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Google and Bing Have No Obligation To Censor Searches For Torrents (betanews.com)

Microsoft and Google are under no obligation to weed out 'torrent' results from their respective search engines, the High Court of Paris has ruled. BetaNews adds: French music industry group SNEP went to court on behalf of a trio of artists, requesting that Microsoft and Google automatically filter out links to pirated material. The group had called for a complete block on searches that include the word 'torrent' as well as blocking sites whose name includes the word. The court found that SNEP's request was far too broad, saying: "SNEP's requests are general, and pertain not to a specific site but to all websites accessible through the stated methods, without consideration for identifying or even determining the site's content, on the premise that the term 'Torrent' is necessarily associated with infringing content".The court added that 'torrent' is a common noun, which has a range of different meanings.

62 comments

  1. that's good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    good

    1. Re:that's good by Midnight+Thunder · · Score: 2

      It is, since how otherwise do you describe "a large amount of water that moves very quickly in one direction" (m-w entry)?

      --
      Jumpstart the tartan drive.
    2. Re:that's good by Godwin+O'Hitler · · Score: 1

      Actually, it describes
              - Cours d'eau de montagne, rapide et irrégulier, de faible longueur, plus ou moins à sec entre des crues violentes et brusques.
              - Liquide qui coule en abondance : Des torrents de larmes.
              - Abondance de quelque chose qui semble se répandre : Un torrent de lumière. Un torrent d'injures (http://www.larousse.fr/dictionnaires/francais/torrent/78539)

      Because Torrent just happens to also be a French word. It wouldn't have been a valid reason in Spain (which however doesn't exclude other valid reasons).

      --
      No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
    3. Re:that's good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually "torrent" is a valid word in some Spanish official languages making it a valid reason in Spain.

    4. Re:that's good by Godwin+O'Hitler · · Score: 1

      Ah yes Catalan, Gallego... I stand corrected; although I'm sure the point wasn't missed.

      --
      No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
  2. .torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Not everything bittorrent is pirated content. Lots of Linux distributions offer torrent files as an alternative download method (often much faster than the mirrors), for example.

    1. Re:.torrent!=pirated by godrik · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Doesn't blizzard distribute its update using bittorrent?

      Sounds like it is : http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/c...

    2. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My.com uses Bittorrent to Patch Armored Warfare.
      Wargaming uses it to patch their games on PC.

    3. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Fire_Wraith · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes.
      Torrents are a protocol relating to efficient and distributed file transfer, that in no way is inherently piratical or illegal. There are legitimate uses for the protocol, even if piracy of music and entertainment is a fairly common use, too. Even if these groups got what they wanted, and people weren't allowed to search for "torrent", guess about how long before a new term would come into common use meaning the exact same thing? Hint: not long.

    4. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > guess about how long before a new term would come into common use meaning the exact same thing [as torrent]?

      Why wait? Why not pick the new term now.

      I nominate "copyright", "justin bieber", "mpaa", whatever the music version is called, and "peace".

       

    5. Re:.torrent!=pirated by c · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Even if these groups got what they wanted, and people weren't allowed to search for "torrent", guess about how long before a new term would come into common use meaning the exact same thing?

      I'm fairly sure "magnet" already works as an alternative.

      Well... "magnet -juggalo", just to be safe.

      --
      Log in or piss off.
    6. Re: .torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My cable company allows time shifting without a DVR.

    7. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not everything bittorrent is pirated content.

      And not every "torrent" refers to bittorrent.
      I can imagine weather reports, blogs being censored because they mention a rain torrent.

    8. Re:.torrent!=pirated by bobbied · · Score: 2

      I nominate "LawsuitBait" as a replacement..

      This coming from a guy that actively runs a torrent client which is serving up legal content 24/7 to the dismay of my ISP I'm sure.. I consider it my way to support CentOS and Debian to name a few.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    9. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Rockoon · · Score: 1

      Torrents are a protocol relating to efficient and distributed file transfer

      Distributed yes. Efficient no. Its the opposite of efficient.

      --
      "His name was James Damore."
    10. Re:.torrent!=pirated by mobby_6kl · · Score: 1

      Yes of course, everyone is downloading hundreds of gigabytes of Linux ISOs every month :)

      I'm curious what this would actually mean in practice. Right now there's a ton of content removed due to automated DMCA complaints, and it seems like those won't be affected.

    11. Re: .torrent!=pirated by Midnight+Thunder · · Score: 1

      And should add is only really effective for popular content. Less popular content (where there is only the original seeder sharing) works out to be no better than an http file transfer.

      --
      Jumpstart the tartan drive.
    12. Re:.torrent!=pirated by arbiter1 · · Score: 1

      Using the mind set of .torrent=pirated then can conclude HTTP=Pirated as well. since well you need sites to get them also FTP=Pirated, newgroup=Pirated. can go on and on.

    13. Re:.torrent!=pirated by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      Cough, cough, the number 1 definition of torrent :a strong and fast-moving stream of water or other liquid. The data transmission protocol (which can be named anything) was named after it for the obvious reason (also used to define heavy rainfall and based upon that, any mass movement of any large number of things). They could have bound the term to bittorrent but that is not the word used generally in listing data availability by that transmission protocol. This is of course exactly why the pigopolists tackled the matter initially in a country where English was not the native language, basically seeking to ban a common use English word and expecting a French court to be that stupid. Why not, the pigopolists routinely steal the English language and trademark words seeking to charge fees for their use (the new rule should be want a trademark make up your own new word do not steal words already in use).

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    14. Re: .torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For me, torrent is very efficient. I download Linux isos only through torrents, since it automatically checksums, and if the connection is lost, there is no problem with resuming. My internet connection sucks, so it saves me a lot of attempts.

    15. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Torrents are a protocol relating to efficient and distributed file transfer,

      And the sources concealed, which is the whole point of the "efficient" protocol.

    16. Re: .torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Last time I looked I had a convenient overview of the IP addresses, which is how distributing illegal content via bittorrent easily leads to legal action here in Germany.

    17. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No; the sources aren't concealed.
      The original source can leave the swarm after a full copy is distributed and it can still work; but someone has to speak to the original source at some point.

    18. Re:.torrent!=pirated by illogict · · Score: 1

      Actually, torrent in French means the exact same thing as “torrent” in English as it comes from the Latin word torrens.

    19. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Emule is more efficient, using compression, upload/download queues, larger chunks and a more complex DHT, but as it turns out most people don't want to wait in some queue before the file starts to download.

    20. Re:.torrent!=pirated by TheDarkMaster · · Score: 1

      Try to explain this to for the stupid lawyers. I say that they should be killed with fire wherever they are found.

      --
      Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
    21. Re:.torrent!=pirated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      By that logic no results should ever be filtered out because HTTP is used for legal behavior too.

    22. Re:.torrent!=pirated by clubby · · Score: 1

      DCS World is a very popular flight sim (among the flight sim community, anyway) and it distributes updates via BitTorrent.

  3. Strike! by pete6677 · · Score: 4, Funny

    French musicians will now strike in the streets, blocking traffic and blaring awful music in protest.

    1. Re:Strike! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lol, which street. Will they have enough to block a two lane?

    2. Re:Strike! by fustakrakich · · Score: 2

      Be grateful they don't play bagpipes.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    3. Re:Strike! by Opportunist · · Score: 3, Funny

      That's about as much of a threat as a strike at the DMV.

      I kid you not, when some bureaucrats around here threatened a strike, the general sentiment was "You're gonna tell us or how are we gonna know when you start?"

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    4. Re:Strike! by GNious · · Score: 1

      I have heard the last few years' entries into the Eurovision Song Contest from France ... Bagpipes would be preferable.

    5. Re:Strike! by Blue+Stone · · Score: 1

      [...] and blaring awful music [...]

      I thought you said they'd be striking.

      --
      Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
    6. Re:Strike! by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Tri Yann use them sometimes, though you could argue that they're about as French as the Welsh are English.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  4. Then they'll just rename torrent to something else by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    People are stupid.

  5. Wow, MPAA did not grease the correct hands in Fr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Who is blackmailing who? LOL.

  6. filetype:torrent by houghi · · Score: 2

    Just search for e.g. "the matrix" filetype:torrent

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
  7. Re:Wow, MPAA did not grease the correct hands in F by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Won't you feel for the MPAA/RIAA, they've lost so much money they can't even afford bribe the governmental systems into bending over backwards for them anymore.

  8. So you're telling me... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That a lack of understanding of a particular word has reached the High Courts of a First World nation? What kind of world is this place coming to...

    1. Re:So you're telling me... by Opportunist · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Cut them some slack, they're French. They probably didn't even know there's any other language where that funny word "torrent" actually means something and isn't just some made up cute term.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re: So you're telling me... by Midnight+Thunder · · Score: 1

      Probably more a question of old school businesses who just don't want to get it? There are too many of them in France and too much paper work and risk adversness to create a healthy startup culture.

      --
      Jumpstart the tartan drive.
    3. Re:So you're telling me... by matbury · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The French invented the modern word "torrent" (originally a Latin word, "torrentem") in the 16th century.

    4. Re:So you're telling me... by silentcoder · · Score: 1

      >Cut them some slack, they're French. They probably didn't even know there's any other language where that funny word "torrent" actually means something and isn't just some made up cute term.

      Except that 'torrent' is, in fact, a French word. It means the exact same thing as in English. English got the word from French which in turn got it from Latin. Being of latin descent the word 'torrent' and close variations are common in over a dozen languages.

      --
      Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
    5. Re:So you're telling me... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hi Opportunist,
      "Torrent" is a french word to begin with (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/torrent#Etymology_1) and still very much used when talking about a "torrent" (i.e. a violent stream of water or figuratively of other liquids). But I'll cut you some slack, since it might very well be that English is your first and only language.

    6. Re:So you're telling me... by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Mais non, je peux aussi repondre a cela en francais.

      Oder waere Deutsch angenehmer?

      Preferiresti la risposta in Italiano?

      I'll spare you Russian, /. still has issues with the Kyrillic alphabet and it feels weird to type Russian in Latin letters. And talking about it, my Latin sure isn't good enough anymore to even pretend I could answer you (though I should still be able to read it, mostly. You start forgetting if you don't need something for a while).

      So, no, I do speak a few languages. Some of them more often, some of them rather rarely. Though, admittedly, French and English are not my first languages. I give you that.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  9. Streaming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Will they go after streaming next?

    1. Re:Streaming by TapeCutter · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If they had their way you would have to insert your credit card into the computer before it would allow you to browse the internet.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
  10. Re:Wow, MPAA did not grease the correct hands in F by Opportunist · · Score: 1

    These organisations are not worthy of feeling anything for them. Essentially, if they drown the most they an have from me is a glass of water.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  11. Prepare by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    ... for the torrent of angry musicians

  12. moderator by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    So this moderator, manish (@srcref), posts a story from his former employer's site (Beta News) every day. The worst part is that this story is actually a second-hand copy-paste from TorrentFreak. And even worse is that no user has submitted this story, but has been shoved down our throats by this guy. Are you still looking for reasons why Slashdot is going down?

  13. Efficiency depends. If the whole office is downloa by raymorris · · Score: 3, Informative

    My office employs mostly nerds who are into comic books, StarvWars, video games, etc. When a major new game version comes out, the office mostly shuts down for the day as everyone stays home to play the new release of the game.

    If a dozen of my co-workers are downloading the new Star Wars fan flick the day it comes out, Bittorrent is much more efficient than regular ftp or http downloads. Only one copy need be downloaded from the far-away server to our office. Mostly everybody copies it around the office, downloading from each other over the local LAN. That's WAY more efficient than downloading a dozen copies from a server 1,000 miles away. (In actual practice maybe twice the file size may be downloaded over the internet, which is six times more efficient than downloading a dozen copies over the internet).

    In less extreme cases, it's still more efficient to download mostly from other people in Texas than from the origin server in California.

    On the other hand, there is some overhead. In worst cases, Bittorrent can use more bandwidth than ftp.

    Also there are of course several ways to measure efficiency. Bittorrent is normally time-efficient. It's bandwidth efficient in that rather than requiring someone to buy a high upstream speed connection, it uses the idle upstream bandwidth that people are already paying for anyway. It can often be less bandwidth efficient in that there is overhead, using more total bandwidth.

    So whether or not it's efficient very much depends on a) the specific situation and b) which type of efficiency you're interested in.

  14. Re:Wow, MPAA did not grease the correct hands in F by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    >blackmailing *whom*?

    FTFY

  15. Re:Wow, MPAA did not grease the correct hands in F by lister+king+of+smeg · · Score: 1

    These organisations are not worthy of feeling anything for them. Essentially, if they drown the most they an have from me is a glass of water.

    I say water is to good for the MPAA. Drink the water then drown them with it after.

    --
    ---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
  16. High court of Paris? by manu0601 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    What is this "high court of Paris"? There is no court named like that in France. Is it Tribunal de Grande Instance de Paris? or Cour d'Appel de Paris? Or even Cour de Cassation, which is french supreme court?

    1. Re:High court of Paris? by rnash · · Score: 2

      What is this "high court of Paris"? There is no court named like that in France. Is it Tribunal de Grande Instance de Paris? or Cour d'Appel de Paris? Or even Cour de Cassation, which is french supreme court?

      See the NextImpact article (French) : it is the "tribunal de grande instance de Paris".

      As it lost, the SNEP has to pay €10,000 to Microsoft and as much to Google.

    2. Re:High court of Paris? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's spelled "NextINpact", mécréant!

  17. Liberte, egalite by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... but to all websites accessible ...

    Corporations do not have more rights than citizens and cannot accuse everyone of committing a 'crime'.

    The preoccupation with "liberte, fraternite, egalite" causes some stupid outcomes when applied to the internet, such as the entitlement to be forgotten, but this time it worked as intended.

  18. Anyone know... by pinzvidz · · Score: 1

    ...who are the musicians? Streisand Effect is coming for them.

    1. Re:Anyone know... by pinzvidz · · Score: 1

      nvm, found it - Kendji Girac, Shy’m, and Christophe Willem. Just a bunch of fucking nobodies.

  19. Re:Efficiency depends. If the whole office is down by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just curious - why on earth does you boss allow his workers to illegally download movies using office network and equipment? And why don't you (seemingly) think this is an issue yourself?

  20. Re:Efficiency depends. If the whole office is down by silentcoder · · Score: 2

    He said "fan film" - presumably at least some of those are legal.

    --
    Unicode killed the ASCII-art *