Slashdot Mirror
The Little Bomb-Detecting Device That Couldn't
theodp writes "Widely deployed in Iraq and promoted by military leaders, BusinessWeek reports the ADE 651 bomb-detecting device had one little problem: it wouldn't detect explosives (earlier Slashdot story). 'The ADE 651,' reports Adam Higginbotham, 'was modeled on a novelty trinket conceived decades before by a former used-car salesman from South Carolina, which was purported to detect golf balls. It wasn't even good at that.' One thing the ADE 651 did excel at, however, was making money — estimates suggest that the authorities in Baghdad bought more than 6,000 useless bomb detectors, at a cost of at least $38 million. Even though ADE 651 manufacturer James McCormick was found guilty of three counts of fraud and sentenced to 10 years in prison in May, the ADE 651 is still being used at thousands of checkpoints across Baghdad. Elsewhere, authorities have never stopped believing in the detectors. Why? According to Sandia Labs' Dale Murray, the ideomotor effect is so persuasive that for anyone who wants or needs to believe in it, even conclusive scientific evidence undermining the technology it exploits has little power."
But, back when I did, I can tell you: a functional golf ball detector would've been very handy.
#DeleteChrome
James randi too was amazed at how basically all dowsers keep believing they have their special powers even after they've been thoroughly debunked.
Nobody can prove your claims to the contary for the make belive threats you countered
In Ramadi '05 we had these cool spray kits.
It was a little plastic case with several sprays and swabs with some instructions for various kinds of explosive testing.
One day we caught these dudes out on the desert who would dig up UXO's and sell them to local insurgents who would use them for IEDs.
Lat Long: 33.16845,43.635263
We had been trying to catch them for a while but they were on motorcycles... try catching a motorcycle in an up-armor hmmwv.
When we caught them, they didn't have any explosives on them. So we though, hey... why not try out this kit?
They tested positive for 2 kinds of explosives. So we detained them, shipped them off to the detention facility with all the appropriate paper work and evidence... as best we could since we aren't investigators by trade.
So we are back at the OP, thinking how bad-ass we are. Then we get the idea to play with the kit some more. We tested our hands, HESCO barriers, lunch meat, hmmwv windows... everything tested positive. Guess the kits didn't really work as advertised but every unit had one.
Of course, maybe our kit was bad. Or maybe we didn't use the kit correctly. Or there was really explosive residue on everything.
At least the kits weren't WHY we detained them. They were going to be detained anyway. But the Military being dazzled by salesmen or shiny new stuff is nothing new.
THL phish sticks
According to Sandia Labs' Dale Murray, the ideomotor effect is so persuasive that for anyone who wants or needs to believe in it, even conclusive scientific evidence undermining the technology it exploits has little power."
That explains a LOT about how the US Congress thinks/works.
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
If only people would believe the evidence then we wouldn't be lumbered with all the paranormal and supernatural ideas so widespread in our society today. There are clearly enough stupid people around though to make these cons pay.
Why do we get this story about once every 3 months? This has been shoved into the ground. Let's finally bury it for god's sake.
"Cowardice in a race, as in an individual, is the unpardonable sin." --Teddy Roosevelt
You forgot Cancer Screening saves lives.
Shoot first, drone first, water board first and THEN ask questions.
Who needs theatre?
Privacy is terrorism.
It says in the article the device can detect bombs,guns, ammunition, drugs and elephants.
My question is: Why are Iraqis trying to smuggle elephants through checkpoints?
This was not a bomb detection device, this was just a scam and nothing else. But corruption does not care about such facts and never is going to.
http://www.220.ro/desene-animate/Beavis-And-Butthead-Mr-Anderson-S-Balls/Exolp5FjL2/
The real reason they continue to use these isn't because they somehow have convinced themselves that it works. It's probably not even directly a scam insofar as they're shoving money to some business cohort through the military industrial complex. I would suspect that what this is really about is that it's far cheaper to stick a device in a young man's hand and convince him that it's there to protect him, so that he'll actually continue to actively do his job, and have him wind up being blown up -- than it is to spend money on any sort of real device. The man is disposable. The worthless device is the placebo to motivate him to feel safe in doing his job. And when he dies, it was a far cheaper investment than the amount that any sort of real device would cost to produce, purchase, train on, and deploy.
Read "The Golden Bough" and you'll find why this works. It's the same reason magic and religion used to be big things (and guarantee their providers a work-free life):
In a situation where forces you can't control determine your survival, you will grasp at any straw that gives you the illusion of control. It's a normal human reaction. It works even if you know about it. You want to believe, at least unconsciously.
It's probably the oldest scam in the history of mankind.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
I like to yell "halt" before I shoot. It's easier if they aren't moving.
All those FDA approved food additives are are fine.
The scanners the TSA uses are safe and effective.
Putting millions on subsidized healthcare and ensuring even more of the incidental costs are hidden from consumers will reduce healthcare spending.
There was no coup in Egypt ...
One of those, the third one specifically, stands out as not fitting the theme.
You do realise it's the *same government* that has given us the TSA, the FDA, and the many other ruinous mistakes in every area it's involved in that you expect is magically going to take charge of health care and make us all better?
Surely you jest.
This is also the same government that put a lander on Mars with a sky crane and created the internet. And how come the FDA doesn't get credit for making food and drugs in the USA among the safest in the world?
Actually on re-reading I believe I misunderstood the OP and responded erroneously to it.
You then misunderstood us both. Ah well. One of the few times I wish slashdot had a delete button. Hopefully the whole thread will be modded down now.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
Selection bais. If people do not like something, the failures define the thing. If they like something, the success define it. Many people like reality to match books and movies and such, nice and simple with clear right and wrong, works and doesn't work.
Some people don't even think it is special powers, just a thing you do. My grandpa did the dowsing thing to decide where to put the various wells on his property. Not because he thought he had special powers, it was just how he'd learned you select your well spot. Anyone could do it. He figured it worked since every time he'd drill that spot, and before long have a functional well.
For him it wasn't magical or special powers, it was just the standard process. Get Y shaped stick, walk around, it signals where the well goes, put it there.
There may be valid reasons the Iraqi forces are using these fake detectors. If the look of these devices makes some clueless criminals afraid of smuggling explosives, they are serving their purpose in preventing crime.
Now, while they're technologically incapable of their purpose, I wonder if they might actually be somewhat effective in real life? IE a different type of placebo?
It says that they're being used at a number of checkpoints. Now, one of the things I know about is that the insurgents/terrorists tend to observe such places before they target them. Often at some distance, but eh.
The ones doing the observing are often no more educated than those working the checkpoint, often less. So they see the operators using their 'bomb detector' in all seriousness. They think 'crap! They'd find our bomb, time to figure out a different plan!' and either delay or go elsewhere. So the end result is that they still have fewer attacks against that checkpoint.
I don't read AC A human right
Shocker: In the face of conclusive evidence understandable to anybody with an IQ higher than a kumquat, people still believe in:
Ponzi schemes
Homeopathy
Dowsing
Young-earth creationism
Psychics
Never underestimate the stubbornness of otherwise-rational people.
So did the authorities actually test them?
They have sample explosives for bomb dogs to find surely they could test the detectors in the same way. Its not an expensive test process.
http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
The point of this device, just like drug sniffing dogs, is not its ability to actually detect what it's supposed to be looking for. Its purpose to give the police, military, or other arm of the state a plausible excuse to detain and/or search anyone they want.
as I was a 9-year old kid going through his tackle box before our fishing trip.
His answer "Fishermen".
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." - Philip K. Dick
How about because they pulled a natural form of vitamin B6 from the shelves so a private company could investigate selling it as a prescription to diabetics with B6 deficiency complications?
The idea behind the FDA is good. The FDA in practice is just another regulator in bed with the private institutions it's been charged with regulating. It's the same fundamental problem that brought us the Deepwater Horizon catastrophe.
I won't join Slashcott. OTOH, If Beta goes live, I just won't be back until it's fixed. Sorry Dice.
There are people on the right that are that idiotic. There are also people on the left that claim that government can do wrong, and how dare you look for waste, fraud, kick-backs, and other abuse.
Both sides are wrong, crazy, and stupid. And the left can quote bad science just as much as the right, they're just not called on it as often.
I won't join Slashcott. OTOH, If Beta goes live, I just won't be back until it's fixed. Sorry Dice.
Yes. My point is, if you cherry pick mistakes, every organization will look incompetent. Name one big organization that hasn't made big, costly mistakes. Is Microsoft run by fools who know nothing about software or business because Windows 8 sucks? Does Ford know nothing about cars because they gave us the Pinto?
All those FDA approved food additives are are fine.
This one is probably technically untrue, because "all" is a lot. The FDA is pretty good, but they're not perfect.
The scanners the TSA uses are safe and effective.
Probably half-true. TSA is not gonna open itself up to major legal liability by using scanners that hurt scannees.
"Effective," is a whole 'nother ball of wax.
Putting millions on subsidized healthcare and ensuring even more of the incidental costs are hidden from consumers will reduce healthcare spending.
Intuitively this makes no sense, but we do have several hundred examples of health systems to compare ourselves to, i9ncluding several dozen high-income countries with economies similar to our own, and what's really fucking weird is that the more hidden costs are the lower they are.
The UK and Canada, for example, never charges anyone for anything. The Brits spend very little on health care per person. The Canadians spend more, but are still like 50% cheaper then we are, and their costs would have to be higher then typical because Canadian Doctors could easily move to Florida and get paid American salaries.
Countries like the Netherlands, Germany, and Switzerland spend between us and the Brits; but they also actually charge people co-pays and insist everyone have a private insurance policy.
There was no coup in Egypt ...
This one is BS, but it's politically important BS because if there was a coup in Egypt then we have to stop paying the Egyptians to be nice to the Israelis, which would mean they'd technically go to a state of war with Israel (the peace treaty between Israel and Egypt is part of a three-way deal with us), poor Bibi Netanyahu would not be able to cut his conventional army to pay for social services, etc.