Slashdot Mirror
Apple Hides Samsung Apology So It Can't Be Seen Without Scrolling
An anonymous reader writes "Apple today posted its second Samsung apology to its UK website, complying with requests by the UK Court of Appeal to say its original apology was inaccurate and link to a new statement. As users on Hacker News and Reddit point out, however, Apple modified its website recently to ensure the message is never displayed without visitors having to scroll down to the bottom first."
The lawyers are probably going to get put in front of the bar for their shite advice to these pricks too.
Banned product, I reckon. And some few billion in compensatory damages to Samsung. It seems the only thing they won't weasel out like a spoilt four-year-old is being slammed down hard financially.
Obviously the courts care since they are the ones that mandated Apple provide this info on their site.
When you've been slapped down for contempt of court, your next action really shouldn't be this kind of open contempt. I wonder how Apple's UK employees feel about this disrespect to their courts?
Apple managers are apparently unaware that sneaky behavior is likely to get a big story on Slashdot.
I wonder exactly how much patience the judges have for this kind of nonsense.
upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
In English judgment is spelt without the extra e when it refers to a legal judgment given by a judge. I don't know why, it just is. Usually the two spellings can be used interchangeably, but if it is an English legal thing, it never has the extra e.
And before this you did not need to scroll. They are trying to manipulate the situation in a way the judges already warned them about.
When you cant win, ad hominem.
Sorry to burst your bubble there, but Samsung is by far the largest smartphone maker in the world and their profits seem to be quite close to Apple's. So no, they're not that far behind.
Kiteo, his eyes closed: AOL buying Time Warner.
The space is occupied by an ad for the iPad mini, with a resolution of 1024x768. Yeah, you're full of shit. You only have a retina resolution on an iPad if it's less than 8 months old, or else it would be 1024x768 as well, so don't go talking about 1920x1080 being obsolete since the year 2000 as if you're making any damned sense.
Apple.com doesn't scale the ipad mini ad like this, it just has a static size. Apple.com/uk does. That much seems suspicious as hell. Now, that said, Apple.com/ca for Canada also does, despite not having legalese.
Viewed from my 1920x1200 monitor, landscape orientation. I first got something with this resolution in 2006 IIRC, maybe 2007. Clearly I'm a damned luddite.
Actually last week I was able to see the footer on both websites without scrolling.
When you cant win, ad hominem.
hah.
Sokath, his eyes uncovered.
If you are in landscape mode, and enable scripting for "apple.com", then the bottom of the webpage will be just below the four images, every time.
UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
On my 2560x1600 monitor with the browser maximized i have to scroll to see the text. Yup, I would say it is definitely fishy.
Not only that, it appears that they've turned off the normal redirect from apple.com to the UK website and aren't displaying it on the main apple.com website for UK visitors, so it's not actually visible even with scrolling to most of the people it's meant to reach. They're literally begging to be found in contempt.
Probably very little, given how quickly they reacted to Apple ignoring the spirit of the law last week. Frankly, I'm stunned that Apple seriously expected that any kind of special treatment of the message posting wasn't doing to get picked up given the level of tech press interest in the UK - the story has even been on the front page of the BBC news site. I'm guessing we'll have wait a few days to find out whether they are going to get another chance to do the right thing by the spirit of the law, or we're just going to go straight to contempt of court and see some more serious punitive action - like having to put the message in place of that nice picture of the iPad Mini.
UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
Prosser: But the statement was on display.
Arthur Dent: On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar.
Prosser: That's the display department.
apple.com/uk vs apple.com on a 1600-px high screen. I had to hit F11 *after* loading apple.com/uk to include the notice in the screen capture.
Pretty sleazy.
This post contains no rudeness or derision of any kind. All arguments are friendly. Terms and exclusions may apply.
If you're going to make a claim like that, you might want to spare thirty seconds to check out the actual web sites.
US Site: No picture scaling
UK Site: Picture scales to hide the bottom of the page. I had to turn my monitor on its side, making it 1920 pixels tall, in order to get the notice to appear.
I really don't understand how some people think they can get away with such obvious lies on the internet. Do they really think that not a single person will bother to check?
Hey, even on my 145inch 8K monitor I have to scroll down... Oh wait, let me turn the magnification down a bit... Ah yes, there we go... Damn! Now where did I put my reading glasses?
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
... you do understand that "Market Value" has nothing to do with "largest company", right?
Apple isn't even top 20 in terms of actual value
Apple's profits: $33 Billion Rank: #2
Apple's assets: $138 Billion Rank: #187.
Apple's sales: $127 Billion Rank: #26
Their stock is over-priced and it will return to earth eventually. They probably cannot maintain their profit margin over the next 3-5 years and as soon as the sharks see them miss a few growth estimates, it will be bye bye Apple market value.
I wonder if a creative judge wouldn't have an original redress, like:
On apple.com, and all your international sites, in the languages you already display, you must display the apology in a click-thru manner, such as NO customer to any apple property is unaware that
Dear customers, we've been found before British court to have falsely accused samsung of theft. Moreover we've been found also by the british court, in contempt of court for not informing our british customers of such.
Please click here to continue to your normal apple site.
They obviously value publicity far more than money, and should be hit appropriately.
Well, if 48 hours was an unreasonable amount of time to make this change, perhaps Apple should have complied with the original order which gave them 14 days. Instead of, you know, being giant cocks about it.
In case you missed this:
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/6237043/applesucks.png
What now?
Required reading for internet skeptics
you have to adjust the code and actually test it, which can't be done in a few days
Huh what? It takes more than a few days to test a change like adding some text to the bottom of a web page? Granted that there are multiple browsers and configurations to test, but even manually that's not more than a few hours' work... and if Apple's web site is managed by competent engineers they should have automated tests for that anyway. This sort of change should take minutes, not days, much less weeks.
Note to ACs: I usually delete AC replies without reading them. If you want to talk to me, log in.
Will be down in the basement, in the dark, with no stairs, in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying 'Beware of the Leopard'.
That hides the bottom 310px of the page no matter what screen resolution is used.
Page with javascript
Page without javascript
Apple has no debt. Did you factor that in?
The $33bn number is "old news". Apple made $41bn in their just ended fiscal year. They are still seeing growth in 3 of their 4 main product lines (iPods are understandably seeing negative growth). Their product mix is still high value and high margin. I frankly do not see them taking an axe to their margins for market share. The bottom line is they sell in the high end of the market, where people spend money (App Store revenues are still ahead of Google Market/Google Play revenues), even with a much diminished market share/install base.
THIS, this right here, is why I can't understand why MSFT is blowing billions jumping into the shark tank that is ARM powered mobile devices. Frankly Apple is the ONLY one making reliable money, the rest are caught in a race to the bottom, HTC has had some bad quarters, so has Samsung, the rest are looking ready to lose their shirts. the chips are changing too fast, they have too much stock, and frankly nobody looks at anything but the price...except for Apple.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, even in a downturn Apple will make out like bandits because they are NOT a tech company that makes fashionable devices, they are a fashion company that happens to work in tech. This is actually a GOOD thing for Apple fans, just look at lines around the block and people paying crazy markup for Air Jordans. Fashion seems immune when it comes to downturns for the most part, and even when article after article bitches about their memory prices...they keep right on buying.
So any company trying to jump into that blood soaked shark tank is frankly more than a little insane, and anybody that thinks they'll make iMoney with Android or WinRT are frankly delusional. Mark my words you'll see dual core 7 inch tablets for $50, the prices will drop so low it'll practically be throwaway devices. The only one that will be making consistent profits will be Apple, and this is coming from someone who doesn't even own an iPod.
It isn't necessarily about making money, IMO. It is about creating an ecosystem that allows their existing product to continue to thrive. As more and more people embrace mobile, and as the tablet and the laptop continue to converge, it seems apparent that Microsoft can't just keep on delivering new releases of Windows and Office. Eventually, as Google Apps continue to improve and make headway, as Google releases the Chromebook and such alternatives take root, there is going to be fewer and fewer things that are keeping people in the Microsoft world.
Even if Microsoft's mobile venture doesn't win them huge sums of money, inroads in market share means that the Windows experience is out there as a viable alternative moving forward. Delivering an ecosystem where Windows applications can run on both the desktop and the mobile device means that development for the Windows platform can continue. If enterprises are forced to support Android and/or iOS anyway then there is no reason to build anything that takes advantage of Microsoft unique features. If Microsoft can put forth a unified ecosystem where enterprises can be convinced to target the Windows platform, that is a huge win for the long term viability of Microsoft.
Holy crap there's more, it also clips off the top of the page if it is too short vertically, but maintains the bottom of the page being just above the statement. They are sacrificing viewing their page navigation to ensure the bottom of the page isn't viewed...
UK and Samsung at Tanagra. Their arms closed.
In typesetting if you don't really want most people from reading a specific paragraph it is always best to put that paragraph at the bottom of the page and if possible put it in a sans-serif font while having all other fonts seriffed. Of course it also helps if you put said paragraph in a page with heavy coloured pictures which basically insures it won't be read by all but the most persistent reader. It must be noted in the UK Apple website all fonts are not seriffed however nearly all words are mainly for captions which is a very valid way of using sans-serif fonts (magazines do this all the time).
Don't believe me then go to here and scroll to the bottom, then try to read the paragraph without your eyes wanting to take a holiday.
Congratulations to Apple web designers for using a technique that typesetters knew over a hundred years ago and yes unless the judge is ignorant or does not care about typesetting (in this case web layout) tricks like this then I can see Apple being found in contempt.
There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
Ordering the apology be put on their web page was done so that customers would see the apology, it is therefore apparent that the court wanted the apology to be plainly visible. Public apologies are ordered by the courts all the time and screwing around with them even while remaining within the strict letter of the order is blatant contempt of court and is generally treated severely by the courts. Add to that, apple seem to have removed the redirect from the US site to the UK one it becomes more obvious that apples intention here is to go against the spirit of the order by ensuring as few people see it as possible. Apple are playing chicken with the courts, somehow I don't think the courts will swerve first.
Apple's more recent success was in creating and filling a market that hadn't previously been properly established and expanded. Full credit to it for its imagination and high standards with regards to usability. Its success has also been to exploit the lackluster performance of Microsoft, which seemed to have become complacent in its market dominance. However Apple plays dirty, and it is worse than Microsoft in its lock-down and lock-in attitude to its systems. That is its weakness, and Google has had some success with Android because of this. Microsoft is the dark horse this time I think because if it can produce a software development platform that straddles the x86 architecture and also ARM, it can kick Apple's arse. Sadly, Linux once again is left a bit in the cold, except in its Android incarnation. I wish the hardware on smartphones and tablets was more open.
Do it yourself, because no one else will do it yourself. [beta blockade 10-17 Feb]
You don't understand. This isnt about Samsung vs Apple. This is about Apple vs the UK.
A judge is god of his courtroom. Just as the saying goes don't fight the police, fight in court. Well the followup to that is don't taunt a judge in his domain.
Feel free to request a review of a judicial order, but you better be starting to comply immediately if you aren't granted a temporary stay on the order pending review.
A judge has the authority to toss your ass in jail if he thinks you show contempt for the court. Unless you are in the US and trying to perform civil disobedience in order to have standing to constitutionally challenge a law, its always bad to piss of a judge.
The judge can also find you in contempt even if you follow the exact letter of the law. That's why they are called judges. We give them the authority to use judgement in applying most laws. They can ruin your day.
Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
So tell me, which jobs would be shed?
Which people are Apple employing unnecessarily, that they could currently shed to gain 10% additional profits, and have decided against shedding, but would shed to regain 10% of their profits?
If those jobs were surplus to the efficient and effective operations of the business, a corporation would already have shed them.
Sorry, I don't trust you at all.
For Apple to post a statement that purports to be from Apple stating that Samsung did not copy would be ridiculous, because it's already won judgments in other jurisdictions that say Samsung did copy.
Apple spread the suggestion that Samsung had infringed on their IP. A court found that Samsung did not infringe. The court has ruled that Apple make it clear that Samsung did not infringe, to correct the damage caused by their initial list.
You may call that juvenile. I consider it to be a reasonable request. Other jurisdictions are utterly irrelevant and the ruling didn't even demand that Apple state that Samsung didn't copy, merely draw attention to the lack of infringement and link to the case.
Let the people know their judges are looking to deceive them.
Please. Tell me how the judges are trying to deceive people. Quote the specific sentence or sentences in the transcript from the court. Because I've read it and the only attempts at deception that I can see come from Apple.