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Samsung Decides Not To Patch Kernel Vulnerabilities In Some S4 Smartphones
An anonymous reader writes: QuarksLAB, a security research company, has stumbled upon two kernel vulnerabilities for Samsung Galaxy S4 devices, which Samsung has decided to patch only for recent devices running Android Lollipop, but not Jelly Bean or KitKat. The two vulnerabilities (kernel memory disclosure and kernel memory corruption) were discovered in February 2014 and reported to Samsung in August 2014, affecting the samsung_extdisp driver of Samsung S4 (GT-I9500) devices. Bugs break ASLR and lead to denial of service (DoS) state or even elevating attacker privileges.
The number of exploits is increasing exponentially but the vendors are scaling back security patches across the board.
MBA's FTW.
Apple doesn't either. I bought a 3G at about the end of its sale, and got one year support.
Learn to love Alaska
What kind of dumbass company is going to spend money porting a new version of an OS to an old platform, with no payday for doing so?
Mobile phone vendors make their money selling new phones. You want a new Android, get a new phone. Your contract will be up in 2 years, and at 18 months, you will be offered a new phone with early renewal, so just wait until the contract is up, re-up the contract, and get the new phone with the fix.
KTHX BAI.
I don't understand why phone manufacturers and carriers don't get sued for things like this. Carriers have typically required two year contracts for phone subsidies, and normally it's possible to buy a phone two years old and get it free. At least that's how it is in the US. That means you can buy a phone that's as much as three years old and have a reasonable expectation to use it for two years because that's the contract with your carrier. That means manufacturers and carriers should provide support for a minimum of five years. That means a phone released in October 2015 should have support until October 2020. I think a customer has a reasonable expectation of this. If nothing else, that should be grounds for a lawsuit against manufacturers and carriers. There's also the issue of delays in fixing vulnerabilities both with the manufacturers and then the carriers. Again, I think there's a reasonable expectation for security updates in a timely manner. Also, when phones ship with locked bootloaders and customers can't choose to unlock them, it makes it very difficult to install a patched version of the OS. This also voids the warranty if you're able to do it. Customers are screwed no matter what they do in this situation, which is why carriers and manufacturers should be sued in the absence of specific laws to protect customers.
I can't help but wonder if the decision to not provide software updates to older phones is partly because people don't see a huge difference between models and this is one way to push people to buy newer and more expensive phones. I can't say it for certain, but it wouldn't surprise me if that's part of the decision process.
M-I-Z
kU still sucks!
http://www.oppo.com/en/smartph... What about the Oppo?
Learn to love Alaska
How do you fix bugs in the proprietary closed source drivers?
bullshit.
Software wise apple supports out to at least 3 years and with iOS 9 out to 5 years of previous build models.
if you bought a 3 year old phone and then expected updates you got what you deserve.
Android models rarely get one year of updates, and almost never get 3-5 years of bug fixes.
i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
And if a company dies, the IP of all its products go to the official receiver - who should put them in the public domain.
Everyone with a phone should be entitled to join a class action against any manufacturer who does not provide a way to fix security problems - so long as the phone is capable of operation: ie until physical death of said phone.
Separately, there ought to be a law preventing sale of undocumented hardware to the general public. If you don't know what it is you own, how do you know it is safe to own it? If the manufacturer prevents you from knowing, surely he takes responsibility for its safety, and should be required to place a bond with the government covering the maximum possible risk (of being sued by all phone owners, everywhere, repeatedly, with the highest legal costs that lawyers can imagine).
Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
Most android phones already have outdated software when sold and only go downhill from there because they are never updated.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
This article makes no sense. It says the vulnerability affects the Galaxy S4 but only if you are running an outdated firmware (like Kit kat). However, there is an official (pushed OTA) update to Jelly Bean on this device, so all you have to do to not be vulnerable is apply the update! Same as usual: if you want to avoid vulnerabilities, update your stuff regularly.
If the manufacturer wishes to end support for a phone - he should be required to open source ALL the code, and release ALL hardware documentation.
I'd like to see that as much as you would, perhaps even more. But that's not SOP in any industry, what makes you think we have a hope of getting that for mobiles?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
These "dumbass" companies have a few more generations of device sales before this becomes a major problem. Then something has to give.
If a phone is available in the store at full retail, the clock for EOL has not started ticking. Now, we know that a true fanboy lines up to buy the phone at launch, and for Apple, those are the people who it's important to keep squealing with glee.
I had a 3 Gen iPod Touch 'go out of support' for new iOS versions less than a year after I bought it. I shouldn't be penalized that way for buying an Apple product late in the period when it is being foisted off on the market as 'current.' Incidentally that iPod is probably the last Apple hardware I will ever buy. There were two iPods that I bought before it.
Android phones are not driven in obsolescence by a team at Apple who urges developers to move onto the new API as soon as possible. So the App Store doesn't stop having current apps for Android phones for much, much longer than with Apple. Look at the number of current-version apps you can still get to run on a KitKat phone, and compare that to the apps you can get for a 3G iOS device today.
When you buy an iOS product you are buying from a company determined to make it obsolete within a year or two of you buying it.
Look at the number of current-version apps you can still get to run on a KitKat phone, and compare that to the apps you can get for a 3G iOS device today.
I still have a device running Gingerbread because it only has 512MB RAM and that's a bit tight. It's just a clock now, and occasionally plays some music or acts as a Kodi remote, so no problem. It's kind of amazing though how much software will still run on that, or at least, doesn't require any later API support. Who knows how well it will run on a 1.5 GHz (OC'd) single core, even if it does have a decent Adreno.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Snort, talk about trying to turn lemons into lemonade... Apple supports it's devices for multiple years and has been successful in drawing users to upgrade their OS as time goes on. Not everyone rushes out to buy the latest iDevice. Many, like me forgo 3 or 4 cycles -- and yet we still have the latest OS. The reason so much android software still supports antique OSes with multiple well known security weaknesses making them a security nightmare is precisely because Android has been able to do the same.
Oh goody, I can still install the original angry birds on my android device, that more than makes up for it's popping up unrelated ads when I surf the net & sniffing my credentials when I connect to my bank...
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
HTC ONE M8.... still stuck on the craptastic 5.0... HTC and AT&T suggests throwing it away and buying a new phone if I want updates.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
they're to put money in a lawyers pocket and a $5 off your next phone coupon in yours. It'd probably be too hard to sue over something like this. It's too hard for a jury of 50 somethings (who are the only folks that could take 6 months off for the trial) to understand. How's that joke go? 10 people too dumb to get out of jury duty...
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
popping up unrelated ads when I surf the net
Yes, we know iOS has ad blockers now. Don't worry, Android has had them for years. Not sure WTF you're talking about here.
sniffing my credentials when I connect to my bank
Or here. Elaborate?
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
It's not that they're no longer updating it, but rather that they're going to update directly to Marshmallow. If you don't get that update when HTC releases it, perhaps it's time to switch to a carrier that doesn't block updates in the name of selling phones.
Also, what do you find so craptastic about 5.0? And shouldn't that be 5.0.1 if you're actually up to date? Nothing really changed (on my Nexus 6 at least) from 5.0.1. to 5.1.1, so you're not really missing out on anything exierience-wise. As for security, AT&T pushed HTC's patch for Stagefright (and other known and already-patched-in-AOSP vulns) back in August, it was a patch coming in between 28 and 55MB depending on device configuration, so I'm not sure what you're considering craptastic there, either.
If your complaint is that you're not on Marshmallow (which we were told would be out last quarter) yet, can it. Neither am I and I'm running a Nexus 6. Know why? Because it isn't out yet.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
Bluetooth stability, phone stability, etc... A LOT of phones have problems with 5.0.x
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Sounds like a phone problem, not an Android problem. Shoddy drivers, perhaps? Google doesn't write (most of) those. My N6 is rock solid.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
I had a 3 Gen iPod Touch 'go out of support' for new iOS versions less than a year after I bought it. I shouldn't be penalized that way for buying an Apple product late in the period when it is being foisted off on the market as 'current.' Incidentally that iPod is probably the last Apple hardware I will ever buy. There were two iPods that I bought before it.
Let's look at your claim: You had a iPod Touch 3rd gen. It was released Sept 9, 2009 and discontinued Sept 1, 2010 when the iPod Touch 4th gen was released. It started out with iOS 3.1.1 (July 2009) and could be updated to 5.1.1 (May 2012). For only one year was your model "current". The OS was updated for almost 2 years after it was discontinued. I'd have to say your claim is shakyt. For your claim to make sense you would have to buy it after May 2011 in which the current model would be the 4th gen.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
When you buy an iOS product you are buying from a company determined to make it obsolete within a year or two of you buying it.
Can't talk about phones, but my girlfriend's iPad had been out for a year or two when I bought it for her a couple of years ago, and it's still getting the latest iOS releases. I believe only the original iPad has been made obsolete by Apple so far.
Meanwhile, the local electronics store is still selling the Nexus 7, which probably gets its last OS upgrade from Google next week.
If Google don't fix this crap, they're going to toss the cheap phone/tablet market to Microsoft.
Instead of making more laws, the best way is to remove copyright/patent protections for unsupported devices, consider them abandoned and in public domain.
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Sorry redundant - asleep at the wheel...
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Considering the current version is fully patched, I don't understand how you would spin this into Samsung not patching kernel vulnerabilities.
"Samsung has decided to patch, but only for recent devices running Android Lollipop, and not for those with Jelly Bean or KitKat."
Xcode 6 supports iOS back to 6.0. That includes every iPad introduced except the first one and every iPhone introduced since the 3GS in 2009.
How many developers would waste time trying to support the iPhone or iPhone 3G - both had 128MB of RAM and a 400Ghz single CÃte processor.
The last day to buy a brand-new iPhone 3G from Apple was June 2010. The last iOS update was November 2010. 6-months of support, for those who bought them near the end of the run. Brand new phones, sold as the *only* iPhone available at the time, so I bought the newest, best available, and got about 6 months support on it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
My Samsung got very little support. I didn't get a single version upgrade on it, and there were maybe two bug fix patches.
What does get support is rooting Android and using a generic package. Though that option isn't available for iPhone, so you are left with phones abandoned the moment they aren't sold anymore.
Learn to love Alaska
The last day to buy a brand-new iPhone 3G from Apple was June 2010. The last iOS update was November 2010. 6-months of support, for those who bought them near the end of the run. Brand new phones, and got about 6 months software support on it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
So what he described did happen. It happened to me, with the iPhone 3G. I didn't realize that the "minor" upgrade from the 3G to the 3GS would make the 3G obsolete and unsupported. At the time, Apple made it sound more like they would be two versions of the same phone, the "S" a minor upgrade of camera and such, not a replacement that would make the 3G worthless. They wanted to sell their last 3G phones. So I picked up one on sale. And got 6 months support, and years of Slashdotters telling me that Apple supports their products for 5 years, and reality isn't real if it contradicts their opinion.
Learn to love Alaska
Apple stopped supported my first gen iPad after 2 years and I have not received any updates since. But in comparisoin, my Nexus One -- which got its last OS update at 2.3.6, a phone that's about 5 years old -- I was still given the option to update Google's services up until I retired the phone this year.
It's a mixed bag with Android and one that's overall better IMO, as the OS since early on has had so many useful features, some of which Apple only more recently implemented into iOS and others that they'll never do so -- like true access to the file system. I absolutely prefer the fact that Android is not a locked down OS, has features more inline wiht actual computers, and that Google's latest services -- so the newest Maps as an example -- are always offered up to older versions of it.
I really don't care if my device is running the latest OS whatever, if that OS hobbles what I can and can not do with "my" device.
Android phones are not driven in obsolescence by a team at Apple who urges developers to move onto the new API as soon as possible. So the App Store doesn't stop having current apps for Android phones for much, much longer than with Apple. Look at the number of current-version apps you can still get to run on a KitKat phone, and compare that to the apps you can get for a 3G iOS device today.
When you buy an iOS product you are buying from a company determined to make it obsolete within a year or two of you buying it.
Another of your bullshit half-truths, as usual.
.
One of Apple's Terms and Conditions for entering the IOS App Store is that your App MUST SUPPORT the most recent version of iOS.
Another of the T&C for an App to REMAIN in the iOS App Store is that your App must be UPDATED in a timely manner TO SUPPORT the latest version of iOS.
NOWHERE does Apple MANDATE that an App MUST NOT remain Compatible with an OLDER Version of iOS
Prove me wrong.
In fact, one of the reasons that there is an issue with iOS "App Balooning" is that, as time goes on, Apps are having to carry a greater and greater amount of "baggage", just to support multiple device configurations and OS versions.
When you buy an iOS product you are buying from a company determined to make it obsolete within a year or two of you buying it.
Can't talk about phones, but my girlfriend's iPad had been out for a year or two when I bought it for her a couple of years ago, and it's still getting the latest iOS releases. I believe only the original iPad has been made obsolete by Apple so far.
Meanwhile, the local electronics store is still selling the Nexus 7, which probably gets its last OS upgrade from Google next week.
If Google don't fix this crap, they're going to toss the cheap phone/tablet market to Microsoft.
Or to Apple, which now sells the still-supported iPad mini 2 and iPhone 5 for relatively low prices.
And yes, the original iPad is the only unsupported iPad, as I sit here typing this in my still-supported iPad 2, and my still-supported iPhone 4s sits waiting for me to "re commission" it as for iPod Touch-like duty (not going to use the phone part anymore) for my roomate's use.
The last day to buy a brand-new iPhone 3G from Apple was June 2010.
What does the iPhone 3G have to do with his iPod Touch 3rd gen? He made a specific claim which appear not to be supported by facts.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Androids are getting Powned left right & center due to their abysmal security & Bronsco thinks I'm talking about ad blockers?!?! Just how deep in the "sand" do you have your head stuck in?
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
Until you get a malicious SMS or your phone gets Powned in one of the myriad of other ways Android is vulnerable... But that wouldn't happen to you, you're too low in the food chain to be of interest -- until you do get infected... I've seen it happen.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
Examples, please? I've seen iPhones pwned by malicious SMS, as well. It happens to the best of us, get over yourself. What's funny about it is that even after my best friend fell victim to one of several iPhone SMS vulns, he still swears the platform is secure. He refuses to let facts cloud his argument and I don't expect you'll be any different.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
You're right phase, this Bronsco guy sounds like a real douche. Care to point to the specific vulnerabilities you're referring to, along with any documented cases of them being actively exploited? No, 3rd-party browsers injecting their own ads do not count; it's easy to avoid that by not being the idiot that uses that browser, and it's certainly not a vulnerability in the platform.
I asked you to elaborate, that's precisely the opposite of sticking my head in the sand. I know my platform is no more or less secure than any other; that's why I take steps to safeguard my own security; something made more difficult on iOS (which is why my iPad is reserved for specific non-sensitive uses). If I had my head buried in the iOS garden, like you seem to, I might be a bit less secure with my iPad.
So I'll ask you again, please elaborate about all these instances of random ads popping up while browsing the web and all the credential theft that happens on Android. I keep looking for it (no, not in the sand) and I'm just not seeing it. You'd think, though, knowing about 5x as many Android users as iOS users (even accounting for overlap), I'd see at least 5x as many Android phones get pwned than iOS devices (actually more if, as you claim, Android is less secure), but it seems the reality is that iOS gets compromised more frequently outside of China (where people install sketchy shit on their Android phones just as often as they do on their iPhones; if you get to ignore China when talking about how secure iOS is, we must ignore it when discussing Android, as well).
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
The last day to buy a brand-new iPhone 3G from Apple was June 2010. The last iOS update was November 2010. 6-months of support, for those who bought them near the end of the run. Brand new phones, sold as the *only* iPhone available at the time, so I bought the newest, best available, and got about 6 months support on it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... My Samsung got very little support. I didn't get a single version upgrade on it, and there were maybe two bug fix patches. What does get support is rooting Android and using a generic package. Though that option isn't available for iPhone, so you are left with phones abandoned the moment they aren't sold anymore.
Your particular iPhone 3G situation is an admitted Outlier. However, unless you are a total liar, you will have to admit that Apple's OS Update support for both iOS AND OS X is second to none.
The current, just-released version of iOS, 9.0.1, is compatible with iPhone 4s to 6s, iPad 2 to iPad Pro, and iPod Touch 5 and 6. OS X 10.11, El Capitan, also just released, is compatible with almost all Macs introduced since 2007.
And if you compare that sort of support with the Russian Roulette style of "Updating through Random ROMS" you are advocating for Android, you are either a liar or are delusional.
You come to France & sign the NDA's my clients have had me sign & we'll talk.
Oh, do keep your head up where it's been hiding and deny that any problem exists, after all, you not falling victim to Android's multiple failings means that they doesn't exist, right?
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
I know my platform is no more or less secure than any other
Right. That's denial right there. Dumbass.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
He gave a bad example. I gave a better one. Apple has done it as well. That was his point. I supported his point, even if I didn't address his facts.
Learn to love Alaska
Your particular iPhone 3G situation is an admitted Outlier.
It's just one I happened to live through. Screw *ME* once, shame on you... Apple did screw me with that one. It wasn't a hypothetical. It actually happened to me. So it matters more to me than the examples you bring up.
And if you compare that sort of support with the Russian Roulette style of "Updating through Random ROMS" you are advocating for Android, you are either a liar or are delusional.
Yeah, the forums filled with complaints on iOS9 wiping devices didn't happen. And if you close your eyes and update random ROMs, you'l have bad results. Most people find one they like, and stick to regular updates from a popular and well supported line of ROMs.
Learn to love Alaska
No he didn't and you missed the point. I questioned whether or not his example is actually a fabrication. As for your example, it is the only case that that Apple has done whereas many, many Samsung models barely are updated as it is also up to the carrier. In relevance to this story some US carriers have not updated S4. I do however find it curious that someone so anti-Apple would ever purchase an iPhone.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
I know my platform is no more or less secure than any other
Right. That's denial right there. Dumbass.
Lol, that right there is stupidity masquerading as rank ignorance. "no more or less secure"... Only if a bicycle is "no more or less fast" as a sport motorcycle.
Hey sparky, I am not your your mother or your wetnurse. Go talk to Cisco. Go talk to Check Point, Go talk to Palo-Alto. Go talk to the TippingPoint people now at HP. You'll have to show that there is something in it over and above overcoming your ignorance to get answers.
In short, put some effort into discovering just which mobile platform is causing the most problems to security professionals. Given your history the answer will surprise you.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
It's not like iOS was just hit with ad-blasiting malware or anything. By the way, how does Marshmallow hold up? I'm asking out of genuine curiosity, having just updated, but I'm not expecting any more from you than geneal puffery.
Also, is it the platform or the retarded skins and apps every manufacturer wants to bake into their distributions that cause most of the issues? I aske because I'm aware of a number of issues caused by Touch-Wiz and Sense. These issues don't exist for Nexus devices.
I'd apologize for calling you a dumbass but I'm still not sure if you were purposefully ignoring my admission that there are vulnerabilities in Android (just like every platform) or if you were just too dumb do see it with out having it pointed out to you. You talk a big game but can't be arsed to back it up, though, so I'm still leaning toward the latter; and I don't expect that to change for my current round of questions, either.
How much is Tim Cook paying you to soread his FUD now that iOS vulnerabilities are making a more public appearance?
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
Gah... typos... this is why i don't post from my phone...
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
You're an android user admittedly ignorant of how the repeated and generally unpatched critical vulnerabilities of his cherished platform have made Android into a security nightmare. You compare iOS vulnerabilities for people that downloaded code from unvetted third parties or from Chinese developers that performed the same bone-headed move with innate Android bugs that in most cases will never be corrected until people replace their phones with new models so that their maker will be motivated enough to update them. The vulnerabilities that Touch-Wiz, etc have are severe but most android malware targets the OS level bugs because that makes the exploits work on more devices.
Again, I am not here to educate you & I have signed NDAs that prevent me from talking about them or just what problems they encountered in anything but the most general terms. Android's adoption rate of the most recent OS has stagnated for years in single digit adoption percentages even in corporate environments. Until that changes and the current avalanche of new Android security vulnerabilities every month tapers off, Android Security will continue to be a joke right up there with Military Intelligence.
As for you calling me names ? I couldn't care less that you are unable to show more control than most small children.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
You're an android user
Thanks for highlighting that incorrect assumption. I didn't give you my full bio but, in addition to being a user, I am also a developer (apps and roms alike) and, in addition to Android, I also use iOS, Windows, several distros of Linux, a couple of BSDs, and my primary OS of choice is OSX. Hardly a fanboy.
Android bugs that in most cases will never be corrected until people replace their phones with new models so that their maker will be motivated enough to update them.
Are you implying that newer versions of Android aren't affected by the vulnerabilities you know of? That's what it sounds like; if that's the case, I don't know what we're arguing about. Older versions of iOS are vulnerable, too. Apple controls the upgrade path for iOS just like Google controls it for Nexus devices; if other manufacturers don't privide patches and OS updates, that's an other-manufacturer problem, not an Andriod problem.
To clarify my point, only Apple makes iOS devices, so we have no example of how 3rd party devices would receive updates. All that exists for this is conjecture. As a result, we can not legitimately compare the update process of iOS devices with the update process of non-Nexus Android devices and pin the results on Google. Likewise, we can not compare the security of iOS devices and non-Nexus Android devices and pin those results on Google, either.
And, as a user of a fully updated Nexus device (and several Apple devices including two iPads) thats, quite conveniently, all I care to discuss.
Again, I am not here to educate you & I have signed NDAs that prevent me from talking about them or just what problems they encountered in anything but the most general terms.
Then I guess it's good that I was asking a very general question, isn't it? I'll restate, in that context: By the way, how does Marshmallow hold up? That's pretty general; yes, it's about a specific version, but if your argument boils down to "all Android versions, combined, are less secure than the current version of iOS" I'm afraid my initial comment regarding the intelligence of your posterior appears to be correct.
It's a simple concept, really; when comparing a specific property of two or more things (in this case, security), you make those things as similar as possible, and you only compare those things. iOS: only distributed by Apple. Easy, only compare with Android on Nexus devices. Latest iOS? Only compare with latest Android. iOS in default configuration? Only compare with Android in default configuration. iOS fully locked down? Only compare with fully locked down Android.
Sure, this doesn't give you a broad picture of the landscape, for that you do have to compare all iOS versions and all Android versions currently in widespread use, in aggregate; that's not what we're talking about here, though. Here, we're talking about Nexus devices, which are updated by Google directly and, as a result, will mostly be running the latest version, much like iOS devices, so the comparison should be limited thusly.
I couldn't care less that you are unable to show more control than most small children.
You must not have kids (or friends with kids). Most small kids would not have waited for you to call them by the wrong name, take an insulting tone with them, insinuate that they're in denial about something they've already openly acknowledged (head in the sand or up... where, exactly?), and refuse to address (acknowledge, hell, not even answer) their questions, before calling you a doo-doo head. I could have displayed a bit more restraint, but the name would have come out in this post anyway.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
You can quit attempting to put words into my mouth, I have no intention of falling for your strawmen.
Android's abysmal adoption rate of new OS versions is well known. Marshmallow is and will be irrelevant for months until it's adoption rates become significant & given how frequent new & different attacks have been released for android over the past few years I have little confidence that marshmallow will bring significant change because any new bug is still no more likely to be patched by upgrading to a fixed version than present versions of Android have been.
That someone with the experience you claim would be so apparently clueless as to ignore these points and to keep bringing up "but how's marshmallow" like it makes any difference just shows that you still haven't understood the problem.
My children are adults now. During their childhood they were often complimented on how well behaved they were for their ages but I've seen what bad parenting does. Your lack of self-control and justification of how that is supposed to be normal in particular for an adult does not speak well for how you were raised.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
You can quit attempting to put words into my mouth,
Where have I done this?
I have no intention of falling for your strawmen.
What strawmen?
Android's abysmal adoption rate of new OS versions is well known.
I never argued this.
Marshmallow is and will be irrelevant for months until it's adoption rates become significant
I don't care about anyone else's devices, only my own. The adoption rate for Marshmallow is 100% for the devices I am concerned about. That's as significant as it gets.
given how frequent new & different attacks have been released for android over the past few years I have little confidence that marshmallow will bring significant change because any new bug is still no more likely to be patched by upgrading to a fixed version than present versions of Android have been.
That's getting a little closer to what I've been trying to get out of you. Since it seems you have no concrete information regarding what I actually care about, I suppose time will tell.
That someone with the experience you claim would be so apparently clueless as to ignore these points and to keep bringing up "but how's marshmallow" like it makes any difference just shows that you still haven't understood the problem.
No, I understand the problem quite well. There are a number of known vulnerabilities in versions of Android that I don't use, which makes it not my problem. I am asking about the version I do use, because those vulnerabilities are my problem.
My children are adults now.
Then you must be old enough to have acquired the wisdom to discern when you and the person you are conversing with are talking about two different things, from two different perspectives. Please apply that wisdom here, as I've pointed this out several times by now.
During their childhood they were often complimented on how well behaved they were for their ages
As as I.
but I've seen what bad parenting does.
We all have. It often leads to discussions like this.
Your lack of self-control and justification of how that is supposed to be normal in particular for an adult does not speak well for how you were raised.
I don't lack self-control, I simply have no tolerance for people like you who try to get by in indirect insults as if that's any better than calling someone a dumbass. As for the words you claim I am putting in your mouth, I can only assume you are referring to me saying the following:
Most small kids would not have waited for you to call them by the wrong name, take an insulting tone with them, insinuate that they're in denial about something they've already openly acknowledged (head in the sand or up... where, exactly?), and refuse to address (acknowledge, hell, not even answer) their questions, before calling you a doo-doo head.
Well, I'm not sure how that's putting words in anyone's mouth. Here are the quotes detailing you doing each and every one of those things:
"by the wrong name": Androids are getting Powned left right & center due to their abysmal security & Bronsco thinks I'm talking about ad blockers?!?!
"take an insulting tone with them" and "insinuate that they're in denial about something they've already openly acknowledged" are covered by the next two:
"head in the sand": Just how deep in the "sand" do you have your head stuck in?
"or up... where, exactly?": Oh, do keep your head up where it's been hiding
And, to that, I'll reiterate: Where, exactly? I'm sure your mother would be proud. As for your refusal to address my questions, well, I'm not going to quote our entire conversation; you can go back and read it yourself.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
As as I.
Should read:
As was I.
I might also add that, while your children (why would you drag them into this? but you did, so I digress) may be well-behaved, that offers no indication that you are; this conversation actually hints to the contrary.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
In my day we used a magnetised needle and a microscope. And we had to grind our own lenses.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Where were you attempting to put words in my mouth and then knocking down strawmen?
Are you implying that newer versions of Android aren't affected by the vulnerabilities you know of?
So, have you stopped beating your wife and abusing small children yet? You know, this isn't the 1950's anymore and punishments are severe nowadays for these acts.
I don't care about anyone else's devices, only my own.
The key admission which makes every single statement you have made up to this point defending Android as a platform a fraud. How unsurprising that in addition to your puerile name calling that you are also a liar only interested in yourself.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
Are you implying that newer versions of Android aren't affected by the vulnerabilities you know of?
That's an honest question. An affirmative response means yes, you are implying that, a negative response means no, you are not implying that; noting more, nothing less.
So, have you stopped beating your wife and abusing small children yet?
This, on the other hand, is actually a strawman. An affirmative response means yes, you admit to having beaten your wife and abused small children, while a negative response mean you are still doing those things. It's an indirect way of getting someone to admit to something they don't realize they're admitting to, and my answer is that I never started doing those things, so your question is irrelevant. Mine, on the other hand, was an honest question. Is that what you are implying? I didn't say you were implying that, I didn't even imply you were implying that; either of those things would have been putting words in your mouth, but I did neither. What I did do was ask a direct question. No words put in your mouth and no strawmen. That you don't want to answer, however, is very telling; were it a strawman, you'd be able to come up with an answer similar to the one I gave, above, rather than skirting it altogether. Yes, or no?
The key admission which makes every single statement you have made up to this point defending Android as a platform a fraud.
First of all, you are taking that out of context to bolster your weak position and I don't think anyone with an IQ over 70 is falling for it. Second, why should I care about someone else's device? Does caring that they made a poor purchasing decision and won't be getting updates that fix these vulnerabilities suddenly and magically grant them updates or some form of protection from those vulnerabilities? No. So why waste the effort caring? I can (and do) show them the light, when I have the opportunity to do so, lead them to water so to speak, but I can't make them drink. Beyond that, what good is done by belittling them for being part of the problem? I'd rather simply be part of the solution and get on with it.
How unsurprising that in addition to your puerile name calling
Again, I'll ask, just where were you implying I had my head stuck and how proud would your mother be of that remark? Pot, meet kettle.
that you are also a liar
And is that not a name, which you are calling me from atop thine high horse? Point out one lie I have told. Don't limit to this conversation, go through all of my comments, everything you can find, and point out one lie. Not one piece of misinformation or a misquote or something else not purposely stated to deceive, but an actual, honest-to-God lie I told with the intent of deceiving or defrauding anyone. Do it. Go on, do it.
only interested in yourself.
Right, because of one out-of-context remark. Grow the fuck up.
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.