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Iran Running Out of Physical Currency, Satellite Broadcasts Dropped in Europe
iONiUM writes "In an interesting problem with physical currency, Iran is now running out of hard currency, due to a combination of inflation, and 'Koenig & Bauer AG of Würzburg, Germany, also says it has not responded to an Iranian request for bids to make the presses to print new rials.' Perhaps they should switch to BitCoin."
In addition to not printing money for them, the European currency presses won't sell Iran the equipment needed to print their currency domestically (not unexpected with the embargo). pigrabbitbear adds: "Eutelsat Communications, one of the largest satellite providers in Europe, has just nixed its contract with IRIB, the Iranian state broadcasting company. While IRIB's programming is still mostly up and running in Iran, the decision means that 19 IRIB TV and radio channels have now been axed from Europe and much of the Middle East."
Printing currency is a fundamental human right! Next thing you know, they be telling you and me that we can't print currency anymore either.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
If the hard cash is difficult to come by, then doesn't it raise the value of the printed notes thus nullifying the inflation and the need for more printed notes?
That is what happens when you take with one hand and flip everyone the bird with the other.
One of those Karma things.
while(1) attack(People.Sandy);
Well at least we can try out our economic theories on Iran about how to manage the money supply. If they are better off without increasing the money supply so as to not risk hyperinflation, we can then analyse what free market responses move to restore productivity.
If not, then why is this story on a site labeled News for Nerds.
This story doesn't belong here. This is just political trolling. Stop it editors.
I remember reading somewhere about Iran being sold/given currency printing presses in the past which were intended for printing Rials but were instead used to print counterfeit US dollars (which lead to upgrades to the security of US currencies)
Unless those machines were destroyed, why cant they use them? (its not like Iran has to worry too much about how hard their banknotes are to counterfeit)
In a society of such unquestionably uncorrupted morals and principals why is a non-repudiable currency even necessary?
"... always going forward 'cause we cant find reverse! "
Iran switch to BitCoin? Noooooo! We can't let them do THAT! According to experts*, if they did that, all their financial troubles would evaporate overnight through the magic of cryptographicalityness! LOOK AT HOW CRYPTOGRAPHIC IT IS!!! Then unicorns would come back and fart rainbows and candy all over the country and they would become as GODS to us mere mortals with our non-cryptographic currency that isn't even SHA-1 hashed! We can't let that happen!
*: Read: "fanatics".
It is pretty douchy that Israel didn't have to sign the NPT but gets weapons and reactors. These sanctions are just going to make Iran desperate. And for what? Because they might make a few nuclear weapons? North Korea hasn't nuked anyone and they talk all sorts of crazy shit.
Blar.
Someone isn't paying for that in BitCoin.
What political party do you join when you don't like Bible-thumpers *or* hippies?
It's my new virtual currency called BLIT-Coin. It only draws currency on a screen. No printers needed.
Silence is a state of mime.
So they'll have more time to hang around the mosque instead of sitting home, watching Baywatch reruns.
Have gnu, will travel.
why there are all these sanctions against Iran. OK: I know that the government does not always treat its citizens nicely, but there are plenty of other countries that act in much the same way and they are ignored; they have a nuclear programme, but so have many other countries and some of these other countries have admitted to producing or using bombs (eg USA); they have interfered in other countries and helped to support ''rebels'', but so have others (eg USA, UK).
So if they are not doing worse than other countries including us, then what is it all about ? I do note that they are sitting on plenty of oil, so are they the next Iraq ? Better ask Cheney I suppose!
I think its funny that "news for nerds" doesn't know that hard currency and physical currency are two different things to businessmen / economists and /. is getting them confused.
Hard currency is someone else's stable currency or gold. You want that when you're doing the hyperinflation thing like Iran's doing now and the US is attempting to do and Germany did about 90 years ago. Foreigners like satellite broadcasters want "real" aka hard money.
Physical currency is the paper bills. Once a stack of bills can't buy a roll of toilet paper, people start using money instead. Ditto firewood/kindling. Again a symptom of inflation. Most legal foreign trade doesn't involve paper currency so the satellite owner probably doesn't care about Iran's paper currency.
It takes pretty high tech to make cutting edge hard to counterfit paper money. Coinage is possible if you have gold. Paper checks, bank accounts, and credit cards don't care how many zeros are on them. Bitcoin would work but its hardly the only solution and requires a lot more electricity than a checkbook. Its not a huge deal.
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
I believe Europe and the US are playing with fire with these sanctions. Get a rat in a corner, you don't know what it is going to do. It wouldn't be the first time that a country has started a war to take pressure off a domestic situation. Is this what the US is hoping for, another war? I don't think they have the cash for it right now. This could end up a real mess.
It's all a conspiracy by the jews and crusaders! I keeeeel you!!!
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
All they need to do is get a bunch of color copiers, design new bills that won't be modified by the anti-counterfeiting technology, and BAM, new mint and all the paper currency you could ever want.
What could possibly go wrong?
Even senior politicians are feeling the pinch. The president is having to sell off his clothes.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Here is the correct link
[citation provided], although the article points out some recent doubts about the issue.
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
China will be more than happy to give them RMB's for their oil. Well played.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
Funny enough, Iran does have a couple of Intaglio presses... so printing more currency shouldn't be a problem. Oh wait, those presses are busy counterfeiting US $100 bills...
at least that is what Western intelligence agencies (not just the US) are saying. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state_terrorism BTW, although many governments have the bomb, the Iranian government is one that we DO NOT want to have nuclear weapons capability. They repeatedly call for the destruction of Israel (there's an annual parade to rally the masses against Israel) and considering their support for Hamas and Hezbollah they should be taken seriously.
People are constantly worrying about the nuclear reasearch program of a country that doesn't have the technology to print its own currency?
Printed currency is normally only a tiny tiny percentage of currency in any market.
Switching from 99% of all currency and transactions in virtual currency to 100% of all currency and transactions in virtual currency should not be that hard.
Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
How would you feel if the USA were banned from printing.
Iran are already being told they can't have their own printing press, now they're being told nobody will print money for them.
How is a country supposed to have money (which being physical objects WEAR OUT OVER TIME) if they can't renew the supply at least?
Iran Sanctions Now Causing Food Insecurity, Mass Suffering
It may be worth reading this, iranian are now facing severe food shortages and lack of medicine, this will physically weaken the population and have an actual death toll. Who are we to impose such misery, and why is the EU doing this? It's a shame, and possibily an act of war. The population won't overthrow the regime either, because they're being weakened and growing dependant on the regime for their survival. These sanctions are absurd, abject and only useful if the US/Israel intend to attack the country thereafter.
Actually, countries have defied the US without this happening, even with strong US sanctions, because the rest of the world thought the US position was stupid and didn't support it (e.g., Cuba). Iran's pissed off a lot more countries than just the US, and it wouldn't be having the problems it is if that wasn't the case.
This will just force them to make their own money which they probably should be doing anyway. They make much of their own electronics for ordinance. Stuff related to national security should be made in house. That goes for the US too!
Sorry, but gray text on gray background is making my eyes bleed.
About the time you hit the industrial era, you'll have the option to discover the printing press. And banking. Now unfortunately looking at your civilization's profile, you haven't even made it to the renaissance yet, so you still have a ways to go, but in a couple hundred turns, you'll be set!
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Who are we? "We" are in a cold war conflict with Iran. We are trying to keep this from escalating into a hot war by imposing sanctions to pressure Iran into complying into agreements they have made - nuclear non-proliferation. Their leaders have threatened attacks on Israel, the U.S. and others. They have been engaging in terrorist attacks across the middle east directly (Quds Force) and through proxies (Hezbollah). They have threatened Israel with annihilation. Israel thinks Iran will try to destroy it if it gets nuclear weapons to they think they must attack now in order to avoid a nuclear war later. "We" would prefer that they not do this but we understand their concerns so we've asked them to hold off and let the sanctions work.
Very often, people confuse simple with simplistic. The nuance is lost on most. - Clement Mok
. . . we can print Rials for them. . . then just flood their economy until hyperinflation sets in.
Can't print currency? They should go ask their friends, the North Koreans. I hear they're pretty good at it.
Ibid.
If they can't print money, I frankly don't know what they'll do. I believe this would be unprecidented.
Like getting your money printed by other "friendly nations".
Or harnessing the local talent.
And then there are options like minting coins for the lower, most easily spent (as in "worn out" as well as in "payed with") denominations, promoting debit cards, using cheques, and even rubber-stamping the existing banknotes with additional zeroes and official stamps to make "new" denominations.
But what is much more likely to happen is that the people will start using foreign currency instead of rials, like dollars or euros.
Rial will remain the "official" currency but you will only be able to buy some items in foreign currency, and the black market will bloom.
Particularly since alternative money transfer systems like hawala are pretty much currency independent.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Security printing is a narrow and specialized industry. There are few printers, and even fewer suppliers of printing presses. China probably has some capability for its own needs, but probably cannot quickly churn out some presses for a foreign order. In six months, no problem.
Consciousness is an illusion caused by an excess of self consciousness.
Back in the seventies Iran had the same intaglio presses used by the Bureau of Printing and Engraving to print US Currency. Back then they used it to print their own currency. After the revolution they are suspected to have used the presses to print counterfeit US currency. If they can build isotope separation centrifuges on an industrial scale they can manufacture whatever spare parts they need to keep those old presses in operation.
At some point they'll just buy the machines from China, Russia or some other country willing to sell to them.
blindly antisocialist = antisocial
Apparently North Korea has the technology to print large amounts of other countries' currency. Iran should ask them to print some up for them.
Those who don't listen to us will feel our wrath. Example Iran. This may seem off topic but I think it's relevant to the underpinning factors of this piece of foreign policy. I'm going to be pragmatic and honest rather than ideal here.
It's my opinion that land and its resources belongs those who conquer it. Who ever gave anyone ownership of oil and/or land? No one, you conquer it then you defend it. I don't care if your God gave/promised it to you, or that you have been there for centuries/millenia. History has shown this time and time with European colonization of Africa and Americas, the mongol conquest of central Asia, the Islamic conquest of Northern Africa and Europe, the Israeli settlement of Palestine. In this regard, Palestine, Saudi oil, etc. all are up for grabs if you ask me, if you wish to take up the conquest.
As an American, I have no problem supporting a questionable foreign policy as long as it serves OUR national interest. I don't have a problem with double-standards, forcing our will, nor do I care whether it is fair, just, and righteous. What does bother me is the masses eating up the propaganda fed to them by our gov't and media and regurgitating it as the noble path. What we are doing to Iran is immoral, unfair and an act of war. Save me the BS of "spreading democracy", "doing the right thing", or speaking of this "world's/international community's" which is only made up of a minority group of nations.
Patriotism/nationalism is irrational, ideological and dangerous and it's running wild in the USA more than ever. The whole society/political spectrum has shifted to the right, xenophobia, intolerance and attacks on secularism are on the rise. Combine this with our hostile approach and disregard to just about any country save a few, we are perpetuating our own decline.
This choke hold on Iran to me, is doing the bidding of our ally Israel based on fickle evidence that is at best propaganda. In addition, we are also doing the bidding of the Saudis and other satellite Saudi kingdoms . I see this as the USA outsourcing its might. I don't believe this serves our national interest. The damages of our hostile actions will hurt us economically, politically and make us less safe. We are walking a tight rope over stagflation should the oil prices rise not to mention of sending more Americans in harms way.
Coinage is possible if you have gold.
Other than some small percentage in bullion most countries use nickel, copper, iron and chrome.
Problem with coinage is the relatively high cost of minting per monetary unit, but as they tend to be virtually indestructible by wear and tear, that's mostly OK - unless you're trying to "chase down" inflation by minting new coins.
Plus, should you need to mint new ones with additional zeroes due to inflation - collecting and destroying all the old ones (which tend to remain legal tender) is expensive and complicated.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Can't they just get Bernanke on the horn to print up some tögrögs or pa'angas or whatever they use.
Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Turkey are part of "The West"?
As far as I can tell, unless you actually believe the biased and unreliable Russian sources, the weapons come from the above mentioned countries... That's hardly the United States and Europe, or "the West" as its collectively known.
The US claims that:
"The United States is not sending arms directly to the Syrian opposition. Instead, it is providing intelligence and other support for shipments of secondhand light weapons like rifles and grenades into Syria, mainly orchestrated from Saudi Arabia and Qatar. The reports indicate that the shipments organized from Qatar, in particular, are largely going to hard-line Islamists."
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/15/world/middleeast/jihadists-receiving-most-arms-sent-to-syrian-rebels.html
Seriously! Instead of printing increasingly worthless fiat currency, this should be a wonderful opportunity for Iran to switch back to the only real currency from times immemorial that doesn't lose value: gold. Currently, they're drinking from the poisoned cup of hyperinflation. If that cup is broken due to broken currency presses, they shouldn't pick up another one; they should stop drinking that poison. (Of course, they won't, as long as their government needs insane amounts of money and thinks that it can simply print more of it on an as-needed basis, like the ECB or the FED).
cpghost at Cordula's Web.
They have the freedom to speak, they don't get private companies' services for free.
Unless they can pay for the services in question they have no right to complain. They're free to broadcast within their means.
Act of war? Withdrawing from trade is not an act of war according to International Law, it may however become that.
To quote a learned source:
Sanctions seem to lend themselves well to international governance. They seem more substantial than mere diplomatic protests, yet they are politically less problematic ... They are often discussed as though they were a mild sort of punishment, not an act of aggression ...
The economic sanctions may violate Just War principles:
http://www.crosscurrents.org/gordon.htm
Does anybody else see something wrong here?
Yes. The priorities of the Iranian government.
Not sure how Koenig & Bauer and others refusing to sell the currency or equipment to Iran has fuck all to do with Iran getting equipment for other things like their nuke program. Seems like a non sequitur there, sport.
Maybe we need to have a national bankruptcy system. When a state folded you'd have a team of administrators sent in appointed by the IMF, World Bank, US Government etc. They'd privatise stuff, cut public spending, open up the economy to foreign capital and so on, i.e. apolitical and technocratic stuff to balance the budget.
Obviously rather in the way that pets need to be tranquillised by vets working to save their lives, a certain amount of coercion (sanctions, invasion etc) may be necessary to force states to accept procedure even though it was objectively in their best interests.
Once things stabilized they could organise elections for a new government. Though the administrators would need to appoint economic experts who would peer review the manifestos of parties running for political office to make sure that they weren't making fiscally irresponsible promises or threatening the property rights of foreign investors. In fact Iranians should be quite used to this measure - a committee of experts already vets candidates for office. The difference is that in my scheme they would be economists rather than Islamic clerics.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
I guess this puts to rest the myth of the Iranian source for those $100 superbills from the late '80s...
If they had the printing presses to make those superbills, they could probably print their own money now.
Maybe if they can just hold out till next year. That's when they will be able to start spending that plane load of new unreleased $100 bills they stole in Phily last week ;^)
Both the U.S. and Israeli intelligence services says Iran has no nuclear weapons program. Iran wants nuclear energy now for the same reason we started giving it to the Shah - they're an oil-producing country and nuclear power frees up more of that oil for export.
So what's this really about? Showing Iran who's boss, and to prevent them from ever thinking about actually trying to get an actual nuclear weapon. Not because they'd use it - it's been over 200 years since Iran attacked another country - but because the U.S. and Israel would no longer be free to attack them with impunity.
And for those hiding behind the NPT as if it's the shield of Captain America:
1. It was signed by the Shah, the puppet dictator installed by the U.S. and U.K
2. What part of the NPT allows it to be enforced with war
3. What part of the NPT allows other nations to bankrupt those they say are in violation
4. Bush insisted that Saddam had to go because of his WMD's....except he didn't have any. Now we're seeing the same crap with Iran.
5. If the NPT is your hangup, then naturally you'd support Iran's right to "the bomb" if they withdrew from the NPT.....right?
That's a lie.
Lie.
Lie.
All of Iran's "threats" have been retaliatory in nature. As in "if you attack us, we will strike back". Again, it's been 200 years since Iran attacked another nation, compared to dozens and dozens of first strikes and wars of choice for both Israel and the United States since WWII.
Neocon drivel. Iran knows perfectly well that Israel has hundreds of nuclear weapons and the full backing of the world's superpower, which spends more than the rest of the world combined on its military. It knows perfectly well that launching a war against the U.S. or any of it's client states would be suicide.
Pure projection. The U.S. drone campaign is a War of Terror, routinely striking targets filled with civilians (weddings), double taps (striking rescuers), and even "signature strikes" where we aren't even sure of who it is that we're bombing. Then the U.S. and Israel have gotten together to support MEK, an actual terrorist group that has attacked Iran. Then there's the multiple acts of war already committed against Iran by the U.S. and Israel, like the release of Stuxnet or murdering Iran's nuclear scientists.
What would be the American response if Iran started killing Los Alamos scientists with bombs? Rhetorical question.
Iran is a real paradox. It is fundamentally hostile to free thought and free expression, yet is utterly dependent on the fruits of free thought and free expression.
There was always that kid on the playground in grade school who nobody wanted to sell currency presses to cuz he was a dick to everyone. It's just funnier on a larger scale.
Is Iran really incapable of making printing presses of the required quality? They seem reasonably advanced in other technical areas, and presses don't require any secret sauce in the way of advanced materials or processes. Why don't they just copy what they've been using?
So it's an act of war to refuse to trade? That's a load of BS. How is it the US' or EU's fault that Iran can't be bothered to grow enough food to feed itself?
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
you're not happy when we don't trade with them and you're not happy when we sell them certain steel for certain cylinders! MAKE UP YOUR MIND WORLD!
anyhow, what's the use of trading with a country you can't visit and has batshit insane government? if you want to trade with them you can still trade with the black market people that have to bring porno to them on foot over the hills.
it's just that trading with the revolutionary guard is even more counterproductive than not trading with them.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
Paper problem with relation to currency is only marginal: when you have no cache you can simply write a check.
Not being able to print money can't stave off inflation if velocity of money is high (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_velocity) and vise versa -- increasing money supply when velocity is low will no produce high inflation (present day USA, where the Federal Reserve is "printing money", is one example).
So it is your position that we are somehow obligated to do business with people or organizations we find morally repugnant? Interesting position. So if Jerry Sandusky set up a sandwhich shop, and everyone in town refused to patronize it because they find his personal activites repugnant, they are somehow bad people for not helping him support his family?
If Iran wants to trade with other civilized nations, they can damn well start acting like one themselves. If not, it certianly isn't everybody else's fault.
Since the rights of non-Muslims and women are far worse in Saudi Arabia, and they don't even pretend to have a democracy, why aren't we punishing them?
Remember, the American word for "democracy" really means "does as we tell them." There is no exception to that rule.
Remember, it's fractional reserve banking, not exponential reserve banking (which doesn't converge, and so doesn't exist). Banks are required to carry currency reserves. So if you deposit $1.00, they are free to lend out say, $0.88, if the reserve requirement is 12%, which can be deposited into another bank, etc, which leaves each dollar on deposit able to support ~$4 in circulation, in the above example.
Has Obama and his handlers timed the squeeze right? If Iran collapsed the night before the elections, no telling what kind of vote boost he could get.
They outsourced the printing of their bills? To a non-allied country? And they are unable to print them locally? Are we talking about the same country? The Iran I know has a nuclear and a space program...
The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
It was probably made as a joke, but one bitcoin option may be viable : the Iranian government could start their own blockchain. That way, all the initial and easy coins would start on their accounts.
The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
There is the old salt about pounding weapons of war into plowshares. How about making coins out of them instead? ..
As a sovereign government they have the right to 'make money', but it doesn't say the outside world has to support their efforts. Or they could just use foreign moneys that they can buy from other governments. Greece would be glad for them to use theirs (if they would ship oil to Greece to cover the costs of the transaction plus a few extra million barrels per month, assuming Greece is off the Euro first...)
... "When you pry the source from my cold dead hands."
I understand the purpose and effectiveness of sanctions but some of it does seem messy, there are people living everyday lives who are having their lives seriously affected by the larger politics at play, is the average joe ever going to be able to live independently of the larger forces at play?