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BlackBerry 10 Preview Looks Positive

Posted by Soulskill on from the better-hope-so dept.

An anonymous reader writes "The Register has a BlackBerry 10 preview up. They say, 'BlackBerry users have a love-hate relationship with their phones. The devices were often forced upon users rather than chosen. At the same time, the handhelds were the most usable and useful communications gadgets you could put in your pocket.' The preview is surprisingly positive, and it goes on to look at BB10's Hub/notifications feature, which they call 'utilitarian' and efficient compared to Windows Phones, which are more about 'style and novelty' whilst being 'a bit limiting.' BlackBerry's implementation may actually improve the system, rather than detracting from it. With BlackBerry providing a QT environment (compatible with Sailfish, which we discussed earlier) and RIM having managed to maintain BB's 3rd place in the mobile OS market, there may a chance for real three-way competition between QT, Android and iOS in the mobile market."

122 comments

  1. GLHF, fingers crosed for QT by fatalGlory · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Qt is a great platform/API, would love to see a Qt based platform in the smartphone market with some significant market-share. I feel Qt (qnd QtQuick) deserves more usage in the commercial space than it gets.

    --
    Censorship is the opposite of education. If neo-darwinism were defensible, people would not need to try and censor ID.
    1. Re:GLHF, fingers crosed for QT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, BB making surprise comeback with Qt after Nokia dropped it and plunged into their current depths, clinging on their new "one trick pony" tactics.

      Whatever Nokia's board was smoking at the time, I hope I never come across the same stuff...

  2. Where are you getting this from? Some highschooler by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "for real three-way competition between QT, Android and iOS" hmmm, this alone says don't waste your time reading. The author must have no idea what QT is. Or no idea what Android/iOS/QNX/WP8 are.

  3. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    What matters is: If I develop a mobile application; where will I have a big enough audience to justify it. In the next year, Android will have 70% or more of the market; iOS will have about 20%. BlackBerry will have about 5% and Tizen/Bada also likely about 5%. If Jolla can make even 3% market share then overall, I can address 8% of the market by writing for QT. This is enough to actually be commercially worthwhile.

    Everything else will be below 2% (see the attached article). That just isn't worth bothering with.

  4. The App Dilemma by ue85 · · Score: 0

    The problem is Blackberry are so far behind in the app race it is nearly impossible to catch up. Smartphone users have spoken and essentially said they want apps and the ability to customize their phone via apps. The previous Blackberry OS had apps, but most of them were overpriced and provided little function. Unfortunately the only way to even compete in the app market would be to adopt Android, which is admitting defeat. If there was a Blackberry with a physical keyboard that ran Android I would be lining up the first day to buy it, but unless BB10 really tanks I don't see this scenario ever coming to light. I am hopeful Blackberry 10 can reclaim some of their market, force them to innovate in a cutthroat market and produce quality. While still in the green, unlike some, RIM knows this is their last chance. RIM has smelled the stench of death, they know if they mess up their empire will come crashing down even more. They need to provide tools to produce in house applications cheaply and easily for BB10 and provide a market for consumers to buy applications, but first they need to make it worth while to develop. I guess we won't know until next year how well this plan will work.

    1. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      You don't follow news on mobile much do you?
      BB10 has an android app player. Also I can't remember the exact number but BlackBerry made a list of the top X apps in mobile and will have them. Not sure what more you want. Android app player should cover having the 120 fart app options if you really want them.

    2. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pretty sure there has been a bunch of press on how it works now. But thanks for the worthless input.

    3. Re:The App Dilemma by majesticmerc · · Score: 4, Informative

      BB10 will have the Android Runtime that came with the PlayBook, so most Android apps will be able to be ported quickly (assuming the developers get round to it). This should give RIM a massive leg-up on populating their app store quickly, albeit with some inconsistent-UI issues.

    4. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not so much of a dilemma. They could adopt Android, and port their own apps to it. In exchange, it will mean they'll have access to, not just the Android on their hardware, but Android phones all over the world, a market hundreds of times bigger. This way, they can make their own hardware and software, two sources of money, which they can bundle for a reduced cost and rejuvenate the BlackBerry brand.

    5. Re:The App Dilemma by shaitand · · Score: 1

      Now we'll have to see if they have a slider with a decent size touchscreen. The full keyboard is nice but the screen on my BB is too small to make using the thing worthwhile.

    6. Re:The App Dilemma by shaitand · · Score: 1

      It is the playbook one.

    7. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You know how long it takes to create an "app"? About a week. You can always catch up because it takes minimal investment to get an app.

    8. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The problem is Blackberry are so far behind in the app race it is nearly impossible to catch up. Smartphone users have spoken and essentially said they want apps and the ability to customize their phone via apps.

      Have you actually looked at these apps, the majority are so pisspoor I marvel that the writers have the chutzpah to offer them up for sale/download/whatever in the first instance.

      The previous Blackberry OS had apps, but most of them were overpriced and provided little function.

      Here, as the (reluctant) owner of a Blackberry for just over a year now, I wholly agree, but I refer you to the majority of the android/iphone apps out there, there isn't much of a difference betwixt their quality and that of the Blackberry ones. The question you have to really have to ask yourself is, 'do I need any of these?' I came to the conclusion, after six months or so, was No, I don't, and uninstalled most/all of them.(I'd kill for a decent 'stand alone' astronomy application for the Blackberry)

      Unfortunately the only way to even compete in the app market would be to adopt Android, which is admitting defeat.

      I don't see the argument here, having spent a couple of years developing/porting software to QNX, I know that there's a fair amount of available code which, in theory, should work on BB10. I'm hoping that I'll be able to get some of the code I've done in the past to run natively on one of these BB10 beasties (if I get the chance), though I've not looked into the restrictions (if any) they've implemented.

      They need to provide tools to produce in house applications cheaply and easily for BB10 and provide a market for consumers to buy applications, but first they need to make it worth while to develop. I guess we won't know until next year how well this plan will work.

      I'm just about to download the Core Native SDK, and will get the Cascades thing as well, so the tools, by the looks of it, are there.
      The market thing, they already have, though they need to purge it of a lot of the drek that currently pollutes it.
      Anyway, I'm off to download the SDKs..

    9. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Sure if you're writing a fart app. Anything of higher quality takes far more than a week.

    10. Re:The App Dilemma by stephanruby · · Score: 1

      Now we'll have to see if they have a slider with a decent size touchscreen. The full keyboard is nice but the screen on my BB is too small to make using the thing worthwhile.

      Their first flagship BB10 phone has a decent-size touch-screen (with no keyboard, not even a sliding one).

      If you want a keyboard, you'll have to wait, or you'll have to go to Android. There are a number Android phone models that have keyboards and touchscreens combined, it's just that those types of phones are not very popular, both sliding ones and non-sliding ones.

      For instance, my Motorola XPRT World phone looks just like an old Blackberry phone (with a slightly larger screen but no sliding keyboard), and it is true that the experience suffers.

    11. Re:The App Dilemma by rtfa-troll · · Score: 1

      You know how long it takes to create an "app"? About a week. You can always catch up because it takes minimal investment to get an app.

      You are the guy getting all the Windows App bounties; aren't you?

      --
      =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
    12. Re:The App Dilemma by sootman · · Score: 2

      That "massive leg-up" had roughly zero positive impact on PlayBook sales.

      --
      Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    13. Re:The App Dilemma by aztracker1 · · Score: 1

      +1 for this idea.. BB made some great strides into corporate infrastructure.. they could continue that with line of business apps offered on their Android platform phones only.. that would give them some strategic advantages, while being compatible with the apps on google play store.

      --
      Michael J. Ryan - tracker1.info
    14. Re:The App Dilemma by antek9 · · Score: 1

      Not so much of a dilemma. They could adopt Android, and port their own apps to it. In exchange, it will mean they'll have access to, not just the Android on their hardware, but Android phones all over the world, a market hundreds of times bigger. This way, they can make their own hardware and software, two sources of money, which they can bundle for a reduced cost and rejuvenate the BlackBerry brand.

      This. They could even make it go both ways, still release dedicated Blackberry phones, running latest Android versions plus their own UI on top of that. Have their own phones run premium versions of their apps, and sell basic versions on Google Play that run on all Android devices. Call it Business Android, or whatever.

      --
      A World in a Grain of Sand / Heaven in a Wild Flower,
      Infinity in the Palm of your Hand / And Eternity in an Hour.
    15. Re:The App Dilemma by no-body · · Score: 2

      The reason was that PB software was ”not so great" when it came out. Now, with Rel 2.1 it's decent but too late because it got bashed before and people remember the bad reviews.

      Used PB's can be had for cheap. I am typing this on one - does the job just fine.

      Looks to me that RIM has learned from this and wait with the BB10 release until the product is more together.

    16. Re:The App Dilemma by shaitand · · Score: 1

      I think the lack of popularity is caused by not offering flagship models with flagship capabilities as sliders. The latest and greatest personal phone is always a big touch screen.

      On the flip side businesses generally want a BB with a company run BES behind it for company issue phones. Even if your company was willing to issue Androids there aren't many android sliders.

      Issue a BB slider with a large touch screen, a hi res camera, full app support, 4G LTE, lots of memory, fully loaded feature set, and that is as fast as the top of the line model and see if people don't buy it.

      Until you do, you aren't asking if people want sliders, you are asking if having a slider is more important to them than all the other bells and whistles. There only needs to be one tradeoff with the slider. Thickness and sliders really aren't that thick. Having a giant screen on super thin phone that feels like it is going to crack like a cracker is overrated anyway.

    17. Re:The App Dilemma by Darkness404 · · Score: 1

      Yep, I think the last "flagship" Android phone with a keyboard was the Droid. Samsung made a decent job with the captivate glide, which was basically a Galaxy S II with a keyboard (slightly lower CPU clock speed, but not too bad) but suffered from a late release date (close enough to the Galaxy S III) and terrible software support (they just now got a bug-free official ICS ROM out for it a week or two ago)

      --
      Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
    18. Re:The App Dilemma by Spaseboy · · Score: 0

      Not so great? It didn't have email or calendar! I mean, WebOS had THAT and it was a flop.

      --
      "I don't want more choice, I just want nicer things!"
      -Jennifer Saunders as Edina Monsoon
    19. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Rim will never adopt Android. Their sole distinguishing characteristic is that they are more secure than any other phone.

      Once Android malware takes off, Rim's stock will go through the roof.

    20. Re:The App Dilemma by Some+Bitch · · Score: 0

      Getting Android apps onto a Playbook is a pain in the arse, so much so that if BB10 uses the same method they may as well leave it out as a feature.

    21. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "(I'd kill for a decent 'stand alone' astronomy application for the Blackberry)"

      I think you might be taking your astronomy a little too seriously

    22. Re:The App Dilemma by ArhcAngel · · Score: 1

      Blackberry users EXPECT security to be baked in. RIM knew this and couldn't deliver a full blown messaging system with that security in such a short time frame so they provided the Blackberry Bridge which allowed for your already secure messaging on your Blackberry phone to link to the PlayBook with the security intact. when they added the messaging this year I set my accounts up and quickly realized it wasn't nearly as good as it already was with the Bridge. That's why they pushed BB 10 back so far. They don't want a repeat of the bad press that sank the PlayBook sales. What's interesting is the Bridge app isn't locked to only the PlayBook. If you had a BB with Bridge installed you could pair it with your Galaxy Tab or iPad (Bridge uses Bluetooth) and use the remote control feature. (good luck getting apple to allow iTunes to work with a non iOS device) For anybody who appreciates BB keyboards this is a nice addition.

      --
      "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
    23. Re:The App Dilemma by ArhcAngel · · Score: 1

      It's no different than the Google Play store except that it's in BlackBerry App World...or were you referring to sideloading them? In which case they are equally as hard on Android and MORE difficult on iOS.

      FYI: The link references apps by Handster. They repackage Android software for other developers. There are other ISVs with Android apps on App World as well.

      --
      "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
    24. Re:The App Dilemma by Some+Bitch · · Score: 1

      Every one I've got on here I had to sideload, sadly. I'm hoping for more native apps next year as the Playbook is getting a BB10 makeover and hardware-wise it's a good bit of kit.

    25. Re:The App Dilemma by vux984 · · Score: 1

      The problem is Blackberry are so far behind in the app race it is nearly impossible to catch up.

      Apps are overrated. Most people don't buy many, and few really care which free apps they amuse themselves with when they are bored.

      The number of high value apps that an app store really needs to have to be 'competitive' is in then 10s not the 10s of thousands.

    26. Re:The App Dilemma by Gumbercules!! · · Score: 1

      Very true. Turns out while iTunes has the largest number of apps (thought Google Play is almost caught up now), no one downloads the vast, vast majority of them: http://www.androidanalyse.com/most-ipad-apps-have-never-been-downloaded/

    27. Re:The App Dilemma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      PlayBook OS 2.1 is still so rough it isn't funny. Try a real tablet please.

  5. 3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Even windows phone 7 shipped.....

    1. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Says the guy posting on slashdot, where every other article is about linux.

      3rd place does not make something irrelevant. In fact, it makes it really damn important to keep the others on their toes.

    2. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What a terrible analogy, think longer before posting. 3rd in mobile is HUGE. Superbowl is fighting over a single object. In mobile you're fighting over BILLIONS of customers.

    3. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Hah. 3rd place in the mobile OS market is kind of like 3rd place in the Superbowl. They don't even get to show up for the game.

      There's lots to back that up; the mobile market is a scale game and without the large number of customers on a platform it just isn't worth investing in new development. However, the mobile market doesn't quite work like a normal consumer market. The buyers in most countries are the big operators - not the end users - and they are willing to put extra subsidies into a third platform just in order to get more competition in future. Look at how desperately AT&T has been keeping Windows Phone on life support even at the cost of their own subscriber base.

      In this case BlackBerry has additional features such as FIPS certification which guarantee it markets such as the military bureaucrats of the Pentagon. That means that they can actually become profitable with a third place and can probably get a decent volume long term.

      The reason nothing like this can ever work for Microsoft is that sensible carriers hate Skype. They know that, if Skype succeeds then Microsoft will become the sole point of contact for customer billing. This will make the operators no more valuable than a WiFi access point whilst they have to invest in serious and expensive radio equipment to provide the coverage required by their licenses. Most operators can see that pushing forward Windows Phone would be suicidal.

    4. Re:3rd place? by Dahamma · · Score: 0

      When 3rd place is 4% of the market and falling, yes, it is irrelevant.

      And Linux *is* pretty much irrelevant from a business point of view on the desktop, if that's what you mean. But it (via Android) was 70% of smartphone sales last quarter. It also has 60%+ market share of web servers, and runs on about 95% of networked TVs and BD players. So actually, if you look at market share of "connected devices" it's solidly in 1st, and pulling away.

      But I guess RIM has that Playbook in the tablet market to save them, right? Yeah...

    5. Re:3rd place? by shaitand · · Score: 1

      If you think Linux is in 3rd place you aren't counting properly.

    6. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      so you think linux is 3rd place? Is that in the mobile phone market where it holds about 90% of the worlds smartphones according to recent news stories I've been reading? Or in the market share of servers? or perhaps embedded devices (routers/firewalls/WAPs)?

    7. Re:3rd place? by Dahamma · · Score: 3, Funny

      Go ask Palm and Symbian how great it is to fight for the last few percent of the mobile market...

    8. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... or a US election

    9. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, it's like 10th place.

    10. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is Slashdot. You actually have to know something to post here. So Fuck off.

    11. Re:3rd place? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is Slashdot. You actually have to know something to post here.

      You must be new here.

    12. Re:3rd place? by Dahamma · · Score: 0

      This is Slashdot. You actually have to know something to post here. So Fuck off.

      ACphincter says what? You have already proven the opposite. But if you disagree, at least have a point...

    13. Re:3rd place? by trashcoder · · Score: 1

      You are assuming that just because Android holds the most market share at the moment, they will never lose any and will always remain at the top. RIM was a market leader not so long ago as was Nokia. There is every chance either of them could make a comeback and take over or someone entirely new enter the market and gain top spot.

    14. Re:3rd place? by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      "Every chance"? Heh. No, not really.

      Even iOS is actually small compared to the overall marketshare of Android. And that's because it's a single manufacturer trying to push its own OS in the days of smartphones largely dependent on their app ecosystem, etc to thrive.

      And why did Android come out of nowhere to be the market leader? Because it works, and it's *free* - so it's not one company making up that 70% share, it's a dozen or more. And unlike Apple, most of the other manufacturers have a relatively tight margin and so their choice is either develop their own OS or license one. (Apple is still kicking ass because they were first, and they make a high quality, high end, high margin product with amazing marketing that will ensure them a profitable 15-20% of the market).

      This SAME THING has already happened in the video space (TVs, BD players, and set-top boxes). 10 years ago Tivo was one of the few devices using Linux, and everyone else was paying license fees for VXWorks, WinCE, PowerTV, QNX, etc. Now (as I mentioned previously) almost every connected TV and BD player runs Linux, because it works and it's free.

      And even more ironically during all of this RIM bought QNX and closed the source so they could ride another proprietary OS into the ground. They should have been paying attention to Palm and HP's fiasco. Their WebOS was actually a *good* design, and it still failed miserably. RIM (like Palm) is in a horrible position in the market because they are a single manufacturer that's going to have a harder and harder time convincing developers to bother with Blackberry apps. Even Microsoft may have a better shot, since they are trying to build an app market by licensing their OS and consolidating their experience on their other hugely successful products...

    15. Re:3rd place? by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      Even iOS is actually small compared to the overall marketshare of Android. And that's because it's a single manufacturer trying to push its own OS in the days of smartphones largely dependent on their app ecosystem, etc to thrive.

      And why did Android come out of nowhere to be the market leader? Because it works, and it's *free* - so it's not one company making up that 70% share, it's a dozen or more. And unlike Apple, most of the other manufacturers have a relatively tight margin and so their choice is either develop their own OS or license one. (Apple is still kicking ass because they were first, and they make a high quality, high end, high margin product with amazing marketing that will ensure them a profitable 15-20% of the market).

      Two problems.

      1) Depending on who you ask, either iOS or BlackBerry App World makes the most money (they apparently jockey for #1 and #2 spots in developer revenue).

      2) #3 spot is apparently owned by Amazon.

      So Apple is "hanging on" because developers make money from the platform, despite being only 20% (of smartphone sales - they make a killing on tablets and ipods as well, which are compatible).

      The other problem is well, Android is available for dozens of manufacturers, most of which are still releasing pieces of crap runngin 2.3 (or less!).

      In fact, what's happened in the smartphone world has happened before for PCs - you've got a few top-end phones, but the market is spiralling down in a race to the bottom of crappy Androids (which wouldn't surprise me are outselling even the top tier Galaxy SIII in remarkable quantities - "free" helps). And there's Apple sitting on the premium phone market, barely competing on the low end market while everyone kills each other down there. (And I don't think users of free Androids do much in the way of app spending.).

      Heck, Gingerbread's been out how many years now and it's still over 50% of the Android market?

      Ofr course, I will admit both Google Play and Apple App Store are full of crap and need a bit of pruning... and that devs need to learn that they need to market their apps.

    16. Re:3rd place? by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      1) Depending on who you ask, either iOS or BlackBerry App World makes the most money (they apparently jockey for #1 and #2 spots in developer revenue).

      2) #3 spot is apparently owned by Amazon.

      Depending on who you ask, if some of the people you ask are completely making shit up! Apple est. app store revenues for 2011 of $2.9B and RIM $280M. Order of magnitude, not "jockeying for #1 and #2 spots". And if you take all Android stores (probably combining Amazon, Google, and Samsung is plenty) they are well ahead of RIM for #2. The only thing RIM leads at is "revenue per app" which makes sense when they have a tiny fraction of the apps of the other stores, and those they have tend to be higher priced.

      So Apple is "hanging on" because developers make money from the platform, despite being only 20% (of smartphone sales - they make a killing on tablets and ipods as well, which are compatible).

      My words were "kicking ass", not "hanging on", not sure where you got that "parahprase". But no, Apple is not hanging on or kicking ass because of their app store, it's because they sell a shitload of high margin phones and tablets, and have a loyal customer base who tends to replace them every couple years. The app store is still only a few percent of the ~$35B in revenue they take in every quarter.

      And as far as "crappy Androids" - they aren't free, they are *subsidized*. The manufacturer can still have plenty of margin. You can get an iPhone 4S for $100 or 5 for $200, and that's the "high end market". $0-$100 with a ~$300-400 subsidy can still get you a perfectly capable Android smartphone.

  6. 3rd place? by Dahamma · · Score: 5, Funny

    Hah. 3rd place in the mobile OS market is kind of like 3rd place in the Superbowl. They don't even get to show up for the game.

  7. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    Exactly. The author hasn't got a clue. Develop for Android, release on BB Android app player as well = 75%. Article is NOT WORTH READING. Author is as informed as an Angry Birds addicted High Schooler. And idiotically is saying there will be a competition between an APP FRAMEWORK and OPERATING SYSTEMS. I'm sorry but this person is clueless.

  8. Firefox OS... by alexandre · · Score: 1

    ... or die trying.

  9. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    So write it for Android, then take the 20 minutes to repackage it for BB10. http://developer.blackberry.com/android/

  10. The OS preview may look positive... by FSWKU · · Score: 1

    Too bad they can't say the same thing about their earnings forecasts. =P

    --
    "So after all this, you make my case for me. To end this stalemate, you must die..."
  11. I'm too lazy to check but... by jtownatpunk.net · · Score: 1

    ...is this the version that wipes out compatibility with their entire app library, requiring developers to start from scratch if they want to support the new platform?

    1. Re:I'm too lazy to check but... by EmperorArthur · · Score: 1

      Probably. On the other hand developers could tweak their 10 year old Symbian apps to work on it.

      Blackberry was like android in that it used a smartphone centric java implementation. It would have been nice if they'd made it just a compile away for android apps, but QT development is pretty straight forward. The fact it's a superset of c++ means many people can already code for it easily enough.

      --
      So lets pretend that we've just completed writing this code, as opposed to having just completed sabotaging it -Altera
    2. Re:I'm too lazy to check but... by mrops · · Score: 1

      That is the one, and its a good thing.

    3. Re:I'm too lazy to check but... by Rabenblut · · Score: 1

      Yup. They intended to include legacy support but gave up, not really giving a reason...

    4. Re:I'm too lazy to check but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean like Apple when they went OSX / Intel, yeah - probably.

  12. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    According to the press releases from Digia, Android will be a tier one Qt platform "soon", and given how bad writing native apps for Android currently is, it might well become the toolkit of choice for Android development too.

  13. Qt not QT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    QT == QuickTime
    Qt == GUI library + other stuff

  14. Warning: Andrew Orlowski by whoever57 · · Score: 4, Informative

    This review is from the same person who called Windows Phone 8 " a strong contender" and frequently refers to "freetards"

    --
    The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    1. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This review is from the same person who called Windows Phone 8 " a strong contender" and frequently refers to "freetards"

      Totally right. Thus in the original submission The Register was described as being "a publication with an open pro-Microsoft bias". Unfortunately the Slashdot editors seem to be actually editing articles today for some reason.

    2. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 1

      The register's journalistic integrity is quite low. That said, some of his complaints against freetards are valid. People who think they deserve everything for the price of their broadband connection aren't people anyone should pay attention to.

    3. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by Finallyjoined!!! · · Score: 0

      Clueless twat.
      Nuff said.

      --
      If I had an Ass, I'd call it Fanny Bottom, then I could slap my Ass; Fanny Bottom, on the Arse.
    4. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He clearly hasn't met a slashtard yet...

    5. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by jareth-0205 · · Score: 1

      The Register was described as being "a publication with an open pro-Microsoft bias".

      Not really, they generally have an anti-everything bias (tag line is "Biting the hand that feeds IT"), and occasionally revel in saying things that go against the generally accepted geek point of view. I read every day, and I don't think they have a pro-anything bias.

    6. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by fast+turtle · · Score: 1

      I've never met a slashtard either but I have met a slushtard

      --
      Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown
    7. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by Xest · · Score: 1

      Maybe you just have the same biases they do so don't notice them?

      The Register definitely has it's biases, it's a very right wing leaning publication. To position it in UK politics it's politically aligned with the furthest right leaning elements of the Tory party, i.e. pretty close to UKIP.

      I used to read it a fair bit but gave up when I posted a response to one of Andrew Orlowski's articles (one of the few times he allowed comments) pointing out some shall we say "factual inaccuracies" in his story including sources, it was a perfectly polite post, but it obviously upset Andrew to have his authority questioned because after that my account was banned and every other post I'd made there ever was also deleted.

      Amusingly their ban system is made of complete fail though, if you did a reset password request on the login area it reset the password, and removed the ban :)

      It didn't matter though because as I say, I stopped reading and posting at that point. Any "journalist" who can't accept corrections to their story and prefers to censor opposing viewpoints can hardly be deemed a journalist. Really, it's the Fox News of the IT world. Lewis Page's articles were always nearly 100% bullshit too, but to give him credit he at least allowed comments and didn't censor the countless people pointing out the hundreds of flaws in his articles- i.e. claiming the Eurofighter wasn't getting a proper bombing capability until 2020 and then hence claiming it had no air to ground capability and that we should've bought F18s, whilst conveniently ignoring the fact that actually the Eurofighter already has Air to Ground missile capability.

      Either way The Register is alright I guess if you want to reaffirm your viewpoint if you share that viewpoint, but it's hardly a good source of objective, or even correct news. Often it's just outright quite literally completely wrong about things which doesn't bode well if you actually want to gain anything of actual value from it.

    8. Re:Warning: Andrew Orlowski by jareth-0205 · · Score: 1

      Somehow, it doesn't surprise me even slightly to learn that Andrew Orlowski is a dick...

  15. Hopefully they won't make a deal to pimp by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    their users to Google -- as nearly every other internet site, browser, and provider has done.

    Google is the biggest scale pimp operation the world has ever known. And there is no opt out. We are all Google Whores now.

  16. I love ripping on RIM but... by EmperorOfCanada · · Score: 4, Interesting

    RIM is so much fun to rip on because of the MBA/Scumbag lawyer types who have their BBs clipped onto their belts. But long ago BB was the first phone that caught my attention (around 2000). It had a sort of 486 processor in it and a fairly easy to use SDK. But I couldn't find a way to market the applications. So I ignored them for the last dozen years.

    But here they are potentially using QT (and thus C++) which is my favorite development base. So there might be hope. I want to see how easy it is to use, deploy, and sell. Next I have doubts about the typical baby boomer being able to use this phone. In the demo there are swipes/side swipes/twisty swipes/and swipes with a half twist of lemon; so I fear that the boomer crowd might be a bit lost.

    Lastly the keyboard might free up room for the screen but my daughter has the option of almost any phone she wants and she and her friends all have BB phones for their keyboards and BBMs. My other daughter doesn't text as much and only wants iPhones.

    So what I hope that comes from this is that there is a push to get QT not only onto the BB but to expand it to the Android NDK as well as iOS. This might not sound like the best idea for RIM but they would then get developers like me primarily developing for iOS using QT but then porting to the others in short order. I look at my Objective-C code and dread porting all those square brackets to Java or C++. But just noodling the GUI and a bit of fiddling to port stuff would be great.

    1. Re:I love ripping on RIM but... by Nethead · · Score: 1

      That boomer crowd you think my get lost with a few odd swipes was the same crowd that coded in machine language and flipped toggle switches to load memory. I don't think a toy interface is going to throw us.

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    2. Re:I love ripping on RIM but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      ...and what percentage of the boomer crowd coded in machine language and flipped toggle switches?

  17. Yes but....... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Does Blackberry 10 still take like 10 mins to boot up if you remove the battery. Seriously the boot times on pretty much all the past Blackberries is painful. I have seen some Berries loaded with some apps take 20 mins to load....

    Imagine this, you are in a serious car accident, and you manage to put the battery back into your phone.. That would be the most painful longest 10 mins in your life just so you can call 911.. Even worse if you are bleeding...

    I am surprised they haven't had a case like this against them by now..

    1. Re:Yes but....... by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 1

      Does Blackberry 10 still take like 10 mins to boot up if you remove the battery. Seriously the boot times on pretty much all the past Blackberries is painful. I have seen some Berries loaded with some apps take 20 mins to load....

      No, on the Dev Alpha B it's about 50 seconds. Every dev alpha software update we've received has decreased that time. This aside, realistically you almost never reboot the thing - unlike the old BB which needed a reboot for every 3rd party software upgrade.

  18. The recent licensing change might disagree... by tlambert · · Score: 1

    The recent licensing change might disagree...

    http://developers.slashdot.org/story/12/11/15/2218230/google-targets-android-fragmentation-with-updated-terms-for-sdk

    Google wants to avoid fragmentation, and a version of the OS only capable of running version 2.3 applications isn't going to make them happy to have it called Android.

    1. Re:The recent licensing change might disagree... by marcosdumay · · Score: 2

      and a version of the OS only capable of running version 2.3 applications isn't going to make them happy to have it called Android.

      Good thing that Blackberry's OS isn't called Android.

      --
      Rethinking email
    2. Re:The recent licensing change might disagree... by ChunderDownunder · · Score: 2

      It's also an assumption that BB's android compatibility will forever remain at Gingerbread.

      Gingerbread was a stable baseline to develop a compatibility layer for QNX in time for the playbook. But given the delays of BB10 , it's fair to say they've had other development priorities. I'd expect a Jelly Bean refresh late next year after they're actually shipping handsets and as more apps actually demand Android 4.x.

  19. Why BlackBerry? by Darkness404 · · Score: 1

    The problem with BlackBerry in recent years is that there's been no real convincing reason to use it rather than Android/iOS/Windows Phone. Unless you belong to a company tied into the BlackBerry environment, why would you really choose a BlackBerry?

    --
    Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
    1. Re:Why BlackBerry? by ChunderDownunder · · Score: 2

      "in recent years".

      This is a new platform built on QNX, borrowing Qt from Symbian and Meego and running Android apps.

  20. 3rd place in a two horse race by gelfling · · Score: 2

    BB isn't in the top 5 in unit sales anymore, or if it is, it's barely hanging on to 5 place. And HTC is 3rd place with barely 4.2% and it's almost entirely piggybacking on Android.

    There are two phone companies now: Samsung + Android, and Apple iOS. And everyone else is or will soon be irrelevant.

    Sony, Panasonic, Sanyo, Nokia, Motorola, Blackberry, ZTE (in the US at any rate) are all going to the Le Brea Tarpits.

    And if MS doesn't pull the plug on Win 8 Phone in 20 months it will be because Balmer has lost what's left of his mind.

    1. Re:3rd place in a two horse race by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You really are a shortsighted knucklehead. Just because Apple & Samsung are strong right now, that doesnt mean everyone else turns to sand. All it takes is someone to develop a great product, and the landscape changes. 2 years ago, Samsung's phone's were junk. 5.5 years ago, Apple's only phone on the market was the Rokr.

    2. Re:3rd place in a two horse race by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You probably haven't even picked up a Windows Phone. It's pretty cool. Gets to the point, no BS. That what all this stuff is about now, 'making it simple'. I don't find android simple/to the point. You could easily be right however.

    3. Re:3rd place in a two horse race by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I won't buy a Windows 8 phone simply because it's from Microsoft. I go out of my way to not buy Microsoft products because everyone expects Microsoft to be the default choice and for you to justify not buying Microsoft products (Windows desktop and server, .NET, Office, Xbox, etc.). I don't care if Windows 8 phones are the very best product on the market, I won't buy one or recommend it. My computers are Mac OSX, Linux and FreeBSD. My tablets are iPad, Android and BlackBerry. My phones are iPhone, Android and soon BB10.

  21. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Exactly. The author hasn't got a clue. Develop for Android, release on BB Android app player as well = 75%. Article is NOT WORTH READING. Author is as informed as an Angry Birds addicted High Schooler. And idiotically is saying there will be a competition between an APP FRAMEWORK and OPERATING SYSTEMS. I'm sorry but this person is clueless.

    Are you expecting to earn money on your app or are you doing it for fun? Good luck making any money on Android. People with android handset do not buy apps.

    I do. I own a Galaxy S2 and I do buy apps and games on google play.

    Nice thing that they run also on my Nexus 7

  22. Hey iPhone Users! by evilviper · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Hey iPhone Users!

    BB10 has maps...

    And they don't suck!

    End of review

    --
    Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    1. Re:Hey iPhone Users! by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      Hmm... talking of blind believers... BB10 isn't out yet.

      The problems with Apple Maps only became apparent the day the public got their hands on them.

  23. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If all of your contacts, entertainment services, and backups are chained into Apple - well, then you're just shit out of luck if you want to move.

    I want to see a complete separation of church and state here. Hardware should be separate from software. Software should be separate from services.

    I want to watch Nokia movies on my Samsung hardware running Google's Android, and then back them up to DropBox.

    That's how it works - more or less - in the PC space. I don't understand why it doesn't in the tablet and smartphone space? Why would I buy a tablet that only worked with content from one provider? Whether that's Amazon, Microsoft or Apple - it's setting up a nasty little monopoly which will drive up prices and drive down quality.

    I know, I know. The mantra of "It Just Works". I'm mildly sick of having to configure my tablet to talk to my NAS, and then get the TV to talk to both of them. That situation isn't just due to my equipment all coming from different manufacturers - it's mostly due to those manufacturers not implementing open standards.

    http://shkspr.mobi/blog/2012/11/i-dont-want-to-be-part-of-your-fucking-ecosystem/

  24. BB10 Demo by RIM CEO by aNonnyMouseCowered · · Score: 3, Interesting

    BBC has a video interview with the RIM CEO which shows him demo-ing the BB10 UI. The UI is more elegant than visually in-your-face striking like WinPhone 8.

    The UI kind of reminds me of the Opera/Chrome, and now Firefox too, Start Page with thumbnail previews of your favorite or most recently used apps.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-20087221

    1. Re:BB10 Demo by RIM CEO by NJRoadfan · · Score: 1

      The split screen view reminds me of the Amiga. Its far from being a new concept, but why didn't anyone think of implementing it on a smartphone until now?

    2. Re:BB10 Demo by RIM CEO by Pulzar · · Score: 1

      "The application grid is a paradigm that was introduced five years ago, and we have completely changed that", he says, as he opens up the application grid.

      Then he proceeds to show us the revolutionary multi-tasking interface, which is in a 2x2 grid.

      I hope they plan to have some better demos soon.

      --
      Never underestimate the bandwidth of a 747 filled with CD-ROMs.
  25. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by ozmanjusri · · Score: 1

    People with android handset do not buy apps.

    That's about the geographical market, not about the platform. Android's early popularity stemmed from regions like China where Apple is also finding difficulty in selling apps.

    China has its own Macworld/iWorld conference and plenty of iPhone fever, but the paid-download app market appears to still be maturing there. A new report from Shanghai-based analyst firm Stenvall Skoeld claims that the Chinese version of the iOS App Store accounted for 18 percent of total downloads in the second quarter, but just 3 percent of revenue.

    China is Apple's fastest growing market, while Android is growing faster in regions with a strong history of paid software purchases. The most recent App Annie data suggests revenue/app for Android is rising, while the equivalent for Apple is falling. In other words, markets are normalising as you'd expect them to.

    Enjoy the iOS income while you can, but don't get dependent on it.

    --
    "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
  26. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by ozmanjusri · · Score: 1

    given how bad writing native apps for Android currently is

    How bad is it, and what's so bad about it?

    I'm an Android (and other platform) developer, and don't really see much difference in difficulty writing for any of the current main mobile OSs.

    I don't consider myself particularly highly skilled, but I make a living, and even absolute beginners can block out surprisingly complete software with App Inventor.

    http://appinventor.mit.edu/

    --
    "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
  27. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by aristotle-dude · · Score: 1

    People with android handset do not buy apps.

    That's about the geographical market, not about the platform. Android's early popularity stemmed from regions like China where Apple is also finding difficulty in selling apps.

    China has its own Macworld/iWorld conference and plenty of iPhone fever, but the paid-download app market appears to still be maturing there. A new report from Shanghai-based analyst firm Stenvall Skoeld claims that the Chinese version of the iOS App Store accounted for 18 percent of total downloads in the second quarter, but just 3 percent of revenue.

    China is Apple's fastest growing market, while Android is growing faster in regions with a strong history of paid software purchases. The most recent App Annie data suggests revenue/app for Android is rising, while the equivalent for Apple is falling. In other words, markets are normalising as you'd expect them to.

    Enjoy the iOS income while you can, but don't get dependent on it.

    Keep telling yourself that. People in all regions using android are not buying apps. It is an "online" cultural issue where people think "open source" means that everything should "free" including third party apps. It has nothing to do countries.

    --
    Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
  28. FIPS-certified by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Military contracts are juicy.

    There are a lot of companies out there which you have never heard of making gear for government and defense agencies which you will never buy and they are making a killing doing so.

    Blackberry is one of these which just happens to have some slop-over into the public realm.

    This latest phone has people excited in the government contracting department. BB products have been sliding of late, but if this phone does the job they promise, (and it looks like it will), then BB ought to have a shot at staying all cozied up to the pork barrel.

  29. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Spaseboy · · Score: 1

    Java is garbage. It's a PITA to write and debug and it DEVOURS RAM. Dalvik just makes it worse. You can, quite literally, do the same app native on iOS and Windows Phone for a half to a quarter of the RAM.

    If Java were any good, it would not have been abandoned by every desktop platform and basically every smartphone platform.

    Qt on ARM is looking to be the future for mobile OSes and the added benefit is that Qt is pretty much available for every desktop platform including legacy systems like OS/2.

    --
    "I don't want more choice, I just want nicer things!"
    -Jennifer Saunders as Edina Monsoon
  30. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Belial6 · · Score: 1

    Abandoned by every smartphone platform except the one that holds a majority market share. As for the desktop, the smartphone platform that dominates the market is not only running a platform where the apps are written in Java, but is running on Linux, which also has done very poorly on the desktop.

  31. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Evidence?

  32. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    People with android handset do not buy apps.

    Keep telling yourself that. People in all regions using android are not buying apps. It is an "online" cultural issue where people think "open source" means that everything should "free" including third party apps. It has nothing to do countries.

    Android users are statistically-speaking, much more cost-conscious than iOS users, and also much more likely to be "late adopters". Meanwhile, iPhone 5 sells to people who already own a smart phone, and who don't flinch at wading through a sea of free Androids to shell out two bills for the phone and $80-plus a month for the required service plan. This demographic doesn't flinch at shelling out $0.99 for Fruit Ninja or Angry Birds: Star Wars Edition to get the non-gimped version. Adding insult to injury, the ability to sideload Android apps outside the app store means app piracy Overall Android doesn't look good, at least if you want to make money selling your app. Now, if your app is a conduit to some other online service (cough, Facebook, Netflix, Bank of Scamerica, etc) then Android simply represents too many eyeballs (and wallets) for you to ignore.

  33. The GGP claimed an "Android runtime" by tlambert · · Score: 1

    The GGP claimed an "Android runtime". They used the licensed trademark to claim it. So did the article.

    To address your point on it being 2.3: no mobile phone vendor who wants to sell the next handset, and no mobile carrier who wants to "let" you opt into a new 24 month contract 18 months into your current 2 year contract is going to be stupid enough to update the version of the OS to the latest version when they can instead use it as part of the hook to get you to buy into the newer handset/contract.

    The one exception to this is going to be Google branded phones, in exchange for the branding agreement, and even that's not going to work out so well in the long run, when capabilities go up further, and apps start using up available CPU and RAM in the newer devices. This is especially true after the 700 band auction, since Google lost out on the spectrum bid to become a carrier in their own right.

  34. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm an Android (and other platform) developer, and don't really see much difference in difficulty writing for any of the current main mobile OSs.

    Are you writing for Android in Java or in C/C++ ? I was talking about the later. As far as I know, it is still sufficiently troublesome that most Android app developers stick to the shit that is Java.

  35. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Java is garbage.

    Bat Java has its garbage collector!

  36. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    WTF "Bat"? I meant "But" :)

  37. They're still in business? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Like a lot of household names, society has passed them by.

  38. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Culture20 · · Score: 1

    But who will pay for your app? That's another factor to consider if you don't want to add advertisements to your apps.

  39. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

    Abandoned by every smartphone platform except the one that holds a majority market share.

    Correlation is not causation.

    Android is popular because there are cheap Android phones available. The figures show most purchasers don't even download apps or access the internet.

    Android is the most popular smartphone OS despite the fact that it has a Java-like development system, not because of it.

  40. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by molnarcs · · Score: 1

    China is Apple's fastest growing market, while Android is growing faster in regions with a strong history of paid software purchases. The most recent App Annie data suggests revenue/app for Android is rising, while the equivalent for Apple is falling. In other words, markets are normalising as you'd expect them to.

    Enjoy the iOS income while you can, but don't get dependent on it.

    Keep telling yourself that. People in all regions using android are not buying apps. It is an "online" cultural issue where people think "open source" means that everything should "free" including third party apps. It has nothing to do countries.

    What are you smoking? The people who are actually buying Android phones have no clue about "open source." You call yourself a geek? What are you doing here? You need to realize the 99% of the non-geek population of this planet never heard of "open source." You need to go out more, socialize, get to know the rest of the world ;) You can't make money on Android and assume nobody else can. But the trend is changing, even here where I live. Blackberry is still very strong, but the growing upper-middle class idolized Apple for years. This trend has been changing for the at least a year now. There are no subsidized prices here, people pay $400-700 for a smartphone. These are not "cheap" people as you seem to assume. Google Play has been getting better and better (though more buggy at the same time, QC Google please!) and now paying through your gmail account became so easy... I bought about 18 apps myself. Samsung has a very heavy presence, lots of marketing and it works. I see more and more people with high-end android smart phones and tablets. Hell, my model at the shooting (I'm a photographer) asked me about the Nexus 10! Have you heard of it? she said. And she is most definitely not a geek ;) I saw a women wielding a Galaxy Note the other day.

  41. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by ArcadeMan · · Score: 1

    What matters is: If I develop a mobile application; where will I have a big enough audience to justify it.

    If you only go with that variable, you're in for a bad surprise.

    What also matters is if the platform has cheapstakes (Android) or spenders (iOS). It doesn't matter if Android has 70% of the market if only 5% of the users buy apps vs iOS with 20% of the market but 40% of the users who buy apps.

    --
    Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
  42. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Belial6 · · Score: 1

    The parent poster is the one that made the claim that there was a correlation/causation relationship. I pointed out that his claim of correlation was exactly the opposite of reality. Given that he claimed that 70% market share is abandonment, his claim is detailed long before we could even get to debating correlation and causation.

  43. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Citizen+of+Earth · · Score: 1

    "If Java had true garbage collection, most programs would delete themselves upon execution."

  44. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Android users are statistically-speaking, much more cost-conscious than iOS users, and also much more likely to be "late adopters". Meanwhile, iPhone 5 sells to people who already own a smart phone, and who don't flinch at wading through a sea of free Androids to shell out two bills for the phone and $80-plus a month for the required service plan. This demographic doesn't flinch at shelling out $0.99 for Fruit Ninja or Angry Birds: Star Wars Edition to get the non-gimped version.

    There is a subset of Android users who are the same - those who spring for the highend RAZRs, Galaxys or Nexus devices - though as you say they are statistically a distinct minority within the Android userbase.

  45. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Correlation is not causation.

    I don't think you understand that concept, the poster you replied to never implied that it did.

    Android is popular because there are cheap Android phones available.

    That statement shows you've fallen to believing correlation is causation (probably again because you don't understand the concept).

  46. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Android is popular because there are cheap Android phones available.

    Correlation is not causation.

  47. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

    The parent poster is the one that made the claim that there was a correlation/causation relationship.

    But a different one. His argument that most desktop and smartphone platforms have abandoned it is one of platform makers and developers making a conscious decision on Java itself. That's a perfectly reasonable argument.

    Your relationship of marketshare of a single platform that has a Java like language to the number of users is obviously bogus. Bogus because the overwhelming majority of their users don't even know what Java is. And because they are making their decision on lots of other factors, chiefly price.

  48. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Belial6 · · Score: 1

    Are you seriously trying to defend the claim that Android has been abandoned by Google and all developers? Because that is what the OP is claiming. The relevance that the platform market share has is that it is impossible that the OP could have missed the existence of Android. That it is obvious that it is still under development, and that there is obviously and army of developers who are writing applications for it. Thus it is clearly not abandoned by the platform maker nor by developers.

  49. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

    Are you seriously trying to defend the claim that Android has been abandoned by Google and all developers? Because that is what the OP is claiming.

    He made no such claim. Nor did I. You're beyond grasping at straws.

  50. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by Belial6 · · Score: 1

    If Java were any good, it would not have been abandoned by every desktop platform and basically every smartphone platform.

  51. Re:Where are you getting this from? Some highschoo by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

    Exactly. That's not what you said.