Slashdot Mirror
App Developer: Android Designed For Piracy
Following news this week of a game developer who turned the Android version of a game free because of piracy concerns, software developer Matt Gemmell has written a lengthy post explaining why he thinks Android apps are laboring under a broken business model. "People have to get paid. There has to be a revenue stream. You can’t reliably have that revenue stream if the platform itself and the damaged philosophy behind it actively sabotages commerce. If you want a platform to be commercially viable for third-party software developers, you have to lock it down. Just like in real life, closing the door and locking it helps make sure that your money remains yours. Bad behaviour has to be more difficult than good behaviour - and good behaviour means paying for your software." He also has some harsh arguments about some of the assumptions and philosophies underpinning the an industry built on an open platform. "Nerds like to say that people care about choice at that level. Nerds are wrong. Nerds care about choice, and nerds are such a tiny minority of people that nobody else much cares what the hell they think. Android is designed with far too much nerd philosophy, and open is gravy to those people because it’s synonymous with customization. ... Open is broken as a money-making platform model, unless you’re making the OS or the handsets. Most of us aren't doing that."
Isn't this the same app that was "pay to win"(pay for the app, then pay another $6 to win, then pay more, and if you do anything that causes a loss in data on your phone, you get screwed out of everything) and people just said: "screw you and shove it up your pie hole." Pretty sure it was.
Om, nomnomnom...
Windows as a platform, at least until Vista/7/8, did nothing to enforce app piracy. That was left purely to the developer. App development was as open as could be - MS imposed no restrictions on distribution and left DRM and similar to the application developer.
Can the author of this editorial kindly explain why there are numerous profitable applications for Windows, during the XP era?
It is "nerds" who invented all the platforms this person is selling or not selling stuff on, and it is "nerds" who wrote the code he sells. The term "nerd" is offensive and derogatory. At this point, I don't even care what he is talking about because I'm so pissed about how he is saying is.
What if someone finds a way, *GULP*, to root iOS devices like they do with those Android phones!?! They'll be able to install pirated iOS apps!
The entire market will crash, human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... it'll be mass hysteria.
And then Matt can say he warned us all.
Mod me down, my New Earth Global Warmingist friends!
"Nerds like to say that people care about choice at that level. Nerds are wrong. Nerds care about choice, and nerds are such a tiny minority of people that nobody else much cares what the hell they think."
I think this guy just sold me my first Android phone. Also:
"If you want a platform to be commercially viable for third-party software developers, you have to lock it down."
Yeah, because no one ever could figure out a way to make money selling Windows software.
We know where leadership by an anti-intellectual "strongman" who scapegoats minorities and likes boisterous rallies goes
I don't see _why_ all work should be compensated, is the notion of someone developing software for fun --instead of say, watching TV-- really that far-fetched?
The moron (and you) is conflating open source and piracy... which is moronic.
The whole blog post is so.... morony.
Mod me down, my New Earth Global Warmingist friends!
Just like Windows was designed for piracy.
Sure, blame all your inabilities to adapt to different distribution models on your target platform. :rolls eyes:
"Ubuntu" - an African word meaning "Slackware is too hard for me."
He probably wants to eat food, yes. But there is no law guaranteeing that he can earn money for his food using a business model he just happened to dream up. Impossible to make money developing third-party software for Android? Well, maybe. But that only means one thing: Don't try. Just because music and movies seemed to do well for such a long time using a broken business model doesn't mean that everyone who has ideas is entitled to copy that broken model and get filthy stinking rich.
Then he can go get a fucking job. armchair game writing is like playing music at a local bar, you are a complete moron if you think you will make you living doing that.
anyone that writes an app and thinks the money will just come rolling in, then they are one of the stupidest people on the planet. ASSUME you will have 50% piracy, and pray it's not more than that. anyone that did any research at all into software publishing knows this.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Last summer I interviewed at a startup that was trying to hire 4 people to work on a collaborative mobile game. I got an offer but didn't take the job, but the lead architect said they were targeting iOS and not Android because of the piracy situation on Android. The money is on the iOS side. We can all guess about the reasons, but that's the simple reality.
People are casually forgetting that Google introduced the option to DRM your apps with Jelly Bean and beyond. This is a problem that has essentially been fixed, especially as manufacturers roll out the new version of Android (which is the real problem with Android: that might never happen in the case of many phones). It's a year out probably before lots of people are actually running Jelly Bean, but the process has begun.
Yeah, never heard that before. "It's not my fault, OMGTEHQQS clearly, you don't pay for it not because my idea isn't super awesome, and sucks, it's clearly because you're all pirates and steal my software for how awesome it is."
Right, is that what you're telling your investors?
Oh, and every fat nerd who doesn't take care of themselves isn't constantly thought of by every hot woman in the world simply because other people have pirated their hotness, or is just too orgasmic to think about.
It has nothing to do with their lack of ambition to be a good catch.
Your software does not have the power of Axe.
I'm needing chest waders after hearing his excuses.
Sure, being a mediocre at best title isn't an excuse for "stealing" it- but in the same vein, even with fairly SOLID DRM in Google's Store model, he couldn't cut it and blames piracy (I want to see PROOF before I buy his "piracy" excuse...).
This is just bullshit spin. Seriously
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
I just paid for a $10 app. Why? Because it actually does something useful: (http://www.backcountrynavigator.com) as opposed to your iCrap application. In additiona, the company actually remembers the "old fashioned" ways to sell things... you know, marketing, sales, and support. I was able to install the demo version and test out all of the features (it wasn't crippleware) to make sure it worked as advertised. The app is also top notch as far as Ux and does what it says it does. The marketing video and "how to use the app" are also top notch. The purchase button was right there, so before I could even go to the piratebay, I hit the purchase button.
You want people to pay for apps? Stop producing iCrap... or make your apps free, because that's about all they're worth.
What if someone finds a way, *GULP*, to root iOS devices like they do with those Android phones!?! They'll be able to install pirated iOS apps!
Rooting an iOS device requires some effort, some risk. Not much but it doesn't take much to deter people from going that route. In contrast on many Android devices rooting is unnecessary, just going into settings and allowing apps from "unknown sources".
Piracy exists on every platform that ever had any relevant level of market share...
Windows does nothing to hinder application piracy for instance.
Piracy popularises the platform, and what would you rather have, 10% of a million users, or 90% of a thousand users? Some will pay, some won't, and those who don't usually wouldn't have anyway, but on the other hand they are increasing your user base, viewing your ads and have now heard of your company and may well recommend your apps to their friends, some of whom may well buy them.
Windows succeeded largely because both it and the applications running on it could be pirated. If it was not possible to pirate windows, then a significant proportion of the world would be running something else, either linux or something else that they can pirate. Were that the case, MS would have significantly less influence over the market, their paying customers would be less locked in and a lot of those who buy software would be using alternatives too.
MS pretty much owe their existence to piracy... Bill Gates even admitted he would prefer users to run a pirated windows than a competitor.
So do Adobe, if everyone who pirated photoshop used something else then it would have a lot less mindshare.
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
Fuck you, control freak asshole. If you want to sell your products then you need to provide a compelling case to your customers. Otherwise, you need to accept that your shit will be pirated and you need to figure out if what you are selling covers your cost. And if you're feeling real insecure, figure out your own security system.
But don't go saying that I need to be treated like the enemy by my own property. My property is mine and will do as I say. You are welcome to have your software on my property, but it isn't going to bow to your demands and fulfill your wishes.
Mat Gemmell is an authoritarian asshole who hates that people are free to do with on their Android devices. I bet he hates PCs with a burning fury and would prefer I have no freedom whatsoever. I bet he's pissed that I can choose not to buy his software. Fuck him.
Oh Gosh, "Open" is broken as a money-making platform model!
This isn't an attack on Android, it's an attack on anything open-source, anything that gives the user the slightest bit of control or freedom. Yes, we are much better off in a completely locked down ecosystem where we can't even change the default browser, where you had best hope the owners of said ecosystem don't decide to compete with their own app that does a similar thing, or you'll get wiped off the one-and-only app store without a care or an explanation from them.
Yes, I'm blatantly talking about Apple here. However, I don't mean to sound like I'm ragging on iOS, or Apple in general, I'm merely pointing out that the opposite end of the spectrum has its own set of issues as well.
Android does have a piracy problem, but it stems mostly from a single tickbox that allows you to install apps that don't come from Google, the same tickbox that lets you install alternative app stores that don't necessarily have the same limitations or guidelines as the Play Store. If you take away that tickbox, I'm not sure the ecosystem will benefit more than it will be hampered.
Plenty of developers seem to be raking in the money on Android, they just use a different approach than they do on iOS. Instead of "Pay up front and be done with it", it's more "Get it free and supplement with in-app purchases" or "ad supported". Angry birds did the latter, Dead trigger (the one the "Piracy" reference was made about earlier this week) did the former. Their app is getting a lot of press, I will be interested to see just how well they do now.
+1 IDisagreeSoHeMustBeATrollOrAnAstroturferOrAShill
People jailbreak and pirate apps on the iPhone as well. It's not even hard from what the people I know who own an iPhone. I'd say the people buying Androids probably are going for it because it's cheaper, or that their are Options that are cheaper. People want Options when buying a phone because they want to see if their is something closer to their budget. We've seen lots of things showing how iPhone users and Apple Users are more willing to part with their cash. People who are Cheap or are less willing to part with their cash might be more willing to go with a Pirated version before they consider buying it, but that's just me making assumptions. I don't understand the fascination with getting apps on my phone. A few apps are needed to make it useful beyond a phone, but I prefer my PC for PC tasks and my Consoles for my Gaming tasks.
"ASSUME you will have 50% piracy" ...unless you write for iOS, then you don't have to make that assumption.
Thanks for proving his point.
However, just like with any other career, you don't get to decide the exact terms of the switch on your own.
So, the author has a theory, that sales on top of a fundamentally open platform have an inherent problem because the platform itself is "built for piracy".
Android may be open, but Ubuntu Linux is even more open, no? I mean, on Android you've got a bunch of closed-source components, particularly around payment processing and app purchase, right?
It's going to be very interesting to see how Steam fares on Ubuntu. How many developers are going to sell their games for Linux this way? Once things have been out for a while, how will the piracy rates on Linux, Windows, and MacOS (for the same application via the same delivery mechanism) compare to each other?
Also: I wonder what the author thinks of GoG. They seem to be making enough to stay in business, even though one of their selling points is "no DRM, at all, period, ever".
(Frankly, I think the bigger reason Android has more of a piracy problem than iOS has more to do with the number of budget phones on prepaid plans that run Android. Leaving all other issues aside, Android's considerably more likely to be in the hands of a cheapass than iOS is.)
Amazingly, the people who can use an Android phone won't pay for an app like that. No shit Sherlock. I mean, Whodathunkit? Non-idiots won't buy garbage.
When I imagine the developer who wrote this app, I think of the girl in the Vonage commercial:"Puppy!" :facepalm:
For him to be successful requires a large number of idiots; apparently, the Android crowd won't be that, and he's miffed.
The people "Pirating it" probably wanted to show their friends how stupid i(whatever) users are.
Before the "pirates" go back to playing Counterstrike...
I judge coworkers on ability by what apps they have on their phone; it makes it a lot easier. :) (My phone makes calls. Only. Yeah, you can still get those.)
Truth isn't Truth - Guliani
make apps good enough to pay for? I hear a lot about piracy on cell phones, I don't see a lot of evidence of it. I know a lot of people with android phones, I've never really seen any of them pirate an app, even those who regularly pirate software on their PC or whatever. Why? Because most apps aren't worth pirating. I have a handful of apps that I've paid for because they're valuable and unique enough for me to do so. Most I don't, because most apps are so simple, even if there is a good paid app available there is almost certainly a free app that is just as good. Sure I could pay for a nice alarm clock or twitter manager, but I could also download one of the hundreds that are available for free or are supported by ads. Adding a tirade about "nerds" just makes me think this guy maybe should have taken a few minutes to breath before writing this up. If you want me to take your opinion seriously, how about not insulting me throughout?
In addition to a lot of the arguments being made here against Mr. Gemmell's rationale, he's not even thinking creatively about the alternative ways a revenue stream could be generated. Case in point: I just played a Flash game yesterday that shows a video ad while loading. The ad unlocked additional features of the game for that playthrough.
But Mr. Gemmell doesn't consider developing new, innovative possibilities like this. He just wants the cash, and will happily use the "locking down" of other peoples' machines on a widespread basis to achieve this. Where's the "locking down" of the property rights that are supposed to come with buying something, like an Android? If it's my device, why wouldn't I have root? It would be apropos if Mr. Gemmell made enough money to buy a car, only to have it stolen within the first couple of weeks.
Mr. Gemmell makes it sound only right for companies and developers to "protect" their [currently-only-imagined] profits, but it comes at the expense of the property rights of the users. So he argues for further inroads on users' access to their own machines, while attempting to make it seem natural, fair and just.
The Wolfpack Project: BitCoin + Crowdfunding = Political Accountability
The thing that cheeses me off about the entire post is his dismissive about "nerds" as if they are the cause of all his "piracy" ills. First and foremost, market share IS a good indicator of what people want, and Android has that market share. Sure not any single phone manufacturer has Apple beat, but the PLATFORM of Android is eating iOS's lunch, relatively speaking, and continues to do so, in spite of the recent updates to the Apple handset line. I'm not knocking iOS as a platform... if people like it, people like it. But it seems to me that if this blogger was paying attention, he'd realize that people don't WANT a locked down DRM infested, closed and obnoxious to the paying customer platform. THAT is why they pick Android over iOS.
I'm sorry, but this guy's got a boner for iOS and thinks he can't do anything until Android is as locked down and "secure" as his preferred platform. That's not just delusional, but like we nerds say "WE don't CARE what you think."
It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.
Stupidity: the fifth, and strongest, of the known quantum forces.
The publisher themselves often included the security that the O/S did not - things like serial numbers, key generation, and call-home authentication.
I have not been using windows from a while, but I remember there used to be quite a while of keygens (key generator, for those who are born in the 2000's) and cracks (copy protection work-arounds for those born in the 2010's) for every successful windows software (and most crappy ones too). And they were, and still are, making many.
The reason is they are useful high-quality professional software, and in a professional environment you're ok to pay fat cash for good stuff. The problem with Android apps is that they pretend to stuff up a quickly hacked piece of crap, an put commercial in it and also want you to pay for it. This does not work. It would not work in iOS too, but you know, 30% of world population are idiots.
this post contain no useful information, no need to mod it down
It's true. Android isn't popular because it's "open", it's popular because after the iPhone launch handset manufacturers were clamouring for an OS to compete with it, and Google just happened to have Android under development and told everyone "Here, you can use this. It's free." The handset manufacturers clamped onto it because it meant they didn't have to go to the trouble of developing their own modern mobile OS.
If Microsoft, or even Palm, had had their shit together at the time, Android may have just been a niche OS today. But they didn't, so here we are.
Does it make you happy you're so strange?
What a jerk. He probably wants to eat food, buy a house, see a doctor, and raise a family. :-) Open source sharing is great with programmers, but with the rest of the world it's a one-way street.
The TFA is not arguing against open source, he's arguing against open platforms. He seems to have a problem with the fact that Android, for example, lets people sideload apps from outside the app store, which to him means that they can rip an app from one phone and install it on another without paying him.
In other words, he is basically complaining that Android gives users enough freedom that they can use it to engage in piracy. And advocates for iOS and other platforms which constrain all users on the grounds that they cannot possibly be allowed to do anything that might be used to undermine the ability of app developers (and the associated Apple cut) to make profit.
So, yes, he is a jerk. He thinks that his right to make money following a particular business model overrides my right to own a device where I retain full control. I sincerely wish him to go out of business.
To be brutally honest I haven't found an Android app I'd pirate. I have some simple free apps on it, but no paid ones, and no pirated ones either. I will probably buy a GPS app at some point to avoid a standalone GPS but I wouldn't be buying the app so much as subscribing to maps. After all, Google's free app is pretty good if you have a data plan, but I don't.
Perhaps that is the real problem. Whining about piracy is just cover for the suckiness of the available apps?
Democrat delenda est
I feel sorry for you.
Perhaps you should switch careers to something you enjoy doing.
I'm guessing most of the full time developers reading /. also do some programming for fun. Perhaps because they really want to have a certain type of application, or because they think they have an idea that'll make them rich. Maybe because they read about some algorithm and would like to have a go at it themselves or just because they enjoy the act of creating something new. Some even program for fun because they enjoy being part of a community. There are probably dozens of other reasons why people develop code in their spare time. But most of all; there joy of doing something is in itself reason enough to do it.
I feel sorry for you if you lost your passion for development and became a soulless office drone.
Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
It's not even an attack on open source, it's an attack on all open platforms - a far broader definition. For example, Windows is an open platform (since it permits you to run any app that you want on it, and otherwise gives you full control over the machine). So is OS X. You don't have to be a FLOSS fan to get irked at this guy.
He's dismissive of "nerds" because he sees himself as a minority he is not a part of, and a group that should be both dismissed and attacked. His stance is offensive and, frankly, we're all better off that he's just a developer posting on a blog and not a lobbyist or politician who could truly damage our rights and freedoms.
Instead, he's just an asshole with a blog.
I have been playing with computers (and writing programs) for well over 30 years. I have my own small business that has nothing to do with computers. Computers are my hobby; if I made it into my job then what would I do for fun?
Right now I'm reading and experimenting with OO programming (GTK, actually), something that I've never really looking into until just a couple of weeks ago, and it's a whole new world compared to the stuff that I've done before.
It's fascinating, it's fun and I like it. So yes, there are people who code for fun.
If you're a zombie and you know it, bite your friend!
If 50% of android apps are pirated, then there are a bunch of 'app collectors'. People who grab the app and never use it. I have yet to meet a single person that pirates android apps. I have no doubt that they are out there, but I haven't met a single one. It is actually the only media platform that I have seen 0 piracy. Every other one from Atari 2600 to TV to music to iOS I have seen piracy on.
It is theoretically possible that there is some grand conspiracy by the all of the other Android users to trick me personally into thinking it is rare, but that would take a huge leap of conspiracy theory faith.
What would take a much smaller leap of faith is to believe that there are fanboys, bloggers and astroturfers who have an agenda.
I make shitty little iOS apps that apple users spend heaps of money on but now people are taking my shitty games and using them for free!!
I don't want to earn a real living, I like it on this gravy train where I just look at the last popular game and pump out a barely different clone that gets marketed and makes me and my cheap-arse Indian software developers a living.
WAAAAA!!!! It's all Android's fault, if they had made a locked down phone in the first place that made sure these idiots kept spending money on my worthless me-too games I could be living the good life.
Unless Google fix this problem where people are getting lots of stuff for free I won't be able to make a fat living, and if I can't make a living, NOBODY can make a living, and even though Google are selling these phones like hotcakes and the users are getting what they want - trust me, it'll all dry up!
NOBODY WILL GET PAID!
He conflates the two. Whether it's deliberate or out of ignorance, I can't tell.
That's precisely his problem. He wants users to be trapped similarly to how they are on iOS, where nothing runs without Apple's approval. He wants the platform to serve his interests first and foremost, with the user constrained to a narrow envelope.
An understatement. But yes, basically all of this. Sadly, he'll probably dismiss all of the discussion on Slashdot with a "stupid neckbeards" like he does in his article.
Yeah it would be NICE to get paid doing something you love - unfortunately that's a nice thought because it's usually quite hard to do so.
Bzzt. I'm a sysadmin by trade, but code for fun. I wouldn't dare code for money because it would be boring coding other people's specifications all day long.
Maybe there's a middle ground. Apps loaded from the store are ridiculously DRMed but you can sideload too?
I wouldn't mind that. No need for "ridiculous DRM" even, just encrypt them with a device key embedded in the hardware. Then I can choose to buy them if I want to, or sideload if I don't (or mix and match as desired).
Coincidentally, this is precisely what Google did in Jelly Bean.
I put up a folding table in my yard to sell lemonade for $50 a glass. For some odd reason people are passing me by and purchasing my competitors product.
It's all the fault of the company that made the folding table They need to do more so that people like me can succeed.
I write programs for a living. I also do it for fun. It's not particularly far-fetched.
Back in 1986 or so, I noticed that I didn't really have a convenient way to keep track of telephone numbers. So I wrote a Desk Accessory for my Mac to do just that. At the time, my job didn't include programming so I wrote it in my spare time. When it seemed like it was working pretty well, I binhexed it up and put it on one of those shareware boards with the request that the users send me whatever they would like.
I got $5 from some guy in Australia. I sent it back with a newer version on a floppy disk and asked him for $5 of Australian money, since I'd never seen Australian money before. I still have that money sitting around in a box somewhere.
The reward isn't always about a paycheck. Sometimes it's just fun to do things.
I remember this same kind of thing happened back in the old days. There was this one operating system that later had a GUI laid on top of it called Windows. It seemed like everything was pirated including the OS itself. Anyway it completely hampered the industry. The incentive to write software was destroyed by piracy as more floppies were copied than paid for. The industry went into a downward spiral and nearly collapsed several times over the last few decades. The software industry hobbles along today and hardly anyone has even heard of Windows and nobody makes any money off of it.
BTW the same thing happened in the music and movie industries. Ever since the introduction of cassette tapes for both audio and video the industry has struggled to stay afloat. We see this mostly as budgets and revenues for music and movies continue to shrink.
Okay that was a little sarcastic but I think the doomsday view of piracy is a little overboard. Every industry has shrinkage when it comes to products. The is partially caused by damage to product, sometimes shelf-lives, but mostly theft. In some areas it can be more than 5%/month and physically removes the product from your possession in addition to the time to buy/use/display that product.
So where do we go from that. Well a store takes precautions to limit factors of shrinkage but only so far. They don't frisk customers down but they may tag everything and try to put sensors by the doors. This is marginally effective. Difficult to remove packaging also helps to reduce theft but annoys customers. Stores also take their shrinkage into consideration when calculating overhead. If 5% of your product evaporates you have to make up for it in your prices.
Now how can we apply this to software. Well some precautions can be taken but they generally aren't very effective. It only takes one person out of billions to figure it out and share it. So you have to weigh the costs of implementing copy restrictions which includes the man-hours to develop that code and the inconvenience to paying customers. The shrinkage rate needs to be taken into consideration. Software shrinkage would be unsustainable if you actually lost product every time but you don't. There is opportunity costs but no costs associated with replacing the product.
It's sort of a mix between shrinkage and market penetration. What software are you creating? What is the piracy rate for that type of software? If there's a possible market of 10,000,000 people and similar products suffer a 90% piracy rate then you better plan on having at most 1,000,000 people when planning costs. If it's not worth it, then it's not worth it. It'll be okay. Some companies will make money and some won't. Maybe think of it as advertising costing 90% of your revenue.
I guess we can call the new Microsoft shills Metro-sexuals.
Is he saying nobody developed software for Windows because it wasn't locked down?
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.