be difficult not just to get secret information in the first place but also to distinguish between what's real and what's bullshit. .

    40. Re:aka... by bryan1945 · · Score: 1

      OK, I can roll with the leaking of stuff like that. I was thinking more in terms of leaking of classified stuff that was not evil but could hurt the country.

      --
      Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
    41. Re:aka... by ancienthart · · Score: 1

      I wonder how long it will take for the disinformation to be mistaken for real information by policy deciders. Mind you, probably won't make that much of a difference to most politicians anyway.

    42. Re:aka... by siddesu · · Score: 1

      Yeah. On a more serious note, the two bigger problems with this policy are the plausible deniability the government gains with it about just any kind of leaked document, as well as the subtle moral corruption that this kind of policy will institute among both potential leakers and journalists.

      Government officials will without doubt be glad to be able to claim that any released inconvenient document is a (partial) fake and explain it away.

      Both potential whistleblowers and journalists will now consider the possibility that they are being set up with a fake on purpose, and be less likely to question a questionable policy.

      I see these two effects bringing more harm than benefit, but we'll see.

  2. Eh? What is new? by Antony+T+Curtis · · Score: 1

    I though disinformation is SOP with Governments... Or maybe it is just a British govt trait.

    --
    No sig. Move along - nothing to see here.
    1. Re:Eh? What is new? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's new is that they can now point to any leak and say - "Oh that? It's just disinformation we planted"

    2. Re:Eh? What is new? by Tastecicles · · Score: 1

      the key word here is "believable" disinformation - where they can point to it and say "Oh, that? That's our information, and he had no authority to access it never mind distribute it". If it's a government document, then anyone found in possession of it may find themselves in the same boat as Assange, that being indicted for "aiding the enemy". That it is disinformation is a bonus; it does the Government no real harm since it refers to fictions, and as it's designed to be "believable" there's no way for anyone outside the information loop to be able to tell the difference between it and the real information.

      --
      Operation Guillotine is in effect.
    3. Re:Eh? What is new? by jd · · Score: 1

      What's new is that the US Government hasn't officially used disinformation against its own public before as that's "illegal", they've only unofficially done so.

      --
      It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
  3. Come to my office by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Management here is extremely skilled in spreading disinformation.

  4. Better yet. by AftanGustur · · Score: 2

    All they really need is to alter a few words in sentences depending on who is accessing the document.

    --
    echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln80~Psnlbx]16isb572CCB9AE9DB03273snlbxq' |dc
    1. Re:Better yet. by ackthpt · · Score: 1

      All they really need is to alter a few words in sentences depending on who is accessing the document.

      I wonder which thread this article came from and who is going to be nailed to the barn door for it.

      I seriously wonder at the sense of telling people you are going to do something - this just forewarns them, if you are going to leak, put the words together by your own interpretation. But if the whole concept of the potential leak is bollox then even scrambling a few words won't be enough to hide where the leak comes from.

      and according to my sources, NASA have developed a new balloon using nanotubes capable of entering Low Earth Orbit! Zowie!!!

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    2. Re:Better yet. by stephanruby · · Score: 3, Insightful

      All they really need is to alter a few words in sentences depending on who is accessing the document.

      What you're talking about is a simple form of watermarking. What they're talking about, since they're calling it "disinformation", is much more than that.

      Now only the 4-star generals will know which spy plane blueprints are real, and which diplomatic cables are true, so no information will be actionable until it first gets reviewed and validated by a 4-star general first.

    3. Re:Better yet. by capnchicken · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That sounds scalable. /sarcasm

      The big thing all these leaks really proves is that there are too many secrets and the US govt's clearance and need to know mechanisms are wholly broken. Some info really does need to be secret, but instead of vetting everything its just way easier to sweep it all under the its a secret rug and call it a day.

      Just another pentagon project to treat the symptoms and totally disregard the main cause.

      --
      A libertarian shat on my carpet once. Claimed the free market would sort it out. -Ford Prefect(8777)
    4. Re:Better yet. by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2

      All they really need is to alter a few words in sentences depending on who is accessing the document.

      Of course. This doesn't seem all that new of an idea. It sounds like it might be someone trying to make more out of this story than is really there.

      Seeding a document so it can be traced to who's leaking it is not a new idea at all. If you know someone is giving away secrets, and there's only three people working in your office, it's pretty obvious that the way to find the leaker is to give them three different stories (even slightly different) and see which version ends up getting out.

      There are significant concerns about the overuse and misuse of domestic surveillance. Lots of really good journalists following this story in places like the New Yorker, Atlantic and many other respected outlets. But there also seems to be a growing number of journo-bloggers who are coming up with stories like "Police are surreptitiously following suspects now!" trying to break what is essentially a pretty ho-hum story.

      It's another version of something that's been done forever, but is news because now it's being done on the Internet. Here, let me give an example from this story:

      And in a recent paper for Darpa, the Pentagon's premiere research arm, researchers say they've built 'a prototype for automatically generating and distributing believable misinformation

      Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes are laughing.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    5. Re:Better yet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I wonder which thread this article came from and who is going to be nailed to the barn door for it.

      Maybe they're not going to employ misinformation, and they only said that to make people think that...

      Just a moment...

    6. Re:Better yet. by 3dr · · Score: 1

      Actually, this story is the first volley in our unannounced plan to disseminate information through particular channels to identify leakers.

      I'm looking at you, Agent 597 in Omaha.

    7. Re:Better yet. by DarkOx · · Score: 1

      seriously wonder at the sense of telling people you are going to do something - this just forewarns them

      Perhaps its about actually stopping leaks rather than finding more folks to toss into the clink. The only reason to punish leakers in the first place is to send the message to other would be leakers that its not acceptable. If you can scare the would be leakers into not leaking things in the first place, that is a win. Documents don't get out and you don't have to do damage control.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
  5. Should rename to derpa by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because that doesn't sound like a plausible plan.

    1. Re:Should rename to derpa by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean other than the fact that this idea has been used for decades, if not longer?

      Yeah, not plausible.

    2. Re:Should rename to derpa by SlippyToad · · Score: 1

      As I recall, super-sensitive movie scripts are kept secret in this same way, by giving each party a slightly different version.

      Encyclopedias are also kept from wholesale copying by the inclusion of bogus entries.

      This is an old technique. Fuck, I've seen movie plots based on this idea, plots where GOVERNMENT INTELLIGENCE was directly part of the story.

      I am stunned that they AREN'T doing this. It is a VERY SIMPLE technique to figure out who is blabbing.

      --
      One day I feel I'm ahead of the wheel / the next it's rolling over me / I can get back on / I can get back on
    3. Re:Should rename to derpa by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      plots where GOVERNMENT INTELLIGENCE was directly part of the story

      Clearly those were works of fiction.

    4. Re:Should rename to derpa by An+ominous+Cow+art · · Score: 1

      Same with maps. I recall a former friend of mine buying a book that talked about the practice.

    5. Re:Should rename to derpa by CptNerd · · Score: 1

      I ran into that one time, almost literally. I was going to a party for a co-worker who happened to live on a small cul-de-sac off a small side road. I had never been there, and I had one of the big map books for Northern Virginia, so I found where the side road was supposed to be. Except when I got to the vicinity, the turn-off didn't exist to get to the side road.

      I wandered around for about half an hour, and finally gave up. This was in the days before GPS and before cell phones, so I couldn't even call for directions. Then I read later that the map company that printed the books was well-known for making "mistakes" like that for copyright purposes. Very irritating.

      I just wonder if any of the GPS companies are doctoring their data the same way...

      --
      By the taping of my glasses, something geeky this way passes
    6. Re:Should rename to derpa by GT66 · · Score: 2

      "I am stunned that they AREN'T doing this. It is a VERY SIMPLE technique to figure out who is blabbing." It is a simple technique. And when have you seen a government even successfully do that much? One movie script or an occasional encyclopedia set is one thing. Given the sheer volume of information generated by our increasingly paranoid and secretive government AND the need to share this information across many agencies, let me predict that total chaos will be arriving shortly. Whatever feeble productivity our government has been able to produce by sheer force of $$$ will now be completely negated as even the money will not be able to overcome the fact hat no one will know who knows what and what is true. What is most horrifying is that our elected clods are more than happy to wage wars fully knowing they are operating on false information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niger_uranium_forgeries We already have analysis paralysis and a government that passes laws that they haven't even read. Pelosi famously told us we need to pass the healthcare law just so we could figure out what's in it. *This* is without a mis-information campaign. Just imagine what's next.

    7. Re:Should rename to derpa by I(rispee_I(reme · · Score: 1

      Phone books also do this, since the list of phone numbers is not eligible for copyright.

      If another party publishes a list of numbers containing the mistakes, that proves they didn't compile their list independently.

    8. Re:Should rename to derpa by ai4px · · Score: 1

      Yes, a very simple technique, but in this case it is not to show who is leaking. In this case, it is used as noise to allow for plausible deniability when the real secrets are found out. They can say with a smile that the real info was contrived to ferret out a leak.

  6. Government Already Operates in a Fog by Gunfighter · · Score: 5, Insightful

    With the discombobulated nature of the believable information and misinformation, who will be tracking the differences to make sure an intelligence report doesn't result in a military course of action against a non-existent foe (or something similar)?

    Translation: What could possibly go wrong?

    --
    -- Stu

    /. ID under 2,000. I feel old now.
    1. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Iraq!

      Death by Discombobulation.

    2. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is a major mistake waiting to happen.
      Grab your seats, get your popcorn.

    3. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by Kaenneth · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Iraq?

    4. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by girlintraining · · Score: 4, Funny

      Translation: What could possibly go wrong?

      So... FOX News was the prototype for this?

      --
      #fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
    5. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by gtbritishskull · · Score: 1

      That was my first thought. If the person does not need the information, they should not have access to it. If they do need the information, you probably want to make sure it is accurate.

      Translation: What could possibly go wrong?

      Indeed.

    6. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by Savage-Rabbit · · Score: 1

      So... FOX News was the prototype for this?

      Prototype for what, generating a fog of disinformation? That was congress...

      --
      Only to idiots, are orders laws.
      -- Henning von Tresckow
    7. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Translation: What could possibly go wrong?

      So... FOX News was the prototype for this?

      CBS.

      "Fake but accurate" falsified documents.

    8. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by detritus. · · Score: 1

      Iran?

    9. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by miles+zarathustra · · Score: 1

      (LOL)

      Brazil? (the movie)

    10. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by rubycodez · · Score: 1

      Even our war on various "Taliban" groups in Afghanistan falls into that category, we are mostly not attacking those that attacked us on 9/11, they were long gone years ago and operating elsewhere. But on the plus side, our CIA gets to move drugs for the drug lords there, that's how they get funding when Congress overtly says no. Remember kids, we're fighting both sides of the War on Drugs

    11. Re:Government Already Operates in a Fog by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Translation: What could possibly go wrong?

      So... FOX News was the prototype for this?

      Originally, FOGS News but then someone said "Let's change it to FOX News, that projects way cooler image"

  7. disinformation all the time by harvey+the+nerd · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The bottom line is that you can't believe *anything* any government official says.

    1. Re:disinformation all the time by Tastecicles · · Score: 1

      Mod parent up. Harvey, you are more right than you know. Check EVERYTHING you are told by ANYONE with ties to the Government. I mean EVERYTHING. Call them on it if you find out they're lying to you, and do it PUBLICLY.

      --
      Operation Guillotine is in effect.
    2. Re:disinformation all the time by EvilSS · · Score: 1

      Check EVERYTHING you are told by ANYONE. I mean EVERYTHING. Call them on it if you find out they're lying to you, and do it PUBLICLY. There, fixed that for ya. Just because they don't have ties to the government doesn't mean they won't lie to you (or that they are not just idiots).

      --
      I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
    3. Re:disinformation all the time by dkleinsc · · Score: 2

      Just because they don't have ties to the government doesn't mean they won't lie to you (or that they are not just idiots).

      Why should I believe that?

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
    4. Re:disinformation all the time by miles+zarathustra · · Score: 1

      Close.

        "Believe nothing until it has been officially denied." [Claud Cockburn]

    5. Re:disinformation all the time by bryan1945 · · Score: 1

      I don't trust your distrust.

      --
      Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
    6. Re:disinformation all the time by Tastecicles · · Score: 1

      Public servants are doing the public a dissservice if they're lying to them, and rightly should be publicly called to account if they lie in the performance of their public duty. Someone else lies to you, you can deal with it, but if say a building safety official lies to you about the safety of the building you live in, then someone (perish the thought, you?) is injured or killed, who's to blame for that? I'll tell you who: the lazy bastard who lied to get out of putting a potentially dangerous situation right. If you survive the falling gable, you can then (nay, should) call out that building inspector on his laziness and let EVERYBODY know that he cannot or will not do his job properly!

      --
      Operation Guillotine is in effect.
    7. Re:disinformation all the time by turkeydance · · Score: 1

      Don't write anything you can phone. Don't phone anything you can talk. Don't talk anything you can whisper. Don't whisper anything you can smile. Don't smile anything you can nod. Don't nod anything you can wink. Earl Long Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/keywords/whisper.html#aDdBKTeRF7pytwOE.99

  8. An interesting study in modern ethics by TorrentFox · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Is it still right to punish those who in good faith believe there is a pressing need to leak certain information? Entrapment aside, this really will have the most damaging chilling effect yet known in the information age. First no whistleblower protection for gov. employees, and now an active campaign to make sure fucked people stay fucked. Proud to be an American!

    1. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is it still right to punish those who in good faith believe there is a pressing need to leak certain information?

      Of course it's not right. Neither is prosecuting 17-year-olds who take pictures of themselves, or torturing prisoners. When has that ever stopped them?

    2. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by lgw · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes, it is right - for those who sign a contract saying that they will go to jail if they reveal a given secret, it is right for them to go to jail if they then reveal that secret. It really is that simple.

      This isn't about "whistleblowers", who see non-secret but embarassing imformation about their employers and reveal that in a damaging way. This is about state secrets. And history shows: if your government can't keep any secrets, it will be replaced by one that can (often quite violently replaced). Just as you may regret the need for national defense, you'll end up with a government that has some, one way or another.

      We're a democracy. We have oversight of state secrets by our elected leaders, and good ones will legally "out" secrets they don't think should be secret (this happened quite recently, with a congressman reading into the congressional record a court-sealed document related to Fast and Furious). Yes, the system has flaws, all systems do, but it's certainly a workable one.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    3. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by sjames · · Score: 2

      It is about whistleblowers when every bit of information is marked classified just in case it might turn out to be embarrassing later.

    4. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by dark12222000 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Funny enough you mention that they are bound by Contract.

      You see, in all of these contracts (and usually verbatim in government contracts), the duty of the secret keeper is forfeit if the information contained is either illegal, or (in America) goes against "the will" of the people.

      In another words, if you bind me via contract to not disclose that you're going to nuke New York, and I tell someone, then I have *not* violated my contract (either the contract is invalid in the first place as it violates established law, or my duty to the law/my fellow citizens surpasses my contracted duty).

      In these cases, most of these people ARE whistleblowers. The information they release has been released because the whistleblower feels it either violates established law or that it goes against the will of the people.

    5. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by colinnwn · · Score: 4, Interesting

      And history shows: if your government can't keep any secrets, it will be replaced by one that can (often quite violently replaced).

      Does history show this? I'm generally curious. My guess is that most governments can't keep secrets well, and even the ones that are particularly bad and have also failed, have other more significant causes of the failure.

    6. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by GT66 · · Score: 1

      "Yes, it is right - for those who sign a contract saying that they will go to jail if they reveal a given secret, it is right for them to go to jail if they then reveal that secret." IANAL. However, it is my experience that while *anything* can be put in a contract, the legality of the contract has little bearing on the legality of what is "in" the contract. People assume that because a contract is a recognized legal agreement that then anything in that contract is then "legal." This is why things like this go to court. If information leaked is covered under a whistle blower or some other law then the fact that there is this this statement in the contract is tough titty. It ain't legal. The rest of the contract if found to contain valid legal clauses would then be upheld.

    7. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by vux984 · · Score: 2

      And history shows...

      History also shows that over reaching laws with a narrower "intent" tend to frequently get used used in over reaching ways when its convenient for those in power.

      This isn't about "whistleblowers",

      Then why not protect them? Where is the language that explicitly limits the scope to just what you think it is actually intended to be used for?

    8. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by lgw · · Score: 3, Insightful

      In another words, if you bind me via contract to not disclose that you're going to nuke New York, and I tell someone, then I have *not* violated my contract (either the contract is invalid in the first place as it violates established law, or my duty to the law/my fellow citizens surpasses my contracted duty).

      Your sense of the importance of the information you wish to leak does not give you the legal right to leak it - in a very practical sense, you rarely have the context to be certain of such things, unless you're very senior in which case you will some legal avenue to bring the information to the attention of the right people. Now, if you really feel your sense of duty is more important than the law, leak away, and go to jail morally righteous. If enough people in out democracy agree with your judgement, someone will pardon you.

      whistleblower feels it either violates established law or that it goes against the will of the people.

      I'm sorry, but what the whistleblower "feels" goes against the "will of the people" is so much bullshit. There are elected leaders whose actual job is to judge that, and who have legal oversight over secret programs, and who represent the will of the people as best humanity can figure out how to make that happen. Those congresscritters have legal ways to fix these problems.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    9. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by lgw · · Score: 1

      Leaking of Secret/classified information is separate from ordinary whistleblowers working for the government. It's a bright-line distinction: each document is Secret, or not.

      Are you worried aabout over-classification of documents? So am I, but the right system is to police that through oversight committies with appropriate clearance to review the information in the first place, who aren't in anyone's chain of comman except the voters. And we have those. Could that process be better? Sure - democracy in general could be better, if only humanity could figure out how. But that's a problem with how we choose leaders, not with the fact that some information is clasified.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    10. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 1

      If enough people in out democracy agree with your judgement, someone will pardon you.

      That's the same argument I made for torture and all the other forms of executive misconduct we've seen since 911. Too bad the commander in chief and his cronies weren't able to live up to the same moral standard that the little guys need to.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    11. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by vux984 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Leaking of Secret/classified information is separate from ordinary whistleblowers working for the government. It's a bright-line distinction: each document is Secret, or not.

      The bright-line distinction is not whether or not something is marked secret. Its whether some thing is right or wrong.

      I don't give a shit how many times they stamp the word Top Secret on something. If its not something we should be doing then it needs to be outed. The US doesn't need secret prisons. And the mis-treatment of prisoners in them is a crime not a "secret".

      So am I, but the right system is to police that through oversight committies with appropriate clearance to review the information in the first place, who aren't in anyone's chain of comman except the voters. And we have those.

      Sometimes we have them. And sometimes they work. But there is no reason not to have other checks in the system... like protecting a whistleblower who is reporting on the criminal activity of the state.

    12. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And history shows: if your government can't keep any secrets, it will be replaced by one that can (often quite violently replaced).

      Citation needed.

    13. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by misexistentialist · · Score: 1

      Hard to see how elected officials are representing the "will of the people" when the people have no idea what the hell they are up to. Keeping particular technologies, methods, or operations secret is one thing, but the government basically keeps everything secret, up to the most general policies. But someone who signs away their judgment and free speech by working for such a system is damned and has nothing to lose. Maybe the "wise leaders" should handle all the secrets themselves--at least that way they can't cause too much trouble.

    14. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Hatta · · Score: 1

      Leaking of Secret/classified information is separate from ordinary whistleblowers working for the government. It's a bright-line distinction: each document is Secret, or not.

      So just classify the evidence of your misdeeds and the law itself will protect you. It's almost as if you want our government to be corrupt.

      the right system is to police that through oversight committies with appropriate clearance to review the information in the first place

      And exactly why do we trust them?

      Allowing secrecy sounds useful, there are certainly cases where it would be useful to keep secrets, if we could trust men with that power. But the fact is we can't. Any suggestion otherwise is wishful thinking at best. Foreign enemies are distant, their threat usually exaggerated, and obscurity provides poor security. The threat from our own government is much closer and real. We stand to gain a lot more than we lose by abolishing government secrecy entirely.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    15. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by lgw · · Score: 1

      Hard to see how elected officials are representing the "will of the people" when the people have no idea what the hell they are up to.

      Well, those elected officials charged with oversight should have a very good idea what the people keeping secrets are up to. If that's not good enough for you, I suspect you have a problem with democracy as a concept more than with secrets.

      But someone who signs away their judgment and free speech by working for such a system is damned and has nothing to lose

      Maybe this is news to you, but there are many kinds of work where signing those things away is just part of the job, and needfully so. In the military, for example, unless you're pretty senior you're simply not going to know enough about what's really going on during a war to form a reasonable judgement about some secret document you read - you just won't have the context, and likely you won't have the experience. Yes, that has led to some tragic mistakes in history, but it's the only way to keep any secrets at all (without which a modern military is mostly useless).

      Maybe the "wise leaders" should handle all the secrets themselves--at least that way they can't cause too much trouble

      Maybe the path to complain about some secret that you think is damning is to talk to thos wise leaders, and not the general public? The military, and most government organizations, has a chain of command for this purpose, and a second channel outside the chain of command for those times when it's your boss that's dirty.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    16. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by lgw · · Score: 1

      Every single thing the government does is "not something we should be doing" in someone's opinion. If that's your standard we'd keep no secrets at all. Why does a "whistleblower" (of secret information) need to go public instead of going to those congresscritters cleared to know the secrets and charged with oversight? And there are other checks on the system: most government organizations have a channel to report actual illegal activity that bypasses the chain of command.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    17. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Amazingly enough, there exist actual mechanisms whereby you can disclose this information up your chain of command. If/when nothing happens, then you can "violate" the contract while still leaving your ass covered.

    18. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, we have prosecuted people for marking embarrassing but not secret information as secret. We've done a poor job of advertising that, since we're legally prohibited from spreading propaganda, and that press release was shot down as "propaganda" since it would have, understandably, a chilling affect.

    19. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You stupid FUCK.

      Why do you think so many people are being charged with war crimes?

      It's because they did exactly as you would wish, Not what they knew was right.

    20. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by vux984 · · Score: 1

      Every single thing the government does is "not something we should be doing" in someone's opinion. If that's your standard we'd keep no secrets at all.

      That's not my standard.

      A whistleblower is taking a lot of risk already... they've pretty much guaranteed they lose their job, and get blacklisted within the industry, may even fear for their lives... do you think they make that decision lightly? Do you really think every mundane little secret is going to get leaked out?

      Why does a "whistleblower" (of secret information) need to go public instead of going to those congresscritters cleared to know the secrets and charged with oversight?

      Actually most whistleblowers do exactly this, so what if it doesn't work?

    21. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by aintnostranger · · Score: 1

      mod parent up. Grandparent is arguing for the legality of anything written on a piece of paper, even if it is the mass deportation to extermination camps.

    22. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by aintnostranger · · Score: 1

      The judges at Nuremberg did not agree with you.

    23. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Thruen · · Score: 1

      I'm sorry, but what the whistleblower "feels" goes against the "will of the people" is so much bullshit. There are elected leaders whose actual job is to judge that, and who have legal oversight over secret programs, and who represent the will of the people as best humanity can figure out how to make that happen. Those congresscritters have legal ways to fix these problems.

      The fact that you think it's alright for the people who would be exposed to decide what information can be released shows you don't understand the purpose of whistleblowing and why we need to allow it. I understand the government needs to keep secrets, but as we've already seen, they keep too many, and the fact that they know they can keep these secrets has allowed them the freedom to make decisions that go against what the American people want. There's no longer any room for debate, after the recent leaks we know the US Goverment has been lying to us about things they shouldn't, things that would affect the decisions made by voters, things that affect peoples' opinions of our elected officials. The fact is if we could trust our government to do what's right without having to tell us about it, the leaks wouldn't have been an issue for the general public. Other countries' officials would still be upset, but if the government acted in the best interests of the people they represent, everyone wouldn't have been so angry when they found out. It's really very simple, power leads to corruption. More secrets means less oversight, less oversight means more power, more power means more corruption.

    24. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You honestly believe you can count on congress...for anything? Let alone for morality and ethical judgment???

      I wonder, where have you been living? Seriously. That's very worrying.

    25. Re:An interesting study in modern ethics by lgw · · Score: 1

      Actually most whistleblowers do exactly this, so what if it doesn't work?

      Well, depends on what channel you have, but if you can actually get the information to a committee charged with oversight, you've done your moral duty. If the duly eclected guys in charge of whatever are OK with the secret, that's the will of the people as best expressed in our system of government. It's also quite possible that they'll take some corrective action that you won't see, or that they have a context that you don't in which what you've found was not at all what you imagined, or was indeed bad, but the least bad choice available.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  9. Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Stop doing shit you don't want the People to know about.

    Cue the state-owned lapdogs prattling on about the dangers of military secrets becoming public knowledge, in spite of the fact that all the fallout from leaked documents thus far has been political, and in no way put any of our troops at risk.

    --
    An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    1. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by geekoid · · Score: 1, Insightful

      "and in no way put any of our troops at risk."

      false.
      Of course you seem to think there is no association of the troops from politics. When documents where released that showed the US's role in maintaining peace in the mid-east, it put several countries into a corner and forced their hand.; which led to an extending campaign in which soldiers died.

      Some documents should remain hidden.
      Should we publish the data on when we move missiles? which truck is the decoy?

      Does this mean all documents should be classified? no.
      Only that there are real needs for classification.
      What needs to be classified is a matter of policy and debate.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    2. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      When documents where released that showed the US's role in maintaining peace in the mid-east, it put several countries into a corner and forced their hand.; which led to an extending campaign in which soldiers died.

      [citation needed]

    3. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by The+Mister+Purple · · Score: 1

      What needs to be classified is a matter of policy and debate.

      Currently, that debate is being won by the "classify everything" side, since it makes it easy to counter FOIA requests and defense subpoenas.

      --
      "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." Feynman
    4. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by SirGarlon · · Score: 1

      Keeping something confidential does not imply wrongdoing. There are many scenarios where a perfectly legitimate government activity needs to be kept confidential.

      Private citizens also need privacy. Say for example I want to build a new addition onto my house and I solicit bids from three local building contractors. I may justifiably not want to tell each of those contractors who else is being considered for the job, to make it harder for them to conspire in a price-fixing scheme. Say for example my doctor finds a benign tumor during a physical exam. I might not want my boss to know for fear of employment discrimination.

      Now, apply an ounce of imagination and think about the complex plans a government might need to make, where premature public disclosure would screw things up. Take into consideration the fact that every time Alan Greenspan (former chairman of the Federal Reserve) opens his mouth, the financial markets (over)-react.

      Yes, a lot of misconduct gets swept under the rug especially in the name of "national security." But to presume that the state has no legitimate reason for secrecy in anything seems quite shallow.

      --
      [Sir Garlon] is the marvellest knight that is now living, for he destroyeth many good knights, for he goeth invisible.
    5. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 2

      "and in no way put any of our troops at risk."

      false. Of course you seem to think there is no association of the troops from politics. When documents where released that showed the US's role in maintaining peace in the mid-east, it put several countries into a corner and forced their hand.; which led to an extending campaign in which soldiers died.

      Bull.

      Shit.

      If not, produce some examples. Otherwise, STFU.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    6. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by GT66 · · Score: 1

      Except that the current modus operandi is to classify and secret-ize EVERYTHING which very much does imply wrong doing. No one denies that some things the state does should be kept secret. However, a government by the people for the people are on a very short leash WRT keeping secrets which as it should be. You can't have a public institution that cannot be checked by the public. See virtually every government that has attempted this to see how that story ends. What people are crying foul over is the government's penchant for stretching the definition of state secret until how many times the janitor changes out the toilet paper rolls in the Capitol restrooms becomes a matter of national security. It has gone too far. The government is RAPIDLY losing the trust as support of the people that HIRED them and AUTHORIZED them to the job of governing OUR nation. Trust me, no good can come from this path the government insists on following.

    7. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by bws111 · · Score: 1

      Except that most of the leaked stuff wasn't about anybody DOING anything. It was about people THINKING things. If, for example, a diplomat is asked what his opinion of someone he is negotiating with is, he better be able to privately and honestly say 'I don't really trust the guy - I think he is lying'. If everything every government employee or official thinks is going to be public information, that is going to lead to nothing except 'toeing the party line' or remaining quiet. And that is just bad for everyone.

    8. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      Keeping something confidential does not imply wrongdoing. There are many scenarios where a perfectly legitimate government activity needs to be kept confidential.

      Never said there weren't; I merely pointed out that up to now, nothing that has been leaked has proven to put our forces at a disadvantage, so the claims that information leaks are somehow dangerous to troops on the ground are nothing more than bullshit propaganda.

      Private citizens also need privacy. Say for example I want to build a new addition onto my house and I solicit bids from three local building contractors. I may justifiably not want to tell each of those contractors who else is being considered for the job, to make it harder for them to conspire in a price-fixing scheme. Say for example my doctor finds a benign tumor during a physical exam. I might not want my boss to know for fear of employment discrimination.

      You're ignoring a major difference in scenarios: You, as a private citizen, are not funded with tax dollars; you are not a representative of the American people as a whole; we have (or at least, had) very strong personal privacy laws in this country to protect private citizens. Also, since you're paying for the aforementioned services out of your own pocket, myself and the rest of Joe Public have no reason to care how you go about your business, so long as you're not violating our rights in the process.

      The military is wholly funded by taxpayer monies, is seen as a representative of the American people abroad, and is tasked with protecting and upholding our Constitution - excellent reasons why their actions and expenses belong under the public microscope.

      Now, apply an ounce of imagination and think about the complex plans a government might need to make, where premature public disclosure would screw things up.

      Yea, if they ever wanted to enact Martial Law, or commit genocide, or literally throw out the rest of the Constitution, I can understand how public knowledge of the plan would cause issues. Considering this is supposed to be an open, democratically-represented republic of the People, for the People, and by the People, I can think of no legitimate reason for the state to keep the People in the dark about... well, anything.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    9. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by HeckRuler · · Score: 2

      it put several countries into a corner and forced their hand.; which led to an extending campaign in which soldiers died.

      Wut?
      OR, taken another way, it put the USA in a corner and forced our hand. The one where we finally GTFO and RAMP DOWN these stupid campaigns. SAVING soldiers lives.

      See how easy that is to spin?

      But no, go ahead, give us some examples of what information was leaked, that caused either Iraq or Afghanistan to "force their hand", which somehow forced us to extend our military campaigns. Please, reason it out. Explain it to us. Because we're obviously not seeing how that could possibly be.

      Some documents should remain hidden.

      Absolutely, which is why Wikileaks takes so damn long scouring the material and releases it in batches

      Should we publish the data on when we move missiles? which truck is the decoy?

      After it's already happened? Sure, who gives a shit which truck is the decoy after the goods are safe. If they can analyze the frequency of our missile movements to predict where the next one will be, we ALREADY HAVE PROBLEMS.

    10. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by bws111 · · Score: 1

      It is just as stupid to make that comment about the government as it is for the government (or anyone else) to claim that anything you want to keep secret implies wrongdoing. Keeping stuff secret means that there is at least one person on the planet to you do not wish to have that information. And since you can't tell 300 million people something and not have that one person find out, you don't tell anybody. Perfectly normal practice followed by every individual, organization, company, and government that exists.

    11. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      Except that most of the leaked stuff wasn't about anybody DOING anything. It was about people THINKING things.

      Expressing a thought to another person, especially via official channels, is DOING something.

      If, for example, a diplomat is asked what his opinion of someone he is negotiating with is, he better be able to privately and honestly say 'I don't really trust the guy - I think he is lying'.

      Again, there's a difference between a private conversation, and OFFICIAL DIPLOMATIC CABLES. One doesn't leave the room; the other is a reflection upon our nation as a whole.


      Make all the excuses you want to try and justify your incorrect thinking, but the fact remains that sunshine really is the best disinfectant, and right now our government can use as much sunshine as we can force upon them.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    12. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      Cue the state-owned lapdogs prattling on about the dangers of military secrets becoming public knowledge, in spite of the fact that all the fallout from leaked documents thus far has been political, and in no way put any of our troops at risk.

      It's fascinating that you have to pre-flame those who might disagree with you... But you sound like the guy who, after jumping off a twenty story building, was asked how things were going as he passed the tenth floor - "pretty good so far!". Not to mention you have no way of knowing whether troops have been put at risk or not.
       
      And the fact remains, whether you like it or not, that when military secrets are leaked, the risks to the troops *do* increase - whether or not those risks translate into casualties in the short term.

    13. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by bws111 · · Score: 0

      'The People' you are referring to are specifically 'the people of the USA'. The other 96% of the world's population does not need or have a right to know anything about what the government of the US is thinking or doing.

    14. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Politics is messy. "The People" want their sausage but throw a fit when they find out what's in it.

    15. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by profplump · · Score: 1

      Temporarily, yes, there's sometimes a tactical justification for secrecy. But there's no reason to keep most of those secrets for more than a few days or weeks, let alone years or decades, which is the status quo for the vast majority of this information.

    16. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by bws111 · · Score: 1

      Diplomatic cables ARE private communication, dumbass. They are why the whole concept of 'diplomatic pouches' exists. They are NOT 'a reflection upon our nation as a whole' until some ACTION is taken. The only time they become a 'reflection upon our nation as a whole' is when some jackass leaks those private communications.

    17. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Keeping something confidential does not imply wrongdoing.

      Sure it does - you just have to take into account that everybody has their own version of what's wrong.

      No, sorry, of course there's only one way to look at things. America is not wrong but JUSTIFIED to spoil Iran's attempts to become a nuclear power - oh wait, to build nuclear power plants, primarily. Never mind that Iran would find this very wrong indeed, because, well, *chuckle*, their government is CRAZY, right? So it doesn't count. You don't have to take seriously what they consider wrong cause they are bonkers and unpredictable and whatever means to protect yourself are reasonable and never possibly could be wrong, right?

      Why conceal it if you don't think it would change what somebody else would do if they heard about it? If they were inclined to change what they do, then maybe because they dislike it? Which is to see it is wrong, for them?

      The point is to apply brutal openness and honesty, and then find common ground. But we're too human for that, so we do wrong things, which makes us horrible, which we can't stand, wo we find justifications, and then it's aaaall good again.

    18. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by GT66 · · Score: 1

      And again, the PROBLEM is keeping EVERYTHING a secret because you are too lazy and or stupid to sort out what is really worthy of being a secret. What it leads too, among other things, is people NOT taking secrecy very seriously.

    19. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      Diplomatic cables ARE private communication, dumbass.

      No, they aren't; they are official US government documents, which, according to the U.S. Constitution, very much are not private. As a matter of fact, by definition nothing the US government engages in can be considered 'private.'

      You may want to avoid throwing such epithets, considering your own quite obvious lack of understanding.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    20. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by cusco · · Score: 1

      maintaining peace in the mid-east

      The US's role on maintaining peace in the Middle East has thus far been to ensure that there **IS** none. I suppose it might have been possible to pick a worse example it probably wouldn't have been easy.

      --
      "Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
    21. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by DarkOx · · Score: 1

      Should we publish the data on when we move missiles? which truck is the decoy?

      The best way to handle keeping secrets like that is to NOT WRITE THEM DOWN. A higher ranked officer should tell the guy who is in direct command of the folks driving the trunks to use some number of decoys, do it sometime this week, and work out the specifics on your own, nobody outside your unit including me needs to to know the specifics.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    22. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're so fucking retarded.

    23. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by bws111 · · Score: 1

      Where, exactly, in the Constitution does it say anything about internal State Department documents being open? Where does it say anything must be open (published) except for Congressional proceedings, Congressional votes, and the budget? And even in the case of Congressional proceedings the exact text is:

      Each House shall keep a Journal of its Proceedings, and from time to time publish the same, excepting such Parts as may in their Judgment require Secrecy; and the Yeas and Nays of the Members of either House on any question shall, at the Desire of one fifth of those Present, be entered on the Journal.

    24. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by Lunzo · · Score: 2

      To prove the GP wrong, all the parent post had to do was provide one specific case where troops were put at risk due to leaked documents. Because the parent waffled in generalities, he doesn't have that one counter-example that would have proved his point.

    25. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      You're so fucking retarded.

      Oooh, scathing retort.

      Did you come up with that one yourself, or did you have to ask the rest of your third grade class for suggestions?

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    26. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      Where, exactly, in the Constitution does it say anything about internal State Department documents being open?

      The same place where it states that you have the right to film public servants in the course of their public duty. Or are you somehow confused into thinking American diplomats aren't public servants?

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    27. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by bws111 · · Score: 1

      So, in other words, it is not in there anywhere. You just made it up.

      The reason you are allowed to film (some) public servants in the course of their public duty is because they are, you know, IN PUBLIC, and there is no law that says you can't, not because of some supposed Constitutional protection. Try to intercept all of the internal email from some government department, or install a bug in their offices, and see what 'Constitutional protection' you have.

      Communications between ANY two parties are, by default, private. You don't magically lose your right to privacy just because you happen to work for the government. There may be perfectly valid reasons to break that privacy sometimes (either by consent of the parties, by law, or by due process), but the default is privacy.

    28. Re:Or, And This is Just a Thought... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      The reason you are allowed to film (some) public servants in the course of their public duty is because they are, you know, IN PUBLIC,

      Communications between ANY two parties are, by default, private.

      I assume you didn't realize that you contradicted yourself in those two statements... unless you're under the impression that the 'public duty' of police officers does not involve "Communications between ANY two parties?"

      You don't magically lose your right to privacy just because you happen to work for the government.

      When you're at work, you do. I know, because I used to be a government employee. What about you, what's your experience that makes you more an expert than someone who's actually been there?

      That's not to say that diplomates and politicos don't have the right to privacy during their off hours, in their own homes (cops, too), but when in the commission of their public office, doing their public duty, funded by public monies, privacy does not exist, and for good reason.

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
  10. Transparency by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You know, if the government was more transparent there wouldn't be the need for people to leak all the crap that's happening in the secret backroom deals. I'm looking at you TPP!

  11. How... by Dahamma · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...is anyone going to tell this disinformation apart from the disinformation that makes up the majority of mainstream news today, anyway?

    1. Re:How... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This won't be coming out of congress peoples mouths.

    2. Re:How... by kamapuaa · · Score: 1

      I've learned that the proper reaction to disinformation is to publicly accuse the poster of being a shill for Microsoft and/or the US government. Or, should you have mod points, mod the post "-1: Overrated."

      --
      Slashdot: providing anti-social weirdos a soapbox, since 1997.
    3. Re:How... by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Or lacking those two options just link to xkcd.

  12. As a taxpayer... by Lendrick · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Deliberately creating and circulating misniformation seems like an unethical use of my tax money, much like propaganda campaigns.

    1. Re:As a taxpayer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So undercover police officers, the vast majority of the CIA, and most combat countermeasures are a no go in your book?

    2. Re:As a taxpayer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Propaganda is distinct from disinformation campaigns for the purposes of intelligence gathering. Propaganda seeks to cultivate support for an agenda. Disinformation for use in smoking out a mole does not necessarily have a positive spin for the people in power. In fact, if the information is scandalous enough for someone to leak, it would most likely be quite the opposite of material intended to cultivate support for any politician's agenda.

    3. Re:As a taxpayer... by SecurityGuy · · Score: 1

      Not at all. Let's take an obvious and hopefully unambiguous example: The D-day invasion in WWII. Let's assume that invading was an unambiguously "right" thing to do. A lot of people need to know about it beforehand. Some of them may be Bad Guys (tm). How do you find out? Everybody gets slightly different documents, or slightly different information. When we find a copy of those documents in enemy hands that contain information only given to Lendrick, we know with relatively high confidence that's where the leak is. Either Lendrick is a Bad Guy (tm) or he's safeguarding the information poorly, or its a really lucky misinformation campaign by the real Bad Guys (tm).

      If I were in possession of that sort of information, I'd assume that some percentage of it, some percentage of the time, is deliberately wrong just to see if I'm mishandling it. Disclaimer: I don't have a clearance, so may not know what I'm talking about. If I did, I probably wouldn't be allowed to talk about it. :P

    4. Re:As a taxpayer... by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      So undercover police officers, the vast majority of the CIA, and most combat countermeasures are a no go in your book?

      Actually, now that you mention it...

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    5. Re:As a taxpayer... by Xarvh · · Score: 1

      Your tax money are being used also to deliberately shoot and bomb people, how is this more ethical?

  13. A standard, age-old counter-inteliigence technique by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You don't even have to generate misinformation. All you have to do is introduce plausible variation. Just make each copy slightly different and remember what those differences are.

  14. The *new* foggy logic. by gestalt_n_pepper · · Score: 2

    where some bright fellow in the government mistakes a real document for a false one, or vice versa, and makes a decision about some silly thing like national defense based on misinformation.

    But of course, that will never happen.

    --
    Please do not read this sig. Thank you.
    1. Re:The *new* foggy logic. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Na, they'd need to read the document for that, it is a rather well known and sad fact that politicians seldomly read things, not even papers they put their signature on.

    2. Re:The *new* foggy logic. by The+Mister+Purple · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't be worried about the politicians, who tend to be more of the "big picture" types. I would worry about the bureaucrats, who tend to be the "small detail" types... and aren't in the public eye as much.

      --
      "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." Feynman
    3. Re:The *new* foggy logic. by qzjul · · Score: 1

      We'll know things have gotten horribly out of hand when we initiate shock & awe vs Antarctica.

  15. Sorry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't want my tax dollars being wasted on this kind of stupidity.

    Defund this branch of government immediately.

  16. Confused. Possibly. by zenlessyank · · Score: 0

    It would seem that if the Pentagram err, sorry, the Pentagon, would want to implement such tactics that they probably wouldn't post it up on the internet, given that they, by nature, are a 'secret keeping' entity. It would also seem that this is a ploy to 'poison the well' concerning the existing leaked information that is already out there, that the Pentagram, err Pentagon can't get back.

  17. Honeypot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sounds very similar to the Honeypot idea. Not new but if they are using that as a model it could work.

    1. Re:Honeypot? by Hollywud · · Score: 1

      Indeed. Is that project still active?

    2. Re:Honeypot? by fotoflojoe · · Score: 1

      Also sounds similar to the Canary Trap.

  18. Posting as AC... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    sorry, but you'll understand posting as AC here. I just got this top-secret document that says the US Government is going to reform copyright; it and all related/neighboring rights are given the same term of protection as patents!

    Gotta go, someone knocking at my DC office door...

  19. Re:Sooo... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They're just going to make Fox News a requirement for all relevant offices?

    No no. BELIEVABLE disinformation is what they're going to be circulating.

  20. Well, by NEDHead · · Score: 1

    That should clear everything up!

  21. Tom Clancy calls this a "canary trap" by Thagg · · Score: 5, Informative

    It's a pretty common idea, really. Wikipedia entry.

    --
    I love Mondays. On a Monday, anything is possible.
    1. Re:Tom Clancy calls this a "canary trap" by Trepidity · · Score: 2

      Even the MPAA has done this for years, and they aren't known for being cutting-edge technologists.

    2. Re:Tom Clancy calls this a "canary trap" by mrbene · · Score: 1

      What's interesting is that in this case, it's not the single document that has multiple copies - it's that the set of documents that any one person has access to is unique, and padded with person-specific misinformation, and with embedded tracking pixels! So there are theoretically three ways of detecting a leak - by determining which set is out in the wild, by examining the specific misinformation (in the case of incomplete sets), and by seeing what pixels get activated from external IPs.

      The first detection is readily circumvented by leaking only a subset of the docs you have access to. The third is similarly trivial to block. And the middle one (person-specific misinformation) is back to being a canary trap.

    3. Re:Tom Clancy calls this a "canary trap" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Trouble is when people in the MPAA get these 'misinformation papers' and act on them:

      http://yro.slashdot.org/story/07/01/26/1840231/canada-responsible-for-50-of-movie-piracy
      http://news.slashdot.org/story/07/02/05/166216/canadian-movie-piracy-claims-mostly-fiction

    4. Re:Tom Clancy calls this a "canary trap" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      here is v.01 algorithm to beat the crap out of it:

      beat_the_crap_out_of_counterintelligence_aka_stupidity_and_counter_productive:
      {
                locase
                spell correct
                normalize syntax
                normalize whitespace
                remove non essential random parts of speech
                replace random words with foreign language equivalents including greek and latin roots
                remove footnotes
                add random references
                capitalize
      }

  22. Generic or incriminating documents? by Beardydog · · Score: 1

    Preposterously oversized Manning leak aside, most government leaks tend to focus on either some kind of specific wrongdoing that the leaker came across in the normal course of business, or portray the leaker or their clique in a positive light.This leads me to two questions:

    1. Can this do anything to stop those much more frequent leaks, in which people don't spend large chunks of their time executing identifiable search patterns, and simply grab a few files on the fly that catch their interest?

    2. Could this process involve the deliberate creation of false incriminating documents ("the CIA is injecting babies with anthrax!") for the sole purpose of catching good, honest people that think such things should be public knowledge? Along that line of thinking, what would you actually charge a government employee with? It isn't actually a classified document, and if it is, it obviously shouldn't be. Even if you think of it as an important investigatory in and of itself for finding leakers, it is a) designed to go public, and b) being deployed willy-nilly, against no one in particular, not against a specific target frim whom there is a known threat.

    It could also spawn a series of creepy trends in which a disturbing story about government wrongdoing is reported, a leaker is arrested, and the government gets to announce that it caught a naughty traitor, and by the way, we weren't really killing babies, it was just a trap to catch that naughty traitor.

    After enough of those, I can imagine it getting increasingly difficult for a leaker with material of genuine concern to the public to find a reputable outlet to disseminate it. I can also imagine the bulk of the public dismissing genuine stories that reach the news as "another one of those fake leaks."

    The whole thing sounds weird.

    1. Re:Generic or incriminating documents? by jfengel · · Score: 1

      It's actually aimed primarily at Manning-style leaks, where somebody just dumps everything they have access to onto a disk and sends it to be printed. The kind where people don't even read what they're taking, and don't have any actual connection to it.

      The paper describes a kind of glorified Mad Libs, to be thrown out whenever somebody tries to make a big copy of a data system. At the very least you'd need to scan the documents to separate out the ones that were fake before you publish them. If you miss one, the fingerprint would identify who took it.

      It still seems rather impractical, even for its limited goal. You'd need to insert it at the network level, and the system operators really would not enjoy maintaining that. IT is a hassle even for ordinary operations. Adding an extra layer of complication for obfuscation purposes makes IT's job even harder.

      The paper is full of other ideas, including using obfuscated source code to finger people who leak software. Doesn't that sound like fun to work with?

      This is DARPA. They're expected to do a bunch of useless stuff in hopes that something will actually turn out well. Some ideas, though...

    2. Re:Generic or incriminating documents? by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't be that hard with a distributed file system. One custom coded node that generates unique babble and logs access. Links to that node in all folders, make it look like someone is running an indexer or something else stupid. (Nothing like being noticed, classified then ignored: para S.S.Rat.)

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  23. I can see the false positives now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    [Cleveland]
    Secret Service Agent 1: Sir, we've finished sweeping the area. POTUS is clear to enter the convention center.

    [New York]
    Secret Service Agent 2: We're bringing him in now.

    [Washington D.C.]
    President: WTF? Where is everybody?

  24. Counterproductive by Blindman · · Score: 1

    If the information is need-to-know only, then giving the people that need-to-know false information will lead to wasted time. If a person doesn't need to know, then the person shouldn't have the information in the first place. The example in the article of burying useful information in a sea of noise still presumes that someone can exceed their access in the first place. Those things should be preventable in the first instance.

    --
    I don't practice what I preach because I'm not the kind of person that I'm preaching to.
    1. Re:Counterproductive by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      If the information is need-to-know only, then giving the people that need-to-know false information will lead to wasted time. If a person doesn't need to know, then the person shouldn't have the information in the first place. The example in the article of burying useful information in a sea of noise still presumes that someone can exceed their access in the first place. Those things should be preventable in the first instance.

      The problem is, someone in that "need to know" circle is believed to be leaking information. You can either get rid of everybody in the circle, do nothing, or find the rat. This is how they go about doing the latter.
      Doing nothing sounds like a REALLY bad idea to me, and getting rid of everyone sounds MORE counter productive than this. Further, getting rid of everyone in the circle probably means the people deciding what to do about the problem would be getting rid of themselves, too.

    2. Re:Counterproductive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Doing nothing is better than the risk that nobody in that circle is actually leaking the information and giving them bad information to work with. That's why previously they were watermarking the documents instead of including inaccurate information. There's always the risk that the leak is happening via some problem with distribution and not the people you're giving the information to.

  25. Wair, they re-invented FOX News? ^^ by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I feel confident, that this will hurt our enemies more than our allies.
    You know: The feds more than the citizens.
    Feds, as in: corporations.

  26. Fogging is a play on Clouds? by mevets · · Score: 1

    Who writes this shit? Is there some smart ass in the back room feeding the author bullshit every time he asks a stupid question?

  27. Yo Dawg! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I heard you like disinformation in your information, so I went ahead and disinformed your information and reformed your disinformation.

  28. Great, now... by Hatta · · Score: 3, Informative

    Put the same sort of effort into discovering and prosecuting those who classify documents to avoid embarassment, rather than ensure national security. This group is far larger, and far more dangerous than any group of whistleblowers.

    --
    Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    1. Re:Great, now... by The+Mister+Purple · · Score: 1

      I'm inclined to agree with you.

      --
      "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." Feynman
    2. Re:Great, now... by Hatta · · Score: 1

      Any decent human being would. The fact that politicians on neither side of the aisle don't do anything to hold people who abuse their authority accountable is proof that none of them are decent human beings.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
  29. Ombudsman is the answer by Nadaka · · Score: 1

    The answer to leaks like this is not to punish the leakers. But for there to be a branch of the government that is tasked with ferreting out the corruption and misuse of power that creates the ethical compulsion to expose malfeasance within the government. Bring the criminals being protected by secrecy to justice and you no longer have a compelling reason to publicly expose those secrets. Provide REAL transparency and accountability, not the bullshit tokens and false claims that got Obama into office.

  30. I can't wait... by Balial · · Score: 1

    ... until a misinformation document gets rolled up into a report to higher ups and the president and policy is set or action is taken based on it.

    ie. what could possibly go wrong?

  31. First Post! Yeah! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not really. It was a "disinformation comment."

  32. A new age of shoddy reporting. by GT66 · · Score: 1

    Boy, is Fox News going to look dumb making non-stop retractions.

    1. Re:A new age of shoddy reporting. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      1) Fox News lies all day long anyway, and never makes retractions.

      2) The idiots that watch and believe everything they hear on Fox News will never think it looks dumb, no matter what it does.

    2. Re:A new age of shoddy reporting. by GT66 · · Score: 1

      True enough.

  33. What citizen ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You don't trust the ministery of history ? You probably did not watch enough telescreen... Kinda seditious....

    1. Re:What citizen ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Jesus, that's some good satire.

  34. The Cuckoos Nest! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Its been done!

  35. Sure, if by "plan" you mean "have no plans" by Baloroth · · Score: 1

    This is a DARPA project. What that means is they are doing it to see if they can, and what problems will come about if they actually try it not because they actually plan on doing anything with it. Other DARPA projects include: flying tanks, thought-controlled robot arms, high energy lasers, hypersonic aircraft, passive radar, onion routing, and the precursor to the Internet. You'll note that only a few of those are actual, real, working, practical things (ironically, some of them are also the cause of the problem they are trying to solve now).

    This project seems like it has a multitude of uses: ways to identify and track the false information, automatic generation tools, and a whole bunch of random security tools that can genuinely be useful in protecting secure networks from intrusion (some of which look extremely useful for private network security, which is most likely where this technology will end up, judging by past DARPA projects)..

    --
    "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
  36. To fool your enemies... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    To fool your enemies, first you must fool yourself.

  37. Creating the illusion of missinformation by Igot1forya · · Score: 1

    This system creates a basis for a "deny everything" notion - which is ALREADY in use. Why create false information at all, just announce that you have a system to create false information and the masses will simply suspect everything is false information. To quote a song a friend of mine wrote, "Area 51 is a coverup for Area 52".

    --
    -------- -1 for SUCK IT!
  38. I cant see this working... by Lumpy · · Score: 1

    Unless you send the fake stuff to all t he senators, and diplomats. Someone can easily determine the fake stuff if they see that Z,Y, and X never get's sent to the president, or any diplomat, but A,B,and C does get sent and matches the news. Otherwise a nice export of all messages sent to diplomats over the past 2 years will contain both and therefore will not tell you anything.

    I guess it will catch the dumb opportunistic spy, but I cant see it catching anyone with a brain.

    How about simply getting AWAY from the stupidity of storing everything in pain text? all messages are encrypted and KEPT THAT WAY. a message from hillary to Bohner should not be stored in the clear or with a key that some lowly tech can access it's contents. How about upgrading the Government and Military IT away from commodity crap like Windows and to a custom system that is actually secure from threats inside and out?

    --
    Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
  39. This is by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

    This has more similarities to cloud computing than just the name. Both are something that has been done for many many years already. They both just got a new fancy name in an effort to get people excited about the same old same old.

  40. I am Moredoc by DontBlameCanada · · Score: 3, Funny

    The Enabler of Disinformation Services! You may know my brother, Mordac the Preventer of Information Services.

  41. Misinformation? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Now it'll be even harder to subpoena the Attorney General.

  42. This isn't new by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is as old as counterintelligence. Even the movie "The Falcon and the Snowman" shows this method being used. If you think they are planting bogus info then push your own bogus info.

  43. track this! by slashmydots · · Score: 2

    You know, that major military leak was tracked because the username submitting it was like first initial - last name - year he was born lol. But in case they're not so lucky with it being such an epic dumbass the next time, I think individual tracking in such a way would work. The problem is, how do you let decision makers know the data is fake without letting the data intermediary staff who might leak it know it's fake?

    By the way, I'm totally not a secret undercover federal agent but I heard that there's actually a life sized replica of the white house made out of gingerbread and frosting in Nebraska where the president will travel to in case of a terrorist attack so they can have shelter and a reliable food supply. But nobody leak that top secret information to anyone, okay?

    1. Re:track this! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dear slashmydots,

      Thank you for telling me about this great house in Nebraska!

      I will fetch my sister Gretel and we shall go there at once!

      Thank you,
      Hansel

  44. View All Link. Use it. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Please don't link to multi-page TFAs in your submission. Link to the one with all pages, or print view if available. These days, that seems to be the only way online articles are readable on otherwise overweight websites.

  45. More Government Control by davegravy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    What this amounts to is a way out for the government any time something embarrassing is leaked through the likes of Wikileaks (or similar). The government can simply announce that a piece of leaked information was part of their disinformation campaign... the population can rest safely knowing that the offending "leaker" is being brought to justice (i.e scape goat is sent off to Gitmo), and that the information leaked is not actually true.

    This campaign isn't to give the government power against the untrustworthy, it's to give the untrustworthy government more power over you.

    1. Re:More Government Control by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The brilliance of it is you don't have to actually create fake documents. Any time something gets leaked, claim it as fake and point back to this announcement. Claim the program is a huge success.

  46. Hence, the birth of SlashDot! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hence, the birth of SlashDot!

  47. The corbomite maneuver!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe this whole disinformation campaign is disinformation!! Maybe they are just bluffing that they have a superior misinformation capability that, if triggered, will destroy us all!!

    This sentence ends in exclamations too!!!

  48. Ummm... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Isn't this is a more expensive and complicated way of doing Traitor Tracing?

  49. An Apple Patent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I guess when Apple sues them for patent infringement they will realize how jacked up the USPTO has become.

  50. It might be even more sinister than that by F69631 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They might be sending message to the wider public: "Oh, you saw documents that state we are up to something really evil? Well... you can't know whether they're accurate or planted by us. If you were certain they were accurate, you might be willing to risk it all to do the right thing but now that you aren't certain... Do you feel lucky?"

    The point of censorship is never to prevent access to information by a few dedicated people. It is to allow the masses - who want to feel like good people - a way to shield themselves from everything evil the government does so they have a way to rationalize to themselves why they don't do what they know to be the right thing. This is exactly that.

    1. Re:It might be even more sinister than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was going to point this out and am glad to see someone already did. Now any leak or possibly scandalous information or proof of any accused wrong doings can be discredited legitimately or in the public's eyes by simply saying it was part of a traceable lie to fix intelligence leaks. And once the Fed uses that a few times, just wait til state and local government start their own "planned disinformation" programs.

    2. Re:It might be even more sinister than that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Somebody in the FED watches Star Trek. This is TNG Season 3 Episode 10 - The Defector.

    3. Re:It might be even more sinister than that by icebike · · Score: 0

      No you've got it all wrong.

      The point of this exercise is to provide unique documents to people authorized to have them and then see (by looking for the uniqueness) which ones were leaked. No one is proposing to dream up dozens of scenarios of gloom doom death and destruction just to be able to say it was all just a joke.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    4. Re:It might be even more sinister than that by ai4px · · Score: 1

      This is just genius... This allows them to pollute their real plans with lots of noise.... and when one of their real plans is discovered, they can say, "no that was noise". Great. Sorta the opposite of what Rush Limbaugh does... he says thousands of things, then goes back later and says he was right all along by cherry picking the instances when he was right.

    5. Re:It might be even more sinister than that by michaelwigle · · Score: 1
      Actually, FTA...

      researchers say they’ve built “a prototype for automatically generating and distributing believable misinformation

      That sounds like an automated version of dreaming up gloom doom death scenarios, but it's not to say it was a joke. For one, the person who leaked it would be identified. For two, if someone leaks real information there is nothing stopping the government from claiming it was "believable misinformation".

    6. Re:It might be even more sinister than that by jep305 · · Score: 1

      "Somebody in the FED watches Star Trek. This is TNG Season 3 Episode 10 - The Defector."

      Right. Because rather than "Star Trek" being a dramatic representation of or statement about how our world operates, our world is actually driven by "Star Trek" plots.

      --
      In Reason We Trust
  51. Plausible deniability by JustinKSU · · Score: 1

    This is great. If real embarrassing information is leaked, they can just claim it was part of this program...

  52. DEAR DARPA: ( Score: +10, Perfect ) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is it NOT a leak if the document is BOGUS.

    I hope this helps the defense attorneys for those charged.

    Yours In Latvia,
    Kilgore Trout, C.I.O.

  53. Three ravens I shall send. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The first promising Myrcella to Dorne, the second to the Vale, and the third was Tommen, perhaps to the Iron Isles.

    Worked fine, didn't it?

  54. Novel idea by belthize · · Score: 1

    And if somebody lets it leak that AF's water purifier is on the blink you'll know who to blame.

    About all I can see that's new about this is that somebody somehow managed to work 'cloud' into the description.

  55. A smarter way to go... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Would be to have already gotten this running a while back, after the first group of leaks necesitated it, then back-date all the documents to well before that happened, and admit that you have already been doing it for years. Then you can make it look like the legitimate leaked documents might well be fake. It's too obvious, really. If I were running this show, we'd have been doing that for a VERY long time.

  56. When decoy docs leak and embarrass them... by John+Hasler · · Score: 1

    ...how will they convince anyone that they were, in fact, decoys?

    What will they do when other agencies believe the decoy docs and act on them?

    --
    Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
  57. Governments Using Disinformation Is News? by detain · · Score: 1

    Isn't this a fundamental tactic used throughout movies, tv shows, etc... (so it must be real)

    --
    http://interserver.net/
  58. I've seen this before... by xpwlq · · Score: 1

    Pretty sure Neal Stephenson already predicted this in Anathem. Next will be people developing "unfogging" software, which leads to more fogging, and we have a new arms race!

  59. Age Old Tactic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Anyone recall the uproar about general Paton supposedly slapping the broken soldier in a field hospital? That was deliberate, misinformation. The General was not anywhere near that hospital when the event supposedly took place. The important part is it confused the Germans about where Paton was at the time. It was classified as secret until rather recently.
                    But in your life if you are ever in a law suit it can be interesting to feed false information to your enemy and wait for them to blunder like raving lunatics in court. For example one of your friends might mention your yacht where a friend of the enemy is within ear shot. In fact you have never owned a yacht. Or they might mention your graduate degree from the U. of Virginia when you never attended that school. By the time your enemy spews three or four false statements in front of a judge or jury the case is almost hopeless for them. Make certain that the falsehoods can easily be researched. For example any judge can get in touch with a university or look at yacht registration histories.

  60. An old idea: by Hartree · · Score: 1

    In fact, it's been used by a famous scifi author (one who had worked in intelligence for some time): Cordwainer Smith (real name Paul Linebarger).

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother_Hitton's_Littul_Kittons

    The odd spelling of Littul Kittons is used to trigger an alarm when the villian of the story looks it up in an electronic encyclopedia.

  61. Sometimes Whistle-Blowers May Be Needed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Surely even the most staunch pro-secrecy, anti-leaking person should consider that sometimes someone has to report bad stuff they find. Lets say John Smith finds a document that confirms that Obama and Romney worked together to perpetrate serial killings. If this is in the government databases as mis-information, someone may report this up the chain of command with a WTF?!?! Knowing it is misinformation the superiors will say don't worry about it. This puts the John in a tough spot. If people are doing terrible things and his superiors are unwilling to do something about it, at some point you can't go along anymore. To waste an otherwise good career on a farce would be just stupid. The government should want people with a strong moral compass (obviously bosses don't want THEIR people to have strong moral compasses, but they probably want other bosses to have subordinates with moral compasses).

    Whistle blowing is a last resort. Since everyone above knows that this is B.S., it forces the last resort, or for John to quit in disgust. Neither is to the benefit of the workings of government.

  62. "disinformation technology." = +1 layer of lies by Catbeller · · Score: 1

    "We call this "disinformation technology."

    We call it "lying". We seek leaks because our government is lying to us. We were lied to on a daily basis to get us into a war with a helpless Iraq, and now we are being lied into another war with Iran. We are lied to every single day.

    Our news companies now openly cheer on the liars, and slander the truthtellers. Wikileaks merely pipelined the truth to us about a generation earlier than we are used to getting it. We heard the truth now, rather than waiting until the ignored homeless vets of the lied-for wars are wasting away on the streets begging for help, and being ignored, as usual.

    Gentle Reader, if truth is not important to you, enlist in the Army and go die for the lies. At least don't cheer on the liars. They are not heroes. They are scum, usually scum who never served and whose children will never serve.

    Not to mention the hundreds of thousands, millions of civilians who also die in agony for our right to hear lies.

  63. This is going to be funny. by multicoregeneral · · Score: 1

    I'm curious to see how long it takes for the government to stumble over it's own misinformation.

    --
    This signature intentionally left blank.
  64. Re:Blame Saint Andreas by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Blame the laziness of Slashdot's astroturf brigade.

    If they had patented their methods for automatically generating and distributing believable misinformation and FUD, the feds wouldn't be able to use them now.

  65. Honey Trap by sanman2 · · Score: 2

    Personally, I was hoping that the govt might come up with a honey trap operation, to test which budding science nerds are most susceptible to seduction by hot women to betray their country. The idea is that hot women would constantly seduce nerds with hot sex in order to test their loyalty.

    Lacking a cleverly themed name like Cloud or Fog to designate this project, I would just call it Heaven.

    1. Re:Honey Trap by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      The idea is that hot women would constantly seduce nerds with hot sex in order to test their loyalty.

      Can I watch when the hot women seduce the hot female nerds with hot sex?

      Oh, hang on ... I'll not wait.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  66. Our tax dollars at work. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Our tax dollars at work.

  67. So who leaked this bright idea? by steelframe · · Score: 1

    Cat's out of the bag now.

  68. Fog? by laxr5rs · · Score: 1

    I thought we already had a fog of information.

  69. Falcon and the Snowman by Dolphinzilla · · Score: 1

    I was thinking the same thing - this movie was based on actual events and they caught the guys by floating fake data from some old satellite program

  70. Corrupt financial system, sneaky policies by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The U.S. government is very corrupt.

    Where there is secrecy, there is no democracy.

    1. Re:Corrupt financial system, sneaky policies by kilfarsnar · · Score: 1

      The U.S. government is very corrupt.

      Where there is secrecy, there is no democracy.

      Yeah, basically. What this story says is that the government plans on strategically lying to people. When your government lies to you and hides things from you, how can you say you have any voice in what it does? You can't even find out what it does, let alone change it! My sig gets truer by the day...

      --
      "What the American public doesn't know is what makes them the American public." -Ray Zalinsky (Tommy Boy)
  71. "New plan" my ass by Legion303 · · Score: 1

    This is a very old plan using new tech.

  72. Stop the wrongdoing... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Here's a novel idea... can't they just STOP DOING THINGS THEY SHOULDN'T BE DOING!

    It's a crime to wear a mask when committing an offense.
    All they are doing is covering up their wrongdoing. How is it any different?

    Throw these assholes in jail.

  73. WWII - Cold War revisited, propagando / dis-info by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is no surprise. The USA secret police is chumming the waters in hopes to find leads to those involved in espionage.

    No worries here. be aware --

    Raise defences to Defcon 5.

  74. Found it by Coffeesloth · · Score: 1

    I'd say we found the first leak.

  75. FOD is FUD by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    'Fog Of Disinformation' (FOD) is Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt (FUD) from the Federal Orafice.

    The real deal is that the Federal Agencies seem to think the citizens of the USA are their biggest threat.

    Seems like 3rd grade Physical Education Period (PEP) all over again.

    While in the school yard a bully approaches.

    Bully (Federal Government): Hay faggot, Give me your lunch money or I beat the shit out of you.

    Me (USA citizen): I turn and start walking away.

    Bully: runs up again. Hay faggot ... your money or I give you pain.

    Me: I kick he bully in his nuts and he doubles over. Then with his head low to the ground I kick him in the throat, causing him to cartwheel to the ground on his back. I then kick and stomp on his adomen. He then vomits blood and shits in his pants. I walk away.

    Then my friend Amy runs up: "That was awsome ... You are so brave." And she kisses me. We walk away together.

    Moral: The citizens of the USA need to kick the nuts of the Federal Government, and some stomping of the adomen to make the Federal Government leave us the Hell alone. :D

  76. Even less. by neoshroom · · Score: 1

    Even less then this, the disinformation plan takes the idea that nothing should ever be leaked. Imagine you somehow find yourself a bureaucrat in the Nazi regime with the ability to leak the fact that concentration camps are being established. Shouldn't you leak this information? Isn't there a point when ethical duties to society at large overweigh organizational duties?

    If you think not, tell me what is separating you from that Nazi.

    P.S. Goodwin's law is a disinformation campaign to prevent us from formulating valid Nazi analogies free from digression.

    --
    Big apple, new Yorik, undig it, something's unrotting in Edenmark.
  77. Very old approach by gweihir · · Score: 1

    Good to see the feds are catching up to the state-of-the-art a few decades late....

    --
    Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
  78. Pee or Piss or taking a leak call it what you will by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Here is the thing - let's say George W Bush had Yassir Arafat murdered - is it illegal to tell that secret considering that it would be an UNLAWFUL Order to keep said secret given that the person who ordered the information be kept secret is in fact the same person who broke the law - I mean it isn't like George W Bush had the guy murdered on let's say October 19th 2004 - before the US presidential election had a look alike in place for I don't know a month then the look a like "died" after the election - George W Bush he is the most honest american ever - oh wait am I taking a leak all over this board - is my IP able to be tracked back - I mean crap I am sure if there was some massive document out there swirling around about his crimes the US would try to prove that the real shit that happened wasn't real etc

    Of course then again by doing this I am sure that they are only calling out the leakers to themselves and not really verifying the person who is writing this did in fact have access to a massive amount of classified information and is having his benefits held hostage because he was in fact a professional hacker and is pissed so he devised a way in order for the information to get out even with the US knowing exactly who that person in Podunk WV is...

    Of course then again - last I heard that puny NSA couldn't even crack a simple quincunx lock let alone a double even with a few super computers :-P

    Ignore me I am just a "troll right?"

  79. Practical Advice for Preventing Information Leaks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There's a nice little article over at the 360 security blog about what you can do in practice to help prevent information leaks from your organisation. If the Feds were doing half of the stuff it suggests they might not have such a porous infrastructure in the 1st place...

    AG

  80. Cool :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Used to be referred to as a "Canary Trap"... Slick stuff!

  81. Second Purpose by sociocapitalist · · Score: 1

    This will also allow the government to disavow anything that is leaked as 'misinformation', regardless of whether it is true or not.

    --
    blindly antisocialist = antisocial
  82. Finally by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Took them long enough. Duh!

  83. This is a FEAR campaign, not reality. by fygment · · Score: 1

    If you can't tag and track REAL documents ... then can't you tag and track FAKE documents.

    If you have to 'learn' a users typing or searching habits, the user can control what is learned ergo the system can be deceived right from the start.

    So, this is really about putting fear in the hearts of potential, amateur 'evil' doers.

    --
    "Consensus" in science is _always_ a political construct.
  84. We already have this; by Lost+Penguin · · Score: 1

    Just watch FOX "News"....

    --
    I am the unwilling control for my Origin.
  85. Old, old technique by cellocgw · · Score: 1

    This sounds like the software equivalent of what Tom Clancy named the "Canary trap" in Cardinal of the Kremlin. Back in those prehistoric days, the idea was to distribute seemingly identical copies of (printed) documents, each with a couple different commas tossed in. Once you find an illegal copy somewhere, you look for the tracers and ID the leaker.

    --
    https://app.box.com/WitthoftResume Code: https://github.com/cellocgw
  86. Orwell by AtomicBison · · Score: 1

    Anyone else have a 1984-esque feeling about this? I just picture people sitting at cubicles 'modifying' info, history, news, etc. Eerie...

  87. I'm pretty sure... by supersat · · Score: 1
  88. How do they limit attempted legitimate use? by obscuro · · Score: 1

    Whatever these documents are there had better be a process for clearing them as legitimate or not. If someone sees one of these documents under circumstances that they believe are legitimate they could attempt to act on them. Imagine someone in a design situation reading the voltage off of something that looks legit but isn't; or someone thinking some name picked out of the sky is a terrorist and finding someone with that name?

    --
    Every rule has more than one consequence.
  89. hah! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    their problem is that fewer and fewer people of competence in this area will work for them. competence in dealing with large systems requires a personal integrity which is incompatible with lackeydumb. geeks rule!

  90. Brilliant own goal by hicksw · · Score: 1

    To work, disinformqtion (lies) will be circulated to potential leakers, that is, people that actually need to know the truth.

    They have just told their minions that they cannot believe what they are told. Worst suspicions have been confirmed -- your boss lies.
    --
    Don't be alarmed. This is all for safety and security. Just not yours.