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Florida Law May Accidentally Ban Computers and Smartphones
GrueMaster writes "Did Florida ban computers and smartphones? They tried banning Internet Cafes, but the wording in the law is overly broad. '... it's the wording that's problematic, as it defines a slot machine as "any machine or device or system or network of devices" that can be used in games of chance. Turns out the Internet is full of gambling sites, which is where the definition runs into some problems. Consuelo Zapata, owner of the Miami-Dade county Internet cafe Incredible Investments, LLC, is suing the state (PDF) to overturn the ban, saying that definition is too broad and could be applied to any number of electronic devices. "
fuck Rick Scott.
Florida is a stupid as Texas, and twice as swampy.
They will be forgotten in a few years...
People responsible for crafting laws should be penalized for poor and vague wording.
Even if it was unintentionally vague (I suspect it is frequently intentional, too).
Talk about overly broad, isn't a coin a device that can be used in a game of chance?
Its mind boggling. Hey! They have a whole lot of hotels in Florida. MOST of them will have a complimentary computers to use in an office setting. Are they going to ban those computers so they cannot be used in Internet gambling? That will make an impression. It will impress people that Florida is braindead.
I thought everything that government did was well planned and orchestrated, directed by the corporations that own everything, including politicians. Next thing you know, somebody will challenge the idea of the all powerful military-industrial complex that has had its share of resources in the US budget reduced from 38% of GDP in 1945 to ~ 4-5% today. That is crazy talk.
much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
It is florida, afterall.
Are you sure?
http://gawker.com/5800990/did-florida-accidentally-ban-sex So, what is there left to do in Florida? Die?
There are reasons why Florida has its own tag on Fark.
This is one of them.
--
BMO
here
Please stop drawing a distinction between smartphones and computers (and tablets). They are all computers. Allowing the farce of distinction to survive is a major part of the reason smartphones can be classified as "applicances" and don't have to follow laws about openness and intercompatability.
I guess the rich dont need to use the cafes. But hey, I bet they are pretty handy for someone who didn't grow up with a computer. No setup fees. Maybe a little free help. No big startup cost on a fixed income. A reason to get out of the house. If there is any state in the union that should have them, its flori-duh.
With one signature, Internet cafes in Florida close
Effect on workers, patrons immediate when Scott makes bill law
http://www.floridatoday.com/article/20130411/BUSINESS/304110024/With-one-signature-Internet-caf-s-Florida-close?nclick_check=1
Applicances are not intercompatible with appliances and intercompatability between the word 'compatibility' and the prefix 'inter' is dubious at best. As is any claim you make.
"any machine or device or system or network of devices" that can be used in games of chance.
Anyone driven a car in Florida? Going to the grocery store is a game of chance down there. :-)
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
I draw the distinction based on whether someone else's permission is required for a given program to execute. Android devices are computers; iProducts and game consoles aren't.
This is roughly as stupid as when people claimed Florida banned sex a couple years ago. Read the bill. It clearly refers to devices that perform gaming function on activation; not general purpose devices.
Common sense, people. What is more likely? A hundred and forty legislators voting to ban computers, or a bogus lawsuit with a silly premise?
... is to file charges against the governor for possessing these now-illegal things.
now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
Just means they can't be used to compile C++ in Florida.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
No, it's not filled with cunts. There's alot of dinks there too.
rewriting history since 2109
You may call the pensioners, but yes, same thing.
Learn to love Alaska
The "internet cafes" near me (I'm in Florida) are certainly not there to be used as you would expect. You go in to buy credit to play games on the machines, which only have gambling programs. The definitions in this bill, and the word "internet cafe", are all being improperly used here. These shops were quite literally for gambling. The one closest to me was called "Lucky Day Internet Sweepstakes." I did see one where you could also browse the internet hourly, but this was clearly not the primary focus.
Have gnu, will travel.
I guess I'm breaking the law just by posting this :o
The Internet King? I wonder if he could provide faster nudity.
First off, these aren't the kind of internet cafe' one can go to and get on-line and check one's email or visit a web site. The computers only have gambling program(s) and it is basically a virtual slot machine. These places don't even offer wifi so you can bring your own computer. They are, in effect, illegal casinos.
Second, the law specifically defines the establishments and computers. It only applies to computers which are set up to ONLY run programs that are games of chance and the establishments that have them.
Third, the reason the law talks about internet cafe's is because that is what these places call themselves.
There is no "-1 offended" or "-1 you don't agree with me" mod options for a reason.
I'm sure it's been said already, but I just wanted to say, on behalf of the remaining Internet: THANK YOU!
An article describing these "Sweepstakes" parlors http://www.businessweek.com/printer/articles/55670-the-casino-next-door
BTW, I found this URL in a previous /. post, http://games.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3638315&cid=43421823
In their rush to infringe on the 2nd Amendment, New York unwittingly banned cops from carrying certain guns earlier this year:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NY_SAFE_Act#Criticisms
Poorly thought-out authoritarian extra-constititutional power-grabs aren't solely a left- or right-wing thing.
Then why can't the police just charge them under *existing* anti-gambling laws?
I don't trust Rick Scott or FL Republicans....seems every law passed in these places must have a secret second purpose that kicks back money/power to conservatives and their allies.
Who is benefitting from this 'internet cafe' ban?
Thank you Dave Raggett
Before you jump to defend the internet cafe owner, read his complaint. The "internet cafe" was a disguised gambling den.
TLDR:-
1. Their computers all carry a "Game Display" programme.
2. Buying internet time entitles the user to participate in sweepstakes where they can win prizes. The more time you buy, the more chances you get to join the sweepstakes.
3. The "Game Display" was expressly created to, in their own words, "instill in the patron a sense of excitement and entertainment".
Yes, the law is overly broad and should be reworded, but in this case it did not get the wrong victim.
Having said that, the politicians appear to be equally dirty. There is some suspicion that this legislation was about politicians covering their butts and keeping legalized gambling interests happy.
If gambling is illegal in Florida, why are people still allowed to bet on Wall Street? It's just another bookmaking operation
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Computers are tools of science, so maybe Florida really did intend on banning them.
A newer law seeks to ban anyone who admitted themselves for a phyc eval from owning guns, whether you passed or failed....
I am the unwilling control for my Origin.
Another government screwup, so what's new?
This isn't about making internet cafes illegal, it's targeted at the small gambling rooms that lure mostly old people.
but you can't actually ban one without the other.. well you could ban advertising gambling sites on the machines and the rooms the machines are in.
in fact, it's probably already banned? so why don't they enforce it?
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
The Greek government passed a similarly broadly-worded law in 2002 , also in its attempt to ban the games of chance (slot machines) that had infested cafes, pool halls and internet cafes. The wording of the law banned all video games, whether of chance or of skill, and whether they were played at home or at a business.
The article I'm linking is exaggerating; nobody was arrested or charged for playing video games at home (although the law allowed the authorities to do so). What the law really did was to eradicate all arcades, even those that had no slot machines. Want to play Pac-Man, Metal Slug and/or Street Fighter? Sorry, no go. Arcades started re-appearing more than five years later, even though the law is still in effect as far as I know.
Technology + lawmakers = stupidity. And we're not talking about cutting edge technology here, we're talking arcade video games that have been around since the 70s.
Improve at backgammon rapidly through addictive quickfire position quizzes: www.bgtrain.com
This is precisely what they intended, with "selective enforcement" being the tool of oppression.
A tyrannical State makes everything illegal, but "lets it slide" for friends of the State. I just read "Three Felonies a Day" by Harvey Silverglate, and it was a real eye opener. You would be amazed at all of the stuff that we do every day and take for granted as being legal, that isn't, and could result in federal prison should the State decide it.
The title of the book basically says it all - the average American unwittingly commits three serious felonies every day of their lives.
That's the goal of far too much legislation. This way law enforcement always has something they can charge people with that they don't like and lets everyone else go about their business. We no longer have a "rule of law" in this country, we have a "rule of staying on law enforcement's good side." In all likelihood, you committed 3 felonies yesterday and will do so again today:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704471504574438900830760842.html
When I see my local politicians doing this, it just shows how much they like the current setup:
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/06/ken-cuccinelli-virginia-oral-anal-sex-sodomy
Hell, that wording probably bans dice. No D&D at the local game store, I guess.
Florida shouldn't be allowed to make laws of vote. Seriously. They make California look good.
It should be possible, without a law degree, to deduct the laws of a society directly from common sense.
It should be possible but in practice it (unfortunately) is not. Our society is too complex and there are too many corner cases for any non-trivial problem to keep things simple. Furthermore you and I might very easily differ on what constitutes common sense and even if we do agree we could easily come to differing conclusions based on the exact same facts. I agree with you in principle but the real world just isn't as simple as you and I would like it to be. If you write a general rule trusting to "common sense" to fill in the details what you will end up with is a bunch of corner cases and people taking advantage of loopholes and causing problems until such time as the law is sufficiently clarified either through legal precedent or additional laws. The complexity will inevitably come.
According to the Florida Senate's website, section 849.16 reads:
The human brain and auditory system is a machine or device (both mechanical, through the eardrum, and electronic, because of the signals that pass along neurons) that can be activated (through a user saying "I bet you ...") and the user may receive or become entitled to money if the condition of the bet (which may rely upon an outcome unpredictable by the user) is satisfied. So unless the State of Florida has defined "machine" and "device" to exclude things with an organic component, which I'm guessing they have not done, a human being would satisfy the definition of "slot machine or device" according to a very technical reading and interpretation.
I had to check for myself to verify they had one, but yeah...ugh the state Lottery...
http://flalottery.com/
for what it's worth they have Monopoly branded lottery tickets
Thank you Dave Raggett
Florida Man bans smart phones, computers, and the Internet!
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
In the US an internet cafe is not a place you pay money for time on a desktop. In my experience such a business would be absolutely useless, because local libraries in both states I've lived have free desktops with free internet connections.
In Florida these "cafes" were basically gambling dens. You'd go in and buy an hour. This does not give you access to Internet Explorer, but it does give you access to a bunch of slot-machine like games. You click the buttons on the games, and you could win more internet time. If, at the end of the day, you still have internet time they refund it to you on a debit card.
Technically under the laws of Ohio, and Florida prior to the ban, you haven't gambled. But in practical terms you bought a bunch of bets on a slot machine and it paid off (or it didn't).
Which way is this post funnier:
1) The OP knows that the GOP holds all state-wide elected offices in Florida, a 76-44 edge in the House, and a 26-14 edge in the Senate.
2) He doesn't.
Brings back memories of trips to my Grandma's house in Florida when I was a little kid. She had a list of all the winning numbers from the last X months of drawings. Then she would let me pick the numbers for the next go. I never did better than two. I'm pretty sure that set me up for a lifetime of nerdy math and stats obsession.
Whats the matter, is it too difficult to send in a undercover cop and bust the bad ones? They have to ban them all? Extend that logic a bit and know horror.
I guess its ok then to make sure there cant be one. Forever.
"it defines a slot machine as "any machine or device or system or network of devices" that can be used in games of chance. " I think they do not realize they are also banning the "State Lottery" Since it is a system or network of devices that is used in games of chance. I think they better rethink the wording in that law. or no more education funding......hmmmm
>> "any machine or device or system or network of devices" that can be used in games of chance.
Besides card tables, this also includes Candyland and other board games with spinners or dice. The entire game is a "system."
One way to get the governor voted out of office would be for the state to ban the dreidel.
This is also a way to prevent any more Wheel of Fortune roadtrips to Florida.