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Coming Set-top Box Mandate May Help Break Pay TV Firms' Hold Over Viewers (latimes.com)
Joe_Dragon sends a report from the LA Times about proposed regulations that could disrupt the cable industry's hold on consumers by targeting set-top boxes. These boxes are required to view most pay-TV programming these days, and consumers often require multiples if they have more than one TV. The rental fees add up to almost $20 billion in revenue for the industry each year. Yet the technology within these boxes is nothing special, and alternatives could easily arise if there was incentive to create them. "The changes aren't coming fast enough for some lawmakers and consumer advocates as well as tech companies such as Google Inc., which are eager to jump into the set-top box market. They want the Federal Communications Commission to require that pay TV providers make their services more easily compatible with third-party set-top boxes or similar devices. ... Such a mandate could allow consumers to access their pay TV and streaming services through one device instead of having to switch between two or more. And it could lead to innovations such as an ability to search for programming across services to determine, for example, whether a movie is available on Netflix or on-demand via a pay TV provider."
And it could lead to innovations such as an ability to search for programming across services to determine, for example, whether a movie is available on Netflix or on-demand via a pay TV provider."
A recent Tivo can do this. It can show you the various sources from which a movie or series is available.
Good, hope this will accelerate a CableCard-like standard for IPTV like it did for cable systems. I love my home-brew DVR, and I'm not willing to switch to Google Fiber or AT&T UVerse until third-party TV equipment can work with their service.
Who cares? Cable TV companies hold on customers is already broken thanks to companies like Netflix. The only thing missing in North America is a service like iPlayer in the UK which lets you watch recently broadcast BBC programs when you want. The broadcast channels should switch over to the internet broadcast and providing services on demand. Having a box which merges broadcast with internet is just providing a crutch for what is rapidly becoming an outdated business model.
Pity this is coming as Microsoft is in the process of killing Windows Media Center once and for all. For all its faults and backwards feature creep (removing sports, Netflix, etc), it is still the only (or one of the very few?) non-embedded systems that can record and playback copy-protected video, which is kind of a big deal if you want to DVR those HBO series. I'd ditch it in a heartbeat if I could find another non-embedded, non-WMC alternative that could do this.
Cablecards were suppose to usher in the great revolution in consumer set top boxes, breaking free the need to rely on cable companies expensive STB rentals. Aside from Tivos, Ceton InfiniTV products, and Silicondust HDHomeRun Prime, there's really not much out there for a compelling consume device.
WMC was the only HTPC-related software that was certified to play encrypted non-copy-freely channels from a InfiniTV and HDHomeRun. And with many content providers/cable companies marking many/most/all channels copy-once, it really hurt the usefulness. Extenders for WMC were basically a non-starter, and with Microsoft killing WMC in Windows 10, it'll be all but dead in the near future.
Cable companies and content producers aren't going to let up on their demands for DRM/restricting content/etc. STB mandates aren't going to suddenly open up a market that was already extremely tepid. And even if the mandates were passed, cable companies will do everything in their power to find loopholes around them, actively discourage customers from using 3rd party devices, offering no support for them if not outright lying about being able to use them, or otherwise making it a PITA to try to use one.
The cable industry has far too much power, far too many lobbyists, oh, and did we mention they pretty much run the FCC these days?
There is simply no way in hell these companies will allow anything to happen which cuts into profits. They'll stop it dead in its tracks, or make anything so onerous and impossible that it won't actually work.
Since they mention this in the first paragraph ... this will be exactly like the old black rotary phone ... even if you no longer have it, they're going to gouge you for "touch tone dialing" and pretend like it costs them anything.
Which means they'll charge you whether or not you have their box, will charge you to connect your box to their stuff, will charge you for the privilege of connecting your box to their stuff and for maintaining the infrastructure, and will find all sorts of ways to keep gouging consumers.
These companies have strangleholds, and monopolies ... they sure as hell aren't going to accept any regulations which cost them money. They're far too entrenched and feel they're entitled to that money.
And they have far too many fucking politicians on the payroll whose job it is to entrench in law their revenues.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Count on it. You can't have it both ways. Every step you take to strip a company of revenue will just increase your bill. To bad few are smart enough to see it. Cable set top boxes use encryption and technology that is usually limited to a few types of set top boxes. Forcing cable to replace those systems will increase your bill. I don't think it will hold up in court since many industries have similar practices. Float the idea at whatever your job is of starting to give away what they have been charging for and see the response you get from the bean counters. I hope you don't get fired for suggesting it.
So... does anyone actually put a set top box on top of their TV set these days? Once upon a time, TVs were deep enough front-to-back to support this; these days, most aren't.
Or is this a term that was once accurate, but will never be accurate again, like "dialing" a phone? It's been a long time since phones had dials, unless they're being purposefully retro.
Program Intellivision!
"There is no quicker way to disrupt this vibrancy that is creating the greatest TV programming in the world than for the government to try and fix something that isn't broken," said Brian Dietz, a spokesman for the National Cable & Telecommunications Assn. trade group.
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA (pounds table) HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA ... oh ah wow good one...
The Verizon FIOS Arris media set top box is the biggest piece of shit ever. Shittiest programming. Just try to change a channel, and watch the how long it takes for the box to respond. Try to enter a number and watch digits drop. Glitches galore in the video too. And just TRY, yes TRY to call Verizon on it and see if they give a shit. Yeah some vibrancy and user experience. The only thing vibrating is in the CEO's wallet.
Exactly ... take away one revenue stream, and they'll just tack on some new line-items to the bills to make that up.
Between their business people who will ensure they don't lose the money, and their lobbyists who will ensure it will never happen ... there is no way in hell those companies are going to allow any loss in revenue.
And they'll have enough politicians on the payroll to ensure their profits are entrenched in law.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
I misread the headline as "Coming Sex-Bot Mandate" and therefore can't muster up any interest in the real story.
I'm not so sure the DRM has to go, but I think there needs to be multiple solutions that satisfy the DRM requirements.
Wondering out loud.... Could we not require cable companies to either turn off the "copy once" flag or have a viable freely available DVR solution that is certified to do the necessary DRM... Like having a closed source addition to the commonly available media solutions?
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
The only thing that keeps them alive is lack of broadband to some viewers. Once the infrastructure is completed the only way to watch TV will be over the web.
right now i can take my time warner box into their store and exchange it for any reason. new boxes are expensive and if there is a problem time warner will just tell me it's my fault. they already have to buy a lot more boxes than they have customers and run the retail stores and support. people buying their own boxes is money saved for them
I think capitalism is ruined by the fact that whenever we perceive a problem, the instantaneous reaction is always:
"Government needs to regulate ..." or "We need to pass a law..."
We should consider passing laws and regulations or imposing mandates only as an absolute last resort when every other solution has failed.
Gee, my heart bleeds for people who have to pay an extra few bucks or go through a clumsy interface to get their full dose of mind-numbing entertainment. Has our society really devolved to the point where we need Big Brother to get involved in THIS? Laws funded by confiscation of wealth and enforced at gunpoint so that it's easier and cheaper for people to access cable TV??? WTF?
We have one cable drop with a PVR in our family room, and our service is for the most basic cable package you can get. It's connected to a Samsung TV with some streaming capability (Netflix and a couple other services). This month I'm putting a second TV in our basement rec room and hooking up an Apple TV to deliver content. In six month's time I will ask everyone in the family (four of us) to give me a good reason why we need to keep the cable service. I'm predicting I'll be cutting the coax next summer.
"Could be worse...could be raining." Igor
Some ISP's force you to rent there gateway / modems that part also needs to be banded / part of the base internet rate. What will be the point of haveing your own box when there is a $15-$20 gateway box / fee on top of the base tv rate or even then saying to get TV you must buy our internet.
They also need to stop renting modems and just sell them / give them out for free to stop the Comcast billing errors where your owned modem shows up as being rented.
Also ban outlet / streams / mirroring fees as well.
On some systems for cable card users they have like an $6-$8 outlet fee for using one vs say a all $9-$10 fee to rent there box.
Wondering out loud.... Could we not require cable companies to either turn off the "copy once" flag or have a viable freely available DVR solution that is certified to do the necessary DRM... Like having a closed source addition to the commonly available media solutions?
DRM relies on keeping a secret, being closed source is just a tool to obscure it. A small, closed source drop-in module would quickly get picked apart, the key(s) taken and the DRM broken. The more transparent the code, the more of the DRM must happen in hardware to be effective, like Firefox's DRM extensions. They don't actually contains the keys for anything, they just provide an interface to talk to the "trusted" hardware for keys. There is no DRM that can work in the open.
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
There's an old saying, "What this country needs is a good war."
Without any real problems (the West's worst medical problem now is too much food) lesser issues float up and take over their role as rage inflection points.
And of course they are nothing of the sort.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
It seems clear that the set top box is basically just a signal converter used so the cable company can exploit customers further. Its clearly not anything you technically need, since OTA proves that multiple channels of digital TV can go through the air and over existing coax just fine (QAM), and all tvs I've ever seen on sale still come with a digital tuner.
Instead of coming up with a law to make cable boxes more interchangeable or whatever, they should make the law so that it eliminates them entirely. Apart from anything else, think of the energy and other waste savings.
The only thing that keeps them alive is lack of broadband to some viewers.
That and the long-term exclusive contracts among sport leagues, pay television networks, and multichannel pay television system operators.
I like British shows well enough, but what are you expecting them to do?
I expect the BBC, through its BBC Worldwide subsidiary, to set up an international subscription service analogous to iPlayer that shows any programme whose exclusive rights in a given country have not yet already been sold.
I can't help with the spoilers of scripted series or the Food Network. But for news, you could follow sources on the web, such as breaking news microblogs on Twitter. For gridiron football, you could visit a bar or a Buffalo Wild Wings restaurant.
disney channel is like X2 the cost of nick and it's mostly ad free.
also ESPN costs like $10 per sub now. Putting it in HBO / SHOW / MAX / STARS range.
> Or are you saying those three choices are no good? Each of them will do the job perfectly.
No they wont.
When CableCards were first introduced, Tivo was seriously behind in terms of PVR devices. That's why people started using stuff like MCE in the first place. You're basically saying that ONE OPTION in two classes of device are fine. That's just two different monopolies. That's pathetic. That's nothing resembling a free market. Do you see only 3 choices of TV when you go to Frys? How about 3 choices of PC? How about 3 choices of cars.
It's funny the kinds of excuses people will make.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Yes. Let's just compromise our values and allow the free market and personal property to be subverted just because YOU personally don't think that this instance of bad behavior is sufficiently bad enough.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
> Whats next... anti-monopoly laws to encourage diversity in FM radio programming?
We already had laws to prevent media consolidation. Clearly someone thought that enforcing anti-trust in that area did not represent a "serious enough problem". So those laws were done away with.
Now we have the fruits of media consolidation.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
In a free market, the solution is to take your business elsewhere. But here, local governments have contributed to the creation of a monopoly. When the city owns its roads and fails to efficiently manage and price rights of way, you have a government problem that the government is responsible for solving. Ideally, a city would bury generic conduits every time it resurfaces the roads and lease them to competing utilities, which can pull lines through those conduits as needed.
The only thing that keeps them alive is lack of broadband to some viewers. Once the infrastructure is completed the only way to watch TV will be over the web.
Not really. People who are wealthy will have cable for decades yet. At some point It will become decoupled from the infrastructure, but they'll still have it. The biggest thing about it is still its role as a content aggregator, plus the fact that amazingly, nobody has the killer media search interface yet.
In six month's time I will ask everyone in the family (four of us) to give me a good reason why we need to keep the cable service.
In four months, NCAA division 1 men's basketball playoffs. In six months, NHL and NBA playoffs.
As I explained in my FCC complaint - you have filed one too, right? - I don't mind my provider (Cox) switching to all digital and thus requiring a box betwixt the actual cable and TV. What I do object to is not having the choice (CHOICE!) of buying my own 'tv' modem' in the market place instead of paying a lucrative monthly fee* for a box foisted upon me (and for each TV not hooked their existing DVR / box). Ironically, Cox has always allowed their customers to buy their own cable modems and use them in their system. Hell, the last new one I installed, I didn't even have to call Support; it was accepted after confirming thru the modems' web page. There is no reason whatsoever to not allow the same method on the TV side.
* - Considering how massive a buy Cox probably did to get enough boxes to cover virtually each customer they have, the cost per unit would be ridiculously low, allowing them to recoup their expenditure probably within 6 months. From then on, that $5 a month is just pure profit.
USA has CAM as well, called CableCARD. It's just that renting a CAM costs almost as much as renting a cable box in many markets. Compare to phones: a lot of carriers charge you just for having an active SIM even if you don't use any voice minutes, SMS messages, or data. (Source: ting.com)
Not a moment too soon. I had two rented set-top boxes that cost $20 each per month so $480 per year. They hadn't been changed in three years so that's $1440 paid. When I finally replaced them they wanted the old ones shipping back. UPS was slow delivering them due to bad weather and I got an email to the effect that if they didn't arrive within 30 day's I'd be charged $300 each of them. So $600 for three year old hardware (full of dust and stuff) that I'd already paid $1440 for! Fortunately they did arrive several days late so I didn't have to wrangle with Verizon over the charge but it's the principle of the thing.
Someone will probably point out that that is why you don't rent stuff, you pay over the odds and in the end don't own anything. I agree, but the cable companies are a monopoly you can't do anything other than rent.
Umm, CableCard has been out for a very long time now.. and as other posts mentioned, Tivos can already do much of this (including VOD and PPV, though I've never used the latter).
In the case of TiVO, there's only one DVR STB option...them. It's whatever they want and if you don't like it, tough. Some option. Plus you get the option of paying an addtional $14.99/month|$149.99/year|$599.99/device lifetime (Oh what a deal!)
With Ceton and HDHomeRun, you have the choice of once piece of software, WMC, for copy-once channels. It's a dated list, but back around when I had my Prime, here was an example of the state of copy-once/copy-freely then. It's a mishmash between cable providers and even sometimes within the same provider in different locals there were differences. Search Comcast's forms for "copy flag" and there's a constant stream of threads about flags randomly changing for no reason, cards needing to be constantly "sent some signals to fix the issue", etc. Even if once you do get your box working then you have to make sure WMC works, all your drives are secured and compatible with PlayReady or whatever it was called, and then you could (hopefully) use WMC as a DVR. That is until Windows 10 came out.
A big help would be allowing subscribers to buy their own equipment rather than rent it. A set top box is about 40$, a remote for it runs 15$.