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Japan Refused To Help NSA Tap Asia's Internet
An anonymous reader writes "The NSA sought the Japanese government's cooperation to wiretap fiber-optic cables carrying phone and data across the Asia-Pacific region but the request was rejected. The NSA wanted to intercept personal information including Internet activity and phone calls passing through Japan from Asia including China. The Japanese government refused because it was illegal and would need to involve a massive number of private sector workers. Article 35 of the Japanese Constitution protects against illegal search and seizure."
A country that gives a shit about its constitution? Surely some mistake...
I'm glad Japan still seems to have some honour left.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
The American constitution is also supposed to prevent unlawful searches, so why does the Japanese constitution succeed and the American constitution fails to stop illegal capture of electronic communication? Do the Americans just not care?
It's more than just wiretapping. Look up civil forfeiture.
IDK what the problem is, if it's just apathy, we have day to day life too good, or what. But we are the epitome of good people who do nothing. We are now just looking for the ultimate evil to triumph over us and just make it official.
Follow the money. The US governmnet is corporation owned.
Anybody recall how the Japanese ended up with this constitution?
Japanese "realpolitik" is complicated and a lot happens "below the surface". While I'd like to hope the request was refused on the grounds of honoring their constitution, a skeptic in me suggests that the true reason must be more pragmatic. Perhaps they did not want US to gain access to their own trade or political secrets (wise choice, given what we now know about wiretapping European leaders). There is a lot of shady stuff going on between Japanese government and businesses (where does it not? I don't mean to single them out, though theirs is not a very transparent society).
So, while it's great to know that at least one rich country can say "no" to US, I wouldn't go moving my colocated mail services to Japan quite yet.
The U.S system is very broken and the constitution has been trampled on by fearmongers telling stories about bogeymen.
Protection from terrorism and Freedom at all costs has been the plan past 10 years.
When the plan goes sour and all constitutional freedoms have been eroded, keeping up the appearances at all costs becomes the new goal.
Unfortunately, our police, our elected representatives, our president, and our unelected courts all have conspired to diminish our 4th Amendment protections against unreasonable search and seizure. Notably this was the result of the failed "war on drugs" but lately due to the "war on terrorism".
The sad part is, both major parties are responsible for this. There are few elected Democratic or Republican lawmakers who seem to care.
Yup, the rest of the world had a big WTF when they realize the US legalized bribes by calling it "lobbying".
I mean wtf is with all the pretending, just cut the BS and call it what it is.
...refused because it was illegal and would need to involve a massive number of private sector workers.
So being illegal isn't enough, it also has to be expensive and inconvenient?
Americans don't care. Really. You only have to look at the reaction to scandals in Japan compared to the US.
A few years ago the minister in charge of tax had to resign because he made a mistake on his tax return. The leader of one of the opposition parties (there are several, and they are not completely ineffective) had to resign because he gave his support to one of the other members of the party who then turned out to have lied about something. Bullshit from politicians is not tolerated.
Their electoral system has some advantages too. Candidates are not allowed to have TV or radio advertising, or even put videos on the internet etc. Coverage is strictly controlled to make sure everyone gets fair coverage, and money is much less of a factor since there is little to actually spend it on beyond a few small posters. Politicians have to actually go and canvas their constituents.
Lobbying is also heavily controlled, and since money is much less of an issue lobbyists have more limited power.
It's far from perfect but people take politics seriously and bad behaviour is severely punish. In comparison US politicians are armour plated, image managed, and awash with dirty money. The NSA scandal demonstrates just how bad it is. Why aren't the FBI arresting NSA staff for violating the constitution? Why are the senators and judges who approved it not under investigation?
Unfortunately the UK seems to be nearly as bad. Our one saving grace is that the EU is going to investigate, assuming we don't pull out before they are finished.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
"Do the Americans just not care?"
Americans are the most ignorant and easily led population on the planet. You need to look at the science. See here what science has discovered about the brain:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYmi0DLzBdQ
Man, I sure wish the constitutions of western nations had clauses like that...
wait...
There is a difference between "Japan didn't help the NSA tap the Asian internet" and "the NSA didn't tap the Asian internet"
"I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
More and more, I am ashamed to be a citizen of this country. I feel like I've been lied to my entire life about the country I live in, what it stands for, and what it's motivations have been for various things it, as a nation, has done over the decades of my life. America as the Hero of the Day for so many countries? Standing for Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness? It all rings so hollow now, being revealed as a stinking pile of bullshit. Don't get me wrong: I mean our government, not the people; there are truly good people, real heroes, in this country -- but so are there in any other country in any other part of the world. As a country we are revealed as no better than some of the countries who are ostensibly our 'enemies'.
I don't know what to do. Part of me just wants to lay down, close my eyes and sleep, never to awaken again, rather than face the horrifying reality that the United States of America that I grew up believing in is a lie, and that we're as corrupt and evil as any of the other alleged villians we've fought against in decades past. Are we really any better than Nazi Germany, North Korea, Red China, Lybia, Iran, Syria, or Al Qaeda? The answer is not obvious anymore.
It would be nice if the U.S. Constitution had a clause against unreasonable search and seizure. Maybe we could add an amendment...
I'd give you points if I had any. You are correct. We have Senator's and Congressmen who get paid insane money for being a "consultant" to some corporation. $50k and up. They NEVER go to the company. The never submit any info to the company. They just get a check every month. Of course the fact they helped vote on bills that substantially helped this company has nothing to do with it right? wink wink, nod nod, nudge nudge. The open corruption in our country is so out of control it's insane. Hell even kids know it. When corruption reaches the level even children are aware of it, wow. Sad.
I'm old, not dead. Well that's my 2 cents worth, your mileage may vary. I say what I think, not what you want to hear.
Note that the summary says "The NSA sought the Japanese government's cooperation to wiretap fiber-optic cables ... but the request was rejected." The use of "the request" here is a standard rhetorical trick to get the reader/listener to believe that there was only one request, and it was rejected. But the English is ambiguous. There could have been many such requests, of which one was rejected, and the statement would still be true. They didn't mention how other such requests were handled. The inference should probably be "... but we won't want to tell you how the other requests were handled".
This is a special case of the general concept of "plausible deniability". Look it up.
Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
No - its that the American government does not care. The way the govenernment is set up, the American people can do nothing to prevent it. Congress is guarenteed a salery for life. Why do what people want - get in, be there long enough to get your salery for life, pass whatever laws you want - you are exempt, and accept all the bribes you want. People don't like you? Who cares, you are set for life - who cares if you win reelection.
Oh, someone is actually going to try to make a difference and run under a third party ticket? Good luck with that happening - even if you get in (which does happen from time to time) you got 400 or so other Congressmen and 99 other Senetors and a corrupt President who wants to be the dictator of a Socialist government.
The American system is broke.
Japanese culture has a long history of having a strong code of honor. Bushido is an example. If we practiced Seppuku, I think the director of the NSA might have had second thoughts about lying to Congress.
Have gnu, will travel.
Oh, someone is actually going to try to make a difference and run under a third party ticket? Good luck with that happening - even if you get in (which does happen from time to time) you got 400 or so other Congressmen and 99 other Senetors and a corrupt President who wants to be the dictator of a Socialist government.
that's actually exactly the "good people who do nothing" at work right there. how could nothing change if good people do nothing to change it. you've given up and that's the "good people who nothing".
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
Good for you comparing Obamacare to what the NSA is doing! The topic is NSA and not Obamacare. If Americans cared so much about their rights like they cared for their hate of Obamacare MAYBE, just MAYBE the NSA would not be doing what it is doing. But hey you are exactly the reason why the NSA is doing what it is, and thinking the real problem is Obamacare!
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
The real irony is who wrote their constitution...
Nice tactic of the feds, give us too much to hate at once and we have to divide our forces.
I envy the Japanese for their constitutional protections.
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
Just for the record.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Makes me wonder why Europe agreed to hand USA data on all financial transactions happening inside EU (terrorist finance tracking program). Anybody with two brain cells to rub together would see that it is great industrial and economic espionage tool.
Nuke somebody and call it a 'kindness' ... only Americans.
Candidates are not allowed to have TV or radio advertising, or even put videos on the internet etc.
Everyone gets the same amount of free TV/radio/newspaper advertising, but the Internet restrictions have been lifted entirely.
Actually the USA is not particularly corrupt. According to transparency international, only a few countries (Canada, some small northern European countries and Australia) are less corrupt than the US. Your story about Congressmen being paid to work for a company while passing legislation to help that company would be a severe breach of ethics and they would be ripped to pieces by their opponents., not to mention investigated by the ethics committee. I'm sure they get away with bad behavior, especially those with guaranteed seats (Corrine Brown, Charles Rangel etc) but that behavior is known and they still get elected so it's their constituents fault.
Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
No, it is that the people don't care. Look at the polls. Talk to random people. The majority either like spying or don't care. If a large majority were angry about it like slashdoters, you can bet it'd make a difference.
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That's the tactic of all the Powers that Be: divide and conquer, bread and circuses. They keep us divided with "wedge issues" like gay marriage and abortion, so we're distracted from the really important issues like the disappearance of the middle class and the destruction of the economy.
Read the article. The NSA asked the Japanese government and they refused. Nowhere does it say that the NSA didn't proceed and obtained access anyway, illegal and contra the Japanese constitution. Just like it did in the USA, Europe, Asia and anywhere they damn well like. They don't give a flying f*ck about laws, foreign or domestic. They simply make their own.
To Terminate, or not to Terminate, that's the question - SCSIROB
Re: your sig. Democracy here in Canada is 38% taking away the rights of 62% due to having more then 2 parties. Funniest was when the other parties tried to work together the minority screamed undemocratic and prorogued Parliament to stop the majority.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Fine, you won't help us. Well screw you! We'll just call sushi Freedom Fish and to hell with you.
Sig Registration Form 34c_766(a) submitted to Ministry of Signature Management. Approval pending.
One huge difference is how much bigger japanese tentacles are compared to american.
FTFY.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
I hope I will not upset some Japanese people, but seen from outside, Japan's political elite seems completely out of control from the people. It is quite refreshing to see that they have moral grounds high enough that they still behave correctly. I wish our politicians were of the same kind.
Article 35 of the Japanese Constitution protects against illegal search and seizure.
Man, I wish the United States had that.
I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust