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Ouya Performance Not Particularly Exciting

hypnosec writes "Results of recent benchmark tests reveal that Ouya is not up to the mark and there are over 70 other ARM devices that perform better than the gaming console. Futuremark, which is known for its benchmarks like 3DMark and PCMark, benchmarked mobile devices and the Tegra 3 powered Ouya has been ranked 73rd." Of course, most of the those devices cost a lot more than $100 without carrier subsidies.

305 comments

  1. It's about content not specs. by ninlilizi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As the early Nintendo days can attest.

    1. Re:It's about content not specs. by ButchDeLoria · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This. Sadly, I personally don't think that Ouya content is going to be able to carry it though.

    2. Re:It's about content not specs. by blackicye · · Score: 1

      As the early Nintendo days can attest.

      The difference was in the early days the market wasn't so competitive (saturated.)

      Why choose one of the two when you can have both content _and_ hardware?

    3. Re:It's about content not specs. by exomondo · · Score: 1

      As the early Nintendo days can attest.

      We always hear about the stifling of the industry because game developers are going after the lowest common denominator in the current crop of consoles rather than exploiting hardware advancements, Ouya could well do the same in the Android game space. It's not all about graphics but for a non-portable gaming device you want it to be fairly capable.

    4. Re:It's about content not specs. by TechieRefugee · · Score: 1

      But but but- blast processing! And doing what Nintendoesn't!

    5. Re:It's about content not specs. by flyneye · · Score: 1

      Compare and contrast Ouja and Ouya.
      Successes, failures, popularity,cost

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    6. Re:It's about content not specs. by MBGMorden · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Early Nintendo days? For the first half of its history Nintendo hardware generally outclassed its competitors. NES was a LOT better than than the Sega MasterSystem. SNES make Genesis look downright feeble, and despite their decision to stick to cartridges, N64 was far more capable than PSX or the Saturn from the standpoint of processing power. Heck even Gamecube was in many ways superior to PS2 and Xbox.

      Nintendo's whole "quality content on inferior hardware" dance really only started on the Wii.

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    7. Re:It's about content not specs. by jxander · · Score: 3, Insightful

      One : Because hardware tends to kill content.

      Devs these days are more concerned about rendering amazing graphics, and epic cut scenes, and *hey put down the controller you're screwing up all my hard work... just sit there and watch the awesome happen. When the cutscene is over you can walk down the hallway to the next cutscene.* Video games used to be a method to tell stories, now all the time and budget for narrative has gone by the wayside in order to cram more pixels into each frame. Plus, there's only so much real estate on physical media. Bluray is, what, 25 - 50 GB. And the aforementioned cut scenes take a lot of room, so instead of 50+ hour epics, we get a lot of 10-hour quickies, for the same price. (just plowed through dishonored over the weekend, hard mode, "Clean Hands," 9 hours)

      And two : Because right now, that really isn't a choice.

      XBox and PS3 are mostly focused on annual franchises that are near sure-fire hits : Battlefield, Modern Warfare, Call of Duty, Madden, FIFA, Halo, etc. Release a new game each year with Title n+1, same graphics, add a few bells and whistles, maybe a new map or two, and you're printing money. WiiU has a grand total of like 2 games that aren't Dance or Party games (or dance-party games)

      Asking for both is even less of an option when you factor in the $100 mark. Less than 1/3 the price of a current iPod Touch. This is a toy, at the moment. A playground for developers to see what they can do, and for people to run old emulators, XBMC or whatever else they can think up. If it catches on, and sw devs enjoy it, maybe it'll pick up steam and release a more powerful version... Time will tell. At the very least, it's nice to see someone else trying.

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    8. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

      Devs these days are more concerned about rendering amazing graphics, and epic cut scenes, and *hey put down the controller you're screwing up all my hard work... just sit there and watch the awesome happen. When the cutscene is over you can walk down the hallway to the next cutscene.* Video games used to be a method to tell stories, now all the time and budget for narrative has gone by the wayside in order to cram more pixels into each frame. Plus, there's only so much real estate on physical media. Bluray is, what, 25 - 50 GB. And the aforementioned cut scenes take a lot of room, so instead of 50+ hour epics, we get a lot of 10-hour quickies, for the same price. (just plowed through dishonored over the weekend, hard mode, "Clean Hands," 9 hours)

      yes yes, everything these days is worse than whatever you had (unspecified) in your childhood, everything kids have these days is mindless and derivative, herp derp.

    9. Re:It's about content not specs. by shentino · · Score: 1

      There's always time for the next version of the Ouya.

      I imagine that they'll pay attention to feedback so they know which areas to beef up.

      Do you think they were using Gamecube grade hardware in the NES?

    10. Re:It's about content not specs. by edxwelch · · Score: 2

      fair enough, but consider that no games for Ouya will have dynamic shadows. That's because Tegra does not support shadow mapping

    11. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nintendo hardware generally outclassed its competitors. NES was a LOT better than than the Sega MasterSystem

      The NES may have been more popular but the Master System had better hardware.

    12. Re:It's about content not specs. by Dripdry · · Score: 1

      Shame on you!
      http://www.gamepilgrimage.com/content/sega-master-system-vs-nintendo-entertainment-system
      Nintendo hardware wasn't even close to better than the SMS. A cursory look at the specs will tell you that. The SMS had more processing power, better graphics and sound.

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    13. Re:It's about content not specs. by Dripdry · · Score: 4, Funny

      And no Oxford Comma, apparently.

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    14. Re:It's about content not specs. by Hamsterdan · · Score: 2

      Nope. The Master System had 8 times the video ram, 4 times the ram, and a much faster CPU.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_(third_generation)#Comparison

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    15. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As other AC said, the master system was at least slightly ahead of the NES.

      The SNES ended up better, but the genius of that design was the ability to put powerful co-processors on the cartridge. Sega had to add other hardware through an aux port, and then their additions also kind of sucked (32x and SegaCD).

    16. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well not usually worse. Often not better. Unless you're just using how pretty it looks as your only standard.

    17. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Did you just make this stuff up...oh, it's an OPINION thinly veiled as fact. And it's wrong.

    18. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mostly wrong.
      The Famicom/NES was a pretty crap system with a lot of oddball hardware and very little ram. It relied on extensible hardware inside each cartridge to overcome a lot of it's shortcomings. (It's also why NES emulation is a PITA - You have to emulate the types of cart hardware too)

      The MK3/SMS was technically a much better system. More memory, COTS parts, faster, more standard Z80 CPU, a real sound chip, etc. It was lightyears easier to program for and the carts were cheaper to make.

      The trouble is Sega sucked at marketing, and the hardware suffered from too many strange overlapping features. Nintendo was actually quite good at getting good titles marketed and in to the hands of players.

      The Megadrive/genisis and Super Famicom/SNES was a different story. The genisis was again a simple COTS systems, z80 coprocessor (for SMS backwards compatibility, but could be used by newer games. Was often used to run the background music) standard 68k cpu, standard sound chip, etc. It was easy to program for.

      The SNES was again full of a lot of really oddball hardware, but this time it was a lot of custom stuff designed by nintendo and it really was a better system. It also had a much cleaner video signal output. While again more difficult to program for you could get a lot of really great looking graphics if you used all of it's video capabilities properly.

      The n64 is was really an odd system too. Considered by many to be a failure in a lot of ways due to some really bad design choices. The CPU and graphic hardware was hobbled through a really slow bus. The carts did not provide much space for textures, but the system could not support large textures anyway due to the previously mentioned bus flaws. The CPU was also inappropriate, designed more for SGI workstations than game consoles. (Whole lot of silicon wasted on a high precision FPU when really fast integer performance is what is needed for a console)

    19. Re:It's about content not specs. by tepples · · Score: 4, Informative

      The Master System had 8 times the video ram

      True, but that's because the NES was designed to use video ROM or RAM in the cartridge. Plug Videomation into your NES and there's more video RAM than the SMS. Tile animation effects, such as the spinning ? blocks and spinning coins in SMB3, could be made much more elaborate in NES games whose mapper chip supported paged video ROM.

      4 times the ram

      This I'll give you: NES games with a highly destructible environment (such as SMB3) needed to have extra working memory on the cartridge at $6000-$7FFF. But games with a battery save feature often got this for free, as they could dedicate about half a KiB to battery save and the rest to expanded working memory.

      a much faster CPU

      Let me guess: You fell for the megahertz myth in the Pentium 4 days. A 6502 CPU has about twice the IPC of a Z80.

    20. Re:It's about content not specs. by Black+LED · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The ratio of good games to bad games is probably the same as it's always been. Don't tell me you've forgotten about the LOADS of absolute garbage games on older systems.

    21. Re:It's about content not specs. by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

      > Devs these days are more concerned about rendering amazing graphics, and epic cut scenes

      Oblg. FPS map design: 1993 vs 2010
      http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17f0o4rihl081gif/original.gif

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    22. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sega had the Sega Virtua Processor. It was only used in the Mega Drive cartridge for Virtua Racing, but it shows that having coprocessors on cart was not a SNES only thing.

    23. Re:It's about content not specs. by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      You are trying to compare the N64 to the *Saturn*? The Saturn was 2 years older than the N64. You might as well compare the N64 to the Dreamcast, since there is a 2 year difference, there, too. Same with the SNES and the Genesis, the SNES was two years newer.

      None of these comparisons mean much. The SEGA/Nintendo battles of the 80's/90's were about one company leapfrogging the other every couple years. Of course you can pick any two consoles and one has better specs, that was the point.

    24. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Funny how PlayStation games looked a lot better than N64 games. N64 suffered from tiny textures that were either glaringly repeated or stretched out to a blurry mess. PlayStation textures looked a lot more detailed.

      I think the PlayStation had better ability to handle lighting too. Take a look at the Colony Wars games.

    25. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It may not support a specific method of doing dynamic shadows, but it certainly can handle them

      Glowball looks great on my Nexus 7.

    26. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As the early Nintendo days can attest.

      That was a god damn gaming machine marketed as one, sold in stores all across the world and had software support from dozens of game makers, had advertising on television around the world, had a magazine devoted to it, legions of fans and broke new ground for home gaming that revolutionized the industry.

      What that has to do with a little block that runs android on your is beyond me. Ouya isn't about having content on it you dolt, its about being able to hack it yourself and do stuff with it. If you actually think ouya is going to succeed because of content on it you are fooling yourself. No one is going to buy it for buying games on and such.

    27. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I especially loved all of those open world, sandbox style games from 1993....oh wait.

    28. Re:It's about content not specs. by hjf · · Score: 2

      and in terms of garbage games, the PS2 is the king.

      i mean how many japanese date games can you have (hint: over half their catalog, or about 10000 games is exactly that)

    29. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      just -early- nintendo days?

      every nintendo console has had weak specs.

      and every nintendo console was either made or broken by the quality of its content.

      see the current wii U which is the biggest failure in nintendo's history due to their selfish content-free release.

    30. Re:It's about content not specs. by Hamsterdan · · Score: 1

      I know about IPC :) . I'll give you the 6502 was faster clock-per-clock than a Z80.

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    31. Re:It's about content not specs. by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      The only thing they did wrong was trying to build their own controller. There are lots of them out there and Bluetooth is as common as mud. If they had saved themselves the expenses and had sold the console at 70 bucks without a controller they would have saved themselves a lot of trouble.

      Building a sturdy controller is an art and fiendishly expensive. You can only make that up in numbers. And even if you built a very good controller it still wouldn't be good for everybody since hands vary quite a lot in size. PS3 controllers for instance are far too small for my gigantic mitts.

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    32. Re:It's about content not specs. by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 0

      Shame then it has completely failed on content which was expected when you force a free to play model on people.

    33. Re:It's about content not specs. by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      The GP has a point. I've played a lot of AAA games where the actual gameplay gets in the way of an impressive 15 minute cutscene. Those are fiendishly expensive to create and they add nothing to the actual game apart from the occasional "Press X to win". It is as if the game devs have forgotten how to tell a story within actual gameplay.

      And let's not talk about the latest murder simulator with attached Sim City knockoff and a naval warfare simulator thrown in for good measure. Those tend to be not very good at either the things they do. If I want to build stuff I get one of the older Sim City installments. If I want to do naval battles I will get a simulator for that. If I buy a murder simulator I want to stabby-stabby and am not interested about their barbecue-defense simulator they have thrown in for good measure.

      To my horror they added Superman64 gameplay into Arkham City. And oh wonder! The gameplay for those sequences was just as bad as the thing they copied it from. And that was one of the more logical mini games added to a AAA title in recent memory.

      They try to build AAA games into theme parks but you buy them for a single ride. Which makes most of the stuff they threw in superfluous. The cutscenes get in the way of stabby-stabby. And they do cost too much.

      AAA games are on their way out. We will not be flooded with them as we have been in the past since a lot of them do not recoup their production cost even at double-digit millions of sales. The market does not sustain them all. Which is one reason why EA hasn't been making money in the past.

      And don't get me started on modern manshooters where you get executed for not triggering the next cutscene if you go over there. That's taking the cutscene dictatorship to the next level.

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    34. Re:It's about content not specs. by ildon · · Score: 2

      It sure is. And the Ouya ain't got shit.

    35. Re:It's about content not specs. by Waccoon · · Score: 1

      Nintendo always had different release schedules than their competitors. It's easy to release a superior platform if it's launched with hardware a couple years newer.

    36. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I find that better than half of their games being about gratuitous ultraviolence. But then, maybe in your culture killing people is rewarded and enjoying love and relationships is frowned upon.

    37. Re:It's about content not specs. by ThirdPrize · · Score: 2

      Isn't the article rather missing the point? Does the average Android game really require more power? How many cores do you really need to play Angry Birds? I guess the hardest thing it is ever going to do is play 1080 video and I suspect the chipset is already optimised for that.

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    38. Re:It's about content not specs. by dywolf · · Score: 1

      They compared a device to other devices that it's not really meant to be compared against. I mean seriously, it's in the very first paragraph: "better off buying a high end smartphone" ...

      really? I want a game console, but this one is slower than a smartphone so i should buy a smart phone instead? How does that make any sense?

      Oh I know, I'm in the market for a new truck for work, so let me compare it against these Vespas first...

      Just more useless clickbait.

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    39. Re:It's about content not specs. by dywolf · · Score: 1

      They compared a device to other devices that it's not really meant to be compared against. I mean seriously, it's in the very first paragraph: "better off buying a high end smartphone" ... really? I want a game console, but this one is slower than a smartphone so i should buy a smart phone instead? How does that make any sense?

      Oh I know, I'm in the market for a new truck for work, so let me compare it against these Vespas first...

      And this before there's even any usable content on the device yet!
      Just more useless clickbait.

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    40. Re:It's about content not specs. by The_Revelation · · Score: 1

      Very true, however, Nintendo may have had a few things going for it:
      * Well known IP
      * Instalments in popular series
      * a unique interface

      Additionally, the Wii was berated by supporters of the competition for being underpowered... the very kinds of systems that this seems to be emulating given the form factor of the controller.

      And if its for playing emulated titles, wouldn't you provide a more emulator friendly controller? Something that looked like a SNES or an Arcade controller? Maybe a cool bit of tech modders could use, like an Mattel's RF Reader/Writer? A cool RF gun? No, maybe some crappy capacitive track-pad, because those feel great to use, said nobody who has used a notebook in the past 25 years.

    41. Re:It's about content not specs. by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      maybe in your culture killing people is rewarded and enjoying love and relationships is frowned upon

      Maybe in our culture we know the difference between a game and real life.

      Hint: I don't want to play a game about taking a shit or going to work in a burger bar for 10 hours.

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    42. Re:It's about content not specs. by Hatta · · Score: 1

      SNES make Genesis look downright feeble

      Please. Compare Sonic 3 or Thunderforce IV to anything on the SNES. The SNES had two things going for it over the Genesis. Mode 7 graphics, and a DSP. But Mode 7 was a gimmick, useful at best for cutscenes and backgrounds. And I really like the clean FM synth sound the Genesis has over the muddy low res polyphonies the SNES tries to pull off.

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    43. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hint: I don't want to play a game about taking a shit or going to work in a burger bar for 10 hours.

      The topic was about Japanese dating games... are you saying that's what your dates involve?

    44. Re:It's about content not specs. by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      This. Sadly, I personally don't think that Ouya content is going to be able to carry it though.

      As long as it can run some flavor of MAME, that's all you need. Stick in a USB hard drive full of ROMs and really, you're pretty much set content-wise. Full controller action and big screen arcades, what more do you need?

    45. Re:It's about content not specs. by edxwelch · · Score: 1

      There maybe some hack to get it working, but how well does it perform?

    46. Re:It's about content not specs. by jxander · · Score: 1

      Very true, and I've not forgotten.

      But now the tripe is better disguised behind shiny graphics, amusing rag-doll physics and multimillion dollar marketing campaigns. Meanwhile, the good and unique games are discarded because they don't carry the N+1 title scheme of an established franchise that's been floating on the reputation of 1 well done game many many years ago. Spec Ops : The Line was brilliant cutting satire of the whole genre, meanwhile CODBLOPS, ME3 and every Halo since, well ... since Halo 1, have been getting worse and worse. Poor writing, terrible pacing, over-reliance on cut scenes, and microtransactions required to actually play the full game. Oh, you paid $60 and thought that was it? HA. Now go buy a coke for a code you can redeem for more bullets, and pre-purchase at this store or that to get a better gun, and then drop another $10 for day 1 DLC ...

      That's the main reason I'm looking forward to Ouya, and others like it. Sure there will be garbage, there will always be shovelware looking for an easy buck ... but hopefully the good games will actually stand out and be rewarded for their efforts. That, and I just want to play FF6 (3) again. ;)

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    47. Re:It's about content not specs. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pretty well on my Nexus 7. Looks great and it's smooth, if that's what you mean.

      If you have a Tegra 3 device, try it out. It's a free Nvidia demo showing off dynamic lighting and physics basically.

      Here is an old video showing it off on non-final hardware (the narrator claims production chips are 25-30% faster).

    48. Re:It's about content not specs. by edxwelch · · Score: 1

      If you're talking about the workaround to render depth to a RGBA texture, that's definatly going to perform slower, because it has an extra 2 steps in the shader

    49. Re:It's about content not specs. by benhattman · · Score: 1

      No it's not. The difference is publishing costs. It used to be that it cost serious money to publish even a garbage game. You'd have to get licensed from Nintendo or Sony or Sega or whoever. Now, you can distribute an absolutely terrible game through Apple or Google stores for essentially nothing.

      However, if you look at only consoles, you're probably right. The ratio of great to garbage on the old NES was probably pretty similar to the PS3.

    50. Re:It's about content not specs. by Black+LED · · Score: 1

      The only place that a publisher was necessary was on consoles, so I'm not sure what you are talking about.

    51. Re:It's about content not specs. by hjf · · Score: 1

      Those date sims include dating children, and they even have manga and video games about child rape ("lolicon"), murder ("guro"), and even books of photos of little girls in bikinis ("U-15 idols", U meaning UNDER and 15 meaning 15yo.) amazon.co.jp and search U-15 if you don't believe. And try U-12 if you want to be shocked even more. BTW: There's also U-3.

      So yeah, I'm not saying either extreme is better.

  2. And... by josephtd · · Score: 1

    Many of those devices are also self contained computers with everything you need to use them included at that price. Not making a dumb comparison, just pointing out that there are flaws in the reasoning behind the last sentence of TFS.

    1. Re:And... by hawguy · · Score: 1

      Many of those devices are also self contained computers with everything you need to use them included at that price. Not making a dumb comparison, just pointing out that there are flaws in the reasoning behind the last sentence of TFS.

      So you're saying that a much different device at a much different price point has much different performance?

    2. Re:And... by Synerg1y · · Score: 1

      Speaking of price comparisons:

      Ouya: $99
      Samsung Galaxy S3: $699

      what'd the author of TFA expect? Something for nothing?

    3. Re:And... by Synerg1y · · Score: 1

      It's about 1/2 the performance of the top rate device, but I somehow feel that it's probably running a less overhead than a phone has to.

      Funny thing about 3dmark though... it doesn't score my PC very high, yet I play just about everything at 1920x1080 ultra/high settings with no lag and I'm not running an elegant cooling solution, so basically... in short... I think WEI has more merit.

    4. Re:And... by bloodhawk · · Score: 1

      well arguably an Ouya can't replace a Samsung Galaxy S3, while an S3 does most everything an ouya can do as well as being a day to day device that you use for practical purposes. Not saying it is a good argument, but price difference here is irrelevant when an Ouya can't actually replace the device in question.

    5. Re:And... by dagamer34 · · Score: 3, Informative

      The raw part cost of a smartphone SoC is a tiny portion of the bill of materials (BOM), maybe 10-15%. CPU is maybe $30 at the very high end? So for a box like the OUYA where the CPU is probably the biggest cost and they don't have to worry about a display, camera, battery, cellular radios, or massive amounts of storage, they probably could have sprung for a Snapdragon 600 or Tegra 4. Only thing is it would have delayed the product by 6 months since those chips are in high demand from smartphone OEMs. Take a look at this cost breakdown analysis of the GS4: http://www.isuppli.com/Teardowns/News/Pages/Samsung-Galaxy-S4-Carries-236-Bill-of-Materials-IHS-iSuppli-Virtual-Teardown-Reveals.aspx $236 worth of parts selling for $699 just shows you how things are roughly priced (granted, MSRP - BOM != profit, but Samsung is in a pretty good position). Also you'll learn the biggest conspiracy of smartphones ever: it does NOT cost $100 to go from 16GB NAND to 32GB, or 32->64, or 64->128.

    6. Re:And... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      The thing that pisses me off is that it won't fit in my pocket very well.

      Plus every time I make a phone call I have to find an outlet.

    7. Re:And... by obarthelemy · · Score: 1
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    8. Re:And... by citizenr · · Score: 1

      http://www.laptopmag.com/review/stick-computers/android-mini-pc-rk3066.aspx

      rk3066 based android minipc $55, ranked 2 places Higher than Ouya on TFAs 3dmark list.

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    9. Re:And... by Enderandrew · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The OUYA is a self-contained computer. It is only missing a display.

      You also have to consider that an OUYA with a controller is $100, and that a controller by itself is $50. So this is basically a $50 self-contained computer. I expect the performance to match/or exceed that of other $50 self-contained computers.

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    10. Re:And... by Shoten · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The raw part cost of a smartphone SoC is a tiny portion of the bill of materials (BOM), maybe 10-15%. CPU is maybe $30 at the very high end? So for a box like the OUYA where the CPU is probably the biggest cost and they don't have to worry about a display, camera, battery, cellular radios, or massive amounts of storage, they probably could have sprung for a Snapdragon 600 or Tegra 4. Only thing is it would have delayed the product by 6 months since those chips are in high demand from smartphone OEMs.

      Take a look at this cost breakdown analysis of the GS4: http://www.isuppli.com/Teardowns/News/Pages/Samsung-Galaxy-S4-Carries-236-Bill-of-Materials-IHS-iSuppli-Virtual-Teardown-Reveals.aspx $236 worth of parts selling for $699 just shows you how things are roughly priced (granted, MSRP - BOM != profit, but Samsung is in a pretty good position). Also you'll learn the biggest conspiracy of smartphones ever: it does NOT cost $100 to go from 16GB NAND to 32GB, or 32->64, or 64->128.

      Yes, but what you're forgetting about is the opportunity cost. If you can make a $100 device that competes equally with a $300 device simply by lowering your profit margin, that's not the whole picture. To design and start producing that device, you need funding. That capital typically comes from people who want a return on their investment, and lower risk. The smaller your profit margin, the closer you are to not being profitable at all if you miscalculated, incorrectly estimated, or failed to account for something. And even if you hit exactly your intended margin, you still end up providing a lower return on investment than if you had charged more...or, in this case, if you lower the hardware costs. Also, keep in mind that a $5 hardware cost difference matters less, profit-wise, on a $300 device than it does on a $100 device.

      Hardware isn't designed and built in a vacuum; these things happen in the context of a business, as well as in the context of an entire industry.

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    11. Re:And... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ouya still beats that but there are sticks like that that beat out the Ouya that either use the i.mx.6 or the RK3166.

    12. Re:And... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Okay, so you delay release to wait for sufficient Tegra 4 availability. And when it finally releases, it gets criticized for being slower than the the Tegra 5...

    13. Re:And... by Black+LED · · Score: 1

      An Xbox 360 controller would be around $40-$50 on top of that. Might as well just get the Ouya, which has better specs anyhow.

    14. Re:And... by Patch86 · · Score: 1

      Without a controller. Add $50 for a controller and the Ouya is the cheaper of the two. And the Ouya controller is a fancy one with a built-in touch pad- not easy to buy on the open market.

    15. Re:And... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The problem though is instead of competing with the $200 consoles out there, they have produced a subpar cheap console that neither competes well with the full mainstream consoles and is even a hard sell in the android space. profit margin is only useful if you can get the sales volume and with the performance and platform that is really in question.

    16. Re:And... by citizenr · · Score: 1

      Ouya is slower than this noname chinese stick.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    17. Re:And... by Hatta · · Score: 1

      The OUYA is a self-contained computer. It is only missing a display.

      And BASIC in ROM.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    18. Re:And... by Black+LED · · Score: 1

      Citation needed.

      Ouya uses a quad core Cortex A9 @ 1.7GHz and the MK808B uses a dual core Cortex A9 @ 1.6GHz. That is a pretty cut and dry comparison, even at a glance.

    19. Re:And... by citizenr · · Score: 1
      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    20. Re:And... by Black+LED · · Score: 1

      Is that reliable? A benchmark? Are there any real world comparisons or reviews? Preferably with the actual MK808B product and not a TMSON M9 tablet. Also comparing the same resolution vs the same resolution, since TMSON M9 is 768x1024 and, presumably, Ouya was tested at 1920x1080.

      It just seems unlikely that the same CPU with two less cores running at a slower speed could be more powerful. Something is highly suspect with Futuremark's scoring system. They don't even have The Asus Transformer Infinity or HTC One X+ in their database.

  3. Benchmarks are nice, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    ...what about the games? Are the games any good? I'd imagine that would be the truly important metric for a game console, not how many cycles per second, or what the framerate is at 1080p.

    Visuals are nice and all, but I'd prefer to buy a game console that actually has some fun games available for it.... *cough* unlikepsvita *cough*

    1. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by Hsien-Ko · · Score: 1

      With 8GB I don't think you can fit much good on the storage through the internet. All I can think of the Ouya is being a hyped-up "revolutionary" box that offers a few f2p trials and nothing more.

    2. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by loufoque · · Score: 1

      The PS Vita has a lot of good games, assuming you like japanese games.

    3. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by blackicye · · Score: 0

      Visuals are nice and all, but I'd prefer to buy a game console that actually has some fun games available for it.... *cough* unlikepsvita *cough*

      Just because you're not in the target audience, doesn't mean there aren't fun games on a platform.

      http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/03/13/vita-outsells-3ds-in-japan-strong-sales-continue

      The Xbox 360 is still a flop in Japan and it debatably has some fun games available for it.

    4. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by whoop · · Score: 1

      It should be enough to handle the vast majority of the Xbox Live/Playstation Network type games though. I think that would be the niche they need to aim for, not the next Call of Assassin's Effect Yearly Sequel 43.

      I think convincing devs to port to it will be the hardest thing for them, though. I'll wait and see before buying.

    5. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by muon-catalyzed · · Score: 1

      The PS Vita has a lot of good games, assuming you like japanese games.

      Japanese only? PS Vita has lots of gold classics euro games from the PS1, like this amazing racer I've once played, but could not find anywhere anymore.., it's on Vita! Comes with a great sountrack from the Scene's legend Blazer (Olof G) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ulV0Wa3r_Q

    6. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not the same experience as PS1 though. The lines are all straight. From what I remember, PS1 wasn't able to draw straight lines ;-)

    7. Re:Benchmarks are nice, but... by dadelbunts · · Score: 1

      From Dust, which is an xbox live indie game or w.e you want to refer it as is like 1.3 gigs. Toy Soldiers Cold War is a bit bigger. So you can fit what, 5 games on it?

  4. Re:And... and... by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 1

    Devices you'd want to have for other reasons. I have a smartphone already. I need a cellphone for my job, and a smartphone is really convenient for it. So I have one. Well if it is something I'm already going to buy, then it really isn't such a big deal to have a good one.

    That's the issue. Ouya doesn't compete with smartphones, it competes with consoles. It has to put up a good showing against what Nintendo, MS, and Sony offer. I won't get one to replace my smartphone because it is not a phone, nor does it go in my pocket.

    So ya, my Note II cost me a hell of a lot more than $100. I paid it because games are only a minor part of what it does. The money was paid to get me phone, web, GPS, SSH, RDP, and so on in my pocket at all times.

  5. High for Tegra 3 Devices by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I think it is far more interesting that it scored higher than the majority of other tegra 3 devices which cost far more. I never really expected it to be performance impressive by the time it shipped. It is running on a 1 year old chip.

    Of course it is going to be outpaced by the newer devices.

    1. Re:High for Tegra 3 Devices by dagamer34 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It is one of the highest bins of the Tegra 3 line, clocked at 1.7Ghz. Most Tegra SoC variants are 1.3Ghz or 1.4Ghz because they have to worry about battery life.

    2. Re:High for Tegra 3 Devices by Kevin+Fishburne · · Score: 1

      Of course it is going to be outpaced by the newer devices.

      All devices are outpaced by the newer devices. ;)

      --
      Buy your next Linux PC at eightvirtues.com
  6. Content and Capabilities by ChefJeff789 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So? This thing was never meant to be a PS4. The OUYA has my attention for several reasons: 1.) It's a kickstarter project and I hope it's successful for the sake of those that bet so much on it. 2.) It's cheap - consoles are never this inexpensive. The Wii was cheap, but the controllers were ungodly expensive (granted, the OUYA controllers aren't that cheap either). 3.) It's open. This is perhaps most important. I had more fun hacking a Wii and turning into an emulator box and a media streamer than I've ever had with my old, dusty Xbox 360. If I can do that with the blessing of the company who's box I just purchased, hell yes I'll buy one.

    1. Re:Content and Capabilities by SternisheFan · · Score: 0

      The plan is for Ouya owners to upgrade the cpu and other parts as time goes on. So this is a game changing ability in the console wars. That openess is to be applauded and encouraged. I hope the Ouya does well, it might cause the big 3 console makers to reconsider drm and vendor lockdown.

    2. Re:Content and Capabilities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You almost see to imply that you can do this with Nintendos blessing, which they do not give. You also could do this with an original Xbox before the Wii came out.

      I am not a huge game system fan, but the 360 is still light years ahead of of the Wii.

    3. Re:Content and Capabilities by Enderandrew · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Software developers wanted to be paid to write software?

      Those scoundrels!

      --
      http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
    4. Re:Content and Capabilities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So true, (writing from the line for iphone 5s)
      I am willing to support emerging vendors

    5. Re:Content and Capabilities by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's also worth noting, just for the sake of balance, that '73d in benchmarks' is a close to meaningless figure, equivalent to declaring that a given computer with, say, an i5 CPU is "not even in the top hundred" because you can buy hundreds of distinct SKUs that have i7 CPUs.

      On the benchmark page you can see that major swaths of the benchmark list are near duplicates.

      The top 20-odd spots are "quad-core Krait 300 Adreno 320", with the bulk of the next 50 being "dual-core Krait 300 Adreno 320".

      The oddballs are "2 GHz dual-core Intel Atom Z2580 PowerVR SGX544MP2", Samsung's "Up to 1.7 GHz dual-core ARM Cortex-A15 Mali-T604" and one or two other minor variants.

      It's actually pretty surprising how much variation their is(in at least one case a dual Krait benchmarked ahead of several quad Kraits, allegedly at the same clock speed, and the ASUS transformer with a slower Tegra3 benches ahead of the OUYA with a higher clocked and otherwise identical SoC); but there Just. Aren't. That. Many. SoCs at the high end of the market.

      There are definitely faster chips(especially on the CPU side, Nvidia went a bit light on the CPU side on the theory, unsurprising for them, that GPU is what counts); but only a handful, just used in 70-odd devices.

      This fact doesn't make the Tegra3 any faster in an absolute sense; but there aren't even enough SoCs on the market for something to meaningfully be '73d'

    6. Re:Content and Capabilities by exomondo · · Score: 1

      it might cause the big 3 console makers to reconsider drm and vendor lockdown.

      That's driven by the publishers, and you can bet the ones that do drm already will go with some sort of lockdown, drm or internet-connected system for their ouya games to.

    7. Re:Content and Capabilities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The plan is for Ouya owners to upgrade the cpu and other parts as time goes on.

      Introducing the need to check system requirements, removing the huge benefit to developers of being able to target and optimize for exact hardware architecture and introducing the need to tweak settings to make games run acceptably. One of the reasons people buy consoles is so they don't have to worry about whether their cpu is powerful enough to run a game or their graphics card is powerful enough or they have enough ram.

    8. Re:Content and Capabilities by SternisheFan · · Score: 2

      The upgrade capability is for those who like to mod their devices, the 'tinkerers'. If it's successful, then there'll be an Ouya Two, for people not inclined to upgrade their device. I believe that the Ouya's 1.7 cpu will be in the Playstaion2 range of computing power.

    9. Re:Content and Capabilities by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      It's also worth noting, just for the sake of balance, that '73d in benchmarks' is a close to meaningless figure, equivalent to declaring that a given computer with, say, an i5 CPU is "not even in the top hundred" because you can buy hundreds of distinct SKUs that have i7 CPUs.

      It would be interesting to know more about futuremark scores. Antutu, the benchmark all the users use (and which is thus much more interesting than a futuremark score) will give a lower score to the same CPU and GPU with a higher resolution display because it runs all tests at full resolution, and the score is based on the frame rate.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    10. Re:Content and Capabilities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      1.) It's a kickstarter project

      yea cause those are impossible to come by

      its a dumb concept competing with 45$ china android sticks using outdated and proprietary hardware

      yawn... what is this 1983?

    11. Re:Content and Capabilities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In the range of PS2 power?

      Almost as good as a 13 year-old console?

      A better solution would appear to be to buy a PS2 on ebay for $60, and you can knock yourself out buying cheap games from one of the best software libraries of any console.

      Tinkerers can buy an original Xbox to use as a media centre, MAME device etc for a similar amount of money.

    12. Re:Content and Capabilities by SternisheFan · · Score: 1

      I'm guessing at the PS2 refernce. My tablet is a 1 ghz arm cpu that handles most all MAME roms and emulates consoles well until the PS1 and Nintendo 64, with which it struggles to keep frame rate. A dedicated 1.7 Tegra chip might handle far more, I don't know. The Ouya's going to be a versatile, moddable console, and I look forward to seeing how far it can taken, once the techie types get their hands on it. It'll eventually have lots of home-grown tweaks done to it.

    13. Re:Content and Capabilities by citizenr · · Score: 1

      What makes this list damning for nvidia is this
      http://community.futuremark.com/hardware/mobile/TMSON+M9/review
      this is Chinese bottom dollar RK3066 chip, you can buy $44 Android sticks with this chip
      http://www.geekbuying.com/item/MK808-Dual-Core-Android-4-1-Jelly-Bean-TV-BOX-Rockchip-RK3066-Cortex-A9-Mini-PC-stick-307415.html

      it is listed HIGHER than top Tegra from multi billion dollar Nvidia :)
      You know Nvidia is in trouble if they are losing to bargain bin Chinese designs.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    14. Re:Content and Capabilities by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think then that you are focusing on your needs and priorities. You are a hobbiest and hacker; you hacked a Wii, which I've literally never heard of. The market for that is small. The Wii is targeted at casual gamers and people who are definitely NOT hackers--they want to pick up a game and go. If the game isn't fun and easy to learn they will bail in literally minutes.

      The OUYA is entering a market absolutely saturated with systems: XBOX 360/720, PS2/3/4, Wii, Vita, Nintendo DS/3DS, PC, Mac, Linux, iPhone, Android, Windows Phone, BlackBerry...

      Granted those are mostly proprietary systems, but so what? I think that open is oversold as a market driver. Cheap might be helpful... but then gamers are kinda known for being willing to spend money to get their gaming fix.

      My best guess, the OUYA is going to appeal to the same community as the Raspberry Pi. It will appeal to the makers crowd. OK, good for you, learn and have fun. However I suspect that the OUYA will never be more than a niche product, appealing to a very small market segment.

    15. Re:Content and Capabilities by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      The weird thing is that the Mali-400 MP on the RK3066 shows up in devices all over the place on the benchmark list. The one you link to is #71; but the same GPU also hangs out in a big cluster down at #248-251(even weirder, just above that cluster of "Up to 1.6 GHz dual-core ARM Cortex-A9 Mali-400 MP (quad core, 250 MHz)" are some higher-scoring "1 GHz Dual-core ARM Cortex-A9 ARM Mali 400 MP (single core)" devices. And (unlike CPUs for some workloads, GPUs are generally alleged to parallelize well)).

      It is a bit surprising to see Nvidia not outgunning the 'sure it's dreadful; but at least it sips power!' players, even with a mains-powered STB that is pretty much limited only by thermal headroom; but either something is severely dubious with futuremark, or there are some subtle ways to fuck up the implementation of exactly the same hardware.

  7. But its only $99 by jdkc4d · · Score: 1

    I don't think you can really complain here. Its really cheap. And if people like this model, it won't be long before a newer version with a faster chip comes out.

  8. Yes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    And the chicks for free.

  9. Performance secondary to Ouya's goals. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    A lot of the the new, popular indie games available aren't exactly taxing on system requirements. Granted some of them could stand a bit of optimization, but having a common framework and a fixed hardware target (exacly what the Ouya provides) really will help there.

    I've got a nice overclock sandy bridge i5 and a high end video card in my gaming system. While I enjoy many of the newer A-list titles with all of their eye candy, I probably put a lot more gaming hours in to titles like minecraft (mostly mod packs like tekkit or FTB), binding of issac, don't starve, super meat boy, and a lot of others that can be had for a couple of bucks on steam.

    While not the fastest thing in the world, I still think the ouya could put a lot of very good games in to the hands of eager players for a very good price. The big console makers miss the mark on indie titles, requiring way too much money for development and focusing way too heavily on monitization at the expense of gameplay.

    1. Re:Performance secondary to Ouya's goals. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      popular indie games

      Said without a hint of irony.

  10. Epoch: The Hacked Twitter Accounts Spam Slashdot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    And it begins ... fucking twitter spam from a hacked twitter account on Slashdot.

  11. 800,000 Applications by tuppe666 · · Score: 2, Informative

    This. Sadly, I personally don't think that Ouya content is going to be able to carry it though.

    Except right now even before launch it has potentially more games than xbox360, ps3; and wii combined...and cheap too, most under a dollar. Everything from throwaway games to 20hr RPG's, Lets be honest most modern game engines work on Android. In fact the only problem it has is making out the quality from the...not so quality

    1. Re:800,000 Applications by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Big point missed: it's supposidly built to run XBMC really well. It does have multiple purposes.

    2. Re:800,000 Applications by AdamHaun · · Score: 4, Insightful

      In fact the only problem it has is making out the quality from the...not so quality

      Which is not a problem we should dismiss out of hand. The exact same problem killed Atari (and the American video game market with it) back in the 80s. When the NES was introduced, Nintendo had some pretty strict quality/quantity control to prevent that from happening again, as well as its own magazine to inform gamers about what was available. Perhaps aggregate reviews on the internet will fulfill the same function today.

      --
      Visit the
    3. Re:800,000 Applications by Holmwood · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This could well be very true. I backed it on Kickstarter precisely because I wanted a low power ARM-based 1080p media device that was more flexible than offerings from Sony, MS, Nintendo. Had no real interest in it personally as a gaming console.

      That said... I read TFA. It completely misses the point. Sure, because brand new bleeding edge phones have higher performance, Ouya (at #70) is a loser. Good grief. It is a certainty that there will be between 100 and 1000 PCs (and Macs) of varying configurations from reasonable manufacturers that will exceed the PS4 and Xbox 720 when they are released (at #101-#1001). (at octo-core 1.6 GHz Jag and roughly half the performance of a 670 video card it won't be difficult). Does that mean that these consoles are failures and Sony and MS should give up?

      Of course not. They will have defined a stable platform that is "good enough" for some years of gaming, along with interfaces to enable that.

      Ditto, potentially, Ouya.

      Will Ouya succeed? I've no idea, but the raw power of the console is unlikely to be a material issue at this point.

    4. Re:800,000 Applications by PopeRatzo · · Score: 0

      I wish I had saved my mod points for you, my friend.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    5. Re:800,000 Applications by node+3 · · Score: 0

      Except right now even before launch it has potentially more games than xbox360, ps3; and wii combined...

      I, like most people, find it difficult to play potential games. I suppose, though, the PS3 has more potential games too. So does the Xbox 360. And the Wii. And the C64. Heck, even the HAL9000 has more "potential" games.

      and cheap too, most under a dollar.

      And worth every penny!

      Everything from throwaway games to 20hr RPG's, Lets be honest most modern game engines work on Android. In fact the only problem it has is making out the quality from the...not so quality

      But then you won't be able to say something like, "it has potentially more games than xbox360, ps3; and wii combined".

      However, for sake of argument, let's just pretend that potential games somehow become real games (by magic, we must assume). Then what? Will people want to run them on a slow console? Why? Because it's $99?

      In terms of sheer numbers, that's actually possible (er, "potential"). But in terms of the types of customers that game companies want, the kind that buy games and care about quality, it's not gonna happen. Those people will buy from Sony, MS, and Nintendo, or build a PC. Or hell, simply just play on their high end Android or iOS devices!

      Ouya is a cool device, and its very existence alone is notable. But I believe it's a product based on a fundamentally flawed premise. That premise is that low cost should trump quality.

    6. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it has potentially more games than xbox360, ps3; and wii combined

      Uhh, no, not unless you're counting each dinky Android "game" and not just the real ones.

    7. Re:800,000 Applications by Lisias · · Score: 2

      However, for sake of argument, let's just pretend that potential games somehow become real games (by magic, we must assume). Then what? Will people want to run them on a slow console? Why? Because it's $99?

      Of course! :-)

      Or you expect me to waste 600USD on a state of the art console to play these cheap games? ;-)

      OUYA will not steal high end console's market. OUYA will succeed only if a latent low profile gaming market is out there, waiting to be discovered and exploited, I mean, explored. :-)

      --
      Lisias@Earth.SolarSystem.OrionArm.MilkyWay.Local.Virgo.Universe.org
    8. Re:800,000 Applications by Colonel+Korn · · Score: 0

      This. Sadly, I personally don't think that Ouya content is going to be able to carry it though.

      Except right now even before launch it has potentially more games than xbox360, ps3; and wii combined...and cheap too, most under a dollar. Everything from throwaway games to 20hr RPG's, Lets be honest most modern game engines work on Android. In fact the only problem it has is making out the quality from the...not so quality

      Sadly, the rule with games available on Android and iOS is that they're almost all terrible. There are very few exceptions.

      --
      "I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
    9. Re:800,000 Applications by DrEldarion · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Those games are almost all either terrible or not up to par compared to big console releases, though - even the bad console games are better than nearly all mobile games. Then when someone invests heavily into making a console-quality mobile game (and prices it accordingly), they get tons of shit for the price point. (see: Final Fantasy Dimensions which drew universal scorn for its pricing, which was HALF what it would have been on a portable console)

      Face it, you can't have great, immersive, polished, professional-quality games for $2.99. Instead, you get what you see now: extremely amateur RPGs, puzzle games that are good for 10 minute stretches but get boring if you play them for more than that in one sitting, etc.

      It's very telling that the only reasons I've heard people say they want an Ouya are 1) XBMC and 2) emulation of old console games.

    10. Re:800,000 Applications by Kwyj1b0 · · Score: 1

      Except right now even before launch it has potentially more games than xbox360, ps3; and wii combined...and cheap too, most under a dollar. Everything from throwaway games to 20hr RPG's, Lets be honest most modern game engines work on Android. In fact the only problem it has is making out the quality from the...not so quality

      However, people who want to play Android games will play them on their Android phones (if they have one). If not, Angry Birds (and its ilk) are likely available on their current phone platform. What you are missing is that people buy console games to play console-type games: 20+ hours of gameplay, with detailed story lines, excellent graphics, good music (don't underestimate the impact of this), and reasonable level of control.

      Now, I agree that there are some Android games that could do well - Team 17's Worms comes to mind. But that is not the norm. I buy the Xbox to play Halo, the PS3 to play CoD. Don't get me wrong - Android games are nice for a phone platform. But there has never been an Android game that I wished was available for my console.

    11. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Despite your negativity, you've found the mark. The gamble is that there are a lot of people who play Plants vs Zombies, Angry Birds, Mario* and other games that work just fine on a Tegra-3. $100 in, and $50 for 20 games, or $300 in and $50 per game. That cost point is absolutely killer.

      Case and point: My Mom outspent me on gaming last year. She discovered Big Fish and spent $200 in $6 games. The market you mentioned exists.

      If they can expl[oit]ore it they'll win. I like my Ouya so far, the controllers feel good in the hand, and the ported games that I've tried were kind of fun, and if I can trade my Big Mac and Frys for Top Ramen tonight, I'll get to try another. Xbox players, have to do Ramen for a week and a half to do the same.

    12. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 2

      This is brilliance. This post. Nothing else is needed to explain TFA.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    13. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 3, Insightful

      people buy console games to play console-type games: 20+ hours of gameplay, with detailed story lines, excellent graphics, good music (don't underestimate the impact of this), and reasonable level of control.

      With the exception of Skyrim, very few (if any) games have actually delivered more than 10 solid hours of gameplay, much less 20. If you can name me 5 games from this list that are both a console game and 20+ hours of gameplay, I'd be really surprised.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    14. Re:800,000 Applications by fearofcarpet · · Score: 2

      Big point missed: it's supposidly built to run XBMC really well. It does have multiple purposes.

      And that is why I ordered one. XBMC runs amazingly well on my Tegra 3 tablet; I want a little Android box that can hide behind my TV and run XBMC. Bonus for a dedicated "remote" (and navigating XBMC with a game controller is a pleasure.) Gaming is certainly a feature, but I already have a PC for that.

      --
      Actually, I wrote my thesis on life experience.
    15. Re:800,000 Applications by fearofcarpet · · Score: 4, Informative

      However, for sake of argument, let's just pretend that potential games somehow become real games (by magic, we must assume). Then what? Will people want to run them on a slow console? Why? Because it's $99?

      Of course! :-)

      Or you expect me to waste 600USD on a state of the art console to play these cheap games? ;-)

      OUYA will not steal high end console's market. OUYA will succeed only if a latent low profile gaming market is out there, waiting to be discovered and exploited, I mean, explored. :-)

      Not only that, but you're paying through the nose for increasingly locked-down consoles designed with the EA mentality of bleeding your bank account dry while you play. Personally I'm done with Nintendo/Sony/MS consoles and their push to lock you into some sort of on-line somethingaverse where you spend Itchy and Scratchy money on stuff that should have been included with the $60 game that is locked to your specific console for no justifiable reason. And as someone that travels between countries, don't get me started on region locking and the "helpful feature" of switching to the language of whatever country your IP address originated from. I don't care about on-line multiplayer, I don't want to create an avatar, I'm not interested in being called a faggot by some preteen with too much free time, I don't want to have to sign in to a server to play a single player game, and I will only tolerate DRM that is as unobtrusive as Steam... and by that I mean I'm willing to pay because Steam is actually easier than pirating.

      --
      Actually, I wrote my thesis on life experience.
    16. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 3, Informative

      This could well be very true. I backed it on Kickstarter precisely because I wanted a low power ARM-based 1080p media device that was more flexible than offerings from Sony, MS, Nintendo. Had no real interest in it personally as a gaming console.

      That said... I read TFA. It completely misses the point. Sure, because brand new bleeding edge phones have higher performance, Ouya (at #70) is a loser. Good grief. It is a certainty that there will be between 100 and 1000 PCs (and Macs) of varying configurations from reasonable manufacturers that will exceed the PS4 and Xbox 720 when they are released (at #101-#1001). (at octo-core 1.6 GHz Jag and roughly half the performance of a 670 video card it won't be difficult). Does that mean that these consoles are failures and Sony and MS should give up?

      Of course not. They will have defined a stable platform that is "good enough" for some years of gaming, along with interfaces to enable that.

      Ditto, potentially, Ouya.

      Will Ouya succeed? I've no idea, but the raw power of the console is unlikely to be a material issue at this point.

      And the Ouya software still is entirely beta and will be for quite some time.

      As anybody can attest: Android devices with not optimised/slimmed down system software can bevery sluggish. They have been performance testing at the wrong time and that is dishonest.

      Also this hardly is news since Tegra3 is yesterdays news and has been surpassed for quite some time. Yet there are not many games that take it really to the edge. It's like claiming that the Geforce 680 has been surpassed by the latest ATI offering. That'd be interesting but of no particular value since nearly no games under normal circumstances strain either of them.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    17. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 2, Informative

      Even the excellent Deus Ex where I absolutely took my time to finish it yielded only about 30 hrs of game time. When I look through my Steam library I find any game that I have finished has about the same play time on it as Bastion.

      I've stopped buying AAA games. They are not good value for money and I will rather pick them up in a sale together with all DLC if at all.

      There are 200 games in my Steam library. Only few of them have 60 hrs+ play time on them. One being Skyrim(most of which was spent trying out mods) and Warlock: Master of the Arcane(crap at release, excellent with the latest DLC) at 400 hrs played. Closely followed by the new XCOM and the first Orcs Must Die. Warlock and OMD did cost me a third of what Skyrim/XCOM did and are not considered AAA games. They propably cost a single digit percentile of what Skyrim/XCOM did to produce.

      Why again do we have AAA games?

      Also I would give a kidney for an XCOM Android port. An extra lung would be thrown in if they kept the art assests/FX intact and degraded them according to the hardware capabilities.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    18. Re:800,000 Applications by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 0

      800,000 shit applications are no better than 1,000 shit applications and quite frankly I don't think there is a mobile game (especially on android) that could be described as anything but shit.

    19. Re:800,000 Applications by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      why ouya though and not some other 100 bucks android device?
      because you enjoy submitting cc info for using it?

      which is kind of the point. it's unlikely to have real ouya hw exclusives - by design.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    20. Re:800,000 Applications by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 0

      That's probably because you're a miserable sod who buys generic shit games like skyrim.

    21. Re:800,000 Applications by Zelos · · Score: 1

      That's 800,000 apps designed for touchscreens, isn't it? How many work on a non-touchscreen TV with a controller?

    22. Re:800,000 Applications by exomondo · · Score: 1

      I want a little Android box that can hide behind my TV and run XBMC.

      We've had those for ages, you can even hook a ps3 controller up to them if you really want to.

    23. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Case and point: My Mom outspent me on gaming last year. She discovered Big Fish and spent $200 in $6 games. The market you mentioned exists.

      And is well catered for thanks to the ubiquity of Android and iOS phones and tablets, the popular games (plants vs zombies, angry birds, fruit ninja, etc) end up on PC (natively or through the browser) and consoles as well anyway to maximize the audience.

    24. Re:800,000 Applications by kinarduk · · Score: 2

      "Stable Platform" - The most important phrase in your post. Developers love this. I know, I'm a developer.

    25. Re:800,000 Applications by fearofcarpet · · Score: 1

      For $100? Links?

      --
      Actually, I wrote my thesis on life experience.
    26. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hehe, since when is stating the obvious considered brilliance?

    27. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I wanted a low power ARM-based 1080p media device that was more flexible than offerings from Sony, MS, Nintendo. Had no real interest in it personally as a gaming console

      And for some reason, you didn't buy a Raspberry Pi?

    28. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      That is your opinion, a valid one but is just that, your opinion.

      For me the big budget games are exactly the same they were 10 years ago but with updated graphic, its always the same old thing. Some have a good story and lore associated which is nice but gameplay and GUI wise its basically the same.

      Fortunately, there are game rigs as the wii that tries to change that a bit.
      Software wise independent game houses with less to lose than big budget ones, try to make things new and different approaches to some familiar game styles. That for me is much more interesting and for many others as well just see how much the mobile as a gaming platform and wii sold and compare that to the other high performance consoles.

    29. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      They've been around for a long time - e.g. http://www.play.com/Electronics/Electronics/4-/39778477/733191752/JUSTOP-K9-Android-4-1-Jelly-Bean-Smart-TV-Dongle-Adapter/ListingDetails.html?_%24ja=tsid:13315|cat:39778477|prd:39778477&ef_id=UUID2gAAAMCLcj2l:20130416095630:s . There's lots to choose from - add a cheap wireless remote and you're set.

    30. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      Given this is Android:

      How about all of them?
      They also work with a mouse. And keyboard support is also integrated.

      The thing that really boggles my mind is there a billions of Android devices out there. But hardly anybody ever tried to hook up his computer peripherals to them despite the fact that most of them(i.e. the non-crappy ones) come with USB/Bluetooth connectivity. HDMI out is also not a product of the drug-addled mind of a science fiction author.
      Whatever happened to the old nerd mentality of: I wonder what happens if I hook those two up?

      The only games that don't natively support controllers are stupid iPad ports since those iDevices make it a point not to use standard connectors and next to nobody is willing to by specialised hardware for those. Gameloft games are particularly aggravating. Some of them natively support PS3 controllers, some don't. And even if they stupidly insist on touch only onscreen controls there are apps out there where you can map controller buttons/sticks to those.


      I just jumped into a quick game of ShadowGun: Deadzone and I absolutely murdered everybody because I have a PS3 controller and a USB cable(my Transformer Prime is not at its best when asked to do Bluetooth and WLAN at the same time).

      Given its origin, XBMC is absolutely workable with a controller.


      So here is a hint: arm yourself with a USB cable and hook up your peripherals. Try it!

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    31. Re:800,000 Applications by Zelos · · Score: 1

      There are different levels of a game 'working' though. As you say, playing with a controller is very different to playing with a touchscreen. A single player Android FPS with dificulty tuned for touchscreen is going to be much easier with a controller or a mouse plugged in.

      Are all those Android game developers going to tune for controller and/or Keyboard&Mouse when the market size is so much smaller? It's not just a matter of "it's Android so the games all work".

    32. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      Nah. They should go for controller. They are already approximating those with those on screen fiddlesticks. Also there is an aftermarket for Android compatible controllers, phone cases with controllers built in, that nVidia shield thing(if it ever goes into production),...
      I've seen quite a few twinstick shooters(eXpendable for instance...straight off the Dreamcast) and what FPS we have is of the duck&cover console inspired variety. Oh the joys of aiming with a stick! I've got Shadowgun on my tablet and found I dislike this type of game on tablet as much as I dislike them on PC. Android has a lot of Arcade racers and Puddle is simply better with a controller since tilting your tablet(and turning it outright upside down) doesn't work as you'd expect. While not exactly neccessary, Sonic is also nicer with a controler even if I have been told that the onscreen controls are quite nice.

      The only time when I really attach a mouse to my tablet is when I play XCOM or MoM on Dosbox. Using a controller for those would be a bit silly.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    33. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My current desktop already runs circles around a PS4. It has half the performance of a GeForce GTX 680.

    34. Re:800,000 Applications by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      But as this news item points out, they all run better on an Android smartphone.

      A slower Ouya could be worth it, it it had games that were designed to work with a console controller. But there aren't "800,000" of those. There are hardly any.

      And in most cases it's not simply a case of doing a quick port of the "800,000". A game designed for a touchscreen will generally be shit with a controller. Just as a game designed for a controller is generally shit on a touchscreen. They are different mediums where different styles of game excel.

      (I put "800,000" in quotes, because there aren't 800,000 Android games. Nearly all apps that are not games are irrelevant for this console.)

    35. Re:800,000 Applications by BasilBrush · · Score: 2

      A Stable platform is indeed one of the secrets of Games console success. But a stable platform is only worth anything if a has a significant number of users.

      Every failed games console had a stable platform. It just didn't have enough users.

    36. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It took longer than I expected, but I'm a PC guy so I don't keep that much track of console releases. The PC list would have been done months earlier with a more fleshed out Strategy/MMO/RPG library.

      X-Com
      Mass Effect 3
      Diablo III
      Persona 4
      Borderlands 2
      Pokemon Black 2 and White 2
      Hitman Absolution

      And that's ignoring the titles that don't have an "end" per se.
      Minecraft (XBL)
      Soul Calibre V (or any of the major fighting franchises)
      Madden NFL 13 (or any of the major sports franchises)
      Black Ops II

    37. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why again do we measure quality games in hours? League of Legends players put in a collecting millions of hours of gameplay a month and it's FREE.

      By that calculation anyone who has ever paid money for any game that they didn't play for infinite hours got ripped off. Or we could say that since you really liked Deus Ex maybe there was something about it other than the number hours you played it trying to get a higher score that justified its retail price to you. If you don't want to pay $60 instead of $30 (That's the "fraction" btw of their original retail prices for the AAA titles and OMD) then wait till they go on sale. Why is this an either/or choice for some people that they need to try to justify on the internet as though only playing Indie titles makes you the Yoda of gaming.

      I personally loved OMD as well, but I had 5 skulls on all the levels well under 20 hours and no reason to keep playing after that. I was really disappointed with OMD2 because it seems like when they decided to add co-op they forgot that some people wouldn't be playing it that way and I got a mix of levels that seemed balanced for either 1 player or 2 but never both.

    38. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      if I can trade my Big Mac and Frys for Top Ramen tonight, I'll get to try another. Xbox players, have to do Ramen for a week and a half to do the same.

      Cool, so there's a market there for idiots who waste money on junk food.

    39. Re:800,000 Applications by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      "How many work on a non-touchscreen TV with a controller?"
      Given this is Android:
      How about all of them?

      Bullshit. Touch screen control is fundamentally different to games controller controller. There's no support for controllers with any of the games, unless the developers have put the effort to putting it there.

    40. Re:800,000 Applications by TheSkepticalOptimist · · Score: 1

      No it doesn't, 99% don't support gamepad input, only touch, so this means that the content is very limited. Ouya even said there are only a few hundred supported titles and expect people to write more games that support it properly.

      Also I tired of companies and people throwing out a large number saying this platform is better than that because it has more apps and games. Ever browser the Google Play store? A huge portion of those 800k titles has less than 3 stars. I would rather 100 quality titles on any platform than 1 million crapware titles that you play once and uninstall in disgust.

      So, from performance to content, there is nothing to be excited about the Ouya.

      --
      I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
    41. Re:800,000 Applications by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      So here is a hint: arm yourself with a USB cable and hook up your peripherals. Try it!

      The advantage of mobile gaming is that it's mobile. You can stick your phone in your pocket and play on the train, toilet or wherever. Once you start plugging in controllers, cables, keyboards, large screens, etc you might just as well use a proper console or PC as it will be a lot more powerful and there will be some genuinely high quality games available for it.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    42. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Skyrim was a game? I thought it was a simulator for a life of pointless grinding wage slavery, with a beautiful backdrop. Go figure!

      Now, Civilization II, that was a game.

    43. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      From a dev perspective: OUYA makes it very easy to verify that a user has purchased a game and, thus, making piracy more difficult. My understanding is that capability did not exist on generic Android devices until 4.1 and requires integration with Google Play. On top of that, the interface seems much for suitable for TV use (i.e., not tablet and not keyboard and mouse). They are also much more likely to provide better support for Kickstarter incentive sales (yes, this is speculative), which neither Apple nor Google do particularly gracefully.

    44. Re:800,000 Applications by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      This could well be very true. I backed it on Kickstarter precisely because I wanted a low power ARM-based 1080p media device that was more flexible than offerings from Sony, MS, Nintendo. Had no real interest in it personally as a gaming console.

      Technically, Raspberry Pi fits that bill as well.

      Don't let its 700MHz ARM11 fool you - it's got a powerful GPU attached to it which allows it to play 1080p videos and xbmc. The only reason it has an ARM (it's really a GPU with an attached ARM) is to feed the GPU with data so OEMs don't need to invest in a new SoC - the ARM just handles the UI, network, USB, etc., getting the video data and feeding it straight into the GPU.

    45. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They are not good value for the money?

      Ok, so just say that you're cheap then. If you get 30 hours of gameplay for even 60 dollars, then you've paid $2 per hour which is far less than any movie or really any other form of media. Good god people make every excuse to avoid the fact that they don't want to pay what things cost.

    46. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 1

      Did you actually play Skyrim? Or any of the Elder Scrolls series, like Morrowind? Yes, they have parts (*cough* catecombs *cough*) that repeat. But generic they are not.

      Granted, I mod my games. Mods are what make Skyrim from a good game into a fantastic game. Things like a more advanced blacksmithing system, or a complete overhaul of spell damage and functionality to make a spellcaster more balanced.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    47. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 1

      I'm honestly surprised that anyone took the time to do that. And, for doing so, you won 1,000 brownie points. :-P

      Maybe I should have said 10 games. Or, maybe I should have just made my point and moved on with life. Basically, what I was saying is that the majority of games don't focus on a rich storyline, or even one with multiple branching options.

      I remember with great fondness my hours spent playing text-based RPGs. Or shucks, even something like the current Stone Soup. Things that were made on a shoestring budget, but still delivered hours of enjoyable (though at times somewhat frustrating when the grue eats you for the eighteenth time) gameplay.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    48. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 1

      Depends on if you see it as a complete game, or a massive ground level framework for mods. Personally, I've got over 100 mods installed at the moment, and I'm on (at least) my 5th playthrough. So far, there's been no grinding. Maybe I'll try that "grinding" thing on my 6th playthrough?

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    49. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow, only $70 for something with half the CPU cores running at a lower clockspeed, a crappy GPU, half the storage, no ethernet and no game controller. Awesome!

    50. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I definitely shouldn't have said hours. Maybe I should have delved into the the content/duration ratio. Or (re)playthrough value. Something to identify that some games provide hours of gameplay via grinding, others provide hours of gameplay through content or creativity. Grinding=bad, at least in general.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    51. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      You are right that it makes very little sense on a phone. On a tablet on the other hand it is really, really good.

      And even a phone can be hooked up to a TV. We had quite a lot of spontaneous gaming sessions with my tablet connected to a beamer.
      But then again I carry a lot of peripherals on me since I've ditched my notebook for a tablet.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    52. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      It's not a lot of effort and a lot of games already support controllers.
      Those that only have touch control still can be used with a controller. There's an app on Google Play that maps controller input to signals from the touch screen. Needs root. Works well.

      Android itself can be fully controlled by mouse and controllers. But mouse or touch is best. With a controller you get the awkwardness of doing something complex on your game console.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    53. Re:800,000 Applications by node+3 · · Score: 1

      However, for sake of argument, let's just pretend that potential games somehow become real games (by magic, we must assume). Then what? Will people want to run them on a slow console? Why? Because it's $99?

      Of course! :-)

      Or you expect me to waste 600USD on a state of the art console to play these cheap games? ;-)

      No, $200-$400. You know, the price they actually cost and not some imaginary price you pulled out of your ass.

      But, yes (to the real price). That is, if you like games. If you just want "casual" games (and that's absolutely fine, btw), then of course not. This is a gaming system for casual gamers that has a bunch of core gamers excited for no good reason.

      OUYA will not steal high end console's market. OUYA will succeed only if a latent low profile gaming market is out there, waiting to be discovered and exploited, I mean, explored. :-)

      Exactly. But this is what people are claiming, that the Ouya will destroy Sony, MS, and Nintendo (or force them to react by releasing cheap consoles themselves). It can't, by design. It's designed to be cheap. That has forced it to be shitty. Why buy a shitty system for $99, when you can buy a high quality item for $199? It makes no sense whatsoever.

    54. Re:800,000 Applications by node+3 · · Score: 1

      Despite your negativity, you've found the mark. The gamble is that there are a lot of people who play Plants vs Zombies, Angry Birds, Mario* and other games that work just fine on a Tegra-3. $100 in, and $50 for 20 games, or $300 in and $50 per game. That cost point is absolutely killer.

      But here's the rub: everyone already can play these games on their phones, iPads, and PCs. Not many of them are going to want to play them on their TVs as well, and for those that do, why not buy a $199 console that far outclasses the Ouya?

      It's a tough sell, to be sure. It will have to carve out a niche between having a phone or tablet and no console and the cheapest real game consoles. That's a really narrow market, especially when the price difference between the two ends is only $199, and the Ouya is right in the middle of it. You can either spend $0 and keep playing on your iPad, or spend $199 and have so much more.

      So, who has $99 for a shitty console, but not $199 for a high quality console?

      Case and point: My Mom outspent me on gaming last year. She discovered Big Fish and spent $200 in $6 games. The market you mentioned exists.

      It exists, and is already being well served. Does the Ouya serve it any better? Not in quality of the hardware. The only thing it truly brings is the TV experience. Will that be enough?

      If they can expl[oit]ore it they'll win. I like my Ouya so far, the controllers feel good in the hand, and the ported games that I've tried were kind of fun, and if I can trade my Big Mac and Frys for Top Ramen tonight, I'll get to try another. Xbox players, have to do Ramen for a week and a half to do the same.

      Actually, most people don't have to choose between food and video games. It's silly to go after a market that doesn't even have any money. And they already do this on their iPhones, iPads, and Galaxies.

    55. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And compared to many other Android devices and gaming systems the Ouya is also just a cheap, low powered device. Or are you trying to argue that the Ouya is the absolute sweet spot and that everything more powerful is unnecessary and everything less powerful is inadequate?

    56. Re:800,000 Applications by exomondo · · Score: 1

      You can't use google?
      Here, here, here, here, and there are many, many others capable of running XBMC and have been around for a long time, many of them even come with the "bonus" you mentioned of a dedicated remote. The ability to do what you are after has long been available.

    57. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      $70 vs $100, or only $30 more for something much, much better.

      Context: learn it.

    58. Re:800,000 Applications by xantic · · Score: 1

      When the world started moving closer and closer to the events depicted in "Idiocracy".

    59. Re:800,000 Applications by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      Those that only have touch control still can be used with a controller. There's an app on Google Play that maps controller input to signals from the touch screen. Needs root. Works well.

      Of course it doesn't work well. It's like trying to dig a hole with a piece of string. You can't control a game designed for touch with a pad, joystick or button, and expect to enjoy or make any progress in the game.

      It's this kind of lack of grip on reality that means this console will fail.

    60. Re:800,000 Applications by hobarrera · · Score: 1

      800k apps designed to be used on a touchscreen device, so you'll mostly be unusable on a Ouya.

    61. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      I absolutely doubt they will let stuff on their console that uses the Sixaxis kludge.

      But since you insist that it is unpossible to play most of the good games on Android with a controller, have it your way. Since you insist the Sixaxis kludge doesn't work, have it your way.

      But I have the distinct suspicion you have tried neither yourself. So why again are you arguing against all this? It's fine to have an opinion but you have nothing to back it up with. I'm done arguing with you.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    62. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      They are not good value for the money?

      Ok, so just say that you're cheap then. If you get 30 hours of gameplay for even 60 dollars, then you've paid $2 per hour which is far less than any movie or really any other form of media. Good god people make every excuse to avoid the fact that they don't want to pay what things cost.

      Compared to stuff that gives the same enjoyment at a third of the cost? There is a difference between production cost and value. AAA games cost too much to produce and too many fail miserably and at a multi-million budget, catastrophically.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    63. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 1

      And when common sense isn't anymore.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    64. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      Hours are measurable. The rest is gut feeling.

      I do not have as much time to play games as I had as a kid. So I simply stop playing when I don't enjoy it.

      Which means I have a lot of unfinished games on my plate. For some reason every time I started The Witcher I stop playing around the same spot(right befor the bank robbery). Go figure.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    65. Re:800,000 Applications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's because you're a faggot. I mean, come on, You play with iPhones and Nintendo shit. You're either gay or a little kid.

    66. Re:800,000 Applications by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      But I have the distinct suspicion you have tried neither yourself.

      I haven't tried digging a hole with a piece of string either. That developer hasn't got some magic pixie dust that overcome the fundamental differences of the input types.

      You yourself say you doubt they'll allow stuff that use Sixaxis on their console. So you accept it's not good enough, and therefore the "All of them" claim was ridiculous.

      Sixaxis looks fine for game types that were originally created for controllers, and have been ported to touch screen. The type of games that feature on screen buttons to emulate the buttons on a controller. FPS for example. It's kind of undoing a kludged port.

      It's clearly not OK for games which are designed with a touch screen in mind. Which have onscreen objects that you manipulate with gestures. Where the points on the screen that you touch vary according to what's on the display.

    67. Re:800,000 Applications by trdrstv · · Score: 1

      Even the excellent Deus Ex where I absolutely took my time to finish it yielded only about 30 hrs of game time. When I look through my Steam library I find any game that I have finished has about the same play time on it as Bastion. I've stopped buying AAA games. They are not good value for money and I will rather pick them up in a sale together with all DLC if at all.

      Agreed. You can pick up great AAA titles for $5 or less if you wait long enough. Rather than buying the new Tomb Raider, I picked up 3 old-ish ones (Legend, Anniversary & Underworld) for $2.50 each. A good game is still a good game a few years later, it isn't produce, you don't need to consume it the 1st week it's available.

    68. Re:800,000 Applications by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      It also seems like a couple of AAA games haven't sold as much as expected. Amongst them new Tomb Raider and Bioshock. Given the hype one would think they would've sold better. Perhaps they'll do better in the long tail which now exists in form of sales on digital plattforms. The times are gone when you only got the latest and greatest which a month later got replaced in the shelves by the new hotness.
      I only know I'm interested in neither and will propably pass even when they go on sale. My Steam library has yet to recover from my Christmas sale buying spree.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    69. Re:800,000 Applications by benhattman · · Score: 1

      If you want a story, watch a movie. If you want a rich story, read a novel. If you looking to games for your "story needs", you're doing it wrong. I recognize people on her get agitated about "games as art", but if you're looking for art from other domains copied directly into games, then it's not actually art. It's just derivative schlock.

      Also, branching story options are generally a waste of the developers time. Many players don't finish a game even once. Of the people who do, some reduced fraction will play the game through a second time. Or a third. Or a fourth...

    70. Re:800,000 Applications by jakimfett · · Score: 1

      But a game without a storyline can leave the actual gameplay without a direction. Without a reason to do what the game wants you to do. A good solid storyline can make a game work in ways that no amount of graphics improvements can. And a railroaded story without any moral or emotional conflict is barely worth playing.

      --
      Bits of code, random ramblings: jakimfett.com
    71. Re:800,000 Applications by Lisias · · Score: 1

      No, $200-$400. You know, the price they actually cost and not some imaginary price you pulled out of your ass.

      Put your money where YOUR ass is. Oh, wait... =P

      --
      Lisias@Earth.SolarSystem.OrionArm.MilkyWay.Local.Virgo.Universe.org
    72. Re:800,000 Applications by Lisias · · Score: 1

      Case and point: My Mom outspent me on gaming last year. She discovered Big Fish and spent $200 in $6 games. The market you mentioned exists.

      It exists, and is already being well served. Does the Ouya serve it any better? Not in quality of the hardware. The only thing it truly brings is the TV experience. Will that be enough?

      Good question. I don't know.

      What I know is that I'm fed up with using my phone to playing games. I need to be at home in order to save that abusive 3G billing anyway, why not leave the phone on the desk and having the fun using a TV?

      Having fun using the phone can be expensive. The 3G costs money, and you burns your battery's juicy (and lifespan!).

      You will laugh on me, but now when I go out, I carry my Android phone for some Net surfing (google maps, mainly) and Voice calling, and my PSP for the gaming. So now I can play until the battery is drained without worrying about staying offline.

      --
      Lisias@Earth.SolarSystem.OrionArm.MilkyWay.Local.Virgo.Universe.org
    73. Re:800,000 Applications by StoneyMahoney · · Score: 1

      ...ignoring the number of AAA free-to-play games like Planetside 2, Lord of the Rings, Dungeons and Dragons Online, World of Tanks, Runescape, League of Legends, Tribes Ascend, Team Fortress 2, Age of Empires, Quake Live, Vindictus, Flightgear... noooo, no way of having immersive, polished, professional quality games for cheap/free/freemium at alllll...

  12. You can look through the games by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    Google play https://play.google.com/store/apps/collection/topselling_paid_game?start=0&num=24 has a list of best selling games which is as good a place as any to start, and Android has great games. Ravensword: Shadowlands is a great place to get into Android Gaming.

    1. Re:You can look through the games by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      But the only people who play RPGs are social inadequates and chronic masturbators who wet the bed and have repressed fantasies about their mothers.

      >>turns around and sees everyone here staring...

  13. As long as it plays movies as good as the Pi by kampf · · Score: 1

    If it can't run XMBC better than a $35 Raspberry Pi with RaspBMC, I'm going to be a bit grumpy.

    1. Re:As long as it plays movies as good as the Pi by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      I don't know if it will run well; but running 'better' than a single-core CPU built on an older design and running at less than half the clock speed, with half the RAM, should be essentially automatic.

      Given that all these little things have hardware decoders, I suspect that actual video decode(for mutually supported codecs) will be close enough to be irrelevant(unless a terribly slow storage bus is messing with things somewhere); but XBMC interface/overlay/widgets will probably appreciate the extra room...

    2. Re:As long as it plays movies as good as the Pi by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      I don't know if it will run well; but running 'better' than a single-core CPU built on an older design and running at less than half the clock speed, with half the RAM, should be essentially automatic.

      How well XBMC supports your platform is highly relevant. In theory the RK3066 is a great place to run XBMC but in practice the video acceleration is almost nonexistent and your best hope is that your vendor will release a version which launches the external player.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:As long as it plays movies as good as the Pi by Custard+Horse · · Score: 1

      As XBMC is already behind the Ouya we should expect good things http://xbmc.org/natethomas/2012/08/07/xbmc-and-ouya-oh-yeah/

      XBMC on the RasPi is excellent if a little laggy on menus (playback, even at 1080p, is fine). If the Ouya can be as good with better hardware and more focus on sound processing (which the Raspi is not so good at) we should have a winner.

      Sure, you can spend more money to get something that is better but then you have the energy, noise and thermal footprint to consider. A lot of us just want a LAN connected media centre with a really decent front-end. That front-end is currently XBMC. If you want to play games, do that on a 360/iDevice/Android device.

  14. Better than SNES or PSX by Kevin+Fishburne · · Score: 4, Informative

    If it can power games anything like A Link to the Past and Symphony of the Night at 1080p then it'll do just fine. The only thing that worries me is the possibility of a metric ton of bad games combined with a lack of great ones like my examples. We'll all find out soon enough.

    --
    Buy your next Linux PC at eightvirtues.com
    1. Re:Better than SNES or PSX by shentino · · Score: 1

      I believe that's why they're having new games put in the sandbox until they're voted into the store proper.

  15. Re:And... and... by obarthelemy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Ouya competes with non-hyped Android sticks. I just got $50 MK808B and Neo G4 ($75) and X5 ($100, but more I/O) sticks that I'm setting up to do Skype, Internet, email... and games... for friends and family. Dual-core A9, 1GB RAM, 8GB Flash, 2x or 3xUSB, BT, Wifi, Android 4.1 (4.2 on the way), SD slot, HDMI (and SPDIF for the X5)... and the full Android PlayStore,which Ouya and GameStick don't offer.

    Add a $50 gamepad (a really good one, xbox or DualShock), any old keyboard and mouse, or a Logitech K400 if you want to get fancy, and you get something that can play almost as well as the Ouya/Gamestick, and do a whole lot more thanks to the PlayStore.

    There aren't a whole lot of games that support gamepads or kb+ms, and quite a few games won't run at all because of lack of touch/accelerometer/gyroscope, and the portrait mode... but there are still quite a few good games, a whole bunch of emulators... and this is a lot more than what the OuyaSticks have right now. And there's a good chance that OuyaStick games will find their way to the PlayStore, too, devs would be crazy not to port them: very little extra work, a way bigger market.

    I think it all comes down to the games: if Ouya or GameStick not only catch up to the PlayStore but snag good, exclusive games, it might be worth pay as much for them as for a true Android device, in spite of Ouya/GameStick being as expensive, more limited, and having bad controllers.

    And quad-cores are on the way for less than $100.

    --
    The Cloud - because you don't care if your apps and data are up in the air.
  16. Devices costing 5 times as much are faster. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    News at 11. Devices that cost many times what the Ouya costs are marginally faster. One person reports "Waaaa my $99 device isn't as fast as $500 devices"

    1. Re:Devices costing 5 times as much are faster. by viperidaenz · · Score: 2

      Price is not a valid comparison.
      The most expensive parts of a phone are not part of the Ouya. No screen, no battery, no cell radio.
      The Ouya console has chosen a lack-luster SoC. If they chose a PowerVR554, an Adreno225/320 or even a Mati-T604 SoC I doubt it would have been more than a few dollars difference.

    2. Re:Devices costing 5 times as much are faster. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And most phones don't come with a $50 separate controller... It's likely that around 1/3 of the production cost is in the controller... so it's still pretty fair to compare pricing.

    3. Re:Devices costing 5 times as much are faster. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      and sadly neither does the ouya :( it comes with a $2 plastic piece of crap.

  17. Non-misleading headline by Enderandrew · · Score: 4, Informative

    The benchmark results show the OUYA (basically a $50 console bundled with a $50 controller) was faster than the HTC One S, which sells for $450 outside of a contract.

    --
    http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
    1. Re:Non-misleading headline by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well, if you want to put it that way, the HTC One S is a $20 SOC bundled with 4G radio, a largish touch screen and lithium-ion battery.

    2. Re:Non-misleading headline by Enderandrew · · Score: 1

      You can buy the controller separately for $50 (which is also roughly the price of a comparable PS3/360 controller as well). HTC doesn't sell 4G radios, touch screens and the like separately. And the SOC is not $20. Nor is the OUYA simply a SOC. It includes a case, cords, power supply, etc.

      Not to mention the design cost. People often simply look at the part cost for an item, and assume that is what it costs to make a product. Phone companies get to re-use designs from one model to the next, where as the the initial design cost for a new product is pretty hefty.

      I'm willing to bet that the OUYA is sold very close to margin, if not at a slight loss.

      --
      http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
  18. so... by viperidaenz · · Score: 0

    Another blow to nvidia by ati?

    1. Re:so... by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

      How is this flamebait? All the top devices use the Adreno GPU, which was developed by ATI and sold to Qualcomm. It beats the pants of Tegra 3. Adreno also happens to be an anagram for Radeon.

  19. Nvidia in real trouble by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    As AMD began its project, many years ago, to fuse first-class GPU circuits within the same chip as the CPU, Nvidia was forced to respond. Nvidia contemplated building an x86 processor of its own, but quickly dropped that idea to focus on building ARM SoC parts. Nvidia had but one goal- to be the number one high-end supplier of ARM solutions.

    Now, many years later, we can see just how badly Nvidia has failed. Tegra 1 was a disaster. Tegra 2 and 3 were terribly late, and only gained sales when Nvidia was forced to essentially give away the chips. Tegra 4 is even later than any previous ARM part, and is such a badly conceived device, Nvidia has been forced to nigh on cancel it in order to 'rush' to release the crippled Tegra 4i that will have a better price and power consumption at the cost of CPU and GPU performance.

    Tegra 3 stinks because originally the much faster Tegra 4 was supposed to be in devices by now. Tegra 4 is the last of the ULP GPU Tegra designs from Nvidia. Tegra 5 brings desktop GPU designs to ARM- at which point Nvidia loses interest in the obsolete slow ULP GPU.

    Ouya is obsolete. It is only good for running a class of games associated with weak Android hardware. The cutting edge Android games will be ports from high end iPads, and will be a bad match for the Tegra 3. There are increasing numbers of Android boxes that you can also plug into your TV and controllers. What possible point does Ouya have in this light?

    If Nvidia has the money and the people, it only makes sense for Nvidia to be accelerating production of Tegra 5 at this stage. Current ARM/Android is matching the early days of the decent PC (486 -> Pentium -> Pentium Pro/Pentium 2) which was also (eventually) accompanied with the birth of the PC 3D graphics accelerator. Nvidia is currently running dead last in the ARM GPU stakes, behind Mali, Adreno, and (of course) PowerVR. Given that Adreno is an old ATI design, this is incredibly humiliating for Nvidia. In fact, Google is throwing out Nvidia with its tablet refresh later this year, and going Adreno (via Qualcomm).

    It gets worse. AMD's astonishing Temash APU, with 4 Jaguar x86 cores and a brilliant GPU, will be a vastly better match for a little independent console box. While a console based on Temash would likely be 200 dollars, and run Windows rather than Android games, its improved performance (3X+ GPU, 20X+ GPU) would make for vastly better value and longevity.

    1. Re:Nvidia in real trouble by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The question there would be if those Jaguar cores will have the same power consumption as the ARM A15/A52 cores in the upcoming spin there- if so, you might be on to something. If not, it's almost irrelevant.

      Just because it's powerful doesn't buy you console unless it's intrinsically quiet.

    2. Re:Nvidia in real trouble by Svartalf · · Score: 1

      Oh, and Windows IS irrelevant to the play there unless you're talking Microsoft. SERIOUSLY.

      *NOBODY* will base an indie console on the competitors OS. You, sir, are an idiot.

      --
      I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
    3. Re:Nvidia in real trouble by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Great! Care to show us shipping silicon with all these awesome next-gen specs?

      What's that? They don't exist? Marketers blow smoke up your ass? You don't say!

      Seriously, you're missing the point here. Sure it's easy to imagine something faster and better but by the time you've designed the thing, prototyped it, worked out all the bugs, and had it manafactured it's two years later.

      The tegra is here. It's available now, in quantity. It's popular and a lot of people have a lot of experience working with it. Nvidia is even quite helpful as they want to get in the the mobile/game SoC market. The ouya takes all of that existing work and puts in to a small, cheap package.

    4. Re:Nvidia in real trouble by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is really funny. You know seeing as how Nvidia is selling chips as fast as they can make them. While AMD is running out of cash fast. They may have to file for bankrupcy later this year.

    5. Re:Nvidia in real trouble by VortexCortex · · Score: 0

      There are increasing numbers of Android boxes that you can also plug into your TV and controllers. What possible point does Ouya have in this light?

      0. You need an Internet connection to use it -- Mandatory online system update at 1st boot.
      1. Every game is free to play / pay to win -- (innovative Sim City / Diablo 3 style always online DRM)
      2. You have to give out your credit card info before you get any of the "free" games.

      You just don't understand, old timer. The Ouya is the new Indie console. These and other innovations over other devices will save the struggling game industry and bring games back to the TV!
      </snark>

  20. Silly headline--the performance is plenty exciting by fluke11 · · Score: 1, Informative

    What makes the Ouya exciting is it's ability to play games and it's performance exceeds several existing platforms which have worked fine for playing games. Ouya is ranked 73rd because of it's score of 4077. This beats the following popular platforms (score/name): 3551 ASUS Nexus 7 3569 ASUS Transformer Pad TF300T 3920 ASUS Transformer Prime TF201 3347 Samsung Galaxy Note II 2894 Samsung Galaxy S III (Exynos 4 Quad) 3590 HTC One X 3341 LG Optimus 4X HD 3501 Amazon Kindle Fire HD 1959 Amazon Kindle Fire If the Ouya ends up being restricted to only be able to play the same sort of games already available for the following devices above, it is still exciting for being able to bring them to the TV for $99. It is unlikely that Gamestick will perform any better.

  21. S3 doesn't have controllers by Chirs · · Score: 1

    A big part of the Ouya is the proper gaming controllers...

    1. Re:S3 doesn't have controllers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the big part for who exactly? for those that this is such a big part for I can't see the majority choosing ouya over current consoles with better quality games and better quality controllers etc for similar cost or slightly more.

    2. Re:S3 doesn't have controllers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      most of the games are not designed with controllers in mind, this makes them awkward to use at best, if this is the big part of Ouya then this console really is doomed.

  22. Tegra a success by tuppe666 · · Score: 2

    Now, many years later, we can see just how badly Nvidia has failed

    I find ARM incredibly confusing. I understood PC CPU/GPU, and I am on the whole pretty knowledgeable. As informed as your post maybe. In my mind I can only name two really recognisable ARM brands!? Snapdragon[because it was everywhere] and Tegra...and I only associate one with graphics performance. I have to say brand goes a long way.

    but if you think single platform games, on a vapourware machine costing twice as much as this console is somehow a threat to Nvidia Arm, its not. It might bring more affordable Windows Tablets to the masses...if anyone still wants one, or a cheap steam box if they can get it out of the gate fast enough. You have to remember Android is set to become the dominant platform this year.

    1. Re:Tegra a success by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In the world of ARM brand is mostly irrelevant, you buy the devices. Ie you buy a Samsung or HTC etc. Nvidia has failed pretty badly so far in this market, they have also lost out in all the highend console market to AMD. personally I think they got very lax and treated there few partners very badly over the last few years and are now paying a heavy price for it.

  23. so? by shentino · · Score: 3, Informative

    Did they use Gamecube quality hardware in the NES?

    Give Ouya a break, it's a brand new console and it's only on its first generation.

    Give the makers time to soak up some feedback on Ouya's weak points and the next version will probably be beefed up a bit.

    1. Re:so? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Being open and Android/Linux based, the Ouya should offer superior backwards compatibility over multiple generations of the console, as well as being easy to port to the PC and other platforms (granted being Java based could limit the games somewhat).

      Being an open console also opens the way for another lightweight Linux distro that can support more programming languages. Ubuntu TV comes to mind as the most likely, since Ubuntu Touch won't be properly tuned towards a controller, unless they do a variant of Ubuntu Touch.

    2. Re:so? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      did they use gamecube quality hardware in the wii U

      its a brand new console that can hardly keep up with 2 gen old systems, you have it backwards

    3. Re:so? by Waccoon · · Score: 1

      Give the makers time to soak up some feedback on Ouya's weak points and the next version will probably be beefed up a bit.

      Which may not be long. Didn't they claim they wanted to release new hardware every year?

    4. Re:so? by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      Tegra4 should be in production just about now so I wouldn't be surprised if they did.

      The rate in which those mobile SoCs get upgraded is mindboggling. A generation lasts about 1.5 years. What's truly terrifying is that nVidia currently claim they are integrating Kepler into their SoC. The Ouya3 or 4 might very well give the PS4 a run for its money. Or less money so to speak.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
  24. Sir, I take exception with that by rsilvergun · · Score: 2

    and as proof, I give you Fatal Fury Special running on the Sega Master System (Game Gear technically, but the hardware is identical) WITHOUT tonnes of custom mappers chips.

    As for your SNES, well it was kinda slow. Not like it ran at the same speed as a Colecovision but.. oh wait. It did. And Ranger X broke the color barrier. Heck, most SNES games didn't run base hardware. It's why cart loaders don't work well.

    You might be right about the N64, but it didn't help much when the carts where $70 a pop a year after a game launched. As for the gamecube, it was the most powerful system of it's generation and the PS2's library trounced it (Persona 4 anyone? Godhand? Okami was a better Zelda than Zelda).

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
    1. Re:Sir, I take exception with that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. The proof is in the games and SMS games always looked better than NES games. This was especially noticeable when the same game came out for both systems, like Double Dragon. The NES version didn't even have two players. Or look at Strider Hiryu, the SMS has the arcade version, albeit toned down, but still impressive. The NES Strider was a piece of shit.

      Mortal Kombat 1-3 and Street Fighter II were released on the SMS. The NES could not handle them.

  25. Blame Microsoft by tuppe666 · · Score: 0

    That's driven by the publishers, and you can bet the ones that do drm already will go with some sort of lockdown, drm or internet-connected system for their ouya games to.

    ...no that is just passing the buck. Microsoft recently got caught with their pans down, wanting an always online console, this follows their banning gown-up games in Europe, but they are all pretty much DRM upto the eyeballs. Your right though various software protection will be available on the OUYA, just like there is on all Android Apps, the difference with the OUYA is you own the hardware...rather than license it.

    1. Re:Blame Microsoft by exomondo · · Score: 2

      ...no that is just passing the buck.

      Passing what buck? To whom? We see always-on DRM on PCs because it's the publishers, not the hardware makers, the console makers are only doing this to appease the content publishers. We see DRM on desktop Linux, OSX, iOS, Android, Playstation and Nintendo platforms as well so 'blame microsoft' is pretty ignorant.

    2. Re:Blame Microsoft by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      yeah its not like sony or nintendo or apple or blizzard or ea or ubisoft has drm huh? its all microsoft!

  26. SMS vs. NES by tepples · · Score: 2

    The SMS had more processing power, better graphics and sound.

    Processing power was a wash, as Z80 is less efficient clock for clock than 6502. SMS had more color depth, more RAM, and ability to update name. The NES won on sound with an extra bass octave, more timbres for pulse wave instruments, and a digital sample playback channel, and it won on graphics with the ability to scroll a vertical split screen area.

    1. Re:SMS vs. NES by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      SMS won drastically on colors on screen (32 vs 16), sprite size, and palette limitations (most notably NES had fugly 4 color sprites while SMS could use 16) though, which were some of the major reasons most SMS games just looked better. Altered Beast is a pretty drastic example of the difference those factors that can make.

    2. Re:SMS vs. NES by tepples · · Score: 0

      SMS won drastically on colors on screen (32 vs 16)

      Where do you get 16? NES has 25: one backdrop color, four 3-color palettes for backgrounds, and four 3-color palettes for sprites. I will grant that a lot of games have duplicate blacks or whites in multiple palettes though. But the NES has a nicer composite output, as the color fringing pattern changes from scanline to scanline and from frame to frame, unlike the constant color fringing of the SMS that's especially visible on vertical lines.

      sprite size

      Where do you get that information? I'm seeing 8x8 or 8x16, just like the NES and Game Boy. Are you talking about pixel-doubling modes?

      most notably NES had fugly 4 color sprites while SMS could use 16

      You wouldn't know it from games like Contra, Mega Man series, and Battletoads, which use different palettes for different parts of a character.

      Altered Beast is a pretty drastic example of the difference those factors that can make.

      Of course Sega would make a more polished port of its own game for its own platform.

    3. Re:SMS vs. NES by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...not to mention AB was a Genesis game.

    4. Re:SMS vs. NES by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It was released on all 3 platforms: NES, SMS, Genesis.

  27. Re:And... and... by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

    This is my view of it as well. I haven't tried the Ouya yet, but I don't think the controller will be comparable to what you can get from just buying an XBox360 or DualShock controller and using it with any old Android MiniPC. Most non-console brand controllers (mad-catz and others) tend to be really low quality, and I question the likelyhood of the Ouya team being able to sell an Android mini PC and a quality controller for $100, while still being able to turn a profit.

    --

    Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
  28. It's a gaming console. by mtb_ogre · · Score: 1

    It's not a smartphone, it's a gaming console.

    It should be good at gaming. I can pick up a Nintendo Wii for $129, it has a better game selection and arguably a better controller. The Nintendo has better third party support and more console type titles. Getting access to thousands of junky phone-games is pretty much pointless. People shopping for a gaming console likely have a console that performs as good as this thing and has better titles.

    It's a cute hacker toy with no real future market prospects outside a small geek niche.

  29. Shows the by tepples · · Score: 1

    and as proof, I give you Fatal Fury Special running on the Sega Master System (Game Gear technically, but the hardware is identical) WITHOUT tonnes of custom mappers chips.

    Fast forward to in-game graphics, and I see three strips: the background, the foreground, and the status bar. One thing you don't get in SMS or Game Gear games is vertical scrolling in games using a status bar like this. On both NES and SMS, a game can divide the screen into horizontal strips and scroll each one separately. On NES, each strip can be scrolled in all eight directions, but on SMS, strips can be scrolled only horizontally. Show me a driving game for SMS that actually has hills like Rad Rader for NES.

    Also notice the slightly boring musical instruments, as the NES has three different timbres for pulse waves compared to one on the SMS, and a primitive sample playback channel compared to none on the SMS. Also notice the lack of bass, as the NES can go an octave lower. Show me anything like the soundtrack of Battletoads or Solstice or Sunsoft games. Or even compare the soundtrack of the Game Boy and Game Gear versions of Mortal Kombat.

    As for your SNES, well it was kinda slow. Not like it ran at the same speed as a Colecovision but.. oh wait. It did.

    And a 1.6 GHz Atom runs at the same speed as a 1.6 GHz Core i series. Oh wait, it doesn't. You have to compare the architectures, and a 65816 handily beats a Z80 clock for clock.

    1. Re:Shows the by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

      That would be the SMS version of Road Rash. World Grand Prix too. And there's nothing even close to Space Harrier on the Nintendo. Or the dungeon animation in Phantasy Star.

      --
      Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
  30. Re:And... and... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The cheap sticks don't suffer from bad hardware, but bad support. It doesn't matter if you have a 50 dollar stick with good specs, it's worth jack-all without a community and good developers to make sure the software runs well. Yeah, it runs android, but not very well. It's not like PC hardware, which will always run windows and linux well. Android requires a lot of hardware-specific tweaking before it's usable.

    The cheap no-name android sticks will ship with a just-barely-running android system image tweaked by someone in china. And that's it. You will likely see no more updates from the maker. You might get some 3rd party developers on board, but really their time and your time is better spent on projects with better support.

    It reminds me of the raspi. Sure, the raspi inst the best tiny single board computer. But it does have the best community behind it, and is thus the most useful to more people.

  31. The price of a controller by tepples · · Score: 1

    Neo G4 ($75) [...] Add a $50 gamepad (a really good one, xbox or DualShock)

    And you've already surpassed the price of an Ouya console.

    And there's a good chance that OuyaStick games will find their way to the PlayStore, too, devs would be crazy not to port them: very little extra work, a way bigger market.

    I doubt that the majority of smartphone users are willing to buy and carry an Xbox 360 controller or a Dual Shock 3 controller. So you have to somehow find a usable mapping for your game controls onto the touch screen. How would you play a game like Mega Man X on a touch screen? I tried playing NES games in an NES emulator for Android on my Nexus 7 tablet, and my thumbs kept missing the buttons because unlike a physical gamepad, a flat sheet of glass provides no tactile feedback as to where the thumbs are relative to the on-screen controls.

    1. Re:The price of a controller by obarthelemy · · Score: 1

      Look at it the other way round: the low %age of tablet/phone/stick users that *are* willing to pay for and carry a gamepad is quite a large market, compared to the Ouya and Gamestick users :-p

      As for price: go for the $50 MK808B and you don't suppass the Ouya... and don't forget you can do a whole lot more.

      --
      The Cloud - because you don't care if your apps and data are up in the air.
    2. Re:The price of a controller by slim · · Score: 1

      Robert Broglia's popular series of emulators for Android all support using a Wii controller -- or a Wii Classic Controller -- because they're just Bluetooth devices and the pairing is straightforward.

  32. Check system requirements: PS1, PS2, PS3, PS4 by tepples · · Score: 1

    Introducing the need to check system requirements

    You already have to do that for PlayStation games. Games for the original PlayStation play on everything, but PlayStation 2 games won't play on an original PlayStation, nor will PlayStation 3 games play on a PlayStation 2 or 4. The store could be made to filter out Ouya 2 games unless all the components have been upgraded to at least Ouya 2 level.

    1. Re:Check system requirements: PS1, PS2, PS3, PS4 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no you buy a ps3 game and it will work on a ps3 or a ps2 game which will work on a ps2, but if i buy a pc game it requires at least a certain type of graphics card and at least a certain speed of cpu and at least certain amount of ram and sometimes the types of components dont work well together or you need a particular driver version and even then the games target a general set of features through an abstraction to cover multiple configurations which removes the ability to do proper hardware optimization.

      The store could be made to filter out Ouya 2 games unless all the components have been upgraded to at least Ouya 2 level.

      so you can upgrade but you'll have to buy certified upgrades from ouya? or at least ouya-approved upgrades? given the cheapness of the console i reckon people will just upgrade, but the installbase will leave developers predominantly targeting the original, just like devs target current console quality for their titles rather than making the most of current PC hardware.

    2. Re:Check system requirements: PS1, PS2, PS3, PS4 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      That's not exactly comparing like with like. We have had 3 Playstation consoles in 18 years - the PS4 hasn't been launched.

      If the Ouya 2 isn't going to come out for 6 years, how many users are going to bother upgrading? My guess is not many. If a new Ouya is launched every 12-18 months, existing owners won't be happy, they will be pissed off that they can't buy new games any more.

      If the Ouya is only bought by modding hobbyists, there will never be a big enough market for Ouya games, and the best indie developers will stick with Android, iOS, PC etc.

    3. Re:Check system requirements: PS1, PS2, PS3, PS4 by Bert64 · · Score: 1

      Actually no...
      If i buy a PS3 game, i have no idea if it will work with my PS3 or not. My PS3 is running an old firmware, as that was sony's recommended route for continuing to use linux on it, so if i buy a game which requires a new firmware i cannot run it without destroying my linux install and forever losing the ability to use it.

      So i have no idea if any game i buy will work on my PS3, subsequently i don't buy any more games for it.

      --
      http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
  33. Hardware in first Xbox by tepples · · Score: 1

    Did they use Gamecube quality hardware in the NES?

    No, but Microsoft used roughly GameCube quality hardware in the first generation Xbox: essentially a Celeron 733 and a GeForce 3.

  34. NDK by tepples · · Score: 1

    the Ouya should offer superior backwards compatibility over multiple generations of the console, as well as being easy to port to the PC and other platforms (granted being Java based could limit the games somewhat).

    Only event handling needs to be in Java. The actual game can use the NDK. Besides, ports to the PC can use Java for PC, just as Minecraft uses Java for PC.

    1. Re:NDK by tangent3 · · Score: 2

      You can even do the event handling without touching Java:

      http://developer.android.com/reference/android/app/NativeActivity.html

  35. Still Blaming Microsoft by tuppe666 · · Score: 0

    so 'blame microsoft' is pretty ignorant.

    Hardware DRM
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardware_restrictions#Windows_8

    Trusted Computing
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing

    I guess it is Microsoft after all :) Seriously stop passing the blame.

    1. Re:Still Blaming Microsoft by exomondo · · Score: 1

      I guess it is Microsoft after all :) Seriously stop passing the blame.

      I had no idea iOS, Playstation, Steam, Nintendo, Ubisoft, EA, OSX, Mac, iTunes video (and quite frankly the list is virtually endless) were all Microsoft products, they all have DRM so I guess everything is microsoft and therefore we can blame them for everything!

  36. Not even remotely true by tuppe666 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Sadly, the rule with games available on Android...is that they're almost all terrible. There are very few exceptions.

    Except that is not even remotely true, having owned a Android game console for over 18 months, its my primary source of gaming, and the costs are cheap too. Android is becoming the primary gaming platform.

    1. Re:Not even remotely true by FauxReal · · Score: 0

      What are your ten favorite games?

    2. Re:Not even remotely true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Android is becoming the primary gaming platform.

      Ladies and gentlemen, this is what they actually believe.

    3. Re:Not even remotely true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, it is true. Have you actually seen the games available for today's console systems and the PC? I think there's a watered down version of Dead Space available for Android, but beyond that it's a smorgasbord of puzzle games, running games (temple run and clones) and some racing/flight games that make use of positioning sensors. You are a lying FOSStard. You know NOTHING about truth.

    4. Re:Not even remotely true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As someone who Funded the Ouya, could you recommend some fun family games? (have a 4-year-old daughter)

    5. Re:Not even remotely true by dywolf · · Score: 1

      really?
      that's what you're going with?

      The tens of millions of people playing Wow/swtor/rift/otherMMOs on windows (and another few million on linux) worldwide, along witht he 35+ million using Steam (also on windows and linux), and the millions and millions of others .... would all like to have a word with you. That word is "reality". You should try living in it sometime.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    6. Re:Not even remotely true by dywolf · · Score: 1

      ROFL. some android fanboi went through and modded down every single post replying to this joker about his claim that android is king of the gaming world...

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    7. Re:Not even remotely true by tehcyder · · Score: 2

      Android is becoming the primary gaming platform.

      Christ, and I thought Apple fanboys were out of touch with reality...

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    8. Re:Not even remotely true by Kadagan+AU · · Score: 1

      Look at anything by gameloft!

      --
      This space for rent, inquire within.
    9. Re:Not even remotely true by Krneki · · Score: 1

      Priceless, console players looking down to android (ouya or phones) and telling themselves how can anyone play on this inferior hardware.

      Look, console players, for us hard-core gamers it is you who are playing on inferior hardware in a caged environment.

      --
      Love many, trust a few, do harm to none.
    10. Re:Not even remotely true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      AirAttack HD, Another World, Asphalt 6, Asphalt 7, BackStab, Beach Buggy Blitz, Blazing Star, Cordy, Cordy 2, Dangerous HD, Dead Space, Dead Trigger, Destroy Gunners F, Destroy Gunners SP, Destroy Gunners Z, Destroy Gunners ZZ, Dodonpachi Resurrection, Fruit Ninja THD, Galaxy on Fire 2 THD, Glow Hockey 2, Grand Prix Story, Grand Theft Auto III, Grand Theft Auto: Vice City, Gunman Clive, Jetpack Joyride, Let's Golf, Let's Golf 2, Mass Effect: Infiltrator, Max Payne, Megatroid, Metal Slug, Metal Slug 2, Metal Slug 3, Metal Slug X, Monopoly, Need for Speed Hot Pursuit, Need for Speed Most Wanted, N.O.V.A., N.O.V.A. 2, N.O.V.A. 3, OpenTyrian, Pinball HD, Pocket RPG, Pool Break Pro, Puddle THD, Raiden Legacy, R-Type, Riptide GP, Sacred Odyssey: Rise of Ayden HD, Sector Strike, Shadow Guardian, Shadowgun, Shine Runner, Six Guns, Solar Warfare, Sprinkle, Star Control II: The Ur-Quan Masters, Star Wars Pinball, Starfront Collision HD, The Amazing Spider-Man, The Bard's Tale, The Dark Knight Rises, The Settlers HD, Tom Clancy's H.A.W.X., Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Shadow Vanguard, Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell Conviction, Waking Mars, Wind-up Knight, Wisp, World of Goo.

      Those are just off the top of my head. If you need more, I can provide.

    11. Re:Not even remotely true by bmsleight · · Score: 1

      Wow - these games are never even on my radar. Any FreeCIV like games for android ? (Apart from FreeCiv its self)

    12. Re:Not even remotely true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You might like The Settlers HD. It's not on Google Play though, you'll have to buy it from Gameloft's site directly.

  37. Microsoft Hardware DRM by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    I guess everything is microsoft and therefore we can blame them for everything!

    I think that is going a bit far Microsoft should receive blame for insisting on draconian DRM on its [not your] tablet, as well as draconian DRM within its software.

    Hardware DRM
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardware_restrictions#Windows_8 [wikipedia.org]

    Trusted Computing
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing [wikipedia.org]

    1. Re:Microsoft Hardware DRM by exomondo · · Score: 1
      Yes i'm aware of Microsoft DRM, you are seemingly ignorant of all the non-Microsoft DRM, why is that?

      I think that is going a bit far Microsoft should receive blame for insisting on draconian DRM on its [not your] tablet

      I didn't realize Microsoft owned my iPad or my Playstation, why do you believe they do?

  38. Low frame rate of Road Rash by tepples · · Score: 1

    That would be the SMS version of Road Rash

    Look at the low frame rate because it has to do all the hill processing in software. Then compare it to the smoothness that is Rad Racer 2.

    World Grand Prix too

    No hills. To get hills + high frame rate, you need vertical scrolling by the strip, something that among third-gen consoles, only Nintendoes.

    And there's nothing even close to Space Harrier on the Nintendo.

    Let's see: 3D Battles of Worldrunner, Tetra Star, Cosmic Epsilon...

    Or the dungeon animation in Phantasy Star.

    I'll grant that that uses one of the strengths of the SMS: tile flipping combined with draw-time VRAM writing.

    1. Re:Low frame rate of Road Rash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Road Rash was just poorly made. It had low frame rates on every system that it came out on.

    2. Re:Low frame rate of Road Rash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not arguing pro or con, just point out that...

      Road Rash vs Rad Racer 2: Road Rash had 2 rear view mirrors, no sprite flickering, and the car could never leave the ground. It's not exactly a completely valid comparison.

      3D Battles of Worldrunner vs Space Harrier: Sprite flickering, and the game itself looks like garbage. I count only about 6 items on the screen at any given time (two pillars, a star / powerup, the hero, and two enemies) compared to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vzGWF2AiGo where shit was thrown in your face like it was going out of business. All those games have tiny sprites compared to Space Harrier. Given the choice of eye candy, I'd go with SH without hesitation.

      I seriously wouldn't have used those examples to prove your point... lol

  39. Sony DRM free gaming console by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    yeah its not like sony or nintendo or apple or blizzard or ea or ubisoft has drm huh? its all microsoft!

    Ironically in context of this article my playstation console phone is running a third party OS, and because its cool you can use up a playstation 3 controller on all playstation certified phones. I support open hardware and shun overreaching DRM. As for you thinking others acting badly makes you think its acceptable for your bad behaviour its not, the fact that Microsoft is the only one on the list that does this on a General Personal Computer with a monopoly status just makes them he worst offender.

    1. Re:Sony DRM free gaming console by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ironically in context of this article my playstation console phone is running a third party OS

      ...and mine cant, you know why? sony DRM, so fuck off you sony shill and place the blame where it is due: at microsoft, sony, nintendo, apple, blizzard, ea, ubisoft and anybody who produces DRM encumbered products.

      the fact that Microsoft is the only one on the list that does this on a General Personal Computer with a monopoly status just makes them he worst offender.

      and fuckstick sony shills like you give sony a free pass because of it.

  40. Open Console by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    No, but Microsoft used roughly GameCube quality hardware in the first generation Xbox: essentially a Celeron 733 and a GeForce 3.

    In the context on this article a lot of us bought the original xbox, because of it being *relatively* open console. In the context of this article one of the killer features that people want is "Xbox Media Center"(XBMC) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XBMC

    1. Re:Open Console by rephlex · · Score: 1

      This simply isn't true. XBMC on the Raspberry Pi is actually a rather poor experience. The Ouya is reputed to be powerful enough to decode H.264 in at least 1080p24 (using the ARM CPUs NEON instructions on all four of its cores) if need be, i.e. no video decode hardware acceleration necessary This ability might come in handy with some non-standard H.264 content that the Pi can't play.

    2. Re:Open Console by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL, "relatively open" after you hacked the shit out of it, voiding your warranty, for the express purpose of pirating. The Xbox was about as "open" of a console as the PS1/Dreamcast, in that they were all very easy to pirate.

      Ouya, on the other hand, is "open" the way the Atari 2600 or Android phones are, in that there is absolutely zero quality control for the software being produced, meaning you have to wade through hundreds of piles of shit to get to a few indie gems that are just "ok," most of which can be played on Steam or your phone or iPhone or downloaded on Xbox Live and PSN.

  41. Too much made of this . . . by Kimomaru · · Score: 2

    Pointing out that the Ouya doesn't compare well with other ARM devices is like complaining that the Cadillac CTS doesn't keep pace with a Ferrarri - the Oya's not supposed to be a work horse. It wasn't designed to be one and it wasn't a priority. The bigger problem it has is that its controller, from what I've read, feels "mushy" and suffers from high latency. That's an actual problem. You can still make some pretty cool games with the console and it's pretty wide open so at least there'll be some enthusiasm by the developer community. For heaven's sake, the homebrew community still writes for the Intellivision! ;) Let's give Ouya some breathing space, I think it's a pretty ambitious little project and everyone's going to learn something from it. I'll pick it up when it's released.

    1. Re:Too much made of this . . . by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      gee, think that latency is from the fact the damn thing cant keep up with polling the controller at least at 60Hz while it struggles to run 3 year old phone games?

    2. Re:Too much made of this . . . by bfandreas · · Score: 2

      What the snippet did was quite stupid. It basically compared mobile chipsets. The first 60 places are taken by the most powerful chipset in production today. It's not news at all that the Tegra3 has been surpassed.

      What kind of idiot would say the Ouya is a bad machine because 70 machines with the more powerful chipset get a better benchmark. Isn't the Ouya using a T33? They should have compared it to a TF700. And even then they should still point out that the Ouya software still is in beta for a couple of months. While ASUS bloat is eternal...

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    3. Re:Too much made of this . . . by Kimomaru · · Score: 1

      That's exactly right.

    4. Re:Too much made of this . . . by Jaysyn · · Score: 1

      The bigger problem it has is that its controller, from what I've read, feels "mushy" and suffers from high latency. That's an actual problem.

      Are you talking about the Dev consoles or the ones that are actually shipping to regular backers?

      http://www.ouya.tv/its-all-about-control/

      --
      There is a war going on for your mind.
    5. Re:Too much made of this . . . by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The problem is in this case is it is more a comparison of a 60's VW beetle versus a 2013 model Ferrari. but without the price difference. Ouya does not compare well on performance or even value for performance. current gen consoles can be had for under $250, often under $200 and performance exponentially better. Even other android devices leave it behind performance wise meaning this is a device that will never even get to run the cream of the android games let alone anything that is likely to inspire it as a home console choice. It isn't even good enough for those that want a cheap console as a bundled Wii or cheap 360 bundle at a sale is a far better choice or even an android tablet.

    6. Re:Too much made of this . . . by Kimomaru · · Score: 1

      I think that it was the concensus by anyone who has recieved it so far. I think I read it on Gamasutra or Kotaku or something.

  42. Console Snobbery by tuppe666 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Face it, you can't have great, immersive, polished, professional-quality games for $2.99

    Ignoring the fact that you have not looked at Google Play recently :) Lets spend a little time looking at costs.
    http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/entertainmentnewsbuzz/2010/02/anatomy-of-a-60-dollar-video-game.html

    These figures are rough and back in 2010 by Steve Perlman, founder of OnLive That bring the cost of a video game down to $27. For your $2.99 Andoird game the developers pay $25 for registration to distribute on the Google Play Store. Application developers receive 70 percent of the application price...leaving you with $2.09

    A quick look at the console market http://www.vgchartz.com/ and consoles average about 80M potential customers at the end of a consoles useful life. Android is Heading towards 1Billion activations, and continue to grow [currently only 12.5x larger than Consoles].

    I am making no claims that more money can be made from Android games than tradition console gaming, but comparing on total selling price alone is foolish when Android market is massive and continues to growl; there is no second hand market; risks are smaller; development costs cheaper; Customers buy more games; Alternative revenue streams.

    That is ignoring the fact that your favourite engine spits out binaries that will work on a plethora of platforms...Look at Unity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unity_(game_engine)

    1. Re:Console Snobbery by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      I also game a lot on my Transformer Prime(which with similar specs is 10 places behind the Ouya in that chart). I also rather buy my indie titles for Android.

      But the GP has a point. Not the one he is making but a similar one. It is very, very hard to find good games on Google Play. They are buried underneath fart apps and cow-clickers. Google Play has no information whatsoever on controller support. You basically get buried under an avalanche of crap.

      If you compare it to Steam then it is not very good. Steam at least has a link to metacritic which in turn has links to lots of reviews you can read to get an idea if the game is finished and any good. I know of no Android gaming news site that isn't entirely aweful and have to rely on gaming news delivered by the nVidia news apps. Which as a news source is absolutely terrible.

      The sheer amount of crap the numerous gems are buried remind me of the video game crash of the 80ies.

      OTOH I hear of talk to bring the new kickstarted Shadowrun game to Android. Yet this has generated no buzz whatsoever in the Android gaming scene.

      Also I find it rather shocking how little people know about their Android devices. The son of one of my colleagues is currently interning with us. He had no idea that he could pair a PS3 controller to his Android device and that the better games do support it. It took his dad's boss to show him what proper games look like on that device class. People are not using their hardware to full potential due to lack of knowledge. If they knew then theyd consider building the Ouya an actual no-brainer. A historic neccessity. Unavoidable. I mean, how brilliant is the idea to build a consle from off-the-shelf inexpensive electronic parts for a platfomr that already has tons of viable games? All they need to do is make sure they sift the crap and promote the hell out of the good games.

      On a side note:
      Only buy Gameloft games after you have thouroughly informed yourself on the particular title. Most of them are iPad ports and don't support PS3 controllers. And if they do the support is rather sketchy. Their customer support says that they may add support at a future time. But games like the excellent Samurai Vengeance 2 seem to be abandoned. And with on-screen controls this game sadly becomes just another cow-clicker.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    2. Re:Console Snobbery by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You should hit up the random Android sites for game recommendations, or take a look at the "highest paid" or "highest grossing" games in the Play Store.

      You might also want to just pop in "game controller" into the search in the Play Store. Most games that have controller support specifically say so as a feature.

    3. Re:Console Snobbery by DrEldarion · · Score: 1

      Android is ridiculously successful and headed towards 1 billion devices, yes, but only a small percentage of those users play games at all, and only a small percentage of those gamers want anything other than small time wasters like Angry Birds or Draw Something. There is very, very little demand for anything as epic or immersive as Skyrim, Portal, etc.

  43. The rise of the Android Console by tuppe666 · · Score: 2

    However, people who want to play Android games will play them on their Android phones (if they have one)

    Absolutely, and their tablets too. Ignoring the fact that they in themselves are pretty good game platforms. I have owned a Android console from Sony over 18Months http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xperia_Play. Right now the Ouya is not the only successful kick-starter Android console http://gamestick.tv/ or that there are gaming tablets from Archos http://www.archos.com/products/themed/gamepad/index.html?country=us&lang=en#a Wikipad’s and 7-inch Android gaming tablet called Wikipad http://www.wikipad.com/...or even that Sony have introduced native DUALSHOCK 3 controller support for Xperia phones http://techcrunch.com/2013/04/09/sony-adding-dualshock-3-controller-support-to-xperia-devices/ Android gaming as you can see is taking off right now...even with traditional controllers.

    1. Re:The rise of the Android Console by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 0

      You can't really call the Ouya a success. It will fail as will all those other throw away budget android consoles. Buying a console isn't about spending less money. It's about getting good games and anyone who works with android seems to forget that.

  44. What's the point of Ouya then? by kamikazekenjistagg16 · · Score: 1

    So, that means people with one of these: 10: LG Nexus 4 (13.2% Popularity) 17: Sony Xperia Z (5.2% Popularity) 58: Samsung Galaxy S III (2.9% Popularity) Can just hook their phone up to their TV, grab an android compatible controller, and have the same thing, if not more, than an Ouya.

    1. Re:What's the point of Ouya then? by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      Yup. that's what this is saying. It's just a benchmark. Not a measure of what the machine does with the power.
      Pretty useless information given there are a gazillion other benchmark tests for mobile chipsets out there that show exactly the same thing: Tegra3 isn't the new hotness anymore. Tegra4(mostly built with unobtainium) propably is.

      ...yawn...

      The submitter is propably one of those raving idiots who hate the Ouya for what he thinks it should be but it never tried to achieve. I don't understand the amount of hate this thing generates. It's quite lovely, actually.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    2. Re:What's the point of Ouya then? by Yosho · · Score: 1

      To be fair, all of those will cost you at least $300 if you don't want a contract with a cell phone carrier. It'll be more than that over time if you do sign up for a contract. That's not including a controller. The Ouya is $100 and comes with a controller. So... that's a pretty big advantage.

      The Ouya also has ethernet and full-size USB and HDMI ports, which are very nice to have. You can also root it without voiding your warranty, unlike any of the above phones if you're on a contract.

      But sure, if you've already got one of those phones, a compatible controller, any cables you need, don't mind walking over to the TV and hooking everything up, rendering your phone unusable as a phone while it's function as a game console, and don't mind being subject to your carrier's whims, then an Ouya might not have a lot of appeal for you.

      --
      Karma: Terrifying (mostly affected by atrocities you've committed)
  45. Re:Silly headline--the performance is plenty excit by bfandreas · · Score: 1

    Yup. Tegra 3 does a lot of good games. Visuals are a bit vintage 15 years ago, but for such a machine it is still impressive. The next gen SoCs are even more impressive. The Riptide GP2 Tegra4 demo was eyewateringly pretty and I really can't wait for the next gen tablet that tickles my fancy.

    The great thing about this is: these SoCs run off batteries. And they are playing a very quick game of catch-up with the big guys.

    I think games like Puddle and Osmos(which I run on my Prime) look amazing. Machinarium is also quite nice looking. How a game looks nowadays depends more on the artist than the technology used.

    --
    20 minutes into the future
  46. Windows Experience Index by tepples · · Score: 1

    but if i buy a pc game it requires at least a certain type of graphics card and at least a certain speed of cpu and at least certain amount of ram

    That's what the Windows Experience Index was supposed to fix: give the user a "generation" to which a particular PC corresponds and which games can target.

  47. No route to host by tepples · · Score: 1

    the low %age of tablet/phone/stick users that *are* willing to pay for and carry a gamepad is quite a large market

    That would be reassuring provided I can get fixes for three problems. First, can you cite a source known for fact-checking that would agree with the claim that a non-trivial number of Android smartphone and tablet users carry a gamepad? Second, a lot of Android devices' Bluetooth controllers are incompatible with the driver applications for these controllers, returning things like "No route to host" and "Protocol not supported" (source). Third, when Google has pushed Android updates to users, some of the driver applications broke. For example, the upgrade from 4.1 to 4.2 on the Nexus 7 tablet broke the Sixaxis Controller app (for the Dual Shock 3) for a while, and it broke the Wiimote Controller app (for the Wii Remote), which is still broken.

    As for price: go for the $50 MK808B and you don't suppass the Ouya

    But are there enough MK808B users that targeting a game to the MK808B becomes viable? The advantage of Ouya is that there are tens of thousands of devices on preorder that all have at least one controller. True, after you've made an Ouya game, porting it to any other Android device becomes trivial, and a developer could use his revenue from sales on Ouya to fund QA on some of these other devices.

    1. Re:No route to host by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      True, after you've made an Ouya game, porting it to any other Android device becomes trivial

      I wouldn't say that until you've tried it.

    2. Re:No route to host by obarthelemy · · Score: 1

      the thing is, contrary to the Ouya, devs don't have to support each and every device: Android offers a Gamepad API (since 2.3, I think). Implement/support that, and you've opened up the market of *all* Android devices with a gamepad. Not just the MK808B, but every Android phone, tablet, stick... I'm even wondering if the Ouya isn't using that very same API, in which case work is essentially zero.

      The advantage of the "standard" approach is that there are millions of devices out there, probably hundreds of thousands with access to a gamepad, and more willing to get one once games are available.

      --
      The Cloud - because you don't care if your apps and data are up in the air.
  48. People fit around a single by tepples · · Score: 1

    is "open" the way the Atari 2600

    The 1983-1984 downfall of the Atari 2600 is not quite as relevant in the Web era, and here's why:

    meaning you have to wade through hundreds of piles of shit

    Reviewers will have done this wading for you.

    a few indie gems that are just "ok," most of which can be played on Steam

    Steam games run on PCs, and though virtually all TVs can display PC video, few people actually take advantage of it. PCs tend to be connected to much smaller monitors than consoles. How many people can you fit around a single desktop (or worse, laptop) PC monitor? So until the Steam Box actually comes out, or until more than a trivial number of people start building living-room gaming PCs, PCs are believed not to be a viable option for game genres that depend on same-screen multiplayer. Single-player, yes; online FPS/RTS/RPG, yes; but not fighting games and cooperative platformers and the like that depend on the sort of cohesion that comes from being in a room together with friends.

    or your phone or iPhone

    Ouya comes with a game controller. What still-manufactured phone comes with a game controller? Or should everybody be buying a used Xperia Play?

    or downloaded on Xbox Live and PSN.

    Say I have a finished PC game that I want to bring to Xbox Live or PSN. What's the best practice for making my company and my game look attractive to Microsoft and Sony?

    1. Re:People fit around a single by CronoCloud · · Score: 1

      Say I have a finished PC game that I want to bring to Xbox Live or PSN. What's the best practice for making my company and my game look attractive to Microsoft and Sony?

      I don't know..ask the companies that have already done it. Lots of small devleoper games on PSN. It seems to help to be an established development house...first timers should stick with PC and portable to prove themselves...then you can contact Sony

      And don't complain about the reality of the situation and how Sony and Nintendo should just let every basement dweller with a puzzle game clone publish on PSN/Wii Shop....thems the limitations and you have to live with them.

  49. Perfect for indie games by halitus · · Score: 1

    A lot of the the new, popular indie games available aren't exactly taxing on system requirements. Granted some of them could stand a bit of optimization, but having a common framework and a fixed hardware target (exacly what the Ouya provides) really will help there

    Ouya could also be a way for good indie games to get noticed in the first place, due to having less competition. With Google Play having almost a million apps already, it's hard for the developers to get their games discovered among all those thousands of tower defense clones and such, unless they can afford some real marketing.

    Maybe with Ouya many niche genres such as turn-based strategy games (a genre that has completely been overrun by real-time clickfest games) could flourish again. I've been toying with the idea of porting my hex strategy game Populus Romanus and its successor to Ouya, but haven't taken a look yet how much the different control method would need changes in the application, compared to the ordinary Android touch interface.

  50. Define "solid hours of gameplay" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Some people think only the "main quest" in an RPG counts, not the side quests. but some RPGs have relatively short main quests and fill up the time with side quests.

    Some people consider gameplay to be the shooting or slashing or jumping or whatever you do, so even if you're repeating a level just for an achievement, that counts towards the hours of gameplay.

    Some people count multiplayer.

    Some people (as pointed out by another AC) don't consider the quantity of gameplay as opposed to quality.

  51. Android update broke Wii Remote connectivity by tepples · · Score: 1

    Robert Broglia's popular series of emulators for Android all support using a Wii controller -- or a Wii Classic Controller -- because they're just Bluetooth devices and the pairing is straightforward.

    If the pairing is so straightforward, then why is the Wiimote Controller application still broken on Android 4.2?

  52. Something fishy by sl4shd0rk · · Score: 1

    In January, Penny Arcade said the Devs confirm [ouya] best in class performance

    What has changed in a couple months that this isn't the case now? Maybe some faster phones came out to drive the curve up? In the link above, Ouya states this thing isn't meant to compete with the "big boxes" and points out the cost of $100US. I don't think there is anything different performance-wise than what Ouya originally stated. It still outperforms the Nexus 7 which isn't so bad.

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    Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
  53. Re:Silly headline--the performance is plenty excit by citizenr · · Score: 1

    What makes the Ouya exciting is it's ability to play games and it's performance exceeds several existing platforms which have worked fine for playing games. Ouya is ranked 73rd because of it's score of 4077.

    This beats the following popular platforms (score/name):

    This is also SLOWER than $44 chinese Android noname stick.

    --
    Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
  54. Proving oneself by tepples · · Score: 1

    first timers should stick with PC and portable to prove themselves

    Let's assume you're right about this. If by "portable" you mean Nintendo 3DS and PlayStation Vita, first timers still need to prove themselves to gain access to those platforms. If by "portable" you mean smartphones, what's the best practice for emulating a gamepad on a flat sheet of glass?

    1. Re:Proving oneself by CronoCloud · · Score: 1

      If by "portable" you mean Nintendo 3DS and PlayStation Vita, first timers still need to prove themselves to gain access to those platforms. If by "portable" you mean smartphones, what's the best practice for emulating a gamepad on a flat sheet of glass?

      In this case I mean Android and iOS. And enough with the "best case" crap, figure it out, it's not that hard.

      The best case for emulating a gamepad on a touchscreen is to NOT do it and do a game designed for touch controls. But yes I know you want to do gamepad-console style games, but thems the breaks.

      Do a couple of phone/tablet games and maybe you can do a game designed for a gamepad on a REAL portable or living room console.

      But it's pretty obvious that you have to pay your dues first, Though if y ou're real lucky you can show of some kind of prootype that's good enough.isn't it?

    2. Re:Proving oneself by tepples · · Score: 1

      And enough with the "best case" crap, figure it out, it's not that hard.

      "You're doing it wrong." "I did the best I could." "But it's still wrong, and you should have known this in the first place." I'm trying to figure out what I ought to know before starting.

      The best case for emulating a gamepad on a touchscreen is to NOT do it and do a game designed for touch controls.

      How would, say, Mega Man have been designed if Capcom had been stuck on a platform with touch controls?

      But it's pretty obvious that you have to pay your dues first

      I understand this. At this point I'm looking for acceptable methods of payment, or how a fan of games in gamepad genres can "learn to stop worrying and love" games in touch genres.

      Though if y ou're real lucky you can show of some kind of prootype that's good enough.isn't it?

      I'm a bit confused as to whether you believe a prototype is good enough.

  55. If you care about these kinds of benchmarks... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... you are simply not in the target audience.

    TL;DR: Whoooosh.

  56. I MIGHT be interested or $100 if... by trdrstv · · Score: 1

    Someone ports Ubuntu & I can boot strait into Steam "Big Picture mode".

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