Windows 10 Will Be Free To Users Who Test It

An anonymous reader writes: Microsoft has been making a big push to change its business model for Windows — likely due to the low/no cost updates you can get for competing operating systems. The company surprised everyone when it said legit copies of Windows 7 and 8 would be supplied with free upgrades, but now they're extending that even further: anyone who tests the Windows 10 Technical Preview will get a free upgrade to the full version of Windows 10 when it comes out. In a blog post, Microsoft's Gabe Aul said, "As long as you are running an Insider Preview build and connected with the [Microsoft account] you used to register, you will receive the Windows 10 final release build and remain activated. Once you have successfully installed this build and activated, you will also be able to clean install on that PC from final media if you want to start over fresh."

Comments

But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[Anonymous Coward]

Will I get Windows 10 Ultimate??

Re:But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[Anonymous Coward]

> Will I get Windows 10 Ultimate??

Yes, you will. As a punishment.

Re: But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually that's a good question. Do you get to keep the more advanced version when you upgrade?

Re:But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[penguinoid]

Do you have a little nag icon on your taskbar that says, "Get Windows 10"?

Re:But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[Brad1138]

No, I managed to get rid of it.

Re:But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[Anonymous Coward]

Do you have a little nag icon on your taskbar that says, "Get Windows 10"?

CTRL-ALT-DEL, Task Manager, GWX.exe kill, wave mouse over icon. Poof.

Re: But I pirated Windows 7 Ultimate

[Type44Q]

When I saw the headline, I immediately thought "Buy that'll be everybody who runs it...!"

So that means it's free to everyone

[JoeyRox]

Because we've all been beta-testing Windows since forever.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[jasmusic]

Because we've all been beta-testing Windows since forever.

Wait till someone lets you in on the secret of Linux.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Xicor]

nope... ive been testing the windows 10 preview, but it completely bricked itself... it will take a full reinstall. ive been using linux instead. pretty sure the system wont realize that ive been testing it and give me a free copy. that being said, i still have the free copy from my school.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Ol Olsoc]

Because we've all been beta-testing Windows since forever.

Wait till someone lets you in on the secret of Linux.

Wait until you get your refund from Linux.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

only if you install windows 10 preview and give in to the online requirement and link your windows to a microsoft account. sorry, microsoft, no thank you.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

only if you install windows 10 preview and give in to the online requirement and link your windows to a microsoft account

That might be because it's a tech preview explicitly meant for people who are willing to test it. Reporting back information to Microsoft is the entire fucking point.

Windows 10 RTM will have no such requirement.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

I tried installing it, but it didn't have my network drivers available, and required I sign in or create a Microsoft account before I could use my computer. So I put Windows 7 back on. I typically use Debian but still use Windows for games.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, you're right. All of that UI stuttering and lag in Android was a bit too much of a learning curve.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[echnaton192]

I would vote you up if I had modpoints today.

The upgrades from the full systems pop up whether the useraccount is linked to the microsoft account or if you simply created a user on Windows 7.

And yes, if someone signs up specifically for a beta program were every click is analyzed and any feedback linked to an account I think it is OK to get the free copy connected to that account. Because this copy is free (as in beer, but not as in speech).

It does not upgrade a bought copy. The alternative would be that every installation of the beta gets a free copy, even if the user did not participate in the beta program.

I hated MS for diversifying the directx-bases because every new directx was only available if the user bought the newest windows. They nearly destroyed the pc as a gaming machine in order to push their xbox. They were evil in general and their monopolistic behaviour was illegal. They tried to kill Linux by FUD.

The free copy is the right thing to do to atone for the abomination that was windows 8 or even 8.1 (two different userinterfaces for account settings, nuff said). And a free copy for every one who beta tested seems fair. Even non genuine windows installs get the upgrade, but there will be nagging.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Give it a few more tries. Just the other day, having made no changes to the system, Win10 booted to nothing and did so again. Third time was a charm, and now it's fine. *shrugs*

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[__aaclcg7560]

Been there, done that. Since Windows 3.11, 95, 98, 98SE, 2000, XP, Vista, 7 and 8. Only a fool would have installed Windows ME.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

I haven't bricked one of my own machines since Windows 95. Are you sure it's not a DFO error? The fact you're using Linux would indicates you probably don't know much about Windows.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

At least you're now free from useful apps and games!

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Hamsterdan]

I'd add Vista and 8/8.1 to that. 7 is not that bad, but XP was faster on same hardware. ME? only thing it had for it it rebooted really fast after bluescreening :p

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[ArmoredDragon]

I don't think Microsoft is giving 10 away to appease users of 8. I think they want to avoid 7 turning into another XP where a crapload of users stick with it so it is hard for them to ditch it, and they end up having to support it for 14 years. That will ROYALLY screw up their "Windows 10 is the final Windows" plan, which I *think* means they plan to charge an annual fee for it (the other shoe for Windows' future licensing model has yet to drop, and I think they expect that most people will hate it, but that they'll hate it only after it's already too late.)

However it would be silly to give it to users of Windows 7 but not users of Windows 8, so they're just giving it to both.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

I ran install on 2 personal machines for almost 3 years. NEVER had any problems with ME. In fact, I found it to be more reliable than Windows 98 which loved to occasionally boot up with a video or sound card driver gone AWOL. It's worth noting that I did disable system restore and remove some extra things like Windows Management. To this day, I can't find one asshole on line that trolls about Windows ME yet can name one specific technical problem they had with it, yourself included. Trolls just mention it because it's an easy swipe whose credibility is rarely called into question.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[mrprogrammerman]

It's also the fact they want to get faster adoption of their universal app platform in Windows 10. If there are no users, developers won't develop for it. Giving it away for free helps to increase the user base so developers will consider it. Also they're now going to be able to make money from Win7 users via the app store.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[jazzis]

Is that you pf?

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[davester666]

you got a free copy of Linux? where the hell do you pirate it from?

i've searched everywhere and can't find one anywhere.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Malfuros the Wizard]

Sorry, I work in a restrictive FCA and PCI compliant environment. (Think card processing/banking type environments). I do have Windows 10 running in a secure sandbox, giving it internet access is a PITA, so many hoops. It's already been decided, Windows 10 due to the sheer number of activities it wants to perform which are internet based is too insecure and bleeds too much data to the web to be allowed into our environment. Windows 7 is where we are for the foreseeable future until Microsoft stop chasing the consumer and present corporates with a secure operating system that doesn't want to do everything on the internet. If the final version allows us to disable all that internet crap then we may re-evaluate but until then our minds are made up. Apologies for the wall of text, some filter somewhere on my network appears to be stripping something out.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

That might be because it's a tech preview explicitly meant for people who are willing to test it. Reporting back information to Microsoft is the entire fucking point.
Windows 10 RTM will have no such requirement.

but to get the "free" license of RTM, as the summary is all about, via the technical preview program.. YOU HAVE TO DO IT.. to install the preview, that is, and that microsoft account will no-doubt be tied to your 'free' RTM product key and installation, since the latter requires the former as the qualifier. get a fucking clue, jack.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[dbIII]

They nearly destroyed the pc as a gaming machine in order to push their xbox

The pop-ups and even reboots in the middle of full screen games are finally explained!

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[dbIII]

I think they want to avoid 7 turning into another XP where a crapload of users stick with it so it is hard for them to ditch it, and they end up having to support it for 14 years

Too late. There is only one person in my workplace that wants the tile interface and that's a person that already has it on a home PC. With the change to tiles I suspect a lot of people are going to stay on Win7 just to have a desktop that they are used to (and not the fucking insane idea of invisible controls hidden off screen).

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[lokedhs]

I tried, but SCO didn't want to listen.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Whatever shall I do without those hundreds of websites packaged into their own individual apps and malware?

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Rich0]

Haven't been following it too closely, but I don't really see the new start menu as all that inspiring. I think that Win7 was a genuine improvement over XP. Having an in-focus search box when you hit the start key was actually a bit like having a command line, etc.

All those tiles just make everything appear less distinct and harder to find, and it seems like I'll be able to fit less stuff on my screen.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Hognoxious]

Giving it away for free helps to increase the user base

Can anyone think of another kind of business that does that?

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[wassomeyob]

Only a fool would have installed Windows ME.

I did. About 1000 times. Re-installs.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[wvmarle]

Maybe it's about time for you guys to consider alternatives to Windows? It sounds like it's not exactly the right tool for the job.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

So what you're saying is that a preview version of an operating system isn't going to work in a production environment.

All I can say to that is "duh?"

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

In Windows 8, When you hit the Windows key, you could just start typing, and get the exact same behavior, a search box that acts as a cmd prompt. You just had to deal with the Tile interface.

In Windows 10, when you hit the Windows key, you get teh same behavior as 7 and 8, you start typing and it searches and can act as a command prompt. It just happens in the Start menu again.

Both versions of this have added features compared to 7. In 8, when you searched, it could also search online, so for example on a new install you have forgotten to install notepad++, in Windows 8 you could just search for it, the same way you would if you had it installed, and it would give you a web page to install it.

In 10, you have that same Windows 8 functionality, and you have a digital personal assistant that can also take voice input. Cortana acts similarly to Google Now, can add appointments, notes, look up local movie times, all that jazz, while still doing everything that the search from Windows 7 and 8 could do.

But, in Windows 10, you also have a new interface to Cortana available, that when you click on it, it gives you local news, sports teams you might be interested in, appointments, driving instructions to recent places, as well as places you go frequently.

By the way, Windows 10 includes built in mapping, with downloadable maps from all over the world. So, even if you aren't connected, you can stil find directions on the go.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

If you had actually read up on the free Windows 10 offer, it says you can do a clean install. Even if you didn't, you can always switch your user account to a local account and then close the Microsoft account.

Got any other idiotic claims you want to add?

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Um, with Windows 10, you can just provision it as part of an Active Directory and restrict all of that stuff, just like you did with Windows 7, Vista, and XP, that all wanted to do the same thing.

The only thing requiring online access at that point will be Windows Updates, and as a business, you can opt for just the security updates, no new functionality, and must update something like a year after consumers get a security fix.

Microsoft will tout a number of 8 months, but that is for the fully tested "business" version of a fix, that has been in consumer hands at least 1 and a half to 2 months, which will have been tested by the Insiders for a good 2 months or so.

And any business that is that restricted due to security concerns needs to be as up to date as possible, correct?

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

I installed Windows ME, because that thing ran like a champ on Windows 98 hardware with 16MB of RAM. This was when XP came out and required 32MB starting out, and ran slower on that hardware.

Then XP SP needed more RAM just to install. Until finally 512MB wasn't enough to satisfy it.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[echnaton192]

Haha.

For instance, MS bought the company that was about to make the best looking game at the time for the PC and made it xbox-exclusive for years. And they did a lot of "xbox-exclusives", that would have run better on their own f...ing OS than it would ever on the xbox. An OS people paid for. And considering "pro" and "ultimate" it wasn't that small of an amount.

The the diversification of the installed directx-versions by making the newest directx exclusive to their newest OS was stupid and destructive for the pc as a gaming machine as well. In order to lure some hard core pc gamers to buy their newest OS (we are not that many) they degraded the experience for anybody else. This made the technical game support even more to a nightmare than it was before, when every Windows still supported would get the newest directx.

Oh yes, the xbox-controller is available for windows. But the driver does not even support the f...cking power off button. Switching between wasd and the controller? Go to the menu of the game and switch the controller off or don't be annoyed by the force feedback-vibrations on your desk or take the battery out.

Yes, the decline in pcgames was partly because people don't want to deal with all the hassle before a game starts on a pc. And many are fine with a tablet for browsing the internet, so the pc basis was reduced. But MS did anything it could to make pc games even more frustrating. For short term profits.

But MS is not apple, they mainly sell Software. So I understand that they limit windows 10 to already paying customers or registered beta testers instead of the whole world.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

The point made was that there will be a product key involved. They have to send you that, and they only do that if you preview 10 with a Microsoft account. That being the case, it's a simple matter for then to store which keys went with which account.

Clean installs are irrelevant. Being a local user is irrelevant. If you buy or are given anything online that needs activating with a unique key, it's its origin can always be traced back to you.

If I bought a DVD of Windows and installed it and activated it, they know it was done and (maybe, depending on my mood) where from, but nothing about me unless I choose to tell them.

Try reading the other poster's point before getting all mad and looking dumb doing it.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Black LED]

The point made was that there will be a product key involved. They have to send you that, and they only do that if you preview 10 with a Microsoft account. That being the case, it's a simple matter for then to store which keys went with which account.

Clean installs are irrelevant. Being a local user is irrelevant. If you buy or are given anything online that needs activating with a unique key, it's its origin can always be traced back to you.

Uh, no. You don't have to provide any self-identifying information to create a Microsoft account and local accounts aren't accessible by Microsoft.

Sorry, but you fail. Try again.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Golden_Rider]

Sorry, I work in a restrictive FCA and PCI compliant environment. (Think card processing/banking type environments).
I do have Windows 10 running in a secure sandbox, giving it internet access is a PITA, so many hoops.
It's already been decided, Windows 10 due to the sheer number of activities it wants to perform which are internet based is too insecure and bleeds too much data to the web to be allowed into our environment.

So you based your decision on whether Windows 10 is appropriate for your environment or sends too much information to the Internet on a technical preview which clearly states in the user agreement that it regularly sends usage information about everything back to Microsoft, because it is a technical preview and wants to collect usage data. Got it.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

You don't get to tout how great Linux is then pull the 'you get what you paid for' nonsense when it falls short. One or the other, not both.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

Why is this modded down? I remember people here anxiously awaiting a four-core Android phone with dreams of finally getting smooth scrolling.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Not to mention Google's own admission of craptitude with "Project Butter".

The fact that a dual core phone with 512MB RAM can run Windows Phone smoothly and seamlessly, as a device should behave, yet Android needs twice the CPU power and four times the amount of RAM to performance acceptably, though still not totally smooth, says a lot.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[guruevi]

Not just Microsoft which is one thing but it advertises itself aggressively on the network, similarly discovery and pulls in a lot of data from 'apps' and 'tiles'

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't forget the ~3000 Napoleon Dynamite soundboards.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

So much FUD

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Two different user interfaces for account settings, and NEITHER FUCKING ONE can reset the contents of the guest profile.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[__aaclcg7560]

To this day, I can't find one asshole on line that trolls about Windows ME yet can name one specific technical problem they had with it, yourself included.

As a video game tester when Windows ME came out, it had horrible video game support. This was a time when DOS games were more common than Windows games. Hence, I'll quote Wikipedia on the technical fault.

Windows ME is a continuation of the Windows 9x model, but with restricted access to real mode MS-DOS in order to decrease system boot time.[8] This was one of the most unpopular changes in Windows ME, because applications that needed real mode DOS to run, such as older disk utilities, did not run under Windows ME (although the system could either be booted into real mode DOS using a bootable Windows ME floppy disk or the configuration could be tweaked manually to reenable access to the underlying MS-DOS).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_ME

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[KGIII]

Meh... I will give you ten bucks but proving it is you is going to be a problem.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[KGIII]

You can start typing in the search in Vista too. I just checked. Just press the WinKey and type away - focus is already on search. Yes, I do still have a laptop that has Vista on it.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[KGIII]

If it is anything like other Windows versions just turn off the guest account, wait a second, and turn it back on. You do not even have to logout or reboot in other, older, Windows versions.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[KGIII]

That seems like a lot of mental gymnastics just to find a reason to be angry. What is your motive? It is obvious that you have not used this, so what are you trying to accomplish? Just speak your mind and be honest. It is okay to say, "I do not recommend Microsoft because of their..." (Say, business practices, lack of support for FOSS, history, or the color of their icons.) Really! It is perfectly okay to say those things (or any others that you come up with) but do so honestly and openly and you will likely find a more receptive audience.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[KGIII]

I had ME and really enjoyed it - on one machine. It simply ran very well on that one box that it came standard with. The box even said it was made for Windows ME. It was an Acer something or other. It had an AMD K6 II at 350 Mhz. It was comfortable overclocked to a bit over 500 Mhz. It was stable and ran quite well. At one point, it was a bit old by then, I had an OpenNap hub (connecting multiple servers) running on it and often went many months without rebooting. It ran the hub for quite a while actually and then I got a visit from a TLA (no arrest or anything - just some questions and no, no, they can not come inside and maybe I should call my lawyer before answering any questions - etc...) and I decided it was time to take it down.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[K10W]

I would vote you up if I had modpoints today.

The upgrades from the full systems pop up whether the useraccount is linked to the microsoft account or if you simply created a user on Windows 7.

And yes, if someone signs up specifically for a beta program were every click is analyzed and any feedback linked to an account I think it is OK to get the free copy connected to that account. Because this copy is free (as in beer, but not as in speech).

It does not upgrade a bought copy. The alternative would be that every installation of the beta gets a free copy, even if the user did not participate in the beta program.

I hated MS for diversifying the directx-bases because every new directx was only available if the user bought the newest windows. They nearly destroyed the pc as a gaming machine in order to push their xbox. They were evil in general and their monopolistic behaviour was illegal. They tried to kill Linux by FUD.

The free copy is the right thing to do to atone for the abomination that was windows 8 or even 8.1 (two different userinterfaces for account settings, nuff said). And a free copy for every one who beta tested seems fair. Even non genuine windows installs get the upgrade, but there will be nagging.

I don't see much change in their behaviour myself. Could be wrong but way it looks to me is free isn't a usable experience liked genuine (business) customers will get. Testing is going to be the suckers who buy into it and updates forced on those users with MS stating after months of testing on home versions it will be rolled out on the real customers machines. Months makes it sound liek they are releasing it with barely any testing done inhouse. Way to make people work for free, not sure that is how it will work but my gut says maybe ;)

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

you got a free copy of Linux? where the hell do you pirate it from?

i've searched everywhere and can't find one anywhere.

Linux doesn't exist any more. It was replaced by Pottering Windows.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Wait until someone lets you in on the secret of FreeBSD.

Then you will know an OS that doesn't pull an arbitrary windows replacement or pull a distro vanishing act every 5 years and whose base is fully developed in one consistent house. Ahhhh, the bliss, finally.

http://www.freebsd.org/

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[L0rdJedi]

So basically, either you don't have an IT dept, or they're to lazy to bother creating local accounts.

It's insanely easy to create local accounts on Windows 10. Far, far easier than it was under Windows 8. It even gives you hints along the way about how to do it. Contrast that with Windows 8, where you literally had to skip past account creation and look for the "Create local account" button at the bottom of the screen. So if anything, Windows 10 makes it easier to avoid going online than Windows 8 did.

I don't know about disabling services, but I don't think it's any harder to do than it was in Windows 8 or Windows 7.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[L0rdJedi]

It's a fine tool for the job, but it sounds like their IT are being lazy.

A PCI compliant environment has to have everything audited and documented. Auditing has to be done every quarter and documentation has to be reviewed every 6 months. In other words, it's a lot of work. It doesn't matter what OS is used, it takes a lot of time and effort. So in order to implement Windows 10 (or anything else for that matter), services have to be audited, permissions documented, any GPO changes must be documented and audited.

If that's the environment, they're probably waiting for Windows 10 to either become a business requirement or they're waiting for their next audit/documentation review period.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[armanox]

Depends on what GP means as the same hardware. On my P3 laptop with 1GB of RAM? XP is faster. On an i7? Windows 7 (and newer) is much faster then XP.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[armanox]

ME had an issue if you mixed drivers, since they could trample each other (ME supported DOS drivers, Windows 9x drivers, and Windows 2K drivers, which all didn't play nice with each other). There was also the issue with data loss if your HDD supported caching, which was later patched. If you avoided mixing drivers (so probably didn't keep that old Sound Blaster 16 in use OR do pure DOS mode stuff, which ME didn't like doing any more anyway), and got the HDD cache issue solved, it was a solid system in my experience.

Re: So that means it's free to everyone

[dbIII]

The old start menu gives you a tree of all the major stuff that is installed.
MS has spent years effectively training people to use that interface and now people have to remember what they want instead of looking in the tree for that application they used last year or even earlier.
That's a bit of a step backwards with the interface IMHO. Not as batshit insane as putting controls offscreen, but it seems to annoy people just the same.

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[Anonymous Coward]

Was Linux not already mentioned before ?

Re:So that means it's free to everyone

[bingoUV]

I have attached the refund $0 with this post. Enjoy.

Clean install is a plus

[Anonymous Coward]

Upgrade installs are a bothersome step, if you're giving it away, why bother with that farce anyway?

Though I do hope they let us reinstall foreverish.

Re:Clean install is a plus

[Anonymous Coward]

Though I do hope they let us reinstall foreverish.

With this being Windows, and not Linux or *BSD, yes reinstalls will be very important. Another satisfied Microsoft customer?

not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no problem installing many OSes via a VM onto a physical disk - then having the choice of booting via a VM or bare metal.
I have been unsuccessful doing this with windows10 - and this is someone who last seriously used windows back in (windows) 98. The irony is that I can boot my Linux install via hyper-v.
If I'm in Linux and I have to do something windows based, then surely it would be advantageous to boot it via a VM. I love my hardware, am no OS fan boy. But if windows 10 is going to be pedantic about what hardware (virtualized or not) I am not interested - free or not.
But it should, since I've had to reinstall windows10 more times in a few months verse a couple of years with say a Linux based OS.
AND I haven't booted into it (win10) for about a week because I've just upgraded motherboard and ram (144gb) and just haven't got the time to stuff about with it (win10) being an pain in the ass.

Re:not interested...unless.

[blackpaw]

Dunno what your problem was - I've been running Windows 10 via KVM and VirtualBox since 10041. Works well with the KVM virtio drivers.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Ol Olsoc]

Dunno what your problem was - I've been running Windows 10 via KVM and VirtualBox since 10041. Works well with the KVM virtio drivers.

One real problem is once you "upgrade" to Windows 10 from say Windows 7 - there is no going back Having checked it out on their website, My Windows 7 copy is no longer registrable.

So if Windows 10 is the steaming smelly pile of elephant shit that Windows 8 is, I would have no choice than to buy another copy of Windows 7 Pro.

I'm not going to spend good money beta testing that one way trip.

I think I might wait until about day 364 to decide if I want that free upgrade or downgrade as the case may be.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Looks like you misunderstood. I doubt you can boot that VM installed image (if you passed though an actual physical disk) *bare metal*. That's the point and the power of other free OSes. You can boot them via KVM or xen or whatever AND you can boot into them directly from a boot loader. Without requiring some windows error or "Refresh" or "I give up just reinstall" situation.

What you have basically done is just lock down that installation of windows to the simple virtualized hardware. I don't understand why that wasn't obvious to you.
The parent made an excellent point and you get modded up for a totally noob reply.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Can't you just get the preview version of Windows 10, upgrade that. If you don't like it, reinstall Windows 7.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Windows is a GUI. More often than not it freaks out when hardware is changed.
People in the Linux/*BSD world have been spoilt with stable and consistent operating systems.
The reason the parents post has been overlooked here is the same reason MS will overlook it aswell.

Windows is not for power users and neither is Slashdot.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Dunno what your problem was - I've been running Windows 10 via KVM and VirtualBox since 10041.

It's depressing to know Windows will continue to be used, so far into the future.

Re:not interested...unless.

[jtownatpunk.net]

So make an image of your Windows 7 setup before you upgrade.

Re:not interested...unless.

[PNutts]

One real problem is once you "upgrade" to Windows 10 from say Windows 7 - there is no going back Having checked it out on their website, My Windows 7 copy is no longer registrable.

The free program Advanced Tokens Manager allows you to back up your activation and reapply it at as many times as you want.

Re:not interested...unless.

[X0563511]

Shame you can't make an image of MS' activation servers, too, because that's the problem.

Re:not interested...unless.

[X0563511]

You must have the correct SLIC (Software Licensing Description Table) for OEM activations.

Does this mean there's some sort of hardware ID magic that happens when you use an OEM copy, or is this saying you must have an OEM copy for the tool to work?

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

One real problem is once you "upgrade" to Windows 10 from say Windows 7 - there is no going back

Oh, just shut the fuck up. You keep spouting all of this FUD when it's painfully obvious that you don't have a fucking clue what you are talking about.

FYI, Windows 10 provides the ability to rollback to your previous version of Windows. Now don't you feel stupid?

Re:not interested...unless.

[Ol Olsoc]

So make an image of your Windows 7 setup before you upgrade.

From Microsoft:

http://answers.microsoft.com/e...

Specifically :If you upgrade from a OEM or retail version of Windows 7 or Windows 8/8.1 to the free Windows 10 upgrade this summer, the license is consumed into it. Because the free upgrade is derived from the base qualifying license, Windows 10 will carry that licensing too.

Try it and tell me how it works for you?

Re:not interested...unless.

[Ol Olsoc]

Oh, just shut the fuck up. You keep spouting all of this FUD when it's painfully obvious that you don't have a fucking clue what you are talking about.

From Microsoft:

If you upgrade from a OEM or retail version of Windows 7 or Windows 8/8.1 to the free Windows 10 upgrade this summer, the license is consumed into it. Because the free upgrade is derived from the base qualifying license, Windows 10 will carry that licensing too.

The specific page:

http://answers.microsoft.com/e...

Now play nice.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

A screenshot from Windows 10 itself:

http://thewindowsclub.thewindowsclubco.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Windows-10-TP-Rollback.png

Feeling dumb yet?

Re: not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Dual boot with it to try it out.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Lumpy]

"there is no going back Having checked it out on their website, My Windows 7 copy is no longer registrable."
Oh you absolutely can go back.

Install an OEM version with DAZ windows loader 2.2.2, then edit the registry to use your KEY.

You are back to a legal version that matches your COA.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Ol Olsoc]

"there is no going back Having checked it out on their website, My Windows 7 copy is no longer registrable." Oh you absolutely can go back.

Install an OEM version with DAZ windows loader 2.2.2, then edit the registry to use your KEY.

You are back to a legal version that matches your COA.

Good grief, if W10 is good, I'll install it. But if it's shit, I'll just stick with 7. Really shouldn't be any need to fuss around. All this activity has been about workaraounds and people not accepting what Microsoft says.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Billly Gates]

Well truth be told to you and the grandparent here that Windows 7 is heading towards another WIndows XP. It is legacy now and in a short time will go EOL. Windows 7 won't be around forever.

Windows 10 is the last OS by Microsoft. Future versions will be MacOSX like 10.1, 10.2, etc.

I forced myself a few months ago to switch to Windows 8.1. Actually I found out I just did not like change mostly and didn't realize it. I put in a start menu replacement and modernMIX to make apps act like applications and found glass8. I have a surface now too which I am now getting comfortable without aero and the new flat look.

Windows 8.1 & 10 are less heavy and boot fast if you disable bios/CSM and go straight into uEFI. UEFI is wonderful! It just works and is very fast.

Cons:
- Windows 10 is not stable and in my opinion very beta quality as No QA team is left at Microsoft and were laid off
- They will be very frequent updates with only the pro version giving you the choise to skip every other update aka .1 release

So if anyone reading this is using Windows 7 I would think about switching ... next summer after bloodstone and 10.1 get released and the nasty bugs get fixed. The applets are pretty cool if they are not full screen and it is nice to have a book reader for my MCSE books and pandora or Netflix going. Under Windows 7 I needed a browser and a million tabs to sort. A pain.

Re:not interested...unless.

[bzipitidoo]

To say nothing of all the other crap they do, MS is still pushing DRM. Windows 10 is no change of direction on that point. If they want my business, they must rip out all the DRM. No more activation keys like they started in Windows 95, no more phoning home like they started in XP, and definitely no more policing of 3rd party media like they tried in Vista. No more Windows Genuine Advantage, OOXML and J++ and ActiveX and other deliberate attempts to sabotage standards, and file format and other lock ins. No more legal debacles like the stunt they tried with SCO.

Let MS admit they were wrong to go along with the sophistry of Big Media concerning piracy, and start behaving like a tech leader again. They tell Big Media how to handle tech, not the other way around. What a weak move that was, following those greedy fools of Big Media, and showing the tech savvy that they don't deserve any respect, don't have any sense of technology, which is supposed to be their core competence. RMS criticizes Torvalds for being just an engineer. That goes double for MS, in their efforts to be just an engineering company and agreeing to implement DRM. But they went further than that, really seemed to believe they could make DRM work for themselves, and when they at last got into politics, pushed for stronger intellectual property laws, not better ones. They're not even a decent engineering shop, they're little more than an abusive monopolist desperately clinging to a broken business model.

Re:not interested...unless.

[bhiestand]

Not sure on this particular piece of software (though it looks handy!), but recommend you take a look at this Windows 7 OEM Activation article.

There normally is hardware magic for the OEM copies, but I'm not really sure how this one deals with SLIC.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Not hardware, but firmware. OEM copies are activated with the help of a BIOS/UEFI extension, the SLIC. An OEM Windows looks for that information, and if it's satisfied with what it finds, it's an activated Windows.

Re:not interested...unless.

[jones_supa]

No QA team is left at Microsoft and were laid off

No QA team? Sure, some QA people were laid off, but I'm quite sure Microsoft still has a nicely sized QA department. :)

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

It may seem nice of MS to provide DNS, but they stalk all of your surfing that way. You're right, DRM isn't the only issue with them.

Re: not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why don't you run sysprep /generalize before trying to run it on another workstation? That seems to work fine for me

Re:not interested...unless.

[Billly Gates]

http://www.businessinsider.com...

According to the above link the development team does both so no qa team. The real question is how they are evaluated? Right now there is no incentive and it shows. No,code freeze and ship first and ask questions later is how it appears

Re: not interested...unless.

[guruevi]

Win10 boot is plenty slow through either BIOS or UEFI. The trick it does with UEFI however is keeping the UEFI boot screen active while booting the entire OS. On a brand new 32-core Intel Xeon machine with NVM SSD and 64GB RAM it takes about 30-45s to get to the login screen after UEFI has handed over control. That's slow. In comparison, Fedora with SELinux and systemd takes ~5-10s

Re:not interested...unless.

[DarkTempes]

That isn't actually from Microsoft. That's a volunteer (aka random guy) who, I believe, is quoting a mixture of the Microsoft FAQ and ToS.

The legality of Microsoft licenses doesn't always follow how they actually work on computers.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Anonymous Coward]

If you're just restoring a previously activated image and you haven't changed the hardware, you shouldn't need to activate it again. If activating it is a problem, then there is always Daz's Windows Loader.

MD5sums for v2.2.2
4bd81c9565e924a539cf2cd05be3c010 *Read me.txt
323c0fd51071400b51eedb1be90a8188 *Windows Loader.exe
3ba4950bcf43b1c7b714a1d93b57ea86 *Keys.ini

Doesn't really matter where you download it from so long as the MD5sums match.

Re:not interested...unless.

[Ol Olsoc]

That isn't actually from Microsoft. That's a volunteer (aka random guy) who, I believe, is quoting a mixture of the Microsoft FAQ and ToS.

The legality of Microsoft licenses doesn't always follow how they actually work on computers.

This is sort of the problem. As a Community moderator and Wiki Author, if he isn't telling the truth, Microsoft should correct him. And after using their products for a long time, I don't make up my mind on what is what, until after their products are out a long enough time.

Example: Windows 8 consumer preview.

If you installed it on a Windows 7 machine, you could go back to your W7 install..

If you installed it on a Vista Machine - there was no going back.Your Vista OS was hosed.

That nugget was to be found on only one little webpage, which wasn't the one you downloaded it from.

And given that it was called "Consumer Preview" a lot of consumer level people installed it on Vista machines without running it in a VM. Which not a whole lot of consumer level folks even know what a VM is.

Basically, if what all the people here who know everything about Microsoft products are right, I'll be swimming in daisies, able to switch back and forth forever.

Uintil I see exactly where someone does that, I'll assume that at the very least, given the completely opposing information coming out between people here, and a Microsoft site, perhaps caution would be indicated.

Unless of course, someone who was absolutely certain would promise to buy me a copy of Win 7 Pro. After all, how could they lose?

Re:not interested...unless.

[Ol Olsoc]

The free program Advanced Tokens Manager allows you to back up your activation and reapply it at as many times as you want.

So what you are saying is tht Microsoft will allow two separate versions of Windows to run from the exact same activation code?

And are you guaranteeing that? Seems like something a little confusing for them to do that, Two identical numbers referring to Windows 7 and Windows 10 concurrently. So I will be able to run both. I will be able to dual boot in either 7 or 10. Because Windows will allow me to do that.

What a wonderful generous group of folks to give me two OS's for the price of one.

Re:not interested...unless.

[armanox]

First off - thanks for the glass8 thought. I'm going to try that on my Windows 8 machines.

Second thought - Currently my policy at home (and home based users) is upgrade 8.x to 10, and leave 7 in place for now.

meh

[mike2006]

Who wants to trash a valid working version of 7 or 8 rather than beta test a fresh install of Windows 10. This would be great if the free license was for those who install and beta test a fresh version of Windows 10 on a PC without having to upgrade an existing copy first.

Re:meh

[SeaFox]

You already get to upgrade to 10 for free if you're running 7 or 8.
This offer would be targeting the people on older platforms without and existing upgrade path. Still running XP? Beta test 10 and get it for free. (Course if you're still running XP you'd probably like to get new hardware now anyway).

Re:meh

[WilCompute]

You can install a clean install of the Insider Builds, then upgrade and have an activated version of Windows 10. That is the exact wording that was used in the blog. It simply stated you had to be running an Insider Build, and when you upgraded, Windows 10 would be activated. No other requirement.

Re:meh

[Golden_Rider]

Who wants to trash a valid working version of 7 or 8 rather than beta test a fresh install of Windows 10. This would be great if the free license was for those who install and beta test a fresh version of Windows 10 on a PC without having to upgrade an existing copy first.

Well, lucky you - because that is exactly how it is. You download the (free) technical preview build ISO http://windows.microsoft.com/e..., install it, and then later on it will be upgraded to a (free) fully licensed copy. Only requirement is that you have to sign up for a Microsoft account (just create some new email address for that).

Or, in easier words, the full version of Windows 10 is free for everybody who participates in the technical preview.

Re:meh

[bingoUV]

Thanks. The Verge says that

Update, June 21st 9:45AM: Microsoft has updated its blog post today and removed references to "remain activated." The stealthy edit isn't acknowledged, and we've reached out to the company for comment.

Do you have any updates since then?

Clean install from final media

[Anonymous Coward]

By "final media" do they mean bittorrent? Because that's where I've historically gotten all of my windows media from

Desperation

[Dunbal]

Can't even give it away huh?

Re:Desperation

[Anonymous Coward]

The first one is always free.

Re:Desperation

[Mictester]

FREE is too expensive! When they offer me a free computer and pay me $50 per hour to beta test their crapware, then I'll bite. Until then, I'll continue to use Linux Mint because it Just Works

Re:Desperation

[PNutts]

FREE is too expensive! When they offer me a free computer and pay me $50 per hour to beta test their crapware, then I'll bite. Until then, I'll continue to use Linux Mint because it Just Works

Linux Mint currently has 3853 open bugs.

Re:Desperation

[Anonymous Coward]

Which is considerably LESS than the count for Windows... >;-D

Re:Desperation

[Altrag]

I don't know if I'd call it "desperation" so much as "recognizing a changing landscape." Its hard to compete with free (Linux) and Apple's essentially giving away OSX with their hardware as well. Windows is the only major OS you still pay for these days.

And really, its not all that much skin off their backs. Probably 90+% of people who already have Windows will never upgrade it until/unless they upgrade the entire computer with a preinstalled OEM version. Not that I have any insider info, but I would guess that off-the-shelf sales of Windows are miniscule compared to the OEM and other commercial contracts. Hell the second most common version of Windows is still XP http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0, 14 years later and long after support was cut off!

Plus, they're still pushing their mobile-integrated (and now XBox-integrated) unified platform idea, so the more people they get on the new Windows (even with Metro being less obnoxious,) the more people they might convince to buy mobile Windows products (and more to the point, start buying stuff from the Windows store which is near-free money once they convince developers enough to put stuff up there and get enough users to buy stuff that the store can become self-sustaining.)

Re:Desperation

[Bing Tsher E]

Plus, they're still pushing their mobile-integrated (and now XBox-integrated) unified platform idea,

I am absolutely certain they are banking on that whole idea succeeding. Personally, I am not at all interested in updating my Windows 7 desktop or laptop, but I can't wait for the Windows 10 update for my Asus Transformer tablet.

All Microsoft really has to do is get users to pick up a modern Windows tablet and use it for a little while, and they'll never go back to an Android Tablet, except for the apps library and what Play Store games they are already sucked into playing. There are very affordable Win 8 tablets from a number of mid-range vendors like Asus and Dell that are going to kill Android tablets and maybe, hopefully, the iPad. Who wants to run a toy OS if there's a real one out there that is even relatively open and will run any x86 app or application?

Re:Desperation

[tsotha]

Apple giving away IOS makes some sense because Apple is trying to sell you hardware. What is Microsoft trying to sell me that will cover a major OS version upgrade? I don't see it.

Re:Desperation

[Anonymous Coward]

Cloud apping with azure

Re: Desperation

[guruevi]

Surprisingly little for an entire OS ecosystem (those bugs include packaged software). I wish there were only 3k bugs and minor annoyances on other platforms.

Re: Desperation

[guruevi]

Office 365, Sharepoint, Exchange and associated CAL's. Windows Server alone runs in the $1000/CPU

Re:Desperation

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, so? Are you saying that 3853 open bugs is one too many for an OS? What are you using as a standard to compare against? You have no idea what the bug tracker for Windows or OSX even looks like until you are working for Microsoft or Apple.

Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last fall

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not really all that surprising that MS wants additional testing badly enough to give away copies of Win10 for free to get it. Remember the fact that part of Microsoft's 2014 layoffs included elimination of all the SDETs in the Windows division. Those that were deemed worthy to stay were converted to SDEs and the rest were told to hit the road.

Needless to say, the result is likely to be exactly what one would expect of canning the entire test team suddenly, if the state of the technical previews has been any indication...

I smell a rat...

[Anonymous Coward]

I have a bad feeling about Windows 10. Maybe it's just my paranoia working over-time.

Re:I smell a rat...

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't have that feeling of paranoia. I hope that it's not the sinking of the Titanic, but it sure as hell looks like it's in that class..

Re:I smell a rat...

[tsotha]

Nah, that's just experience talking. Every other version of windows has been usable, with the intervening ones garbage. By going from Windows 8 to Windows 10 Microsoft is letting us know they plan on skipping the good one this time around.

Enough already.

[westlake]

I see we now have a balloon, a stained glass window icon and the real-life Microsoft logo appearing in-line with the headline.
Thankfully without obscuring the text. This time.

Re:Enough already.

[alexhs]

It's actually the old Microsoft logo. The new one is basically like the stained glass window, without the window frame.
And if you "want" the logos to obscure the text, you just have to narrow your window width to a size of 950 pixels or less :)

I'm suspicious.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why do I get this nagging feeling that in all these offers where they are saying "It will be free for XXXX" they are not showing you the fine print which says "for the first 90 days."

They do the same thing on bundled PC's with Office, "Comes with Free copy of Microsoft Office!" they say, and you boot it up and find it's a free TRIAL of office. Or free for 6 months.

I'm skeptical.

Re:I'm suspicious.

[terbo]

"It will be free for XXXX" they are not showing you the fine print which says "for the first 90 days."

I'm skeptical.

Its not quite that - more that "free" in this case means "in exchange for unprecedented amounts of your personal information."

Really?

[Anonymous Coward]

But, is that gonna be for ever, or just free for one year.. like they initially said it'd be for pirates...

Because really, you didn't need anything special to get in, anybody could get in, a simple matter of login in your account and registering for it.

Easy solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

... just don't install it on hardware.

Re:Easy solution...

[Ol Olsoc]

... just don't install it on hardware.

When you register it, your Windows 7 hardware install is no longer "Genuine Microsoft". But if you want to donate one of yours......

Re:Easy solution...

[markus]

Have you tried calling Microsoft's customer support about this? In the past, they have always been super friendly whenever I talked to them. They know that their licensing is super confusing and it is easily possible to trip up the automated license enforcement mechanisms. But in my experience they are usually willing to work with you. If your complaint sounds at least somewhat plausible, they will either figure out how to undo the damage you did, or they will send you a new license.

Of course, if you just make up bull shit to try to get a free license for the copy of Windows that you downloaded from Bittorrent, don't expect that they'll be able or willing to help.

Re:Easy solution...

[Bing Tsher E]

Old Olsonic hasn't used anything from Microsoft since Windows 3.1. That's a very bitter slashbotter.

Re:Easy solution...

[Ol Olsoc]

Old Olsonic hasn't used anything from Microsoft since Windows 3.1. That's a very bitter slashbotter.

Truth be told, I stopped at Windows 8.1 when my wife refused to use her laptop any more.

But after that (blessed) hiatus, I needed a copy of some form of Windows from 7 or up, when I bought a Software defined FlexRadio, and although there is an API for OSX, it doesn't have the full command set.

So I bought a fresh copy of Windows 7 pro in order to use their fully fleshed out program, that also has remote operation, SmartSDR.

Runs quite nicely with Bootcamp.

But I have no intention of putting up with a Windows 8 dog's breakfast, and the Windows 10 previews seem to be either "Greatest thing ever! Not one single problem!". Or the people who point out specific problems and get screamed at by the "BEST OS EVER!" peeps. I recall they were out in full force during Vista and Windows 8 rollouts as well. Who ya gonna believe?

So I'm a little reluctant to put up with a bad OS just to do what I'm already doing.

Another point of reference is I only used 3.1 for a very short time. I was using almost all DOS until W95. Having used the Amiga and Early Mac systems, W 3.1 just made me giggle. But Bing - your story is pretty good, so you can roll with that. I won't snitch on ya.

Re:Easy solution...

[gladius17]

Why the fuck would I call Microsoft about a free copy of Windows from Bittorrent? Or ever, for anything? Have fun with your life of slavery.

Re:Easy solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, hate to brake it to you, but you're wife is a moron. Or perhaps you already knew that. Cool story: Six months ago at work I installed Windows 8 on 5 machines that are each shared with 2 people. That's 10 users. Not a single one complaint. One guy actually said, "I'm really liking this Windows 8." And this is a soccer player who generally hates all technology. Yet, on-line, particularly on Slashdot, I hear all these assholes crying about it. Which just confirms what I've known for the past 30 years. Most of you people are morons. You're slow to adapt, slow to learn, slow at everything. Really shows how pathetic the human race really is.

Re:Easy solution...

[Anonymous Coward]

I actually moved my Windows 8 Pro to a completely different computer when it prompted me for a reactivation code. I called Microsoft and got a straight to the point automated system that had my code for me in a matter of minutes.

But

[Billly Gates]

Then my computer will have Windows 10??

Locked to one PC?

[Snufu]

"...you will also be able to clean install on *that* PC from final media if you want to start over fresh."

What if I get a new computer or upgrade my CPU/motherboard?

Re:Locked to one PC?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's probably the same as the 7/8 upgrade which is locked to the mobo, so they would need to buy a new copy.

Re:Locked to one PC?

[unixisc]

I quite agree. I have been beta testing the preview edition for the last few months. A few days ago, Microsoft included the new Windows logo in the status section of the Windows 7 & 8 toolbars, which if clicked prompt people to reserve their copies. I went to the local Microsoft store and asked them about it on my Winbook, and was told that I'd have to reinstall 8.1 and then upgrade. Which is ridiculous - going from Preview Edition to the Release version should be as simple as a Windows update. Nothing more, nothing less!

On the promo itself, there are a couple of things Microsoft should give those of us who beta tested for them. (I even posted comments on some of the apps that either were too brittle, or could use improved features.)

1. 1. Have a feature that would allow us to create a media w/ a legit copy of Windows 10
2. 2. Allow us to use that copy on up to N computers (where 5

Do that, and I'll feel appreciated. Otherwise, why pretend that those who voluntarily risked a beta version on their computers and tested Windows will be given any better treatment than those who just went about their business until July 29th?

Re:Locked to one PC?

[Anonymous Coward]

You can do a factory reinstall from within Windows 10, which is essentially the same as using a media, except without the media.

As for letting you install your copy of Windows 10 on multiple computers... They run a business here, they ain't a charity. You want free? Stay with linux.

Re:Locked to one PC?

[Mashiki]

Peh. I just called MS and they re-authorized the serial I had. It took me no more than 5 minutes on the phone for them to give me the counter-challenge for it.

Re:Locked to one PC?

[StormReaver]

It took me no more than 5 minutes on the phone for them to give me the counter-challenge for it.

I just installed a new copy of Kubuntu on five computers, and I didn't have to spend even one second asking for permission to do so.

Re:Locked to one PC?

[Mashiki]

I just installed a new copy of Kubuntu on five computers, and I didn't have to spend even one second asking for permission to do so.

That's great, when I do a deployment I can do it across 450 machines at a time and don't have to ask permission either. Shocking!

Re: Locked to one PC?

[guruevi]

Actually you do. Microsoft actually recommends you install an authorization proxy (several $1000 in Windows Server) to activate your "Enterprise" versions. I am on a network that cannot reach said servers and every Win7+ Enterprise install expires about a month after installation after which I have to run an arcane command or call Microsoft to activate. That is with the key and activation commands baked into the image.

Re: Locked to one PC?

[Mashiki]

Recommends != require

Re: Locked to one PC?

[guruevi]

But if you don't you're in shit-town where you have to manually re-activate (ask permission from Microsoft to use your software) individual installs a month after installation.

Re: Locked to one PC?

[Mashiki]

But if you don't you're in shit-town where you have to manually re-activate (ask permission from Microsoft to use your software) individual installs a month after installation.

Uh no. You know the deployment kit can do this across all the machines in about 15 seconds right?

Re: Locked to one PC?

[guruevi]

Again, you need to purchase Microsoft SCCM ($$$) to make it work. I use the deployment kit to make the images, that part is free. The part that doesn't work is where it deactivates itself again a month after deployment because it can't reach a Microsoft Server.

Connected?

[TubeSteak]

build and connected with the [Microsoft account] you used to register, you will receive the Windows 10 final release build and remain activated.

Is this like Windows 8 where it nags you to sign in with a @msn or @hotmail account?
Because I'm very much uninterested in having Microsoft follow along with my daily activities.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

Windows 8 asks if you want a Microsoft account or a local account exactly once during installation and never bothers you about it again.

You must have got drunk, passed out and dreamt about the nags.

Re:Connected?

[terbo]

Is this like Windows 8 where it nags you to sign in with a @msn or @hotmail account?
Because I'm very much uninterested in having Microsoft follow along with my daily activities.

More than that; using their browser, their search engine and local search facility,
their anti-virus, all send copious amounts of information to Megasoft.
Using the default settings sends numerous types of data over the wire.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

you need a microsoft account attached to your windows account if you want to use the windows store. probably required for other MS apps too, eg skype.

Re:Connected?

[vux984]

No you don't. You can use a local account; and still use the app store. I've both 8.1 and the 10 tech preview setup like that.

Re:Connected?

[vux984]

Windows 8 asks if you want a Microsoft account or a local account exactly once during installation

Ok. This isn't quite true. Windows 8 -assumes- you want a microsoft account, and makes the option of using a local account, more than little non-obvious.

Apple, for what its worth isn't any better.

and never bothers you about it again.

Also not quite true; various interactions with the store require you to sign into the store; and if you are not paying attention, the default path the wizard takes you down will convert your local account into a microsoft account. It warns you this is going to happen, but if your not paying attention you can end up with a microsoft account after installing with a local one.

You must have got drunk, passed out and dreamt about the nags.

If you never use the app store, you won't see any nags. But if you do, it will prompt you to sign in to the store with your ms account; and it will "helpfully" suggest you switch your account to a microsoft account to make your life "better".

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah it might not nag but they conveniently buried the way to get around registering an account during the install

Re:Connected?

[Billly Gates]

I own a surface and as annoying as using this for my hotmail account it is really nice to have Office 365, Onedrive, favorites, and even desktop wallpapers and settings synced together. Even if you use Android you can gain the cloud functionality portion and MS office too!

MS doesn't track your daily activities. The purpose is to get you on Onedrive and it's cloud offerings. You are free to use it or not. I use it because it is included. I have a truecrypt container I put on it for important files encrypted to be on the safe side for my passwords file and tax returns etc.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, because "Sign in without a Microsoft account" right on the create account screen is so vague.

Seriously, you've got to be a retard or illiterate to have missed that.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

The built in email client doesn't work with with ANY external accounts unless you link windows 8 to some sort of microsoft account. Try it. Complete bullshit.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

You just can't download anything. Really useful.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's because the mail client is a Metro app. You can still use it without creating an OS-wide Microsoft account by using a local account and opening any Metro app or the Windows Store. It will prompt you to login per app.

And really, the people who are against using a Microsoft account for the whole OS aren't likely to be people who even use Metro.

Re:Connected?

[Anonymous Coward]

You never used it and instead decide to talk out of your ass, huh?

If you are using a local account and open the Windows Store app, it gives you a per app login prompt just like any of the other Metro apps. Downloads and purchases work just fine and you can continue using a local account for Windows.

Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

I know the easy answer is "Because that's what they're used to", but somehow I don't find that sufficiently compelling. Lots of people value function too, not only form, and Linux certainly doesn't lack functionality.

Can't most X11 window managers in Linux distros be configured to look similar enough to Windows to feel like "home"?

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Ol Olsoc]

Can't most X11 window managers in Linux distros be configured to look similar enough to Windows to feel like "home"?

Yes, I have a Linux Mint install configured to look and mostly act like XP. It's still Linux underneath. An XP or W7 user would be able to find their way around, until they operned a terminal.

I haven't seen any W7 imitations, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[michrech]

Only if they can play all the Windows-only games that exist, and since Linux cannot, it will not take off like people such as yourself would like...

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Bing Tsher E]

Believe it or not, some people run a computer for other than cosmetic reasons. It wouldn't be enough to make the desktop 'look' like Windows.

So while you might enjoy running whatever Window Manager is in vogue at the coffeehouse, the rest of us are loading other stuff on our computers like word processors, spreadsheets, and browsers.

If you're running X11 isn't the Tab Windows Manager good enough? It wasn't for me, so I've upgraded to FVWM2 but twm is a decent and usable Window Manager, too. It's installed as part of the base X11 install on NetBSD. Your results may vary if you run a clone like Linux.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[rhodium_mir]

Can't most X11 window managers in Linux distros be configured to look similar enough to Windows to feel like "home"?

Yes. On a related matter you can buy a car that looks very similar to a Lamborghini for a fraction of the price. As for handling and performance I assume its just as good. I mean, it looks the same, so why shouldn't it be?

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Bing Tsher E]

With the ongoing convergence of Xbox and Windows 10, it is only going to get worse for Linux gamers. Better download Virtual Box. In fact, right now would be a great time to download Virtual Box, because you can install the Widows 10 preview and get it 'validated' when you install it as a VM on your Linux box. Then you're set, and you've not had to pay the Microsoft Tax.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[rhodium_mir]

After my girlfriend broke up with me I had a Real Doll created that looks just like her. Lower maintenance cost, fewer viruses, better documentation, infinitely more user friendly, and she completely respects my privacy.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[ArchieBunker]

Let me know when I can run SolidWorks, Altium, and Adobe Premiere in Linux because those are just a few applications I happen to dabble with.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Ol Olsoc]

After my girlfriend broke up with me I had a Real Doll created that looks just like her. Lower maintenance cost, fewer viruses, better documentation, infinitely more user friendly, and she completely respects my privacy.

Umm, well that was entertaining. The've actually managed to cross the bottom of the uncanny valley.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

You've still got to deal with the slowness of X, which rapes the CPU even when doing something as simple as moving a window and still makes disabaling desktop composition necessary to maintain decent frame rates in modern games. There's a reason why OSX and Android won't touch X with a 10-foot pole. Wayland is a step in the right direction, but that's years away.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[rhodium_mir]

I would imagine that if you don't immerse it in hot water for a while before use it'd be uncannily similar to fucking a corpse.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

... I had a Real Doll ...

Life-size sex dolls were traditionally a Japanese market but now most countries have a shop selling their own model. A Real doll costs several times more than competing American products likeShopoza and Dolloza.

... more user friendly ...

But you can't brag how horny she is. Men are judged by what they can do, and fucking a real woman, who doesn't charge up-front, is unfortunately viewed as more successful than renting by the hour, or using a realistic toy.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Ol Olsoc]

I would imagine that if you don't immerse it in hot water for a while before use it'd be uncannily similar to fucking a corpse.

But I suppose it will allow you to drive in the HOV lanes.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

You're not going to be able to play many games from a VM.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

Same here. 99.9% of what we use doesn't run on Linux: SolidWorks, Altium Designer, AutoCAD Electrical, Visual Studio, ImageCraft/Keil/IAR and tons of related embedded tools, everything Adobe, MS Office, etc. Hell, even things like iTunes and popular games don't work. It's not a your-OS-is-better thing, it's *all* about what the OS can run, and Linux has basically none of the software we need.

If your needs are very simple (web browsing and torrent?) then sure, you can probably get by using anything -- including Linux.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[unixisc]

I use not Linux, but PC-BSD, and while I'm happy w/ it, there are some things which I can't do, which is why I got the $100 Winbook on the side for those missing apps. Aside from being able to open and edit Office documents (I use Calligra rather than Libre Office), there are times I need to do things like GoToMeeting or other apps that just don't work outside Windows or Android/OS-X. Also, there are some web sites that recognize your environment and throw up their arms in despair if you try to run them.

However, PC-BSD works great, since most of the sites I visit are viewable under either Chromium or FireFox, and the only major game I play is FreeCiv. On the Winbook, I did get Steam and Civ4. It would be nice if there were a Steam VM under PC-BSD where I could play Civ 4 as well.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Billly Gates]

Because it works!

It comes with their computer. It was they use at work. Their documents do not look funny on other computers. It is stable (yes slashdotters it is not 1998 anymore as WIndows uses an NT kernel now), and most important RUNS ALL THEIR SOFTWARE. No WINE. No hacks, No clones of what they used on their work pcs.

Why would someone want to change? Why put up with xorg.conf files, drivers breaking after a release update, finding drivers, etc. I left linux a few years ago as my main OS and unless things have radically changed the lack of an ABI meant after a release update or 2 the distro would BREAK. ATI drivers would stop working etc.

So the answer is unless you run a server, do crazy development work in computer science or strange mathematical apis, then there is no reason to change. In 1998 Unix had the best development tools. In 2015 Vistual Studio 2015 has clang, java support, android SDK, typescript, and the same libraries.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[drinkypoo]

You've still got to deal with the slowness of X, which rapes the CPU even when doing something as simple as moving a window and still makes disabaling desktop composition necessary to maintain decent frame rates in modern games.

Compiz has solved both problems for years. The default is now to unredirect all fullscreen windows, which makes most games work fine without any additional trickery.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[UnknownSoldier]

As an ex-hardcore gamer let me know when ALL my favorite games run natively under Linux; not emulated with a performance hit, or buggy implementation of Wine.

I prefer OSX and Linux for development but the reality is that Windows is the where the majority of new games are (only) released on.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, I'd expect that a car for half the price of a Lamborghini would be something you could back, without having to open the door and sit on the sill. As for performance, well, I think I can fit a few more kids and a lot more shopping in a Honda Odyssey. Try cramming half a dozen kids in a Lamborghini while going for a drive. Hell, handles so I could open the doors rather than yanking on a piece of string would be a fucking good idea. 100 times the price of my car, and no doorhandles? Some people are so fucking stupid.

You are one of those stupid people. You remind me of someone I used to know. This cock told me that Windows XP was older than Linux, and therefore better, and that's why I should be using it.

Both you, and he, need to understand something:

I do not make my purchasing and usage decisions based entirely upon your ego. You are nothing more than the modern incarnation of one of those mustache twiddling Apple artiste cocks from 10-20 years ago, but with less maturity.

You really need to grow up, quite a lot, but until then - shut it: grown ups are talking.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

...and most important RUNS ALL THEIR SOFTWARE.

Thanks for playing, but you win the prize for being yet another stupid fuck:

Much of my software, software that I bought a few years ago - when I owned a current Windows - won't run on a modern system. I have to hack the system, find a compatibility layer or patches, or run an emulator to make it work.

I suppose, for some of it, I could splash out and buy the new versions or alternatives but honestly, why should I? Everything already does what I need it to. Why should I invest several thousand dollars buying tools that I already own and use, and they already work?

Yeah, didn't think you'd have a good answer for that, although that's basically because there isn't one.

Why would someone want to change? Why put up with xorg.conf files, drivers breaking after a release update, finding drivers, etc. I left linux a few years ago as my main OS and unless things have radically changed the lack of an ABI meant after a release update or 2 the distro would BREAK. ATI drivers would stop working etc.

Hmm. Let's quickly analyse what happened with the Vista machine I just reloaded for somebody.

I'd had Linux on it. I put the disc in, loaded it up. Everything worked, and worked well.

Then I loaded Vista on it. It took me a few hours to find the network drivers (because the model wasn't listed on the manufacturer's website (Lenovo)), and then a few days to find the SM Bus drivers. I still haven't found the audio drivers for it. I did install the nVidia drivers on it, that took three reboots to get them going. The updates took me 9 hours to download (for some reason, under Vista, the download speed is almost a quarter of what it is under Linux) and install.

This is what you'd have me leave Linux for? I thought Windows "just worked," and ran everything!

I'd have put Linux back on it, but they have some critical software that runs only on Windows, and since the box has a Vista sticker on the side, well, they can deal with the rest of it. But they'll be doing that without sound.

So the answer is unless you run a server, do crazy development work in computer science or strange mathematical apis, then there is no reason to change.

Unless you happen to lose the drivers disc, because then you're fucked. Honestly, do us all a favor:

Stop letting your ego and personal preferences influence your decision on what everyone should run. This is especially important because what I choose to run is nothing to do with you. Stop telling me otherwise, and grow up.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[rhodium_mir]

You are one of those stupid people.

I know you are but what am I?

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[rhodium_mir]

Thankfully I don't have to reload Windows for people. That's pleb work.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Overzeetop]

Where is AutoCAD for Linux
Where is RAM/Elements for OSX
Where is Photoshop for Linux
Where is ProTools for Linux
Where is Pro/Engineer for OSX

I'm not looking for some "alternative" - I have 20 years of designs, arts, compositions in those native formats and it costs me $200/hr to convert, change and retrain.

The cost of switching from Windows to another OS which HAS an equivalent program is going to be into 5 figures for every employee. The cost to switch to a different program (many of which take 2-3000 hours to become truly proficient) is going to be much higher.

The OS may look the same, but it will operate differently (time to fire my IT guy and hire a different one, along with the tens of thousands of dollars such a move costs) and my industry specific programs will no longer run the way they did under the original OS. It's a fucking nightmare from a business perspective, no matter how much easier it will be for you to use a command line to load and troll slashdot.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Anonymous Coward]

Whoosh.

Way to absolutely miss the point. Since you didn't get it, it's an analogy for Windows (real girlfriend) versus Linux-that-looks-like-Windows (lump of rubber "girlfriend").

Re: Why do people want to run Windows?

[guruevi]

You're also spending 5-6, if not more digits on licenses on a yearly basis. In the long term it might be cheaper to convert.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[natex84]

I'd had Linux on it. I put the disc in, loaded it up. Everything worked, and worked well. Then I loaded Vista on it. It took me a few hours to find the network drivers (because the model wasn't listed on the manufacturer's website (Lenovo)), and then a few days to find the SM Bus drivers. I still haven't found the audio drivers for it. I did install the nVidia drivers on it, that took three reboots to get them going. The updates took me 9 hours to download (for some reason, under Vista, the download speed is almost a quarter of what it is under Linux) and install. This is what you'd have me leave Linux for? I thought Windows "just worked," and ran everything!

Which version of Linux (release date / year)? If it is a more recent build than from 2007, comparing it to Windows Vista (which was released in January 2007) is hardly fair... I'm not surprised 8.5 YEARS of updates took a while to download.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[Billly Gates]

I'd had Linux on it. I put the disc in, loaded it up. Everything worked, and worked well.

Then I loaded Vista on it. It took me a few hours to find the network drivers (because the model wasn't listed on the manufacturer's website (Lenovo)), and then a few days to find the SM Bus drivers. I still haven't found the audio drivers for it. I did install the nVidia drivers on it, that took three reboots to get them going. The updates took me 9 hours to download (for some reason, under Vista, the download speed is almost a quarter of what it is under Linux) and install.

This is what you'd have me leave Linux for? I thought Windows "just worked," and ran everything!

Which version of Linux (release date / year)? If it is a more recent build than from 2007, comparing it to Windows Vista (which was released in January 2007) is hardly fair... I'm not surprised 8.5 YEARS of updates took a while to download.

I am not a WIndows fanboy but 8.1 install will find hardware automatically. Windows 7 can for most too including 3rd party bluetooth. I didn't even have to do an update. It just started installing itself within minutes of a fresh setup.

Funny how the parent thinks I am trying to enforce my opinion on others when the grandparent talked about how to trick users into thinking xorg is Win7 or how to evangalize Windows users.

Re:Why do people want to run Windows?

[KGIII]

Alternative theory: One could just not have moved their OS to a newer version and have just taken over their own security. Then the applications they would have purchased would still work. Crappy software vendors is not a very good reason to blame an operating system. If your mechanic puts on crappy wiper blades do you think your car is junk?

yes ...

[cascadingstylesheet]

... I'm sure the PC makers would love it if I would "upgrade" to Windows 10, discover that my PC just won't cut it, and then buy a new PC (which coincidentally will have Windows 10 bundled).

Re:yes ...

[thegarbz]

If your PC runs Windows 7 it'll run Windows 10. There have been no increase in performance requirements in the past 3 versions of windows. In fact Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 are working on ever increasing memory and CPU efficiency.

Re:yes ...

[Billly Gates]

If your PC runs Windows 7 it'll run Windows 10. There have been no increase in performance requirements in the past 3 versions of windows. In fact Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 are working on ever increasing memory and CPU efficiency.

Not true. It requires UEFI 2.3.1 with CSM bios turned off.

Unless I misread something. If you have a 2011 era computer with a bios with no EFI your options are 8.1 or 7 until they go EOL. Any new pc from 2013 or later should have them but I have not seen much at all in 2012 or earlier besides some botique boards and imacs that had UEFI 2.3.1.

Re:yes ...

[thegarbz]

Jury is out.

It looks like to get a Windows certification OEMs *must* ship with UEFI 2.3.1 and with Secure Boot enabled by default. It also looks like they've removed the requirement that Secure Boot must be selectable on x86 architectures (which is a backtrack and potentially a problem for Linux). Also it appears that this requirement will only be enforced after 1 year from the Windows 10 release. This is based on replies on the Microsoft Forums.

Currently the technical preview has no problem running under Legacy BIOS (actually people are having more problems installing it on UEFI BIOSes based on forum complaints.

That said some of the media sites are reporting that UEFI is not optional, but I can't find anything on the Microsoft site to say that.

Re:yes ...

[Mashiki]

Since I just finished installing a copy on a 2010 machine(Asus board first gen USB3 w/AMD965BE) that only had a BIOS, pretty sure it seems to be working just fine.

Re:yes ...

[jones_supa]

Not true at all. I have been able to install the Windows 10 Technical Preview to all sorts of crusty old PCs that have not heard about EFI or even 64-bit.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Billly Gates]

Which is why this ain't touching my desktop nor surface.

If I weren't an IT professional expected to be up to date I would still be on 7 to which is Microsoft's best OS. It is NO WHERE NEAR ready for primetime! I do not even run it on a vm in my lab as a simple vlan change can so a BSOD and there are no rsat tools?? wth. Now I read your post and it makes sense.

Window 7 beta 1 circa 2008 was faaar more stable than 10 now near RTM.

I will wait for bloodstone update then next one next summer and then upgrade because it's my job. It still will be flaky I am sure but oh well. Like I said if I were in another industry I would hold onto 7 for dear life

Still not seeing the catch, it makes me nervous.

[Anonymous Coward]

So, basically anyone that wants to can go sign up now, and get free windows on any computer... I have been running the preview for a while on a computer with a valid licence for 7 ult, this is really cool and all, but all this pushing free windows is starting to make me a little nervous. I can understand not wanting a situation like they had with 8 or vista, where everyone just sat on 7/XP forever because it suited their needs better. But I have to wonder where they are making money from handing out free 10 like it is Christmas. I don't think they would do it, but doing this would put them in a really good position to do a bait and switch to subscription model. If not, I would almost expect to see adds or something during updates and bootup.

Re:Trialware - not free

[neilo_1701D]

Then your understanding is wrong. As per Gabe Aul, you own it.

The "one year" thing is to push people into upgrading sooner rather than later. If you upgrade within the first year, Windows 10 is free for the life of the device (and that includes reinstalls; so long as you have a Microsoft account and your Windows user is connected to that account, you can reinstall on that device to your heart's content.

If you delay in upgrading past that one year mark, you need to go buy a copy.

Re:Trialware - not free

[jo_ham]

Shouldn't we call it "free trial" rather than "free"? As far as I understand it, we're going to have to pay up after the first year of "trial". This goes for everyone including us who got a full Windows installation.

You understand incorrectly.

Once you have a Windows 10 key, its yours.

To make it more obvious, the price for the foist year will be $0.00, and if you "buy" it during this time for the low, low price of $0.00 then you get a key that doesn't expire.

If you buy it after that year the price will be more than $0.00 (let's say $x, where x is not zero) and you will get a key that doesn't expire.

What will almost certainly happen though is that the period where it is available for free will be extended indefinitely. It's clear they want to push adoption of the Windows ecosystem to make it more homogenous and the best way to do that rapidly is to make it look like the window for the free upgrade is limited. I suspect it will be free forevermore, but they want a rapid uptake of users rather than a slow trickle.

Re:Trialware - not free

[Anonymous Coward]

No, dumbass. We've been over this a billion times.

If you register for the free-as-in-beer upgrade within the first year, then your license is valid for as long as you use it. (This is true whether you install and use it or not, since the registration is the only thing they care about.) But if you sit on your hands for a year and don't reserve your upgrade within a year of release, then you don't get one and have to buy it instead.

Office Upgrade

[birukun]

Oh but you get to pay for a new version of Office....... so not totally free.

Re:Office Upgrade

[Anonymous Coward]

Office is a separate product.

Re:Trialware - not free

[superswede]

Thank you for clarifying and correcting me on this one ... and I'm glad that I was wrong.

Factional infighting

[aNonnyMouseCowered]

Just like in an empire or communist party, the conflicting reports/retractions make it increasingly obvious that some infighting is going on in Redmond. Interesting is who gets purged.

Re:Trialware - not free

[superswede]

Thanks for the detailed explanation. Sorry if I mislead anyone (it was my honest belief).

Re:Ha-ha. No.

[Bite The Pillow]

Free Windows upgrade for testing sounds like barter system. If you want to provide feedback, you will sign on. If not, you won't. If you get paid to test, then don't participate.

Are you going for insightful? Or interesting? Or maybe informative?

Glad to know that you are not part of the ecosystem involved, based on your answer, so, and I say this with the utmost respect because I have no other basis to tear you a new aresehole, fuck off and die please for the betterment of humanity.

Microsoft's Gabe Aul confirmed this method on Twitter yesterday as part of a new blog post detailing some new changes to the way the company tests Windows 10. "As long as you are running an Insider Preview build and connected with the MSA (Microsoft Account) you used to register, you will receive the Windows 10 final release build and remain activated," says Aul

Re:Ha-ha. No.

[ArcadeMan]

A small price to pay to get a free OS for my gaming PC that won't be used for anything else.

Re:Trialware - not free

[jo_ham]

No problem. There was a lot of mixed information about how the free Windows keys would work due to a lack of info from MS themselves when they announced it, whether it would be one year only, and whether you'd be able to do a clean install or just an upgrade only etc.

Microsoft has clarified that it's a full Windows key that can be used for clean installs and that once you have it, it's the same as buying a copy of Windows today.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm actually surprised that you even went there...but hey, too fucking lazy to go Google it for yourself.

Here, let me Google that for you...

One of the first Links is THIS.

Next time I strongly suggest going and fucking yourself, using 20-grit and lye, before bowing up like that without good cause. You DIDN'T have it, dumbass.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Anonymous Coward]

There was even a slashdot story about it if i remember correctly.

John Thompson said this moring it isn't free!

[Anonymous Coward]

He confirmed that you had to give Microsoft marketing information in exchange for the license, and again confirmed that they were only guaranteeing it to be free for a year. Considering he is the chairman of the board and picked the current figurehead President, what he says has more weight than what their marketing department claims. I wish they'd get their stories straight. They keep contracting themselves.

Re:John Thompson said this moring it isn't free!

[Anonymous Coward]

People do seem to forget that he is the person in charge. He was picked for his political connects since he's friends with Obama, so he isn't very technical. Expect him to continue to make mistakes like this.

Re:John Thompson said this moring it isn't free!

[Anonymous Coward]

And, he is the guy in charge of Microsoft. He keeps fighting back on this issue, and I expect he'll win in the end. That means, no free upgrade and if you do upgrade, you'll have to subscribe after one year.

Re:Trialware - not free

[Drethon]

Then your understanding is wrong. As per Gabe Aul, you own it.

The "one year" thing is to push people into upgrading sooner rather than later. If you upgrade within the first year, Windows 10 is free for the life of the device (and that includes reinstalls; so long as you have a Microsoft account and your Windows user is connected to that account, you can reinstall on that device to your heart's content.

If you delay in upgrading past that one year mark, you need to go buy a copy.

Hopefully they release SP1 within that first year.

Rewarding the Beta Testers

[Anonymous Coward]

Finally, Microsoft is compensating its legions of formerly unpaid beta testers.

Test, format, reinstall, repeat. Hope you have backups.

Next, Microsoft might compensate the rest of its loyal users for all the unpaid beta testing they did, and continue to do with their unpolished, half-baked software.

Can I please have my XP interface back?

[maz2331]

I just want to have the old XP interface back. Hell, I'd pay double retail for that option. I love the internals of 7 and 8, but so hate the interface.

Re:Can I please have my XP interface back?

[Overzeetop]

Which part? My 7 (and my 8) looks strikingly like XP. Some of the internals have moved, but they're not hard to find (esp with global search and shortcuts).

Re:Can I please have my XP interface back?

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.classicshell.net/ might get you close enough to make the experience tolerable.

Nervous about upgrading

[cfalcon]

My concern is this: only the more expensive ("pro") versions will let you control your upgrades. Upgrades are pretty filthy- routinely booting you out of games, crashing stuff you need to have happen, messing up everything- and disabling that and only doing it when YOU want is a pretty big deal.

More importantly, making this a "premium only" feature means that, once you have 10, your choices are
1- Take exactly the upgrades they want on your machine, when they want it, forever,
2- Some kind of hack
3- Pay for the upper version to get basic admin rights on your machine back

But that's what a "premium only" feature means- what does it imply?

Combined with all the "get 10 for free" crap we see going around (on top of the fact that 10 will become a mandatory pack-in on most hardware and essentially all laptops), and we see a Microsoft that is absolutely desperate to get you away from a Windows box you have full control over, and onto one that THEY control... and that means they see forsee a great deal of profit for doing that.

Exactly what else will get patched into 10? What's on their upgrade cycle? Everyone with a free copy of 10 gets to find out what the price they actually paid was later... just give them a little time.

The latest 7 patch puts an advertisement for a product on your box- the 10 button. I'd hazard a guess that this won't be the only time you have advertisements spamming your GUI in the near future. Just look at the X-Box interface for a preview of "check this shit out bro".

I could be wrong. I hope I am. But I'll wait a few months to see if it is good, and then I'll buy the premium version that keeps my admin control, and if I'm wrong I'm out a bit of cash, but if I'm right, I'll be able to use my PC without whatever the hell this mandatory software injection scheme they have is... maybe.

Or I stay on 7. Which appears to have only gotten better with time, based on Microsoft's devout refusal to produce a version that isn't garbage.

Re:Nervous about upgrading

[Hadlock]

If you pay full price for Win 10 you still get the full ownership experience. This option will always exist as they have to support enterprise users who require that kind of control over the machine. I have Win 8.1 pro running classic shell and I still have full control over my PC without having some crazy hotmail login, why would that change for Win 10?

Re:Nervous about upgrading

[cfalcon]

http://www.howtogeek.com/21916...

I mean, it's an announced negafeature already. You have to get one of the non-home versions to do this. What version do all these "free" upgrades give you? The one where you can't turn off their binaries, advertisements, and whatever the fuck else they think is good for you to have.

Re:Nervous about upgrading

[cfalcon]

I mean really, it should be obvious by now- if Microsoft is willing to jump through hoops to prevent you from disabling auto-update, then it must be VERY much in your interest to disable auto-update. It must be super in your best interest if they are willing to try to shut it off. They wouldn't take away that if you weren't gonna need it real bad in the near future.

Re:Nervous about upgrading

[Anonymous Coward]

They are pulling an obvious bait-and-switch, where the "free" version will actually be the beta-testing version and thus damn near unusable damn near all the time. 10 is not going anywhere near any of my machines.

Re:Nervous about upgrading

[Anonymous Coward]

My concern is this: only the more expensive ("pro") versions will let you control your upgrades. Upgrades are pretty filthy- routinely booting you out of games, crashing stuff you need to have happen, messing up everything- and disabling that and only doing it when YOU want is a pretty big deal.

From what I've read, it's only the GUI for doing this that has been removed. There's nothing to stop you just disabling it via cmd or powershell.
e.g.

set-service -Name "Windows Update" -Status Stop -StartupType Disabled

when you want to update again:

set-service -Name "Windows Update" -Status Running -StartupType Manual

Even if there's some kind of "security policy" that resets the StartupType to Automatic every logon, you can set the powershell script to run 30 seconds after every logon to disable it again.

Shouldn't have to do this shit for an OS admittedly - but at least you can if you want.

I wonder if they'll make it free...

[Anonymous Coward]

No, I mean really free... not just not paid, but free as in Freedom.

That might be important if those transparency center don't work in Europe as expected and tougher Openness laws are enforced.

Also, this might give them a better footing to fight Android (which is purportedly GPL AFAIU).

(*) Openness: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openness

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Uberbah]

I'm actually surprised that you even went there...but hey, too fucking lazy to go Google it for yourself.

Except that's fucking bullshit. It's the job of the person making the assertion to back it up with evidence, not the audience. Otherwise I'll casually assert that you like have sex with goats. Is it my job to prove that assertion, or your job to disprove it?

Support Lifecycle for Windows 10

[Jagungal]

The real questions that needs to be answered is what the support lifecycle for Windows 10 is. With Windows 7 we are right to 2020, with Windows 8.1 it is good until 2023 ... with Windows 10 .. well there is just a bunch of talk about software as a service and nothing at all about the length of support.

Re:Support Lifecycle for Windows 10

[bazorg]

I'm sure that once the product is released the policy will be published in the usual place... https://support.microsoft.com/...

For now, it's a good idea to sign up and start a trial install on VirtualBox or on a real machine.

Free Windows or Free Testers?

[hsa]

The opt-in testing is a big question mark..

Home users get forced updates, like you can read here:
http://www.howtogeek.com/219166/you-won%E2%80%99t-be-able-to-disable-or-delay-windows-updates-on-windows-10-home/

Who tests these updates? Are the "happy" Insiders unwilling test subjects? Will you just get notifications, like:
"Windows installed some potentially unstable updates on your computer. Please provide feedback and error logs before we release these to real users. Thank you for your co-operation."

Re:Trialware - not free

[Anonymous Coward]

boy are you going to get pissed off when they renege on that

Freebie! wooho!

[bazorg]

Excellent, I was going to pony up £80 for a new license for the new PC I'm building. Now I'll spend more on the hardware. I hope this works on Virtual Box so I don't mess up my current machine.

Re:Freebie! wooho!

[knight17]

Are you sure this will work in virtual machines? If they do this will be really great

Re:Freebie! wooho!

[bazorg]

It installed correctly yesterday on VirtualBox. The new PC arrives later in the week, I'll install it there again and then hope that on the 29th July it will become a permanent licence.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[hercludes]

Only when providing new theories or evidence or hypothesis' or whatever. AC being a goatfucker is not common knowledge, windows layoffs are common knowledge and aren't exactly anything new. You'd have to provide a link every other sentence if that were the case.

Updates and patches

[Anonymous Coward]

Recent mails from MS talk about Windows as a service. Does it mean we will have to pay for updates and patches?

It's like herpes

[Hognoxious]

I followed the instructions (forget where) to get rid of it, but it came back.

Re:Ha-ha. No.

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not really free. The percentage of people who installed the windows preview on a PC that didn't have windows already is so low not to matter. What would be the point of forcing them all to reinstall windows 7 or whatever and upgrade for free anyways?

free....wha?

[argStyopa]

OK so wait, their first announcement that if you upgraded to Win10 now, you could have it for free.

Now they say that if you are willing to test it, you can have it for free forever ...which would imply that the PREVIOUS announcement *wasn't* 'forever'.

Re:free....wha?

[KGIII]

How the hell did you reach that conclusion? No, no such thing was implied nor is implicated (by any rational mind).

Re:free....wha?

[argStyopa]

Well, maybe I'm not rational then: from http://www.microsoft.com/en-us...
Boldface mine.

"*Windows Offer Details

Yes, free! This upgrade offer is for a full version of Windows 10, not a trial. 3GB download required; standard data rates apply. To take advantage of this free offer, you must upgrade to Windows 10 within one year of availability. Once you upgrade, you have Windows 10 for free on that device.

Windows 10 Upgrade Offer is valid for qualified Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 devices, including devices you already own. Some hardware/software requirements apply and feature availability may vary by device and market. The availability of Windows 10 upgrade for Windows Phone 8.1 devices may vary by OEM, mobile operator or carrier. Devices must be connected to the internet and have Windows Update enabled. Windows 7 SP1 and Windows 8.1 Update required. Some editions are excluded: Windows 7 Enterprise, Windows 8/8.1 Enterprise, and Windows RT/RT 8.1. Active Software Assurance customers in volume licensing have the benefit to upgrade to Windows 10 enterprise offerings outside of this offer. To check for compatibility and other important installation information, visit your device manufacturerâ(TM)s website and the Windows 10 Specifications page. Additional requirements may apply over time for updates. Security and features are kept automatically up-to-date which is always enabled. See the Windows 10 How to Upgrade page for details."

Precisely how else might a 'rational' mind interpret that?

What I'm unsure of, and isn't clearly addressed above is whether Win10 eventually becomes one of those 'instead of buying it you pay monthly' things like Office365, and thus you might have a version of Win10 for free, but support ends in 12 months or something.

Re:free....wha?

[KGIII]

Just because they clarified does not mean it was not free, or going to be free - or meant to be free, before that. Such a strange conclusion to draw. Really.

Re:free....wha?

[argStyopa]

First, your weird double-negative statement is nonsensical.
(That they made a clarification) "...does not mean it was not free, or going to be free - or meant to be free..."
Logically there's a finite list of possibilities here; either it was going to be a) free, or b) not free.
Whether or not they clarified it now is irrelevant. It was going to be one of the two.

Second, what it does mean (to a rational mind) is that their message to the marketplace was pretty damn confusing to more people than just me, to the point that MS felt they needed to try to clarify.

In case you're wondering where I got this "crazy" idea, here's an example:
http://www.theguardian.com/tec...
From that article, in regard to the 'free Win10 offer': "...Once you have installed Windows 10 and made a note of your product key, itâ(TM)s yours forever. ..."

I'm still trying to figure out how you could parse that it's NOT free, or that that is somehow obvious?

Re:free....wha?

[KGIII]

I see where, I think, you are making your mistake... No, it was not limited to free or not free to those people the offer applied to. The product could have been free (and was, by most accounts) prior to the clarification. It was going to be free the entire time. It was not mysteriously not free before hand, it just was not clear and officially stated. That does not mean it was not free before this, it just means that they had to clarify it because people, such as you, were not comprehending and there was no official announcement that made it clear.

If I say that air is free that does not mean it was not free yesterday. It just means that I have made it clear today.

Setting the record straight via fact/truth... apk

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux has done such a "fine job" there on the desktop & only reason it's used on servers + smartphones is that it is FREE, keeping per unit costs down - & THAT is the ONLY real reason!

(It's certainly not 'superiority', since face facts: Device drivers of solid quality for peripherals happens for Windows for sure, & it is what truly separates Windows & sets it ABOVE Linux - it's nigh guaranteed since Windows "rules the roost" marketshare-wise on BOTH PC desktops + servers combined).

Fact: Linux had to seek alternate markets-outlets (smartphones) since it failed on the largest market in computing prior to this in PC desktops especially!

Truth: Windows OWNS that for decades @ what? Roughly 94.5++ % of marketshare?? Yes.

You "Pro-*NIX Penguins" had to GIVE AWAY your OS in order for it to have ANY share of market... MS didn't.

APK

P.S.=> It's always NICE dispelling your illusions & "FUD" bs you "Open SORES" people spew around here, but then again?

ANDROID (yes, a Linux) DOES THE JOB EVEN BETTER vs. the YEARS OF "FUD" BS SPEWED HERE ON /. ESPECIALLY OF "Windows != Secure, Linux = Secure" when it's purest LIES from you fools, & Linux was hiding behind "security by obscurity" (not being used as much, thus, hacker/cracker types wouldn't target it anymore than pickpockets target 1 person only - it's not worth their efforts, & LOW "ROI") being shown for a decade++ now to be untrue since ANDROID gets exploited weekly practically, lol... so much for your "marketing bs" boys - it doesn't stand up to reality! apk

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Zero__Kelvin]

"Except that's fucking bullshit. It's the job of the person making the assertion to back it up with evidence, not the audience."

It is certainly not the job of every poster to anticipate how uninformed you are and then provide links to help you combat your own ignorance. If you couldn't get proof by simply googling it would then - at that point - it be reasonable to ask for some kind of citation. As it stands now you are just another sad and pathetic variation of the Citation Needed weenie.

So, clarify this for me...

[Brian Kendig]

- If I do a clean install of Windows 10 Preview onto a computer, that will turn into a full license of Windows 10 on July 29, no upgrade from a previous version of Windows is necessary? Or does this only apply if I've installed Windows 10 Preview onto an installation of Windows 7 or 8.1?

(http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/06/19/upcoming-changes-to-windows-10-insider-preview-builds/ is unclear on this, saying "As long as you are running an Insider Preview build and connected with the MSA you used to register, you will receive the Windows 10 final release builld" but then "It’s important to note that only people running Genuine Windows 7 or Windows 8.1 can upgrade to Windows 10 as part of the free upgrade offer.")

- I only see Windows 10 Preview releases for x86 and x64. How do I get the Pro version instead of the Home version?

I see this as a good way that I can get free up-to-date Windows licenses for old computers I have that are running XP and Vista; all I need is to wipe them and put Windows 10 Preview on them, and link them to my Microsoft account. I just want to make sure that this will work, and I'd like to have the Pro version.

Re:So, clarify this for me...

[Anonymous Coward]

The Windows 10 Tech Preview is free for anyone to try. You can clean install it on a PC, contributing reports to Microsoft, and when Windows 10 is released you will then get a free upgrade. No need to have purchased a previous version of Windows.

FTFA:

If you install the latest Windows 10 preview (build 10130) on a machine and use a Microsoft Account that's registered for the Windows Insider program then you'll get the final version of Windows 10 free. Windows 10 will stay genuine, so you can clean install the preview right now and simply upgrade to the final bits for no charge.

Re:So, clarify this for me...

[Brian Kendig]

Also from TFA: "Update, June 21st 9:45AM: Microsoft has updated its blog post today and removed references to 'remain activated.' The stealthy edit isn't acknowledged, and we've reached out to the company for comment."

Re:So, clarify this for me...

[Anonymous Coward]

From http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/06/19/upcoming-changes-to-windows-10-insider-preview-builds/

Stay with us as a Windows Insider

As we’ve announced before, the Windows Insider Program will continue even after we release Windows 10 on July 29th. Windows Insiders will continue to receive future flights as we begin to work on the next release immediately after Windows 10 ships. You’ll get to see the latest Windows fixes, features, and updates and give us feedback. So stay with us! Of course, we’ll provide you an option to leave the program and stay on the final build if you choose: but we hope that we’ll continue to provide you great reasons to remain a Windows Insider.

Update: "remain activated" deleted in MS blog post

[__roo]

From TFA:

Update, June 21st 9:45AM: Microsoft has updated its blog post today and removed references to "remain activated." The stealthy edit isn't acknowledged, and we've reached out to the company for comment.

I bet /. comments helped encourage this.

Re:Updates and patches -- WOW!

[Anonymous Coward]

> Does it mean we will have to pay for updates and patches?

They decided to stop charging for the features and start charging for the bugs!

These guys are gonna be RICH!

Re:Ha-ha. No.

[snowgirl]

A small price to pay to get a free OS for my gaming PC that won't be used for anything else.

Ah it doubles as a nice Chromebook!

Yawn. Another windows...

[TheRealLifeboy]

Free upgrade? My Ubuntu 4.04, 6.04, 8.04, 10.04 and 12.04 was free. Both types, libre and gratis. So was my 14.04.

Is there a Windows 10 Pro technical preview?

[Anonymous Coward]

How do I install the Windows 10 Pro version of Windows 10 Technical Preview?

Re:Update: "remain activated" deleted in MS blog p

[Junta]

Ever more severe correction:
"Once you have successfully installed this build, you will also be able to clean install on that PC from final media if you want to start over fresh. It’s important to note that only people running Genuine Windows 7 or Windows 8.1 can upgrade to Windows 10 as part of the free upgrade offer.*"

Basically, Windows 10 is not *intended* to be free for anyone who wasn't going to get it for free already. MS may not be able to reasonably stop free editions of 10 stemming from free installs of 10 preview, but it certainly seems to reserve the right to try and say that it is invalid per their license terms.

I strongly suspect the initial description will stand. Windows 10 preview activations weren't linked to anything at all, and all signs point to MS not having the ability to discern the history of an activation to see if there is any weirdness that may invalidate. So they are likely in the situation of either letting 'insiders' get 10 for free that were not running genuine 7, 8, 8.1 or screwing over 'insiders' that installed Windows 10 and no longer have the ability to easily prove their Windows 7/8/8.1 genuine status.

Re:Trialware - not free

[labnet]

So what about domain connected computers that don't use a Microsoft account as typically found in most businesses; can they be upgraded?

Re:Trialware - not free

[neilo_1701D]

Windows 7/8 Enterprise is NOT able to upgrade (for free) to Windows 10.

Look at the fine-print here:

It is our intent that most of these devices will qualify, but some hardware/software requirements apply and feature availability may vary by device. Devices must be connected to the internet and have Windows Update enabled. ISP fees may apply. Windows 7 SP1 and Windows 8.1 Update required. Some editions are excluded: Windows 7 Enterprise, Windows 8/8.1 Enterprise, and Windows RT/RT 8.1. Active Software Assurance customers in volume licensing have the benefit to upgrade to Windows 10 enterprise offerings outside of this offer. We will be sharing more information and additional offer and support terms in coming months.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Uberbah]

It is certainly not the job of every poster to anticipate how uninformed you are and then provide links to help you combat your own ignorance.

It's not my job to go along with your strawman, as the only one blathering on about "anticipation" is you. Now where are all those citations proving that you do not in fact have sex with goats? Or are you always this "lazy"?

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Uberbah]

windows layoffs are common knowledge

Not for their Q/A team at the same time they've been prepping for a major release, it's not. It was rather more specific than a vague "Microsoft has had layoffs".

Re:Update: "remain activated" deleted in MS blog p

[Anonymous Coward]

All that means is you can't upgrade from Windows 10 Technical Preview to Windows 10 RTM, you must do a clean install of RTM on that machine. Windows 7 and 8 users can just upgrade.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Zero__Kelvin]

I have no doubt that you can't figure out the difference between trying to find a citation that something is true, versus trying to find a citation that proves a negative. Congratulations, in one single statement you graduated to the top of the moron list here on Slashdot. Kudos, as that is no easy feat.

What about the users who Windows tests?

[Art3x]

What about all the users who Windows tests?

That's the point

[allo]

they want you to use a mircrosoft account instead of a local account. you pay with your data.

Re:Because Microsoft laid off their QA team last f

[Uberbah]

I have no doubt that you can't figure out the difference between trying to find a citation that something is true, versus trying to find a citation that proves a negative.

No one is going to know what is true until it is proven, fuckwit. And it is your job, as the person making the assertion, to back it up. Skepticism isn't lazy, expecting other people to prove your points for you, is.