Fighting TSA Harassment of Disabled Travelers

An anonymous reader writes "A man with a neurological disorder is currently pushing the TSA to release a full list of its policies and procedures after a series of incidents in which he was harassed while trying to fly. His condition requires medical liquids and causes episodic muteness, and the TSA makes his encounters very difficult. From January: 'Boston Logan TSA conducted an illegal search of my xray-cleared documents (probably motivated either by my opting out or by my use of sign language to communicate). They refused to give me access to the pen and paper that I needed to communicate. Eventually they gave it to me, but then they took it away in direct retaliation for my using it to quote US v Davis and protest their illegal search (thereby literally depriving me of speech). They illegally detained me for about an hour on spurious, law enforcement motivated grounds (illegal under Davis, Aukai, Fofana, Bierfeldt, etc). ... TSA has refused to comply with the ADA grievance process; they are over a month beyond the statutory mandate for issuing a written determination.'"

Comments

My answer

[ozmanjusri]

I haven't traveled to the USA.

The exchange rate makes it a reasonable destination, but I don't want to be treated like dirt.

Re:My answer

[thephydes]

Agreed, there are places in the US that I'd like to visit, but frankly I'd prefer to wait for hours in Nairobi (yes I've done that) than have some officious asshole abuse me or my family. Thanks TSA you have really enhanced the world view of your cuntry oops ..... country.

Re:My answer

[Aethedor]

I totally agree. The TSA consists of a bunch of mindless idiots following stupid rules. There is nothing that those TSA idiots did that ever stopped a terrorist attack. The only thing the TSA is good for is wasting money and pissing of Americans and foreigners.

Re:My answer

[_KiTA_]

I totally agree. The TSA consists of a bunch of mindless idiots following stupid rules. There is nothing that those TSA idiots did that ever stopped a terrorist attack. The only thing the TSA is good for is wasting money and pissing of Americans and foreigners.

Wrong.

The modern TSA is a way to legally funnel government funds to contractors in the United States.

In addition, it gives the airlines and government a shield in case anything DOES happen. "Well, we at least TRIED to stop it."

The combination of the two means that it will never stop, and it will never get better.

Re:My answer

[theshowmecanuck]

The U.S. is America.

Re:My answer

[zequav]

Yep. I'm a university professor and have visited USA before (conferences), but I'm not doing it again. Several years ago I decided not to send papers to any conference there.

Re:My answer

[Anonymous Coward]

Already been there two times. I did not feel treated like dirt, but like others airports screening process...

Don't know what "other" airports you have been to, but I have been to airports in both Asia and Europe in the past few years (India, Japan, Germany, UK, etc), and NONE, no even a single one, had a screening process that is even remotely close to TSA.

For the past decade, I refused to travel to the US for the same reason, even though there are quite a few places I would like to visit.

Re:My answer

[umghhh]

tricky this.

Indeed a friend of mine traveling from NL to Mexico with transfer in US was asked to produce transit visa in US (this was in 1998 I believe so even before TSA). He is Polish so the traditional friendship between the great nations of Poland and US cost him hours of stress and missed flight to Mexico. He also needed to buy a new ticket to Mexico and arrange for a new no-US transfer flight back to Europe because he was put on some sort of special list for terrorists and other persona non grata. This was as said before TSA and I see the situation 'improved' a lot since then.

Not sure what does it do except proves that US authorities behave like assholes towards anybody because they can - it certainly does not improve security. I guess US is a federation i.e. there are really progressive states nice to visit and maybe even work but I would never know because at this time even if I personally do not have to have a visa to travel there I would only go if they really pay well say with the rates used when you travel to war zone which is unlikely. Even if they paid well I would consider twice before going. I am considered conservative and pro-US by majority of my friends so go figure.

Re:My answer

[longk]

I did travel to the USA last year and experienced no unfriendliness by TSA officers. Near the end of my trip my visa was extended without hassle so I could complete medical treatment after I had an emergency hospital visit. I was quite impressed and pleased with the US authorities really.

Regardless, do you really make a trip decision based on the few minutes of interaction you may have with the border authorities? I've been traveling extensively the last 7 years and most problems I encounter occur once I'm inside the country, not at the border. I'd rather have someone ask me the purpose of my visit and send me on my way than deal with hotel staff about a broken airco or having to return a rental because they gave me a car where one of the tires needs inflating every 3 days.

Re:My answer

[longk]

Try Schiphol, Amsterdam. I found leaving Amsterdam much more tedious than leaving Dallas (both recent flights.) Same silly body scanners and security procedures but in Dallas I didn't have to wait and staff was reasonably friendly while in Amsterdam the lines were long and staff arrogant. They actually called a little girl stupid for forgetting to remove her water bottle.

More to the point: how can you know the TSA is so horrible if you didn't go there for a decade? I don't want to defend the TSA, I'm sure incidents happen and some airports in the US suck, but I get the feeling most people at many airports experience no real issues.

Finally, I do totally agree with regards to Asian airports. People still treat you like the well paying customer that you are instead of cattle that needs processing. Very refreshing.

Re:My answer

[Runaway1956]

You had a good experience. Either that, or you're more tolerant of invasive scanning, searching, and questioning.

I'm terribly intolerant of being questioned, felt up, irradiated, or justifying my presence and/or my travel plans. Meeting just one asshole who thinks it his right to grope me, or to push me around, or even to be overly disrespectful could cost much, much more than the trip is worth.

I've not flown since before 9/11/01, and probably won't again.

Re:My answer

[Anonymous Coward]

Direct flight to canada, preferably avoiding British Airways and Air Canada, you should be ok with Swish, KLM or Air France (if you come "close" to the US border the Canadian accepted to submit to US flight conditions, so you'd prefer an airline that takes the flights as north as possible.

If you go to South america you will find direct flight to brazil, and for any other south american country use the Argentinian LAN, Buenos aires is quite a good hub, and LAN tries do be cheap (not always the most reliable in timing though, but then ... it's kind of a regional thing).

For Central America you can use Mexico city as an hub, and AeroMexico goes direct from europe to Mexico.

And finaly you can use www.amadeus.net and filter out: all american airlines, and prefer direct flights, this should enable you to find your flight quite easely and even if you might see now and then a share code flight that goes through some US hub, it will be clearly marked, and you'll be able to compare the price difference, and decide if in the faster/cheaper/less hassle criteria one or two trumps three ...

  Cheers, and happy flights

Re:My answer

[heypete]

I'm an American living in Switzerland and fly fairly regularly out of the major Swiss airports (Geneva and Zurich), as well as several other big European airports (London Heathrow, London Gatwick, Frankfurt, etc.). I also fly (or have flown) fairly regularly to/from major US airports (Washington-Dulles, Chicago, Atlanta, the New York airports, Houston, Philadelphia, San Francisco, Los Angeles, etc.

While each country and airport has its own different quirks for airport security and border controls, I've never really had a "bad" screening process with any airport -- including those in the US. The TSA's asked me to go through the nude-o-scope once (every other time has been the standard metal detector), I politely opted-out, they did a quick pat-down, and I was on my way faster than many people who went through the scanner. One time my wristwatch set off the metal detector in Zurich and they gave me a similar pat-down, only it was slightly faster as they weren't explaining exactly what they were going to do like the TSA guy was. Both were of similar degrees of "invasiveness" (that is, not unusually invasive for a standard pat-down search). The screening of carry-on luggage has been pretty much the same for decades and hasn't given me any hassle.

Even when taking unusual electronics in carryon luggage, such as scientific equipment to Oman, there hasn't been any issues.

The only difference I've noticed between the US and European screening is that the Europeans don't require that I take off my shoes. A minor thing and something I find fairly stupid, but hardly the end of the world.

To me, the big difference is at border checkpoints: the Swiss checkpoints are, as you might expect, quick and efficient. The British seem to hire cheerful, pleasant people to staff their checkpoints and I've never had any issues with them at all. Lines have been minimal, even leading up to the Olympics.

The American customs and border patrol people are dressed like street cops (including body armor) at the checkpoint. They routinely have drug-sniffing dogs and will randomly pull people out of line for additional searches. Even as a US citizen, they scrutinize my passport as if it were a fine work of art and take a moderate amount of time to do so. Evidently non-citizens from visa-waiver countries need to do some pre-travel background check online that costs $15 or so (but is good for 5 years), get fingerprinted, and have their photo taken. That's definitely a hassle and I think it's unnecessary and way more uptight than the European passport control process. Still, the whole process takes just a few minutes and you only need to go through it at the border; once inside the country it's not an issue.

Re:My answer

[purnima]

I'm an Arab professor. I look like an Arab and have an accent. I travel to the US all the time. Aside from my experiences in 2002, I have never had a problem getting into the US for conferences. The TSA/border control people are always very nice and polite. Maybe I've been lucky.

Re:My answer

[Culture20]

And Germany likes to call its country Deustchland. People who don't want to cause waves when speaking German say Deustchland, not "Germany". In America, North America is a continent, South America is a continent, "the Americas" refers to both, and "America" is a shortened name for the United States of America, just like "China" is short for People's Republic of China. If you don't want to be confused when discussing America with an American, learn this instead of insisting their entire country is wrong for what they call their own country.

Re:My answer

[radio4fan]

I love visiting the US, but almost every time I've been put off by the unpleasant and agressive attitude of the people on the immigration desk. In my view they're much worse than the TSA on departure.

I'll put up with being photographed and fingerprinted (though I think it's downright daft), but my experience at immigration last time just took the piss.

I had made some trivial omission on my visa waiver form — I probably forgot to tick the box to say that I wasn't a spy, saboteur or Nazi war criminal (yes, this tick box really exists) — and I amended the form right there in two seconds, but the officious drone showed great pleasure in sending me to the back of the long queue like a naughty schoolboy.

Then when I got to the front of the queue again — this time to a different drone — I was accused of "abusing the visa waiver" because I had the temerity to visit the US twice in one year (once to San Francisco, that time to NYC, both fairly long visits). It was insinuated that I wasn't welcome back for some — unspecified — period of time. The visa waiver FAQ specifically states that there are no limits to the number of visits in any given period of time.

I guess the government is only interested in promoting tourism when it means handing out billions of dollars to the airlines.

I decided at the time that I would never go back to the US, but time heals all wounds and I'm starting to think I can put up with the necessary humiliation again.

As absolutely everybody else I've met in person in the US has been smart, funny and friendly I can only assume that all your assholes work in airports.

Re:My answer

[N1AK]

Surely the point is equally true in reverse? When using an internationally frequented forum don't assume people are using the US 'definition' of America or that they are obligated to do so to be polite. Your point about German isn't really relevant as we're not speaking 'American' in the USA; we're speaking English on a forum used by people from dozens, or probably hundreds, of countries.

Re:My answer

[Lumpy]

In the USA they hire morons and idiots to work for thew TSA. none of them have any Law enforcement background and are nothing more than minimum wage private store cops that have been given far more power than they should have.

Re:My answer

[fustakrakich]

Just flash your two digit UID. You'll whiz right through.

Re:My answer

[LVSlushdat]

HERE! HERE!! I was gonna mod you up but I decided to comment instead...

I disapprove of everything the TSA does. What they seem to do, more than anything, is to indoctrinate people into being docile toward people in uniform. I'm not a docile individual. Security theater is revolting, and I refuse to participate in any way.

ANYbody who puts up with being groped by the TSA is either a sheep, or is so desperate to get somewhere in a hurry that they ignore the fact that an abortion like the TSA (or the IRS also, for that matter) has NO business in an .. allegedly free .. country like the United States. The tactics these organizations (and MANY others in todays "government") use have NO basis in the Constitution and are sickening to anyone who loves this country and detests where it is headed.. I'm a 63 y/o Vietnam veteran and the last time I flew was in Sept 2003, and based on that experience, I've clearly concluded I'm done with flying on commercial airlines.. My experience was, admittedly, not as bad as the horror stories I've read since then, but it was enough to show me that I'm not going to tolerate ANY abuse from people who have no business in a police-like uniforn, and rather should be peddling hamburgers at McDonalds.. Everytime I hear of someone standing up to these thugs, I feel there may still be *some* hope for America.

Runaway1956, I salute you!!!

Re:My answer

[ceoyoyo]

I was offered a job in Philadelphia. I turned it down. I also try not to submit to conferences in the US.

I have a common name. There have been several people with my name over the last fifteen years that the US would like to chat with, but the current one seems particularly scary. Generally my crossing the US border goes like this:

Customs: Where are you going? What are you going to do there? Oh shit! You, over there!

After that I usually get interviewed for an hour or so and then they let me go. That applies to transits through the US too, so I have to be careful when booking connecting flights.

Once recently I was driving across the border and ended up getting handcuffed on the hood of my car with thirteen freaked out border guards pointing their guns at me. Then I was hauled off to an isolation cell (left in handcuffs, handcuffs cuffed to the bench). After about half an hour a border guard walked in, said "you aren't black, are you?" and after fingerprinting let me go.

The TSA themselves are pussycats. They seem to be limited to hand searching my bags and I (up to five separate times before boarding a flight).

Yes, I have lots of redress numbers. One customs agent actually read my whole file once and remarked on it. Then said they were still going to want to see me in the special room anyway (she didn't bother to escort me there).

I try not to go to the US, unless I'm with someone I want to scare the hell out of.

Re:My answer

[theshowmecanuck]

First will someone please mod my first comment from this thread up out of the cellar. It shouldn't be modded down for correcting an untruth. Now to correct another person's untruth.

I am Canadian. I live in North America. I like America and most Americans but not always the governments. I am NOT American. I am Canadian. Get that through your head. And every single Canadian will say the same thing about themselves and Americans (except the idiots who think the War of 1812 is still ongoing). The whole is called 'The Americas'. Note the 's' at the end. Come to Canada and call someone American. If the aren't a tourist visiting from America, you will be flamed to your face. Most Canadians don't have a problem with Americans, and most like the country (but maybe not the governments). But it is like calling an Austrian a German because they both speak German. You will not be received favourably.

So here is your corrected geography lesson as you seem to be horribly confused and/or misinformed. In the north part of The AmericaS, is North America. It is divided into three countries: Canada, The United States of America (also known as 'America'... no 's' at the end), and Mexico. Canadians and Mexicans (who, when they are speaking English) use the terms, Canadian for Canadians, Mexican for Mexicans, and Americans for Americans, the latter of which are people who come from the United States of America. We do not call them 'United States of Americans'.

Mind you, you might just be the troll that others are accusing me of.

Re:My answer

[rthille]

Where the hell were you from 2003-2009?

Re:My answer

[AK Marc]

That's true - the Spanish speakers.

What gets me is The United States of Mexico is referred to simply as "Mexico" and nobody has an issue. Someone from there is "Mexican", again no issues. But repeat with USA, and everyone is in an uproar. The *only* consistent usage is to distinguish between America and "the Americas" (As your dictionary definition indicates "the Americas" is different).

Re:Yawn

[Ultra64]

Yeah, where does he get off having a neurological condition rendering him unable to speak?

That bastard.

Re:Yawn

[docmordin]

I'm normally not one for coarse language and insults, but, given that the atypical neurogenic tic disorder that the individual suffers from can lead to both life-threatening asphyxia and tachycardia, I would have to say that you are a massively apathetic twat. I hope that you never become afflicted by any debilitating condition, let alone wind up in a similar situation and encounter someone insouciant who denies you access to medicine or necessary sustenance, as I doubt you'd have the fortitude to stand up to your ilk.

Fortunately, your pococurante attitude served some purpose beyond broadcasting your own inadequacies: it spurred me to pledge several thousand dollars for this guy's legal fund.

So do something about it.

[Anonymous Coward]

This is what I don't get about people these days.

None of you are willing to sacrifice ANYTHING or inflict ANY kind of inconvenience upon yourself to deal with the issues that need to be dealt with. You just sit there and whine and complain about everything, you make up excuses from thin air and say you've got no choice. Well, news flash, you do.

You want to get rid of the TSA?

Don't fly.

It's that simple. No, don't tell me you have to. You don't. You get enough people together and you all refuse to fly until the TSA is dismantled, and you know what'll happen? The airlines will get things changed in a hurry and the TSA will evaporate in a puff of invalid logic. It's that simple!

"Oh but it isn't and I have no choice and I need to fly and-"...

Yeah, that right there, that's the reason why the TSA still exists. You're unwilling to inconvenience yourself. None of you are. So the TSA will continue to inconvenience you instead, because they've got you by the balls (sometimes literally) and they know it. They'll continue to squeeze and squeeze, they'll expand out into the rest of the world like a cancerous tumour and then, when you find yourself in a police state and the TSA controls all major forms of travel- you'll wonder why you didn't do something sooner.

The fact that you think you have no choice is precisely what they want you to think, because that is what gives them control over you.

Cue the endless stream of "I have to fly, you're wrong, if I wish really hard I'm sure the TSA will go away all the same" replies.

Re:So do something about it.

[skiminki]

You want to get rid of the TSA?

Don't fly.

It's that simple.

No it's not. TSA is expanding to provide its services outside airports. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christopher-elliott/the-tsa-wants-to-be-every_b_2393332.html

War on Diginity

[Jah-Wren Ryel]

The TSA says they are all about the war on terror.
But their actions prove they are only interested in conducting a War on Diginity.

Groping children
soaking a man in his own urine
Arresting people for wearing watches with exposed gears
Arbitrary strip-searches
Detaining people armed with flash cards
Forcing mothers to drink their own breast milk
Forcing a woman to remove her nipple ring with pliers
Requiring women to remove their bras
Requiring a woman to remove the brace on her sprained ankle and then making her walk on it to prove it was sprained

The list of abuses is into the thousands. Every once in a while they get a taste of their stupidity. But it isn't anywhere near enough.

OP here.

[saizai]

I've tried to address some of the questions people raised @ http://saizai.com/tsa#FAQ If you have more, please add them as responses to this. I don't guarantee I'll answer 'em all individually, but I'll try to make sure the FAQ addresses all substantive issues raised. Cheers, Sai

Time for a Bivens lawsuit

[coats]

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bivens . Basically, in cases of denial of Constitutional rights, the doctrine of sovereign immunity does not apply, and the individual bureaucrats can be held individually responsible. You might think of it as the "Nuremberg War Crimes" clause in US law...

He ought to sue those persons responsible, as individuals. Going all the way to the top. IMNHO, there is more than cause for him to do so. And he certainly has standing...

A few multi-million-dollar judgements against individual TSA agents and managers would do a lot pour encourager les autres.

Re:An important lesson

[Paleolibertarian]

The first and last time I encountered the TSA (Toadlike Stupid Assholes) was a bad experience which I won't detail, so I no longer fly commercial. I drive wherever I go which could be a 3,200 mile round-trip to visit relatives. It takes about 2.5 days both ways out of my vacation time but I do get to see a lot of pretty country on the trip. I no longer need to put up with Toadlike Stupid Assholes wanting to question me and look in my luggage and feel my junk. I also miss out on the travel time to-from airports (at LAX it's very stressful) and I don't have to eat airport/jet plane food or listen to kids crying etc... etc...

The TSA is just one of the many violations of my god-given rights some of which are enumerated in the Bill of Rights. What really saddens me however is the sheep-like response of the majority of the public in putting up with these violations. Every time some government jack-booted thug violates a citizens rights the citizen should protest loudly to whoever will listen. But instead most of the sheeple will either knuckle under and go along to get along and be thankful he wasn't beaten or shot to death. When it happens to somebody else the sheeple sometimes laugh and make fun of the poor soul who is now in the hospital or morgue because he dared to open his mouth and protest or resisted (in the mind of the thug anyway) even slightly.

Yes. In many ways we live in a totalitarian police state. The fact that sheeple deny it is because they were mostly educated in a government school and raised by their parent sheeples. Few are the scholars who know what life would be like if the Bill of Rights were strictly enforced by placing every government thug on trial for rights violations and the agency he works for to be civilly liable for monetary damages.

http://www.ncc-1776.org/

An old joke

[spaceyhackerlady]

Reminds me of the old joke:

Q: What's the best way to tell the difference between a Canadian and an American?

A: Casually comment that there isn't any.

...laura, proudly Canadian