China's Tech Work Culture Is So Intense People Sleep and Bathe In Their Offices (techinsider.io)

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China's Tech Work Culture Is So Intense People Sleep and Bathe In Their Offices (techinsider.io)

Posted by msmash on Friday May 13, 2016 @08:45AM from the different-culture,-different-lifestyle dept.

An anonymous reader writes: China's technology sector is booming at an intensely fast pace. Many startups are seeing their business grow faster than they can hire, placing a heavy burden on those already working within the industry. "The pace of Chinese internet company growth is extremely fast," Cui Meng, general manager and cofounder of data startup Goopal, told Reuters. "I've been to the US and the competitive environment there isn't as intense as in China." This has led many workers to put in overtime, sleeping at their desks, on cots, or even in provided bunk beds. Many employees are encouraged to live at the office during the workweek. Lunchtime naps are generally allowed, and those who end up staying past midnight usually pass out in the office.Reuters has amazing photographs of such offices and employees.

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When I think of China by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 08:48 · Score: 5, Funny

When I think of China the first thing that comes to mind is technical innovation.
1. Re: When I think of China by Aethedor · 2016-05-13 08:59 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  There is not much innovation in that country. They are good art reproducing, doing what they are told to do and build according to given plans and instructions. Many is to blame at their education. Most of the time at school is spent at learning thousands of chinese characters. At the end, reproducing is all they know. Because of that, inventing is not in their system. They have never been challenged to innovate. Their economy is based on cheap labour. As soon as western countries find cheaper or easier way to build stuff, China's economy will collapse.
  
  --
  It doesn't have to be like this. All we need to do is make sure we keep talking.
2. Re: When I think of China by zenlessyank · 2016-05-13 09:11 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  The worlds' addiction to laziness and greed will ensure that doesn't happen. You have been warned. China is but an embryo slowly morphing into the mighty dragon it will become. It is already too late. Just sit back and enjoy the show.
3. Re: When I think of China by waspleg · 2016-05-13 09:14 · Score: 2
  
  At least their unemployment problem will be far worse than ours when the robots finish taking all the jobs =)
4. Re: When I think of China by 110010001000 · 2016-05-13 09:15 · Score: 1
  
  They said the same thing about Japan in the 1980s. Now it is mired in a 20 year recession.
5. Re: When I think of China by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 09:23 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  I agree 100%. I have been to China and I have seen how rapidly they are accelerating. Anyone who dismisses the rise of China by making racist remarks or talking about their lack of innovation is in for a surprise. I work with many chinese engineers and i see no shortage of innovative ideas. Some of them might lack in their leadership abilities but unlike Japan and Korea, China is very open to adopting western ways of doing things and you already see the changing of their culture. American engineers should enjoy their 8-9 hour/day jobs while Chinese engineers and entrepreneurs are working 15 hours a day. Soon Silicon Valley will be like the North East, hordes of angry unemployed people shaking their fists at the "damn farreigners".
6. Re: When I think of China by 110010001000 · 2016-05-13 09:31 · Score: 1
  
  Replace "China" with "Japan" and you just said what the 'experts' were saying the in 1980s. JAPAN IS GONNA TAKE OVERZZ!
7. Re:When I think of China by Applehu+Akbar · 2016-05-13 09:36 · Score: 2
  
  When I think of China the first thing that comes to mind is technical innovation.
  Being first to innovate is meaningless unless you can turn those innovations into real products. China didn't invent nuclear reactors, but it's the one country that is busy replacing their coal-fired power with them. China didn't invent high speed rail either, but is is building bullet lines all over the country, while our one bullet line in California is still tied up in the courts. The Germans invented maglev rail, but guess which country Siemens had to build it in?
8. Re: When I think of China by 110010001000 · 2016-05-13 09:37 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly. The same will happen to China. And yes: Japan is still in a recession. Only fools think China is the danger.
9. Re: When I think of China by RabidReindeer · 2016-05-13 09:55 · Score: 1
  
  No it won't. They're Communists.
10. Re: When I think of China by ShanghaiBill · 2016-05-13 09:58 · Score: 1
  
  Japan is not in a recession since decades.
  Not true. Japan was in recession 3Q last year. They have been cycling in and out of recession since 1990. They may be heading back into recession now.
  
  The collapse of Japan was orchestrated by american banks around 1987 - 1990
  Baloney. Japan's recession was 100% self-inflicted, and could have been (mostly) avoided. There is no excuse for a deflationary recession. You just print money, which is what America did with QE during the Financial Crisis, which was not a deflationary recession but could have become one.
11. Re: When I think of China by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 10:00 · Score: 1
  
  Their alzheimers and dementia problems with the population will be even worse. If you exhaust yourself to the point that you are brain-tired and passing out at work, you're on the way to getting permanent brain damage. Brain's need rest just like muscles.
12. Re: When I think of China by Maxo-Texas · 2016-05-13 10:07 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  And right about the time they hit their stride, we'll hit a shortage of almost every industrial metal.
  Should be interesting.
  I can understand their motivation. It's like it used to be for programmers in the U.S. in the 80s. You could literally work 6 months and earn 2 years worth of pay.
  Today, you work 72 hours a week and the company offers you base salary plus a "potential" bonus that never hits 100% while the executives take home millions in pay, have a 2nd better funded pension system, and gold plated health care.
  U.S. workers do work hard when they have a realistic potential to earn $200k in less than a year. I've seen them walking around with black eyes from lack of sleep. I've been at companies where they worked themselves til they were taken away unconcious from their desk to an ambulance.
  But executives have gotten greedy and taken away... comp time, genuine achievable bonuses, and decent pay (with heavy offshoring).
  As china moves from a GDP of $15,000 to a GDP of $45,000 the ability to become 'rich' thru working long hours will fade and with it so will their enthusiasm to work these hours. Their children who enter the work force in 10 to 15 years will not be nearly so enthusiastic ( same pattern as the u.s., then japan, etc.).
  There will be a time when the chinese also ask, "Do I live to work or do I work to live?"
  Former programmer then manager... retired for 4 years and loving it.
  
  --
  She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
13. Re: When I think of China by charyou-tree · 2016-05-13 10:26 · Score: 1
  
  The worlds' addiction to laziness and greed will ensure that doesn't happen. You have been warned. China is but an embryo slowly morphing into the mighty dragon it will become. It is already too late. Just sit back and enjoy the show.
  LOL
  
  China is fucked.
  
  They're staring down the barrel of a self-inflicted one-child demographic problem that couldn't be worse if it'd been orchestrated by an all-powerful super-villain who hated China.
  
  They've got hundreds if not thousands of Superfund sites ... but no Superfund.
  
  A billion of their people are living in mud hut poverty, and the ones that aren't are living in a real estate bubble that's gargantuanly monstrously huge.
  
  Their provincial debt problems are absolutely staggering.
  
  They have an unbelievably corrupt and oppressive communist government.
  
  The thing they're best at, cheap unskilled labor, is being increasingly exported to southeast Asia.
  
  They've been an irrelevant inconsequential naval power since they burned Zheng He's ships eight fucking centuries ago. Today, they can't even sail to Taiwan.
  
  Sure, China's going to dominate the world. Sure.
  
  China is fucked.
  
  "China is but an embryo slowly morphing into the mighty dragon it will become. It is already too late."
  
  ell oh ell
  
  You're so cute.
14. Re: When I think of China by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 10:31 · Score: 1
  
  No innovation? DJI is the world leader in drones. There are many billion dollar startups like Alibaba in China that will dwarf Amazon & Facebook.
  China will be a larger version of Japan. By the time they reach 1/4 the level of per-capita GDP of the US, they'll be the world's largest economy.
15. Re: When I think of China by bmo · 2016-05-13 11:49 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  The British said this about the Americans at the start of the Industrial Revolution, when we stole their technology.
  We Americans said the same about the Japanese and Koreans.
  The British were wrong. We were wrong. Everyone who says that "they just steal our innovation and copy it without any creativity" is wrong. Completely, utterly, to their own detriment, WRONG.
  It screams "whistling past the graveyard" /at best/ and probably veiled racism depending on who you hear this stuff from.
  "China's economy will collapse"
  Whose economies don't have cycles of boom and bust? Ours? HAVE YOU FUCKING LOOKED AROUND?!
  Christ on a stick. You have no fucking clue. You are complacent and have not looked past the headlines at all.
  --
  BMO
16. Re:When I think of China by Austerity+Empowers · 2016-05-13 12:40 · Score: 1
  
  How can you tell them apart from Texans? The reason we drive such big cars is so we don't have to worry about what we run over when we change lanes.
17. Re: When I think of China by Austerity+Empowers · 2016-05-13 12:42 · Score: 1
  
  Just sit back and enjoy the show.
  Hopefully in their teenage dragon years they realize their government is a shitshow and they throw it out with yesterday's trash.
18. Re: When I think of China by K.+S.+Kyosuke · 2016-05-13 13:16 · Score: 1
  
  American engineers should enjoy their 8-9 hour/day jobs while Chinese engineers and entrepreneurs are working 15 hours a day.
  Apples and oranges? Surely engineers at American startups aren't "enjoying their 8-9 hour/day jobs".
  
  --
  Ezekiel 23:20
19. Re:When I think of China by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 13:41 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Why admit you're 10 years behind the news? http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/13...
20. Re: When I think of China by K.+S.+Kyosuke · 2016-05-13 13:45 · Score: 1
  
  All economies are filled with obvious inefficiencies: they still use humans.
  
  --
  Ezekiel 23:20
21. Re:When I think of China by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 13:58 · Score: 1
  
  LOL
  Jap criticizes Chink innovation, when the entire Jap society is a carbon copy of Chink culture.
  Although K.S.Kyosuke is probably just a fake name, and you're not really Jap.
22. Re:When I think of China by K.+S.+Kyosuke · 2016-05-13 14:02 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, if I login-named myself Elrond, you'd think I were an elf. Please tell me you're not that stupid.
  
  --
  Ezekiel 23:20
23. Re: When I think of China by zenlessyank · 2016-05-13 16:00 · Score: 1
  
  You are as much of an idiot as Trump. Where the fuck do you get your info?? Republican semen?
24. Re:When I think of China by Austerity+Empowers · 2016-05-13 17:24 · Score: 1
  
  Texas yo, we drive over them only after having shot them in self defense a few times.
25. Re: When I think of China by AmiMoJo · 2016-05-13 21:07 · Score: 2
  
  No, what has held China back is the lack of institutions. It takes time to build up universities to do basic research, and commercial R&D divisions to develop it into new products. That's been coming on-line for a couple of decades now. Examples of China's world-leading innovation, off the top of my head, include extremely good but low cost wireless modems and CPUs, LCD technology and supercomputing. Contrary to what some people claim, this isn't stolen tech, it's developed in China by Chinese companies. Taiwan got started earlier than the rest of China, but it's all catching up now.
  The language thing is a red herring. Yes, there are thousands of characters, but so are there in Japanese (it's a shared alphabet, Japanese people can read Chinese newspapers but not vice-versa) and Japan leads the world in innovation. Besides, most of the characters are just compositions of simpler ones, so it's not like you need to memorize thousands of completely separate shapes. Arguably the way they talk about numbers give them an advantage too, because they have a word for 10,000 and no teens or special names for multiples of 10.
  
  --
  const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
  SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
26. Re:When I think of China by K.+S.+Kyosuke · 2016-05-13 22:26 · Score: 1
  
  A random choice from one of the world's cultures. It could have been something else, but you ususally don't get to pick multiple alternates for a login identifier.
  
  --
  Ezekiel 23:20
27. Re: When I think of China by orledrat · 2016-05-14 00:43 · Score: 1
  
  Brain's need rest just like muscles.
  Yep, and that's without taking into account any anaphylaxis from allergies. Mussel damage is no joke.
28. Re: When I think of China by angel'o'sphere · 2016-05-14 01:48 · Score: 1
  
  Perhaps you have a different definition of recession :D
  No one ever mentioned a recession in Japan the last decade in the news.
  
  --
  Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
29. Re: When I think of China by Cognivore · 2016-05-14 03:13 · Score: 1
  
  The worlds' addiction to having a life will ensure that the Chinese will want one eventually, too. No need to fret. China is supposedly communist fustercluck that somehow manages to exploit their workers anyway. Eventually the workers will get tired of that shit. It is already too late. Just sit back and enjoy the show.
  There, fixed that for you.
30. Re: When I think of China by GuB-42 · 2016-05-14 05:21 · Score: 1
  
  Japan leads the world in innovation?
  No but they lead the world in perfectionism. They tend not to be very creative, however, they are very good at making small improvements and fixing defects. So even if they don't create many breakthroughs, they are more than able to stay ahead in already existing technologies.
  
  The fucking ATM's shut down every night.
  You can now find ATMs in combinis open 24/7. Only traditional Japanese banks still do this, and I am not even sure. The Japanese banking system was broken, that's true, but since the arrival of foreign banks, things have improved a bit. One must keep in mind that Japan is a cash based society, and thanks to the low criminality, people can travel with large amount of it with little worries.
  
  Japan is so advanced that fax machines still dominate the business world because they don't 'trust' email.
  It is not about trusting e-mail. It is simply habit. Fax machines were and still are a lot more common than in the west and they just keep using them because it works. For personal communication, they use e-mail a lot more than we do because cell phones supported it since well before the smartphone era.
  
  Japan is a backwards society that rivals China for how inefficient and anti-technology business can be.
  Japan is not backwards and not anti-technology. They simply advanced in different fields because they have different needs and a different culture. As for inefficiency, I have to agree with you, and it is driving a lot of "gaijin" mad. They make it up with hard work (at least when the boss is looking) and a sense of duty unheard of in the western culture.
  Well Japan is changing now, they seem to lose a bit of their identity, for the better or for the worse. For the economy, it is mostly a bad thing I think.
31. Re: When I think of China by lonecrow · 2016-05-14 05:44 · Score: 1
  
  I think these days they have more of a single party meritocracy with a dash of cronyism here and there. But communist? Not if you mean the state owns and runs everything.
32. Re: When I think of China by ShanghaiBill · 2016-05-14 08:43 · Score: 1
  
  Perhaps you have a different definition of recession :D
  A recession is two or more consecutive quarters of economic contraction (negative GDP growth). That is a widely accepted definition of the word.
  
  No one ever mentioned a recession in Japan the last decade in the news.
  Perhaps not in People Magazine. Over the last decade, I have seen dozens of articles about recession in Japan, many of them comparing the post-1990 recessions in Japan, and the ineffectual response by the JCB, to the 2008 Financial Crisis in America and Europe, and the responses of the US Fed (mostly effective) and the ECB (mostly ineffective, for mostly the same reasons that the JCB failed).
33. Re: When I think of China by Maxo-Texas · 2016-05-14 11:48 · Score: 1
  
  Japan has had recessions from
  1991-1993
  1997-1999
  2001-2002
  2004-2005
  2009-2010
  2012-2013
  https://www.linkedin.com/pulse...
  and
  2015-2016
  http://www.bbc.com/news/busine...
  See also.
  http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/bus...
  Japan's essential problem is that their GDP caught up with everyone else. Japan's GDP is about $45k (USD) (roughly the same as Germany, France, the U.S., etc. depending on the exchange rate).
  Google "Japan bbc recession" for a variety of news articles on japan's various recessions. If you add a year you can get details on a particular recession (like "japan recession 1998".
  The same fate awaits china in about 20 years and india in about 40 years.
  It may affect parts of india much sooner since the country is so bifurcated.
  
  --
  She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
34. Re:When I think of China by toddestan · 2016-05-14 13:26 · Score: 1
  
  China didn't invent nuclear reactors, but it's the one country that is busy replacing their coal-fired power with them.
  I wouldn't exactly say that. China has been building a lot of nuclear power, but they've also been constructing coal power plants as fast as they can build them.
35. Re: When I think of China by NewYork · 2016-05-15 03:59 · Score: 1
  
  "If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants" --Isaac Newton
  
  --
  Casteism
36. Re: When I think of China by RabidReindeer · 2016-05-16 00:13 · Score: 2
  
  As long as the Communist Party runs China, the long view is that it's Communist. The Party allows private ownership and private control, but the key word there is "allows". All it takes is for the Party to decide that they don't like how things are working out and they can nationalize everything overnight at gunpoint and bye-bye Capitalism, regardless of the turmoil it would cause. The ultimate motivator for the PRC is still the Party, not some abstract economic system and the Chinese have a very long history of not caring what the rest of the world thinks about what they do.
  The sour old joke in the USSR was that "they pretend to pay us and we pretend to work". But a lot of Putin's popularity comes from the fact that he reminds people of the "godd old days" when income might have been a joke, but at least you had an income, guaranteed and with luck, there'd be something in the shops to buy with it.
  Capitalists have always been proud of their freedom, including the freedom to starved to death if you don't work. Or can't work. Or there simply is no work, which is what worries us as even lawyers are seeing technology threaten their jobs.
Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Frosty+Piss · 2016-05-13 08:49 · Score: 1

Startups here would do this if they could get away with it, perhaps some already do...

--
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
1. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by TheGratefulNet · 2016-05-13 08:58 · Score: 1
  
  I've heard (not sure if true; any ac want to confirm?) that samsung in the US has bunks for its employees and many are expected to stay long hours that require bed reset -onsite-.
  I think its common for samsung overseas; but do they do that, here, in the US?
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
2. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by kilfarsnar · 2016-05-13 09:16 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  "giving the entirety of one's being" to one's company is already a pretty big trend.
  Those of us who know what it's like to actually have a life know what stupid bullshit that is. I have worked with people like that and they seem to think they were put on this planet to work for some company or other. I was not put here for that purpose.
  
  --
  "What the American public doesn't know is what makes them the American public." -Ray Zalinsky (Tommy Boy)
3. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by avandesande · 2016-05-13 09:20 · Score: 2
  
  And why wouldn't you? If I had a reasonable expectation of becoming a multi-millionaire, I would certainly do this for a few years.
  
  --
  love is just extroverted narcissism
4. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by fustakrakich · 2016-05-13 09:21 · Score: 1
  
  Start ups? Hell, the poultry factory workers don't even get bathroom breaks, and they have to supply their own diapers, right here in the good old USA already. The Chinese have it good. Those offices look nice and clean...
  
  --
  “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
5. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by thinkwaitfast · 2016-05-13 09:24 · Score: 1
  
  I have many times. So what? There was even a movie that showed people doing this.
6. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Verdatum · 2016-05-13 09:28 · Score: 1
  
  If you get hired at a Bay-Area startup, they charge you rent to sleep at your desk; otherwise, your cube gets leased out to some other guy for the evening hours.
7. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 09:35 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  At one time it was a reasonable deal. You'd give your youth to a company, and they'd provide a pension when you're too old to work. Now we still give our lives to companies, but we don't get the pension, or even steady employment in a lot of cases.
8. Re: Coming To an American Statup Near You? by knightghost · 2016-05-13 09:42 · Score: 1
  
  Says the kid that has yet to sample real life. Take a taste and you'll be hooked.
9. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Nethead · 2016-05-13 09:53 · Score: 1
  
  I didn't see any in the Bellevue, WA office when I installed their phones and data rooms.
  
  --
  -- I have a private email server in my basement.
10. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by ShanghaiBill · 2016-05-13 10:10 · Score: 4, Interesting
  
  I've slept on the floor at my last startup. Whatever.
  When I first moved to Silicon Valley, I didn't even rent an apartment for the first 2 years. I just lived at the office and slept under my desk. Many others were doing the same. The company provided showers, a full kitchen, and laundry service. Then I got a girlfriend. We had sex in my office a few times, but then she insisted that I get an apartment. That was quite some time ago, since we are married now, and our daughter is in high school. But I will see people living out of their vans in tech company parking lots, so I think the startup culture is still alive and well.
11. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by TheGratefulNet · 2016-05-13 11:01 · Score: 1
  
  did they know you were coming, with advance warning?
  (j/k)
  thx for the data point.
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
12. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by TheGratefulNet · 2016-05-13 11:03 · Score: 1
  
  I came in one day to find I was replaced by an arduino.
  that arduino better watch its step, though. there's a 4bit controller that is itching to take its job, and will take much less pow^H^Hay.
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
13. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 12:05 · Score: 1
  
  Startups here would do this if they could get away with it, perhaps some already do...
  Certain Established Large UK financial institutions in London have, for decades, provided these facilities 'on site' for IT staff on a totally 'this-doesnt-exist' basis (local government officials get funny about things like this). As it was rumoured that as some of the IT people hadn't seen the outside world for months, eventually the management had to set a limit on how long they could stay hidden in their electronic dungeons, rather generously they said that the poor IT troglodytes had to venture out for a least a week every couple of months..
  First f/t IT job I had, slept at work from Monday-Friday, went home at the weekends..did this for over 4 years (London again, got to loathe the place..)
  Last f/t IT gig I had (not in London), again, totally on the QT there were showers, beds and kitchens if you knew where to look for them. Surprisingly, the kitchens were rather well equipped, but as we were surrounded by a fine selection of Pubs, Pizzerias (not fsckin Pizza Hut and Dominos) Indian and Chinese restaurants and takeaways, they weren't used that much by t'other IT bods..
  Current (mostly non-IT) gig, I've done several 24hr++ stints where I've had to kip (read: catnap) at work just to get the products out the door on schedule...
  So, remind me again, Chinese IT people living at their place of work, why is this either surprising or even news?
14. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 13:31 · Score: 1
  
  "giving the entirety of one's being" to one's company is already a pretty big trend.
  Those of us who know what it's like to actually have a life know what stupid bullshit that is. I have worked with people like that and they seem to think they were put on this planet to work for some company or other. I was not put here for that purpose.
  Mod parent up. There is already a problem when it is culturally acceptable for such conditions. The Reuters article itself implied such culture was "normal"
  
  Business is booming faster than many start-up firms can hire new staff, forcing workers to burn the midnight oil to meet deadlines
  No, there is no "forcing" with that. If a deadline is not met, what's going to happen? Somebody will lose some money? Somebody won't be as happy as they would have been if the deadline was met? Unless you work with software that is involved in life/death situations ... it will be ALRIGHT. You'll live a long longer, happier, and healthier by not trying to meet artificial deadlines due to poor project planning, unrealistic sales commitments, greed, unpredictable acts of deities, or (insert your favorite reason here).
  
  Signed - those of us who have been in the industry long enough to know BS when we hear it.
15. Re: Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 15:24 · Score: 1
  
  A lot of people call the Me generation picky and lazy because they won't work unless they get compensated well. I call them smart for not accepting bad deals.
16. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by Mashiki · 2016-05-13 16:01 · Score: 1
  
  Startups here would do this if they could get away with it, perhaps some already do...
  Startups? Hell I know fortune 100 companies where people already do this(and have done this for years). When I was working in heavy manufacturing in the 90's, I spent around 70% of the work week living at work(sleeping/relaxing/etc) because during crunch there was always some problem that required someone to be on site, especially with some very specific problem that had to be looked after. These days? You'll still find this happening, especially if you're in the software industry or you make video games for a living. You've also never worked in Japan, this was very common in the 80's, 90's and through to the mid-00's there.
  
  --
  Om, nomnomnom...
17. Re:Coming To an American Statup Near You? by antdude · 2016-05-14 14:52 · Score: 1
  
  Sex at work? You didn't get caught? HR didn't care? :O
  
  --
  Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by decipher_saint · 2016-05-13 08:53 · Score: 4, Interesting

I remember basically living at work for a few years, slaving away for no good reason (other than ship-ship-ship). I had a friend of mine who worked for a fairly well-known maker of tax software, half their year was basically crunch time complete with in-office cots. They were treated well outside crunch time but I swear to god it aged him prematurely.
I don't think I'd ever work like that again, at the end of the day the code quality was poor and it burnt out all the talent. I didn't think it would be possible to be sick of pizza, but you learn these things.
Sure made the bastard CEO a hell of lot of money...

--
crazy dynamite monkey
1. Re:Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by istartedi · 2016-05-13 09:19 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Did you find that it was unsustainable? There were two periods in my life like this: Bachelor's degree, and a start-up. The start-up was just slightly easier than the bachelor's degree. YMMV based on how hard your school is, how much of a task-master your boss is, and let's face it--how smart you are. I'm sure there were some people that just absolutely cruised courses that made me cram... but then again there were people who dropped out and never came back. I dropped out of start-ups, and when you're middle aged you start to think twice about a diet of late-night pizza and soda. If you pass out with a coronary at 50, what's the point?
  Still though, if you think it's really important--if it's for God and country, or family, or just trying not to end up homeless or working a shit job for the rest of your life, you'll do it. Sometimes I think about the excitement and for the right project, maybe... one more time. I ran into a 20 something like that a while ago. He wanted me to help him code his stuff; but unfortunately it was the kind of software I hate. It was easy to turn that one down...
  
  --
  For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
2. Re:Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by thinkwaitfast · 2016-05-13 09:28 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  I did this for a couple of decades and comfortably retired.
3. Re:Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by barc0001 · 2016-05-13 09:45 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Similar experience with me in the 90s and early 2000s. We worked 16 hour days in many cases, sometimes for weeks on end to ship and at one place I worked at they finally did an audit of our bugtracker after one release. It was discovered that the amount of mistakes on code worked on during those pushes went up dramatically, and especially tellingly - during the last 4 hours of those 14-16 hour days, frequently working all weekend as well for up to 2 months. As a result during the next release cycle, the "push" was started earlier but days were limited to 10 hours and we took weekends off again and our ship time on the release was actually faster.
  Another after-release audit of the bugtracker showed that the number of introduced bugs was significantly lower than on the previous death march release and the conclusion was that the extra work hours were being burned up by mistakes to no benefit and much lower morale. Going forward, that company continued the 10 hour max rule and continues to do well.
  I moved on to other things and places and sometimes there was the old work long cycle again, but I've decided that I will no longer work at places that institutionalize that kind of time commitment. I work in systems so I am on call 24/7, and if something breaks at 3am I get up and fix it because it's what I signed on for, but I am definitely not putting in crazy overtime as part of general employment.
4. Re:Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by Sir+Holo · 2016-05-13 11:22 · Score: 1
  
  Similar experience with me in the 90s and early 2000s. We worked 16 hour days in many cases, sometimes for weeks on end to ship and at one place I worked at they finally did an audit of our bugtracker after one release. It was discovered that the amount of mistakes on code worked on during those pushes went up dramatically, and especially tellingly - during the last 4 hours of those 14-16 hour days, frequently working all weekend as well for up to 2 months.
  Most people cannot do mental marathons. That is the normal human condition. The bugtracker study done at your company was a smart thing to do.
  Some people can do mental marathons, but it takes not only the innate ability, but practice over many years to know when the mind is out of juice for the day. The best way to tell is to audit-your-code/edit-your-writing done during the marathon, and when in the marathon it was done. That way, eventually, one can indeed learn to tell that their brain is fuzzing-out when it starts to fuzz out.
  It can age one prematurely. That is true. Long recovery periods after anything marathon-like are mandatory. In the end, it is either (a) time-shifting, or (b) using a huge amount of information into your active, working memory. The latter takes several hours, so once it's in there, you make the most use of it that you can (with quality results). And always audit your work after recovery, regardless. Keep your sword sharp.
5. Re:Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by sootman · 2016-05-13 11:59 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  "I slept at work again last night; two and a half hours curled up in a quilt underneath my desk, from 11am to 1:30pm or so. That was when I woke up with a start, realizing that I was late for a meeting we were scheduled to have to argue about colormaps and dithering, and how we should deal with all the nefarious 8-bit color management issues. But it was no big deal, we just had the meeting later. It's hard for someone to hold it against you when you miss a meeting because you've been at work so long that you've passed out from exhaustion."
  - Jamie Zawinski, 1994
  https://web.archive.org/web/20...
  
  --
  Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
6. Re:Reminds me of the Dot Com bubble by lars_stefan_axelsson · 2016-05-14 05:08 · Score: 1
  
  It was discovered that the amount of mistakes on code worked on during those pushes went up dramatically, and especially tellingly - during the last 4 hours of those 14-16 hour days, frequently working all weekend as well for up to 2 months.
  And that's why USAF air craft mechanics do not work more than 12 hours per day, even during combat. Their bosses/officers, who will ultimately fly the planes, don't want them falling out of the sky due to simple and unavoidable mistakes. (It's amazing what management with true buy in will do to boost common sense in said management.)
  And that's realising that even 12 hours is pushing it. Sixteen? Forget about it.
  
  --
  Stefan Axelsson
From a picture in TFA by argStyopa · 2016-05-13 08:59 · Score: 4, Insightful

"God rewards the diligent."
Is that Chinese for "Arbeit macht frei"?

--
-Styopa
1. Re:From a picture in TFA by Sir+Holo · 2016-05-13 11:23 · Score: 2
  
  "God rewards the diligent."
  Is that Chinese for "Arbeit macht frei"?
  Luck favors the prepared. --- Sun Tzu
Working hard or hardly working?... by floatpt · 2016-05-13 09:00 · Score: 2

Looks like a bunch of people sleeping on the job to me.

--
d-_-b
Been there, and no. by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 09:04 · Score: 1

Maybe there are some cases of this, but from what I saw: they started at 9:00, had a nap directly after lunch, and they went home at 18:00. There were thousands of workers at this location in the tech sector.
Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by mark_reh · 2016-05-13 09:08 · Score: 1

In the 22 years I was an engineer I got to take a week off two or three times, otherwise vacation time was used by extending weekends to 3 days. The only time I was able to take more than a week off was when I was between jobs.
I pity those poor Chinese engineers!
After working full time as a dentist (4 days a week), for a few years, and finding the same sort of problem getting time off, I realized that I needed more between-jobs time. So now I do locum tenens work. It doesn't pay nearly as well as full time work in a clinic, but it sure makes life more pleasant. There seems to be plenty of locum tenens work available.
1. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by Verdatum · 2016-05-13 09:31 · Score: 1
  
  How on earth do you manage to transition from being an engineer to a dentist? Maybe the reason you never had time to take a long vacation was because you were constantly prepping for another exam!
2. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by rfengr · 2016-05-13 09:33 · Score: 1
  
  So I take it you went to dental school after 20+ years in engineering?
3. Re: Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by 110010001000 · 2016-05-13 09:34 · Score: 1
  
  I work at Microsoft and everyone gets 4 weeks. Nice troll.
4. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by sconeu · 2016-05-13 09:50 · Score: 1
  
  He got the idea from Herbie
  
  --
  General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
5. Re: Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 10:01 · Score: 1
  
  This. Not a single company I've worked for in the Seattle area since I moved here in 1986 has allowed whites to take as much time as our Asian coworkers.
6. Re: Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 10:29 · Score: 1
  
  You guys get fucked over bad. I work in information security for a big big company in Australia. I get into the office at 9:30am as i dont like morning traffic, monday/tuesday stay until 4pm...wed/thurs/ and alternate fridays i leave at 3pm to get kids from school....occasionally do maybe 4 hours remote over weekend , always take at least 4 or sometimes 6 weeks vacation a year and pull down around 180k/year.
  Company makes a fortune, productivity through the roof, whole economy ticking along nicely...CEO doesnt make 50 million in bonuses. Everyone happy.
  You never did get over that whole slavery thing huh ?
7. Re: Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 10:41 · Score: 1
  
  The policy can't legally be different by races, but the approvals certainly are.
  This. I manage our HR software, and it's funny how the American sounding names nearly always have hit the vacation accrual limit, but the names I can't pronounce almost always have less than half a week of time accrued. There certainly is a vacation inequality problem.
8. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by Sir+Holo · 2016-05-13 11:28 · Score: 1
  
  locum tenens == substitute dentist (in this case) – when the primary is on vacation, I suppose).
  Like a substitute teacher, only with better pay.
9. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by mark_reh · 2016-05-13 14:23 · Score: 1
  
  I spent two years doing the prerequisites - general and organic chemistry, physiology, biology, microbiology, etc., then applied and got into dental school when I was 48 YO. 4 more years of school and I became a dentist in 2011 at the tender age of 52. I believe at the time I was the oldest dental student in the US. I don't know what they were thinking letting me into dental school. My only regret is that I didn't make the switch about 5 years into my engineering career. I had a lot of less than exciting engineering jobs. My hobby projects were always much more interesting than anything I got to do at work.
  I spent the first 3 years as a dentist working in a public health clinic, sucking on the teat of Big Government (NHSC student loan repayment program). I liked the patients and the work was very rewarding but I eventually and came to the realization that public health clinics (at least the one where I worked) are operated by incompetents, criminals, or incompetent criminals. They got some sort of grant from the feds that paid $140 or $150 for every patient encounter in addition to the title 19 insurance payment, so they would schedule appointments at 45 minute intervals. I was working two chairs, each with a new patient every 45 minutes, plus doing exams in the hygienist's chair (sometimes 4 hygienist's chairs). You can't do a whole lot of dentistry in 45 minutes, and you can't write decent notes from the patient encounter. It was awful for everyone including the patients.
  I took a swing at private practice for a year in a large group practice and we came to a mutual understanding that partnership in that clinic was not in the cards for me. That's when it occurred to me that I needed more between-jobs time. Now I work when I want and travel or just work on hobby projects. I figure I'll keep working for another 10 years or so, as long as my body holds up (dentistry is surprisingly demanding physically- I had shoulder surgery a couple years ago that took months of recovery).
10. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by mark_reh · 2016-05-13 14:30 · Score: 2
  
  On paper I always had plenty of time off. But just try to take it. Then you find out how much time off you really get. And every time you change jobs, the clock starts over.
  I worked at HP back when the HR dept used to herd all of us into a room every year to proudly explain that they had colluded with all the other big engineering companies throughout the bay area to set salaries and benefits. The subtext was obvious- stay here because you aren't going to get a better deal anywhere else.
  I had an interview with a company in Agoura Hills while I was working for HP. After passing me around for a day the HR guy finally said they want to hire me and he gave me all pay and benefits info. I said "I'm getting 4 weeks of vacation at HP and you want to cut me back to 2 weeks (not that I could ever take that 4 weeks off), and the pay you're offering is a little less than I get at HP. Can we do something at least with the vacation time?" He said "Nope, that's the deal everyone gets, take it or leave it". I was back in my car in about 30 seconds.
11. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by mark_reh · 2016-05-13 14:35 · Score: 1
  
  Better pay than a substitute teacher, but no benefits at all. I have to pay for everything from my own pocket including 16 hours of CE every year, malpractice insurance, DEA registration, CPR certification, ADA membership, etc. And since I work in different places with no guarantee that they will have instruments that I like to use, I have to buy my own (just certain specific ones that I have grown particularly fond of), and let me tell you, dental instruments are not cheap. I get no life, health, or disability insurance and no 401k plan.
12. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by Sir+Holo · 2016-05-13 16:21 · Score: 1
  
  I get no life, health, or disability insurance and no 401k plan.
  If you so choose, even though you are a 1099 contractor at each job, you can elect to pay those Soc. Sec., state unemployment, and other taxes. If you do so, you pay the taxes, but at least then you have access to the social safety net. The unemployment, or under-employment, category is probably especially applicable to you.
13. Re:Jeez I thought it was bad in the US by netwiz · 2016-05-14 06:53 · Score: 1
  
  Someone needs to film said proclamations then have the Department of Labor take HP up on charges of collusion to set prices. Somewhere, that stuff has to be illegal.
Amazing isn't the word I would use. by waspleg · 2016-05-13 09:10 · Score: 1

Depressing is. China is working hard to out America America.
They don't have to destroy unions where there never were any.
These pictures just look like cleaner more expensive sweat shops to me. I wouldn't be surprised if they were carefully staged too, like their empty apartment buildings and whatnot.
1. Re:Amazing isn't the word I would use. by avandesande · 2016-05-13 09:21 · Score: 1
  
  You don't know that... maybe they know something you don't.
  
  --
  love is just extroverted narcissism
I owe my soul to the company store by Iamthecheese · 2016-05-13 09:11 · Score: 2

This is what happens when capitalism is unrestrained. In every country undergoing an industrial revolution there's a mix of outdated feudalistic modes of thought and inefficiency matching worker to task that allows this sort of thing -- whether it's mining camps, heavy industry, or middle commerce. Scrooge's shop in A Christmas Carol wasn't at all far from the common, nor Song of the Shirt unrealistic. Only government reigning in corporate interests for the common man can stop these travesties. So here's my hope for the Chinese people to say, "enough" and make their government fix this.

--
If video games influenced behavior the Pac Man generation would be eating pills and running away from their problems.
1. Re:I owe my soul to the company store by rfengr · 2016-05-13 09:47 · Score: 1
  
  Maybe they did in the Cultural Revolution. Problem is people either want full-on Ferengi gold pressed latinum capitalism, or nationalize everything workers party socialism. Doesn't seem to be a compromise.
2. Re:I owe my soul to the company store by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 10:35 · Score: 1
  
  Problem is people either want full-on Ferengi gold pressed latinum capitalism, or nationalize everything workers party socialism. Doesn't seem to be a compromise.
  Most of Europe today is in the middle ground/compromise. The US is far more socialist than people who don't live here (and many who do) realize. The problem is that the anarchist/communist crowd doesn't tolerate any capitalism; occasionally they manage to get a country to go full socialist, which always fails. Then they scream when private enterprise returns.
3. Re:I owe my soul to the company store by slew · 2016-05-13 13:13 · Score: 1
  
  | So here's my hope for the Chinese people to say, "enough" and make their government fix this.
  Last time they "fixed this" was not that long ago, and they called it "The Cultural Revolution".
  You need to review your history. The Cultural Revolution wasn't the chinese people uprising against their system, it was the government clamping down on perceived capitalist/bourgeois infiltrators into their system (but in a way more brutal fashion than USA McCarthyism was trying to purge communists).
4. Re:I owe my soul to the company store by _Sharp'r_ · 2016-05-14 04:43 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, Communist China...the very model of unrestrained capitalism. Only government control of their industries will solve the problem, right?
  
  --
  The party of stupid and the party of evil get together and do something both stupid and evil, then call it bipartisan.
Re:So... by kilfarsnar · 2016-05-13 09:17 · Score: 1

So the guys who were denouncing that France wants to forbid companies to email/text their employees after office hours (seven articles past this one) will be cheering here or ...?
Sounds to me like the French understand something we don't.

--
"What the American public doesn't know is what makes them the American public." -Ray Zalinsky (Tommy Boy)
"Reuters has amazing photographs..." by friesofdoom · 2016-05-13 09:20 · Score: 1

Those are the exact same photographs that were used in the techinsider site, just in a different order. What is the purpose of convincing us that there are "amazing" photos at another site when your main link already showed them to us? Are you just trying to wean more clicks out of us? Are you being paid to do this?
1. Re:"Reuters has amazing photographs..." by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 09:43 · Score: 1
  
  Reuters is the source of the images. Don't be obtuse.
That's an improvement over slavery... by __aaclcg7560 · 2016-05-13 09:22 · Score: 1

Back in the 1980's, the FBI would raid Silicon Valley companies to free Chinese workers who brought over to the U.S. illegally, work long hours for little or no pay, and locked up each night inside the buildings.
1. Re:That's an improvement over slavery... by Sir+Holo · 2016-05-13 11:30 · Score: 1
  
  [citation needed]
  Really. Doesn't ring true. I would have heard of it.
2. Re:That's an improvement over slavery... by __aaclcg7560 · 2016-05-13 13:12 · Score: 2
  
  Really. Doesn't ring true. I would have heard of it.
  I saw several TV news broadcasts on the subject in the early 1980's, but that was pre-Internet and newspaper accounts are probably available only on microfiche. I wasn't able to turn up anything on the Internet. However, the modern practice of tech slavery is alive and well in the Valley.
  
  According to the report, which was released by The Center of Investigative Reporting (CIR), The Guardian, and NBC Bay Area's Investigative Unit, these labor brokers have often charged workers the cost of a visa and didn't have a job waiting for them when they arrived, both of which are prohibited by visa rules. And in some cases, when workers arrived in the U.S., the account goes, they were "benched"—placed in a guesthouse with subpar living conditions and asked to post exaggerated resumes online.
  Then, when workers received jobs, the report claims, the body shops who hired them collected a cut of their salary. The authors of the investigation probed this migrant worker problem for a year, speaking to thousands of Indian tech workers both on and off the record. They found abuses in Silicon Valley, as well as other parts of the U.S. One worker described it as an "ecosystem of fear."
  http://www.wired.com/2014/11/investigation-reveals-silicon-valleys-abuse-immigrant-tech-workers/
3. Re:That's an improvement over slavery... by Sir+Holo · 2016-05-13 16:30 · Score: 2
  
  Really. Doesn't ring true. I would have heard of it.
  I saw several TV news broadcasts on the subject in the early 1980's, but that was pre-Internet and newspaper accounts are probably available only on microfiche. I wasn't able to turn up anything on the Internet. However, the modern practice of tech slavery is alive and well in the Valley.
  
  http://www.wired.com/2014/11/investigation-reveals-silicon-valleys-abuse-immigrant-tech-workers/
  Thanks. I'll read.
  Sex slavery and human trafficking are alive and well. Several brothels exist within a mile of my home. There is seemingly nothing I can do about it. Cops will 'come by for an inspection' occasionally, get their free rub-and-tug or BJ, and then move on. The cops are part of the problem.
  These places pull the same stunt that you described – job in America!!! Once they arrive, Visa or Passport is "held" by employer until repayment of airfare, etc. is paid for. Their job is not cleaning, or whatever, but sex-trade work. They fear returning home out of (misplaced) shame. Or lack of funds. With no papers, they cannot open a private bank account. And the pimps cycle them through all of the various cities to keep a fresh stable of (slave) whores, who have no idea what city they are are in at any given moment.
  So, that said, and having perused your link, I must agree.
  H-1B visa overload, with people training their own replacements, is another example of this type of double-exploitation. An H-1B is supposed to be for someone with a "special skill that can't be found locally in the US." Um. Hello? Americans are training their own replacements. That is a hint that the required talent exists locally – just not any that can have a visa-renewal lorded over their heads to demand long hours.
  Again, thanks for the link.
I did this in Silicon Valley at a big company by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 09:22 · Score: 1

A couple years ago I got tired of rents going up so much in Silicon Valley so I ditched my apartment, bought a van, and lived at the office. I worked for a large tech company. There were showers there. I slept in my van in the parking lot. Turns out there's actually thousands of tech workers doing this in Silicon Valley, but there's a stigma surrounding it. (There's a reason I'm posting this anonymously.)
Part of me was doing it in protest of Agile and Scrum. There was no reason I had to physically be in the office day in and day out other than to service daily standup meetings. (Dialing into them was considered taboo.) Eventually I got a job at less a regressive company that sees Scrum as the micromanagement fad that it is and is fine with remote work so I moved far, far away.
Now I live in a low cost of living paradise filled with natural beauty. No more crowded city with insane rents. Don't have to be surrounded by crushing poverty and homelessness anymore. I wish more people recognized the absurdity of taking all the good paying jobs and cramming them into overpopulated cities. It serves no purpose. But at least I got out.
Re:So... by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 09:28 · Score: 1

So the guys who were denouncing that France wants to forbid companies to email/text their employees after office hours (seven articles past this one) will be cheering here or ...?
Sounds to me like the French understand something we don't.
And there's a reason why the Germans come marching through Paris every few decades...
Hard to say if it's really that bad by foxalopex · 2016-05-13 09:42 · Score: 3, Interesting

I think it's hard for a lot of folks to see both sides of the picture. I've worked both "crappy" jobs at a call center all the way up to a programmer for a telecom. There are times I wonder if I get paid way too much for doing so little work as a programmer compared to the crazy non-stop work as a call center agent. And while the call center job was a lot of work it always impressed me how some folks could handle that job happily and make thing seem a lot better. While sometimes my very well paid co-workers in telecom would complain about ridiculous things. I think some of those folks despite that crazy life style are having fun. They're pushing their abilities to the limits and accomplishing more than a lot of folks are. It's sometimes nice to be able to focus on one thing and to give it your all in life. Also letting your workers nap is a good thing. They've shown a 15 minute nap can double productivity. If I was the boss I'd encourage it. Life is a lot of things to different people for some it's anything but work but for some it is work. So either way, I wouldn't see it as bad necessarily.
1. Re:Hard to say if it's really that bad by 110010001000 · 2016-05-13 09:45 · Score: 1
  
  100% correct. You can work crazy hours for a few years, do an IPO, and then not work so hard. Or you can work crazy hours for the rest of your life in a dead end job. We are spoiled.
2. Re:Hard to say if it's really that bad by Tablizer · 2016-05-13 10:19 · Score: 1
  
  There are a class of people who need constant stimulation and changes of pace, and call centers do that because issues are constantly flying in from all different directions.
  
  --
  Table-ized A.I.
I for one by Max_W · 2016-05-13 09:52 · Score: 1

welcome our new Chinese overlords! [couldn't resist]
Not just the Chinese by roman_mir · 2016-05-13 10:08 · Score: 1

Anybody working from home bathes and sleeps there too, you don't have to be Chinese for that.

--
You can't handle the truth.
Re:So... by ShanghaiBill · 2016-05-13 10:15 · Score: 2

Sounds to me like the French understand something we don't.
That micromanaging and over-regulating businesses leads to 11% unemployment, and 0% GDP growth?
Ok... by Ryanrule · 2016-05-13 11:11 · Score: 1

Does this person not know chinese culture? Lunch naps are there because everyone goes and drinks at lunch.
Re: So... by liquid_schwartz · 2016-05-13 11:16 · Score: 1

You're probably right. We've been invaded by around 11 million people with no end in sight and we are definitely rolling over and surrendering to them. Land of the free and home of the brave ended with our grandparents.
Re:So... by __Paul__ · 2016-05-13 11:17 · Score: 1

And there's a reason why the Germans come marching through Paris every few decades...
Germany has very similar attitudes towards having a life outside work as France does.

--
worldmobilenet.com -- World Prepaid Wireless Internet plans
Re:So... by I4ko · 2016-05-13 11:38 · Score: 1

You normally have very reasonable and agreeable posts, but this isn't one of them.

Why does there have to be growth, any form of growth that is not linked to the birth rate? Being able to provide adequate jobs for 100-11=89 of your population is perfect. Pursuit of growth for the sake of growth is greed and gluttony. It is insane and harmful to the humanity in its entirety.

And btw, reducing the work hours one is allowed to work, forces the employers to let go some of their greed and actually hire more people.
Or you are happy with the gulag that America has become out of greed?
Even now true of some startups by SuperKendall · 2016-05-13 13:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

I went through the same experience pre-2000, I would sleep at the office and work 100+ hour weeks at time.
The thing is I don't actually regret it because it was just at the start of my career and I learned a lot of stuff extremely rapidly that has served me well though the years.
It's not like I'd do it again but I don't see anything wrong with other people working like that if they desire to.
Unlike you, I have not yet found the amount of pizza that would make me sick of pizza...

--
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
1. Re:Even now true of some startups by ultranova · 2016-05-14 01:23 · Score: 1
  
  It's not like I'd do it again but I don't see anything wrong with other people working like that if they desire to.
  
  The problem is, you either desire to do whatever the company asks of you or you'll be replaced by someone who will. It's not voluntary, any more than kneeling before the kings of old was.
  
  --
  Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.
2. Re:Even now true of some startups by SuperKendall · 2016-05-14 03:40 · Score: 1
  
  I don't think you understand, I often did this without being asked. I would go in after hours of my own volition and work on stuff, it was never expected or asked of me. Again, I was happy to do so...
  The same is really true at startups. They are not exactly ASKED to work as many hours as they do, it's just that a lot of people do.
  You either desire to do whatever the company asks of you or you'll be replaced by someone who will
  So what? Especially now, you are insane if you do ANYTHING you do not want to do because it's so easy to find development work. I am pretty sure that just like myself, most of the people working these startups simply do not mind working really long hours.
  
  --
  "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Re:So... by ShanghaiBill · 2016-05-13 13:13 · Score: 3, Informative

And btw, reducing the work hours one is allowed to work, forces the employers to let go some of their greed and actually hire more people.
Economists call this the Lump of Labor Fallacy. Real economies don't have a fixed number of jobs to be divvied up, and reducing working hours did not reduce unemployment in France.
Do you really "think" though or just groupthink? by Anonymous Coward · 2016-05-13 13:44 · Score: 1

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/13...
Where do you fuck? by MrKaos · 2016-05-13 13:48 · Score: 1

Seriously, and lame jokes aside about 'nerds and sex' it can't be healthy not to have a social life, and if you can only have a social life in the office because you have to eat, sleep, shower and work in the office then where is somone supposed to have a fuck? And if you do want to make a lame joke about 'nerds and sex', then where are they self masturbating?
It's happening people.

--
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Bathing??? by ZecretZquirrel · 2016-05-13 14:04 · Score: 1

What is this "bathing"? Sounds like a complete waste time.
Re: So... by liquid_schwartz · 2016-05-13 16:48 · Score: 1

those fucking cunts invaded my country, home of the brave my ass.
Which country is that exactly?
Meh, that nothing by codeButcher · 2016-05-13 23:42 · Score: 1

Where I work we have this system called an open-plan office. While it is still difficult to deter people from eating while working, it does limit the sleeping in the office thing. I also haven't seen anybody bathing in the office yet (thank goodness, but on the other hand it might be sorely needed for some). I'd say we have made lots of productivity gains by limiting the non-work behavior like that.
(For the usual humor-impaired /. crowd: yes, the above is meant in an ironical way.)

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Free, as in your money being freed from the confines of your account.
What's the incentive in China? by cliffjumper222 · 2016-05-14 04:12 · Score: 1

I'm genuinely interested. Do Chinese start-ups give stock to employees? Or is it all cash and bonuses? I've worked for multiple US companies and stock is one of the big drivers to pay over and above the base salary. Sure, there's employees at start-ups all over the world who work night and day, but they're doing it because they have a stake in the company usually.
Slept in,on and under tobacco stock by eionmac · 2016-05-14 04:53 · Score: 1

When I started work I was required to sleep in the stock room for tobacco so as to be available 24/7. UK early 1950s. Main London stores (e.g. Harrods) had staff sleep on premises until war years. P R China now at same stage.

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Regards Eion MacDonald
The desperation of thieves. by sethstorm · 2016-05-14 06:09 · Score: 1

These are the faces of those stealing from the US.

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Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.