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Most Healthcare Managers Admit Their IT Systems Have Been Compromised

Lucas123 writes: Eighty-one percent of healthcare IT managers say their organizations have been compromised by at least one malware, botnet or other kind of cyber attack during the past two years, and only half of those managers feel that they are adequately prepared to prevent future attacks, according to a new survey by KPMG. The KPMG survey polled 223 CIOs, CTOs, chief security officers and chief compliance officers at healthcare providers and health plans, and found 65% indicated malware was most frequently reported line of attack during the past 12 to 24 months. Additionally, those surveyed indicated the areas with the greatest vulnerabilities within their organization include external attackers (65%), sharing data with third parties (48%), employee breaches (35%), wireless computing (35%) and inadequate firewalls (27%). Top among reasons healthcare facilities are facing increased risk, was the adoption of digital patient records and the automation of clinical systems.

73 of 122 comments (clear)

  1. Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    It's only a matter of time before real programming becomes a licensed profession.

    And as a developer who know what he's doing, I can't fucking wait for all the clowns to be weeded out of my profession.

    And if you don't want actual standards and real legal responsibility, YOU ARE ONE OF THE CLOWNS.

    1. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by sexconker · · Score: 2

      All indicators show that programming is becoming less professional, not more so.
      At best, you'll get some sort of liability clauses built into big military / government contracts that will be ultimately toothless when shit goes wrong.

    2. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "And if you don't want actual standards and real legal responsibility, YOU ARE ONE OF THE CLOWNS."

      You don't know many professional working under license, do you? They would show you quite a different point of view.

    3. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by Z34107 · · Score: 2

      And as a developer who know what he's doing, I can't fucking wait for all the clowns to be weeded out of my profession.

      You can't be that great if you haven't heard of Dunning-Kruger.

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    4. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by RabidReindeer · · Score: 1

      It's only a matter of time before real programming becomes a licensed profession.

      And as a developer who know what he's doing, I can't fucking wait for all the clowns to be weeded out of my profession.

      And if you don't want actual standards and real legal responsibility, YOU ARE ONE OF THE CLOWNS.

      They tried licensing exams back in the 1970s and failed. Even back then, the field was too broad for a 1-size-fits-all set of exams. The only ways I can see to make licensing work is by having a trustworthy board that certifies based on proven training or experience. And based on union practices, getting a board that isn't slanted towards "friends" is hard enough.

      Then again, as long as employers hire whoever bids the least over skills or experience, you can forget about them paying for licensed practitioners.

    5. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by onkelonkel · · Score: 2

      Cool idea. We could call the licensed programmers "Software Engineers", and have it actually be true.

      --
      None of them can see the clouds; The polished wings don't care.
    6. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by jellomizer · · Score: 1

      It isn't the software that is the danger point. It is piss poor management culture in health care.
      Granted medical software is decades behind the time compared to other sectors. But it is because health care management culture just doesn't get IT.
      There are doctors with their ego, who think med school makes them qualified in all things.
      Then you get higher ups in the business areas who need to pick and choose the fights with the doctors because most of the stuff they want is purely stupid or unreasonable. Plus these guys have their ego to contend with.
      So they compromise. Now don't get me wrong knowing when to compromising is a good thing, however when it becomes your management bread and butter it creates solutions that everyone dislikes.
      IT in health care is compromised because leadership just makes compromises with everyone.

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
    7. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by jellomizer · · Score: 1

      You want to find the scape goat for a security glitch.
      Who is at fault?
      The guy who coded it?
      What wasn't it double checked?
      Was the product rushed out?
      Was the product used for its original use?

      Making it a licensed profession will not improve quality, it will make sure programmer salaries stay high (a good thing), but also reduce startups and new ideas.
      Now it may be more prudent to have the software certified as secure from an outside certificate who isn't paid by the software maker, that will analyze the software on many fronts including source analysis.

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
    8. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We could call the licensed programmers "Software Engineers", and have it actually be true.

      The trouble is, it wouldn't be, because we're probably still several decades away from the kind of maturity and evidence base we'd need in the industry to actually do software development as a true engineering discipline. It's a laudable goal, but we don't know how to do it yet.

      --
      If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
    9. Re:Aaaand *NOTHING* happens to them... by kmoser · · Score: 1

      Great idea! I'm glad you're looking forward to following my standards.

  2. Solution: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Just relocate the servers to Hillary's basement. It's an accountability-free zone. Because obeying laws is for the little people.

    1. Re:Solution: by ewhac · · Score: 2, Informative

      BWHA-HA-HAHAHAH!! Z0MG, you're so Hillary-ous!!

      ...Oh, wait: http://www.dailynewsbin.com/ne...

      Looks like e-Ghazi was a big nothing-burger. Which is what we dirty fscking hippies have been saying ever since it was first trotted out. But: Please continue, Governor. Don't let minor things like facts get in the way of a good right-wing misogynistic rant. Your lives are bleak and meaningless enough as it is.

    2. Re:Solution: by fredgiblet · · Score: 2

      The mention of Benghazi is likely a reference to the fact that Republicans are STILL trying to make Benghazi out to be a conspiracy despite multiple independent investigations turning up nothing.

    3. Re:Solution: by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      All that counts is winning. Morals, ethics, basic honesty, those are for everyone else. You're probably not allowed to be a cannibal in politics, but that's just about the only real line there is.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    4. Re:Solution: by fredgiblet · · Score: 1

      Pedophilia is probably out as well.

    5. Re:Solution: by Calydor · · Score: 1

      If I took 300 million in bribes I would retire for the rest of my life, not stay in the public eye.

      --
      -=This sig has nothing to do with my comment. Move along now=-
    6. Re:Solution: by BVis · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You assholes never miss a chance to inject your political ideology into a discussion where it's not relevant, do you.

      I can do that too:

      "It looks like healthcare IT has the same attitude towards its quality that George W Bush had towards 9-11."

      --
      Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
    7. Re:Solution: by meta-monkey · · Score: 3, Informative

      "It looks like healthcare IT has the same attitude towards its quality that George W Bush had towards 9-11."

      What are you talking about? Healthcare IT is a disaster, but 9/11 was a smashing success for Bush.

      --
      We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
  3. Holey Moley by lbalbalba · · Score: 1

    Am I they only one that is completely freaked out by this ? These are some seriously scary numbers !

    1. Re:Holey Moley by gweihir · · Score: 3

      This has zero surprise value to anybody active in the IT security field. And yes, the numbers are scary, but they have been building up to today's abysmal state over several decades, as companies noticed they could get away with it and nothing was happening to them. I now even have heard the head of IT security of a large company serving a lot of customers say that a data-breach was not a reputational risk, because it happened so often these days that customers forget fast.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    2. Re:Holey Moley by gstoddart · · Score: 1

      Freaked out in the "gee I'm so totally surprised by this" sense? Not even a little.

      Freaked out that organizations continue to be grossly incompetent with IT and security and bear no responsibility? Absolutely.

      This stuff is all around us, on a constant basis. That these guys know they've been compromised and done nothing means they are either incompetent, or so grossly underfunded there was only ever going to be one outcome.

      But apparently being grossly negligent and incompetent with security isn't something which ever gets acted on. Because nobody ever seems to have any actual penalties for this kind of stuff.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    3. Re:Holey Moley by quantaman · · Score: 1

      Am I they only one that is completely freaked out by this ? These are some seriously scary numbers !

      I think some context is important. From what I can tell is a criminal organization hacking the hospital so they can access patient records and blackmail the patients is going to be counted the same as the secretary opening an email attachment, getting a virus, and temporarily turning into part of a botnet. It might not even be clear from IT's perspective which is which but I'm guessing most of those breaches are fairly benign.

      --
      I stole this Sig
    4. Re:Holey Moley by coofercat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      These numbers are basically bollocks. I'd be prepared to bet that 80% of any businesses, large, small or from the planet Zod have had a malware infection within the last 2 years. The point is that they're asking if they've had *any* problem - it could be that someone clicked a link, they realised their mistake and called IT to rebuild their machine, right up to confidential data transmission to parties unknown.

      If they'd asked "have you lost any confidential patient data in the last 2 years?", I bet the number admitting to it would be virtually zero. For those that have lost data and know about it, they've either been out in public already, or else are doing everything they can to cover it up as it could be commercial suicide to admit such a thing. I'll bet the majority of companies of any sort couldn't be sure data had been lost unless it was a massive loss or performed by some idiot employee who got caught loading his desktop into the back of his car. Admitting you caught a virus here or there is pretty much a zero-risk thing to admit, because in most cases it causes no direct harm other than some extra work for some IT folks.

      For all its worth, we could ask "has your home network been port scanned in the last year?". 80% of slashdotters would say yes, the other 20% would say no because they haven't checked, and yet nothing of value was gained or lost as a result. For extra click bait, I could then add "port scanning is the first step to far more serious hacks which could result in data loss" (which would mimic all the scaremongering in the article, all of which is attributed to KPMG).

  4. Give me a choice by ebonum · · Score: 1

    I wish I could request paper records. Some old systems are better than the replacement. I would rather not be entered into any electronic system.

    The current electronic record systems are notoriously hard to use. Nurses and doctors end up copying and pasting and clicking through these systems with little regard to the accuracy of the data. As a result, when there is a lawsuit, the extremely poor data quality of the medical records ends up hugely supporting the plaintiff.

    From a more basic perspective: when I'm the the dr.'s office watching them type in my heart rate and blood pressure and notes, I'm thinking that my data is going into a central records system somewhere in the hospital where everything is in one spot so that it is easy to steal when it is eventually all stolen ( more specifically downloaded by someone who doesn't even need to enter the building. ).

    This is how databases work. They put all your eggs in one basket. Plus, you can't have openness ( e.g. the paramedics can get to your records in seconds after finding your driver's license so that they know your pre-existing conditions ) and strong security. The goal of electronic records, making it easy to let a long list of people from the pharmacy to the insurance company to the government "server you better", is completely inconsistent with data privacy. If I can log into a webpage and view my records, it is only a matter of time before those records are stolen.

    1. Re:Give me a choice by Tablizer · · Score: 1

      I wish I could request paper records. Some old systems are better than the replacement.

      Better yet, let's use stone tablets so that it's harder for thieves to steal more than a few at a time. Paper is too easy to slip under a coat or tunic. And rats & moths eat it.

      Never once was Fred Flintstone hacked.

    2. Re:Give me a choice by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      Etching them in cave walks in ideograms might do the trick.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    3. Re:Give me a choice by reboot246 · · Score: 1

      Well, there was that one time that Fred caught Wilma in bed with Barney. He was pretty hacked off about that.

    4. Re:Give me a choice by Z34107 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I wish I could request paper records.

      You really don't. I've shilled for EHRs before, but the TL;DR is

      • Paper charts kill people. They don't check for drug interactions; they don't double-check that you've got the right patient when you're operating or administering medications; in the case of a recall, they can't tell you who received a bad batch of a vaccine; and they certainly can't tell a first responder that unconscious you is allergic to blue dye, unless they already happen know your regular clinic and have a fax machine in the ambulance.
      • Paper charts are useless for patient care. The hospitalist trying to reconcile what you were taking at home with what they want to give you in the hospital can't actually determine whether they're about to kill you if the cardiologist treating your heart attack happened to take the only copy of the chart to enter his notes. If they made a second copy for the cardiologist, there's no guarantee his notes and medications will ever get entered into the hospitalists copy, or into pharmacy's copy, who might also wonder why two different doctors plus your PCP are trying to dose you on blood thinners, or into your regular doctor's copy, who might be totally unaware of the cardiologist's findings
      • Paper charts are expensive. If nobody knows that you already had a lab or an X-Ray, they're going to order it again. If they do know you had one of the above, you're going to have to wait for a fax, or for them to mail negatives. Because handwriting and general disorganization, especially over a long admission, tends to make them write-only, it's much harder to know exactly what they gave you and why, which makes it harder to justify to the government or an insurance company why they should pay your tab.

      That doesn't mean the electronic versions don't have terrible, even maddening, flaws, but even the worst are better than paper.

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    5. Re:Give me a choice by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      Ah yes, that was in the days before Stonebamacare. Poor Barney, his quarry health insurance didn't cover testicle reattachment.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    6. Re:Give me a choice by Z34107 · · Score: 3, Informative

      I hear you--even within a hospital system, and even where standards exist, it's a pain. Ultrasound machines (for those that aren't imaging informaticists) are supposed to speak DICOM, but some do it creatively--one technically sent DICOM messages over the network, but most of what they contained was wrapped inside a proprietary XML blob rather than standard DICOM fields. What standard fields were implemented were implemented strangely, waffling between spelling out measurements ("centimeters") or using their abbreviations, mixing case, and reporting measurements to absurd precision (dozens of zeroes after the decimal point, for a bone measured in millimeters).

      Sharing charts between hospitals is a mire of politics. There's the government's own Direct standard, which they mandated every hospital use to send charts, without any indication of what the recipient is supposed to do--a lot pipe them to /dev/null, because the vaguely defined content of the message is often useless and redundant with existing methods of communication. They're now working on legalese to require that you "do something" with the messages you receive, but exactly what that is (and how to objectively prove that you did it) they're still figuring out.

      Then there are organizations like Commonwell, trying to monetize a data-sharing "standard" not even their founding members could be bothered to implement. They haven't sent a single chart as far as I know, but that doesn't stop them from issuing press releases praising their "interoperability" with the same frequency AT&T issues press releases praising their gigabit fiber.

      Then there are HISPs (centralized, sometimes quasi-public, repositories of patient information). Some have managed to legislate themselves as mandatory middlemen, and, having done so, have proceeded to extract monopoly rents over the transmission of outdated and incorrect patient information. Even better is provider look-up--if they give you the wrong fax number for a physician, you are responsible for the HIPAA violation when a random gas station gets someone's medical information. This causes them to care as much as you'd expect about the integrity of the data they peddle (and that you're required to buy).

      It's frustrating, because medical information has to be shared for it to be of use--there's no use having a mammography if no one will read the results, or if the people treating you can't access the study and have to order their own.

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    7. Re:Give me a choice by Z34107 · · Score: 1

      Certain kinds of errors have decreased dramatically. Computers reduce wrong patient/wrong medication errors dramatically, especially in systems that require you to scan the patient's barcode (to make sure you have the right patient), and then scan each medication's barcode (to make sure you've got the right meds). There's a lot of scholarly research available if you search for EHR medication errors, but this is one of the first non-paywalled things that pops up in Google.

      Other issues are more challenging. You might have grabbed the right IV bag, and the computer might have confirmed that it had the right barcode, but that alone doesn't prevent pharmacy from filling the bag with the wrong fluid in the first place, or putting the wrong barcode on the wrong bag. It also doesn't stop a harried nurse from failing to mix both diluent and active ingredient of a vaccine when filling a syringe, or from using the same insulin pen on multiple patients; nor do computers keep toddlers from digging fentanyl patches out of the trash, overdosing on painkillers, and dying.

      TL;DR most kinds of medical errors are decreasing, and computers tend to help--they're good at checking meds, and good at counting how many sponges you had in the OR field before and after cutting the patient up. Others are still around--handwashing compliance can still be flakey, silk neckties encounter years of sick people yet are never laundered, and "nosocomial infections" are still troublesome. Pick your favorite kind of medical error and give it a Google for recent stats.

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    8. Re:Give me a choice by Z34107 · · Score: 1

      It doesn't do ANYTHING you are talking about

      EHRs absolutely do do all of those things, including checking drug interactions, allergies, and pregnancy and lactation warnings, and there absolutely is scholarly evidence of their effectiveness if you care to Google. Here's one concluding barcoding and CPOE are "vital."

      If your EHR doesn't do those things, then that's a defect peculiar to whatever software you're using.

      The medication lists are ALWAYS wrong or misleading as they are huge and hard to read, harder to update

      You think they were any shorter, easier, or more up to date on paper? A bad computer system can make med rec harder, but even a good one can't make anyone give a shit about the patient's PTA meds. Nor can a hospital losing Joint Commission accreditation, apparently.

      results from another EMR is always incompatible, so you have to scan it in

      Yes, that's very common. It doesn't have to be the case, but it usually is.

      Have you read an EMR progress note?

      Yes. I have read lots and lots of EMR progress notes. I've seen notes filled with pages of stale labs because computers make it easy to copy forward the entire chart. I've seen notes flagged by the built-in plagiarism tools because copy-pasting an old note (and getting paid when you file it!) is easier than actually rounding on the patient. I've seen SOAP notes filed with weeks-old vitals because one group of residents preferred copying things into and out of Microsoft Word, which didn't exactly have the latest telemetry. I've seen notes with assessments that weren't done, filed on patients that weren't rounded on, because easy money.

      But you know what? You can read them. And so can the doctor who sees the patient after you.

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    9. Re:Give me a choice by Z34107 · · Score: 1

      Keep searching, m8. There really is a lot of stuff out there: Medication errors: prevention using information technology systems

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    10. Re:Give me a choice by fredgiblet · · Score: 1

      Computers were invented well before 2009.

  5. Attack of the cyber attack malware .. by nickweller · · Score: 1

    Only the technically illiterate use 'cyber' in relation to the Internet. Please stop embarrassing your readers.

    "those surveyed indicated the areas with the greatest vulnerabilities within their organization include external attackers (65%), sharing data with third parties (48%), employee breaches (35%), wireless computing (35%) and inadequate firewalls (27%)."

    In todays distributed, objects-in-the-cloud type of Internet, anti-virus are mostly ineffectual, so are firewalls as procedure calls can be relayed over HTML.

    1. Re:Attack of the cyber attack malware .. by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · · Score: 1

      The problem is, as soon as someone attacks you and the proxies activate, they'll be scattered all over the Internet.

  6. One more reason not to use SSN for healthcare ID by schwit1 · · Score: 1

    Healthcare records should have zero connection to your finances.

  7. Hey! back off the insults! by laurencetux · · Score: 1

    You are insulting the fine profession OF CLOWNING.

    (although some folks taking up clowning instead of ...)

  8. half aren't adequately prepared the rest are liars by Narcocide · · Score: 1

    No, many of us have been shouting about this for so long that everyone else stopped listening.

  9. Re:My nurse case managers PC or email got hacked.. by Narcocide · · Score: 1

    They probably hacked her phone too.

  10. clueless management by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 2

    Being licensed profession will stop clueless management from force stuff to be so easy to hack / not willing to pay the costs to have be done right.

    1. Re:clueless management by Z34107 · · Score: 1

      Being licensed profession will stop clueless management from force stuff to be so easy to hack / not willing to pay the costs to have be done right.

      If you're going to make it illegal for literally anyone else to write software, then maybe. I'd love to see you square your favorite licensing regime with anything resembling open source development.

      --
      DATABASE WOW WOW
    2. Re:clueless management by gweihir · · Score: 1

      The good thing is that licensed professionals have to adhere to professional standards or become liable.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    3. Re:clueless management by mSparks43 · · Score: 1

      NSA spent so much money making the systems insecure, and 20% of systems still not weak enough.

  11. malware by phantomfive · · Score: 1

    Malware could mean something as simple as "the accountant tried to install a screensaver." This story really doesn't tell us anything about how often critical medical systems are attacked......

    (and of course the systems are vulnerable, just like every other system connected to the internet).

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    1. Re:malware by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Right. So the real question is, how many of these were HIPAA violations? Knowing that malware got installed on some PC doesn't tell you much.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    2. Re:malware by Nethemas+the+Great · · Score: 1

      Deliberate attacks generally target insurance data. You can't make much off of knowing someone got a booboo, but insurance fraud is a gold mine.

      That isn't to say that ambient malware isn't finding its way everywhere else. The reality is that modalities (CTs, MRIs, etc.), are rarely patched, many are running ancient versions of Windows. Re-imaging systems--sometimes near daily at some facilities--is the normal strategy for addressing malware. Lack of support from the manufacturer being principally to blame. Most facilities have a strong concern for security but there's often an absence of adequately qualified IT staff to address the matter elsewhere in the facility.

      --
      Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once ... with negative results.
    3. Re:malware by gweihir · · Score: 1

      "The accountant tried to install a screensaver." does not usually generate a security incident.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    4. Re:malware by gweihir · · Score: 1

      And on the plus-side, if somebody dies as a result, a hospital is an ideal place for that to not attract notice until the numbers become significant. Sure, errors are made and if for every 100 dead from human error, you have 1 dead from computer compromise, I can live with that. As long as it is not targeted. (And I know that wherever decisions are made, errors are made and that is just as it is and we have to live with is. Not making decisions is far worse.)

      These days, most hackers to not have the knowledge to attack medical information or industrial sites in a way that does real damage, but it is only a matter of time before some do.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    5. Re:malware by guruevi · · Score: 1

      Why aren't the nursing stations locked down? Why are they even running Windows? Why does your application require such high privileges?

      The first thing to do would be to boot the ridiculous vendor requirements from the system(s) and either go with a decent system or build your own.

      --
      Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
  12. Re:One more reason not to use SSN for healthcare I by timrod · · Score: 1

    The problem is, that's not something that could be realistically done. Health insurance has to have your SSN to determine identity and for tax purposes - the insurer needs to make sure they are billing the right people, and they need to make sure that their clients can verify their insurance information because of the way health insurance (especially through an employer) interacts with the tax system. Most employer-provided health insurance is paid for pre-tax, and if the IRS comes along with any questions as to whether the insurance is real or not, there has to be a way to prove it. At the same time, the hospitals and other care providers need SSNs to be able to correctly bill the insurance companies for the right person's care.

  13. Why just healthcare IT managers? by QuietLagoon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It wouldn't surprise me if the statistic held true across all industries.

    1. Re:Why just healthcare IT managers? by gweihir · · Score: 1

      With the abysmal state of IT security these days? No you will get no argument from me.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    2. Re:Why just healthcare IT managers? by acoustix · · Score: 1

      With the abysmal state of IT security these days? No you will get no argument from me.

      Let's look at why IT security is where it's at today: We have people forcing new, untested, cool buzzword technology into the workplace that are not needed.

      --
      "A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
  14. Re:half aren't adequately prepared the rest are li by gweihir · · Score: 1

    Very true, unfortunately.

    --
    Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
  15. Those same executives are resistant to updating by garyebickford · · Score: 1

    The company I work for, Bright Plaza, has a SAAS that can almost eliminate the risk of phishing attacks and several other threats, while improving the user login experience. (It's a proof of knowledge SAAS that can support almost any type of proof of knowledge, from text and picture passwords to cognitive self tests and others.) And, based on the number of Lamborghini's at the Healthcare IT conferences, there's no lack of money available. Even more, the HIPAA lawas make it extremely expensive to expose clients' personal data. But from our attempts to to get healthcare companies to consider actually implementing, or installing even dirt simple new features, they have zero interest in actually doing anything about this. Like lemmings, they will either keep running their own systems (often dating back years), or if they're already sucked into one of the vendor systems will just wait until EPIC, or one of the other big three vendors, provides some new halfway measures.

    --
    It's easier to be a result of the past, but more fun to be a cause of the future! http://www.spacefinancegroup.com/
  16. Re:One more reason not to use SSN for healthcare I by guruevi · · Score: 2

    So the health care provider needs a health insurance subscriber number, not an SSN to identify someone. The health provider can in turn have the SSN but that limits the surface significantly.

    --
    Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
  17. In other news... by stinkydog · · Score: 2

    20% of Healthcare CIOs are idiots or liars. Every healthcare organization has seen the basic web malware on the the inside of the firewall. If they haven't been cyptolockered at least once, the do not use the internet. Patching in healthcare sucks. Doctors do anything they want with IT systems. If you have an electronic healthcare record, someone unauthorized has seen it. Hospitals systems are busy building new sites and cutting IT 10%. I saw one EHR deployment where every client/user logged into the database as "SA". The only faith I have in the system is that it has been compromised already...

    SD

    --
    âoeWho knew something as harmless as willful ignorance could end up having real consequences?â
    1. Re:In other news... by Antique+Geekmeister · · Score: 1

      > 20% of Healthcare CIOs are idiots or liars.

      Or both., I'm afraid. Or the survey was badly constructed. I've seen a number of security compliance surveys, especially now with HIPAA laws affecting health care security, that were designed to allow hospital IT departments to claim more or less security with subtle interpretation. The result is that for medical IT staff who needed more security funding, and wanted to justify the work, they'd answer the surveys one way and say "we have a problem, we need to spend money". And if they wanted to report success the next year, despite no genuine oerall change, they'd choose other similarly "interpritive" answers and point to the improvement in security.

    2. Re:In other news... by acoustix · · Score: 1

      I saw one EHR deployment where every client/user logged into the database as "SA".

      Unfortunately this isn't limited to heatlhcare. I know of banks (plural) where everyone in the office logged into their Novell systems as "admin". Everyone.

      --
      "A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
    3. Re:In other news... by mu51c10rd · · Score: 1

      . I know of banks (plural) where everyone in the office logged into their Novell systems as "admin".

      That is the ultimate security...could you even find a black hat person willing to bother with Novell anymore?

  18. Re:So 19% are lying, delusional, or don't know? by davester666 · · Score: 1

    The only real solution is to give the whole project over to the NSA. They'll make sure nobody else has access to the data, unless they get paid.

    --
    Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
  19. It's 100%, those numbers are lies by behrooz0az · · Score: 2

    I have hacked into 3 different hospitals, not large ones, moderate size.
    None of which took more than 15 minutes to do, And I did it with my phone because I was bored waiting in line to see the doctor.
    Got all the doctors names, what surgery is where, the insurance contacts, the accounting data, how much everyone gets paid(best part) but didn't touch patient data because I knew that one has it's own criminal penalties.
    Point being no one noticed, no one cares to notice, after years they still don't know.
    I didn't even go after the hospitals seriously, I used a fucking phone.
    I don't know how much harder it can be to penetrate insurance companies or large hospital chains. but it can be done in a timely manner. I beleive You can actually have a timetable for hacking them because they all use the same crappy software vendors.

    --
    Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion. -- Spazmania (174582)
    1. Re:It's 100%, those numbers are lies by behrooz0az · · Score: 1

      s/contacts/contracts

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      Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion. -- Spazmania (174582)
  20. No surprise - I work in the industry by cpm99352 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Incompetence abounds in the health care industry:

    1. Legacy mainframe systems that have no data integrity - dates like 99/99/9999 are considered valid

    2. Legacy mainframe systems that have no data integrity - tabs present in names & addresses, so a tab-delimited extract then proves challenging

    3. IT Staff who refuse to block China and the -stans (despite having only US coverage), saying that it is not a complete solution.

    4. On the database side, passwords stored in cleartext. Surprisingly, this apparently isn't a violation of PCI rules.


    My advice? If you have a sensitive claim, pay cash and don't involve the insurance company. This is difficult, and may require you to use a different doctor when going this route. Bonus points if you can use fake ID. You would be absolutely astonished at where the claims data goes. Third parties get all sorts of data. HIPAA exclusions are enormous. If you think only your doctor knows about your embarassing drug addiction/sexual disease/mental health problem you are grossly mistaken.

  21. Re:One more reason not to use SSN for healthcare I by fredgiblet · · Score: 2

    Would be nice if we could have 2-3 National ID numbers of varying security so that we could give the low security one to places like that, reserving the high security one for things like finances.

  22. Re:what source is that? by dave420 · · Score: 1

    Ad hominem all the way!

  23. Re:Federal law requires your participation by dave420 · · Score: 1

    The ACA system is about as far from socialism as you can get. Parroting that canard only reflects poorly on you.

  24. But who will watch the watchers^Wregulators? by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 1

    The good thing is that licensed professionals have to adhere to professional standards or become liable.

    The problem is who sets those standards.

    No-one knows how to write perfect software, because there is no such thing. Even with technically perfect implementation, there are always questions of requirements and design where at some point the specification of what you need isn't in a neat, unambiguous, technical form.

    Very few people in the world know how to write highly robust and secure software, and the cost of doing so is often high. A few more people are exploring various potentially better ways of doing things, which might improve the situation in the long term, but for now there isn't a large and reliable body of evidence to support most of these ideas. Crucially, in many cases today, even skilled and diligent professionals who will all do good work may genuinely disagree about which tools and techniques they prefer to use and why.

    Regulation and licensing would most likely be based on "best practices" determined by some central organisation, but there is a tiny pool of candidates who are even remotely qualified to make such judgements and a tiny body of evidence to support it. Realistically, that means the people settings the standards probably won't be the real experts, such as they are. No, the regulators will more likely be people like those consultants who sell a different trendy methodology every few years, and the idea of giving those vacuous salespeople a louder voice than already have and actual legal powers over how other professionals develop software is more terrifying than any bug.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  25. It's not just healthcare, either by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 2

    You make a good point, but it applies beyond healthcare too.

    May I introduce you to the auto industry? They'd like to sell you a new car that is always on-line, accepts OTA updates, and runs the safety-critical vehicle control systems on the same bus as the infotainment controls. What could possibly go wrong? (It's ironic that among the reports of hacks and abuses over recent months, there was also a report suggesting that many customers didn't use or actively didn't want a lot of these new electronic gadgets in their vehicles anyway. The only developments that almost everyone seemed to support were the directly safety-related driver aids.)

    Then we have the financial and insurance industries, whose only requirement for any software they make sometimes seems to be "minimise fraud". Obviously that's an important commercial requirement, but meanwhile, they still can't reliably do basic things like sending money from person A to person B, providing secure and usable on-line banking facilities, providing working IT for their in-branch staff, or sometimes even keeping accurate records of who is authorised to access an account or facility.

    --
    If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
  26. Not surprising by mu51c10rd · · Score: 1

    Why is this surprising to anyone? I am sure it is quite similar in every industry. Between businesses cutting their IT staff (especially common between 2008-2012), moving from dedicated security people to having the admins be responsible for security as a secondary responsibility, to having dedicated security people from certificate factories who are more interested in checklists and getting shiny new toys from whichever vendor gets them the best bribe (movie tickets, sports game tickets, etc.); how is anyone surprised. I don't work in IT security, but I find there are not very many good security people out there, and even the good ones can struggle to find jobs as security people were easy to let go when companies don't value it as a "mission critical" headcount for RIFs. I suppose the only surprising thing in this article is that there aren't more data breaches that have occurred in healthcare.

  27. Re:Federal law requires your participation by scamper_22 · · Score: 1

    It really depends.

    Are we talking 'true' socialism is big fat quotes.
    Or are we talking the kind of system that tend to occur when socialists implement their policies.

    It's the same communism or capitalism as abstract ideals.
    We can theorize that the Soviet Union was not truly communist. But there never was an ideal communist state.
    We can theorize what an ideal libertarian state could be, but there never was such a state.

    Yet in the end of the day, what actually matters is the policy that comes out.

    The ACA is in line with modern socialist policies.
    1. Forces your participation
    2. Attempts to provide a service to the poor via subsidies
    3. Reduces choice in the kinds of coverage you can have. The minimum is not just a basic minimum for emergencies so hospitals emergencies don't go unpaid.
    4. various pricing control mechanism on providers
    5. attempts to control an industry via the state ...

    The ACA might not be ideal socialism, but
    saying that the ACA is about as far from socialism as you can get is simply parroting a canard that only reflects poorly on you.

  28. Re:One more reason not to use SSN for healthcare I by eth1 · · Score: 1

    Would be nice if we could have 2-3 National ID numbers of varying security so that we could give the low security one to places like that, reserving the high security one for things like finances.

    No, we need to fundamentally change the system so that its "security" doesn't rely on the secrecy of a few widely distributed numbers.