Slashdot Mirror
Photos Stream Back From China's Lunar Lander
After the successful soft landing of its carrier vessel on the surface of the moon, China's Jade Rabbit lunar rover has begun beaming back photos of the lunar surface. From the BBC's article, with links to video as well as several photos, comes this description: "Chang'e-3 is the third unmanned rover mission to touch down on the lunar surface, and the first to go there in more than 40 years. The last was an 840kg (1,900lb) Soviet vehicle known as Lunokhod-2, which was kept warm by polonium-210. But the six-wheeled Chinese vehicle carries a more sophisticated payload, including ground-penetrating radar which will gather measurements of the lunar soil and crust. The 120kg (260lb) Jade Rabbit rover can reportedly climb slopes of up to 30 degrees and travel at 200m (660ft) per hour. ... The rover and lander are powered by solar panels but some sources suggest they also carry radioisotope heating units (RHUs), containing plutonium-238 to keep them warm during the cold lunar night. According to Chinese space scientists, the mission is designed to test new technologies, gather scientific data and build intellectual expertise. It will also scout valuable mineral resources that could one day be mined."
That first photo makes me think they are coming back with tablets and commandments...
Gently reply
The space race is a fit subject for international cooperation and competition.
Queue the nay-sayers in 3...2...
This is vital science and we all know China is only able to progress its technology by sending a camera on wheels to the Moon.
As far exerybody can thrust the submitter =P on the matter, giving us some links for references would not had hurt anyone. :-)
Lisias@Earth.SolarSystem.OrionArm.MilkyWay.Local.Virgo.Universe.org
Can I pick up a rover, cheap, on AliExpress? It looks like it might be fun to play with.
This SUCKS! Register your complaint now, before it's too late.
I heard that the Sea of Tranquility is now the South China Sea of Tranquility.
In addition to the Chinese moon-rover landing Iran is claiming a 2nd successful launch and recovery of a Rhesus macaque.
And Slashdot has already reported about India's Martian expedition.
There are some rocks of significant size immediately behind the rover. Those are certainly large enough for the rover to get hung on or to flip it over on its side. I'm surprised the lander touched down within just a few feet of rocks like that. Either their hazard avoidance system looks only directly beneath the footprint of the lander, or it failed to properly detect those rocks. Had it landed just 50% closer to those rocks, the ramp the rover descended would have been right on them..
Better known as 318230.
Ha Ha!!!
I got to the chocolate box before you, that's why the hard ones have teeth marks.
Is keeps Russian probes warm and turns Russian spys cold.
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
They better be careful... We all remember what happened to the Tsien. Fortunately, this one is not manned...
Why do the photos also look like they are from the 70's?
THIS NEW DESIGN IS DOGSHIT.
Normally people buy flying toys from China and are happy to have them land without crashing. China brought a really big toy from Russia and was happy to not crash it. I think more congratulations should be directed to Russia than China. Russia has a thriving space program even if it is via proxy. Maybe America needs to take a page out of Russia's book and licence more tech to places like China to allow them to continue space exploration while America seems to lack the will. At least then if something does go wrong America could learn from it but be able to point fingers at China saying it was really their fault. Beta testing at it's finest.
It's time for those who insisted that the moon landing by the Apollo astronauts were fake to stop spreading their falsehood.
The moon pictures that the Yutu rover and the Chang'e 3 lander take look very much like the pictures that NASA provided us some 40-odd years ago - of course they can try to claim that these new batch of pictures are fake as well.
I do not understand why there are still people holding on to that kind of conspiracy theory. I just do not understand.
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Pics or it didn't hap-... Uh, wait...
Your attitude reminds me of those people who advocate the use of JavaScript or NoSQL. They're always going on about how "innovative" both are, and how they're "going to be the future" ("sooner rather than later", too!). But on closer inspection, we see that there's really nothing inherently special about them. In fact, we see they're merely lower-quality rehashings of what we had several decades ago.
NoSQL databases literally are 1960s-era technology that has been rediscovered today. They aren't innovative, and they aren't special. In fact, if you can do it with a NoSQL database, it can be done with a relational database.
JavaScript has an early 1970s-era syntax, with semantics that are a shitty misunderstanding of what we knew in the 1960s and 1970s, and implementations that are worse to deal with than 1980s and early 1990s scripting languages.
But none of these facts will get in the way of people screaming about how "great" and "novel" they are, even though they're so far behind what we had so many years earlier. These people will somehow claim that reimplementing classic games from the 1980s or 1990s in JavaScript, although running a lot slower on far more powerful computers, is an achievement worthy of praise. Well, the reality is that it is not impressive at all.
The same goes for China. Industrially, they're getting to where the US was in the mid-1800s. Their space technology is in the 1950s, and early 1960s. Socially, they're pre-1750s in many ways. Militarily, they're in the 1910s, at best.
Maybe things will change, but it's very likely they'll run into internal conflict and strife well before they become real challengers to existing Western powers. Achieving what the U.S. or other nations achieved half a century ago isn't impressive. Doing it with researchers, engineers and academics trained in the U.S. or other Western nations over that time period isn't very impressive, either.
Let's not kid ourselves. This sort of an achievement just isn't special these days. It was in the 1950s, but not now. It's really no different from how the database techniques of the 1960s aren't special today, nor are the programming language concepts from the 1960s and 1970s.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
They better be careful... We all remember what happened to the Tsien. Fortunately, this one is not manned...
Can you kindly elaborate what you mean by " the Tsien " ?
I have been closely monitoring China for the past 40-odd years and never encountered any Chinese spaceship with any name that associated with "Tsien".
I'll be very appreciative if you can share with us the information that you have on "Tsien".
Thanks !!
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Guys, something is seriously wrong with my Slashdot. It's showing some "Beta" banner by the logo and now the site is basically unusable. It took me a good 10 minutes to even find where this comment box is located!
The text looks really fucking bad now. Almost all of the text is really small, the fonts render very poorly, and a lot of the text is gray on slightly darker gray. It is extraordinarily hard to read. Even the text in this comment box is very small, and its in italics and it's just so hard to read.
There's a lot of wasted space now, too. I've got a 28" monitor and probably 80% of the screen is empty gray areas. The rest is tiny, tiny text that's goddamn unreadable.
When I look at the main story list I can't tell where one story ends and another begins. Some of them have huge images, but others have huge blank gray areas. And I have to scroll so much now just to see all of the stories! I used to be able to read like 6 at a time on my screen. Now I can barely fit in even just two!
The comment threads are even worse. The whole lack of contrast means it's so hard now to figure out what is a comment and what isn't. For crying out loud, everything here is now gray-on-gray-on-gray-on-gray, with some teal on the buttons just to make them very distracting.
I thought that the last design was horrible compared to the one before it, but my god, this new "Beta" Slashdot is virtually unusable. I literally won't be able to continue using this. I can't even read the fucking story or comment text here any longer, and now it's nearly impossible to post comments. There's no reason for me to stay if I can't even just read the content here passively!
how are they allowed to pollute the moon like that? do we simply assume humans will never go there, or is 238 some kind of magic vanishing form of radiation, that will not simply sit there and radiate, as nuclear waste tends to do? we can safely assume, i assume, that shielding was not included in the 120kg design, or am i wrong? have they some legitimate excuse for this, or should we simply assume "some sources" are wrong about the plutonium, in the first place?
The same goes for China. Industrially, they're getting to where the US was in the mid-1800s. Their space technology is in the 1950s, and early 1960s. Socially, they're pre-1750s in many ways. Militarily, they're in the 1910s, at best
I certainly hope that you are NOT an American.
If you are, please, I beseech you, please WAKE THE FUCK UP.
America is in a steep decline, and the rate of decline has quicken in the past 2 decades.
And America's decline is in stark contrast with the rapid growth of Brazil, India and China.
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
has only just landed and the hoaxers are already out (they must have crawled out over the edge of their flat earths so they can feel they're still in the game).
My congratulations to the scientists and engineers that made this mission work! A difficult job done well!
Big difference: China landings are driven by science and verifiable by high-tech equipment.
US Hollywood moon landings were driven by hate towards Russians who put first man in space.
looks like they used a samsung flip phone for the camera.
Students could send an iphone up and get a panorama image..
Clearly its fake and done in a giant hanger/stage.
I hear all the excuses for the last 40 years that is impossible to land on the moon.
Could only happen in the era of black and white TVs and Hollywood productions. 70s shows
It astounds me that nobody here is questioning why the photos are such low quality. Why spend millions of renminbi on the mission, when they are using possibly the worst quality cameras I have seen in ten years? Why aren't they streaming back live HD video constantly? Do they not think tens of millions of people want to see it? Please - someone enlighten me. Look at the quality of the live footage Apollo was able to send back, with forty year old technology. You can now buy a HD CCD for about $2 or less, and obviously beaming back a digital signal would be easier than the analogue Apollo signal was, so why are we seeing laughably poor quality images, right at the start of the landing, when they should be trying to astound the public with never seen before high resolution video of the surface of the moon?
Seriously, I'm glad somebody else is going into space. NASA seems to be doing well in deeper space - Mars rovers, missions far out into the solar system, and deep-space satellites - but we still have plenty to discover in our own backyard.
Even though the rocketry task has been done before (putting a rover on the moon) there's a hell of a lot of difference between a 1960's Soviet rover and a 2010's rover, so they're going to be uncovering plenty of new stuff.
Sorry, I will always maintain that it was faked by a nation bent on claiming some pride during a power struggle with another superpower. I refuse to believe that we went there in 1969 yet in 2013 aren't going there once a week. (Or at least once a month. Heck, once a year!)
"But we have no reason to go there every week, douche bag AC !"
Yeah, that's why no one has ever revisited Everest, the Amazon, the South Pole and other inhospitable locations since they were first conquered.
Bull. Crap.
Grats to China!
Please go take pictures of the U.S Rovers and launch pads so the sales of books and DVD's that the USA never landed on the moon make them look like the foolish people they are :)
What a coincidence. It look like a US rover design. Quite frankly, the pictures suck.
an ill wind that blows no good
I'm not sure if it's me projecting things but do those rockets and robots _look_ Chinese to anyone else? How it that possible?
This is Taco Cowboy, I'm using a public connection so I log in as an AC.
Many thanks for the explanation from you and others!
Thanks again !
Hey, dumbshit, do you think it would have been possible to fool the Soviets? Or that they would have let the US get away with lying to the world?
That's a bad policy.
Play Command HQ online
This is Taco Cowboy. I'm accessing this site over a public connection so I log in as an AC.
Can we come back from this?
I'm afraid this is no longer a case of whether we CAN come back - it is about the LIFE or DEATH of America as we know it.
The decline is not going to leave its impact economically but also on the social fabric.
You gotta understand that the mixture of the social pool of America has drastically changed the past few decades, from a predominantly white populace to a minority white society.
It's not a purely "race" thing, but rather, it's the ATTITUDE thing.
I'm not a White guy. I'm a Chinese. But I need to stress that the PURITANISM culture of the White society that brought on the "caretaker of the land" attitude which translated to the "hard working" practices that many of the first White settlers had demonstrated.
America's foundation was built on blood, sweat and tears of those first settlers.
However, with the influx of many of other people, most of them, unfortunately, do not share that kind of attitude of hard work.
Most of the current crop of Americans, yes, including many of the descendants of the White settlers, do not see "hard work" as a necessity to attain success.
If America falls further behind in term of industrial might and knowledge power, there won't be enough bread left to feed those who don't want to work hard, and that will most probably see the beginning of the end of America.
Big difference: China landings are driven by science and verifiable by high-tech equipment.
US Hollywood moon landings were driven by hate towards Russians who put first man in space.
Here I was expecting some troll to criticize the Chinese effort for being a copy of what was done 40+ years ago, or simply a stunt. Instead I find a troll saying "China landings are ... verifiable by high-tech equipment", thus implying that US efforts weren't. Are you a conspiracy nut suggesting the US landings were faked?
"China landings are driven by science ...". The science is great, but if you think that prestige and publicity aren't part of the reason for the Chinese effort, then I've got a bridge to sell you. I've also got no problem with that being part of the motivation.
"US Hollywood moon landings were driven by hate towards Russians who put first man in space." Wow, you've heard about the space race - a term that was coined at the time because it described the obvious. BTW, what do you think motivated the USSR? It wouldn't have been a race without at least two sides. However, "hate" is a ridiculously way to describe such a competition. Whatever you say about the motivation, the space race was a lot more peaceful than the arms race. A nice side effect was all the science done and the technology developed. Out of curiosity though, what was Hollywood about the moon landings? That they televised it? Not even Hollywood is that good - it got 125M viewers around the world. Maybe it had something to do with it being such an impressive and historic event, albeit a silly thing like the first time that people set foot on any body other than the earth.
P.S. You also overlook that this Chinese probe is more analogous to a Soviet mission of 40 years ago, than to the manned US landings, But hey, any idiotic excuse to bash the US, right?
You have to get out of orbit...you need to get to the moon....you need to get into lunar orbit and then land....successfully. Read the history of the Ranger Program to see how much work this took the US, and they were crashing onto the moon, not trying to land a working Rover. Getting the insertions correct is not easy. China has done something difficult and laudable. While I'm sure they had the full data from the US program, and the USSR program, making this happen is still a great achievement. I have noticed how the US media is paying little attention to this......
You could not fake radio messages from the moon. The signals where UHF, line of sight. Anyone with the equipment to receive it also had to point those antennas....triangulate......
It was a soundstage on mars.
What makes you think this is a stage in Mongolia?
So, is part of Moon now officially a Chinese territory?
The lander did not land in Sinus Iridum, but in Mare Imbrium proper.
I do not think this was a mistake, as they could have waited a few more orbits and made the original landing point in Sinus Iridum. For some reason, a site in Mare Imbrium was chosen. As the actual landing site is on the border between the Titanium rich and Titanium poor parts of Sinus Iridum, I suspect this was not an arbitrary choice, but driven by a desire to understand better the mineral resources of the Moon.
If we are really lucky, the rover will drive the 120 km North to Montes Recti, a mountain range to the North. (These mountains are really islands of old terrain high enough to avoid being submerged in the Mare Imbrium lava flows.) At 100 m/day, it would only take 3 years...
Hopefully the Chinese will release some high quality pictures. I'm not suggesting the moon landings were fake, but given the overall cost and engineering that goes into such an endeavor, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect photos of the same quality I can take with my cell phone.
I read that the first images we see now are low quality to keep transmission time low. The high quality ones, including full video of the decent, will follow.
The quality of those photos is terrible. What'd they do, send up a cheap digital camera made in chi...
Okay, enough of the bickering.
There is a page claiming that CNSA (China National Space Administration) will share all the data it gathers from both the Chang'e 3 lander and the Yutu rover with scientists from all nations.
http://io9.com/heres-what-chinas-yutu-rover-is-doing-on-the-moon-1483746967
I do not know if the CNSA really will share all the data it gathers with the world. Time will tell.
But if it does (and I hope it will), that will be a plus for humanity.
And I sincerely hope that the ISS will be open for China's involvement as well.
It is utterly stupid to play politics in space.
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Even if we agree that signals were received from the moon, the question remains: did they originate from the moon?
I always begin these by saying that, yes, I believe the moon landings are real.
That said, I would imagine the radio signals from the Moon would be the easiest part. Land a receiver and transmitter that just takes what it receives on one channel and broadcasts it back to Earth. If you take the live feed from NASA and send it to the astronauts who reply immediately, it will take the appropriate amount of time for NASA to receive the signal from the Moon and no one at NASA would be wiser (except for the conspirator who was making sure the live signal went to the astronauts).
It's a neat thing to think about--not whether they were faked but how could they have been faked. How much of a mission would you have to go through? I mean, we heard from Neil, Buzz, and Michael the whole trip out and then we heard from Buzz and Neil on the Moon. You could conceivably use a similar technique for voice communication, but the weightless part inside the capsule would be pretty tough to do on Earth. Did they do TV broadcasts from inside the capsule (like was shown on Apollo 13)? The capsule could have stayed in orbit--either Earth or lunar--but that would be tricky to sync up the movements of the fake moon-walking astronauts with the voices from the capsule.
One of the questions I have for the conspiracy nuts is what missions were faked? Only the Apollo missions? Assuming it was only the Apollo missions, then the Surveyor missions weren't faked and that shows that NASA could land equipment in the Moon. Were all the Apollo missions faked? Apollo 8 and Apollo 10 sent men around the Moon. Were those faked?
Space race was part of the arms race.
According to this page (which I do not know if the info is true or not)
http://io9.com/heres-what-chinas-yutu-rover-is-doing-on-the-moon-1483746967
it claims the following:
A. The Chang'e 3 lander has a powerful HD science cameras that can send at a rate of one image per second.
B. The Yutu rover will be sending high-definition images, including panoramas, back to Earth.
and
C. Ouyang Ziyuan, one of the chief scientists on the Chang'e-3 mission, said the in an interview: ( @ http://english.cntv.cn/program/newshour/20131130/102473.shtml )
"Number one: space observation from the moon. This is the dream of many astronomers because atmosphere, wind, snow and pollution don't obstruct visibility as they do on earth. The result is also better because of the longer periods of uninterrupted observation from the moon due to it orbiting the earth. One day of observation on the moon is equivalent to 14 days on earth.
Number two: we have an ultraviolet camera on the lander to monitor the earth. This camera is different from the one used by America's Apollo 16. Ours can see the formation of the earth's plasmasphere and its density change. It's better than a satellite, which can only record data section by section as it orbits around the earth. On the moon it can observe half of earth at a time without moving. This is something people have always wanted to do.
Number three: we will be the first to learn the structure and layers of the moon 100 meters below its surface with radars installed at the bottom of the rover. As the rover drives on the lunar surface, it will be as [if] it can cut and see what's 100 meters below. "
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Developing nations are generally doing some or all of the three:
1) Building their industrial base
2) Providing free or low cost education
3) Providing free or low cost health care
The United States is doing the opposite of that. Our infrastructure is crumbling, our lack of high speed rail is a joke, as is our lack of mass transit outside of a few major cities, and our internet and cell phone networks are a decade behind Europe's. More job-crushing trade laws are being pushed (TPP), getting a college degree means five or six figures of debt, and the trivial detail that Obomneycare will still leave the U.S. with the worst health care system in the industrialized world.
How are those trends sustainable for the United States, where 80% of the population is in poverty or a paycheck away from it?
I'm sure looking forward to their findings!
I don't think the Chinese have the technology to fake a landing, so they had to do it for real.
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
A trip to the moon
Note the last line of the article states:
. (The French already landed in the left eye over 100 years ago ).
Let's be honest, anyone who still thought that the moon landings were fakes, isn't going to be convinced by this either.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Here I was expecting some troll to criticize the Chinese effort for being a copy of what was done 40+ years ago, or simply a stunt........if you think that prestige and publicity aren't part of the reason for the Chinese effort, then I've got a bridge to sell you
Ironically you ended up being the one to say what you thought a troll would say.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
No, read more carefully. Nowhere does it say I expected to encounter a troll who criticized the Chinese effort because it was motivated in part by a desire for prestige and publicity. Moreover I specifically said "I've also got no problem with that being part of the motivation." Now what was your point?
Here's a clue: the space race was about sending both unmanned and manned missions into space, including earth orbit, the moon, and other planets. The arms race was about developing better ways to nuke the other side (though also likely suicidal).
Perhaps you meant to say that both were motivated by competition with, and hostility towards, the USSR, although it's hard to see how the space race was motivated by hostility, since it wasn't aggressive. Did they sometimes use similar technologies, like rockets? Yes, as indeed computers were also used for both. In other words, they were the same thing ... if you completely ignore the differences.
What was your point?
Specifically? That your post is hilarious. And it still is.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
That seems strangely logical.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6MOnehCOUw
Science is all about firing a drunk pig out of a cannon just to see what happens.
The wise try not to reason in absolutes; There are almost always exceptions...
Hell, a mission on the moon does not happen every year, and I cannot find absolutely *anything* on the web apart from a couple of meaningless photos. Where is the landing, or photos taken around the rover, or anything? Unlike Mars, that thing is controllable in almost real-time, what are they doing? Maybe China is like the former USSR in keeping information secret, or the world is really apathetic.
Currently China is only sending us computer animations, so they want to ease life of conspiracy people.
has anybody noticed the regular polygon forms on the background of the probe on the right of the first picture on the link? is that part of a hill on the moon? that'd be worth sending the rover to!
The transmissions used were line of site, VHF, the transmissions to the moon were followed by replies from the moon.
Both sides of the transmissions could be monitored by other nations, including the USSR who would have been VERY fast to call phony.
Also, the USSR had spacecraft that could listen in and could tell where it was all coming from, so because of the time of travel and source of the transmissions, the only way to fake it would be to have the entire thing prerecorded before launch.
But you would still have had to land the recordings and transmitter on the moon as well as send back the images of the moon, which would have to be faked ahead of time and sent to the moon.
Except that much storage didn't exist back then.
So no, it couldn't have been faked, unless the USSR and perhaps several other nations were in on it. I guess that part is possible, but frankly I think in 1969 it would have been easier to just send men to the moon than it would be to fake the whole thing and get the USSR on board.
That, plus I've personally met two of the moon astronauts, Buzz Aldrin and Gene Cernan. I met Buzz only briefly, however I've spoken with Gene for more than an hour about his experiences.
He could be lying, but frankly, I believe him and I don't think you'd get those 12 men to lie about it for as long as it has been.
The space race about using the populations' egos to justify spending immense resources on improving military space technology.
The US has since made it very clear that whoever controls the skies controls the battlefield (unless it's insurgents in urban areas). Space is just a sky above the sky, and controlling that was believed to be the key to beating the other guy, when ICBMs were in their infancy.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/chinas-flag-bearing-rover-photographed-on-moon/2013/12/15/12928868-65f7-11e3-997b-9213b17dac97_story.html
China said Monday it was on track to launch a fifth lunar probe with the aim of bringing back lunar soil and rock samples following the successful moon landing of a space probe.
I think he wanted to point out that the technology required to launch peaceful, scientific operations into space happens to be almost exactly the same as much of the technology required for ICBMs. So yes, "they sometimes use[d] similar technologies, like rockets". That was a very large part of the point; the connection between the arms race and the space race is very well known indeed. If you genuinely believe that governments of the 1960s were piling untold billions of dollars into the space race purely for the scientific merits and a PR boost then I'd suggest a certain naivity on your part. It's a perfect way of developing needed technology, and technology that could be useful in the future, in an ethically and even legally defensible manner, and which will coincidentally provide you with a propaganda boost and, sure, some science as well. With the benefit of hindsight, it can probably be convincingly argued that the space race was an inevitable consequence of the arms race.
Can't tell if using iPhone or having stroke.
... that this is what happens when a country puts its energy into space travel and not spying on its own people, but China is of course doing both.
Where as the US is only doing one of these.
Oh ZING! YEAH! THAT'S GOTTA HURT!
Have you heard of these people?
Without them, there is no Apollo moon landing, because they were the brains behind the Saturn V rocket. And they were both Nazi scientists.
Without the Saturn V rocket, no humans would have landed on the moon.
The idea that Goddard had something to do with it is pure fiction. Do some research man.
Perhaps delivering high resolution images to US/ Western geeks is not their primary mission. Perhaps a few low res snapshots to keep the western media off their back (see, we really did it, put away your conspiracy theory stories) is all they felt obliged to do.
Maybe there's a high res camera sending pictures back to their scientific research / military people and they just don't feel the need to distribute this material to the general public in other countries. The Chinese funding model might not be the same as the USA's, maybe they don't need to distribute high res holiday snaps to ensure continued funding.
Perhaps there's no high res camera on board because the science of the mission doesn't need any more than a few low res snaps. The real work might be elsewhere. I've read a couple of articles that note that the lander is much bigger than you might expect for a rover of this size, so it might be the real mission here is to test lander technologies in preparation for sending a manned mission. It might be that the real science is around testing that platform, and the rover is just supplementary, a nice addition for extra kudos and you might as well do it while you're there.
Just wait until they find the Transformers on the dark side and start mining them for parts.
You are not a TRUE AMERICAN if you don't turn around, put your fingers in your ears and sing "La-La-La-La..."
In otherwords, you enjoy the opportunity to fight up the gravity well, to the heights above. Isn't it easier, better protected to fight downhill? But I do love the opportunity that it presupposes. A race for a better world. But unfortunately there are those that wish for the return of christ....death to the world and it's people.
...non-existent? I thought so,,,
Then it's obvious, isn't it? Those poor 12 men were fooled, just as we were!
The transmissions used were line of site
That's SIGHT, moron. Take some remedial English classes, your ESL sucks.
There's a reason they said "let's nuke the site from orbit" :)
Unity? Screw that: XFCE. Slashdot Beta? Screw that: SoylentNews. Australis? Screw that: Pale Moon. UX developers DIAF
Can I put my fingers in Obama's ass and go... "what does the Fox (news) says: ding ding ding ding ding ding..."?
You also need to remember that all of this happened with technology developed in the 1960's. Some of this fakery that can happen now simply was not available (especially live computer graphic simulations). The live feeds of Gene Cernan and Harrison Schmitt running around on their rovers, for not just a few minutes but almost continuously for several days straight, is something that I think would have been impossible to fake.
Besides, you can't reason with those who think it is all a huge conspiracy. Some of them are convinced that NASA has subsequently sent stuff up to the Moon to fake the landing sites... as if faking stuff on the Moon is any easier than simply doing the real mission and doing exactly as has been claimed.
China bought the vacuum stage, no wonder they look similar....;)
A rat done bit my sister Nell....
Apollo 8 and 10 were not fake, but the others were obviously fake. There is no atmosphere on the moon, and they would have suffocated in minutes.
The Wise also know when to not take the literal meaning of phrases and then give a pedantic response.
Ok, I see the lander and the rover photos, however it makes me wonder about the lander photo. Is that photo taken on the moon? Because if so what on the moon looks like what we see in the background. Several rectangular objects on the horizon just before the black background. Both left and right of the top of the lander. They look like they are lighted and smooth with a row of inverted objects that are u-shaped with posts for what ever purpose. Any ideas.
The Obama administration's decision to outsource the space program to China is certainly working well.
Allowing the Chinese to 'borrow' or buy almost every piece of technology necessary (except the space suits and launch vehicle - they are Russian) show what a wonderful friend Obama is to China. Doubly so since now the US itself cannot launch much into space and must depend on the largesse of the Russians at $70 million a pop.
Still it is what Obama wanted. A diminished US.
And, of course, the platitudinous remarks here and elsewhere about China sharing it with the world. Oh yes China is famous for giving away everything. That is sure to happen perhaps by 3013.
In the meantime the fringe of the Chinese military has proposed setting up a missile base on the moon to be able to accurately aim at targets on earth. Similarly Chinese war games target 'white devils'. Guess that is not Obama so we are safe.
Don't you love the outsourcing. I smile when I think of the crap that awaits the millenials - the Obama voters - in the future when the rest of us are gone. Too late then for voter remorse. The deed is done.
Fat Kim just sent a "satellite" up for propaganda, not at all to test an ICBM.
"history doesn't repeat itself, but it rhymes", right?
At least India and China are physically close enough that you can believe their moon/mars expeditions are mostly for propaganda.
Why not use a laser to communicate? Pretty tough to listen in on. They certainly had lasers back then, as everybody likes to point out that they set up laser reflectors on the Moon. I'm sure there's some way to scramble the audio as well.
Also, you assume the Soviets didn't believe that we were sending people to the Moon and would be checking every scrap of communication to verify it. It could be that the ruse worked.
Again, I'm going to reiterate that I believe we landed on the Moon. There's plenty of evidence that we did, we had the capability, etc. I'm just saying that (a) the communication isn't really a problem and (b) it's fun to think about how you could fake it.
For example, when someone points out they put laser reflectors at the Apollo landing sites, I like to ask whether anybody pointed a laser at those sites before we landed to verify that there was nothing reflecting lasers beforehand. Also, I'm pretty sure that with 1960s technology, we could land a laser reflector on the Moon.
Bull. Crap.
I refuse to learn anything or realize that very smart people given a lot of money can do a lot of things before they become mainstream.
"Yeah, that's why no one has ever revisited Everest, the Amazon, the South Pole and other inhospitable locations since they were first conquered."
These are all on this planet and are a billion times more hospitable than the Moon. You can *WALK* to Everest.
People believe the US faked the landing because they were caught using wires everywhere in their moon video
Apollo 16 astronaut fell and lifted by wire
We can see the wires people!
People believe the US faked the landing because they were caught using wires everywhere in their moon video
Apollo 16 astronaut fell and lifted by wire
We can see the wires people!
Have you ever watched "Breaking Bad" or Trainspotting? ;)
Well, there's your answer
-- 29A the number of the Beast
so don't.