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China Telco Replaces Cisco Devices Over Security Concerns
hackingbear writes "China Unicom, the country's second largest telecom operator, has replaced Cisco Systems routers in one of the country's most important backbone networks, citing security reasons [due to bugs and vulnerability.) The move came after a congressional report branded Huawei Technologies Co. Ltd. and ZTE Corp. security threats in the United States, citing bugs and vulnerability (rather than actual evidence of spying.) Surprising to us, up to now, Cisco occupies a large market share in China. It accounts for over a 70 percent share of China Telecom's 163 backbone network and over an 80 percent share of China Unicom's 169 backbone network. Let's wait to see who's the winner in this trade war disguised as national security."
Why should the Chinese trust American equipment and vice versa. It's not like these are objects that get sent to another country never to be see again, they get put on networks, many available publicly.
It's not a trade war disguised as national security, it's national security disguised as a trade war. There's been no evidence presented of any backdoors. I'm quite certain that by now, many intelligence organizations have taken the chips apart and scanned them down and if they'd found anything there would have been a reaction. But there hasn't been -- it's just been hints, allegations, and rumor. It's disinformation, because there's no truth to go on, just more communist red-baiting. Not to say China doesn't have the resources, and doesn't have a long and inglorious history of electronic espionage... but so does France and nobody says a peep about them.
The United States isn't worried about China because it poses a military threat, or a "cyber" threat, or a terrorist threat... they're scared shitless because this country has clubbed and beaten its rivals over the head with economic policies and rules. China has us by the balls on rare earth metals, and most of our consumer electronics are made in Asia. If they decide to play economic hardball, we're going to lose. For a country that's grown complacent being able to pick up a phone and make every other country on the planet bend over and drop their pants to please the all-mighty american dollar... we're fucking terrified that there's a couple billion people about to industrialize and their economy is a jaugernaut. It won't be long before our military is the only thing remarkable about our country -- and it won't be sustainable without a solid economy to back it.
In 20 years, we're going to be facing the same situation the Soviet Union did: They died because they tried to maintain their military at the expense of their economy. This is a game we're going to lose, badly. That's why every trade sanction, disinformation campaign, and high profile story about places like FoxConn are desperately sought after by our military and economic leaders... if China manages to develop its economy much more, we're screwed.
#fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
And your priority with the oncoming East Coast weather holocaust is to make first posts on /. bemoaning submitters not making every story about weather or the Middle East?
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
One thing I like about CHina is that they are smart enough to realize that national security IS an issue. They are in a cold war with the west and know that if they can not control an area economically, then they should avoid that same issue.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Cisco is the Microsoft of the networking world - the household name that's failing to let go of the past and embrace the future. Their saving grace is that Juniper doesn't have a Steve Jobs figure. Nevertheless, anyone switching away from Cisco shouldn't be viewed as a political choice, but rather a rational choice.
It's pretty hard getting the right firmware installed by Chinese designers.
They feared that it could be used to suppress protest or support unpopular rule.
get your head screwed on, what's your problem?
1. yes hurricanes hit New York regularly. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_New_York_hurricanes
2. The U.S. economy grew 2% during last quarter, quit your whining.
3. What war in middle east? just some congerssional actions against insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan, and some civil riots in syria, etc.
"Surprising to us, up to now, Cisco occupies a large market share in China. It accounts for over a 70 percent share of China Telecom's 163 backbone network and over an 80 percent share of China Unicom's 169 backbone network."
Not at all... you think they built that snazzy internet firewall and surveillance system with home grown tech? Hell no! They've been buying the best equipment and services from U.S. companies for a long time:
http://wraltechwire.com/business/tech_wire/opinion/blogpost/1166609/
no, the really high end high traffic routers run proprietary algorithms. iptables won't scale to continental size, sorry.
Pretty sure that the Chinese know how to make just as good a router as Americans. Heck, they've copied from Americans in the beginning and they are fully capable of advancing the state-of-the-art by themselves now.
FTFY
Yeah, but then we will all have to start from zero.
How are your skills for a 1790 environment?
Lot of well educated folks right here will only be good for physical labor.
I'm pretty sure the fries I just got at McDonalds were about 3 fries short. Whether by weight or by count, I'm not sure, but if you extrapolate, it probably constitutes a massive fraud.
rewriting history since 2109
Art of War: "To increase Central Family power, take advantage of all situations to increase surveillance." "Any excuse will work, even trade war."
Lot of well educated folks right here will only be good for physical labor.
That's a good thing since there will be lots of need for physical labor.
Let's wait to see who's the winner in this trade war disguised as national security."
A trade with whom? Both companies' equipment is made in China. Cisco just sells their stuff.
As for paranoia, the US should be paranoid about Cisco stuff be made in China. It certainly gives me the willies. As does the fact that our medicine and vitamins are made over there as well. But that has had a good affect on me, I guess, as I am eating more local grown foods and staying away from processed foods. Except for Heath bars. Can't resist those.
You didn't FTFY. American companies willingly taught the Chinese how to build high-tech. They shipped thousands of manufacturing jobs to Asia so that they could save a buck or two. The Chinese did more than just copy; they learned.
I'm not saying there wasn't *any* corporate espionage (on both sides, BTW). But the effects on the American economy of spying pales in comparison to the effects wrought by the gutting of America's manufacturing abilities.
You didn't FTFY. American companies willingly taught the Chinese how to build high-tech. They shipped thousands of manufacturing jobs to Asia so that they could save a buck or two. The Chinese did more than just copy; they learned.
I'm not saying there wasn't *any* corporate espionage (on both sides, BTW). But the effects on the American economy of spying pales in comparison to the effects wrought by the gutting of America's manufacturing abilities.
Wish I had mod points, AC.
The storm will peter out, the global financial system will not collapse, and minor wars in the Middle East have been going on for literally thousands of years with nothing of value lost.
Nothing new or particularly interesting going on.
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Yeah, where's the fucking storm tracker I came here to see? I'm hoping that Sandy blows NYC off the map, causes some butterfly to fart in turn creating sister storms to destroy China, the middle east and Tulsa. I fucking hate Tulsa.
We can only hope that the global financial system collapses. Maybe then, it can be rebuilt into something that actually works.
Hope you enjoy starving/freezing to death. If you manage to hoard enough canned food and heating oil to survive, enjoy being beaten to death by thieves.
In the meantime, a drastically reduced worldwide population can enjoy its "new global financial system" - i.e. - a "king" or "lord" (the heartless guy with the most weapons) tells you what you are allowed to use for money, what you are allowed to buy, how much of it you can buy, etc. And of course, you can kiss industry and manufacturing goodbye since there will be no capital investment and no methods of distribution - so your shopping choices will be, shall we say, very limited. Talk to a North Korean refugee when you get a chance - they'll tell you how much fun the new "financial system" will be.
It is interesting how easily people forget.
Back in the 1950s and 1960s, Japan was the one copying, making knockouts and whatnot. But what happened is exactly what you described: they learned. And that is exactly what is happening to China right now.
morcego
And I have a problem with your stupidity, if you really think I was making a race related comment, instead of a historical one totally unrelated to race, relating only to technological copying, learning and innovation.
morcego
I would say that this type of article is exactly the type of content that Slashdot should be reporting... it involves one of the largest network infrastructure providers losing a significant part of what would probably be their largest market (if not now, then at least over the next decade)
And why should a tech news site care about the weather or problems borne out of greed and prejudice like the situation with the financial system or the unrest in the middle east?!
Just because China and Japan share some similarities does not mean they will keep increasing their similarity. The world is at a different stage now than when Japan was starting out. Power was manufacturing then but now it's information and knowledge. It was about making stuff back then but now it's about creating stuff. The modern environment may not take China where Japan went.
On one side, when China is sufficiently ahead technologically, China may decide not to be the factory of the world and dedicate millions of people and billions of yuan to research into curing cancer, solving clean energy problems and so on and generally making the lives better instead chasing consumerism. The Chinese authorities have to make things better for the population every year for everyone to be quiet and maybe everyone will have quality of life above the west European countries eventually because of this.
Or they may the big Japan producing gizmos for the world, slowly producing mega-corporations.
Or they may crash and burn.
There is a lot of murmur that capitalism has served well in the manufacturing phase of our human history but might not be best suited for post-manufacturing economies. Sitting around waiting for someone somewhere to make some breakthrough and creating industries out of it might not be the best way forward. Maybe national and global push towards solving the world's problems might be the way instead of hoping the invisible hand fixes it. Maybe a system like China where large central decisions are made and pseudo-capitalism creates efficiencies in those central pushes is the best way forward, or maybe the old communist ugliness will rear it's ugly head and create massive inefficiencies. I guess we have to wait and see where the world is headed and in that frame where China will be.
Being a little sensitive aren't we? I suppose you think the Chinese belong in a maruta factory or something?!
Clearly he was referring to the fact that only a few decades ago it was Japan, not China that was known for its cheap low quality electronics... in time China will advance and some other so called "third world" nation will take their place as the low cost / quality source.
Don't waste your time replying to him, he is nothing but a stupid troll.
And yes, that is exactly what I meant. Not only that, but I believe in a few decades (if not sooner) China will be known as the creative and technological country, where the good products come from.
As I said, Japanese products were considered crappy knockoffs, with extremely low quality. Then, after a couple decades, they were the producers of great products and technologies. "Made in Japan" started meaning high quality. Even today, there are already some very good products coming from China, created and developed there.
morcego
You make a very compelling argument. Thank you. It is nice seeing intelligent posts here. All to rare, unfortunately.
morcego
... and this is the way we do it when we are in France ...
We leave "specially prepared documents" in our hotel rooms every time we went out for dinner, or meeting, or whatever.
Those "specially prepared documents" do that look very genuine, with all kinds of juicy "insider secrets", but in fact, we fill them with half-truths, and spice it up with stuffs that we know would create havocs for those who try duplicating the result.
Why we do so?
Because, the French intelligent agency are in every single hotel in France.
Every single business delegation, every single group of scientists, every commercial entourage will be closely followed by the French secret police, and they will go into your room and scan all the papers they can possibly find.
It's an open secret to those of us who are veterans in the industrial espionage thing.
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Surprisingly well off - grew up on a simple farm, with crops, sheep, goats, and chickens. I have basic skills of craftsmenship. I have hand tools for planing wood, the annoying part is drying it (not hard, you can put tar on the ends of the board and then let it sit in a dry place for a year). I can make just about every type of food (and do so regularly because I have a passion for DIY food). I can brew my own beer (malting would be a challenge but not hard to figure out), wine, ciders, etc. I don't think it would be that bad, for me personally anyways.
Interestingly, Japan didn't continue on the trajectory toward world domination, and it turned out reasonably well for both them and the US. We'll see how China plays out. I'm sure there are a lot of other countries that would like to get a chance to follow suit.
My son is half Chinese.
Racism? I have been living in East Asia. The culture of the middle class and higher is much more focused on education, getting in to the right school, work for the right companies, and so on. This is simmilar in China, Singapore, Taiwan, South Korea, and Japan.
The cultures of those countries has a lot in common. It is not racist to say so. The Japanese and the Chinese DNA are more or less the same: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongoloid_race#Genetic_research
Just like every other country copies every other country. Look at any modern car and it will contain ideas invented by other companies and licensed, parts made by other companies and so forth.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
How are your skills for a 1790 environment?
Upgradeable, if you don't mind.
Ezekiel 23:20
And your priority with the oncoming East Coast weather holocaust is to make first posts on /.
Still better than some Facebook status updates. "Wow, I'm flying inside a hurricane!" And I see vividly the tweets as well: "#hurricane LOL WTF where's my roof?" :D
Ezekiel 23:20
There is a difference between a nation of 100 million and 1.3 billion you fuckwit
Have you missed all the posts detailing where Cisco is built?
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
Agreed, a very intelligent post right there. I think China will slowly rise because they were destined to be a world power. They were a very powerful country when Japan and Korea were still backward civilizations. Only thru their defeat in the 1860s and what they call the century of humiliation is what I believe kept China down. Now that their political system is stable again and managed to unify the country, they will only keep rising. Some of those cloners making electronics are becoming wiser and creating their own brands too.
So as you said, we'll have to wait and see.
Richard Stallman just keeps being right about these things. The source must be open. The hardware must be open. All governments and individuals must be able to inspect the platform because there is no way to actually "Trust" proprietary solutions.
Right now, Cisco routers run Unix at the core and distribution levels. Linux is mostly being used on the access layer (edge) of the network. It is time to add more enterprise features and hardware support to make Linux suitable at all levels. Open chip designs can be developed in each country. That is the only way to make sure that each country does not subvert the networks of the others.
This!!!
The Japanese and the Chinese DNA are more or less the same: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongoloid_race#Genetic_research
Of course it's more or less the same. Everybodies DNA is more or less the same.
Watch this Heartland Institute video