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Bill Gates Calls On the US Government To Invest More In Research and Development (fortune.com)

An anonymous reader cites an article on Fortune: On Monday, Bill Gates attempted a commendable feat: to get politicians to focus on something other than the current election cycle and its partisan bickering. In an op-ed published by Reuters, the billionaire co-founder of Microsoft called on the United States to spur technological innovation by increasing its investment in research and development. "Government funding for our world-class research institutions produces the new technologies that American entrepreneurs take to market," he wrote. But while other nations like South Korea and China have drastically upped their R and D spending, the United States' has "essentially flatlined." He said that the rest of the world's commitment to research and development is great, "but if the United States is going to maintain its leading role, it needs to up its game." His call for more government-sponsored R&D also comes as corporations pull back on their commitment to discovery and innovation. With more government investment, he said, U.S. scientists could completely eradicate polio and further decrease the number of deaths from malaria. More funding could also "develop the technologies that will power the world -- while also fighting climate change, promoting energy independence, and providing affordable energy for the 1.3 billion poor people who don't have it today."

154 comments

  1. Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Always easier to spend other people's money than it is to spend your own, eh Billy?

    1. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Always easier to spend other people's money than it is to spend your own, eh Billy?

      It's called capitalism. If you're using your own money for business, you're doing it wrong.

    2. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      Always easier to spend other people's money than it is to spend your own, eh Billy?

      Even better, he wants to spend U.S. taxpayer dollars for the benefit of people who don't live in the U.S. Sorry, Bill, spend your own money, or STFU.

      Oh wait, he *DOES* spend his own money. His foundation invests hundreds of millions of dollars in oil companies operating in Africa and causing pollution that is harming the local residents. Even more invested in the largest polluters in North America. Then there's investing in companies that violate child labor laws. In total, somewhere around $10 Billion invested in companies whose operations go against everything he says he is trying to accomplish.

    3. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you're not using your own money for business, that's called serfdom.

    4. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      He and his rich buddies also want to take advantage of all that 3rd world labor whose diseases they'll be eradicating. "Okay, now that we've eliminated your malaria, you need to to come work for us for $2 a day!" Great news if you're either very rich or very poor. For the rest of us, it just means fewer middle class jobs.

    5. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This. Republicans always want t take our money at gunpoint.

    6. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No republican has ever seen a tax increase they didn't like.

    7. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      If you're not using your own money for business, that's called serfdom.

      Serfdom is what happens when you out of your own money, shut down the business, and blame others for your failure as an entrepreneur. People who are afraid of risks in using OPM shouldn't be in business.

    8. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Their IRS is responsible for nearly half of the suicides.

    9. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      They love high taxes.

    10. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      BULLSHIT - That's NOT capitalism.

      Unless you want to say that federal funding of climate research is nothing more than cronyism, do you?

    11. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by oh_my_080980980 · · Score: 1

      Using your own money *IS* the definition of capitalism.

    12. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's how they be.

    13. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yep, well get onto that just as soon as we gather the taxes you SHOULD be paying.

    14. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      BULLSHIT - That's NOT capitalism.

      I guess you don't invest in real estate, where OPM is used all the time.

      Unless you want to say that federal funding of climate research is nothing more than cronyism, do you?

      Interesting straw man argument that you got there. Where in my comment did I advocate funding for federal R&D?

    15. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He gives away more money than you'll ever see.

    16. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by bsDaemon · · Score: 1

      Investing money (capital) into assets used to make a profit, with both the ownership of the capital assets as well as the profits being in private hands is the definition of capitalism. Using your own money is one way to do it. Borrowing other people's money is called leverage.

    17. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And here to tell us why government investment in basic science research is an oppression of his rights, is today's libertarian AC.
      (Hello, mi. I know it's you.)

    18. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      "Okay, now that we've eliminated your malaria, you need to to come work for us for $2 a day!"

      It doesn't work that way. The biggest weapon against malaria is literacy. Literate people can learn how the disease spreads, and can read the instructions on bed nets and cans of insecticide. Once they can read, they are also more productive, and can earn more than $2 per day. In the past decade, Africa has made huge progress against both malaria and illiteracy. If you overlay the maps of malaria reduction and illiteracy reduction, they line up almost exactly. They both line up well with a map of rising incomes.

      For the rest of us, it just means fewer middle class jobs.

      So reducing malaria and preventing the needless deaths of millions of children is bad? Is there anything that you don't complain about?

    19. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Using your own money *IS* the definition of capitalism.

      Only if you want to remain a small time entrepreneur.

    20. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by jellomizer · · Score: 1

      Back in them good old days which the republicans look fondly on. Had companies that had their own R&D areas. Where they toyed with designs and ideas, some not profitable, but often would lead further to greater innovation. I am good with Government funded R&D it is very useful. However a good Private R&D is needed too.

      Government by nature is very risk adverse, meaning its R&D can have solid funding, however on tasks with a higher chance of success.
      Private will be more willing to take risks, however its funding is more fickle.

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
    21. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      Government funding led to nuclear power and space technology. Hardly risk averse. It's the private sector, especially publicly traded ones that are usually risk averse because risk causes the share price to fall.

    22. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > I guess you don't invest in real estate, where OPM is used all the time.

      Just because it uses "money" doesn't make it capitalism... North Korea has shopping malls and a currency too.

      > Where in my comment did I advocate funding for federal R&D?

      A core government function is to do R&D. Ever hear of a census? Surveying? Nah, nah.. that's just more capitalism right?

    23. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by idji · · Score: 1

      uh no. This billionaire is spending his own money and money of others who approve what he is doing. We wants the country to then spend trillions on improving the life of billions. Commendable and he puts his money where his mouth is. What did you do this year to improve the world for other humans?

    24. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by dywolf · · Score: 1

      We should pay.
      And gladly.

      Basic science research is an investment.
      An investment that yields tremendous returns.

      Not just in the abstract of knowledge being good and the next someone building on the knowledge we gained today.
      But also in the form of economic growth, employment, advancing industry, productivity.
      Not just in our nation, but across the whole world (though of course those who harness it best tend to profit the most).

      It's one of the most powerful positive loops in a nation's (or world's) economic engine.

      Government investment in science research is one of the fundamental underpinnings of the US's prosperity and leadership following WWII. Air flight, air travel, communications, computers, internet, data storage, cellular phones, transportation, materials science, historical research, biology, nutrition, medicine....

      Nearly every scientific advance in every field of science has been positively impacted by government investment in basic research.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

      Exponential economic growth such as we have experienced comes from positive feedback, where the production of something enables you to produce even more. Economists note that only capital — including human, intellectual, and environmental capital — can fuel exponential growth. Solow and subsequent researchers found that at most half of historical growth could be attributed to known factors. The unexplained part, sometimes estimated to be as large as 85 percent of growth, was termed the “Solow residual.” Subsequent work showed that the bulk of that residual could be explained by positing a new factor in production: technological progress.

      Technology produces wealth, and it produces more technological progress, which produces even more growth, thus enabling a virtuous cycle of exponential growth. Technological progress depends on basic research; this is why economists have found that investments in basic research can produce returns between 20 percent and 60 percent per year.

      The problem is that those extraordinary returns frequently go not to the investor in basic research but to the entire world. The applied research that follows on basic research does not necessarily take place in the same company or university. Basic research leading to scientific discovery is, therefore, a public good. The purpose of companies is to provide a return on investment, not to provide for the public good per se. However, the public good is the purpose of government, so this national investment must come from the federal government — as it has, in a major way, since 1947.

      That last paragraph both perfectly explains why many companies are hesitant to invest in research (because there's guarantee of a return, or that they will be the beneficiary of the return), and why government (re: the public) picking up the tab is in the public interest.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    25. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      Who do you think you are, Trump?! Are you even remotely aware of the fact that you're actually allowed to think before replying?? (Go on, try it... I imagine it'll take some getting used to, however.)

    26. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Ever hear of a census? Surveying? Nah, nah.. that's just more capitalism right?

      Let me guess... you're one of those people who still complain about the 1803 Louisiana Purchase for $68M francs as a government boondoggle.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana_Purchase

    27. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      You haven't actually looked into what he and his cronies are really up to, have you.

    28. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Research is hard to do at corporations. Research does not make profits in the short term, and in the long term it makes profits for other companies. So the bottom line from the board of directors almost always says to do very little research. Broad based research is even more rare. The few exceptions to this are companies that are either extremely rich or which have a monopoly position (IBM, Bell). So there is a reliance on universities and government funding to keep research alive. That taxpayer money pays for itself over time.

    29. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Who do you think you are, Trump?!

      Trump is a great example of using OPM. Banks still loan him money for his businesses despite having four business bankruptcies on record.

    30. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by the_skywise · · Score: 1

      Let's recap-

      >It's called capitalism. If you're using your own money for business, you're doing it wrong.

      Unless you want to say that federal funding of climate research is nothing more than cronyism, do you?

      > Where in my comment did I advocate funding for federal R&D?

      A core government function is to do R&D. Ever hear of a census? Surveying? Nah, nah.. that's just more capitalism right?

      > Let me guess... you're one of those people who still complain about the 1803 Louisiana Purchase for $68M francs as a government boondoggle.

      Well according to you that's just proper capitalism because it was all done with OPM!

    31. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Let's recap-

      You forgot to check the Post Anonymously box.

    32. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Once they can read, they are also more productive, and can earn more than $2 per day.

      So Gates should be teaching the Chinese working at the Foxconn factories to read??

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    33. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Commendable and he puts his money where his mouth is.

      If that were actually true, he'd have paid capital gains taxes on his massive fortune in MS shares when he sold them. Instead he 'donated' them to a charity.

    34. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sure you have, so why don't you copy and paste your manifesto here that I'm sure you have handy so we can hurry up and mod you +5 Idiot and be done with it?

    35. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not Trump - that's how business works.

      4 busts on thousands of successful business ventures? I'd say that's a pretty good record.

    36. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Andvari · · Score: 1

      He does spend his own money: http://www.gatesfoundation.org...

    37. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Strangely, the Federalists that were staunchly opposed to Jefferson's purchase of "Louisiana" are the roots of today's Democratic Party. And, those times were some of the most bitterly partisan times in US History, which make the arguments of today look laughable by comparison.

    38. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Tharkkun · · Score: 1

      "Okay, now that we've eliminated your malaria, you need to to come work for us for $2 a day!"

      It doesn't work that way. The biggest weapon against malaria is literacy. Literate people can learn how the disease spreads, and can read the instructions on bed nets and cans of insecticide. Once they can read, they are also more productive, and can earn more than $2 per day. In the past decade, Africa has made huge progress against both malaria and illiteracy. If you overlay the maps of malaria reduction and illiteracy reduction, they line up almost exactly. They both line up well with a map of rising incomes.

      For the rest of us, it just means fewer middle class jobs.

      So reducing malaria and preventing the needless deaths of millions of children is bad? Is there anything that you don't complain about?

      Yes. If we were willing to just napalm Africa we'd solve many problems. Malaria, Clean water, Ebola, Poaching, Starvation and Illiteracy rates would drop. Global warming would cease to exist. Hell we might even enter an ice age with all those people no longer generating heat.

    39. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      Yeah, because decades of research into particle physics and fusion power is definitely something that a private corporation is going to do with no practical immediate uses available in the next 6 quarters.

      Government R&D definitely has it's place, and anyone that says otherwise is a damn fool.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    40. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Tharkkun · · Score: 1

      uh no. This billionaire is spending his own money and money of others who approve what he is doing. We wants the country to then spend trillions on improving the life of billions. Commendable and he puts his money where his mouth is. What did you do this year to improve the world for other humans?

      I bought a homeless man a twinkie. He died in front of me. I saved the government food stamps.

    41. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      Private generally doesn't invest in things with low chance of profit. Space and military are just such things.

      Government can increase the risk by threatening tax increases, spending out of control such that increases may be inevitable, and running around trying to get elected promising to bash evil big business on the head.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    42. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by LinuxIsGarbage · · Score: 1

      Private generally doesn't invest in things with low chance of profit. Space and military are just such things.

      Unless you are a contractor. The Aerospace industry makes money hand over fist on Government projects.

    43. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Any publicly traded company, or any company that issues bonds is in fact, "Using other people's money"
      It is an integral part of capitalism

      What enrages capitalists about government investment is that there is no opportunity for the capitalist to make money from the investment

      Consider the public highway system. Because it is a government investment there is not opportunity to charge tolls, or to gain a profit from each driver.
      Capitalists consider this to be a lost opportunity
      However, the general public may view this to be a good thing because roads are built to many destinations which would not provide enough profit to be built under a completely capitalist system

      When applied to research, with Government funding you get fundamental research from NICET, which may be leveraged for significant advances, while Captialism will only support research which will return an immediate profits

      We NEED Government investment primarily because Capitalism only invests in things that can return quarterly profit, we would be way behind in all areas if we relied solely on private funding

      Capitalists can go such on it if they do not like it because they are the root cause for the need for government investment

    44. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by WolfWithoutAClause · · Score: 1

      Is Elon Musk a serf?

      --

      -WolfWithoutAClause

      "Gravity is only a theory, not a fact!"
    45. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      So Gates should be teaching the Chinese working at the Foxconn factories to read??

      Foxconn employees make a lot more than $2/day. A typical wage is $20-$30/day, which is more like $50/day at PPP. That is a decent wage in China.

    46. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      Now would that be the money in tax havens or the money in tax discounting countries without any revenue or the money from un-employing people where the revenue is generated and employing people who can never afford to buy the product based on the wages being paid or is that money generated by using slave prison labour or is that the money generated by using criminal uncompetitive practices or the money generated by corrupting governments to ensure product sales of etc. etc. etc.. You tell a lie, that generates bad Karma, you broadcast that lie and you basically end up telling millions of lies and you repeat those tactics again and again and can you even possible dream that paying a tiny portion of that income generated to subsidise people who do good works, even comes close to balancing out the negative. Sure spend millions of PR=B$ to fabricate an illusion via mainstream media and "You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time." but the reality is, it doesn't ever balance out that corruption or the continuing corruption that is M$.

      So the US be investing more if research and space, of course, should they tax more no but they should make sure those who should be paying taxes are paying taxes and that tax havens are basically stripped of their ability to cheat the rest of the world of their social services and of course cut the military spending budget by half, hmm, perhaps not enough by at least 80%, more than enough money to spend on better infrastructure, a new push into space, universal health care, free education and a shit bucket ton of research, funding a better future than a destructive military black hole.

      Gates would have done much better if he had actually meaningfully committed himself by saying how it was to be funded ie by significantly cutting defence spending.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    47. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just ask Kanye West.

    48. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by bugs2squash · · Score: 1

      I don't think you can apply PPP AND say " a decent wage in China". Once you've applied PPP we get to judge if it is a decent wage by non-Chinese Standards and frankly I imagine it would be difficult to live on anywhere if it were the only income coming in to a family.

      --
      Nullius in verba
    49. Re: Rich guy wants us to pay by ArmoredDragon · · Score: 1

      Who do you think you are, Trump?!

      Trump is a great example of using OPM. Banks still loan him money for his businesses despite having four business bankruptcies on record.

      Almost every person worth more than a few million dollars has had a business failure at some point, or even several. The thing is, most businesses fail within a few years of opening, and just because you have as much money as Trump had during his 4 big failures doesn't make you immune to it.

    50. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Methadras · · Score: 1

      As long as government is in the business of dealing with OPM and doling it out, then this will always be a problem.

    51. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      You shouldn't give homeless people cyanide twinkies...it isn't right...

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    52. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous+Cow+Ward · · Score: 1

      He is spending a lot of his own money. Asking the government to fund more R&D is a good thing, and even as rich as Bill Gates is, the feds have way more money.

      --
      Examine even your most deeply held beliefs. Nobody is always right.
    53. Re:Rich guy wants us to pay by Anonymous+Cow+Ward · · Score: 1

      Well, I'm sure the people in Africa would much rather have paying jobs than die from malaria. And raising the standard of living in Africa will help the rest of the world - more trade is generally better.

      --
      Examine even your most deeply held beliefs. Nobody is always right.
  2. hard by religionofpeas · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Government spending is easy. Making sure it doesn't result in people lining their pockets with the money without producing tangible results is hard.

    1. Re:hard by Tablizer · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Government spending is easy. Making sure it doesn't result in people lining their pockets with the money without producing tangible results is hard.

      Gates has a point (for once). The US economy typically depends on the leading-edge. Once something becomes a commodity, it flows to cheaper-labor countries, where we can't compete.

      And if we want to continue to surf the leading edge, we have to create the leading edge. Nobody else is going to do it for us.

      That may require government money. The Internet, early computers, jets, the space program, and indirectly the semi-conductor industry were all spurred on by government spending, changing the world.

      The private market has decided to focus on near-term R&D and products for the most part. The days of Xerox's GUI-like research are mostly gone (with the notable exception of near-Earth-orbit spaceflight.)

      I'm not sure why industry changed. It could be a bad batch of MBA's trained via education fads to chase short-term, or maybe the pressure of global competition putting companies in semi-panic survival mode. But it has changed.

      Thus, government has to step in the fill the void. I don't see the private sector growing more interested in medium- and long-term R&D again. It's not whether the government sucks, it's whether the alternative is worse.

      Perhaps some form of collaboration between government, universities, and private industry needs to be explored more. Sometimes you just have to experiment with collaboration systems.

      Either way, if we don't find a way to stoke the leading edge, our comparative advantage of pushing the envelope will disappear and we'll become a second-rate economy. Stagnation is not our friend.

    2. Re:hard by religionofpeas · · Score: 2

      The private market has decided to focus on near-term R&D and products for the most part. The days of Xerox's GUI-like research are mostly gone (with the notable exception of near-Earth-orbit spaceflight.)

      Exactly. But the private market isn't doing this for a lack of money, so adding government money isn't going to fix the underlying problem that the private market just isn't motivated in doing long term research. Instead, the business will take the government handouts, and use it to support a part of their company that wasn't making much profit. They'll come up with some nice looking business proposal that nobody in the government can properly judge on its merits, and the money will be wasted.

    3. Re:hard by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Government spending is easy. Making sure it doesn't result in people lining their pockets with the money without producing tangible results is hard.

      Fortunately, government-financed R&D has produced lots of tangible results. If some grad students and associate professors "line their pockets" with a barely-living wage, I don't care.

      And if companies can share in the benefit from this research and make billions, great.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    4. Re:hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you want to develop known technology you use the private sector. If you want to invent new technology you use the public sector. IBM didn't invent the transistor, Microsoft didn't invent the computer, and Google didn't invent the internet. Private companies will always have limited research scope, and you should see a least one reason why.

    5. Re:hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Socialism is all right for corporations in the USA. It's only when applied for the benefit of individuals that it becomes evil.

    6. Re:hard by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      We had a panic over communism which spurred on education and research. There was very serious concern that our schools were falling behind and so tax dollars flowed into the schools. There was worry that the Russkies were making better weapons than us and so money flowed to defense industries. The whole space program was about competing against the enemy. Today though the panic is over terrorists so there's no worry about being better educated or having better technology. Though if the public's panic was over China conquering us economically (a likely outcome) we'd probably see a lot more public spending.

    7. Re:hard by thunderclees · · Score: 1

      BillWG wants the US government to spend while his monopoly pushes for removal of visa caps and easier, tax payer supported outsourcing. Perhaps he is petitioning the wrong government?

    8. Re:hard by chihowa · · Score: 1

      This is a great answer. To add to that, the US government runs quite a few national research laboratories that are having to turn away potential researchers and push out existing researchers because there is too little money allocated to keeping research staff.

      Where I work, well equipped and built up labs are sitting empty because there is no money set aside to actually hire people to work in the labs. The budgets barely keep up with inflation and often come with so many new mandated projects that money has to be stripped from already running projects to start the new ones.

      --
      If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.
    9. Re:hard by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      The private market has decided to focus on near-term R&D and products for the most part. The days of Xerox's GUI-like research are mostly gone (with the notable exception of near-Earth-orbit spaceflight.)

      I'm not sure why industry changed. It could be a bad batch of MBA's trained via education fads to chase short-term, or maybe the pressure of global competition putting companies in semi-panic survival mode. But it has changed.

      Easy, greed took over. It used to be executives managed their companies looking in the interest of the entire company, not just in the short term, but also in the longer term.

      Then they got greedy - realizing that short term gains give them a lot of money, and then they start cutting because a dollar saved then goes into their pocket.

      There's a chart showing how real incomes of regular folks and CEOs pretty much kept in step until the 70s or so, then started diverging with the 1% (and 10%) rising far faster. This coincides with the fact that the CEO to lowest paid worker ratio started increasing dramatically - it was around 5:1 and started heading to 10:1. It was worrying that 20:1 would result in collapse (we're around 100-200:1 or so now).

    10. Re:hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And if we want to continue to surf the leading edge, we have to create the leading edge. Nobody else is going to do it for us.

      All we have to do to bring back manufacturing is relax the "nuclear non proliferation" laws on US rare earth mining so that non fissile materials (like Thorium) don't make it overly expensive to mine dysprosium and neodymium, etc. China and Russia are trying to ensure our US politicians don't allow this to happen. This way manufacturing jobs which gravitate towards the source of their raw materials won't ever be viable in the USA. Stop flipping out over Thorium, and we'll be able to bring jobs back to America, and then our innovators will be able to innovate on the manufacturing process as well as product design.

    11. Re:hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It could be a bad batch of MBA's trained via education fads to chase short-term

      It's because CEOs get a pretty good base pay, but the vast majority of their income is based off of hitting certain metrics, and all of them are defined in the short-to-mid term. There is no "get a $10M bonus if you invent a new disruptive technology." There is a "get $10M bonus if share price goes up 5% this year." So sell off tons of shit and move things around to artificially inflate share price 5%, collect $10M, no longer have to worry the rest of your life about money.

    12. Re:hard by roman_mir · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure why industry changed. It could be a bad batch of MBA's trained via education fads to chase short-term, or maybe the pressure of global competition putting companies in semi-panic survival mode. But it has changed.

      - well I am sure. I am sure that the reality is very different from the way 99% of people see it in case of government and individual rights. It is different because the 99% have been conditioned in the way that blinds them, makes it impossible for them to understand what is going on.

      The problem is that USA became a socialist country starting with the Sherman's act of destruction of private property rights, FDR, all of the 'great society' crap, Federal reserve and fake money, IRS and income and wealth taxation, SS, Medicare, wage and price controls. All of these ideas led to the 1971 default on the dollar and since then the inflation has been rampant, double digits, much higher than any officials would admit and they are very busy changing the way that inflation (and thus GDP) get reported.

      USA productivity is destroyed because there are no savings, no actual savings. There is no money. I am not talking about paper that the Fed and the banks are creating, I am not even talking about the slave contributions made to the Treasury through IRS and taxes. I am talking about real money, something that became taboo in USA and much of the rest of the modern world, something that is destroying productivity and economics everywhere.

      Without real productivity there are no real savings, without real savings there are no investments, no investments means no research also.

      Thus, government has to step in the fill the void. I don't see the private sector growing more interested in medium- and long-term R&D again. It's not whether the government sucks, it's whether the alternative is worse.

      - the government has destroyed the ability of the free individual (private sector) to save money and thus to be able to afford research and development. Government can only print or borrow (borrowing is future taxation, printing is underhanded taxation of all dollar denominated assets now).

      Government 'stepping in and filling the void' would be ironic since the government is the void that sucked all the life out of the economy.

      The solution is obvious but you have to recognize the root problem, but you have been conditioned to look at it and right through it without ever recognising it.

    13. Re:hard by Z80a · · Score: 1

      Sometimes you have to actually produce some results, or well, there won't be any money to pocket.

    14. Re:hard by TopherC · · Score: 1

      I have to disagree with this, at least as it relates to R&D spending. It sounds like you're advocating for pure, unregulated markets and want to rely on free market economics to somehow, magically, create a thriving privatized research program.

      I wish I could believe in that, but it's way too simplistic. People point to Bell Labs as an example of successful private research, but other than that and Research Corporation, I don't know of any privately-funded basic research programs. Both of those, combined, produced very little basic science. Not to belittle them, but government funded programs far exceeded them in terms of funding and science output. I view Bell Labs as a market anomaly -- a momentary quirk of a market failure, possible only because Bell telephone held a monopoly for a while and had money they didn't know what to do with and no competition to keep them running lean.

      In a properly-functioning market economy, companies that aren't 100% dedicated to maximizing return-on-investment will fail. This rules out basic science funding by corporations. Then you have private philanthropy, which only works when you have such an enormous wealth disparity that the top 0.0001% of citizens hold a large fraction of the nation's wealth and feel the desire at some point to spend a lot of it on research. Again, a consequence of a failed economy.

      The way science has been successfully funded in the US has been through government spending by politicians who were motivated to do the right thing for our country. This was publicly justifiable, especially during the cold war, and probably for the wrong reasons. But starting around 1993, the public has begun to steadily lose interest in science and other long-term goals, and our politics have reflected that.

      I don't even pretend to know about the pros and cons of the federal reserve bank. I know its history is suspicious at best, but beyond that there is a lot of intelligent debate that's outside my field of expertise. This is an important issue for sure, but I don't see how any fixes related to the Fed would do anything to restore a beneficial state of research in the US. In a healthy, thriving, and competitive economy, basic research can't and won't happen in the private sector.

    15. Re:hard by TopherC · · Score: 1

      Typically in university-based research, most of the government funding goes to post-doc salaries. The professors are paid by the university, and most of a grad student's research assistantship (basically minimum wage) is also paid through the university. Post-doc salaries are between about 1/3 to 1/2 of what industry would pay the same people.

    16. Re:hard by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Typically in university-based research, most of the government funding goes to post-doc salaries. The professors are paid by the university, and most of a grad student's research assistantship (basically minimum wage) is also paid through the university. Post-doc salaries are between about 1/3 to 1/2 of what industry would pay the same people.

      I am completely OK with post-docs "lining their pockets" with that fat "1/3 of what industry would pay".

      The post-docs I've known are pretty damn hard-working, or they wouldn't be post-docs.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
  3. Wait a minute by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Why don't the entrepreneurs invest in the R&D that they're going to take to market? Why should we socialize the cost of R&D and then privatize the profits that come from it?

    1. Re:Wait a minute by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why don't the entrepreneurs invest in the R&D that they're going to take to market?

      Because making the rich pay their fair share is punishing success.

      Why should we socialize the cost of R&D and then privatize the profits that come from it?

      Because fairness. Remember, when the government gives money to poor people, that's welfare and socialism. When they give it to rich people, that's capitalism and a free market.

    2. Re:Wait a minute by Tablizer · · Score: 1

      Why don't the entrepreneurs invest in the R&D that they're going to take to market? Why should we socialize the cost of R&D and then privatize the profits that come from it?

      Entrepreneurs are mostly interested in something that will pay off in about 5 years. The breakthroughs that are needed to spark entire new industries typically have taken longer than that. (Examples: early computers, jets, space rockets, Internet, DNA, etc.).

      If you take a finance class, you'll generally see that the payoff for cutting-edge endeavors is both too far away and uncertain compared to here-and-now investment alternatives. Cutting edge research looks poor on paper, per existing financing theories.

      And historically, early adopters often fall on their face because they don't know what the market wants or can do with it.

      Take the Olivetti Programma 101, arguably the first desktop computer. While it was a mild financial success, in part due to the stubborn nature of the inventor, the company's marketers and management were confused about what to do with it.

      Then there's Xerox's bungling of it's GUI and laser-printer technology. While they did get some royalties, it's questionable whether it paid off overall for them. Again, the company's marketers and management were confused by it and didn't how or where to sell it.

      And we have the Apple Newton, and Microsoft's Tablet of 2000. Interesting products, but immature and/or poorly executed.

      It often takes awhile for the ideas to roll around the market place before somebody finds the right combo of features and marketing to make them practical. The original idea is just the first step. It's the spark, but the ignition is slow.

      Governments can take a longer-haul view.

      I'm not sure how to fix this issue from the entrepreneur side of things. It's just the way it is.

  4. Article haiku by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 3, Insightful

    >> Government funding for our world-class research institutions produces the new technologies that American entrepreneurs take to market

    You pay the taxes
    Public schools research the tech
    Big business profits

    1. Re:Article haiku by phantomfive · · Score: 2

      Big business profits

      Man, all of us profit from that stuff.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    2. Re:Article haiku by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But some animals are more equal than others.

  5. Crony Capitalism by DidgetMaster · · Score: 2

    Given its track record, I have little faith that the government would use taxpayer funds to get promising ideas developed by people who would otherwise not have the resources to do it on their own. More than likely, this would be just another avenue to funnel tons of cash to the friends and donors of those in power (on both sides of the aisle).

    1. Re:Crony Capitalism by dywolf · · Score: 1

      spoken like someone unfamiliar with:
      -the track record of government funded science
      -how basic research is done and the sums involved
      -actual crony capitalism

      the modern world exists because of government funded basic research.

      and much the whole stupid "terrorists will hide in the refugees" thing, if getting rich off government funds is your thing, there are far easier, far more lucrative avenues than some piddly research grants.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    2. Re: Crony Capitalism by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      Yeah who needs satellites, GPS, nuclear power or the internet.

    3. Re:Crony Capitalism by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately we will not see any groundbreaking revolutionary new technology on private funds. Private investors want products. They want something to sell. And that's far, far away when you're doing basic research. But that is what you need to get new technologies.

      Take lasers. You know, the staple of 60s James Bond villains and the things that we use to read optical media. The fundamental work and early research towards them started about a century ago. A century. It took almost half a century until the first applications started to surface and they were few and far between, expensive and error prone. Only in the late 1980s CDs became a consumer product, pretty much the first that used this technology in the consumer market. And today they're pretty much the medium of choice when it comes to storing motion pictures for the consumer market.

      You think we would have them if we left the development to the private sector? A technology that isn't going to bear fruit for decades (and that was pretty much known back when research started, that it would take decades to produce anything marketable), do you think there was a single private company that would sink millions into the development of something like this.

      What would the world be like without, though? Well, for one we'd probably still record movies on magnetized tape. Actually, we probably won't. That was another government funded research, so, I don't know. But you may rest assured that whatever gadget would be used to show us inferior motion pictures, it would have a ton of bells and whistles nobody asked for.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    4. Re:Crony Capitalism by dywolf · · Score: 1

      "Short" (1176 articles), and incomplete list of science performed with NSF funding:
      http://www.nsf.gov/discoveries...

      Much of it seemingly banal ("health indicators of coral", "water availability"), but that's what basic research is: building blocks.
      But get enough blocks together, and eventually you've got a skyscraper of discovery and innovation.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    5. Re: Crony Capitalism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All of which had military applications when originally developed.

    6. Re:Crony Capitalism by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Given its track record, I have little faith that the government would use taxpayer funds to get promising ideas developed by people who would otherwise not have the resources to do it on their own.

      I love people who argue against government-funded R&D...on the Internet.

      Some other successes of government-funded R&D:

      - Communications and weather satellites
      - optical digital recording technology
      - supercomputers
      - digital communications
      - lasers
      - GPS
      - Human Genome Project
      - fluorescent lights
      - Every single bit of technology used in the so-called "private space industry"

      This is a partial list, of course.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    7. Re:Crony Capitalism by gtall · · Score: 1

      You clearly do not understand how the federal government funds research. It goes to NSF, NIH, DoD labs, etc. You won't get a drop without a viable research plan and work at viable research institution. Congress has periodically attempted to short-circuit this, but earmarks have been cut to such an extent, research earmarks no longer exist.

      That said, one of the best things Congress could do is cut that tax writeoff for research by private companies. They will label anything research just to get free money.

      Another big problem is the states. They have been cutting funding for unis to the point they have been trying to attract foreign students who don't pay instate tuition. The states have been cutting tuition assistance for instate students well as uni overhead. Yet, they still want to claim they support public unis. I'll let you figure out which political party is responsible for this.

    8. Re: Crony Capitalism by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      Yeah, and bioscience, particle energy research, fusion power, etc. have absolutely zero military applications.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    9. Re:Crony Capitalism by dywolf · · Score: 1

      well I wouldn't go so far as to say none.

      there have always been a few mavericks who would push the envelope just because its there.

      but its definitely true that they do not and never have represented the majority view when it comes to private investment in research.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
  6. Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "...corporations pull back on their commitment to discovery and innovation..."

    Gee, I wonder why they do that? Could it possibly have a little something to do with the cadre of politicians running around trying to use the force of government to take their wealth away? It's hard to spend money on R&D when Bernie Sanders is threatening to destroy your business overnight.

    1. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 2

      Gee, I wonder why they do that?

      Corporations used to have R&D centers. In fact, I work down the street from a rather famous one in Palo Alto that the corporate owners had no clue what to do with. But the bean counters from Wall Street ruled that R&D was an expense that added nothing to the bottom line. God forbid if you reduce today's profits for a future cow cash that might revolutionize the industry and make even more money.

    2. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by serviscope_minor · · Score: 1

      Corporations used to have R&D centers

      Some still do. Microsoft for example has a very well regarded pure resarch division.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    3. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Microsoft for example has a very well regarded pure resarch division.

      Microsoft closed the R&D center they had in Silicon Valley. I had a job interview at their campus several years. It was dead, dead, dead. Walk a couple of blocks away, all the Googlers were dancing in the street, chasing after unicorns and looking for lunch.

    4. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Gee, I wonder why they do that?

      Corporations used to have R&D centers. In fact, I work down the street from a rather famous one in Palo Alto that the corporate owners had no clue what to do with. But the bean counters from Wall Street ruled that R&D was an expense that added nothing to the bottom line. God forbid if you reduce today's profits for a future cow cash that might revolutionize the industry and make even more money.

      And the Xerox shareholders got suitably rewarded for their short-term thinking. XRX was over $140 a share at one point. It's currently about $11.

      Meanwhile, companies like Apple and Samsung and Google created new products and even entire new markets - without the government telling them what to do.

      Why do you think the government needs to fix this by spending taxpayer dollars on R&D?

    5. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Why do you think the government needs to fix this by spending taxpayer dollars on R&D?

      Where in my comment did I advocate this position? I pointed out that the corporations used to have R&D centers, but the bean counters came and the Wall Street short term mentality became the norm.

    6. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by oh_my_080980980 · · Score: 1

      LMOL yeah I guess you forgot about the government bail out of wall street. Jack ass.

    7. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by dywolf · · Score: 1

      its because they are risk averse, and (especially with today's short sighted next quarter mentality) if they can't see an immediate profit, they don't care.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    8. Re: Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      How dare anyone expect the wealthy to pay towards the developed world societies they benefit hugely from! Damn commies!

    9. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by RabidReindeer · · Score: 1

      Apple spent years circling the drain because the bean counters had taken over. It wasn't until they got desperate enough to bring Steve Jobs back. Steve wasn't afraid to to R&D.

      Google may be a powerhouse, but it's definitely not afraid to fail, and fail frequently. Bean counters hate that.

      As for Samsung, I missed the memo. I can't recall offhand anything they're doing that other companies aren't doing too. But if they aren't doing something, don't expect them to remain at the top.

      No, the government doesn't need to spend taxpayer dollars on R&D, but the current business mindset is one where bean-counters outnumber the innovators, where buying and selling companies rather than products is a major business.

      So maybe one day the Invisible Hand of the Market will fix all this, but I'm not going to hold my breath, and I'd rather not wait for innovation from beanville. I'd die of old age first.

      You can quack anti-government cant all you want, but at least the bean-counters don't own it.

    10. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by k6mfw · · Score: 1

      a rather famous one in Palo Alto that the corporate owners had no clue what to do with.

      Ah yes, that place. Where some people developed a computer that sat on a desk. It had this doohickey called a mouse. But don't let Steve Jobs and his cohorts in or they will steal all the secrets of this desktop computer design.

      --
      mfwright@batnet.com
    11. Re:Why does this happen, Billy Boy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Perhaps you would actually like to consider that the days of private companies doing long term research - Bell Labs, Xerox Parc - all occurred during the days of "high" taxes (and significantly lower CEO salaries) and coincidentally there was a strong middle class.

      But then the 80s changed things, executive salaries went ballistic while taxes dropped significantly, and the new executives cut the research as a waste of money.

      So no, it has nothing to do with the threats of the last couple of years given that it started 30+ years ago.

  7. the US government can't invest in anything by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It doesn't have any money. What Bill is calling on is more money to be taken from peoples' paychecks. I guess even evil capitalists can really be commies underneath.

  8. Spoils by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I just hope that while we continue to fund public research that the resulting economic gains stay squarely in the hands of the private sector.

    1. Re:Spoils by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Are you high? Only expenses get socialized, profits get privatized. Where have you been those past years?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Spoils by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know... I'm saying it'd be too bad if that changed.

      Right?

  9. And he wants to tax ALL OF US to pay for it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Meanwhile, he can use his billions of dollars to figure out how to make even more money off government R&D.

  10. It's too late now. by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The government might have the money to increase R&D funding if companies like Microsoft hadn't used creative accounting to almost totally avoid paying taxes. Perhaps Bill should have thought about that sooner.

    1. Re:It's too late now. by dAzED1 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This. The mega-corps like Google, Apple, and MS offshoring (or insisting on H1Bs) and avoiding taxes is a lot of why we're having our current problem. The Gov already *did* this for us - they invented the Internet (as an example), which Gates thought was a passing fad, and then the ultra-elite moved the rewards of the monetization of it offshore. Timothy Berners-Lee has a net worth of 1/1600th of Gates, yet none of us would be having this convo without him. Either TBL gained too little, BG gained too much, a bit of both, or...? But the greed of the ultra-rich is the problem here, not under-investment by the government.

    2. Re: It's too late now. by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      Well said.

    3. Re:It's too late now. by nine-times · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Also ironic because Microsoft spent years squashing competition and innovation in the tech industry. Now the guy responsible complains that we don't have enough innovation.

    4. Re:It's too late now. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      EXACTLY. Here's a guy who while certainly not dumb he hasn't done anything revolutionary other than stumble back asswards in to a monopoly worth BILLIONS & figuring out how to exploit that while avoiding major litigation & when that eventually happened it amounted to little less than a few 100ths on the dollar. He/they missed the internet boom by a 'moon shot' distance and yet are in position to successfully still exploit that monopoly.

      Bill Gate's advise is worth diddly squat. If IBM hadn't handed over the monopoly on DOS he'd be pushing broom in his daddy's mansion for spending money.

    5. Re:It's too late now. by sabbede · · Score: 1

      If that had something to do with how the Federal budget is drawn up, you'd have a point.

  11. Nice idea but probably futile by sjbe · · Score: 2

    Bill Gates attempted a commendable feat: to get politicians to focus on something other than the current election cycle and its partisan bickering.

    I didn't know his middle name was Sisyphus...

    Getting politicians to care about anything other than getting power and bashing the opposition these days is nigh impossible.

    More funding could also "develop the technologies that will power the world -- while also fighting climate change, promoting energy independence, and providing affordable energy for the 1.3 billion poor people who don't have it today."

    The party which currently controls Congress cares about none of those things. They plainly dispute even the existence of climate change, they aren't concerned about energy independence because that would hurt their oil and coal buddies and they certainly don't care about providing energy for poor people, especially ones that aren't American citizens.

    1. Re:Nice idea but probably futile by CrashNBrn · · Score: 1

      Filed Under: Sad But True.

    2. Re:Nice idea but probably futile by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wrong on the middle one. The party that currently controls Congress is big on energy independence. They make a ton of money from domestic fossil fuels and they hate sending money to the middle east. They are even more open to nuclear power. They just (oddly in the one place they won't bend over backwards for the libertarians in the party) don't care for small-installation, environmentally friendly options like customer owned solar or wind. The one issue the parties ought to agree on gets bogged down in the details and the party currently in control of the White House has a few more hang ups with energy independence than the one in Congress.

  12. HUZZAH! by rdelsambuco · · Score: 1

    Bill Gates for KING!!!

    --
    I comment occasionally so that I can mod others -1 overrated or -1 offtopic.
  13. $140B now.. How much more? by Virtucon · · Score: 1

    It's been down since the Great R but we're at $140B for FY2016, how much more should we spend there billy? Under Dubya it was up to was about $20B more.

    --
    Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
  14. Microsoft Ran Out of Companies to Steal From by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Awww... Has Micro$oft run out of companies to steal source material and actual ideas from? Perhaps you should have thought about that before you put nearly all of your competitors out of business, you monopolistic, anti-competitive, Sherman Anti-Trust Act breaking scum.

    Did you really think that just because a few decades have gone by we don't remember what you did to us? The rest of the world loves to read about how you and Melinda are giving even more millions to cool charities, and John Green worships you because you sat in a helicopter with him. It's Ok -- they're too young to know.

    We remember. We know where the money that funds your "philanthropy" really came from. I know why I lost two jobs and why those companies don't exist anymore. Personally, I give Paul some points because I think he realized what was going on and got out early enough that he can pretend to be guilt free. However, I'm still waiting for you and your dancing pet monkey Steve to get those jail cells you so richly deserve.

    Instead of funding R&D for you and Satya to steal, it would be better if our government made our system of justice work properly.

  15. gubb'mint is bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah right. Try to get the government to spend money on something worthwhile when republicans control both houses of congress. FYI, "The government" can't even see its way clear to buy paper for the copy machine.

    If you aren't in one of the privileged sectors (/coughDEFENSE/cough/cough"HOMELAND SECURITY"/cough), you better get used to doing your research and development with stuff you bought using your own nickles and dimes at Saturday morning garage sales. Government R&D for anything outside of defense and a few of Bill's pet projects is about as well funded as your average inner city kindergarten teacher.

    1. Re:gubb'mint is bad by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Well, it's a rich guy wanting something, so Reps might listen.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:gubb'mint is bad by Virtucon · · Score: 1

      Well, it's a rich guy wanting something, so Reps might listen.

      That's exactly the reason they shouldn't listen.

      --
      Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
    3. Re:gubb'mint is bad by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Why? Rich guys have the money and make campaign donations, who else should they listen to?

      Which makes me wonder... think we could get a Kickstarter campaign rolling? Maybe we can buy us our very own senator if we all pitch in?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    4. Re:gubb'mint is bad by dywolf · · Score: 1

      "coincidentally", nearly half of research grants in this country come out of the defense budget.

      --
      The guy who said the election was rigged won the presidency with the second-most votes.
    5. Re: gubb'mint is bad by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      And exactly the reason they will.

    6. Re:gubb'mint is bad by crunchygranola · · Score: 1

      Which makes me wonder... think we could get a Kickstarter campaign rolling? Maybe we can buy us our very own senator if we all pitch in?

      Buying Congressfolk is old hat. Today they are leased.

      (Yes, it works pretty much like that. You contribute regularly to their "leadership PAC" which is a slush fund from which they will eventually pocket all of the money. And you tell them from time to time how you would like them to vote. They know that if they ignore these "suggestions" the money will get cut off. No illegal pay for a vote at all, no sirree!)

      --
      Second class citizen of the New Gilded Age
  16. Pur your money where your mouth is by Opportunist · · Score: 0

    Bill, you have more money than the US, do it yourself.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  17. funny, that. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So a Billionaire calls on the government to spend more on research.
    Corporations want the government to do this, since it can save them money and time.
    The government has been cutting back, expecting corporations to take up the slack ( for profit....).

    So Bill says "/. fill in the blanks/."...
    So what. What he wants is of little concern to anyone who thinks.
    What the government wants - ditto.

  18. First you need the science educated people by Insanity+Defense · · Score: 1

    First you need the science educated people, so lets get the science back in science class and the creationism (ID = Creationism) back in church.

    1. Re:First you need the science educated people by deadwill69 · · Score: 1

      This hit the nail on the head.

    2. Re:First you need the science educated people by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your bigotry is showing.

    3. Re:First you need the science educated people by Insanity+Defense · · Score: 1

      Your bigotry is showing.

      How is it bigotry to say that non science does not belong in a public school science classroom? Or is it that ID is creationism? Read the Wedge Document it makes it quite clear that ID is Creationism. Read the ruling in the "Dover Trial" the Christian Judge quite clearly saw that ID was Creationism not science. Teach your religion in your church and your home to your kids not to everyone elses kids. Obey the 1st Amendment. i

  19. He lost me at "fighting climate change" by neo-mkrey · · Score: 1

    That battle is already lost.

    Better to put your money into something you can control and make a difference in, like cheap/free Internet for the world (although the cheap electricity thing would have to come first, obviously).

  20. Makes sense, companies aren't doing it anymore by ErichTheRed · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Regular companies have slashed their R&D or eliminated it completely. Bell Labs barely exists anymore, HP, IBM and Microsoft's Research arms are so product focused that very little long-term groundbreaking science comes out of there these days. Product manufacturing being shifted overseas means the engineering around manufacturing and product development is slowly shifting closer to the factories. Add in the fact that science in the academic world is a notoriously unstable, low-paying area to be in, and it's no wonder that basic research gets underfunded. It's not the same in other countries -- foreign students come back from their education here and are treated quite well compared to students here.

    The problem is that to continue innovating, you need that R&D pipeline. The public market and the MBA crowd prohibit investment in anything further than 2 quarters out, so something has to come in and pick up the slack. The golden age of for-profit companies paying for R&D is over unless some major shift happens. Not that I want to go back to the Cold War era, but look how much money got poured into the Space Race and defense programs. When the limitations of budgets, etc. were removed, progress was made quickly. The goal was to beat the Russians to the Moon, or to protect the country from a nuclear attack at all costs, and the work got done.

    tl;dr: Yes, throwing money at this particular problem will work, and it has in the past. It just takes the will to do it.

    1. Re:Makes sense, companies aren't doing it anymore by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Microsoft's Research arms are so product focused that very little long-term groundbreaking science comes out of there these days.

      It's actually kind of amazing how little good stuff comes out of Microsoft research, considering how much money they throw at it.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    2. Re:Makes sense, companies aren't doing it anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Windows for CloudGroups - now with Clippy 3.1

    3. Re:Makes sense, companies aren't doing it anymore by CrashNBrn · · Score: 1

      Yeah, there were lots of prototype devices that likely would of only interested the geekiest (small market). So given production at the time, likely a loss all round even if brought to market. Except, the market we have today, with 3D printing and other low-run manufacturing possibilities...it makes one wonder what Microsoft might do with all those (previously) "set-aside" hardware prototypes.

    4. Re:Makes sense, companies aren't doing it anymore by Qzukk · · Score: 1

      I remember a lot of people making googly-eyes at the Microsoft Courier After half a decade of ipads and android tablets, I doubt it could make any kind of comeback, especially not with the Surface occupying the "Microsoft Tablet" niche.

      --
      If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
    5. Re:Makes sense, companies aren't doing it anymore by quintessencesluglord · · Score: 1

      The problem is you then perpetuate businesses using the public trust as their own slush fund while offering very little in return. The public gets raped twice- once from paying the actual taxes that corps.skiver, and again when the products are sold back to them as jobs move elsewhere.

      It all seems a bit of economic brinkmanship, with corps. threatening to crash the party unless they get dibs on research dollars, and sucking that dry until the infrastructure crumbles and they move on to another market.

      I'm actually okay with government R/D for BIG things like the Desertron which companies could never hope to fund privately (and where were the calls for increased R/D and more importantly tax dollars when that was being closed down? Fuckers!).

      But this idea that corps. deserve a cut of the R/D pie in lieu of funding their own damn research is little more than a gimme, and actually perpetuates the technological slide the US has been on as the sum total of research goes down. It's not like engineering is projected as a hot field for the future according to the BLS. Maybe they should hire more engineers?

      But if they want to make a good faith offering, they can start putting their MBA heads on pikes at all of their research campuses. Prove they are really serious about being at the forefront of technological development and not just some guy in a $5,000 suit asking for a handout.

  21. Billy you liberal sob... by XMadtowner · · Score: 1

    "His call for more government-sponsored R&D also comes as corporations pull back on their commitment to discovery and innovation. With more government investment, he said, U.S. scientists could completely eradicate polio and further decrease the number of deaths from malaria." Just how many deaths from polio and malaria happened in the U.S. last year? We have already done that. Oh, you mean for other countries. Gotcha. I tell you what Bill. Go tell the leaders in those countries to stop stealing the money we already gave to them for that to line their own pockets. At last count America is about what, um, $19 trillion in debt. Take care of your own first. Poverty, crime, failing bridges, lead in drinking water pipes,,,,,,,,,, Govt. R&D???

  22. Oh course, we will need more H1-B Visas... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...So that *America* can stay on the leading edge.

    Sigh

  23. $5 Trillion by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    That $6 trillion we pissed away in Iraq and the Afghanistan would have come in handy right about now.

  24. Not for hardcore Republicans by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, hardcore republicans had the Import-export bank unfunded for several months. They opposed Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. They opposed the 2008 bailout. They oppose corn based ethanol.

  25. Yikes!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Quick.. someone invent something new, the Chinese are running out of IP to steal !!!!

  26. Yes ! Yes ! Yes ! by JimSadler · · Score: 1

    Not only do we need research in areas likely to be useful we also need the exotic research that has no apparent reason to take place. Those exotic studies somehow tend to yield the best fruit.

  27. We don't need more gov $$ in R&D by blindseer · · Score: 1

    Bill Gates is no doubt an intelligent and educated man, he is also no doubt acting in his own self interests. From where he sits he stands to benefit from more government spending on research since that is then research he does not have to fund himself but is also in a position to turn into products quickly. The internet is something that Gates did not see coming, and from what I recall from history he was either late to realize the impact it would have or perhaps even was dragged kicking and screaming into the internet age since the internet is something he could not control.

    It is rare to see government funding result in something beneficial to mankind. Frankly it is rare to see any research result in anything beneficial. However there is a big difference between private and public funding. Private funding means someone with an idea has to convince someone that has amassed their wealth from smart business decisions, hard work, and perhaps a bit of luck, to hand over some money to make it happen, with the hope that it makes them wealthier. Public funding means convincing a US senator that won a popularity/beauty contest to get into office to hand over money they did not earn in the hope of not getting a product that can make a return on that investment but to buy enough votes to stay in office so that they can spend more money that they did not earn to buy more votes six years later.

    In my mind people turn to government funds as a means of last resort. It tells me that these people were unable to make a business case to any one of thousands or millions of people with the money to fund their research. It tells me that these people either have a slim to none chance of success or are terrible at public relations, in either case they are unlikely to make a product that can sell.

    What might benefit Gates and the nation more than more federal research funds is more freedom for people to invest as they wish. This can take the form of lowered taxes so that people have more money to invest in new business ventures and technologies. This can take the form of loosening restrictions on research.

    I hear horror stories of people with terrible illnesses that want to take some experimental drugs but the FDA will not approve them. This lack of approval may be because of insufficient data on its effectiveness, known side effects, or whatever. I'd think that if the patient is given proper notification of the risks, and a physician approves, then the FDA need not be involved.

    When it comes to energy research Gates should realized the roadblocks the government has put in place. Gates is a fan of nuclear power and if we want to see more research then we don't need government money, what we need is government permission. There's lots of money out there that people would like to invest in nuclear power but the government has so far forbidden much of it. People are willing to invest because nuclear power has the potential to make them much more in return.

    Greed is not bad, it is a survival tactic. We can use greed to make the world a better place, because people like new stuff, a more comfortable life, etc. and are willing to spend money on it.

    I know people will reply with the mention of nuclear power and greed by claiming we'd get nuclear power plants that will run for ten years and then explode, because that is what greedy people will do. I say, fuck off. No one is so greedy that they'd put their own profits at risk like that, especially if it's their neighborhood that could get irradiated in this failed nuclear power plant experiment. No one makes money doing that, except perhaps when the government is funding it. Take the government money out of it and it's the investors' money on the line, that will give us safe nuclear power. Remember that all the nuclear power plant disasters we've had were from power plants that passed government inspections. The worst of all, Chernobyl, was a government project from beginning to explosive end.

    --
    I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    1. Re:We don't need more gov $$ in R&D by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Government money for research is allocated by independent bodies that evaluate the requests for money. It is *not* handed out by the elected officials.

    2. Re:We don't need more gov $$ in R&D by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The banks sold mortgages they knew couldn't be repaid, in fact they knew it was so dangerous that they came up with complicated ways to hide the danger because the profits were so great - at least until it all fell apart and you and the other taxpayers had to pick up the bill to allow them to keep making their profits.

      MMA railway cut back on maintenance and labor, resulting in the death of 42 people in Lac Megantic Quebec.

      The head of the White Star line was on board the Titanic, but meeting the schedule was more important than worrying about icebergs.

      Recently it was news that a cheese company was bulking up their "Parmesan" with cellulose.

      Not that long ago the UK had a horse meat scandal.

      Or how about mad cow, because it was decided adding leftover parts of cows was a cheap way to feed cows.

      History is full of examples of greed causing poor decisions to be made, either because the negative won't happen to me, or because the executive making the decision knows they won't be around to face the consequences.

  28. commercialization is the challenge by Goldsmith · · Score: 1

    Since 1999 the US government has paid more for basic research to universities than the combined private and public investment in early stage commercialization (government research grants vs angel investing + venture capital + SBIR). We've built our R&D system such that it costs more to commercialize a good idea than it does to do the basic research. Basic research costs are kept low by subsidies from the researchers who accept degrees, PhDs, postdoctoral fellowships, and tenure in lieu of money.

    So, now we have an overabundance of basic research ideas and projects, and a shortage of commercialization opportunities and industry funding.

    How does that lead to the government needing to spend more? The government is spending enough.

    1) Let's go back to requiring DoD contractors spend 15% of their overhead funding on internal R&D.
    2) Let's require SBIR recipients to work on their funded projects full time.
    3) Let's require that "diversified investments" advertised to the general public include 0.5% of total funds invested in companies less than 5 years old.

    The money is out there, and the researchers are out there. The government doesn't need to pay for everything, nor the scientific community accept the expansive view of "basic" research to include everything up to sales (and in some cases, past that). There needs to be a nudge in the right direction though.

    1. Re:commercialization is the challenge by MoarSauce123 · · Score: 1

      Add to your list the requirement that university receiving federal grants have to keep their administrative and non-academic expenses to 25% max. Otherwise these grants fund more administrative positions and other needless fluff. US universities have increased spending on administrative and non-academic (mainly college athletics) positions by 300% while expenses for academic positions (profs, researchers, techs) stayed flat at best.

  29. Gates killed enough small businesses... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    he should assuage his guilty conscience with his own plunder.

  30. never mind the godless cunt by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    camel. eye. needle.

    Think Bill with Global Mother Fucking Spyware can defeat God's creations?

  31. Flatlined? Gee, I wonder why. by sabbede · · Score: 1

    It's not like we've been through an unusually long recession or anything else that might lead Congress to tighten the strings on discretionary spending.

  32. Gates? by MoarSauce123 · · Score: 1

    The Gates Foundation favors research teams over others stifling the necessary discourse. Also, so far none of the projects sponsored by the Gates Foundation had any lasting impact for the greater good. Plus...although he is no longer directly involved...Microsoft is one of the biggest roadblocks to open access to tech.

  33. Re:Flatlined? Gee, I wonder why. by MoarSauce123 · · Score: 1

    Yes, but a responsible Congress with folks who have a clue increase R&D and infrastructure spending during a regression. Not only does that keep folks employed, it also lays the groundwork once the economy picks back up again. And that is when Congress needs to step in and grab some of that cash so that it compensates for previous expenses rather than make very few people very rich. But with that many utterly clueless tea baggers in Congress we can all forget about common sense.

  34. Re:Flatlined? Gee, I wonder why. by sabbede · · Score: 1
    No, that's what they do if they misread Keynes. His theory was that the government can shore up the economy by increasing spending to replace falling consumer demand, but it's been twisted around, leaving out everything but "increase spending during a recession". Having forgotten the key point that it is consumption that needs to be increased, well intentioned but incorrect legislators start to think that any spending will do; or worse, that the government needs to increase supply and demand labor. Not only does this not help the situation, it can prolong or even worsen a recession.

    In a recession people don't need to be given jobs in research or highway construction. That doesn't solve anything - it's two too small sectors of the economy with restrictions on who can provide the labor (one has high qualification requirements, the other has skill and physical requirements). People need to keep the jobs they have. There isn't time to retrain IT workers as road workers or put retail salespeople through grad school.

    Besides, using infrastructure projects to boost an economy has been tried elsewhere. The usual outcome is wide stretches of pristine highways and beautiful new facilities, all unused because the labor force is tied up building the highways instead of engaging in the commerce the infrastructure is meant to facilitate. Truck drivers too busy building roads to use them and so forth.

  35. No government please.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Give the money to Musk. We need more Tesla and SpaceX.