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China Criticizes US For Making Weapon Plans Steal-able, Alleges Attacks From US
Etherwalk writes "Huang Chengqing, China's top internet security official, alleged that cyberattacks on China from people in the U.S. are as serious as those from China on the U.S. 'We have mountains of data, if we wanted to accuse the U.S., but it's not helpful in solving the problem.' Huang, however, does not necessarily attribute them to the U.S. government just because they came from U.S. soil, and he thinks Washington should extend the same courtesy. 'They advocated cases that they never let us know about. Some cases can be addressed if they had talked to us, why not let us know? It is not a constructive train of thought to solve problems.' In response to the recent theft of U.S. military designs, he replied with an observation whose obviousness is worthy of Captain Hammer: 'Even following the general principle of secret-keeping, it should not have been linked to the Internet.'"
A few experts think China's more cooperative attitude has come about precisely because the U.S. government has gone public with hacking allegations.
"This is what I was wearing when China stole my weapons schematics. Tell me I asked for it."
Fuck off with your victim blaming, China. Pricks.
Why are such important files internet accessible ? I mean that's security 101 for top secret stuff
But it does put us in the midst of a second cold war
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
Whilst I'm not saying China doesn't do any state sponsored hacking I've pointed out before that China has the largest online population of any nation and has about 1/6th of the world's population. Statistically if you get non-state sponsored hackers in every nation it makes sense that you're going to see more from China than anywhere else.
It's quite possible that it's nothing to do with the US "going public" and everything to do with the fact that a large number of hack attacks from China against the US is pretty much a statistical certainty regardless of state actors being behind it or not.
I think all governments do state sponsored hacking, I certainly think China does, to what extent is unclear but I do think at least the claims against China are probably overhyped.
Which may not inherently be a bad thing anyway though I guess if it gets Western firms to take security a bit more seriously so maybe there's a silver lining regardless.
Whatever, its not like its going to start WW3... moving on.
If the Chinese use the data appropriately, it can stop WW3 from ever starting by giving them the chance to disable our defenses through software without firing a single shot. They just need to get a Chinese Jeff Goldblum to upload a virus to our mother ship with his Chinese made Macbook.
It isn't likely that this would start a full out war, but it has the possibility of starting another cold war between the US and China. Not nearly as many lives are lost, except perhaps people dying in hospitals because the governments are spending more money on defense than on medicare.
Even if all this rhetoric does is give both countries a reason to waste trillions on excessive defense spending, that is already pretty bad.
-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
We've got a lot of more tech to buy and dollars to spend and need an enemy to justify it. The middle east isn't a viable technological terrorist...China is.
So they are the new corner stone of the next Axis of Evil. I'm not saying China isn't trying to pentest our stuff. I'm sure they are, and we are reciprocating. I just know we are going to exagerate to subsidize the raytheon's and bae systems et al.
Whatever, its not like its going to start WW3... moving on.
If relations sour enough that China stops rolling over and buying more US T-bills and starts selling off its holdings, the collapse of the Dollar will drastically exacerbate the US economic collapse. This could easily lead to a WW III situation.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
I always thought it was a rule from Espionage 101 that you don't let the other side know when your side has been compromised. You use it as an opportunity to start sending out false information, and to learn their tactics and precisely who is involved. I don't understand why we are telling everyone in the world that the Chinese have stolen our information. It just makes us look inept in all sorts of ways.
Proverbs 21:19
Also, how do we know that the IP address from the US is not just a VPN endpoint?
Any nation-state that does no espionage is irresponsible. They all do it. It's a game, and someone on the US side made a poor move.
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
You think US would allow their most sophisticated weapon design to be stolen by kids in China? No. I think what's really happening behind the scene are: a) the designs are faked -- it wants to drain Chinese resources on building something that never works b) US government wants to introduce a legislature to curb on internet activity. They put out this type of news to support their intent. c) all the above
I spend most of my time NOT being in debt up to my eyeballs. No credit cards, no loans, no student debt, no insurance, no drivers license, no mortgage... I can tell you as a casual observer of the world media, and a former soldier, that war is profitable...and if it's not, cleaning up the mess is. Ask Halliburton, and look into their purchase of Boots and Coots bout a week or so before the Big Oozy (gulf oil spill). Ask the schools that they are building in Iraq that fall over in a nominal wind storm. Ask Ray Nagin bout how he helped to spend the Katrina Relief funds on things like a house in Dallas. Most of this world is pissy right now about the inordinate amount of debt in the world, and how everyone is now paying the price for bad business at the top. 40% of the debt in the US is student loans. Who owns you...that is, how much money do you owe to banks, and what can they take from you if you don't toe the line?
There are three kinds of people in the world. Those that can count, and those that can't.
I do hope that means a second space race. If China seriously looked like they were about to set the first man on Mars, or establish a long-term moon base, I think America would have to devote billions of dollars to doing it first just to defend their national ego. Again.
But it does put us in the midst of a second cold war
Not even. China can get all butt-hurt if they want, but they'll NEVER put themselves in a position where they can't trade with the US, that would be suicide. China is acting all butt-hurt when we all know they have far more to gain by spying on us than we have to gain by spying on them, economically. We gain by spying on their military strategy, foriegn policy, and disposition of forces.
Python: 'And then suddenly you have a language which says "we're all stuck with whatever the whiniest coder wants".'
According to the RIAA, that's worse.
The obviously count every single automatic attack on the sshd port, made from millions hacked zombie computers from all over the world, as 'data'. Not serious.
These machines shouldn't have been connected to the internet... They also shouldn't have been running OSX or Windows. From there, freaking use LUKS to prevent physical threat and otherwise don't allow Chinese nationals to come into rooms with sensitive data.
I wish my country would come up with a decent security policy...of course, this could've all been a trick, and they could have potentially placed these in a convenient location with compromised plans designed to just cost money and explode...but I don't give the bureaucrats that much credit.
The Mandiant report was pretty damning.
"In over 97% of the 1,905 times Mandiant observed APT1 intruders connecting to their attack infrastructure, APT1 used IP addresses registered in Shanghai and systems set to use the Simplified Chinese language."
Oh, sure, it's probably just random hackers that really like that network...
Here's an update:
https://www.mandiant.com/blog/apt1-months-significantly-impacted-active-rebuilding/
Holy crap! Even more reason to ensure my car doors are locked, lest it end up in China. :-) ]
[ and a car analogy to boot
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
And by the same virtue the Democratic Party is the Republican Party and the Republican Party is the Democratic Party in America.
Both serve the corporations.
If it's any help- I think it's too late to do anything about it.
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
Let them steal the plans, but use a honeypot of plans that when implemented don't work or leave traces that they were stolen.
WalMart has outsourced the production of plastic flower pots and patio furniture to China for decades - the Chinese are simply reversing the process! By letting U.S. taxpayers fund the billions of dollars per year we pour into military R&D, they save massive amounts of money and man hours, and are guaranteed the best designs that 17 year old Chinese Red-Bull & Cheetos-fuelled hax0rs can steal.
Take a copy-catted F22 Raptor, paint a Chinese air force insignia on it, and * VOILA! * Fifth generation air superiority fighter MINUS the 20 years of research and testing.
What you say? Their copy is only 85% as good as ours because they made shortcuts in the radar, or avionics, or missile systems? That's OK, our congress will keep paring down the final platform order until our air force ends up only getting 200 F22s, while the Chinese will manufacture 1,150 of theirs.
The current US military philosophy is starting to look more and more like WW2 era Germany, with absolute faith placed in a relatively small number of extremely expensive, extremely high quality weapons systems, which ultimately were smothered and overrun by a developing nation (the U.S.) with phenomenal industrial capacity capable of running M4 tanks, jeeps, B17 bombers, and numerous other things off assembly lines faster than the Germans could destroy them.
The comparative ironies to today's military situation are incredible.
THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY LEFT BLANK.
Satanic lizard demons
And by Satanic lizard demons you mean "the Joooooos".
Israel has been caught, many times, stealing and spying. Yet, I have never seen a US President complain about this. Why?
The next enemy for America is China. Right now the US is in cold war with them. But it's going to get hot soon. Much of what is happening in the Middle East is about controlling the oil and thus, China.
The next battlespace will be Africa.
America is sleep walking, as usual, into a war with China.
What a brilliant idea.
Or you could put them in camps and gas them.
People like you are the reason we are fucked.
The next battlespace will be Africa
Next? WTF do you call what is going on there now?
Oh, I'm sorry sir, I thought you were referring to me, Mr. Wensleydale.
'Even following the general principle of secret-keeping, it should not have been linked to the Internet.'"
You think so??? Really? This is a novel concept to our American Information Security Industry, please, tell us more! Surely you don't mean that power plants and water treatment facilities and power grids and other sensitive facilities should not be linked to the internet...HOW THE FUCK ARE THE OPERATORS GOING TO GET TO FACEBOOK IF WE DISCONNECT THEM!?!?!?!?
Perhaps not. If Chinese officials and U.S. Officials all pay lip service to the same corporations, people, dynasties, or whatever...
Listen. I am an American citizen and I do not want our secret whatever weapons plans stolen by ANYONE. We paid good tax money for those space lasers and trained velociraptor dragoons. I'd like to think we could actually go to war without all our wonderful toys being obsolete.
So why is the US government putting our top secret hush hush designs ON THE F"ING INTERNET LIKE DRUNKEN COEDS POSTING THEIR BOOBS ON FACEBOOK!
From here on out... lets just make a rule. If you're just straight up illiterate of computer science then do the universe a favor and don't get put in charge of computer ANYTHING. The degree of ignorance and incompetence out of government lately seems almost comical. Its as if the point is to illistrate that you're stupid. Is that what I'm to take from these events? I should hope not. Because if you can't be trusted with something as basic as keeping a few weapons plans secret then you're not capable of actually doing anything. Keeping a couple secrets is fundamental. Do it or its time to just dissolve the whole thing and start over.
You are embarrassing yourself and us by extension. Stop it. Are the Chinese spying on you? Do men look at a women that runs naked through a park? Put your damn clothes on.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
China has about 3 times our population, which means they have about 3 times as many skilled hackers (or will soon). This doesn't bode well for US in a cyberwar.
Immigration amnesty is starting to look more attractive.
Table-ized A.I.
You would really agree to fly to Mars for 6-7 months in the cold vacuum of space in a spaceship with a big "Made in China" sticker on it?
My father does a good job of capturing the sheer absurdity, I think.
Me: So, apparently China says that not only are we just as guilty of attacking them, but it's our own damn fault they were able to get at the data. ... I need a moment.
Him: Let me get this straight, China's response to our accusations of cyber-espionage is basically "I know I am, but what are you?"
Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*
The US Gov allowed this to happen. How else will the US GOV fleece the tax payers for billions more for weapons development? This is a healthy ongoing event for the United States. When a country quits making history, they tend to die out. I just hope there is a few trojans in the plans the Chinese acquired. Anyone remember the Russian Trans Siberian pipeline explosion? There just might be a "chink" in the Great Wall of China.....courtesy of the CIA.
China: "It's your fault, you wore a red dress!"
USA: "Oo... You big bad boy... I love your money!"
These two need couple's counseling.
they'll NEVER put themselves in a position where they can't trade with the US, that would be suicide
Before 1914 the economic importance of "free trade" was used to explain why WWI would never happen.
Hell, there was a topic here just in the last week that counterattacking was SOP, whether it was objectively useful or not.
We can't allow an intrusion gap to develop!
No car, no license, complaining about mortgages. Do you rent, or did you have a mortgage previously? Do you even have a job, or do you live off of handouts (government disability or such)?
Some of us manage to pay down our house at a reasonable rate, and not owe any more than necessary for the life we want to live. No, I've never had a car payment, but that doesn't mean I have no car, or no license. And yes, I have insurance, to make sure my stuff is replaced if something bad happens. I can't be bothered to carry all my belongings with me at all times in a shopping cart.
Learn to love Alaska
We never ended the first. We have always been at war with eastasia. When the USSR fell and abandoned communism, we adopted a new communism to hate, one that was always on the list, just a little lower on the list.
Learn to love Alaska
Yes, the highest quality stuff comes from China. The problem is that the US manufacturers outsourced to China and asked for lowest build quality possible, then complained when they got what they asked for.
Learn to love Alaska