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How NSA Spies Stole the Keys To the Encryption Castle

Advocatus Diaboli writes with this excerpt from The Intercept's explanation of just how it is the NSA weaseled its way into one important part of our communications: AMERICAN AND BRITISH spies hacked into the internal computer network of the largest manufacturer of SIM cards in the world, stealing encryption keys used to protect the privacy of cellphone communications across the globe, according to top-secret documents provided to The Intercept by National Security Agency whistleblower Edward Snowden. The hack was perpetrated by a joint unit consisting of operatives from the NSA and its British counterpart Government Communications Headquarters, or GCHQ. The breach, detailed in a secret 2010 GCHQ document, gave the surveillance agencies the potential to secretly monitor a large portion of the world's cellular communications, including both voice and data.

56 of 192 comments (clear)

  1. No surprise by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    When you have the money and will technology and people are easy to get

    --
    I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
    1. Re:No surprise by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 2

      Deniability.

      If they steal the keys, there's no public record that they have them.

      If they request them from the corporation, even if they use a national security letter, the corporation can announce that they have been requested, or use a warrant canary to stop confirming that they haven't.

  2. NSA... by tekrat · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Can we all just agree that the NSA is the most nefarious hacking group, the most dangerous and out of control? That they make all the other so called "black hats" look like innocent little babies?

    I think we all need to work together to get rid of this terrible, nasty, unpredictable hacker group -- for the sake of national and international security. They represent a clear and present danger to the future of this country.

    --
    If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
    1. Re:NSA... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      We are the NSA. We are Legion. We do not forgive. We do not forget. Expect us.

    2. Re:NSA... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Hardly, this is their fucking job. I'm glad they did it, and sad that it got publicized.

    3. Re:NSA... by ATMAvatar · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I agree. It is becoming increasingly difficult to consider the NSA as anything other than an extremely well-funded criminal organization.

      --
      "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    4. Re:NSA... by Charliemopps · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You don't seem to get it. No one wants the NSA. The American people have been polled, and overwhelmingly despise the NSA and what it does. Local and state governments have publicly declared their actions criminal, and Congress has overwhelmingly decried their activities. But they're still here and there's literally nothing we can do about it. That should tell you something.

      It's like we're all in a coffee shop, and a man armed with a 12 gauge just barged in to rob the place and demanded we all act normally. Even the cashier is nodding and offering him a latte... but in reality we're all glancing at each other wondering who's going to be brave enough to clock him over the head with their coffee mug first. There's one feeling that I think we've all felt in this country over the past 10yrs or so, and I think that feeling is best described as "Unease"

    5. Re:NSA... by fustakrakich · · Score: 2

      It's like we're all in a coffee shop, and a man armed with a 12 gauge just barged in to rob the place...

      Yeah, in really slow motion, over a four year time period.

      The polls are bullshit. Count the votes. only there will you find what people really think. Everything else is just bad theater.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
  3. How is this even remotely legal? by Jahoda · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Under what possible interpretation of the law can this be considered the actions of lawful government?

    1. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by Kjella · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "We are the law."

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    2. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by Ralph+Wiggam · · Score: 4, Informative

      Gemalto is in the Netherlands. It's entirely legal for the NSA and GCHQ to do anything they want outside of their home countries. They were both chartered 60+ years ago to spy on foreign communications. You can certainly argue that this attack was unethical, or a bad idea, and it was definitely illegal under Dutch law- but it was legal under British and American law.

    3. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by NettiWelho · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Really? Breaking into computer systems is not a crime under British and American law?

    4. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 4, Insightful

      if this is true, then the NSA has blatantly broken law, STOLEN property (intellectual property, that's property, right? RIIIIGHT?) and nullified most of the network and systems security we have tried to put in place over the last 10 or 20 years.

      they also are using fear and intimidation to keep the population in check. ie, they are terrorists. state sponsored terrorists who steal without regard to their actions.

      so, when are they going to be tried for terrorism under the patriot act??

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
    5. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by Ralph+Wiggam · · Score: 4, Interesting

      British and American laws don't have jurisdiction over computers in the Netherlands.

    6. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by BoRegardless · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "We are the law."? No! They invent the law out of thin air. Plus legislators can't be held liable for what they say or vote for in Congress (unless you can prove a bribe or conflict of interest.)

      This is the sort of attitude that eventually destroys institutions from within, though it takes awhile.

      I do tend to agree that secession is inevitable in the US, just as it seems heading in that direction in the EU. What that will do is return some semblance (notice I said some) to States rights and hopefully smaller government, which currently redistributes about 50% of all earnings in the US. That is double what serfs paid in around a thousand years ago.

    7. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by NettiWelho · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Broken what law? Dutch law, I guess, so the Dutch would have to find and arrest them.

      It's not a violation of American law to rob a store in Paris.

      I believe the Netherlands have an extradition treaty with both UK and US.

      What's been done here is a crime in all 3 nations.. Besides, doesnt US consider hacking an act of war?

    8. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by bware · · Score: 4, Insightful

      http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/02/18/0239259/russian-man-extradited-to-us-for-heartland-dow-jones-cyberattacks. The US seems more than willing to extradite and try someone from a foreign country for hacking US computers. It seems likely the US has an extradition treaty with the Netherlands. It seems likely the Netherlands has laws against hacking computers.

    9. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by fustakrakich · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Reverse that. The Netherlands doesn't have jurisdiction over British and American laws. Well, they don't have the weaponry to resist. Might makes right...

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    10. Re:How is this even remotely legal? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      Actually they do. In the EU they can get a European Arrest Warrant for anyone in the UK, including GCHQ staff. They can also investigate crimes that happened in the Netherlands but were committed by people in the UK. International crimes have been going on forever and there are established mechanisms for dealing with them.

      It's a shame that The Intercept has not published the names of those at GCHQ who committed these crimes so that they can be brought to justice. They have clear evidence of criminal activity and yet are protecting the criminals from prosecution under the law.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  4. Rainbow tables by ArchieBunker · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Is this a big deal considering we already have the GSM rainbow tables?

    --
    Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    1. Re:Rainbow tables by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      GSM never used end-to-end encryption, so I don't think anyone should have considered it secure.

      It is a big deal that the US did this to their European allies.

    2. Re:Rainbow tables by IamTheRealMike · · Score: 2

      Rainbow tables only worked for GSM, which is now decades out of date. Most people are going to be connected to 3G or higher in urban areas (i.e. where all the action is), which isn't so easily hacked. Hence their interest. It's in the article, even.

  5. I think people do not understand how deep it is. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's not just about SIM cards.

    Gemalto makes smart card readers etc. Think not just communications, nor banking. Think secure access. We use things like that to ascertain authenticity and inviolability in signed documents, emails etc.

    We used.

  6. Class action lawsuit ? by Alain+Williams · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Should Gemalto be sued by people who use their cards & other products on the grounds that they did not adequately secure their computer systems and thus let in outside crackers to steal the encryption keys ? That the crack was done by GCHQ/NSA does not really alter things -- they were cracked. The point of this is that successful legal, and expensive, action would make all corporates treat security properly; this would have great benefits -- more than just keeping the spooks at bay.

    The only problem is that to sue Gemalto the plaintiffs would need to demonstrate that they have suffered. This might be hard, although insisting that they were all given new SIMs might be a start.

    1. Re:Class action lawsuit ? by Kjella · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So if somebody breaks into your house, steals your car keys and proceed to run somebody over they should sue you for manslaughter? Because you know you could have put those in a safe inside a vault inside a bunker and not in your spare pair of pants. No, what you describe is pretty much the reason the US legal system is what it is and having a ton of good lawyers on staff is a necessity. And it wouldn't really stop the NSA anyway.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
  7. Re:A big surprise by aberglas · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Actually it is surprising. Many if not most large government IT projects are appallingly run. Vast amounts of money wasted on useless consultants that end up producing very little if anything at all.

    As the NSA's budget grows and grows, I suspect this will happen to them. Lots of MBAs that can only organize their own careers, while the crypto-nerds are pushed into the background.

  8. Time to go back to land lines and cash. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    At what point do we start putting these criminals away? They have broken every law on the books.

    1. Re:Time to go back to land lines and cash. by jonwil · · Score: 2

      No, time to go to open source verified-by-security-audit strongly-encrypted VoIP (the kind that at the very least will require the spooks to put a lot of effort into cracking it so they cant just vacuum it all up like they do now) and secure anonymous distributed crypto-currencies that the feds cant easily track (and cant seize as part of a "random" roadside stop on the interstate)

    2. Re:Time to go back to land lines and cash. by BlueStrat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      At what point do we start putting these criminals away? They have broken every law on the books.

      One of the most insidious effects of this sort of Panopticon-level data collection & analysis is that it works as well against prosecutors, judges, AGs, and even SCOTUS justices, as it does some CEO or key IT admin somewhere they're interested in compromising.

      Parallel construction is blind, therefor the current US justice system no longer is. Along with every other government agency, bureau, department, etc, all the way down.

      Total Information = Total Control

      The US Government is under the control of those who control that information. Even if the target is squeaky-clean, they are perfectly capable of planting things like kiddie-porn or any other convenient data on a hard drive such that it would stand up to the type/depth of forensics used in the typical criminal trial.

      Threatening to leak damaging private information, especially when it involves an elected official right before a(n) (re)election, works without even involving the justice system or making a public scene.

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
  9. Legal, schmeagle by fyngyrz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Under what possible interpretation of the law can this be considered the actions of lawful government?

    Oh, I'm sure they can find something. You can't do anything about it -- you can't sue -- because you don't have standing. You'd have to show they were listening to *you*, just to start with, and then you'd have to have a few million to push it through to the supreme court.

    And *then* of course you'd be facing the same idiots that think "shall not infringe" means "infringe", "intrastate" means "interstate", article 3 means article 5, and that "no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized" means "as long as we think it's reasonable, we can search and seize to our heart's content", and " no ex post facto Law shall be passed" means "retroactive punishment is no problem."

    The only privacy you have at this point is in your own head. Assuming you haven't spoken, written down, or otherwise "shared" your thoughts.

    The system is broken. Badly. And very few care -- we're stuck on this downhill-all-the-way roller coaster ride.

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  10. Re:Remarkable feat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yes well they were at war with Germany. Now the government is at war with - the people?

  11. We are the global village bully by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Veterans Today on February 11, 2015

    Why the United States Always Loses Its Wars

    We are the global village bully that's hated by much of the world.

    America loses all its wars because it seems we've always been on the wrong side of history. Morally nor legally should any nation have the right to invade and occupy another sovereign nation, much less believe it can achieve victory in long, protracted wars.

    Yet in violation of all ethical precepts and all international laws, the sole global superpower citing its impunity through exceptionalism hypocritically insists it can maintain its moral high ground in its relentless pursuit of regime changes anywhere it so chooses on earth. We are the global village bully that's hated by much of the world.

    And it's pure self-aggrandizing bullshit to perpetrate the myth that America is hated because of our "freedom," another rhetorical brainwashing lie. We now live in a fascist totalitarian police state run by a globalized crime syndicate of the central banking cabal. As of last April per a Princeton-Northwestern study the US has officially been designated an oligarchy.

    Last year after a group of ethnic Russians living in Crimea voted to become part of Russia, the Russian military claimed control over its own naval base there that the US-NATO had been lusting to steal after the unlawful overthrow of Ukraine's democratically elected sovereign government.

    Ever since it's been nonstop lies and propaganda propagated to demonize Putin as the aggressor when in fact all along it's the American Empire that's been recklessly pushing what could end up World War III against nuclear powered Russia. With US-NATO missiles installed on Russia's doorstep in virtually every former Soviet eastern bloc nation, hemming Russia in, who's really the aggressor here?

    The WMD lie that was the repeated mantra used as prewar drum beating propaganda to launch a war against humanity in Iraq a dozen years earlier is now being replayed as deja vu all over again to amnesic, dumbed down Americans. Despite defeats in both Iraq and Afghanistan still being dragged out as America's longest running wars in its history, the US-NATO war machine is once again prepping for yet more war raging now in Eastern Ukraine.

    The US government's rush to war hit a minor snag the other day when various European nations like France and Germany announced their opposition and refusal to send arms to the Ukraine government, wanting to give peace talks with Russia a chance. Today's headlines state that Obama has been forced to pause in his arms rush, not unlike the world turning against his rush a year and a half ago for air strikes in Syria after the false flag chemical weapons attack that was actually launched by US backed rebels.

    So it may not be full speed ahead for US Empire to ship its heavy weaponry to the eastern warfront after all. It is being reported that mercenaries speaking American English, Polish, French and Flemish are fighting for the Kiev government in Eastern Ukraine against ethnic Russians who are fighting for their independence, their home and their very survival. And with their backs up against the wall, recently the eastern Ukrainians have beaten back the Ukrainian government forces. Again, the US has a knack for being on the wrong side of history.

    No true victor can emerge from any war on either side. The incessant US aggressor boasting superior firepower as the most deadly, expensive military force on the planet (spending more than the next ten nations combined), America has little to show for itself as it has not won a single war in seventy years!

    Neo-colonialism cloaked in imperialism, balkanization, economic exploitation, debtors' theft, indentured servitude and enslavement can never be justified as the spoils of war. It's a losing proposition in every imaginable way, not only for the aggressive American Empire that keeps starting and losing war aft

    1. Re:We are the global village bully by u38cg · · Score: 2

      I considered moderating this down, but I will reply instead. This is such a warped, confused view of history it's hard to know where to start. However; there is such a thing as a just war, international security is hard, and Russia had and has no right to Crimea or the Ukraine. Iraq WMDs: I remind you that Saddam believed he had WMDs. As for the Lusitania, I would remind you Churchill had his hands full with a minor issue called Gallipoli. And in Syria and Libya, there were no good options, and the situation was not of the West's making; it's difficult to know when a market trader's messy suicide will start a regional revolution.

      --
      [FUCK BETA]
  12. Time to Embargo USA and UK by DavenH · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's what they'd do.

  13. Re:A big surprise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's already sort of the case. The NSA and similar agencies in other countries are LOADED with useless incompetent staff and engineers. It has everything to do with their impossible hiring practices combined with it being a shitty unethical job. They don't even pay super well, and anyone competent can make more in the private sector.

    This makes the whole thing even more scary to me, because being utterly corrupt and not very bright are pretty much absolute requirements for the job. The fact that they get anywhere at all is because they have a huge budget and federal backing to force companies to play along.

    I'm always extremely skeptical of stories that the NSA actually broke something through math. It's way way more plausible that they simply paid someone off on the inside.

  14. Re:Remarkable feat by xaxa · · Score: 4, Informative

    Remarkable feat! Guys from Bletchley Park — who also intercepted and decrypted everything they possibly could — would've been proud...

    These are the "guys from Bletchley Park" -- in the sense that it's the same government organisation.

    "During the Second World War, GC&CS was based largely at Bletchley Park ... GC&CS was renamed the "Government Communications Headquarters" in June 1946"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G...

  15. Re:A big surprise by TWX · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I think the points are though, that first, companies do not do a good job of cybersecurity, or security at all for that matter. This is the issue that allowed another party to gain access to the crypto data for the SIM cards and for other security mechanisms in order to defeat them.

    And second, while the NSA and the British equivalent might be unweildy bureaucratic monsters where those in-charge might not even know what the appendages are doing, they're well-enough funded that they can afford to buy people off to socially-engineer their way in to places where they wouldn't otherwise have the right to go. That gives them the ability to get into corporate networks or to get data from individuals working for corporations; they buy their way in and the consequences of the actions of the employee are not the NSA's concern. All they want/need is the data, and if they can buy it for cash or buy their way in for cash then they might just do that.

    Security is hard. Ultimately it comes down to the individual employee, who has to have access to what he or she works on, but by having that access, also can be a risk. A multimillion dollar system can be compromised by a single technical employee because that employee needs access through those safeguards to do the job. It's really no different than bribing the guards at the castle to get in.

    --
    Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  16. Every company should release their private data by CQDX · · Score: 5, Interesting

    on every US and UK government employee. Let them become life-time victims of identity theft. Let the Chinese and Russian intelligence agencies have a field day. It's the only hope we have that they'll learn.

    1. Re:Every company should release their private data by goodmanj · · Score: 2

      Maybe you didn't hear, but companies do try to make a profit. Throwing your customers to the wolves may not be the simplest way for a company to commit suicide, but it'll do.

  17. Of course... by chill · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why do you think all the recent cell phones that are rated for classified voice, such as the Sectera Edge and Project Fish Bowl all run VoIP for classified communications?

    Because they know better than to trust the commercial telephone networks and their voice "security".

    --
    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
  18. While we are at it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...can we all return the favor by pressuring the government to Grant Snowden Clemency?

    If people don't stand up to protect whistleblowers, then there will be no whistle blowers, and government evil will run unchecked.

    Sign it.

  19. USA! USA USA! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    While I think some of the points, however plausible, are a bit on the side of paranoia, the Libertarians firmly believe that we should have only a defense force and not project power.

    The current rational now for IS - or whatever they are called now - is to fight them over there so they don't come over here. They just want control of the Middle East - they are no threat to us. Also, the Arabs, Persians, Kurds, and other people's of the Middle East have been dealing with their ethnic problems for thousands of years. And of course, being there, we the USA are going to fuck things up even more.

    Unfortunately, we have a populous who treats our military conquests like a football game. USA! USA! win! It makes small people feel big.

    We in the USA are small people who like big guns. We lost the idea of walk softly and carry a big stick.

    We bluster, shoot things up and wonder why other peoples hate us.

    But this football mentality is how you get people to volunteer to fight in idiotic and unjust wars - get the stupid people to die and get maimed for the elite.

  20. Re:A big surprise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    My source.... well... here goes.

    Yes, they actively recruit Math and CS majors with high GPAs. That is true.
    However....
    In order to get in you must:
    1) Pass a preliminary security interview
    2) Pass a polygraph test
    3) Pass a drug test (including for marijuana) - this eliminates a LOT of competent people
    4) Pass a more in-depth security interview ... probably more steps which I haven't mentioned.

    By the time this is all done, about a year and a half has gone by. A bunch more of their potential recruits will be established at a job they want to stay at at this point. The ones who are still seeking work are unemployed after so much time for a reason - often because they're incompetent.

    On top of that, the pool of people morally corrupt enough to even _consider_ working for the NSA is teeny.
    GPA is one predictor of competence at work, but it's not a 100% reliable predictor by any means. There are many people who can breeze through academia but who are utterly useless on any real job. People like this _like_ government jobs where they may get a permanent contract and where no one can judge their level of competence.

    It REALLY is this way. Every single government security agency on the planet has this same problem and the NSA is no different. Competant people do not work there for long. They will lose their minds or end up the next Edward Snowden.

  21. Re:A big surprise by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Actually it is surprising. Many if not most large government IT projects are appallingly run. Vast amounts of money wasted on useless consultants that end up producing very little if anything at all.

    As the NSA's budget grows and grows, I suspect this will happen to them. Lots of MBAs that can only organize their own careers, while the crypto-nerds are pushed into the background.

    Except that this is not an IT project, but an espionage project. It just happened to have an IT component; one very different than the create a web site / database / payroll system project.

    --
    I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
  22. Snowden cared. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And, unlike most of us, Snowden actually did something about it. As a result of his revelations, political pressure is being applied to the government from many different directions to get the situation resolved.

    Of course, it cost Snowden his job, and his ability to live in his own country, and might still land him in jail or worse.

    You could swallow some of that cynicism and at least try to improve things. Maybe ask the government to grant snowden clemency?

    Nah. Why exert the effort to click an online petition when it is so much easier to just bitch about how hopeless things are?

  23. Re:Remarkable feat by mi · · Score: 2

    Yes well they were at war with Germany. Now the government is at war with - the people?

    Who you intercept and who you actually fighting don't have to be the same people. You listen to everybody to find out, who your targets are. This is obvious to all, and the security people — who have huge leeway in interpreting laws — act to perform their mission, which is to keep us safe...

    Now, are we — the rest of society — willing to trade our privacy for these gains in security? Does the freedom being surrendered qualify as essential and the gain — as temporary?

    --
    In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
  24. Where does Snowden get all this information from? by schweini · · Score: 2

    Could someone explain where Edward Snowden is getting these kind of leaks and infos from, so long after he fled the NSA?

    Or was this information, and the other stuff he claimed in the last couple of months, all part of the package he took with him back then?

    If he was sitting on this information, then why wait so long to release it?

    Or does he have a new source 'inside'?

  25. Re:Where does Snowden get all this information fro by AHuxley · · Score: 3, Informative

    Re "If he was sitting on this information, then why wait so long to release it? "
    All the material is now in the hands of the press. The press can release the material in any way it wants or needs to.
    Re "Could someone explain where Edward Snowden is getting these kind of leaks and infos from, so long after he fled the NSA?"
    The material released by the press is long term generational projects staff get read into as they need to work on the same projects or with staff who do.
    Re the how http://www.bbc.com/news/world-... "Edward Snowden: I was a high-tech spy for the CIA and NSA" (28 May 2014)
    "...he said he had worked for the CIA and NSA undercover, overseas, and lectured at the Defense Intelligence Agency."

    --
    Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  26. Re:Counting Alarmist Sheep by AHuxley · · Score: 2

    The problem is tame junk encryption is really open to many ex staff, former staff, other nations, cults, faiths, rich people, political groups, anyone with lots of cash and a few contacts.
    SISMI-Telecom scandal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
    Greek wiretapping case 2004–05 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...–05
    Cell networks have a very low standard of local encryption thanks to weak junk international standards been set over many years. The results can now be see and understood.

    --
    Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  27. Snowden fatigue by goodmanj · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This should either be the biggest news story on the planet, or the biggest lie of the year, but the public response seems to be "meh". The problem is, Snowden stole too much. Or claims to have stolen too much. There have been so *many* earthshattering Snowden revelations that both the outrage and the fact-checking seems to have evaporated.

    This is a big problem either way.

  28. Re:I think people do not understand how deep it is by manu0601 · · Score: 4, Informative

    But on a smart card, asymmetric cryptography can be used. The private key is generated by the chip on user request. It is not supposed to leak outside of the device.

    As I understand, this SIM debacle is only possible because the cryptography used here is symmetric, which means the telephone operator must have a copy of the SIM key.

  29. Re:Any chance of clarification... by Sabriel · · Score: 2

    That's a valid question. I'll try to answer it. Yes, neither act is "theft" in the jargon of the law. But you're asking why people (who aren't lawyers) are treating one as theft and not the other.

    One answer is that "we" (generally) don't feel that there is any strong societal contract with the TV/movie corps, so there's little or no "trust" for the pirates to steal (from that social contract). On the other hand "we" do very much feel that there is - or at least should be - a strong societal contract with the government that purportedly represents us. So any hypocritical action taken by the government feels like a betrayal, a "theft of trust" from us.

    Another answer is "nobody likes a hypocrite, and they like him even less when he punishes others for doing what he does". For an analogy: your coworker loves to quote scripture, but helps themself to the office stationery; your boss loves to quote company policy and fired your coworker, but helps themself to the office pension plan; your senator loves to quote the constitution but voted for free speech zones and civil forfeiture laws before taking a revolving door VP position at your company and fired your boss only to outsource half of your department and walk away even richer when what was left collapsed. Which of these three would you consider assholes, and which would you consider the worst?

  30. What can we do? by wasteoid · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Aside from the feckless fist-shaking at the air, what can the average person really do? Public-key encryption? That gets mentioned every time, and the general consensus is that it's too much work for the average person. Is there any other action that can be taken, or are people just too lazy to care anymore? Maybe there should be more purposeful acts to disrupt the lives of average citizens, to shake them out of their stupor. Wake people up. Perhaps those in power have realized that keeping the populace happy & sedated allows them to do whatever they want. Maybe a full belly and a scratch behind the ears is all we need to become pets to the people running the world now.

  31. Re:I think people do not understand how deep it is by kevinbr · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Gemalto generate a master SIM key with batches of cards shipped to each Mobile Operator. I work on a project for mobile payments, mediated with a STK loaded on each card. A HSM is loaded with all the master keys. If you have the master key, you can decrypt all the communications with the STK app on the SIM card. If the Master key leaks, all payment operations/transactions are fucked.

  32. This info is for us, not the average pleb by afxgrin · · Score: 2

    Considering this audience is pretty much the only one that understands the implications behind these revelations. WE should be the ones raising the issues and getting in the government's face about this, but technologists are notoriously passive when it comes to protesting the government. With that in mind, there's not too much _I_ can do as a Canadian to protest the NSA/GCHQ, but there's definitely the CSE who are one of the "5 eyes" members.

    However the easiest response to mass surveillance is mass encryption, and that doesn't involve standing outside for hours shouting at people who couldn't care less or trying to educate the average person about why this isn't just part of the fight on 'terrorism' but it's a direct assault on all of us. Obviously the entire cell phone network design will need an overhaul after these keys have been leaked, and hopefully the overhaul uses better techniques.