Being Colder May Be Good For Your Health

An anonymous reader writes: If you live in a developed nation, you're probably pretty warm throughout most of the day. Enclosed spaces, thick clothing, and heating devices do a good job to keep the cold away. But this hasn't been the case for most of human history. Even in warmer climates, humans often had to deal with chilly nights and tough winters. That's where our metabolic system evolved, and now people are doing research to figure out if that's a better natural state for maintaining our health.

One recent study found that "when people cool their bedrooms from 75 degrees to 66 degrees, they gain brown fat, the metabolically active fat that burns calories to generate heat." Another showed that "even after controlling for diet, lifestyle, and other factors, people who live in warmer parts of Spain are more likely to be obese than people who live in the cooler parts." The article talks about people letting their house temperatures drop into the 50s and wearing ice vests during the day, all in the name of further research.

Comments

It all comes together...

[Anonymous Coward]

No wonder my wife has such a healthy butt. It is always frozen.

Yes brown fat will help you

[Spy Handler]

if you're an obese American gulping down double cheeseburgers and driving a car to everywhere. However, the "obese American" phase of human evolution has only been going on for about 60 years or so.

What about the previous 2,000,000 years, how did these brown fats help the primitive man whose main problem was finding enough calories to eat?

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

By keeping your chunky bacon-bearing butt warm and able to move, especially taking care of youngsters, with all those fall feasting calories. Even the most efficient physical activities go into at least 50%% waste heat.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[AK Marc]

What about the previous 2,000,000 years, how did these brown fats help the primitive man whose main problem was finding enough calories to eat?

Kept you from freezing to death.

What is this all about proving that it's 100% diet, despite all the studies to the opposite?

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[slashmydots]

You do know that 200 years ago the life expectancy was just a hair lower, right?

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

You do know that's because infant mortality was higher, right?

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[TechyImmigrant]

What about the previous 2,000,000 years, how did these brown fats help the primitive man whose main problem was finding enough calories to eat?

Kept you from freezing to death.

What is this all about proving that it's 100% diet, despite all the studies to the opposite?

It's not 100% diet, but diet is 100% of what you can do about it.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[itzly]

but diet is 100% of what you can do about it.

And exercise is the rest.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[TechyImmigrant]

but diet is 100% of what you can do about it.

And exercise is the rest.

Not if you're unmeasurably lazy like me.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[gl4ss]

You do know that's because infant mortality was higher, right?

you know that's bullshit, right?
or you consider vaccines something that save mostly infant lives?

where did this tidbit pop up lately, since wackos are repeating it all over the internets lately? for some reason they think that adult life expectancy now is the same as 200 years ago when that's bs. and as for nutrition, the beds from 120 years ago in my home country weren't small because they enjoyed sleeping in too short beds.... they were small because they ate poorly..

I guess it's the same wackos who like to say shit like "cancer is a modern disease", as if cancer started appearing only when they got advanced enough to make classifications for it..

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Dorianny]

And exercise is the rest.

The human body is so efficiently optimized to run on as few calories as possible that exercise simply is not effective as a counter to overeating. The calories in a piece of cheesecake would take hours of moderate exercise to burn off. Of course exercise has many benefits, especially in keeping the cardiovascular system in shape which mitigates some of the risks of obesity even if not loosing weight.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[itzly]

A completely sedentary person may burn 2000 kcal/day. An hour of exercise can increase that to 2500 kcal. That's significant enough. Of course, it doesn't mean that you can eat 3000 kcal/day. Strenuous of exercise, like weightlifting, can also increase metabolism for up to 48 hours after the actual exercise.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[jandersen]

I think part of the story is that when you live in the more northerly regions, where seasons are more pronounced, you have to rely more on meat as a food source, and therefore have to process more saturated fat; this, on the other hand, tends to be balanced out by the need to spend more energy on keeping warm - thus it is a great advantage to be able to produce brown fat even as an adult. This may be an adaptation along similar lines as the ability to digest milk - all children can do this, obviously, but adults in cultures that have had no dairy farming generally can't; this is relatively new mutation, something like a fewish thousand years old. Anecdotally, I have noticed how many of my friends from Africa are absolutely freezing when they come to UK, even when I feel moderately warm - they probably have very little brown fat compared to me.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

"cancer is a modern disease" those people must not know about cancers found in Egyptian mummies. Cancer has existed since organisms have had specialized cells.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Carewolf]

A completely sedentary person may burn 2000 kcal/day. An hour of exercise can increase that to 2500 kcal. That's significant enough. Of course, it doesn't mean that you can eat 3000 kcal/day. Strenuous of exercise, like weightlifting, can also increase metabolism for up to 48 hours after the actual exercise.

Of course you can eat 3000kal/day, you can also eat 4000 if your metabolism is fully functional it will not store excess fat unless you are stressed. Eating and exercise is not enough to explain the obesity epidemic, it is just the only two things worth talking about to stop it, as the we do not have enough information about the factors that influence the metabolism.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[itzly]

Of course you can eat 3000kal/day, you can also eat 4000 if your metabolism is fully functional it will not store excess fat unless you are stressed

Nonsense. Metabolism is mostly driven by demand (how much you move), and only to a small degree by available calories. Your argument also make no sense from an evolutionary survival perspective. Excess calories should be stored as fat to survive future times where food may be scarce.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

If you spend your time on the couch with the heating cranked up, dieting isn't going to make you magically slim. If you want to lose fat, your body needs some muscle to burn it and a reason to burn it.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

Saturated fat is unhealthy but doesn't make you fat. Carbs make you fat. You want to lose weight, eat less pasta and more meat and fish.

Re: Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

Its the wackos like me that checked their lineage as far back as they could, noticing that many of our ancestors lived to at least their sixties if not longer, iff they were male and lived to adulthood. Lots of kids died at 0 or shortly after though, as well as wives in childbirth and many of my forefathers and their brothers then married again and had more children. The farthest back I could go so far was in the 1700s.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't know if your anecdote applies since I'm not sure how quickly a change in body fat makeup occurs. You can see the same thing in the USA when someone used to warmer temps gets exposed to a colder climate or vice versa. I know it takes me a few weeks to adjust from being comfortable outside in the 50s (fahrenheit) to being comfortable in the 80s in the spring. I don't think that's due to a change in the brown fat content of my body.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[TheCastro1689]

People sat up when they slept back then too, so the beds didn't have to be as long since they weren't lying down. Many people had lung diseases and would cough flem and mucus when lying down and in the morning, but sitting up the mucus didn't come up so they thought lying down was the problem.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

from http://www.cheesecakefactorynu...?

A slice of cheesecake from the cheesecake factory has an average of 384 calories (min 210, max 700, SD 106), which is roughly 1 hour of jogging*. As such, if you order randomly from the cheesecake menu, you will most likely (68%) get something between 278-490 calories, which will require an EXTRA 40-70 min of exercise.

The numbers bear out: you are correct. On average, a WHOLE HOUR of EXTRA exercise will be a roughly even trade for a slice of cheesecake.

http://www.buzzle.com/articles...

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Holi]

http://www.livescience.com/105...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/...

Probably because it has some basis in fact.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[itzly]

On average, a WHOLE HOUR of EXTRA exercise will be a roughly even trade for a slice of cheesecake.

Yes, but that doesn't mean that exercise doesn't work. It means that you can eat a free piece of cheesecake for every day you do an hour of exercise. Or you can skip the cheesecake, and loose 500 kcal per day, which adds up to a pound in a week. Or you can skip the exercise, eat the cheesecake, and gain that pound.

And you seem shocked at a WHOLE HOUR. It's not that much, especially if you can combine it with other things like commuting or shopping. And if you're really stressed for time you can do a shorter, but more intense, workout. Most people have enough time though, just the wrong priorities.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

Vaccines mostly save childhood lives. Not that adults are somehow immune to infectious disease, but for most diseases adults are more likely to survive than children. The age of people who die of "old age" causes has gradually gone up, but nobody really knows why. In any case, we have plenty of evidence that (non-poor) people who reached adulthood routinely survived into their 60s in the Middle Ages.

And the "cancer is a modern disease" thing is even more bullshit than you say, as Hippocrates was classifying cancer back in ancient Greece. He's probably even the one who named it.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[TechHSV]

And you seem shocked at a WHOLE HOUR. It's not that much, especially if you can combine it with other things like commuting or shopping. And if you're really stressed for time you can do a shorter, but more intense, workout. Most people have enough time though, just the wrong priorities.

You could also find something you enjoy doing, so that WHOLE HOUR turns into ONLY AN HOUR. There is a curve to getting into physical activity, for example many people hate running at first. But if you're able to push through so you can run a couple of miles without feeling like you're going to fall over, you'll find you may actually enjoy it. There are tons of things you can do that are fun that have the side benefit of being exercise. Just put some effort into it and find something you like.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Ol Olsoc]

You do know that's because infant mortality was higher, right?

you know that's bullshit, right? or you consider vaccines something that save mostly infant lives?

where did this tidbit pop up lately, since wackos are repeating it all over the internets lately?

I dunno. Looking at my family history, if you discount injury, or war death, the men lived to be around 85 years old.

My parent's generation, with modern medical care, better safety, and maintenance pharmaceuticals lived to be - around 85 years old.

Indeed along with our longer average lifespans, there appears to be a new preening mouse among us. The people who believe they are all going to live forever, or at least live completely healthy in a 20 year old lifestyle until they die peacefully and painlessly in their sleep at 150 years old.

We see some of this in the illogical idea that women can and should wit until their mid-40's to start bearing children. I watched a TED talk where a lady (I think she was a shrink) was promoting the idea that it's actually healthier. Anyone want to make book on the likelyhood of these middle aged people seeing their grandchildren?

Let's not forget there are still people semi starving themselves in the notion that it will keep them living longer.

It is hoohaw to believe that cancer is a modern disease of course. But people believe in a lot of hoohaw, like a prey animal diet is somehow better than a diet that an alpha predator has evolved to use, or that you should drink a huge lot of water, or like a fellow I knew, believed and practiced getting all his fluid intake from what he ate. No drinking straight water. This one is right up there with the woman who rand a food cart in town who was a fruitarian. (She did make some kickass vegan sammies though). All believe they are doing something to make them live longer

Regardless, you don't think that reducing infant mortality will tend to increase the average lifespan? Perhaps there is some confusion with the likely length of life at any particular given age?

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[blue9steel]

Although burning calories is an important part of exercise, more important is the hormone signaling effects that occur. If you want to lose fat rather than just weight exercise is a key component.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[Pikoro]

I don't know about you, but I plan to live forever. Or die trying.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[AK Marc]

Evolution demands people eat all they can when they can, store it all as fat, move only to get more food and then get ridiculed on Slashdot by those that don't understand evolution, while pontificating on evolution.

Re: Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

Of course people enjoy it. They become addicted to endorphins.

You can also just take a pill, like ephedrine or amphetamine, to stop your hunger. And then you get to do more fun/productive stuff than 1 hour of exercise plus 30 minutes of dressing, undressing, showering, dressing.

Re: Yes brown fat will help you

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not bullshit, it's math. Dying at 1 year old is a serious drag on the AVERAGE lifespan. Dying at 40 doesn't reduce AVERAGE lifespan nearly as much. Because... maths.

Throw in the fact that infant mortality has plummeted by several multiples, and it's obvious why infant mortality dominates the change in AVERAGE lifespan.

Feel free to break out the difference. You should be able to find the numbers for deaths after 3, 5, 10, or 21 years of age or thereabouts. Then you can put evidence to your dumb argument.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[K10W]

A completely sedentary person may burn 2000 kcal/day. An hour of exercise can increase that to 2500 kcal. That's significant enough. Of course, it doesn't mean that you can eat 3000 kcal/day. Strenuous of exercise, like weightlifting, can also increase metabolism for up to 48 hours after the actual exercise.

Of course you can eat 3000kal/day, you can also eat 4000 if your metabolism is fully functional it will not store excess fat unless you are stressed. Eating and exercise is not enough to explain the obesity epidemic, it is just the only two things worth talking about to stop it, as the we do not have enough information about the factors that influence the metabolism.

I'd argue we do have enough info on metabolism. It was a hell of a large part of my studies (biochem) in 1 and 2nd year and that was in the 90's and understanding has increased not decreased since then. We know a hell of a lot and understand it extremely well right down to the molecular physics of excatly how it does that not just the fact it does.

The problem is most people I know outside of those education subjects and careers don't know it, including a health care professional who is an expert nutritionalist who I've had to give extra info to a lot as she admits she never heard that but comes back surprised after research at it being well known. People want simple answers and the human body is complex; we want magic bullets, instant solutions, and 1 word answers is my guess at the real problem.

Re:Yes brown fat will help you

[K10W]

Of course you can eat 3000kal/day, you can also eat 4000 if your metabolism is fully functional it will not store excess fat unless you are stressed

Nonsense. Metabolism is mostly driven by demand (how much you move), and only to a small degree by available calories. Your argument also make no sense from an evolutionary survival perspective. Excess calories should be stored as fat to survive future times where food may be scarce.

that isn't true, it is not that simple. Muscles actually prefer burning fats at rest and storing glucose from (or converted to from) food as glycogen so there is a store for aerobic erxercise but more importantly for the brain since fats can't cross the blood brain barrier. We need the fats to store fat soluble vitamins too. There are many many factors driving metabolism, the basic ones are activity, hormone levels (made more complex in that some like hgh's have insulin effects), food types eaten and fast periods (including hour(s) long not just days/weeks/months), climate, daylight length, genetics etc etc so it gets complicated and no generalisations can be made.

Most people ask nutritionalists and personal trainers who understand very little and some of it they know the right answer but their reasoning is wrong so they form extra conclusions which are crap. What you really need is to be asking biochemists and molecular biologists and the like those questions or medical practitioners strong in those areas.

tropical thailand

[geekymachoman]

I live in Thailand. Don't really see obese people here. It's hot. Very hot.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

People LIVE in Thailand?!

Re:tropical thailand

[Nemyst]

How many people in Thailand live the Western lifestyle of working in a cramped office all day and then coming home to watch TV on the sofa?

Re:tropical thailand

[Tough Love]

Perhaps something to do with the gluten factor?

Re:tropical thailand

[ArchieBunker]

Compare typical Thai food to American food.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

Compare typical Thai food to American food.

You can get fat on Thai food. It is more likely they live a healthier lifestyle and don't eat snacks at the desk between meals. And for the one citing the gluten factor: The gluten factor is also blamed on weight loss, not only on gain and all documents around the gluten factor wont stand a review or are pretty much esoteric to begin. Looks like some people have found a new word and like to preach.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

I live in Thailand. Don't really see obese people here. It's hot. Very hot.

Given that Thailand's per capita GDP is only a little over USD $5,000, there's a lot of people in Thailand who simply can't afford to be fat - either because they can't afford the food or because they can't afford the air conditioning that would allow them to be overweight and still survive the extreme (outdoor) heat.

Along those lines, there's two related ideas I've wondered about. First, there have been studies that show that people who get heat stroke that requires hospitalization generally have permanent brain damage. What if some of the poverty in tropical countries could be explained by (sub-clinical) brain damage? Second, in my experience, it becomes very hard to do anything at all (even just sit and think) in the extreme heat and humidity of tropical countries like Thailand.

Of course, correlation isn't causation and there are plenty of other factors that can explain poverty in Southeast Asia and other tropical countries. The fact that the industrial revolution first happened up in the colder climate of northern Europe is most likely just random chance. But it would be interesting if there are eventually some careful scientific studies that are able to show that extreme heat has a major impact on individual economic productivity.

Re:tropical thailand

[rwa2]

Compare typical Thai food to American food.

That, and Asians also have had a few thousand more years of agricultural society compared to hunter/gatherer Westerners. Food grows everywhere and is available year-round, so southeast asian bodies haven't exactly had to evolve the "pack it away for the winter!" approach to carbs.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

As a Finn... While that's possible, it seems a lot more likely/important that colder climate forces you to be more efficient, exact, etc... If you have one harvest a year, short days for half a year and freezing cold outside, it strongly encourages a culture where meetings occur and works begins at precisely the time that was agreed upon, the working hours are spent as efficiently as possible, etc.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

I live in Thailand too. I see fat people everywhere.

Obesity is epidemic in Thailand, and much worse in neighboring Malaysia.

Just look at the stats. The Thai government even called it a "crisis" just last year. The day of "everyone's skinny in Thailand" is long gone. The Western diet has arrived.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

It's an interesting point that moving from the equator toward the poles results in lower (average) temperatures but also more seasonal variation. To a first approximation, there's less poverty away from the equator. But the full picture is a bit more complicated - except for New Zealand and Australia, it's almost a northern versus southern hemisphere kind of thing.

The ultra-simplistic argument is that poverty is partially caused by poor people being lazy and stupid and partially caused by rich people being selfish and mean. That raises the question, then, of whether there's some sort of environmental effect that either causes poor people to be less lazy or rich people to be less selfish going from the equator toward the poles.

Re:tropical thailand

[nadass]

Absolutely! But only because a private blogger said so.

Re:tropical thailand

[suss]

A quick google for "thailand obesity" brings up another story...

Here's one.

Re:tropical thailand

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

I'll say it's the Thai food is FAR LESS PROCESSED, not filled with corn syrup and various chemicals.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

You say that as if a few thousand years were significant in mankind evolution.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

As an American living in Europe, I'd say that it's because American food is so damn cheap. It's just economic incentive.

Yea, you heard me... I don't come from a rich background, and yes, I wish bills were easier to pay, but frankly, I have a good job, and food prices in Europe are such that if I continued to eat like I did in the US, I would go bankrupt. After a few months of moving countries, as I tried to cut back until I could get my budget to balance out, I magically was eating substantially less than I used to.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

All food is filled with various chemicals.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

southeast asian bodies haven't exactly had to evolve the "pack it away for the winter!" approach to carbs

You're chalking it up to evolution. But after 6 years living in South East Asia, I was skinny as fuck too. Nowadays I'm lugging around an additional 60 pounds of fat.

Re:tropical thailand

[Jeeeb]

The equator runs through Indonesia. Most poor countries (and most countries full stop) are north of the equator.

Re:tropical thailand

[itzly]

A few thousand years is not enough for significant mutations, but in a large pool of individuals there already exist a wide range genetic variation from previous mutations gathered over longer times. By themselves, these are fairly small, but a period of harsh times can combine and concentrate the beneficial mutations in a smaller group of survivors creating a sudden change in the average genetic makeup.

Re:tropical thailand

[xaxa]

Malaysia is the most obese country in Asia.

Malaysia: 44% adult men overweight or obese

USA: 71%

Western Europe: 61% average (e.g. UK 67%)

Thailand: 32%

Thailand's adults are a lot slimmer than the average European, but Thai children have mostly caught up to European children's weight.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

I'll say it's the Thai food is FAR LESS PROCESSED, not filled with corn syrup and various chemicals.

All food is made of chemicals, as is your entire damn body. Whining about "chemicals" is just a way now for the intelligent folk to tune out ignorant whiners like you.

Re:tropical thailand

[M8e]

All food IS various chemicals.

Re: tropical thailand

[ferret4]

All poisons are made of chemicals, as is your entire damn body. Whining about "chemicals" is just a way for blah blah blah blah blah.

Re: tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

then add in "artificial" when you take a break from being a cunt.

Re:tropical thailand

[LordLimecat]

various chemicals.

Scare word alert. How bout a trigger warning next time?

Re:tropical thailand

[q4Fry]

I dunno about you, mate, but the thing I miss the absolute most about Thailand is the cheap food. I could visit a little rahn-ahan (literally "food shop" but more like a mini restaurant) for 30B, maybe $1 US or so, for rice and two things to go with it (say chicken curry and a veggie dish). It'd run me $20 US here plus tip, and I'd be less impressed with the food.

Re:tropical thailand

[q4Fry]

I grew up in Thailand, but left after school. I went to visit Chiang Mai again for a few months over term break at uni, and lost 15 pounds. Returning to the West, I gained it all right back. (This was several years ago.)

I'm curious though about the next generation of Thai kids. Thais used to be short, but with the king's milk program from a few decades back, the average height of the population has grown. I wouldn't be too surprised if the next shift is the average girth.

Re:tropical thailand

[g0bshiTe]

I think it's the diet. My wife and I were on a Korean cooking kick not too long ago, I really miss it and during the 6 months to a year we were cooking like that I felt great and actually began losing weight. We've since stopped, not sure why, and I feel crap again.

Korean and Thai are among my favorite Asian food types, with Japanese and Chinese bringing up the rear.

In fact it's winter and I want nothing more than a hot bowl of ddubaki.

Re:tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

Very hot or very cold works metabolism. Staying always in the comfort zone is the problem. Low on energy? At end of shower cycle very cold water for 1 minute then back to warm for 30 secs then 2 minutes of very cold then off. You will be wide awake.

International translation

[Anonymous Coward]

For non-Americans (and other Fahrenheit speakers, if any): approximately between 19 and 24 degrees Celsius.

Re:International translation

[rwa2]

Fahrenheit is really a stupid scale: It was originally planned to have only unsigned values, and have three (fucking three!) fixpoints. Everybody knows that a line in the eucledian plane is determined already by two of its points.

Please dear americans, adopt reasonable measures.

The best explanation I've heard is that Fahrenheit is a 0 - 100 scale for essentially the coldest and warmest air temperatures typically faced in the middle of Europe. Given the euro-centric nature of this and related studies, Fahrenheit fits fine.

Yeah, if you're doing any type of science or engineering, a Kelvin / Rankine scale would be more useful. If you're freezing or boiling water at STP, sure, whip out your Centigrade scale, but otherwise, it's just as arbitrary.

Re:International translation

[TechyImmigrant]

The triple point of water is a lot more stable and well defined than the freezing point.

Re: International translation

[Anonymous Coward]

So it suits *you* and that's the reason not to adapt to the rest of the world? That's so typically American, the rest of the world really gets fed up with.

Know your place, you're only 4% of the world.

Re:International translation

[Rhywden]

Not to mention that it's actually the melting point. Even when you have a well-defined pressure of 1 atm, water doesn't have to freeze at 0 C (and it also doesn't have to boil at 100 C). It is likely that it will freeze at that point, but far from being guaranteed. If you're doing things right water can go as far as -50 C before freezing.

Re:International translation

[Anonymous Coward]

People heat their houses to 24 degrees? I'd have trouble sleeping at that temperature.

As for 19 degrees, that's still hotter than I (or, I would expect, most of England) have ever heated my bedroom to at night!

Re:International translation

[deniable]

I'll be happy if it drops below 25 by midnight. Dropping to 19 means sealing the house and cranking the AC to 11. Then again, we have a cool change, 39 today and 29 tomorrow. A low of 18 should let things cool down overnight.

Re:International translation

[Anonymous Coward]

If you're freezing or boiling water at STP, sure, whip out your Centigrade scale, but otherwise, it's just as arbitrary.

But at least it is a scale that is familiar to everyone. If the value is given in Centigrade, you don't need to convert it before you have a feeling for it.

Re: International translation

[Anonymous Coward]

And yet you're the one who's so fed up. If we're so insignificant, why do you care what system of units we use in conversation?

Re:International translation

[Anonymous Coward]

The best explanation I've heard is that Fahrenheit is a 0 - 100 scale for essentially the coldest and warmest air temperatures typically faced in the middle of Europe.

Not really. Fahrenheit is a brine-based or blood-based temperature scale, with both 0 and 100 being mis-measurements. The 100 was an overestimate of the temperature of blood in the human body. The 0 was a mis-measurement of the temperature at which blood congeals or of the lowest temperature to which brine could be cooled as a liquid (both are wrong).

Re:International translation

[zwarte piet]

Not to me. I'm used to Celsius, so when I encounter a temperature in Fahrenheit, I'll have to convert it to Celsius first, to know how much it is.

So there's this young penguin. One day,

[Anonymous Coward]

he asks his mom "Am I a penguin, mom?"
"Of course you are, dear."
A few days later, "Is dad a penguin too?"
Yes, son, dad's a penguin. I'm a penguin. And so are you."
A few more days,"Mom, are grandma and grandpa penguins?"
"Of course they are. We're all penguins, and their ancestors are penguins as far back as you can find. Why do you ask?"
"Because I'm fucking freezing!"

I sleep better in the cold

[Snotnose]

In the living room I've got the windows closed, no heater yet, and it's 65. In the bedroom the window is open and it's in the 40s. I love snuggling under my pile of blankets, and sleep much better that way than I do in the summer when it's 80 in the bedroom.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[Anonymous Coward]

My lungs fill with mucus and I end up hacking up goo for several minutes in the morning if the temperature drops below about 73 F (23 C) in my bedroom at night.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[Anonymous Coward]

That explains your user ID...

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[Stoned_Immaculate]

Getting used to cool temperature works even better when you're not wearing clothes at all in house. It's 64F in my living room, I'm nude and perfectly comfortable (even sweating a little). Thursday afternoon it's time for the annual new-year's dip in the 45F Northsea, going back to the beach-club in the 38F (predicted) air temperature should be an "interesting" experience.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[xaxa]

Getting used to cool temperature works even better when you're not wearing clothes at all in house.
It's 64F in my living room, I'm nude and perfectly comfortable (even sweating a little).
Thursday afternoon it's time for the annual new-year's dip in the 45F Northsea, going back to the beach-club in the 38F (predicted) air temperature should be an "interesting" experience.

Why did you bother to convert that to Farenheit? Now I have to convert it back to Celsius...

64F = 18C

45F = 7C

38F = 3C

18C is a reasonable temperature, and the British government recommended temperature for the "rest of the house". They recommend 20C for the living room. I think my house's thermostat is set to 17 or 18C.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[xaxa]

In the living room I've got the windows closed, no heater yet, and it's 65. In the bedroom the window is open and it's in the 40s. I love snuggling under my pile of blankets, and sleep much better that way than I do in the summer when it's 80 in the bedroom.

British Government health advice is that living rooms should be heated to temperatures of 21C (70F) and the rest of the house to 18C (64F).

The World Health Organisation says "vulnerable people" are at risk of respiritory infection below 16C (61F).

My thermostat is set to 18C.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[zwarte piet]

I like that too, but my wife starts complaining it's fucking freezing if it drops below 75, so I usually sleep without a cover.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[zwarte piet]

I usually had 19 or 20 in the daytime, 17 at night when I was single. Now that I'm married it's 24 degrees 24/7. Took a long time to get used to that.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[rossdee]

Its not just the temperature, its also the humidity.

In the winter when it gets very cold it also gets very dry which is bad for your skin, and for your respiratory system.
The dewpoint of the outside air right now is below 250K, so if you warm that air up to a comfortable temperature (around 291K) you are left with only 2% relative humidity.

Fortunately here at home I have a humidifier and its about 40% RH

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[xaxa]

That probably affects the British recommendation -- it's permanently damp here. (amateur data in London, but the official data is only available as a download).

It's 3C outside now (17:09), with 86% humidity, changing to 0C and fog overnight.

Re:I sleep better in the cold

[Anonymous Coward]

Why did you bother to convert that to Farenheit? Now I have to convert it back to Celsius...

The dewpoint of the outside air right now is below 250K, so if you warm that air up to a comfortable temperature (around 291K)

Fahrenheit, Celcius, Kelvin... for ****'s sake, will someone please convert these figures to degrees Rankine so I can understand what you're talking about?!

Hands and feet

[manu0601]

I like cold, I sleep without a blanket (just a sheet), I walk outdoors without a jacket most of the year, but the only problem I never solved is hands and feet. Exposed to cold, their temperature tend to adjust to external temperature, which hurts with temperature below 10 degree Celsius.

Re:Hands and feet

[Intrepid imaginaut]

Likewise, I despise warm climates. Give me the ice and cold and snow! Mind you I prefer to be warm in those climates, but having the option is important. In Nordic countries many parents leave their babies outside in sub zero temperatures.

Re:Hands and feet

[Anonymous Coward]

I like cold, I sleep without a blanket (just a sheet), I walk outdoors without a jacket most of the year, but the only problem I never solved is hands and feet. Exposed to cold, their temperature tend to adjust to external temperature, which hurts with temperature below 10 degree Celsius.

Well, there's a simple solution to that problem. *chop chop*

Re:Hands and feet

[tlhIngan]

I like cold, I sleep without a blanket (just a sheet), I walk outdoors without a jacket most of the year, but the only problem I never solved is hands and feet. Exposed to cold, their temperature tend to adjust to external temperature, which hurts with temperature below 10 degree Celsius.

Great to know there are other people like me who are cold-blooded. If the temperatures are above 10C, a shirt and pants is sufficient for me to go outside. Below 10C in the mornings I have a jacket on, but during the day I go without. This lasts me until 5C or so. Below that I need a sweater and I just use the sweater when going out.

I generally sleep on top (a sheet can be quite hot), though for the winters, I go under the sheets. But I have to be careful because I sometimes wake up in a pool of sweat.

I plain prefer to cold. I'm with airplanes - I perform better in the cold. At my desk is a fan that's on practically all day everyday - in the summer (A/C not cool enough) and in the winter (they turn on the bloody heater).

Re:Hands and feet

[rwa2]

I like cold, I sleep without a blanket (just a sheet), I walk outdoors without a jacket most of the year, but the only problem I never solved is hands and feet. Exposed to cold, their temperature tend to adjust to external temperature, which hurts with temperature below 10 degree Celsius.

That's natural... your hands and feet have a high surface area to volume ratio, so they naturally serve as radiators to help help regulate your core temperature.

When you're hot, the capillaries in your hands and feet will bring blood to the surface, helping you cool off. When you're cold, circulation decreases so less blood flows to your hands and feet to help maintain more heat in your core.

So for people who overheat and start sweating under their blankets, all they really need to do is let their hands and feet stick out from under the blanket and let the bodies better regulate their core temperature naturally.

For your case, I'm afraid you ought to just try wearing a vest to raise your core temperature just enough that your body has to start pushing warm blood out to your hands and feet to shed off the excess heat.

Re:Hands and feet

[Anonymous Coward]

Sounds to me like you're hot blooded, not cold. If you were cold blooded you'd prefer baking desert heat just to get some temperature into your muscles.

I'm not quite as extreme as sweating under a sheet, but I still have to stick my feet out from under the covers. The worst thing is having too-hot feet, they get all twitchy and immensely irritating. I can't imagine anyone needing / wanting to sleep in a room that's 24 Celsius. I also don't get this modern habit of heating our houses to the point you can walk around in your underpants without being cold. It's winter - wear a sweater! Same thing at work, people seem to expect to be able to turn up in a thin short sleeved shirt in January and be comfortable. It's seasonally inappropriate - wear a sweater! It's still perfectly possible to be just as comfortable in a room at 18 Celsius with a sweater as it is in a room at 22 Celsius in a thin top.

Re:Hands and feet

[Carewolf]

Outside with warm blankets and an insulated baby carriage. I personally guess this is something that made a lot more sense 20 years ago, when it was more likely people would be smoking in doors. My sister has baby and the baby alarm even have a temperature report, when the general air is -3C outside the temperature in the baby carriage is still 5-10C and that is not even counting the blankets and warm clothes the baby is wearing when sleeping there.

Re:Hands and feet

[Anonymous Coward]

yes!

you can dress for cold weather (at a point it does get cumbersome or inconvenient... but there isn't a naturally occurring temperature on this planet's surface you can't truly 'dress for'), just pile on the layers, using specific fabrics of course for extreme temperatures..

but to shed those layers in a hot humid climate, there is a point where you can't take off anything else or you'll be naked (and likely illegal in public in most of society).. and you'll still be too hot even if you are.

Re: Hands and feet

[Anonymous Coward]

Our living room is set to 18C in winter. Thats a really nice temperature. Yes I wear a sweater but I do that at 22C too. The bedroom should be at 15C or below but thats hard, as you also need new air or it gets damp really fast. I.e. either leave the door or the window open. And with -20C or around that here in Canada, we'll go bankrupt from the heating expenses if its the window :)

At the grandparents' house in Germany its 25C all day long inside. I hate it. The air always feels like I'm going to choke. Fortunately it's cold outside too (-5C yesterday) and I can go for a walk in the snow.

We generally don't use any AC in summer but keep everything closed so that it stays cool and dry. We only use the AC inside if it somehow got humid inside.

Re:Hands and feet

[operagost]

Um... wear a jacket? If your core is kept warm, the body won't neglect the extremities in favor of core temperature. If you really insist on not wearing a jacket, I guess you'll have to wear gloves and warm socks.

Didn't your mother teach you how to dress?

Re:Hands and feet

[zwarte piet]

To quote my wife on that, "sweaters and thick covers are for people who live in bad houses that can't be kept warm properly".

Re:Hands and feet

[Anonymous Coward]

Whoa. The articles says that the babies are bundled up, so I'm sure that they're warm. But regardless of the babies state of dress and temperature, *they leave them outside*??? In the U.S., that would get you arrested for child neglect.

Re:Hands and feet

[MarkRose]

I also have a fan on all the time. I'm simply uncomfortable in temperatures above 21C.

I'm comfortable in pants and a t-shirt down to 0C if it's not too windy, or -15C if it's calm and sunny and I'm moving around. Below those conditions I'll wear a jacket and perhaps gloves. Only once it gets to -25C do I get out the winter gear and start layering. I don't need it until then.

Re: Hands and feet

[g0bshiTe]

Ah so you only post as AC in winter!

Re:Hands and feet

[Carewolf]

Whoa. The articles says that the babies are bundled up, so I'm sure that they're warm. But regardless of the babies state of dress and temperature, *they leave them outside*??? In the U.S., that would get you arrested for child neglect.

Yes, that happens: http://www.nytimes.com/1997/05...

Let go though, because there is no neglect involved. We are just not living in constant fear of things that are mostly imaginary.

Skeptical

[Anonymous Coward]

66 is cold to live in 24/7 you might be able to burn the fat off through tricking your body into engaging it's cold protection mechanisms and changing to a low sustenance diet. However you would be miserable all the time. What additional psychological stress does this add to your body. They are basically saying you should turn the temp down until you aren't comfortable and then live in that 24/7. I think this is just an additional manifestation of insane diets that people do these days. Wouldn't it just be easier to adhere to a reasonable diet and mild to moderate exercise. It seems like that would be best for your body and mind. I mean i'm sure you could loose wait in a CIA torture chamber as well that does not mean that is good for your health.

Re:Skeptical

[Cyberax]

66F (18.8C) is _cold_? It's a nice warm temperature - it might feel a little bit cold if you spend all of your time simply sitting in one place, but even with minimal movements it's just fine.

As a child I lived in a house made of logs and had to wear woolen socks during winters - the floor was too cold otherwise. The air temperatures at night was around 14C - I slept just fine, but I hated to wake up and dress quickly. To this day, I prefer sleeping with the air conditioner set to 16-17C, though I program it to go back to 22C around the time to wake up.

Re:Skeptical

[Anonymous Coward]

I used to be cold all the time and needed a room temperature in the 70's (22+ C) to be comfortable.
As "converted" naturist I weaned myself off this habit and now I'm perfectly comfortable in my 18C (64F) living without wearing anything but a pair of socks (my feet still get cold alas, no floor heating). I sleep in a 16C (61F) bedroom under a light comforter but at times this is too warm so I'm taking this down a notch.
So, yes, I'd say that 19C inside should be warm enough for most people.

Re:Skeptical

[RabidReindeer]

It's the coldest hour of the end-of-December day and the current outside temperature here is 19C. The interior temperature is about 25 because the heat from yesterday's sun is still lingering in the building. Heat hasn't kicked on in about 2 weeks.

Spend enough time in that sort of environment and your internal thermosensors reset. Working at a company office desk, I spent a great deal of time contemplating setting fire to to whatever I could burn to keep warm. The temperature? 72 degreees Fahrenheit. Good enough if you're an executive wearing a 3-piece suit and wandering around annoying the grunts, but Bob Cratchitt frigid if you're just sitting there pushing paper and bits.

I can tolerate cooler these days, though. Used to be my summer A/C setting was 83F (27C). Now I prefer it a degree or 2 colder.

Blood pressure increases with decreasing temp

[Camel Pilot]

The summary claims "Good For Your Health" but only considers one aspect. Shame on them...

http://www.webmd.com/hypertens...

Re:Blood pressure increases with decreasing temp

[Anonymous Coward]

And blood pressure is also affected by humidity, atmospheric pressure, cloud cover, wind, etc.
Of course, these conditions along with temperature don't affect everyone and are mostly prevalent in the elderly.

It's amazing to me!

[EzInKy]

I keep my house at 62F during the winter, and it never ceases to amaze me when my guests demand the heat be turned up. It's as if they don't understand that there are real costs involved when warming a space up. Besides, those who are cold can add any number of layers of clothing, those who are too warm can only strip so far.

Re: It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

Meanwhile, I grew up with a father who insisted on keeping the house cold, and I got very sick nearly every winter. One time, I had to be hospitalized for a month.

As an adult, I ensure that my house is warm, and if I ever have kids, I'll make sure that they aren't cold.

Re: It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

Perhaps it would pay to understand that cold doesn't make you ill. A damp house will make you ill.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

Tell that to my parents. I keep my place around 65F- 68F, but when I visit my parents they keep the house at 75F - 80F. It's the middle of winter and I'll sweat my ass off when I sleep there. So I'll open the window and then get yelled at because I'm wasting all the heat.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[pepty]

Could be worse. My girlfriend and I realized that her idea of a comfortable room temperature is about 77-80F and mine is about 60-77F. For sleeping, I'm more comfortable below 70. Yep: she's a bit anemic.

Re: It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

...I got very sick nearly every winter.

Most children do get sick in the winter but not because of the cold, per se. In the winter people are packed together in enclosed spaces so when someone coughs or sneezes out an aerosol of infectious pathogens then other people are more likely to breathe it in and get sick. The incidence of certain types of infectious disease (e.g. upper respiratory infections like colds and the flu) is simply higher in winter. And then schools are a nightmare of infectious disease transmission - packing thirty people together in a small little room for most of the day is a really bad idea from the point of view limiting disease transmission.

One time, I had to be hospitalized for a month.

Cold dry air isn't great for upper respiratory infections but unless you were so cold that you were shivering all the time then it shouldn't have affected your immune system all that much. It's more likely that you happened to catch something nasty (perhaps even bacterial) and it was the nature of the pathogen rather than the cold that resulted in your hospitalization.

Re: It's amazing to me!

[EzInKy]

Harmful to human pathogens thrive in the environmnet that you you feel comfortable in. It was your desire for warmt that made you sick, not the temperature.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

I keep my house at 62F during the winter, and it never ceases to amaze me when my guests demand the heat be turned up.

You're actually amazed that people would prefer it to be warmer than 62 degrees?

Re: It's amazing to me!

[N1AK]

It was your desire for warmt that made you sick, not the temperature.

He lived in a cold house, got ill, but you think it was the fact he desired for warmt (sp) that made him sick. Yeah, that doesn't sound stupid at all

Re: It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

Most children do get sick in the winter but not because of the cold, per se. In the winter people are packed together in enclosed spaces so when someone coughs or sneezes out an aerosol of infectious pathogens then other people are more likely to breathe it in and get sick. The incidence of certain types of infectious disease (e.g. upper respiratory infections like colds and the flu) is simply higher in winter. And then schools are a nightmare of infectious disease transmission - packing thirty people together in a small little room for most of the day is a really bad idea from the point of view limiting disease transmission.

That is a dangerous myth that has to be debunked. You catch cold when cold shrinks your surface blood vessels and your peripheral circulation gets slower in your mucous epithelium. That means your first lines of defense are left under-supplied, undermanned and also under-hydrated. You don't need infectious pathogens from ill others to get sick (although it "helps"); there are always plenty of pathogens hitching the ride on your self, or lurking as spores in the surrounding. Unchecked cold elevates their chances to invade. However, it has much to do with body reaction to cold. There is an window of opportunity between "depressing cold" and "arctic cold" where the conditions are just right. Once it gets real cold outside and people get going in and out of the house, all of the sudden the aerosols and too much people in small rooms cease to cause infections. Our metabolisms switch to higher gear.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[xaxa]

62F = 16.5C. Below 16C the World Health Organisation says vulnerable people are at risk of respiritory infection, they recommend at least 21C for such people.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

I keep my house at 62F during the winter, and it never ceases to amaze me when my guests demand the heat be turned up. It's as if they don't understand that there are real costs involved when warming a space up. Besides, those who are cold can add any number of layers of clothing, those who are too warm can only strip so far.

Simple solution: people like you should simply not have guests if you're such an unwelcome host.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

My house is at 55 F (~13C). I wish it was hotter from natural sunlight, but the designers weren't thinking when they drew up the plans.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[jellomizer]

It is normally courteous to have your home around 65-68F when you have guests over.

Normally when guests come over you take their coat, and they really don't want to travel back to their home to get extra clothing, because you are being cheap on the heating for a few hours out of the day.

Being that most hosts will keep their home around a warmer temperature+extra heat from more people. They dress for that temperature. And it is rather impolite to bury themselves in your blankets that may be around.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

just be glad people bother to visit someone too poor or inconsiderate to heat their house to normal human living conditions

Re:It's amazing to me!

[operagost]

It's as if that you don't realize that it's the host's responsibility to make his guests comfortable. You wouldn't be shocked if they complained about noise or filth in the place, right?

Re: It's amazing to me!

[Anonymous Coward]

Being cold doesn't make you sick either.
http://www.everydayhealth.com/cold-and-flu/colds-and-the-weather.aspx

On the contrary, cold weather appears to stimulate the immune system, according to a study by the Army Research Institute of Environmental Medicine, says Dr. Belilovsky.

Re:It's amazing to me!

[PPH]

those who are too warm can only strip so far.

Offer that as an option to your guests. They'll be comfy. And you'll be naked.

Of course, that would have been my plan all along.

55-65 deg F

[ChunderDownunder]

That's 12.8 - 18.3 deg Celsius for the rest of us.

(My indoor thermometer says 22 deg C at the moment)

Re:55-65 deg F

[Anonymous Coward]

Beware, my friend, somebody has unleashed modtrolls:
http://science.slashdot.org/co...
http://science.slashdot.org/co...
I hope you can retain your excellent karma.

Re:55-65 deg F

[Anonymous Coward]

Mine says 15 C or 59 F, but that is because power bills for heating my Victorian house are huge. I don't think health will figure in family discussions about turning the thermostat up.

Tim Ferriss talks about this

[PapayaSF]

Tim Ferriss talks about this in The 4-Hour Body. It's one reason competitive swimmers are in such good shape: it's not just the exercise itself, it's being in water that's much colder than body temperature. One of Ferriss's weight-loss tips involves using ice-packs.

Re:Tim Ferriss talks about this

[itzly]

Apparently, being in the cold promotes the growth of brown fat cells. That's nice, but is has nothing to do with being in good shape.

Re:Tim Ferriss talks about this

[PPH]

Your body automatically regulates your metabolism and makes physical exertion more difficult to prevent overheating your core (and brain). So it is possible to exert yourself (exercise) harder when the temperature gradient between your core and the outside is greater (cooler environment) and you can dissipate more heat.

This does not apply to sprinters. They never reach temperature equilibrium during a short event. And the initial body reaction is to restrict blood flow to the extremities upon initial contact with cold to conserve heat. Not what you want for a short dash.

Maybe, maybe not

[kheldan]

I dunno how valid what TFA has to say, but I do know that I sleep more soundly in a room that's ~60-65F, and getting enough and high quality sleep has much bearing on your general health.

Need a conditoning study

[vix86]

This study is interesting, but I'm way more interested in the affect of conditioning and body temp regulation. I grew up in the US and all of houses/apartments always had good temperature control as well as ceiling fans in rooms. I got use to living in places where if the temperature was above say 70F, there was a fan running, the air in a room was circulating.

When I studied abroad in Japan and then moved there I discovered this wasn't the case and constructed a theory that early life conditions on body temp are 'imprinted' in a way. Japanese tend to let rooms run very hot. In the Summer/Winter rooms and trains are kept at about 28C maybe 30C (possibly higher in the winter), and I always found these miserable and always resulted in me sweating. I always noticed though that most other (Japanese) people never had this problem though, even in a room thats almost as hot as a mid-summer day in the winter, people would have 2-3 layers of clothes on and would be fine. I knew I wasn't alone either because in talking to other westerners living in Japan I learned that many of them had the same issue too. The only reason I've been able to come up with was that it had to do with how they were raised early on and the kind of temp. environment they are use to living in.

So I'd be curious to see if these physical effects in the study aren't something that isn't tuned by early conditioning.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[Anonymous Coward]

I moved to an area where the temperature was consistently 65-70 degrees on good days. I was always chilly for about the first year and then I acclimated to the temperature difference. First thing my visiting friends said (wrapped up in a jacket), "It's cold here."

Then I ate them.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[Anonymous Coward]

I always noticed though that most other (Japanese) people never had this problem though, even in a room thats almost as hot as a mid-summer day in the winter, people would have 2-3 layers of clothes on and would be fine.

There is certainly some degree of adaptation that occurs for people who grow up in a particular climate - otherwise poor people who live in extreme tropical heat without air conditioning simply wouldn't survive. But smaller people (e.g. Japanese versus westerners) also have a higher ratio of surface area to body mass - plus people in Japan are less likely than Westerners to be significantly overweight (excess fat is a lot like wearing extra layers of clothes). So it's not all about adaptation, per se.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[rwa2]

Well, I've lived in cold climates and hot climates... Everyone has a different approach to staying comfortable. It takes years (YEARS) to transition between them, but it's possible... I think you would have acclimated to the Japanese approach after a few more years. I don't think your early childhood experiences really matter.

I grew up mostly in New England, which has decent extremes in either direction... I think similar to Japan. There's maybe 2 perfect weeks in fall when the temperatures are "just right" to comfortably keep the windows open... the rest of the time, you either have the heat or A/C on (the 2 perfect weeks in spring usually has too much pollen).

I've lived a few years in Thailand, and it takes time to:
1. learn to surrender to the heat. You can't fight the heat like you fight the cold.
2. let your blood thin out. After a few years, your blood thins out to help radiate away heat. You also eventually fine tune your perspiration so you can stay slightly moist and somewhat cool without dripping buckets.

Then I moved to the Pacific NW, which is usually wet and cold by New England standards. We eventually learned:
1. most people have an internal energy that just keeps them going
2. more layers of clothing is the norm - socks and sweaters stay on indoors. But the clothing also comes off at a lower threshold too (>60 F is T-shirt weather!)
3. wet = cold; dry = warm was the mantra for camping back in New England, but that pretty much goes out the window in the PacNW. Your body temperature just is what it is and you stay nihilistically detached from it.

So I'd say it's more about expanding your range than it is about trying to recreate the conditions of your childhood. Maybe head out to a Korean sauna sometime and see how long you can spend in the different rooms (cold, hot, sweltering, etc.), and see what you can do to adjust to each extreme. Yes, constant climate control has narrowed our range, but it doesn't take that much self-training to push the envelope back out again.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[Mr D from 63]

There is a genetic difference when it comes to sweating;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Re:Need a conditoning study

[iMadeGhostzilla]

Another anecdote for your hunch -- I have a friend who when he was around 13 decided (for unknown reasons) to condition himself to living in cold environment. He'd take baths in cold water, walk barefooted in his unheated room in the winter and so on. For the past 30 years he's been much more tolerant to cold than the rest of us, for example he'd just wear a sweater outside in the snow, and he seems to be in good health.

I believe we are adaptable even when we get older, though of course less so.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[Anonymous Coward]

And we are fat compared to the Japanese on average. We are much better insulated with fat which is most likely why we prefer it colder.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[Anonymous Coward]

Living in a climate with very warm summers and cold winters always convinces me that it doesn't take that long to acclimate to the temperature. In the spring when it is 60 degrees people are putting on shorts and tossing the warm layers. After a warm summer when it is 60 in the fall people are hibernating. You just get used to the warmer temps. Same with the cold.

Re:Need a conditoning study

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm a completely European descended white American, who group up in the hot as hell deep south (bedroom 80+ degrees at night), but it was also slightly cold indoors (55 to 65 degrees F) in the winter. It was always too hot in my room in the summer... my brother and I used to wait till nobody was looking (in bed) and cool off in front of the window unit on the other side of the house and then try to fall asleep. We slept fine in the winter, but it was hard to get us out of bed. I was a thin kid, and while I enjoyed playing outdoors 8+ hours a day in the summer during 95 degree F hot and humid weather, I could not sleep well in the heat.

Fast forward 30 years later... I'm no longer thin, but I still don't much like sleeping in the heat. Actually I despise it. When I visit my wife's family in Japan, I can deal with winter, but can barely sleep/ am really hot in the summer because they barely use heating or cooling in doors. But in trains and cars it was not the case, I was always too hot in the winter when they used heating in vehicles.

My son "got my genes". He is 7, thin as can be, but very active. He regularly sits around... OK he doesn't stop moving for long... the house in nothing but underwear when it is 65 degrees inside during the winter. When we try to get him to put something on he says he is too hot. Outside in the winter, he can run around in shorts and a t-shirt when it is 50 to 55 degrees no problem. My daughter is more moderate in this sense.

Despite there being a huge amount of "getting your body used to" temperatures, I figure there also comes a point where it's mostly genetic. From recent genetic tests I'm about 45% British, 40% German/surrounding areas, and 15% Scandinavian. After reading up on common high calorie foods in European roots, the fact that Europeans evolved to digest cow milk, etc., it seems that European ancestors I'm related to, when healthy and active, must have turned a lot of calories into heat during the winter. I've seen on TV shows that Eskimo type people living in super harsh cold weather eat insane amounts of calories to produce heat. I see an article saying average daily caloric intake for a certain Eskimo group is 3500 to 4000. Page 2: http://ajcn.nutrition.org/cont...

I am willing to bet most Japanese have evolved to eat less calories and just bundle up more in the winter. They definitely like it much warmer.

Global Fattening

[mentil]

If true, that may help explain why the southern US has more obesity than the north, aside from obvious education/income/cultural factors. It also would imply that global warming would lead to global fattening, which has already been seen.

Re: Global Fattening

[Anonymous Coward]

It's now called "weather instabilisation", not "global warming". GW is the description we used in the 80's, is just a part of the problem and is only true in some parts on Earth (not global).

To the ripe old age of 28-35.....

[Anonymous Coward]

Seriously, how can a claim like this even be taken seriously when no one normally lived even a quarter as long as the people do today compared to 1000 + years ago?

University of Bonn

[Timosa]

German researches found already similar clues about brown fat. At home my work room temperature has been around +15C (59F) during winter, just to cut heating costs of the old house. It's great to see, that it's not the only benefit.

bad design

[rewindustry]

it's not the cold, it's the things you do to escape it, that make you sick. your buildings and carriages are sealed up like tupperware, into which you blow hot air, usually loaded with moisture. convection heating is cheap and easy, a very low budget way of making people feel warm. proper radiant heating and healthy fresh air are expensive and difficult to maintain. of course, you could just dress for the weather, but most of you don't.

i can't breathe in your world, i drown in my own perspiration every time i get on a bus, go shopping for groceries.

it was minus two here, and dropping, the last i looked, and my windows are open wide, as they always are, year round.

the air tastes like fresh water.

Re:bad design

[Anonymous Coward]

it was minus two here, and dropping, the last i looked, and my windows are open wide, as they always are, year round.

the air tastes like fresh water.

At minus 2 with the windows open, the taste you're getting is probably snot from your running nose.

Sorry to say you've confused the taste of fresh water over the years, and this is also very likely the reason you haven't gotten many repeat requests from your dinner guests.

Re:bad design

[Anonymous Coward]

He may be a yeti and the guests were dinner.

Re:bad design

[david_thornley]

Minus 2. Would that be about 271 or 253 kelvins?

Ocean

[MrKaos]

Jump in the ocean, in the middle of summer and let it take the heat out of you. Even better if you can swim, tread water and catch waves - you will feel incredible - that is why I love (and fear) the ocean.

Re:Ocean

[PPH]

I swim for exercise. Lakes in the summer, pools during the winter. But the local health club pool has been cranking the heat up gradually (about 84F) to accommodate the non-swimmers. As a result, any extended physical exertion is quite uncomfortable. There is some physiological effect that throttles back your metabolism to prevent overheating your core. At about 76F, its a bit chilly jumping in initially. But once you get moving, the heat generated in your muscles equals the rate of loss and the temperature becomes comfortable. And you can exert yourself more, which was the whole point anyway.

"One study found" that another study is full of sh

[Anonymous Coward]

it.

gain fat

[blogagog]

"when people cool their bedrooms from 75 degrees to 66 degrees, they gain brown fat..." I don't really want to gain fat of any color. I'm pretty good at that no matter the temperature.

Need a conditoning study

[Anonymous Coward]

I think you are on to something. I do have another anecdote to add.

- My home was heated, but my bedroom formed ice on my bed (yes the matress actually froze to the wall). I was sick almost all the time. really.
- I'm cold nearly all year long in Canada, inside or out.
- I have friends that are similar. One has moved to the Carribean for the heat, and really thrives there too. The others complain like me.
- I prefer desert environments (dry, hot 40 degrees C (105 F)) and I do much better there.

I think this study may be revealing something that is more about what people are used to, than what is 'best'. To me, whatever climate that you actually *do* things in, is the climate you should be in. If you go to a hot climate and stop moving, then it is not 'good' for you. If you are trapped in a cold climate and stop moving, then it is not 'good' for you.

I don't think it is imprinting per se, but maybe a kind of pre-disposition.

I'm cold now. it is probably around 26C (78F).

All they are saying is that people that are in the south of spain are fatter. Go to Morocco, and I suspect the over-weight thing disappears. The correlation is meaningless.

Benjamin Franklin felt so

[mbone]

Benjamin Franklin certainly felt that colder was better. He slept with the window open even in the dead of winter (seriously annoying his travel mates when they had to share rooms in crowded Inns).

I knew she was wrong.

[dohzer]

I knew mum was wrong when she told me to go easy on the air conditioning.

Garbage title

[Anonymous Coward]

Having a bigger dick may be good for your sex life.

Warmth

[Retron]

There's been a marked trend here in the UK for people to have warmer and warmer houses. The thermostat in mine's set to 18C (64F), as it has been for the last 30 years. Meanwhile my friends' houses get warmer and warmer - up to 25C in some cases (77F). There's a perinneal struggle in the office at work too, with my preference for the temperature to be set to 18C, while the boss would rather have 25C. So we have a compromise of 22C, which is still warmer than the neighbouring IT classrooms (yes, I work in a school). Those classrooms are set to 19C or 20C.

Re:Warmth

[tlhIngan]

There's been a marked trend here in the UK for people to have warmer and warmer houses. The thermostat in mine's set to 18C (64F), as it has been for the last 30 years. Meanwhile my friends' houses get warmer and warmer - up to 25C in some cases (77F). There's a perinneal struggle in the office at work too, with my preference for the temperature to be set to 18C, while the boss would rather have 25C. So we have a compromise of 22C, which is still warmer than the neighbouring IT classrooms (yes, I work in a school). Those classrooms are set to 19C or 20C.

Dang, that's warm. I'd have to have fans going if 25C was the standard temperature (I still have a fan at my desk because the office is that warm at 22C). A lot of people dislike it because they get cold but I have to have the fan or I end up hot and sweaty.

Heck, now that's below zero outside, the office is cool enough I can turn the fan off.

Re:Warmth

[godrik]

I don't know in the UK, But most heating systems I saw in the US are terrible. Typically based on air conditionning with a single thermostat placed right over the main air arrival. Which means that if you set it to 70F, you get 70F at the center of the house and a gradient of temperature toward the walls and windows. And when it is 20F outside, you feel your pain. Also the thermostat is often ancient which means that the accuracy of the things has certainly decrease significantly over the years...

My mother in law still has not understood that and insist her house to be set at 65F. except that by the window, it is closer to 50F.

Not obese != healthy

[Anonymous Coward]

Life expectancy for inuits is still about 65 years, over a decade less than in general population (Inuit lifespan stagnates while Canada's rises). Diabetes is more common among them than in general population, too.

There are many factors that contribute to this (access to health care, etc.) and I don't claim to be expert in the subject. Still, I'd be quite hesitant to look at them as an example of healthy lifestyle or something.

Re:Not obese != healthy

[tomxor]

That depends on your definition of a healthy life, you are arguing that health is equal to longevity. Other people myself included, would define a healthy life as a disease free one that does not necessarily maximise longevity... but i will forgive you as you correctly used a falsy comparator :P

Re:Not obese != healthy

[Anonymous Coward]

Life expectancy for inuits is still about 65 years, over a decade less than in general population (Inuit lifespan stagnates while Canada's rises). Diabetes is more common among them than in general population, too.

There are many factors that contribute to this (access to health care, etc.) and I don't claim to be expert in the subject. Still, I'd be quite hesitant to look at them as an example of healthy lifestyle or something.

The Inuit suffer from diabetes like the Native American tribes in the USA for one reason, they've adopted a western diet based in grains and sugar from their traditional diet which is lower in carbohydrates than the world average.. Sorry to be another low carb fanatic, but time and time again a "healthy" diet according to the USDA isn't healthy.

Re:Not obese != healthy

[Anonymous Coward]

Innuit also eat an incredibly fat rich diet.

most folks would gag if they tried to eat whale blubber.

Old Ben surely conspired with Captain Hook.

[Anonymous Coward]

after all...

what else is new

[prefec2]

Honestly, 20ÂC (68F) in normal lifing space and 16/18ÂC (60/64.4F) for the bedroom are already communicated for decades as a good environment. So what is new?

On a side note: I know Slashdot is an US based site.However, Fahrenheit is only used in the US and some territories where you go for holidays. Is it so impossible to at least add the celcius values in brackets?

Re:what else is new

[nadass]

Re: inclusion of Celcius...

That requires math, or at least basic arithmetic skills. American education does not consider such basic skills relevant to their future workforce. That guy who stepped onto a pebble that one time (300 years ago) to be the first man to set foot on American soil, however, is required knowledge.

FWIW, English language skills are also optional; however, biased support for American football is strongly encouraged.

Re:what else is new

[Njovich]

Or just spend 5 minutes to get acquainted with Fahrenheit and never have to be annoyed with people not including Celcius ^^

Re: what else is new

[prefec2]

Obviously I am able to translate Fahrenheit in Celcius. However, it is an extra effort everyone has to do who lives not in the US. Therefore, it would be more helpful to the readers if the authors could just make that translation. If it takes only 5 min for Fahrenheit it could not be that much more difficult to go in the other direction. On a side note: 6.5 billion people live in a metric/celcius world and only 0.5 billions (or less) live in a body parts/Fahrenheit world. This is 13:1 if you need it in a relation.

Re:what else is new

[N1AK]

It'd take people 5 mins to get acquanted with any number of outdated and replaced measurements it doesn't mean that they either desire to or should. When I give monetary values on here I tend to give them in US$ rather than GBP because it's an international forum and dollars provide better context. Thoughtful people communicate in ways that help others understand...

Re:what else is new

[Anonymous Coward]

That requires math, or at least basic arithmetic skills

I take it you have forgotten how to Google "66f in c".

Re:what else is new

[mrbester]

Fahrenheit is still used (unofficially) in UK, along with pounds, stones (and hundredweight); inches, feet, yards, chains, furlongs and miles; Gas Marks; guineas etc.

Re:what else is new

[itzly]

It takes 1 minute for the author to write temperature in both scales. It takes N*1 minute for N readers to do the conversion.

Re:what else is new

[xaxa]

Fahrenheit is still used (unofficially) in UK, along with pounds, stones (and hundredweight); inches, feet, yards, chains, furlongs and miles; Gas Marks; guineas etc.

Fahrenheit is used much less than pounds/stones or inches/feet/yards/miles, including unofficially. Many -- very possibly most -- old people use Celsius, and the BBC weather forecast (on TV) hasn't given temperatures in Fahrenheit for many years.

Re:what else is new

[prefec2]

According to wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F... Fahrenheit is used in the Bahamas, Belize, the Cayman Islands, Palau, and the United States and its associated territories of American Samoa and the U.S. Virgin Islands (except Puerto Rico and Guam, with the former predominantely using Celsius and the latter equally using Celsius and Fahrenheit). Canada retains it as a supplementary scale that can be used alongside Celsius.

True in the UK, they also "use" it unofficially which does not stop them to post it also in Celcius.

This still results in almost everyone uses Celcius while the US and some other minor territories use Fahrenheit. With approx 7 billion people on earth and only 0.4-0.5 billion Fahrenheit users make this a 13:1 - 16.5:1 relation. We have been told that the US is an innovative country so why are they not able to switch to or at least acknowledge that the metric system is everywhere else. One acknowledgement would be on an international website to use (at least) both scales.

Re:what else is new

[operagost]

American public education does not consider such basic skills relevant to their future workforce

FTFY

Re:what else is new

[operagost]

How about, because we are used to it on a daily basis, and don't think other people should tell us what we can use?

Re:what else is new

[prefec2]

How innovative of you. On the same "we are used to it" basis nobody would have bought a car, because horseless carriages are also only new and we are not used to them. However, this is all beside the point. You can stay with your historic measurement units, but when writing news for an international auditorium it is a good idea to use metric measures otherwise they all have to calculate the flipping values for themselves just because the author was too lazy or too arrogant or both which perfectly supports the image of the US outside the US. Maybe you want to change that and acknowledge that there are other cultures and people outside of the US bubble.

Re:what else is new

[nadass]

Ha! Agreed. (Whereas the private education sector does have its own issues; math certainly isn't one of them.)

Re:what else is new

[Rockoon]

Explain how it is innovative to use what others are already using.

Thats right. You can't. This is because your argument is shit. Both the scales that concern you are arbitrary crap and also unsurprisingly have nothing to do with metric since both the first and last time you have seen the term "Kilodegree Celsius" was just now in this sentence.

When the rest of the world wakes up and starts using some form of natural units instead of arbitrary shit, only then will you have any sort of reasonable leg to stand on with any sort of argument about the unit of temperature being used.

Re:what else is new

[david_thornley]

Could we compromise and just list all temperatures in kelvins?

Re: what else is new

[Dixie_Flatline]

The Celsius scale isn't that arbitrary. The freezing and boiling points of water are well covered. As well, 1 calorie is the amount of energy it takes to heat 1ml (1 cubic centimetre) of water 1 degree Celsius.

Ultimately, everything is arbitrary, sure, but that's a poor argument to put forthâ"some systems are more consistent than others. Use the system with the greatest internal consistency.

Other factors

[Anonymous Coward]

In addition to keeping my house temperature around 55F, I also run several furlongs every fortnight. It saves my tonnes of shielings per annum.

I already do this

[Anonymous Coward]

The gas & electric company can have my money when they pry it from my cold, slim hands!

Re:Being obese

[cheesybagel]

Yeah there are. This story seems kind of bunk to me.

Meanwhile: everywhere else...

[Anonymous Coward]

75 degrees sounds like it would broil more fat.

Body temperature.

[Anonymous Coward]

It is said that "warm blooded animals use up to 25% of their daily calories to keep their body temperature constant".

So, to lose weight, I try to keep my bedroom as cold as possible. Use as little blankets as possible. When you wake up "cold" during the night, that means your body has already been burning fat trying to keep warm for about an hour. It makes a noticable difference in the effort I otherwise have to spend in maintaining or losing weight.

Just to clarify

[jandersen]

... 75 degrees to 66 degrees, ...

When the article talks about temperatures, they are of course referring to the Kelvin scale, not Celcius, hence the numbers that looks a bit on the high side. (*BING* *BING* Alert: You Have Witnessed A Joke *BING* *BING*)

Re:Just to clarify

[Anonymous Coward]

Bullshit. If they meant Kelvins, they would not have said "degrees." Kelvins are not degrees.

Re:Just to clarify

[Anonymous Coward]

Once again for the stupid:

(*BING* *BING* Alert: You Have Witnessed A Joke *BING* *BING*)

maybe that explains

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

why it's always so cold in our Enterprise Command Center...it must be part of out new Employee Health benefits!

tropical thailand

[Anonymous Coward]

Thais still walk a lot. (no wonder with the bangok traffic jams). Rice, veggies, and fish is very light diet. White bread is almost non existant, as is cheese. Dairy products in general are kinda missing. Hot spices also help burn calories (there is research on this).

Yay! Statistics!

[Anonymous Coward]

people who live in warmer parts of Spain are more likely to be obese than people who live in the cooler parts

People who live in the warmer parts of Spain have a very different diet from those who live in the cooler parts. In the warmer Spain they abuse fried stuff and high carb food. In cold Spain stews and fish are common. Also, people in the warmer Spain are more inactive and generally carry a more sedentary lifestyle than people in colder regions. I'm betting diet and physical activity have much more to do with obesity than temperature.

Re:Yay! Statistics!

[pjt33]

I wish the article said something about which parts of Spain, because with the exception of the Pyrenees it doesn't really make sense to talk about the "warmer parts" versus the "cooler parts". There are the parts which have much more seasonal variation - and so are warmer in summer and cooler in winter - and the parts which are more moderate all year round. This is influenced by altitude and proximity to the coast, so probably also has a good correlation with humidity. And I'm sure there are even more confounding factors which could be added to the list.

Re:Yay! Statistics!

[Anonymous Coward]

No, not really. While there are parts (in the inner peninsula) where you find a lot of seasonal variation, as you mentioned, you can measure the mean temperature per region, you'll see clear differences. Also, northern and northwestern regions are way cooler than any other region (with maximums 10-15 degrees lower than warmer regions and minimums up to 15-20 degrees lower). The Mediterranean coast (and Canary Islands) show less temperature variation and extremes, but the Cantabrian coast has lower average temperatures. If you visit the southern country you'll experience maximums over 40 degrees in almost any city during most of the summer; in Burgos or Pamplona, you won't be over 32 for more than a couple weeks in July (if at all), while August is a relatively cold month there (under 18 degrees around sunset).

Huh? What is the point of this?

[Anonymous Coward]

We've known for longer than I have been alive that it is healthier, for example, to sleep in a slightly chilled room under blankets rather than a warm room. Open the window a crack, if needed.

Also, fuck that. I can't get my bedroom below about 74 or so in the summer and in the winter, anything under about 75 is too damn cold.

To the ripe old age of 28-35.....

[Anonymous Coward]

People today live to a maximum of approx. 100. So you're saying no-one lived to more than 25 a thousand years ago? I call BS. Most (not all, but most) of the "increase" in life expectancy is due to decreases in infant mortality rather than some magic 400% increase in the life expectancy of the average 5 year old.

Re:Being obese

[Anonymous Coward]

You don't believe in brown fat because there are obese Eskimos? That's some logic. Of course ambient temperature isn't the only factor that controls metabolism.

Coder

[rastos1]

Am I the only one reading it as Being a Coder May Be Good For Your Health?

Re:Coder

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope. Had to go back and re-read the title when the body didn't match what I thought it said.

How do people survive at 75 degrees?

[loufoque]

Isn't that near the boiling point of water?

How about using actual units in a "scientific" article?

Re:How do people survive at 75 degrees?

[deniable]

I'd be happy if they'd specify if 0 degrees is east or north, then I'll know which way to rotate the house.

Is 75 really normal?

[Anonymous Coward]

How many people keep their home/bedroom temperature at 75? I generally keep my house at 70, and set it to 66 overnight. For the record, I am still obese despite sleeping at this temperature.

Incorrect

[buck-yar]

No such thing as brown fat. Its muscle tissue that has its mitochondria uncoupled via thermogenin. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T...

Its how animals survive in frigid environments.

BREAKING NEWS

[king neckbeard]

The body burns fat to stay warm. No shit. It's not as if a calorie being defined as an amount of energy to heat up water or the extensive use of animal fats as fuel could have made that more obvious.

Re:BREAKING NEWS

[itzly]

Most heat is generated in the body as a waste product of doing other stuff. Burning fat as a primary purpose of staying warm is actually pretty rare for adult human cells.

So....

[nospam007]

So, when we call an ultra-thin, almost anorexic actress a cold bitch, we might actually be right?

Re:Being obese

[cheesybagel]

Sure there are different kinds of fat. I just kind of doubt the production of the types of fat is that temperature sensitive.

from 75 degrees to 66 degrees?

[danknight48]

when people cool their bedrooms from 75 degrees to 66 degrees

75'c is cool? And what exactly does a cool 66 degree angle have to do with anything?

An anonymous reader writes:

A typical American writes for other typical American readers:

NB: Written with a hint of sarcasm for the rest of the world to enjoy.

Re:from 75 degrees to 66 degrees?

[PPH]

66 F is cool? That's my daytime t'stat setting (when I'm home). 54 F is my night time house temperature (with a nice, thick comforter).

66 degrees F is cool?

[plopez]

I usually keep my house around 15C (60 F), which is nice and toasty when it is about -20C outside.

Florida Heat

[JimSadler]

Half of the state of Florida stays stinky hot almost 365 days a year. It's 85F outside my door right now. We would need to develope a sleeping box that is well insulated with its own cooler as trying to run an AC to take a home to 66F would bankrupt most people. I usually set my AC at 77F to keep my electric bill at a sane level.

75 in the bedroom?

[operagost]

I would probably sweat to death at 75. I keep the bedroom at 63. That's enough to get cozy under the blankets, but not freeze if you have to get up in the middle of the night. I find it implausible that a large number of people sleep at 75 degrees (except in summer), so dropping that to 66 and remaking at the results is rather academic.

Mentally, though I feel worse.

[azav]

When it's colder, I'm more upset, more irritated and that puts and keeps me in a poor state of mind. A little more paranoid, a little more apprehensive, a little more concerned about being able to stay warm.

In winter times, this is important, because it brings one (me) closer to depression and depression is a big demotivator.

While being colder may be physically better for you, mentally, it can be more of a problem that it is a benefit.

Just my personal 2 cents on the matter adjusted for inflation.

Re:Mentally, though I feel worse.

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm not sure what is your definition of "colder", but for me I begin to be "upset" about the temperature only when it drops below -10 Celsius (14 Fahrenheit). If it's sunny and without winds, then the limit is about -15 Celsius (5 Fahrenheit). This morning it was -14 without winds and although I admit I did put on a tuque and gloves, I would qualify that temperature as "refreshing" but certainly not "cold".

On the other side of the scale, I feel clearly irritated when someone insist in setting the room temperature to 25 Celsius (77 Fahrenheit) during winter.

Re:Mentally, though I feel worse.

[volmtech]

You may be suffering from seasonal affective disorder (SAD). Short winter days mean less sunlight. Look up light therapy. I suffer from the opposite problem. On long summer days it gets dark so late I can't get enough sleep before it gets bright again. I tried blacking out the windows but them my wife gets depressed.

Units?

[PPH]

Centigrade, Farenheit or Kelvin?

Its not just making the room colder

[laoseth]

My younger brother was actually one of the test subjects in this study. One thing that isn't mentioned in the source article, but is mentioned in here http://www.nih.gov/researchmat... is that all the subjects got to sleep in at night was a thin bedsheet, and a hospital gown to sleep in. He said the cold month was pretty miserable, especially towards the beginning. Its not like turing your heat down to 62 and then sleeping under a down comforter, it is basically being miserably cold, forcing your body to produce fat to allow you to keep enough heat to actually sleep.

Re:So there's this young penguin. One day,

[Anonymous Coward]

No he is a polar bear!

Minnesota's Fat Bottom Girls

[thejuggler]

I live in Minnesota, the land of Winter Snow and Ice. We have 8 months (9 really) of wonderful glorious winter!

In Saint Paul, MN we celebrate winter with a Winter Carnival, Torch light parades, ice sculptures and occasionally an Ice Castle!

Don't get me wrong, Minnesnowta does have summer too! Last year it fell on a weekend and everyone was happy about that.

All I'm saying is if Fat Bottom Girl's make the world go around then Minnesota is spinning like a top. So this story about the cold making us thinner can't be true. Just say'n.

Stay Calm and put another log on the fire!

Re:Minnesota's Fat Bottom Girls

[Anonymous Coward]

Stay Frosty my friend! Your story makes me feel good about living in "Crook" County Illinois (aka kindof like Chicago).

We got a whole town up here

[jpellino]

built on the pluses of cold air cures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...

sad

[rewindustry]

you're one of those metal beetle people, aren't you?

Re:sad

[Anonymous Coward]

One of these? Nay.

I am merely someone who appreciates a dinner host who does not confuse sinus effluvia with fresh water.

I suspect that...

[Anonymous Coward]

... Ten to fifteen minutes of moderate exercise in a day would probably be the equivalent of an entire day's worth of discomfort at a temperature below preference.

So if you're measuring health and fitness on the "misery scale," being cold all the time is much higher in misery than exercise, with a comparatively insignificant payoff. It is also more likely that most people who lower the thermostat will simply self-regulate the temperature by putting on more clothes (which is great from an energy efficiency standpoint and surely what we should all be doing, but which will change the conditions so that the subject will fail to lose weight).

The social ramifications of this are disturbing as well, because overweight people are going to try this, put a sweater on, lose no weight, and be even more resistant to the idea of using less energy for climate control.

It's what you get used to

[lightbounce]

During the winter I keep my home at 55 degF and don't even bother with sweaters or other outer wear unless I'm not active (e.g., watching TV). Given that it was -11 degF last night, it makes a big difference in the heating bill. But mostly it's what I prefer.

Re:So there's this young penguin. One day,

[Anonymous Coward]

So my wife comes home from work. I am sitting there comfortable in a 70F room, (22C, I think). My wife comes home sheds all of her clothes except for a thin house dress. Now I have socks, slippers, T shirt and jeans on. She then turns the thermostat to 82F (26C, I think) because she is cold. Further more If the door bell rings I am supposed to answer the door in my skivies? I guess, or maybe I just to have sweat, just becuz? I have not been able to explain or understand this for 15 years. Could it be I have a tiny amount of penguin genes and she does not? Now get this if it is 82F (27C I think) outside & sunny. It is too warm to take the dog to park and sit and watch the dog run around & play. The dog and I think every thing is fine. We both don't get it. The wife is still a mystery the dog and have not figured out. BTW this I have figured out if she wants sexy time the thermostat stays at 71F (21C, I think). BTW I spent a winter with the house temperature set at 55F (15C I think) before I married her. Funny it did not seem cold when I went outside and could spend hours walking around in the snow. Never got the sniffles, and I did not put on the usual 10-12lbs (5kg I think) that winter either. Of course heat lamps in the bathroom and electric blankets are a good thing. I also don't understand women In he work place complaining about it is cold in here. Got short skirt on shirt unbuttoned to the navel and it is 23C. Now I know she ain't cold because she not showing any signs of it (nipples deflated). I think I may be missing something here.

50 degrees eh...

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm from Finland so if I can get my bedroom to stay even at 22 degrees I'm happy.