Keurig 2.0 Genuine K-Cup Spoofing Vulnerability

An anonymous reader writes A security researcher has released a humorous vulnerability description for the Keurig 2.0 coffee maker, which includes DRM designed to only brew Keurig brand coffe pods (K-Cups): "Keurig 2.0 Coffee Maker contains a vulnerability in which the authenticity of coffee pods, known as K-Cups, uses weak verification methods, which are subject to a spoofing attack through re-use of a previously verified K-Cup." The vulnerability description even includes mitigating controls, such as keeping the Keurig in a locked cabinet when not in use. Also at Hackaday.

Comments

Someone has

[grahamsaa]

too much free time.

Re:Someone has

[TWX]

And here you are, posting on Slashdot...

Re:Someone has

[Z00L00K]

Considering the impact on the environment of pods that just ends up in the garbage there's now two reasons not to buy them.

OK, the coffee they make isn't bad, but what's wrong with an ordinary espresso machine?

Re:Someone has

[peragrin]

Waste.

Keurigs one selling point is that only coffee that is wanted gets made(baring people who toss it after it gets cold). I can't tell you the number of pots of coffee I made that I have thrown out. Probably around 30%. The k cups allow only coffee that is desired to be made at the cost of extra plastic waste. Bonus you can get increased variations of coffee. ao different people can get the different flavors they want including hot chocolates and teas for those who don't drink coffee.

You can't do that with just any coffee maker easily.

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Or someone likes to have fun.

Re:Someone has

[TWX]

The machines are designed to need less maintenance and to be mess-free when operating. If it's hooked to a water-line, put in the pod, put in the cup, push button, pick up filled cup, throw away pod.

Re:Someone has

[rogoshen1]

It really isn't that great of coffee. It's not bad, just a quick cup of mediocre coffee done quickly.

But the appeal has always been coffee in about 30 seconds, with only a button to push, and no cleanup.

Having both a keurig and a single serve espresso machine: in the mornings I'll go with the Keurig -- coffee's ready by the time i finish leashing up the dogs and getting ready to take them outside. If i want an actual cup of coffee to relax and enjoy though; the espresso machine wins 100% of the time.

Re:Someone has

[nitehawk214]

But I think it is the other waste factor that people are more concerned about, trash generated per cup of coffee.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

My wife went from making 4-8 cups of coffee a day to making the 1-2 she actually drank.

My cost is about 80% less buying these things (because she is not over making coffee). We empty them when done and toss them into the recycle bin. She also many times grinds her own (as she did before).

So I predict that the v3 of these things each cup will have a semi unique serial number . Then they scan that and if they see the same sn more than once or say in the past 30 cups made. Just enough to be a PITA. Which is all that is needed for effective DRM.

DRM does not stop determined people. It just needs to slow down the lazy.

Re:Someone has

[AthanasiusKircher]

Considering the impact on the environment of pods that just ends up in the garbage there's now two reasons not to buy them.

OK, the coffee they make isn't bad, but what's wrong with an ordinary espresso machine?

(1) A Keurig doesn't make espresso -- its pressure is nowhere high enough. (2) Cost: if you really want espresso worth making at home, you're going to pay a LOT more than it costs for a Keurig. (Well, in the short-term anyway; if you keep buying the K-cups, maybe not.)

Anyhow, I would never have bought one of these things myself, but I was given one by a family member something like 6 or 7 years ago. She had used it, but had some trouble with hard water clogging things up, and eventually she got Keurig to send a replacement. But they requested that she remove the insert that allowed you to actually use K-cups, rather than sending the whole thing back.

The flaw in that scheme was that Keurig makes a different sort of permanent plastic "cup" that could be refilled with coffee grounds, allowing you to brew whatever kind of coffee you wanted. But in order to use it -- guess what? -- you needed to remove the insert.

Anyhow, after they had already sent the replacement, it too malfunctioned briefly, and this family member tried cleaning the old one -- and now it worked! (But obviously they didn't have the "DRM" insert to actually use K-cups with it, so they could only brew with actual coffee grounds.) Later they got the new one working again, so now they just had a spare sitting around... which was given to me.

It still works, 7 years later. I've never bought a single proprietary K-cup or even any off-brand ones. I've only ever used it to brew whatever coffee I grind at home.

I would sometimes use it for a fast cup of coffee, but eventually I grew tired of the inferior flavor and went back to a french press.

Point is -- at least with older models, you could brew with your own coffee grounds if you removed the insert and bought the special reusable thing for the grounds (which maybe cost $10 -- an amount you'd save even after a couple boxes of K-cups).

In that case, the environmental impact is really quite minimal and probably better than some other traditional home-brewing methods, since you only heat up enough water for a single serving at a time, rather than people who tend to make a pot of coffee in their drip coffee pot and then never finish the pot or let it sit on the burner keeping warm for hours.

Re:Someone has

[gstoddart]

The k cups allow only coffee that is desired to be made at the cost of extra plastic waste

I would rather end up with liquid coffee and coffee grounds as waste products. The plastic and mylar? Not so much.

Bonus you can get increased variations of coffee

You know, they've had ground coffee in various flavors for literally decades, it's a solved problem. You can buy the bean whole or ground.

different people can get the different flavors they want including hot chocolates and teas for those who don't drink coffee.

You can't do that with just any coffee maker easily.

Maybe, maybe not ... but they've had this remarkable invention called a kettle for most of recorded human history.

Re:Someone has

[Immerman]

And the advantage over a "generic" coffee machine capable of brewing single cups is...?

I'm not a big coffee drinker, I had a roommate with an espresso machine for a while - brewed at most two cups at a time. After brewing you throw away the grounds, rinse the strays out of the "cup", and you're good to go again. Like a cast iron pan, it's only used when exposed to germ-killing heat so you don't even have to wash it unless except occasionally to prevent buildup of unpleasantly flavored residues. And it takes what, 2 seconds longer? You'll spend a lot more than that paying for those expensive little pre-packaged coffee scoops.

Re:Someone has

[Sowelu]

Trash generated in the household per cup of coffee, you mean. I wonder how much waste is produced by the whole supply chain of coffee beans -> your home? It's like that electric car thing where you still need to generate power somewhere, and if you're not using clean energy, you're just moving the location of the pollution.

Okay the cups are probably greater magnitude of waste but still, unused coffee does have a higher cost than just "pour it down the drain".

Re:Someone has

[MBGMorden]

As another person pointed out - a coffee filter and used up coffee grounds not that detrimental to the environment - there's a high level of biodegrability there.

Plastic cups? Not so much.

This also negates the fact that from a cost perspective, regular ground coffee (even better varieties) cost significantly less than K-cups. You may be financially ahead throwing out your extra.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Well given that we had an "article" on turning your monitor sideways it must be a very, very slow news day.

Re:Someone has

[kaiser423]

I don't even know what you're talking about here. Up until a year or so ago, none had DRM. And you don't need to remove anything to use your own coffee grounds. I have quite a few reusable K-cup sized filters that I've been utilizing to put my own grounds in forever without modifying the machine. I've never actually met anyone that didn't have at least one -- eventually if you drink coffee, you realize how much money you could save with one of those versus the K-cup.

I use the Keurig for when I have multiple people wanting something. I like my coffee incredibly strong, so most people don't drink my french press coffee. But with the K-cups, they can get coffee, tea, whatever without me having to expend any extra effort. Makes hosting people easier than reworking my fancy coffee setup for 12-18 cups of coffee.

Re:Someone has

[toonces33]

Well if you don't mind paying 50-100$/pound of coffee, I guess the Keurig thing works out for you. And I suppose if you only drank one cup per day, it might still work to your advantage.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

"(baring people who toss it after it gets cold)"

Well yes, usually when you're bare you're cold.

" I can't tell you the number of pots of coffee I made that I have thrown out. "

You'll have to change your habits when you live on Mars, eh?

Re:Someone has

[Bob the Super Hamste]

Coffee grounds aren't waste, find someone who gardens and give them to them. They make a wonderful soil amendment and if you have high pH soil it also help lower it some.

Re:Someone has

[grub]

We have refillable Keurig coffee cups and grind our own beans. Our own setup is virtually trash free other than the empty bags of beans.

Re:Someone has

[50000BTU_barbecue]

Here in Montreal some dude has a mushroom growing kit that grows on a bag filled with coffee grounds. They were the most intensely flavored mushrooms I ever tasted. I was like getting hit in the face by a boxing glove made of mushrooms.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

My own personal coffee hack has eliminated 100% of the would-be trash and environmental impact: I don't drink it. Feel free to bask in my holier-than-thou light.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

What? Impact on the "environment"? Just stuff them in the recycle bin.

We recycle everything that our center will take--little cups like the K-Cups, etc. We contact manufacturers if it isn't evident that a "thing" can be recycled.
All of this is very simple and easy to do. We have done this for years.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

"And you don't need to remove anything to use your own coffee grounds."

Wrong. There is no My K-Cup or derivative thereof that doesn't require you to remove the insert in the machine that has the needle in the bottom of it -- the one used to puncture the bottoms of the pre-made K-Cups.

Cheers.

Re:Someone has

[blue9steel]

So you're trading biodegradable coffee waste for persistent plastic waste that takes more net energy to produce, how is that a win?

Re:Someone has

[Hamsterdan]

Please share the info, I'm pretty sure other people here live in (or near) Montreal.

Re:Someone has

[ganjadude]

I was like getting hit in the face by a boxing glove made of mushrooms.

Sounds like they were some pretty good mushrooms. were you also at a pink floyd concert by chance?

Re:Someone has

[mrchaotica]

Too bad you can't easily use the coffee grounds when they're encased in dozens of stupid little plastic cups.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

>virtually trash free other than the empty bags of beans.
that's not virtual or trash free.

Re:Someone has

[Dr_Barnowl]

This is why I used a cafetiere for the longest time.

I made all the coffee I wanted to drink at once, and the only waste was the grounds (and yes, it seems I'm wasting them, thanks for the tips about using them as soil improvement, sibling poster.

Now I use an Aeropress.

It makes better coffee, at the cost of a small circle of filter paper as waste. The grounds are much easier to deal with because it compresses them into a puck. I may even start saving them for my herb garden....

Re:Someone has

[Zalbik]

Wrong. There is no My K-Cup or derivative thereof that doesn't require you to remove the insert in the machine that has the needle in the bottom of it -- the one used to puncture the bottoms of the pre-made K-Cups.

Wrong. I have these

I usually use these with my Keurig. Ocasionally I use standard K-Cups. No need to remove/reinsert the insert.

Re:Someone has

[Dr_Barnowl]

And for that convenience you sell your control over your coffee maker.

I mean, seriously. It's a hot water machine with DRM on it. If the bottled water guys get hold of this idea, they'll make a kettle that only boils when you put the cap from the bottle into a slot. See what a ludicrous idea that is?

I have an Aeropress. You put a paper filter, and coffee in it. When you're done, you're left with a puck of coffee grounds which you eject into your (compost) bin.

You then rinse it under the tap and enjoy your coffee. Maintenance done.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

your a fagget!

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Your spelling is atrocious, faggot.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

I was waving at you but I guess the dancing Nazi hammers had you pretty distracted, maaaaan.

Re:Someone has

[msauve]

"Keurigs one selling point is that only coffee that is wanted gets made"

My Breville Youbrew (I have no affiliation...) does that, too. The amount is variable from a small cup through a full pot. Strength is adjustable. No extra waste if you use the gold foil basket. Plus, it will grind fresh beans immediately before brewing. So, the only incremental costs are coffee beans, water and electricity.

And, if you just want hot water, or want to fill the basket with something other than ground beans from the hopper, you can do that, too.

All easily done by pushing a few buttons.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Having both a keurig and a single serve espresso machine

I see your problem right there, dude. You gotta upgrade that machine to one of those expresso machines. They're way faster.

Re:Someone has

[Jason Levine]

We have a Keurig (which we won... didn't buy it) and were concerned about waste. My wife bought a reusable K-cup and buys coffee in bulk. She scoops in the appropriate amount of coffee into the reusable K-cup, brews her cup of coffee, and then dumps the grinds/washes the reusable K-cup. Every so often, she runs the reusable K-cup in the dishwasher.

Of course, Keurig 2.0 would flag her reusable K-cup as a non-allowed K-cup and wouldn't let her brew coffee. This is a big reason why we won't be buying a Keurig 2.0.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Did you see "Keurig" in the title and think "Hey, I better let people know what my coffee regimen is".

FYI: This isn't a survey.

Re:Someone has

[Jason Levine]

Get a reusable K-cup. Then you can use whatever coffee you want and dump only the grinds (or put them into a garden). Of course, you can't do this with Keurig 2.0's DRM which is why we're sticking with our "1.0" model.

Re:Someone has

[gearloos]

You cut the lid off a kuerig official coffee and hot glue it to your reusable screen cup. Look for the one with the black dot on them that say Kuerig .. or just any kcup that brewed a cup in your 2.0. Works fine. Of course since this is DRM, I would never do such a thing, but I've "read" it works fine.

Re:Someone has

[rogoshen1]

Thanks for taking the time to clear that up ace.

Re:Someone has

[mrchaotica]

The issue is that I pretty much only drink coffee at the office, and there's no way I'd be able to convince all my coworkers to switch. (At home, all I own is a cheap french press that I barely use.)

Re:Someone has

[reboot246]

High pH would be very alkaline. I guess you meant low pH, because it's a common myth that coffee grounds are very acidic. They are pretty near to neutral and actually get more basic as they decompose.

I just measured the pH of some coffee grounds here in my kitchen. The results ---> 6.9

Keurig K-Cups are for people who don't know how to make coffee. Where did their coffee come from and how old is it? Is it a blend or single origin? What roast is it, or is it a blend of different roasts? What's the grind? What is the temperature of the water in the machine?

I roast green coffee beans, let them rest for a day, grind the beans just right for whatever method I'm going to use to make the coffee (drip, espresso, French press), and brew with good filtered water at the right temperature for just the right amount of time. Even $tarbuck$ can't come close.

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

My grandmother used coffee grounds for her roses. Luckily I remembered that when I got my house and they work great!

Re:Someone has

[Darinbob]

You CAN do this with other coffee makers! There are other coffee makers almost exactly like Keurig doing the same thing without DRM, there is even a standard for this so that you can buy your coffee pods from multiple vendors. They're paper pods not plastic. Some even allow using the pod or a small scoop instead, with the same machine. There is nothing whatsoever that Keurig does that another vendor does not also do.

The difference is that Keurig seems to be borrowing a business practice from HP, sell the machines cheap, sell the cartridges/pods with a big markup, and do whatever it takes to forbid the use of cartridges/pods from third parties.

The sad thing is that even with all the varieties of coffee makers that take pods and which take pods from third parties, superior to Keurig, if you hit any major department store you will only see Keurig being sold. That is the only reason it is popular.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Not sure if you know, but the original K-cups were not DRM encumbered.
Its the new 2.0 cups that have this protection built in.

Re:Someone has

[tlhIngan]

It's like that electric car thing where you still need to generate power somewhere, and if you're not using clean energy, you're just moving the location of the pollution.

However, overall efficiency is still higher for electric cars even after repeated transformations. An ICE is like a traditional incandescent lightbulb - it converts energy to heat primarily. Side effect is you get a tiny amount of useful energy emitted as well - either as motion or light. But most of the energy stored ends up dumped as heat.

And honestly, it's far easier to clean up a dirty power plant than it is to clean up a million tailpipes. It did take a long while for catalytic converters to basically be standard, and mostly because old cars without catalytic converters were scrapped. Whereas a power plant can be cleaned up in a few years and even modern coal power plants are far more efficient than an ICE.

Okay the cups are probably greater magnitude of waste but still, unused coffee does have a higher cost than just "pour it down the drain".

You can make smaller pots of coffee quite easily.

The real reason people like Keurig is because it's far more convenient - cup under spout, pod in top, hit two buttons (power and cup) and coffee in 30 seconds. Especially at inconvenient times of the day, say after waking up.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

They were selling these at my local coffee shop.
Its just a cardboard box, some spores, and coffee grounds.

These aren't the people who were doing it at my local shop, but it looks like they are local to me too.
Maybe there are many people doing these kits now.
mushroom kit group

Re:Someone has

[Darinbob]

Then don't waste either the plastic or the coffee. Just buy a machine other than Keurig that uses small single-serving scoops or which uses standard paper pods.

Re:Someone has

[CanadianMacFan]

I've got one of those too and they are very good. I got it specifically because it does the cup at a time. Their tea maker is amazing.

Re:Someone has

[MrNiceguy_KS]

Another Aeropress fan here! It's perfect for me since I'm the only one in the house that drinks coffee. I do have a standard drip machine for when we have guests and I need more than one cup at a time.

I discovered the wonders of Aeropress on a coffee-related Ask Slashdot a few years ago.

Re:Someone has

[Darinbob]

And there are other brands of espresso makers doing exactly the same thing, with more recyclable pods, without DRM, and which use a standardized pod used by many vendors. Those that don't explicitly use pods often have metal baskets that accept the pods. And other machines that are more normal coffee makers but which will still make single or double cup servings in a few minutes with easy clean up. Yes, some of those espresso makers that take pods are very expensive, but there are cheaper versions that are competitive with Keurig.

There are some machines that take either a scoop of fresh ground, or a Keurig cup, or a coffee pod, for $50. Why stick to Keurig then and be stuck with a single source DRM encumbered system? Keurig literally has no competitive advantage over the competition except for good marketing and exclusivity deals.

http://www.podmerchant.com/cof...
http://aerobie.com/Products/ae...

Re:Someone has

[Darinbob]

And other vendors can make you coffee from a pod in one or two minutes with little to no cleanup, but without the DRM.

Re:Someone has

[nblender]

wow. that looks cool.

I hadn't paid attention to consumer kitchen appliances but I bought a Breville Blender and I've been nothing but impressed with it... I didn't want to spend the dough on a vitamix or whatever those thigns are ...

I wish I could find a toaster oven that works as well as my Krups (which is itself kind of a piece of shit but works better than any other toaster oven I've ever owned).

ok, so I'm off topic.

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

So does the stove top expresso machine it makes one cup nous more on les. Bonus: no plastic wasted. When you get the hang of it...notre much longer to make.

Re:Someone has

[rogoshen1]

Have you heard of soda-stream before? :) They went even farther. You don't 'own' the bottle, you lease it. It uses a booby trapped connector that AFAIK will mechanically fail when attempting to refill a bottle with non-sanctioned compressors.

Re:Someone has

[Zontar The Mindless]

I use a French press, beans, and a grinder. Zero waste other than the grounds (and if I had a yard, I could compost them). The grinder's a hand-cranked model, so the only power used is to heat the water.

I've been making coffee this way for years, but never thought about the fact that it's also very conservative of resources until now.

And I despise the capsule-style makers on general principles; as for Keurig--if I won't accept DRM for my music and video, I sure am as fuck not going to accept it for my coffee.

Re:Someone has

[bobbied]

It's like that electric car thing where you still need to generate power somewhere, and if you're not using clean energy, you're just moving the location of the pollution.

However, overall efficiency is still higher for electric cars even after repeated transformations.

Totally off topic and likely wrong. Storing energy in a battery is wildly inefficient and when you couple the transmission and generation losses along the path from say Natural Gas -> Steam -> AC electricity -> DC Electricity -> battery -> motion there is a lot of energy lost. I'm not sure, but I'd not be surprised if you don't actually burn MORE Natural Gas going the EV route than a standard internal combustion engine would. All that transmission and conversion loss is going to really burn up a lot of energy, as will the losses of the battery which are a lot higher than you might think.

So the previous poster was right... EV's are NOT as clean as they appear to run, and don't get me started on the industrial waste they produce being made and scrapped.

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

There are reusable k cup like holders for scoops of geound coffee. No waste produced other than the grounds and left over coffee.

Re:Someone has

[jrumney]

Waste

Wait, you're seriously complaining about the possible waste of undrunk biodegradable coffee, and suggesting expensive disposible plastic pods as the solution?

Re:Someone has

[Gibgezr]

The poster you replied to specifically said "an ordinary espresso machine"; from your reply ("waste") I gather that you are unfamiliar with how a typical home espresso machine works. They typically make one (or some larger machines two) cups of espresso at a time, and they use steam forced through a reusable metal cup with tiny holes in it. There is no extra coffe to get cold, there is not even a filter to toss away: just take out the cup and tap it with the metal part of the handle that twists off when you release teh cup, and the grounds fall into the garbage/compost bucket (coffee grounds make great compost). The steam means that the cup is sanitized on every use, so you don't need to wash it more than once a month or so, and measuring a couple of spoons of fresh coffee into the cup is super easy and quick.

If you are afraid that a home espresso maker is not going to make a nice "regular" cup of coffee, you might be surprised to find that if you buy some nice coffee and try it out, it will likely make a much nicer cup of coffee than your k-cup machine; the beans are the most important thing about your coffee.

Re:Someone has

[cdh]

You can, however, replace it with a different one and refill it with $20 for 20 lb CO2. Cost about $100 to get the equipment, but pays for itself after one full CO2 container. Simple and passes the wife acceptance test.

Re:Someone has

[Noah Haders]

Your comments about efficiency losses for natural gas maybe true, but then you need to be be fair and consider all the energy that goes into extracting refining and distributing gasoline and diesel. Lotta shizz there.

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

The cups are not recyclable. They also contain coffee so your argument that brewing a traditional pot of coffee also produces waste is negated since both systems use coffee but only one leaves behind an un recyclable K Cup.

Re:Someone has

[Fjandr]

It wouldn't be if "virtual" and "trash free" were both meant to describe the setup independently of each other. Since "virtually" actually describes "trash free," the usage is correct. If you're going to be a pedant, at least be a correct pedant.

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Does it pass the dead Palestinian children test?

Re: Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

That's cute. If the plastic is unrecyclable you've just pushed the problem onto recyclers. You probably spoiled their batch.

While it's possible to recycle plastic back into usable fuel, or to make new items that pretty much never happens.

Recycled plastic is simply ground up and used as filler in more plastic items. A lot of which never get recycled.

Re:Someone has

[Bob the Super Hamste]

Yes high pH soil is alkaline but a lot of plants people grow in their garden like a lower pH slightly acidic soil. I unfortunately live in an area with high pH soil (about 9 naturally) as it use to be a riverbed for a tributary of Glacial River Warren. I know that coffee grounds don't do much for soil pH and if that was the only benefit you were seeking you would be better served by adding some elemental sulfur or a bunch of peat moss to acidify the soil. Than again most people don't care all that much about their soil in their gardens and just use copious amounts of fertilizers or just change the dirt out periodically instead of trying to improve the soil quality. I have been slowly transforming the dirt in my garden into basically a form of terra preta.

Re:Someone has

[Lotharus]

He said espresso machine, though. Espresso machines make single espresso shots at a time, not whole pots.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

My own personal coffee hack has eliminated 100% of the would-be trash and environmental impact: I don't drink it. Feel free to bask in my holier-than-thou light.

I don't drink coffee, either, but these single cup machines allow for other hot beverages (such as hot chocolate)

Re:Someone has

[cthulhu11]

No centralized food waste collection where you live? If you have a fireplace you use, dry them out and burn 'em. Failing that, I wonder if flushing them would be a net win.

Re:Someone has

[Zontar The Mindless]

Now that you mention it, all the household trash gets burnt for electricity here, so I guess even that part's really not all that wasteful.

Re:Someone has

[gzuckier]

And the fossil fuel needed to get that Juan Valdez and his damn donkey to the kitchen so he can give me the damn coffee beans.

Re:Someone has

[gzuckier]

I think if you compost the used Keurig cups and use the compost to grow coffee, when it fruits the coffee comes out prepackaged in K cups.

Re:Someone has

[Anonymous Coward]

Same thing I use to do... didn't make sense paying basically .50 per cup of coffee with real k-cups, the trash, the time wasted opening the k-cups to compost the grounds... just didn't make sense (not to mention the coffee couldn't really be sourced so if you're worried about deforestation and/or organic...).

But then I realized I was drinking weak coffee, so the poor old Keurig has turned into just a water heater for a french press lol

Holy Fuck!

[d33tah]

Holy fuck! These pirated K-Cups are going to hurt the whole industry!

Re:Holy Fuck!

[ThePhilips]

And the poor customers gets duped into buying a counterfeit pods without even realizing it!

That must be stopped!

Think of the customers!!

Re:Holy Fuck!

[slashmydots]

Not as much as the cost of those RFID tags or whatever they had to add to their cups. The expense was obviously passed directly onto the customer.
They spent money on RFID tags and charged the consumer more to ensure that the customer pays them more money by not buying off-brand stuff. Now that's how you show customer appreciation.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Githaron]

Apparently, they are using a propietary ink: http://www.consumeraffairs.com... rather than RFID.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[nitehawk214]

Obviously the solution is to put a tax on all normal coffee and send the money directly to Keurig.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[schlachter]

when the little needle in the Keurig device comes down and punctures the spoofed k-cup, it will surely execute an Java injection attack.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[CauseBy]

You nailed it. Let's take this argument to Congress and see if it is absurd enough to make them think.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[rsborg]

Holy fuck! These pirated K-Cups are going to hurt the whole industry!

As evil as imported prescription drugs. I feel for those poor customers who buy something that's claims to be a K-Cup when in reality they're getting scammed.

</snark>

In other news, cold brew coffee has removed any desire for me to brew my own. I only drink 1-2 cups a day, and since I've switched to cold-brew, my jittery feelings are all gone, and my productivity remains unimpaired (well, aside from /. ). At 8 cups per bottle, that's about $1/day, with no mess, 30s prep time to combine the milk, coffee and syrup, and no cleanup.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Matheus]

No. That will inspire them to create an amendment and make the Keurig Coffee Tax part of the Constitution.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Anonymous Coward]

Never do that. There is nothing so absurd that won't get serious consideration in Congress.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Anonymous Coward]

There was formed a Coffee Alliance to allow coffee customers to have a way to inform about the illegal purchasing of pirate coffee.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Jason Levine]

Just tell Congress that some terrorist might plan their attack using hacked K-cup coffee. If we prevent Keurig hacking, the terrorists will be too sleepy to plan anything. Before you know it, hacking your Keurig will result in the FBI kicking down your door.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Anonymous Coward]

Damn. Mod parent +1 billion.

For those that missed it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_copying_levy

Re:Holy Fuck!

[ChrisMaple]

Most pirates are male. From among the females, I'd certainly like to see those with K cups.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[mattack2]

Digital Mocha Counterfeiting Act?

Re:Holy Fuck!

[jrumney]

Now that the ink DRM on their cartridges is cracked, will we see the emergence of third party continuous coffee delivery systems?

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Anonymous Coward]

Nah. Keurig can just hire the Unabomber to say, "You'd have to be crazy to drink pirated Keurig coffee!"

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Anonymous Coward]

> Holy fuck! These pirated K-Cups are going to hurt the whole industry!

"Home brewing is killing coffee."

Re:Holy Fuck!

[davester666]

Yes. It will replace the existing first amendment.

Re:Holy Fuck!

[Anonymous Coward]

Meh, D-Cup spoofing didn't hurt industries. Might have even spawned whole new industries. ;)

Captcha: predate

Re:Holy Fuck!

[hAckz0r]

[...] to Congress and see if it [...]to make them think.

What? Make them think? Make Congress think? That's an Oxymoron, having both terms in the same sentence.

Besides they will never think, because if they did, then all that money paid to them to buy political/financial favors might be all for naught. The rich will never let that happen.

Keurig's only reason is profit.

[Anonymous Coward]

And they don't care if YOU the home user violate their profit, they care if somebody selling cups by the crate does it.

It's like a courtesy lock, it's only there to tell people you don't want them in, not to stop criminals.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[TWX]

I don't agree. Satellite pirates were prosecuted for private, in-home personal use only. Sony tried rootkits against end-users. Keurig is in the same market as HP's injket printer business is in- sell your the device fairly cheaply, but sell you the supplies for it at a high price. My guess is that if someone created a concise, easy-to-follow set of directions to make coffee without using new Keurig cups, they'd push to have those directions taken down, even if the document did nothing but explain how do to it without otherwise seeking any profit whatsoever.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[gizmo2199]

There's a YouTube video on how to circumvent the DRM.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[Anonymous Coward]

There is a nice youtube video showing how to do it already. I watched it this morning, it basically entails cutting the ID out of an existing validated coffee doohickey and taping it over the reader in the machine. Problem solved.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[Bob the Super Hamste]

That is the old razor and blades sales model perfected by King Gillette.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[Anonymous Coward]

At that point, you're basically talking the crate of cups there.

It's still not worth it for them to pursue you, the individual.

But they'll go after the bigger one.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[Anonymous Coward]

That is the old razor and blades sales model perfected by King Gillette.

Ironic that the article you linked to shows that it is falsely attributed to Gillette.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[jonwil]

The satellite TV situation is different since you are obtaining a service without paying for it.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[Bob the Super Hamste]

I mentioned that it was perfected by Gillette, not invented by.

Re:Keurig's only reason is profit.

[rdnetto]

The solution is the same as for the razor blade model - stick with products which accept generic consumables. e.g. coffee grinders that take beans, or double edged razors (all the blades have the same shape and are intercompatible). The difference in cost is usually about an order of magnitude. e.g. DE razor blades are ~30c each.

Dafuq?

[Anonymous Coward]

K-Cups? Is this like inkjet printers? Can these genuises work out how i can spoof my lexmark pro?

Re:Dafuq?

[TWX]

Yes, it is like the inkjet printers.

If you can make an inkjet use the Keurig modules for ink, we could save a ton of money...

Re:Dafuq?

[__aaclcg7560]

No need for a real cup of coffee if a printer can print a coffee-stained cup ring on the page.

Re:Dafuq?

[bobbied]

Yes, it is like the inkjet printers. If you can make an inkjet use the Keurig modules for ink, we could save a ton of money...

Wouldn't you need a 3D printer for that?

Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

I demand additional ineffective security procedures for my Nespresso machine. I'm completely ineffectively unprotected.

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

The usability of the Nespresso Club website seems like a very effective deterrent.

Re:Nesspresso!

[gstoddart]

I'm completely ineffectively unprotected.

Well, then might I suggest wearing a condom, a helmet, and elbow pads the next time you make coffee?

Me, I'll go with my open source espresso machine which lets me put any coffee of my choosing in, and produce any of several different cup sizes, depending on how long I keep the water flowing.

No vendor lock-in, FTW!!

Re:Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

Agreed. I just stock up when I visit San Francisco.

Re:Nesspresso!

[blue9steel]

Right, but is it RFC 2324 compliant?

Re:Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

That's just an RFC. You need a real international standard.. http://www.iso.org/iso/iso_cat...

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

Those open hardware coffee machines are total bullshit! What you neglected to tell everyone was that every time you changed coffee flavors, you have to recompile the kernel...of the bean!!

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

Given the fact that it is nearly impossible to find the capsules to make coffee, the machines are pretty damn secure. According to Nestle, even here in Seattle there are no stores that sell the capsules. The only place we found at work for the three machines we have is from a club that Nestle runs. We weren't accepted into the club so we can't buy from them. We scrapped the Nespresso machines since they're so "secure" that they do not allow you to make coffee.

Re:Nesspresso!

[greenwow]

Where can you buy them in SF? I live in Seattle, and from what I've seen and according to several other people I've talked to, no store in the Seattle area sells the capsules. The company I work for has an office in SF. We could get someone to ship the capsules to us. I liked the coffee the machine made. Too bad we've since had to put it away since it is impossible to find the capsules. I still have trouble believing Nestle's claim that they're having trouble finding people to distribute the capsules. The machines are a scam if they don't also sell the capsules.

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

Agreed. I just stock up when I visit San Francisco.

Where? I have the Nespresso Pixie, and after over a year of looking, I haven't found anywhere that sells the capsules. I think I've been to every coffee store in the Bay Area. I haven't found anywhere to buy them. I was rejected club membership since I can't read the serial number tag on my machine. Without the capsules, the machines are a pure rip-off. It is dishonest for Nestle to sell these machines without capsules being available.

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

Is the lack of availability of capsules a security feature? We have one at work, but we haven't found a single place to buy them from. We're literally across the street from a Seattle Coffee Gear location, and despite the fact that they sell the Nespresso machines, they can't find a capsule source.

Re:Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

>Where?

Here: https://www.google.com/maps/pl...

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

That's where I bought the machine from! They didn't admit beforehand that while the machines come with a few capsules (16 IIRC), it is very difficult to near impossible to find more capsules. Nestle is a company known for unethical behavior.

Re:Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

They sell the capsules downstairs. At least they have the past four times I've been there. It's been about 8 months since I was there last.
The website sucks, but it works for me.

>Nestle is a company known for unethical behavior.

Yes. If at the time I knew what an arse it would be, I'd have got a different brand.

Re:Nesspresso!

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

As an experiment, you should see if you can get started in San Francisco an outrage meme similar to Uber, but for unofficial K-cups.

"They aren't insured. What happens when one poisons someone? Ther's no guarantee. Any old person could make one in their home."

Same exact stuff the city council is so adamant about.

Re:Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

You can get them from Amazon, but they're just playing arbitrage. They charge more than the company web site, but the company web site is so bad, that if you can navigate it successfully, you can charge a premium for them on Amazon.

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sorry, but ISO stopped being a standards organization after microsoft bought it.

Re:Nesspresso!

[TechyImmigrant]

They are still the only way you get WTO export protection for your product. It sucks but it's how it works.

Re:Nesspresso!

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm having trouble with the double-negative. does that mean you are protected? or maybe just whoosh!?

Apparently it's very easy to get around

[Russ1642]

I know someone who keeps a genuine k-cup lid around and just sets it on top of the off-brand cup every time he uses his machine.

Re:Apparently it's very easy to get around

[Anonymous Coward]

So once again, the DRM is improving the customer experience, then?

Re:Apparently it's very easy to get around

[Anonymous Coward]

That's literally the exploit described in TFA

But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[pla]

Why in the hell would anybody buy a coffee maker that uses DRM to prevent using "non-genuine" coffee?

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[neilo_1701D]

Because K-Cups have a great range of coffee, and are available almost anywhere?

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

To get the Keurig Genuine Advantage, obviously.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

Laziness.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[brunes69]

You are confusing K-Cups with these K-Cup 2.0 pods. K-Cups are what have a great range and are available anywhere - because they have no DRM and all patents were worked around. K-Cup 2.0 pods have a very horrible range and limited distribution. I feel sorry for anyone suckered into buying one of these newer brewers.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[TWX]

Because the ability to make a single serving of exactly the coffee one wants and to then have someone else do the exact same thing for their particular tastes is worth something.

US Airways private lounges have these things. Friends of mine have one. Honestly, if there wasn't DRM, I'd be tempted to get one for work, so that I don't have to brew a lot of coffee when I only want one cup.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[grimmjeeper]

Because the ability to make a single serving of exactly the coffee one wants and to then have someone else do the exact same thing for their particular tastes is worth something.

US Airways private lounges have these things. Friends of mine have one. Honestly, if there wasn't DRM, I'd be tempted to get one for work, so that I don't have to brew a lot of coffee when I only want one cup.

There are many other brands of brewers that make single serving coffee and none of them force you to use any particular brand of cup.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[MMC Monster]

Probably the same reasons anyone would buy a coffee maker where home-brew coffee costs more than 25 cents a cup.

1 - Laziness
2 - Poor math skills
3 - Lack of impulse control

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

Great range of bad coffee perhaps. at best very mediocre. No K-Cup brewer is nearly hot enough or has the pressure to brew good coffee.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[harrkev]

My wife loves the convenience of instant coffee. I wanted to stick with a regular drip maker, but she did not like the mess involved in cleaning it up nor how long it took to make a pot. I don't like the expense and the waste of K-Cups, but the wife always wins in these sort of disagreements.

I must admit that the new Keurig makers are nicer than the old ones as they seem to have changed the pumping mechanism. That was always a weak spot with the old ones, especially if you had non-optimal water. Well water could kill an old K-cup machine in just a hundred cups or so.

We moved so no more well water, but I hope that this maker lasts a lot longer. We were also bitten by the DRM. We have some old "genuine K-Cup" pods laying around without the new ink, and they don't work -- at least until I get the time to dig up a very sharp craft knife to do the plastic surgery.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Creepy]

That doesn't equate to great tasting coffees, though they are better than most (if not all) of the canned stuff.

And I'm far less of a snob with coffee than with beer - I will actually drink Keurig or canned coffee but I need to add cream. For black I prefer beans roasted 5 days or less before use and burr ground, with grind type as per the style of coffee (Turkish, espresso, french press, drip). Yes, home roasted. Unlike beer, home roasting has saved me a fortune after the initial expense, too ($~130 for 20# bags and $300 for the roaster offset the cost of buying beans at $14-18 a pop in 2 years).

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[jellomizer]

Nobody wants DRM. The companies impose it on us to prevent unauthorized use.

I think for a coffee maker. The fact that they are trying to say which coffee you can and can't use is really stupid. Unless they show that ripoff k-cups somehow harm the system.

I know with Solid Ink Printers. You really need to use the branded ink. The cheap third party stuff has a slightly differing heating and cooling rate. Where over time they gum up the internals and you have a printer with solid ink stalagmites and stalactites on the inside.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[gstoddart]

There are many other brands of brewers that make single serving coffee and none of them force you to use any particular brand of cup.

So, on the off beat chance you don't know this ...

Most of those single serving cups are, in fact, the k-cup form factor. The patents for those expired several years ago, and everybody could make compatible stuff. Because, really, it's a little plastic tub with coffee in it and it isn't rocket science. You can buy them anywhere, and find lots of makers which support them.

Now ... this is the new hotness. The K-cup 2.0, with DRM.

So, all of those brands of brewers and cups you could buy? You still can. Nothing about those has changed. Your older Keurig machine? Nothing has changed with that either.

But, if you end up buying a newer Keurig machine ... suddenly you get DRM, specifically because it's the razor blade business model, and Keurig has decided you must buy from them.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[sconeu]

Unless they show that ripoff k-cups somehow harm the system.

So what if it harms the f***ing system? I BOUGHT it. It's MINE. If I want to harm the system, that's my choice.

This is a "Fords will only use Ford Brand gas" thing. I wonder if they can be sued under Magnusson-Moss?

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[allquixotic]

I have the Vue system. This is apparently an ugly redheaded stepchild (like Windows ME, or Windows XP x64 Edition) that came between the "original" Keurig, and Keurig "2.0". It lacks any form of DRM, and there are $10 plastic adapters on eBay that allow you to brew any original K-Cup pack using the Vue. I tried it and it works fine.

The features of the machine are much better than the original Keurig: larger water tank, touchscreen with customizable temperature and water amount, it heats up and brews faster, doesn't make a horrible noise when brewing, and it accepts both K-Cup Vue and original K-Cup packs. Oh, and it has a water filter in the water tank (you still have to replace it of course), so I don't have to wait for water to trickle out of my fridge's filtered water dispenser to fill up the Vue: I just fill up a glass or pitcher from the kitchen sink, unfiltered, and dump it in the Vue's water tank. The filter takes care of the rest.

Sometimes the red-headed stepchild is the sweet spot. Like how Windows 2000 was a suitable substitute for Windows XP for many years for folks who didn't like the whole Internet-based Windows Product Activation. Obtain a single valid Win2K license and you could technically activate an infinite number of systems.

Will be hanging on to my Vue for a long time...

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

Your post title

But does it report artificially low ink levels?

Made me think of an interesting law my state passed during the 2003 session, codified at N.C.G.S. 75-36, because of the amount of insane abuse by printer manufacturers:

Any provision in any agreement or contract that prohibits the reusing, remanufacturing, or refilling of a toner or inkjet cartridge is void and unenforceable as a matter of public policy. Nothing in this section shall prevent any maintenance contract that warrants the performance of equipment under the contract from requiring the use of new or specified toner or inkjet cartridges in the equipment under contract.

Here is an old Slashdot article covering it.

Of course regardless of state laws I totally expect, if they haven't already, printer companies and perhaps companies like Keurig to incorporate software into their products and use the DMCA's anti-reverse-engineering and anti-circumvention provisions to combat the rights of end users to dictate what they can and cannot do with physical devices they own.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[mythosaz]

Convenience =/= Laziness

And the value of my time and comfort has nothing to do with "poor math skills."

They're incredibly convenient devices for people who, on a whim, want a cup of coffee, cappuccino, tea, coco, cider or coco, or who, after a dinner party, would like to offer that wide variety of coffee/tea choices to their guests. This is all doubly true for people who like drinking coffee only sparingly, or only like making sure they can offer coffee to their guests.

The same reason that I can't hire someone to brew me fresh coffee for $0.25 on a whim is why I'm not interested in brewing 4 different pots of hot beverages after dinner when I can just throw a $0.62 full retail K-cup (delivered by Amazon) into the machine, with little to no prep or cleanup required.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

I contacted Keurig about there V2.0 DRM K-Cups. I was in the market for a new coffee maker and thought theirs was a great idea until I read about the DRM. They courteously told me "to get stuffed" and acted like the argument against DRM was quackery. I refused to buy a Keurig machine and they lost a sale and the sale of their DRM-ed K-Cups.

I purchased a $10 Proctor Silex at the grocery store instead and switched to Starbuck's Via (powered/instant with micro-ground coffee) and am happy. The $10 coffee maker also makes hot water for instant oatmeal, Ramon noodles and lots of 'just add hot water" food stuffs.

Keurig lost a $120 sale and a continuous sale of K-Cups because they choose to screw me and the rest of the consumers. They lost out with me.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm far less of a snob with coffee [...] I need to add cream

Obviously.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[rsborg]

Because the ability to make a single serving of exactly the coffee one wants and to then have someone else do the exact same thing for their particular tastes is worth something.

US Airways private lounges have these things. Friends of mine have one. Honestly, if there wasn't DRM, I'd be tempted to get one for work, so that I don't have to brew a lot of coffee when I only want one cup.

Go cold brew - the coffee lasts weeks in the fridge, and doesn't cause me to get jittery nearly as much. Lastly, I don't have to cold-brew myself - it's easily available in large quantities at a store (TJs) so, like UHT milk, I can buy weeks of supply at a time and even buy online.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[squiggleslash]

Yeah, that's as bad as my Keurig toaster. I found out it was a problem when they stopped selling the individual bread cartridges.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[leonardluen]

from your description it sounds like Keurig has always been DRM'd. their previous form was the patent, but since that expired they had to go with an electronic form.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Firethorn]

Because, really, it's a little plastic tub with coffee in it and it isn't rocket science.

I'd argue that a 'k-cup' would be hard to patent due to having an obvious nature. The trick would be that the machine is patented, which is why 'everybody' could make k-cup compatible tubs, but not the machines. Well, a google search shows those patents have likely expired as well, I'm seeing lots of compatible machines.

Really, you'd just have to change the machine enough to avoid Keurig's patents. How? Depends on how the patents were written.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[squiggleslash]

Razor-blade model? You think those $100+ coffeemakers Keurig sells cost even $25 to make?

It's just greed. Really. Honestly.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[amicusNYCL]

So before Keurig came along, coffee was limited to only a handful of flavors and was difficult to find? And Keurig solved this problem, but no other coffee maker has, so the best solution is to buy a consumer-screwing machine?

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Dr_Barnowl]

Yeah, the only thing that got me off Win2k was DRM.

The games I wanted to play had DRM that the crypto API in Win2k didn't support.

"Upgraded" to Vista. Was I ever bitten.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[cnaumann]

Have you complained to Keurig directly about the "genuine K-Cups" that will not function and asked for replacements? The only way to prevent this sort of crap is to raise a stink about it. Also consider returning the coffee maker and gving it a negative review on Amazon. Seriously, why are you putting up with this quietly?

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

You sound bitter, just like my coffee. Let's hang out!

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[AmiMoJo]

There needs to be a warning on the box of devices that come with anti-consumer DRM installed. Like the warnings on boxes of cigarettes. Something unmissable. It's only fair to make sure consumers aware of what they are buying and that it is unlikely to work properly.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[harrkev]

Simple. It is called a "wife." The "wife" program is not just an entertainment application, but rather an OS upgrade that limits what I can do. ;-)

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Jeremi]

Why in the hell would anybody buy a coffee maker that uses DRM to prevent using "non-genuine" coffee?

When polled on this question, the number one response from consumers was: "What is DRM?"

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Jeremi]

But, if you end up buying a newer Keurig machine ... suddenly you get DRM, specifically because it's the razor blade business model, and Keurig has decided you must buy from them.

If there's any justice in the world, Keurig will be getting a lot of post-Christmas returns this year, when people realize that the coffee machine they just upgraded to is incompatible with most of the coffee they wanted to make.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[dloyer]

Why in the hell would anybody buy a coffee maker that uses DRM to prevent using "non-genuine" coffee?

Same reason people buy printers that uses DRM to prevent using "non-genuine" ink.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Dogtanian]

Keurig lost a $120 sale and a continuous sale of K-Cups because they choose to screw me and the rest of the consumers. They lost out with me.

I'm pretty sure companies don't care about a single lost sale, and even a low number of lost sales to geeks caused by DRM et al (if they're aware of it) will be considered a minor tradeoff against the monetary benefit of being able to lock in and (profitably) screw over the large number of people who *will* still be buying it anyway.

(This is the same situation as with the PSP et al being locked down and a couple of geeks saying "you lost a sale". Big deal, they lost a sale to people who probably weren't going to buy lots of games (where they make the most profit) and retained the ability to milk the remaining 99.5% of people who were still going to buy it for lots more money).

The best way to hit them where it hurts is to spread the word about how lousy and hostile to the user Keurig's machines are, preferably in terms that the ordinary user will understand (i.e. you *can't* use generic pods, you *will* have to pay more because Keurig want your money, and if you can't get the official Keurig ones, tough).

Ultimately, giving them an abstract lecture about DRM will probably turn them off, explaining *why* this particular example of DRM is lousy for them is a preferential backdoor in propaganda terms. (Though I wouldn't shove the term DRM down their throats).

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[grimmjeeper]

I was not aware of the patents. Thank you for bringing that to my attention.

I bet all of the other single serve machines that use the old design will continue to be sold and Keurig's attempt to "control" the single serve market will fail miserably. I think my analogy to the PS/2 (scroll down to find it) just makes that much more sense now.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Darinbob]

http://www.podmerchant.com/

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Darinbob]

Your argument would make sense if Keurig was the only machine or the best machine that did this. But it's not.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[bobbied]

So before Keurig came along, coffee was limited to only a handful of flavors and was difficult to find? And Keurig solved this problem, but no other coffee maker has, so the best solution is to buy a consumer-screwing machine?

No, a simple hot pot and a French press is all you need for great brewed coffee, well that and some beans a grinder and water...

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[bobbied]

Happens all the time... Because they lost the legal protection of a patent, they had to resort to something else to keep the money flowing in. Too bad it won't work long term. I'd be shorting the holder of the Keurig trademark, if I had any money.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why in the hell would anybody buy a coffee maker that uses DRM to prevent using "non-genuine" coffee?

When polled on this question, the number one response from consumers was: "What is DRM?"

Damn Runtime Management...

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

You're right! Where's RMS to weigh in on this?

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[mattack2]

I just use the coffee maker at work (they used to be Starbucks branded, but aren't anymore) that just spit out a cup of coffee.. (They use a bunch of filter that spews out underneath into the garbage..)

This 'pod' idea would be cool to me, if it weren't making a zillion little plastic tubs that are AFAIK unrecyclable. (Just because it has a plastic type logo on it means it can/will actually be recycled.) That is, if they used something like paper, or even something that would dissolve, that would be really cool.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[unity]

The san Francisco bay coffee company makes keurig compatible coffee pods that are 97% bio-degradable. http://www.sanfranciscobaycoff... I like their "fog chaser" version. they tend to be less expensive than other brands at my local store as well.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

Nobody wants DRM. The companies impose it on us to prevent unauthorized use.

I don't _want_ it, but I accept it in some cases, if it makes some more people buy the product. Then the company can make more money, even if they make less profit per individual sale. (i.e. it's sort of like economies of scale -- and yes I understand supply and demand)

In this specific case, I think it's really lame, but as others have stated, apparently the main pod concept is out of patent, so rightfully other companies are making coffee makers with the old style pods.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

I feel bad for anyone that bought ANY of these brewers. Coffee coming out of these things is the worst coffee I have ever had.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[kheldan]

Because we're living in a day and age where people are getting lazier, dumber, and less skilled. They apparently can't be bothered to learn to brew a goddamn cup of coffee themselves, or use a drip coffemaker, or any other coffeemaker for that matter, they have to have it NOW! and it has to be so simple that a 2 year old could do it without screwing it up. Furthermore it's one of the single most wasteful and expensive ways to make coffee I've ever seen, what with all these 'single use' containers that in 10 seconds flat become more plastic waste that I'm not even sure can be recycled easily (metal foil glued to it, plus the coffee waste and whatever filter it uses). I lose respect for anyone who actually buys something like this.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[kuzb]

The world is full of clueless idiots who buy garbage like this thinking they are joining the new age or something.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

consumer-screwing machine?

Count me in! And one for the wife!

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[gzuckier]

Keurigs used to be popular in waiting rooms of various consumer enterprises around here, but I've noticed they're being retired in favor of the good old coffeepot half full with several hours old sludge. I'm assuming $$ is the reason.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[gzuckier]

Somebody mod this up please.

Re:But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Hognoxious]

I think for a coffee maker.

You write like a teapot.

anyone who drinks that stuff

[surd1618]

deserves to be DRM'd (now a verb!).

Re:anyone who drinks that stuff

[Anonymous Coward]

The best coffee is ground fresh from bean !
Any coffee ground more than a few days old is ready to be discarded because it's lost flavor.
The only way a Keurig coffee maker could be of any value is to fill one of those empty cups with fresh ground.
With ver 2.0 they screwed that up.
They want people to purchase only their old ready for the trash ground coffee packed in DRM protected pods.
Last week I was about to purchase the new Keurig but when I discovered the stupid DRM thing, I purchased a different brand.
The non Keurig machine is making great coffee !
Way to go Keurig.. your dumb DRM idea has lost a customer forever !

DCMA lawyers standing by

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh, you thought this was a joke? Lawyers laugh last.

Re:DCMA lawyers standing by

[Overzeetop]

Lawyers don't laugh - it throws them off their count while going through their piles of money.

TROOLKORE

[Anonymous Coward]

Do an(d doing what all parties it's election to the inventing excuses Gave the BSD at my freelance alike [to reap Is ingesting Creek, abysmal

K-Cups?

[Anonymous Coward]

I can only imagine how expensive that must be. The last pair of double-D's set me back a fortune before it was all said and done. Although, they were nice.

Re:K-Cups?

[Anonymous Coward]

Dude... Sorry to hear you didn't get the DRM in place in advance on those double D's. Next time use the prenup...

rm -Rf /home/kitchen/keurig

[johnholstein]

rm -Rf /home/kitchen/keurig I fixed my Keurig problem. I now have $25 standard coffee pot in the kitchen.

Trying to control a market they no longer own...

[grimmjeeper]

This smacks of IBM and the PS/2. Long after they lost control of the market they created, they attempted to force their own propeitary expansion bus and other architecture on everyone. The end result is that the market took from them the few bits they liked and shoved them aside like yesterday's trash.

With so many alternatives out there, why on earth would anyone buy this idiotic machine that attempts to force you to use their cups yet fails miserably at doing do?

Good!

[eepok]

Keurig coffee, with all their DRM, just adds to our waste-plastic problem and costs about twice as much as coffee you grind at home. (http://goo.gl/NiVJ8D)

Get yourself a stainless steel cup, throw some coffee in there, and use the pilfered K-Cup tag to make it all work together.

Welcome to the...

[Sir_Eptishous]

Internet of Things.

Where all manner of previously easy to use appliances and household goods come with phone-home DRM for "added value".

Re:Welcome to the...

[Anonymous Coward]

To be fair, the K2.0 isn't attached to the internet...

Re:Welcome to the...

[phantomfive]

That's the most depressing thing I've read all day.

Re:Welcome to the...

[Anonymous Coward]

...yet

Single most useful Slashdot article ever

[halivar]

I now forgive you in perpetuity for Bennett Haselton and Dicevertisements...

...until Keurig breaks my coffee again.

But does it report artificially low ink levels?

[Anonymous Coward]

Mostly from ignorance (It' not like the box will have "Uses electric verification to reject physically compatible coffees!" on the box in big friendly letters), but partly from being trained to expect physical incompatibility with products that use a "machine and consumable cartridges business model" like this (razors and blades, printers and ink, etc.)

So if they try a coffee and it doesn't work they assume it's a physical incompatibility and resume buying the branded ones that they know will work.

Keurig, meet IBM

[MobyDisk]

Sounds like the HP and IBM law suits over printer cartridge lock-in.

This is *exactly* the kind of thing that the DMCA was made to prevent! Tape is a circumvention device and should be banned! (Since there was recently an article here about how the DMCA is being abused, so I'm itching for them to issue a DMCA takedown against this article so I can add it to the list of reasons to repeal the DMCA).

Re:Keurig, meet IBM

[Anonymous Coward]

wasn't lexmark one of the more evil ones?

Re:Keurig, meet IBM

[Anonymous Coward]

The DMCA is irrelevant here. No copyright protection measure is being circumvented.

Re:Keurig, meet IBM

[Anonymous Coward]

Lexmark tried using the DMCA to keep people from reverse engineering the DRM on it's printer cartridges.

Workaround

[Ol Olsoc]

Easy to follow steps:

1. Go to your favorite sore that carries coffee makers

2. Purchase a drip, french press or percolator, or whatever type I missed as per your wishes.

3. Buy some coffee at the same store. This may come as a shock to many people, but there is a large variety of typs of coffees out there. Different grinds, or grind your own - it is amazing I tell you, must be something new. Keurig is not the only company out there. I'm partial to a brand roasted in Philly, that I purchase from of all places, a diner in Rio Grande, New Jersey. But I digress.

Brew your own fucking coffee the way we used to do it when men were men, and the sheep knew to be respectful. Enjoy it on the patio, yelling at kids to get off the lawn.

Re:Workaround

[Sneftel]

The "way we used to do it when men were men" was to roast one serving worth of beans in a skillet, grind them with a mortar and pestle, steep the grounds in water, and then strain the coffee through muslin or cheesecloth. Also you have to heat the water over a wood-burning stove. Anything less means I get to look down on you.

Re:Workaround

[drinkypoo]

and then strain the coffee through muslin or cheesecloth

If you don't use a sock, it should be because you don't own socks, and you had to use your hanky. Because if you don't own socks, you probably don't own underwear, either

Re:Workaround

[Ol Olsoc]

The "way we used to do it when men were men" was to roast one serving worth of beans in a skillet, grind them with a mortar and pestle, steep the grounds in water, and then strain the coffee through muslin or cheesecloth. Also you have to heat the water over a wood-burning stove. Anything less means I get to look down on you.

You know, the hipster in me thinks that sounds like pretty good coffee.

Re:Workaround

[Anonymous Coward]

You have a stove? And you call yourself a man?

The proper way to do it is to grow your own coffee - or trade it with a neighboor for goods (no cash) - roast it in a skillet, grind it with mortar and pestle, steep the grounds in water, and then strain the coffee through muslin or cheesecloth. Also, the water must be heated on a campfire.

Ah, the good old days.

This could lead to death

[davidwr]

A malicious attacker could substitute toxic fake coffee or hot chocolate for the real thing.

A malicious attacker could also substitute a coffee or hot chocolate that is tainted with a chemical that creates slight etchings in the surface of the coffee cup or other cup used to hold the end product. For certain types of cups, the result will be a cup that will be more likely to harbor bacterial growth than one with a smooth surface. Assuming a successful attack, the risk of illness or fatality is low for a healthy adult but it might be significant for a person with a suppressed or compromised immune system.

Recommended mitigation:
Keep people who want to kill you away from your coffee maker.

Re:This could lead to death

[Anonymous Coward]

This could lead to a malicious third party vendor supplying K-cups with improved quality and taste over the genuine brand.

Re:This could lead to death

[Jason Levine]

Even worse, they might brew the coffee with (*gasp*) Dihydrogren Monoxide!!!

Re:This could lead to death

[Anonymous Coward]

Or decaf!!! (implying there's a difference between water and decaf...)

Re:This could lead to death

[gzuckier]

Coming soon; Keurig 3.0, which will use only Keurig brand water, to ensure the safety and satisfaction of the consumer.

These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Ol Olsoc]

Ever have a group of people over who would like some coffee? So now instead of starting a pot, then going back when it's finished, and pouring it for people, if you need ten cups of coffee, you gotta do it ten times over.

How

Fucking

Handy.

And so cool that the last people get their cup long after the first are done, or more likely if the guests have manners, the first will wait ahile their coffee gets cold.

In a world where people become lazier ever day, it's hard to imagine how such a waste of time would ever catch on.

Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't realize Keurig users don't have any friends. Carry on.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

I have a Keurig for myself and a regular coffee pot (they're not that expensive) for when people come over.

It's not a hard problem to solve.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[ArcadeMan]

If you have so many friends over, You're doing it wrong.

The obvious solution is to have as many Keurig coffee makers as you have visitors.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

What kind of machine makes enough coffee for ten from a single pot? A restaurant-style dual jug machine? A giant samovar?

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

I realize you are being a bit sarcastic, however I have found the single cup brewers quite convenient. We brew at most 2 cups on a typical morning. 3 or 4 when the in-laws are in town, and sometimes one of our guests would prefer tea, or decaf, or a particular flavor. The Keurig is quite versatile. We do still keep the 45 cup percolator for parties, but rarely brew more than 15 cups when we do bring it out, and even then end up throwing a good bit of that away. So I say buy what works best for you. The DRM on the 2.0 model does suck. I don't plan to upgrade to any coffee maker that uses it.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Agent0013]

I'm not a Keurig fan by any stretch. I use a french press at home. But you seem to lack any sort of creative imagination. Here's the alternate story.

Ever have a group of people over who would like some coffee? Sow now instead of each person getting to brew the coffee variety of flavor or decaf level that they would like in an individual cup, you have to brew many full or partial full pots of coffee so people can be happy. Or you just say screw you to your guests and make them drink the fully caffeinated super dark roast because that is what you like, and they can just suck it!

Basically, the group of people is when the Keurig is most handy. Each person can have their own flavor. And when you want a second cup you don't have to worry about the pot being cold or stale. It is a new brew right in your cup.

My in-laws have one and we use it when visiting. The second place I have found it to be handy is my new place of work. Nothing is supplied but the brewer. Rather than have a coffee fund or something each person just gets their own pods and cream or sugar as they desire. Works pretty well for ease of managing.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

Or you have a fucking Mr. Coffee for when you have guests over, and a K-Cup doohickey for your morning coffee on the way out the door so you don't have to fuck around with brewing and cleaning up after a whole pot of coffee.

Maybe you should be a little less judgmental, you shitbag.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Jason Levine]

Would that be a Beowulf Keurig Cluster?

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

now instead of each person getting to brew the coffee variety of flavor or decaf level that they would like in an individual cup, you have to brew many full or partial full pots of coffee so people can be happy. Or you just say screw you to your guests and make them drink the fully caffeinated super dark roast because that is what you like, and they can just suck it!

That's exactly right, but not a problem. When your host offers you a beverage, you either accept or decline with thanks. People who complain about free gifts aren't invited back.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Ol Olsoc]

What kind of machine makes enough coffee for ten from a single pot? A restaurant-style dual jug machine? A giant samovar?

I have a Gevalia maker that makes 12 cups at a time, It's a 30 second job to recharge it for a second 12. The ones I have at camp will do 12 also, I forget the make though.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Ol Olsoc]

Or you just say screw you to your guests and make them drink the fully caffeinated super dark roast because that is what you like, and they can just suck it!

Wow. The way that I was taught manners was that I would happily accept or decline whatever the gracious host provided, trusting to their wisdom, with the only coffee decision beting between caffienated or decaffienated.

Then again, you might be entertaining self-orbiting, mannerless visigoths. It's a pity that you are forced to provide what they demand. I've discovered new and ecting tastes upon others offerings.

Basically, the group of people is when the Keurig is most handy. Each person can have their own flavor.

And if you have some of the flavors, but not the one that they must have? The problem with your analysis is that I've had experience with this sort of thing. The hostess who was a necessary part of the post-meeting social time ended up spending 20 minutes or more away from the meeting, while making everyone's coffee. And the first people had their coffe finished by the time the last people got theirs. Most of us ended up getting sodas in subsequent meetings because you grabbed one, thrw in some ice and you could mingle, without someone wishing they had your coffee, or waiting for it.

And when you want a second cup you don't have to worry about the pot being cold or stale. It is a new brew right in your cup.

Another 20 minutes away from the group. Either we're arguing against over each other, or I haven't made myself clear. This is not a coffee tasting contest, where the goal is to have a cup of coffee made exactly as you must have it, it is a group of people discussing matters, mingling and being sociable. Having experienced one of these devices before, it was just not convenient, and most people stopped drinking coffee. THe coffee itself was pretty decent, but you can have the best of both worlds by brewing a pot or two of decent coffee, and just takes a few seconds to fill and get back to people.

The second place I have found it to be handy is my new place of work. Nothing is supplied but the brewer. Rather than have a coffee fund or something each person just gets their own pods and cream or sugar as they desire. Works pretty well for ease of managing.

That's not too bad a use of the machines. I do suspect after a few years, the novelty will wear off.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, Olsoc, the world has changed since 1942. Manners aren't what they used to be. I mean, back then, if your old lady didn't bring that coffee out to you at precisely 132deg, you could smack the fuck out of her! You also didn't have to drink from the same pot as those dirty niggers. They had a separate machine. Those were much better days indeed. I'm going to agree with you and say Bring Back Proper Manners...or ELSE!

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[Anonymous Coward]

Hmh? Any ordinary coffee machine? At least around where I live.

Re:These stupid ass one shot coffee makers

[gzuckier]

And to think I was impressed when our IT guy hooked the shredder up to the Ethernet during the up swing of his manic-depressive cycle.

Security or identification?

[jklovanc]

The 2.0 can brew a cup or carafe of coffee depending on the pack inserted. They are just using rfid to differentiate. If they can not differentiate they don't brew.

Re:Security or identification?

[Sneftel]

I seriously doubt they're putting a 10-cent-or-more RFID chip in each cup. Particularly given that they're apparently also using a CCD to read the label.

Re:Security or identification?

[jklovanc]

RFID or bar code the same thing applies.

Re:Security or identification?

[Dr_Barnowl]

It's IR-reflecting ink. There's no identification. They are just being assholes.

Re:Security or identification?

[jklovanc]

According to this article;

The anti-counterfeiting system doubles as a way to distinguish between carafe-size pods and regular ones. If the sensor detects the green dot that marks carafe cups, it brews a large pot. If it detects the ring of black symbols on the standard pod, it brews a smaller cup. If it doesn’t detect a Keurig-approved marking at all, it tells you "oops!"

And that's why you should stick with open source.

[ericbrow]

In all seriousness, research the cost differences between traditional coffee makers and coffee vs the Keurig.

Let's counter-balance that free Keurig ad a little

[ArcadeMan]

Tassimo
Nespresso

It's a Java vunerability

[schlachter]

in the Java run time environment

Re:It's a Java vunerability

[Applehu Akbar]

This could cause Arabica beans to be made available on office coffee servers throughout the enterprise!

Re:It's a Java vunerability

[epyT-R]

grind wide open!

Re:It's a Java vunerability

[Fjandr]

They could let those Ay-rab beans in? We need comprehensive K-cup reform or the terrorist coffee farmers will win!

Way to be a month behind the curve /.

[gelfling]

Really just awesome. Hey can someone down mod me to negative bazillion?

When is M$ going to release a patch for this?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's horrifying, M$ should do something quick.

off topic

[frovingslosh]

Please keep the discussion to coffee. I'm straight, as is most of the population, and I don't want to know what you do when you go to San Francisco

Re:off topic

[TechyImmigrant]

I go here: http://www.dwell.com/post/arti...

What happens inside, I'm not allowed to say.

1000 Years Jail Time or Aaron Swartz Yourself

[Tokolosh]

For infringing DMCA, wire fraud, computer fraud and abuse, circumvention and dissemination of DRM, racketeering, leading to losses of [pinkie] One Billion Dollars [/pinkie] to Keurig.

Stand by for completely over-the-top reaction from the Establishment.

WRONG

[Anonymous Coward]

We use something like these which are dirt cheap at just about any drug store:

http://topicspill.com/2013/01/03/official-cafe-cup-website-reusable-coffee-cup-you-can-fill-with-your-own-coffee/

We use K cups because we're lazy, but if we're go tot he trouble the refillable cup above drops in just like the real deal. It sounds like 2.0 (without the hack in TFA) would end that.

A more elegant hack

[Anonymous Coward]

The way demonstrated in the video is a pretty ugly way to fix the problem, you have to constantly put your fake lid on top of the cup you make. Towards the back left side of the piece that lowers down there's some kind of small optical sensor that looks for the keurig border that's only on keurig cups -- if you peel the label off one you can cut out a small piece of just the border and tape it directly under the sensor -- you just have to make sure it's lined up the way it expects and you'll never have to futz with an extra lid again. Some quick scissor work and a piece of scotch tape and it's been going strong for probably around 2 months now.

Re:A more elegant hack

[nuckfuts]

I dunno what video you're talking about, but the video linked from TFA shows exactly what you're describing.

Re:Let's counter-balance that free Keurig ad a lit

[Anonymous Coward]

Tassimos also use proprietary pods. Nespresso's patent has expired and there is competition, but most of it sucks (unlike the situation with Keurig)

Someone already designed a perminant solution.

[luciano.moretti]

Freedom Clip: Clips onto your Keurig over the DRM sensor hole so you don't have to mess with extra foil.

https://www.gourmet-coffee.com...

Re:Trying to control a market they no longer own..

[desdinova 216]

because the management of the place where I work decided to put one in

Because I'm stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

Those makers that force me to use Genuine Coffee (tm) have been a godsend! Before I started using K-cups, sometimes in my morning pre-caffeine foggy haze, I'd end up putting all kids of shit in my "standard" coffee maker. Pencil shavings, oatmeal, cheerios- I even packed an entire bag of pork rinds in there once! Some things were surprisingly good- I still make Fruit Loop coffee to this day- but others were absolutely horrible (pork rinds only sound good in theory). Ever since I switched to my Keurig, I have been saved from myself countless times. No more gagging on nutmeg, no more iron filings! So to answer your question, *I* am the one keeping Keurig in business! You can have my K-cups when you pry them from cold, dead hands!!!!!

Coffee percolator

[OrangeTide]

I've had better coffee from a coffee percolator than from a K-Cup. It's simpler too, if you have one with a mesh screen you don't need filters and easily rinses out if you don't leave the coffee in it all day. Else you can scrub it out with a long handled brush when it starts smelling like old coffee. (for me the percolator coffee seems to do the best job at high altitude, start boiling at about 92C for me)

Since K-Cup's can't make espresso (not enough enough pressure), no need to compare it to a proper espresso machine. It's simply an elaborate drip coffee maker. A $30 Mr. Coffee from Costco will also make a fine drip coffee. You can use expensive unbleached compostable paper filters if you want, they're still a few percent of what each K-Cup costs.

My compost pile loves used coffee grounds.

Re:Trying to control a market they no longer own..

[Jason Levine]

I agree. Keurig is trying to sell Keurig 2.0 which has limited selection since you can't use "Keurig 1.0" pods in it. I'm guessing somebody will make a Keurig 1.0 compatible coffee brewer (if they haven't already). This will immediately have a large selection of pods that can be used in it, thanks to Keurig 1.0's success. A couple of years from now, talking about making quick cups of coffee might refer to SOME_OTHER_MAKER machines and not Keurig.

A clear circumvention

[Anonymous Coward]

Dear valued customer,

Our software is software is special, copyrighted stuff,
Just because the machine you bought contains it, does not mean you have a licence to use it for just anything.
To help you remember, we use DRM.

Just remember that circumvention of DRM to avoid a copyright issue is a federal offense.

Have a nice day.

Their marketing plan is a clever way to circumvent the need to make customers happy.
If you don't have any, you don't have to make them happy.
Clearly, that is their goal.

I wonder what the street price of a pre-2.0 machine is these days?

Re:Trying to control a market they no longer own..

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep. Pointy-haired-bosses make up the bulk of Keurig's market.

Re:Java Injection Attack?

[gameboyhippo]

No... I'm pretty sure it would inject water.

Forced internet connectivity on next revision

[wiredlogic]

Now the next revision will have a mandatory internet connection so they can blacklist used cups.

Re:Trying to control a market they no longer own..

[grimmjeeper]

I bet they'll still call them "K Cups" but like the modern "PC", the new generation will have no idea where the name comes from.

Re: But does it report artificially low ink levels

[Anonymous Coward]

The coffee doesn't power the maker, your analogy is shit on a stick.

K-Waste

[Anonymous Coward]

Does anyone else think these K-cups are extremely wasteful and possibility toxic? We had one these machines at my last work. Basically the machines pokes a hole and then pumps hot water thorough thin plastic. The garbage bin was full of these k cups which a normal coffee pot would just dispose of a paper filter and coffee grinds. I don't think they are recyclable due to the insides.... unless someone was to rip one open and take out the grinds. I hope these things get discontinued.

K-Cup and K-Carafe

[tepples]

Keurig 2.0 machines brew K-Cup packs and larger K-Carafe packs. The new generation may not know what the K is but they will know what the Cup part is because you get one cup (200-250 mL) of beverage out of it.

Re: But does it report artificially low ink levels

[bobbied]

The coffee doesn't power the maker, your analogy is shit on a stick.

I don't know, they might have something there... I'm pretty sure at 6 AM the coffee at least EMPOWERS the maker (me).

People here keep talking about DRM

[Anonymous Coward]

Shouldn't it be CRM? Where "C" stands for "Coffee"?

Not a great product to begin with

[RogueWarrior65]

The coffee is entirely too weak and the cup is friggin' plastic. People complain about water bottles but not about this.

Re: But does it report artificially low ink levels

[corychristison]

If the fork() commad has been run 1 or more times, you've got a full on rootkit there.

Why does the DRM even exist?

[El_Oscuro]

I mean, I understand the PHB/corporate group think that thinks this useful, but why, when I can get a perfectly good non-DRM official Keurig from amazon for less than I would pay for a Keurig 2.0? And no, it is not some discontinued model, it is the #1 best seller on Amazon.

yuk

[Charliemopps]

You're seriously a moron if you think Keurig has coffee worth pirating.

K Cups??

[tigersha]

Hell, C-Cups are already enough for me!

What about real coffee?

[Anonymous Coward]

Counterfeit pods to defeat DRM are all well and good, but I won't be impressed until someone makes one of these heaps of wasted technology make a real cup of coffee. And I won't be holding my breath.

Having to circumvent to have your coffee is stupid

[kimgkimg]

I hope Keurig competitors are taking notice. Having to hack your way around their lame DRM in order to enjoy the coffee that you want is stupid. This is such an anti-consumer move on Keurig's part.