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Israeli Group To Attempt Moon Landing
cold fjord writes: "NDTV reports, 'Israel plans to do what only the world's biggest countries have so far managed to do: land an unmanned spacecraft on the moon ... only Russia, the U.S. and China have soft landed on the moon, and India hard landed its tri-colour using the moon impact probe in 2008 ... The washing machine-sized spacecraft that weighs 121 kilograms is being readied by a not-for-profit venture called SpaceIL. ... The Israeli lunar probe had its genesis after the $30 million Google Lunar X Prize was announced as a competition which challenged non-state-owned space agencies to land on the moon, send back photos, and move 500 meters on the surface of the moon. About two dozen global teams are racing to win the prize- SpaceIL reckons it's in pole position. ... ex-NASA engineer Yonatan Winetraub and two of his friends conceived of the spacecraft in 2010 ... then used a Facebook page to promote the dream. Today, the dream has matured into a $36 million mission with 20 full time employees and 250 volunteers. ... Around 40,000 school students have been associated with this project.' Further details are available here."
The U.S.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
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Someone convince them the Muslims got there first, and are living in craters... then we'll get loads of colonists on the moon in no time.
moon colonies?
Let's wish the first Israeli moon probe a better landing than the first Israeli astronaut.
Going to the moon isn't merely a curiosity or a scientific achievement. It's a statement to the world that you were able to accurately land a payload on a target more than 350,000 km away. If you can do that with a rocket that leaves near-Earth orbit, it means you can do it with one that does not leave Earth orbit.
In other words, moon landings are how you tell the world you have ICBMs (or at least the ability to make them) without the public throwing a fit about it.
Maybe ... the ... author ... should ... try ... writing ... an ... article ... in ... full ... sentences
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Are they planning to relocate the Palestinians to the moon?
If they can send all of the "settlers" there, instead of into Palestine.
(Why am I imagine a mash up between Gil Scott Heron and Mel Brooks?
Three Squirrels
But this has long since ceased to be any sort of technical challenge or accomplishment.
Putting a lander on the moon (or, even, for that matter, a human) is not much of a technical challenge, insofar as needing to do anything other than learn how to properly use complex (but well-known) technology.
There's a whole raft of small aerospace companies (of which SpaceX is merely the best known) with funding in the low millions than can produces a lunar lander for you within 6 months of a go-ahead. And building a sufficiently large rocket to put 100kg on the moon for a 1-way trip is merely a matter of money, not even advanced tech these days.
The bigger obstacle is political will, and being able to divert the few tens of millions it costs from being cannibalized by special interests.
If the Israelis do it, good for them. But it's not really advancing the state-of-the-art in any way, nor is it much more than a publicity stunt.
There are always four sides to every story: your side, their side, the truth, and what really happened.
http://www.evcomics.com/2009/0...
... than making peace with your neighbours. ;-)
(Warning: Possibly anti-Semitic content)
http://www.evcomics.com/2012/0...
Except Russia got there first, with Luna 9.
How uncivilized! Lobbing rockets at the people living in the houses you built, and then were forced out of by guns and tanks. Clearly, being evicted from your ancestral homes by force (in violation of international law) is nothing to get angry about. No decent human would be outraged at having their country occupied by foreigners who regularly imprison and torture dissidents, while blockading normal international trade, resulting in frequent severe lack of access to basic food and medicine.
You really need to learn some history... and law.
See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v... for a start.
I wonder how America would feel if Iran tried to land a similar probe on the moon instead?
Uh oh - What about the Nazis hiding out up there on the Moon? This can't end well...
Personally, I find it somewhat sad that individual groups of people are all trying to accomplish the same thing or things which have been accomplished by humanity previously. What I'm saying is that I wish, rather, that the entire world would unite efforts in furthering human space-exploration technologies instead of countries keeping these "secrets" to themselves and ultimately slowing everything down from what they could be if we had one major, united world effort.
I suppose a lot of that behavior originates from from exactly what you point out in your post — though I do not understand said behavior.
and they shouldn't have used a washing machine.
Yeah, but that's only one tiny part of the space race --- America's the clear leader if you look at the big milestones, instead of just cherry-picking one isolated mission. Like, first satellite in orbit --- oops, ignore that. How about first human in space --- aww, shit; well they aren't really in space unless they can do the first spacewalk --- dang. Well, the free and equal US at least got the first woman in space... fooey. Well, near-earth is easy stuff anyway; how about first to reach another planet? Darn, but first to touch another planet... well, first to soft-land on another planet... shit. OK, first sample-return from outside earth... err, let's focus on what's really important in the space race...
USA Number One! USA! USA! USA!
You're missing some history.
Time Now for a Declaration of Mideast Peace; Doomed Arab Refugees
In ''Semites and Anti-Semites'' (New York, 1986), Bernard W. Lewis quotes (page 270) from the memoirs of Khalid al-Azm, Prime Minister of Syria in 1948-49, listing the factors that led to Israel's success:
.... the summons of the Arab governments to the population of Palestine to leave the country and take refuge in the neighboring Arab countries . . . this collective flight served the Jews and strengthened their position without effort. . . . Since 1948 we have been demanding the return of the refugees to their homes when we ourselves were the ones who induced them to leave them. . . . We doomed a million Arab refugees, by calling on them and insisting that they abandon their land, their homes, their work and their occupations, and we made them unemployed and homeless.''
When we all "cooperate", there's little incentive to actually finish things. Competition works better because then your progress isn't just based on some ambiguous feelgood metric, but also the concrete things that everyone else is doing.
Especially when you consider that most of your neighbors (if not all) belong to a religion that forbids them from making peace with anybody who doesn't share their religion. At best, you can get a long-term truce, but never peace. Who knows? Maybe flying to the Moon will help persuade the more reasonable factions in the Middle East that a very, very long-term truce with Israel is a Good Idea.
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You're also missing some history --- you do realize that the 1949 borders are not generally the territory under dispute? That Israel has done a few things since then with regard to stealing territory and imposing perpetual occupations?
I recommend this entertaining quiz for more insight on how peaceful either religion is.
This is just the beginning. Moon Alliyah and settlements to come, replete with extremely loud, religious 19th century gun-toting god-botherers claiming God said the moon was theirs.
You mean the USA?
Your point is?
History of the World, Courtesy of Mel Brooks.
Man blir trött av att gå och göra ingenting.
Sadly, the Palestinians had a chance to negotiate a peace that would have recovered territory when Labor was in power, but Arafat found it much more comfortable to be a leader in exile than to take a chance on peace. As Abba Eban said, "the Palestinians never miss a chance to miss a chance".
The article starts off with "Israel Plans", except it's not Israel, it's an organization inside Israel? I had a salad for lunch. "America has salad for lunch! Later plans to visit restroom!"
Yeah, but that's only one tiny part of the space race --- America's the clear leader if you look at the big milestones, instead of just cherry-picking one isolated mission. Like, first satellite in orbit --- oops, ignore that. How about first human in space --- aww, shit; well they aren't really in space unless they can do the first spacewalk --- dang. Well, the free and equal US at least got the first woman in space... fooey. Well, near-earth is easy stuff anyway; how about first to reach another planet? Darn, but first to touch another planet... well, first to soft-land on another planet... shit. OK, first sample-return from outside earth... err, let's focus on what's really important in the space race...
USA Number One! USA! USA! USA!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F...
GGWP rest of the world.
Is it just me or is there no reference to launch date whatsoever?
Or conversely why dont we send all the rabid Zionist land grabbers to build those cities on the moon.
I have nothing against Jewish people but I oppose Zionism.
His point is that this "We're #1" hubris is a bit misplaced when it was the Russians that got just about every single first in the space race. Year the moon landing was slick and the joyride on the surface in a rover with a driver's seat was kinda cool, but don't go around saying America was first in everything.
This complacency is going to be America's undoing, and the standard racist /. reaction to every non-American space venture is just a symptom of it.
Drill baby drill - on Mars
Or maybe, just maybe, it's a scientific accomplishment that a technologically advanced nation would like to achieve. They don't have to land on the moon to remind the other nations in the Middle East that this probably isn't the best time to start another pogrom.
They don't have to, but it's a very clear message, from a sometimes-aggressive and presumed nuclear nation.
There are basically three reasons to do it. (1) It's fucking cool. (2) It's a message to their enemies that they are capable of building ICBMs and putting their nukes anywhere on the planet. (3) It will be useful in domestic political campaigns.
Reason (1) is the best one, but it is exceptionally rare for countries to fund things for reason (1). (2) and/or (3) are FAR more likely.
They're going to (already?) spend $36 million to win a $30 million prize.
I don't think they're as smart as a rocket scientist.. oh, wait...
Individual groups of people all trying to accomplish the same thing or things is absolutely essential to get stuff done. It motivates people to focus and work hard on the problem, because they know that others are working hard too and they will likely reach similar quality and are progressing fast. The competition between people means competition between solutions, which allows the soundest solutions to prevail (up to exceptions).
Competition can be friendly, especially if you are not too emotionally invested, and that's great especially for the people involved. Unfriendly competition is still great in the long run even though it introduces redundancies. The space race gave a big surge to the technological progress. Sport competitions give many athletes (or chess players or whoever) an incentive to improve. Computer Go programs evolved rapidly recently also thanks to competition. Recent Debian discussions about their next init system gave massive boost to openrc development.
Without competition, people are lazy and slack, since any effort is not worth it! Competition is awesome!
It's not the fall that kills you. It's the sudden stop at the end. -Douglas Adams
...so could this "lunar rocket" be "accidentally" targeted at Palestine?
well if that jerk would just keep his dog off my yard...
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
Hmmm
I'll just leave this here...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
Strat
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
Let's face it, as soon as Israel can reach the moon it's just a matter of time before they build a settlement on it.
Especially when you consider that most of your neighbors (if not all) belong to a religion that forbids them from making peace with anybody who doesn't share their religion.
Which religion were you referring to?
Do it yourself, because no one else will do it yourself. [beta blockade 10-17 Feb]
It's not Israel "stealing" territory and imposing perpetual occupation. It's the unwillingess of the so-called allies of the Palestinians to actually end the various wars they have started.
Egypt got it's territory back as soon as they made peace with Israel.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
> Which religion were you referring to?
The one that advocates global jihad and a caliphate.
It's like the Tea Party but with different hats.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Ok. So here's a question: it's 2014, not 1965. Which space program would you rather have: the USA's, China's, or Russia's? Which one is having the most success *right now*? Which one is roving Mars? Orbiting Saturn? Exploring interstellar space? Heading to Pluto? Would you really trade even up for Russia's Soyuz? Because it seems like that's about what they have going right now.
PR stunts cannot erase the bloodstained governance that plagues this military-apartheid state.
> Which religion were you referring to?
The one that advocates global jihad and a caliphate.
It's like the Tea Party but with different hats.
Keep drinking the koolaid and spouting that hasbara.
The only people that chant things like that are people that are criticizing the US. Hard to believe but people don't actually do that here...except near the 4th of July, because we get to blow stuff up if it is in the name of patriotism.
The US gives Israel about 3 billion a year in financial aid, and Israel can only use this money to buy military equipment back from the US.
Israel's defense budget is about 15 billion a year.
He is probably referring to Christianity and the Bible (Old Testament) which forbids any peace, and denies heaven to anyone not slaughtering disbelievers.
A fraction c Israel.defence is aid by the U.S..
The numbers are.public.
If you ent know, don't make things up, no hats just ignorant.
Israel is obliged to buy only us army products with that dollar aid and as I.recall, Israel is will funding a vibrant local army industries, such as uavs , which compete with us uavs.
Hell, the us even uses them itself.
So f you dnt know,.just shut up.
What part of PRIVATE organization don't you get?
It's a PRIVATE organization, we are doing it solely on science.
There is no more than 10% gvment funding and even then , it's financial , with what the industry could benefit.
Politics has NOTHING in it nor we want it within our project.
Please, stop making reasons up. Unlike our neighbors , or you for that matter, science is our main goal, we couldn't care less for war, nor do we.want to promote it in any kind.
What we do promote is the education of an entire generation, similar to the post 69 era in the us.
The pallies have already declared themselves the moon natives and that the Zionist empire is trying to expand there. T
They are claiming nazies from the.moon is a documentary Palestine have made of Zionist plans to the moon and earth.
THAT IS HOW CRAZY YOU SOUND.
Numbnutz.
Ok. So here's a question: it's 2014, not 1965. Which space program would you rather have: the USA's, China's, or Russia's? Which one is having the most success *right now*? Which one is roving Mars? Orbiting Saturn? Exploring interstellar space? Heading to Pluto? Would you really trade even up for Russia's Soyuz? Because it seems like that's about what they have going right now.
Only one way for thee and me to get into space, and that's Russia.
Ok. So here's a question: it's 2014, not 1965. Which space program would you rather have: the USA's, China's, or Russia's? Which one is having the most success *right now*? Which one is roving Mars? Orbiting Saturn? Exploring interstellar space? Heading to Pluto? Would you really trade even up for Russia's Soyuz? Because it seems like that's about what they have going right now.
Only one way for thee and me to get into space, and that's Russia.
And China of course. India may well be next.
'Israel plans to do what only the world's biggest countries have so far managed to do:
Well, is it Israel trying to send robot under fake name of some anonymous group and thus steal Google prize ? :)
Well, Russia plus 20 million dollars. Good luck with that.
Like a Treblinka shower. I didn't know there were so many liberals here @ /.
Specifically Hollywood.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
We all knew it was coming...
*Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
Well, Russia plus 20 million dollars. Good luck with that.
It's called capitalism. Something the USA doesn't have (you do have corporatism though, like 1930s Germany)
Except Europa. Would it kill you not land there, like a shmendrick?
Let's look at the subject in more detail. First satellite, first human, first successful lunar mission -- clearly the Soviets.
After that:
First successful mission to another planet: Mariner 2 flyby of Venus, 1962, USA. Your listing of Venera 1 as the "first to reach another planet" neglects to mention that the spacecraft failed before it got there.
First successful mission to Mars: Mariner 4, 1964, USA.
First communications satellites: passive, Echo I, 1960, USA; active, Courier 1B, USA.
First spacecraft rendezvous in orbit: Geminis 6 and 7, 1965, USA.
First spacecraft docking in orbit: Gemini 8, 1966, USA.
First manned spacecraft beyond low earth orbit: Apollo 8, 1968, USA
First manned spacecraft in lunar orbit: Apollo 8, 1968, USA
First spacecraft to orbit another planet: Mariner 9, Nov 1971, USA
First mission beyond the inner solar system: Pioneer 10, 1973, USA
First flyby of Jupiter: Pioneer 10, 1973, USA
There are many others.
Now let's examine some of the Soviet space firsts:
First soft lander on the Moon: 3 Feb 1966, Luna 9, USSR, a success by any definition, sent back pictures, operated for 3 days on lunar surface
compared to:, Surveyor 1, first USA soft lander, landed 14 July 1966, operated for nearly 6 months on the lunar surface
First soft lander on Mars: Mars 3, Dec 1971, USSR, operated for 14.5 seconds on the surface, compared to Viking 1, first USA Mars lander, July 1976, operated for 6 years on the surface.
So the story that the USSR was the clear leader in early space exploration is clearly false. Both nations had impressive 'firsts', anyone who doesn't acknowledge the accomplishments of both has poor knowledge of the subject.
Islam. Though technically they allow peace with another religion as long as the people practicing it wholly submit to their Muslim overlords and pay a tax for the privilege of existing.
Is the moon kosher???
Idiot there is no heaven in the Old Testament. That's not part of the Jewish religion!!
This would be really great, the first step towards an Israeli colony on the moon. This ought to give them enough room, without being shoulder-to-shoulder with hostile neighbors.
...or erect expandable walls around the landing site?
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Great, so you're ok with arming the American Indians, then, right? Because that's EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM until about a century or so ago.
. Define sqrt(x) as something really evil like (x / rand()), and bury it deep. Watch your coworkers go nuts.
Admittedly moving all the Israelis to the moon would make them a lot harder to hit with 10 dollar rocket attacks...
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Citation very much needed. Are you talking about the conquest of Canaan? Maybe in that specific context, but definitely not "forbidding any peace," as they settled in afterward and were in fact discouraged from allying themselves with other nations, which would tend to push them towards a more defensive stance I would imagine.
As far as I am aware, salvation in Christianity has NEVER been dependent on killing anyone, even in the Old Testament.
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(Okay, yes, it wasn't actually Christianity in the Old Testament; it was Judaism. You know what I mean.)
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