Slashdot Mirror

← Back to Stories (view on slashdot.org)

Stars Form Near Milky Way's Supermassive Black Hole

Posted by Soulskill on from the volatile-real-estate dept.

New submitter Aspiring Astronomer writes: Scientists report that stars have likely formed near the supermassive black hole in the heart of our galaxy. How does this happen, if a black hole exerts so much gravitational force that not even light can escape? Astronomers believe the black hole may actually facilitate the formation of these stars. According to study author Farhad Yusef-Zadeh, the gases and dusts constantly flowing toward black holes compress and heat up, creating enough disturbance to cause the materials to collapse and then form a star. Yusef-Zadeh speculates that in addition to stars forming near black holes, planets may form there, too. The disk around a protostar (a mass of gas and materials that form early in star formation) breaks off into clumps of matter, and when paired with the extreme force of a black hole, may cause the formation whole planets.

32 comments

  1. clarification by buchner.johannes · · Score: 4, Informative

    "How does this happen, if a black hole exerts so much gravitational force that not even light can escape?"
    The stars don't form inside the black hole, so I don't see how that is related. Instead they are at a distance of several light years, where some of the gas that falls towards the center stops (angular momentum; similar gravitational attraction of black hole and galaxy stars). The gas can collapse and form stars. These are called "nuclear star clusters".

    --
    NB: The message above might reflect my opinion right now, but not necessarily tomorrow or next year.
    1. Re:clarification by Duckman5 · · Score: 2

      It's also worth pointing out that gravity decreases with the square of the distance between the objects which is especially significant on a cosmic scale.
      That being said, I still wonder about effects of gravitational time dilation and the odds of very rare things happening (such as life developing). Probably only the stuff of science fiction, but the first thing to pop into my head, nonetheless.

    2. Re:clarification by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Similar mysteries to be solved:
      - How can there be dolphins near an island, since an island is land, and dolphins cannot survive on land?
      - How can there be people near a mountain, since the weight of the mountain is enough to crush people?
      - How can there be birds near a nitrogen tank, since nitrogen doesn't sustain life?

    3. Re:clarification by 50000BTU_barbecue · · Score: 1

      Now THAT was funny!

      --
      Mostly random stuff.
    4. Re:clarification by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "How does this happen, if a black hole exerts so much gravitational force that not even light can escape?"
      God, I'm sick of that particular bit of hyperbole. Escape velocity is sqrt(2GM/r), so once an object is (M) massive enough, the escape velocity is greater than the speed of light. That doesn't make black holes magical, it doesn't make them marauding, all-devouring nomadic cosmic muggers, and it doesn't allow them to pull things in that are too far away to be pulled in; any more than the earth can pull in the moon, or the sun pull in the earth. Orbital mechanics don't suddenly go out the window once a black hole is involved.

    5. Re:clarification by Antique+Geekmeister · · Score: 2

      I'm not sure if you thought about it, but "square of the distance between the objects" only applies to single masses, "point sources" in ordinary Newtonian mathematics. When you look at a spiral shaped galaxy full of stars, and you're measuring the _net_ effects of gravitation and the relative potential energy differences among them and the net forces acting as one enters the actual accretion disk of matter surrounding its core, it can be confusing. Whether it is a black hole isn't the issue, the effect I refer to exists whether or not the core is a black hole or a simple mass of starts. In effect, the accretion disk can lessen the gravitational effects of the core, especially tidal effects if the accretion disk is dense. It's an old calculus problem to understand that, inside a torus, the gravitational effect is to pull one towards the side of the torus unless one is _exactly_ in the center.

    6. Re:clarification by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, LOLZ

    7. Re:clarification by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Obviously you have never watched a Hollywood film...

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    8. Re:clarification by MisterToad · · Score: 1

      Very good! It is very disappointing to see such over-generalizations

      --
      Dick
  2. When? by hcs_$reboot · · Score: 0

    Scientists report that stars have likely formed near the supermassive black hole in the heart of the our galaxy

    TFS doesn't give any time indication. Since it seems to be some breaking news, was that yesterday? Thursday?

    --
    Slashdot, fix the reply notifications... You won't get away with it...
  3. Correction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Alleged by pot-smoking-hippies super-massive black hole.

  4. Thought Experiment by Ukab+the+Great · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Scientists used to believe that no life would exist at the bottom of the sea around hydrothermal vents do to the kack of light, high heat, and toxic chemicals. Then they visited the hydrothermal vents in subs and found them teeming with all sorts of crazy life, violating their expectations in the most extreme way possible. Perhaps the same holds true for planets near supermassive black holes. And that that's where most of the life is in the galaxy. And that Earth is a bunch of intra-galactic hicks living out in the sticks. Which is why we haven't found any evidence of extra-terrestrial life yet.

    1. Re:Thought Experiment by Aspiring+Astronomer · · Score: 5, Informative

      What an interesting theory! I have very limited knowledge of space and black holes, as this was my first submission (and it made the front page - whoohoo!), and I am still in high school. I do, however, plan to continue studying astronomy throughout high school and eventually in college. So, plan on seeing more submissions from me as my knowledge grows! :)

    2. Re:Thought Experiment by Billly+Gates · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Also when people think of super massive black holes they think of violent, scary, life suckling masses. Compared to the smaller ones they are tamer as they have such a great surface area that stars near there can stay for away from the event horizon for billions of years due to subtripical force and the fact gas gets pulled from great distances

      --
      http://saveie6.com/
    3. Re:Thought Experiment by Mal-2 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Scientists used to believe that no life would exist at the bottom of the sea around hydrothermal vents do to the kack of light, high heat, and toxic chemicals. Then they visited the hydrothermal vents in subs and found them teeming with all sorts of crazy life, violating their expectations in the most extreme way possible. Perhaps the same holds true for planets near supermassive black holes. And that that's where most of the life is in the galaxy. And that Earth is a bunch of intra-galactic hicks living out in the sticks. Which is why we haven't found any evidence of extra-terrestrial life yet.

      The problem with this is a simple matter of time. The stars thus created don't have the luxury of billions of years, or tens of billions of years in the case of lower-mass stars than our sun, to evolve complex life. It would also be a problem that, if they were to survive long enough to evolve a space-faring civilization, they would need to find a way to carry the escape velocity from the black hole in addition to all of the other energy necessary just to get away from their home planet.

      --
      How is the Riemann zeta function like Trump rallies? Both have an endless number of trivial zeros.
    4. Re:Thought Experiment by circletimessquare · · Score: 1

      imagine a life and civilization evolving, looking out at their immediate galactic neighborhood, becoming aware that this weird night sky shape that their ancient ancestors worshiped is a supermassive black hole... and then growing an awareness of what that means for their future

      how depressing

      --
      intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
    5. Re:Thought Experiment by NoZart · · Score: 1

      They would sing songs about life, love and the obliteration of all life in the universe ;)

    6. Re:Thought Experiment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is thought that the center of the galaxy is hostile to life as we know. So save your depression for a rainy day.

    7. Re:Thought Experiment by circletimessquare · · Score: 1

      "life as we know" is only life on earth. that's a sample size of one. not a useful guide for the kinds of life that might exist or that we should expect is out there

      --
      intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
    8. Re:Thought Experiment by wjcofkc · · Score: 2

      To mod or comment..?

      Comment.

      If you are new around here and plan on coming back I suggest you spend quite awhile looking over stories and their comments from years past. This place has it's own... You'll figure it out.

      --
      Brought to you by Carl's Junior.
    9. Re:Thought Experiment by Yggdrasil42 · · Score: 1

      subtripical force?

      I guess you mean stars can survive for a long time due to the balance between the centripetal force exerted by the black hole (pulling the star towards the center of its orbit) and the centrifugal force exerted by the circular motion of the start around the black hole (apparently pushing the star away from the black hole but actually just inertia trying to make the star follow a straight path).

    10. Re:Thought Experiment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Scientists used to believe that no life would exist at the bottom of the sea around hydrothermal vents do to the kack of light, high heat, and toxic chemicals.

      Citation?

    11. Re: Thought Experiment by Godwin+O'Hitler · · Score: 1

      it's obvious you have no attitude whatsoever for it

      It's obvious you are the one with the attitude.

      --
      No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
  5. Misleading summary... again by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

    This is NOT a report. This is not based on observation, either direct or indirect. This is simply a claim based on a theoretical paper providing a theoretical explanation of how this could happen (if the author's theory is correct).

    --
    #DeleteChrome
    1. Re: Misleading summary... again by stevedog · · Score: 1

      From TFA... "But the new study details observations of low-mass stars forming within reach of the galactic center. The findings lend support to the argument that "adult" stars observed in this region formed near the black hole." I didn't dig into the study that the article itself was referencing, but at the very least the summary was an accurate representation of the article. Or were you just trolling?

  6. Real Experiment by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 2

    imagine a life and civilization evolving, looking out at their immediate galactic neighborhood, becoming aware that this weird night sky shape that their ancient ancestors worshiped is a supermassive black hole... and then growing an awareness of what that means for their future

    Imagine a life and civilization evolving, looking out at their immediate galactic neighbourhood, becoming aware that this glowing ball of light that their ancient ancestors worshiped is a star... and then growing an awareness of what that means for their future in a couple of billion years when it has heated up enough to terminate all life on their planet.

    We don't need to do a thought experiment because we are in almost exactly the same predicament. It might be a couple of billion years rather than a few tens of millions but frankly it doesn't matter either way: on those timescales either we develop the technology to solve the problem or we go extinct. Besides I'd expect any planet close enough to the accretion disk to see it as a disk with the naked eye will be getting fried by the high energy x-rays it emits which is how we detect black holes from half way across the galaxy or even further.

  7. had this idea for quite some time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0Bx_U1ZOH86cWNUhuYTh5NFIxdkU/0Bx_U1ZOH86cWfm5COWdsMjFtc01KcHRQNXRnR2swRDB6QU1Kc0U1T0tRSU9wYmhiYkZ3X3c

  8. Interstellar comes to mind by vikingpower · · Score: 1

    I'm going to re-watch that movie with renewed interest :-)

    --
    Religous speak to God. Insane are spoken to by God. When all shut up, one can finally hear Shostakovich in peace
  9. "Perling" effect by sansprivacy · · Score: 1

    I can see that given the forces associated with a black hole..