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Taiwan Protests Apple Maps That Show Island As Province of China
itwbennett writes "Taiwan is demanding Apple revise its mapping software and remove a label that describes the island as a province of China, rather than as a sovereign state. The complaint was lodged after local media reports said that users on the island had noticed the change in Apple's latest iOS and Mac OS versions. 'The maps don't acknowledge Taiwan as its own nation. We voiced our disapproval, and hope Apple will make the change,' an official with Taiwan's foreign ministry said Wednesday. This isn't the first time such a mistake was made. Google also labeled Taiwan as a Chinese province in 2005."
It's not a mistake. China's market is far more lucrative than Taiwan's for Apple, and since they have to choose which one to piss off....
The mistake is more important than one may think at first, because Taiwan is one of the places the navigator will take you through in the path from your home to the local grocery store.
but apple maps will probably show it as second post.
If the map says Taiwan (ROC) is a nation, that will offend mainland China (PRC). If the map says Taiwan is a province of PRC, that offends Taiwan.
Really, they're screwed either way.
At $work, we are mandated to call ROC a "region". That's as accurate as we can go without offending anyone.
Maybe if the Chinese weren't buying all the U.S. Megacorps (and everything else in the U.S.), this wouldn't be happening.
FTFY
The cow says "Moo." The dog says "Woof." The Timothy says "Thanks, valued customer. We appreciate your input."
It matters very much if you're in Taiwan.
The cow says "Moo." The dog says "Woof." The Timothy says "Thanks, valued customer. We appreciate your input."
So, this fixation on homosexuality is telling. When are you coming out of the closet?
Because the PRC has a billion potential customers who think Taiwan is a province of mainland China.
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No, it isn't. Beijing doesn't control anything that goes on in Taiwan, much as they'd like to. Yeah, they used to make hostile noises in the past whenever Taiwan spoke of formally declaring independence, but it ultimately didn't amount to much. But Taiwan controls everything of its own, including its foreign & defense policies - not something that can be said about the province of any country
Taiwan is demanding Apple revise its map data
FTFY. There is a difference between data and software and we should understand that.
Both the government of the People's Republic of China (which controls the mainland) and the government of the Republic of China (which controls Taiwan) believe that Taiwan is a part of China. The two just disagree about who China's rightful government is. I realize that over the past 60 years Taiwan has grown more and more self-contained and has become a de facto state independent of China, but in theory there's nothing either side should object to in portraying Taiwan as part of China.
I think he's just spanking his Android :)
Build a Man a Fire, and He'll Be Warm for a Day. Set a Man on Fire, and He'll Be Warm for the Rest of His Life.
It's complicated.. basically it is de facto a nation, but it is not necessarily a nation de jure. But if you want one of the most likely kick-off points for World War III it is the issue of Taiwanese independence..
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And Taiwan doesn't.
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
I don't think this is a "mistake." Taiwan's status is an open question and Apple is probably choosing whichever side will benefit them more. Where's their bigger customer base, the island or the mainland?
Liberty in your lifetime
You are wrong according to both Taiwanese and Chinese. Both view themselves as "China that has rights to controlling all of Chinese territory". I.e. Republic of China government that is located in Taiwan claims that entire mainland China is their territory and Taiwan is just one province.
People's Republic of China that is located on mainland has the exactly same claim. It's basically two different regimes that (mostly, discounting Mongolia issue) agree that China encompasses both Taiwan and mainland, but disagree on which government is legitimate one. This is because both claimed to be legitimate governments back in the days of civil war, and one side was simply pushed out of mainland and into Taiwan, but never finished off.
Even Taiwanese tend to forget this because official propaganda doesn't like to talk about this inconvenient truth. However you can check yourself both from history books, or even wikipedia and its sources.
Taiwan is recognized by 22 countries. Many other countries have trade offices.
I suggest reading about the Treaty of San Francisco, Treaty of Taipei, and the Treaty of Shimonoseki before commenting about the Taiwan / PROC dispute...
The current status of Taiwan probably most similar to that of Germany. Where Germany was divided up into 4 zones after the war (US, UK, France, Russia), Taiwan is apparently effectively a US occupied zone until its fate is determined. It was recognized as an occupied territory of Japan before/during the war, but required that Japan relinquish control of Taiwan (and other territories acquired before the war) as a penalty for pre-war territorial aggressions. However, the treaty never specified to which government it was to go to (mainly because of the civil war between the ROC and the PROC which happened at the end of WWII).
The Treaty of Taipei (a separate peace treaty between Japan and the ROC, since abrogated by Japan when they recognized the PROC government), specifically ceded Taiwan to the ROC government. It's sort of a title to Taiwan that the ROC has waived around in the past, but it is unclear how the PROC ultimately winning the civil war affected the status of this document.
The US is pretty much in a conundrum. It could probably legally cede Taiwan to the PROC under the theory promulgated by the Treaty of San Francisco (give the island back to the country had it before Japan took it, this is what the UK wanted to do), or they can do nothing and claim that this is an internal issue between the ROC and PROC governments (I believe this is the continuing official US stance since the treaty), or they might twist the treaty wording and assert that Taiwan has the right to self-determination (which is of course what the US wants to do, but is opposed by the PROC and probably is too far a twist from a legal sense).
Originally, the US was sitting on its treaty status over Taiwan as part of a greater anti-communist sphere-of-influence policy. Now, it is probably merely attempting to get better terms for a PROC takeover by sitting on their hands until they get a deal that Taiwan is okay with. This has basically stalled because Taiwan doesn't appear that it would be happy with any PROC takeover (however, they are no-doubt looking at the Hong Kong 2-system situation with great interest).
"Taiwan, Province of China" is the official name used by the United Nations: http://www.unece.org/cefact/locode/service/location.html
Other companies also use this same name, such as ebay.
No, it isn't. Beijing doesn't control anything that goes on in Taiwan, much as they'd like to. Yeah, they used to make hostile noises in the past whenever Taiwan spoke of formally declaring independence, but it ultimately didn't amount to much. But Taiwan controls everything of its own, including its foreign & defense policies - not something that can be said about the province of any country
Clearly you've never been to Texas.
Sorry, your claims are just nonsense.
Taiwan is its own country since WWII ended and certainly so since the early 1950s.
Taiwan cares a fuck about what is going on inside of mainland china.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Cross straight relations and history are sometimes difficult to parse. What he said was correct, the ROC still doesn't recognize the PRC as legitimate (and vice versa) and in the immediate years after the Chinese Civil War, most of the world continued to see the ROC as the legitimate government of China in exile. After a several years it became obvious that the PRC wasn't going anywhere and world opinion about legitimacy flipped.
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
ROC technically controls part of two provinces, not only Taiwan but some minor outlying islands that are considered part of Guandong IIRC.
Regardless of the legal fantasies of the KMT, the majority of Taiwanese see themselves as independent (not just the DPP and the pan greens, but independence is only one issue, and people aren't going to ignore all of the domestic policy issues of the political spectrum just because of how they feel about independence, so there are quite a few KMT and pan blues who would consider Taiwan independent as well).
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
The largest ever takeover of a US company by a Chinese company is number 213 on the Fortune 500- and this is evidence of China "buying all the U.S. Megacorps".
Seriously?
What does Apple now use - Google Maps or OpenStreet Maps or something else? They might as well get Nokia's HERE, since that will be separate from Lumia once the Microsoft deal comes through
Tell that to the government in Beijing. The only thing that has prevented mainland China from taking over Taiwan is direct confrontation with the US. So in a way, Taiwan is a "country" that exists because of the US, very much like South Ossetia exists because of Russia, but in fact it is still part of Georgia.
No, the Portugese. Where do you think the name 'Formosa' came from?
> Maybe if the Chinese weren't buying so many U.S. Megacorp products this wouldn't be happening.
FTFY
Modded down in like ten minutes?
PSA: Don't make jokes about Norway until its the middle of the night there. Sheesh.
That too would open up a can of worms - in this case, w/ China. If such choices are provided, the entities opposed to such choices being there in the first place happen to be the country/government with majority opinion. China would oppose such a feature on marking Taiwan, Greece & Cyprus would oppose a feature allowing Turkish Cyprus to be marked separately, India would oppose such a feature on marking Pak-occupied/Azad (depending on your POV) Kashmir, Arabs would oppose Israel being shown as an independent country and so on. At least the default settings would have to be the 'popular' opinion
In China, the maps should show Taiwan as a province of China.
In the rest of the civilized world, including Taiwan, the maps should show Taiwan as its own entity.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
ROC technically controls part of two provinces, not only Taiwan but some minor outlying islands that are considered part of Guandong IIRC.
Kinmen and Matsu are part of Fujian province
When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
With all of the issues Apple has had over their map software, I have to wonder if they're starting to regret trying to reinvent the wheel just to modestly distance themselves from Google.
In 1895, China transferred control of Taiwan to Japan. In 1911, China became the Republic of China (ROC). In 1945, as a result of the loss of WWII, Japan transferred control of Taiwan to the ROC. In 1949, the mainland became the People's Republic of China (PRC) and the ROC govenrment went into exile in Taiwan. Since 1949 the ROC has controlled Taiwan and a few minor offshore islands (like Jinmen) and the PRC has controlled the Mainland and a number of other offshore islands. Currently, only the PRC has a seat in the UN and few countries officially recognize the ROC.
Until you try to cross one.
I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
Yeah, that's what I get for trying to go on memory.
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
That's some interesting history, but it sounds like southwest Asia where imperial powers carved up nations without regard to the people living there. Self-determination is some silly hippie idea.
So it's a good thing Taiwan has a flag.
Q: Has the Taiwanese government declared that Taiwan is an independant state?
A: No.
Until they do, they are a province of China. This isn't a troll, this is basic logic.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
The post specifically mentions "Megacorps", indicating large companies, the kind in the Fortune 500.
The previous post states that Chinese companies had already purchased "all the U.S. Megacorps (and everything else in the U.S.)".
China is the next big market for everyone to go after. Companies will want to please China, not Taiwan. Surely they can figure that one out.
Taiwan is still a province of the ROC.
Right. Even their license plates say "åç£çoe" (Taiwan Province).
The point is: Raiwan is a souvereign state since 1949, and so the Taiwnas see themselves as well. Who cares if they have a seat in the UN?
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Close, the USSR wanted the PRC as the legitimate government, mainly for the extra pro-communist seat in the UN Security Council and if you have enough nuclear weapons to throw around, people tend to listen to you.
England, Scotland & Wales were originally 3 different countries, which united some point in time.
Great Britain = England + Scotland + Wales
United Kingdom = Great Britain + Northern Ireland
British Isles = Great Britain + Ireland OR England + Scotland + Wales + Ireland
Britain (w/o the 'Great') is variably used in place of either Great Britain or the UK, and worse, sometimes merely England. There are some more complications, like Wales was early on annexed to even England, and wasn't recognized as separate, and isn't even represented on the Union Jack. To complicate things further, there are international sporting events where England & Scotland field rival teams.
Hence the qualifier "most".
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
It's even funnier than that. There are people in Taiwan who'd love to just declare it an independent country sovereign within its present de facto territory and be done with it, but PRC doesn't like it one bit. So long as Taiwan claims to be "one China", they're in agreement with PRC that there is "one China", and the only dispute is over who gets to run it... which, ironically, PRC much prefers to the notion that the countries truly are separate and can go their separate ways.
So the Taiwanese party which claims authority over the PRC mainland is seen much more favorably by PRC than the party that does not. Go figure...
Politics have some fun contradictions. This situation reminds me of far right parties from all over Europe gathering for a summit a couple of years ago. I caught a glimpse of some of the footage, and it was hilarious - watching people who make their political platform to hate one another shaking hands and talking how others are right.