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Microsoft CEO To Slash 18,000 Jobs, 12,500 From Nokia To Go

DW100 (2227906) writes "Satya Nadella has taken an axe to Microsoft's 127,000-strong workforce by announcing a whopping 18,000 job cuts, including 12,500 from the recently integrated Nokia division. At least 13,000 jobs will go within the next six months." It's official, Ballmer's layoff record has been smashed. From the email sent to employees: "The first step to building the right organization for our ambitions is to realign our workforce. With this in mind, we will begin to reduce the size of our overall workforce by up to 18,000 jobs in the next year. Of that total, our work toward synergies and strategic alignment on Nokia Devices and Services is expected to account for about 12,500 jobs, comprising both professional and factory workers. We are moving now to start reducing the first 13,000 positions, and the vast majority of employees whose jobs will be eliminated will be notified over the next six months."

54 of 383 comments (clear)

  1. I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by AbRASiON · · Score: 5, Funny

    Right, right? No way would they need anyone from overseas for any upcoming jobs, no sirree. Won't see any work of any kind going to other countries, nope!

    1. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 5, Insightful

      "In order to ensure continued access to scarce skillsets that are key to our ability to innovate, we need to be able to draw flexibly from a global pool of professionals."

      (Oh, and we also resent having to pay those scarce and valuable individuals more than $15 / hour. So we'll still need some foreign worker visas, thanks).

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    2. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by beelsebob · · Score: 5, Informative

      As a foreign worker in the US, I have no idea where you got that $15 an hour from. I can assure you, I'm paid substantially more than that.

    3. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by cheesybagel · · Score: 5, Funny

      At least one of these stupid companies finally got around to outsourcing their CEO from India as well. It has gone full circle.

    4. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by clickety6 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      If 12,.500 layoffs are at Nokia, then weren't most of these jobs overseas anyway, from a US viewpoint?

      --
      ----------------------------------- My Other Sig Is Hilarious -----------------------------------
    5. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by beelsebob · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And yet, somehow, a figure picked out of GP's ass to cause a stir... is?

    6. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by Entropius · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They continually invent new and creative kinds of suck.

    7. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      more than $140,000 a year, but less than $180,000 (plus various other things like stock etc)

      Unless you are doing the job of someone they would usually be paying $200,000 per year, then I would say you are probably a good example of when H1B works. But looking at the numbers and average salaries I see a lot of average salaries in the $50k and $60k range which is really very low and likely is undermining the market for entry level jobs in the US.

      Microsoft does seem to be competitive with an average salary in the $100k range for H1B Visas, but that also means that there could be hundreds of people there who are really paid very low salaries and it could be offset by very few people making very very large salaries. In other words they can pay a few token executives, managers and key engineers large six figure salaries or even millions and get hundreds of cheaper than competitive rate programmers and still make the averages work out in order to make it look good on paper.

      Personally, I've worked with experienced H1B people making 20% less than the competitive salary both for their formal position and the work they were *actually* doing. I am sure there are outliers on both sides, but I do think the numbers combined with the anecdotes do paint a picture of a H1B system that is often times abused by employers to get cheaper labor.

    8. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by Lumpy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you are not making $45 or more an hour you are being robbed. Programmers are massively underpaid compared to the skillset we need to do our jobs. Why the hell do we tolerate deflating the job down to the level of a factory worker?

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    9. Re:I guess they won't need any more foreign Visas? by phantomfive · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Programmers are massively underpaid compared to the skillset we need to do our jobs.

      A bachelors degree? We don't 'deserve' to get paid more than chemists, but we do. Like everything else, we get paid according to supply and demand. The skillset required to be an artist is tough to develop, but those guys don't get paid much.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  2. I really really hate by bravecanadian · · Score: 5, Insightful

    CEO-speak.. "building the right organization" "work towards synergies and strategic alignment" gobbledygoop

    I'm all for cutting out bureaucracy where it isn't needed but come on man..

    1. Re:I really really hate by Jason+Levine · · Score: 5, Interesting

      You should listen to a song on the latest Weird Al album: Mission Statement. Sung in the style of Crosby, Stills, and Nash, it's a perfect parody of those managers who love to speak in "corporate talk." Next time you go to a meeting with one of those managers, recite some of the lyrics (spoken, not sung, of course) and see whether they nod their heads in agreement.

      "We'll set a brand trajectory
      Using management philosophy
      Advance our market share vis-à-vis
      Our proven methodology
      With strong commitment to quality
      Effectively enhancing corporate synergy"

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  3. Buzzword speak by i+ate+my+neighbour · · Score: 5, Funny

    The synergy will get you.

  4. Beware these muppets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Just another puppet inheriting the stink barge. Nothing will change at Microsoft. Cuts, layoffs, and generally contribution to economic stagnation is all these clowns are about. Pay no attention to what they ever say. Watch what they do... and it's always the same...

  5. The cycle begins again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Just remember that companies like Valve were founded by ex-Microsoft software engineers.

    1. Re:The cycle begins again by Raenex · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Just remember that companies like Valve were founded by ex-Microsoft software engineers.

      Many of the early employees of Microsoft became millionaires due to stock options, so they could afford to jump ship and do their own thing. I doubt that's true of the people being laid off.

  6. Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by Squidlips · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Words like "synergies and strategic alignment" and right sizing are right out of the Dilbert Mission Statement generator (which used to be on the Dilbert web site). Nothing can be as demoralizing as being managed by exec's so stupid that they have never read Dilbert.

    1. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by gstoddart · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Nothing can be as demoralizing as being managed by exec's so stupid that they have never read Dilbert.

      The problem in real life, as it is in Dilbert, is the things we cringe at are the things the executives think "now there's a damned fine idea".

      There's a huge disconnect between how management people respond to those things versus what the rest of us do.

      Unfortunately, they're the ones calling the shots -- and what we see as parody and satire, they see as an instruction manual.

      I don't believe I've ever worked at a company where the management team didn't (on a semi regular basis) take a page straight out of the Dilbert playbook and begin to implement it.

      It's like we experience an entirely different reality.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    2. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's like we experience an entirely different reality.

      Well of course you do. Your reality is working on a project, shielded from higher-level concerns. Their reality is trying to shield you from higher-level concerns by managing them. You are no more equipped to understand their job than they are to understand yours. Dilbert does a great job lampooning the aspects that are visible to you, but a poor job of explaining the aspects that are not. You won't get this until you become a manager, I'm afraid.

    3. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by Casualposter · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Oh what utter rubbish! Management is mostly irrelevant - especially the over paid CEO types who can't seem to figure out what the company does - but they can sure "manage" it. Good, driven, visionary management can keep a company healthy and profitable for centuries, but most of these managers are about as useful as pot holes. What they are really good at is convincing themselves and their cronies on the board of directors that they deserve more pay, more bonuses, because well, they are paid millions so they must be worth millions more! In reality, the average manager is not any smarter than the guy running the project and certainly not better at predicting where the market it is headed, or what the economy is going to do, or what the sales for next quarter will be. AS for the higher level concerns . . . what higher level concerns? A business has all the same issues as a family - income, taxes, the crazy dude next door with the chainsaw and the lawyer...which church to go to for the tax breaks and legal loop holes. Please don't put any faith in management - they either understand the company because they've worked there (and can do an adequate job of keeping the place running) or they are just some rich dude in a suit with less clue about how to run a company than a chimpanzee has of running a zoo.

      --
      Creative Spelling Copyright (2002). May use without Persimmons
    4. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You are no more equipped to understand their job than they are to understand yours.

      If they can't understand my job, they damn sure aren't competent to manage it.

    5. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by Sir_Eptishous · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Most CEO's and Executive Level types are sociopaths.

      --
      We play the game with the bravery of being out of range
    6. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You are no more equipped to understand their job than they are to understand yours.

      Horseshit.

      I once worked at a company which primarily grew by acquisition.

      The running joke (albeit real) was that the VP of R&D from the last major acquisition was now the VP of R&D for the entire company.

      And that VP would develop a huge sense of "Not Invented Here", and start to decide that any product which wasn't invented by his company wasn't worth pursuing.

      In several instances they tried to fiddle with the core competencies, get rid of things which were absolutely central to the business model, and generally fsck things up. Because the particular brand of hammer they sold was all they understood, and anything else must therefore be unimportant.

      I can't even count how many MBAs I've met who had precisely zero experience in the industry they were suddenly in, who started to make decisions which demonstrated that, other than the case studies they did in school, they didn't have a frigging clue. In fact, I've seen numerous examples where their understanding of the technology was so non-existent they couldn't understand what it did, and why their arbitrary choices were disconnected from the real world.

      People get parachuted into management positions in companies they know nothing about and don't fully understand, and then apply their one size fits all solution -- even if that solution is a terrible idea.

      This belief that someone who has studied management understand either the business or the process of management is a crock of shit. Because anybody who has worked in tech long enough knows damned well that most of them are doing things just to make themselves look important.

      We once had a departmental manager insist on building ER diagrams for our product. The problem was, the software wasn't based on an RDB, the ER diagrams were meaningless and misleading, and had absolutely nothing to do with anything.

      I've seen situations in which the guy who owned a piece of technology was responsible for deciding that it was the one we should go with, despite overwhelming evidence that the piece of software he was responsible for wasn't capable of doing what it was supposed to replace. This was purely ego, politics, and carving out their own little fiefdom.

      You think Elon Musk went into Nokia with an understanding of what Nokia needed as a business? Or merely a view that whatever they were doing was wrong because it wasn't based on Microsoft stuff?

      You won't get this until you become a manager, I'm afraid.

      If I hadn't seen so many examples of gross incompetence in management, I might actually believe there is a kernel of truth here.

      But since I have, I don't.

      Management isn't some elite bunch of people with all of the answers. They're a bunch of people who were chosen by a bunch of people like them to carry out policies which have already been decided upon.

      And it is as much about politics as it is reality.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    7. Re:Dilbert words: Can anything be as demoralizing? by erp_consultant · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The latest buzzword is Human Capital Management. Note the use of the word Capital, as in asset. You, as an employee, are nothing more than a piece of furniture in their eyes. In the old days they called it the Personnel department. At least that had some sort of human element to it.

      The morals of the story?

      1) Don't trust management. They will cast you aside at the blink of an eye to save their own ass.
      2) Don't get fooled into thinking you have lifetime employment with anyone.
      3) Even when you have a job, never stop looking for the next one.

  7. Burning platforms by stoploss · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I guess Nokia's platform really was burning after all. It's just that it was arson.

  8. IBM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's what IBM does: lays off thousands here in the USA and just hires overseas.

    And they still charge an obscene amount for their products and services.

    It's all about cost arbitrage now: really cheap technical labor overseas and charge like you have 100% American or Western European labor.

    Our country and economy is being bled dry by the multinationals.

    While we are distracted by cheaper big screen TV and other electronic toys, the things that really matter are becoming more expensive while our pay is declining - and it's not just inflation. I see jobs here in Metro Atl that are paying $60K+ that once paid $80K+ back in the late 90s. If you include inflation, that's a hell of a pay cut.

    But in the meantime, fuel, medical, education, food, housing (rents are going back up) and essentials to living are going up.

    We are in a spiral to the bottom because multinational companies are importing poverty from the Third World.

    Solution? I stopped buying shit. It helps that retailers are becoming more and more obnoxious. No more rip-off cable or other services like that. Smart phone? Shove it.

    Food? I cook and it's all unprocessed - no packaged shit with shit additives.

    Car? 20 years old and counting. And I do the maintenance: clutch, head gasket, brakes, you names it. Sorry for the local mechanic, but that's the new reality of our country.

    1. Re:IBM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Nothing to do with IBM. The oligarchs have seized power over the last 20 years and now the screw is being turned. The more they turn, the more scared you become. All around the world, policy is dictated by the corporations and they're invariably directly working against the population.

    2. Re:IBM by allquixotic · · Score: 3, Interesting

      As eloquently said by Truxton Spangler (portrayed by Michael Cristofer) at the end of the show Rubicon (which was pulled off the air after 1 season, IMHO, because it hit too close to home for the oligarchs):

      "Do you think anyone will give a shit?"

      That's the problem. It's the boiling frog problem. Most people will downplay this move as Microsoft exiting the mobile business. But it's much more than that. It's just one more step down the ladder into tyranny.

  9. Re:Translation: Slash 18K jobs, apply for 18K H-1B by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Right, because getting ah H-1B is /really/ easy!
    No bureaucratic nonsense there!

    And they are also a lot cheaper, because they can be lower than comparable US workers, right, right?

    http://www.h1bwage.com/index.php
    http://www.flcdatacenter.com/ /sarcasm

    Can we skip this useless blabber?
    You hire someone on H-1B because they possess quality you can't find in the country.
    Hiring H-1B for cost-reduction is idiocy! (better just ship your production overseas)

  10. Lets cut the H1B's! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sign the petition, lets get Obama to address why we still have H1B's
    https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/discuss-why-we-still-allow-h1b-visas-during-slow-economy/BxntX3JC

  11. what this says by slashmydots · · Score: 4, Interesting

    He might as well have written "Hey everyone, stop giving a shit about your job because you're probably fired." The same thing happened for the contracted/outsourced IT dept at the hospital where I worked. They told them 2 years in advance that they were not renewing their contract and were switching to a crew from IBM. So they stopped caring, didn't follow the dress code, outsourced internal support calls to Mexico, and their support response time rose to 3 months.

  12. Re:Nokia sure has bad luck by Exitar · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nokia can only blame itself for letting Elop become their CEO years ago.

  13. Stephen Elop by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's amazing that this guy can run the company into the ground and still have a job. How badly do you have to screw up to get fired as a CEO?

    1. Re:Stephen Elop by cheesybagel · · Score: 4, Interesting

      He ran Nokia into the ground so it could be acquired by Microsoft for peanuts. Now that he has done his job he gets the reward of a cushy job at Microsoft. I do not see anything strange here.

    2. Re:Stephen Elop by Jaime2 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      KMart was run into bankruptcy 13 years ago by it's CEO and COO. I don't mean they happened to be there while something bad happened, I mean that business strategy that was chosen directly caused the bankruptcy. The COO was the one making most of the calls and his previous two jobs got rid of him when they went bankrupt (Hechinger, Big V Supermarkets). Yes, he bankrupted three companies in a row. He's still an executive. Also, when he left KMart, he wasn't really fired - he "left voluntarily" and on the way out he was given a 3 million dollar loan and a document that said he would never have to pay back that loan. They did that because they weren't allowed to give him a bonus due the whole Chapter 11 thing and they felt so bad that he was going to be out of a job and needing to live on his meager eight figure investment portfolio.

  14. Re:Translation: Slash 18K jobs, apply for 18K H-1B by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    [Posting AC because I'm talking about my own employer.]

    Bullshit. H1-Bs save employers more than enough to pay for the bureaucratic overhead of hiring them. That's a one-time cost that's easily amortized over the three or six years of the visa, and if you hire lots of H1-Bs, the process can be pretty well streamlined. You can even outsource the paperwork.

    The last time I had to hire two code monkeys, the company hired an agency in India to find H1-B candidates. We interviewed over 20 candidates, and made offers to ten. Two of them turned out to have misrepresented their work histories, we finally hired two, and the rest ran screaming the other way when they saw what we offered. It was infuriating, but the bean-counters wouldn't budge. Get people who will take what we offer or do without.

    This is what companies do. Their employees aren't their greatest asset, they're their greatest cost center. In the long term, it's stupid, but the suits don't care. They only care about this quarter's (or this week's) results. Why buy socks at Nordstrom when you can buy them at Walmart?

  15. Re:And in totally unrelated news.... by donscarletti · · Score: 3, Informative

    Here's the thing.

    We are moving now to start reducing the first 13,000 positions, and the vast majority of employees whose jobs will be eliminated will be notified over the next six months."

    They are announcing layoffs that will not be implemented, in some cases for over 6 months in the future. That means, for over 6 months, Microsoft employees won't know for sure whether they will be laid off or kept. In management terms, that is going to result in dramatically lower morale and productivity for half a year for what? So that Microsoft can announce 5,000 more layoffs than they are actually capable of firing right now.

    It really just shows how much more Microsoft cares about stock value than running a good company.

    --
    When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
  16. Just when you thought morale could not go lower by Squidlips · · Score: 4, Insightful

    MS already has a hideous management technique called "stack ranking" that killed morale (http://www.forbes.com/sites/frederickallen/2012/07/03/the-terrible-management-technique-that-cost-microsoft-its-creativity/). Now some idiot in management decides to float the story about 5K jobs going away in 6 months and couch it in Dilbert weasel words. So everyone who is not demoralized enough by stack ranking will be terrified by this announcement.

    1. Re:Just when you thought morale could not go lower by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative
  17. Re:Freak out everyone for 6 months?! by CanHasDIY · · Score: 3, Interesting

    >the vast majority of employees whose jobs will be eliminated will be notified over the next six months.

    Really? With that one half of a sentence, you've just killed morale for 6+ months.

    You're looking at it all wrong, from an employee mentality.

    You need to look at it from a PHB mentality - telling people they *might* get fired in the next 6 months is incentive for them to work harder so that their job isn't the one that's cut (nevermind the fact that management decided who was to go a long, long time ago).

    --
    An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
  18. Re:And in totally unrelated news.... by gstoddart · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Wait a minute. Microsoft has the ability to innovate? Who knew!

    That's been true of most companies since the .com era.

    Long term thinking is out the window in favor of short term increases to the stock, which increases the net worth of the CEO and makes them darlings of Wall Street.

    That they might be actually harming the company long term is irrelevant.

    --
    Lost at C:>. Found at C.
  19. Re:Nokia sure has bad luck by jcdr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Very true. How the board was misinformed to the point of doing a such clear suicide is still part of the hidden story. Even more strange is the constant support the board give to the CEO even after all the alarms was turning full red. The "No plan B" concept was the biggest mistake ever from a board.

  20. Re:And in totally unrelated news.... by Aqualung812 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That means, for over 6 months, Microsoft employees won't know for sure whether they will be laid off or kept.

    Which means the most talented and valuable employees will find new jobs before there are layoffs, and Microsoft will end up keeping the ones that couldn't find a job elsewhere.

    How does this make Microsoft better?

    --
    Grammer Nazis - I mod you "troll" unless you actually add something on-topic. Yes, I know I have mispellings in my sig.
  21. Re:Translation: Slash 18K jobs, apply for 18K H-1B by Raseri · · Score: 3

    Present evidence to whom? There is no oversight of the H1-B program. What country are you from, if you don't mind my asking? (not being snarky, I'm genuinely curious)

    --
    Writhe your naked ass to the mindless groove.
  22. Re:And in totally unrelated news.... by GNious · · Score: 4, Informative

    In some (many?) countries, sizable lay-offs have to be announced well in advanced by law - they may just be trying to accommodate for this.

  23. Re:Translation: Slash 18K jobs, apply for 18K H-1B by Raseri · · Score: 4, Informative

    Sorry, but nobody checks any of that out, thus, there's nothing to stop any company from putting whatever they want on the form and then paying the employee much, much less. You didn't get fucked over because you're from the UK, congratulations. It's much easier to fuck over people, from third-world shitholes like India, who think $30k/yr is a lot of money.

    I hope you're enjoying your time in the colonies, anyway.

    --
    Writhe your naked ass to the mindless groove.
  24. Don't ask; I'm not telling ... by CaptainDork · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yeah, my company escorted me out the gate because I was a network jockey and they didn't want me to sabotage the system.

    Two days later they're calling me with, "How do we ...," and "What's the passwords for ...," and "Where are the ..."

    I offered to respond by email:

    "The Firm has made the decision to "right-size" its IT department to better align with strategies going forward. In support of that decision, I know the Firm has retained the very best-of-breed systems analysts and I think we should rely on those superior personnel to figure out what knowledge I departed with. I know you will agree that Firm policy prohibits sensitive communication with non-employees and it is with a spirit of cooperation that I decline to ever speak to any of you ever again."

    --
    It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    1. Re:Don't ask; I'm not telling ... by alexo · · Score: 4, Informative

      You should have offered to help.
      For $200/hour + expenses.

  25. Half of their employees to be fired. by pavon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Microsoft brought over 25,000 Nokia employees in the merger of which 12,500 are to be laid off in the next 6 months. Probably all that's left is the hardware engineers, with nearly all of software, marketing and management getting the boot.

  26. Re:Surprised? More to come by gaudior · · Score: 3, Informative

    Mergers & Acquisitions. It's a Wall Street Term of Art that describes the rape and murder of smaller companies by bigger ones.

  27. Re:BINGO in the first paragraph alone by timrod · · Score: 3, Informative

    I think in this case, it's to avoid lawsuits. "Buzzword Bingo" speeches are made specifically to be as vague and neutral as possible so that there's zero chance of a discrimination lawsuit from someone who gets laid off as a result of these job cuts. A friend of mine just recently showed me a good example of why executives do this. His company went through a round of layoffs, and his was one of the jobs that was cut. Rather than simply use CEO-speak and lay him off, they fired him in an attempt to dodge paying him unemployment benefits - they claimed he was sleeping on the job, but none of the statements the managers there gave to the unemployment office matched up. He brought this up in an appeal to the unemployment office, and they awarded him benefits because they saw through the company's BS.

    Outside of that, though? I think it's a Jungian thing. The CEOs think that successful CEOs speak in buzzwords all the time, so they form their own CEO persona and start acting like that because they want to be successful as well. What they probably don't realize is that the truly successful CEOs don't actually do that unless it's absolutely necessary and just assume they're doing the right thing by using buzzwords all the time. Whatever gets them promoted, I guess.

  28. Elon Musk at Nokia?... by MikeRT · · Score: 4, Informative

    You think Elon Musk went into Nokia with an understanding of what Nokia needed as a business? Or merely a view that whatever they were doing was wrong because it wasn't based on Microsoft stuff?

    Don't you mean Stephen Elop? If Elon Musk had taken over Nokia, chances are Nokia would have ended up owning Samsung not being acquired by Microsoft.

    1. Re:Elon Musk at Nokia?... by gstoddart · · Score: 3, Funny

      Don't you mean Stephen Elop?

      Apparently, yes ... I knew there was an "Elo" in there somewhere. :-P

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
  29. Citation Provided by Radtastic · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Most CEO's and Executive Level types are sociopaths.

    Perhaps not "Most CEO's", but the position tends to attract them: http://www.forbes.com/sites/ke...

    --
    You stereotypers are all the same...