Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft Signature PC Requirements Now Blocks Linux Installation: Reports
Reader sombragris writes: According to a well-documented forum thread, the Signature PC program by Microsoft now requires to lock down PCs. This user found out that his Lenovo Yoga 900 ISK2 UltraBook has the SSD in a proprietary RAID mode which Linux does not understand and the BIOS is also locked down so it could not be turned off. When he complained that he was unable to install Linux, the answer he got was: "This system has a Signature Edition of Windows 10 Home installed. It is locked per our agreement with Microsoft."
Even worse, as the original poster said, "[t]he Yoga 900 ISK2 at Best Buy is not labeled as a Signature Edition PC, but apparently it is one, and Lenovo's agreement with Microsoft includes making sure Linux can't be installed." As some commenter said: "If you buy a computer with this level of lockdown you should be told."
There is also a report on ZDNet which looks very understanding towards Lenovo, but the fact remains: the SSD is locked down in a proprietary RAID mode that cannot be turned off.
Even worse, as the original poster said, "[t]he Yoga 900 ISK2 at Best Buy is not labeled as a Signature Edition PC, but apparently it is one, and Lenovo's agreement with Microsoft includes making sure Linux can't be installed." As some commenter said: "If you buy a computer with this level of lockdown you should be told."
There is also a report on ZDNet which looks very understanding towards Lenovo, but the fact remains: the SSD is locked down in a proprietary RAID mode that cannot be turned off.
Just return it.
Demand a refund, no matter how much Best Buy tries to tell you that they won't.
It's unfit for the purpose that you bought it for, and expecting it to be fit for that purpose is not unusual or unreasonable.
If they completely refuse to refund your money, sue everyone involved (BB, MS, and Lenovo) in small claims court. Small claims goes up to $2500 or even $10,000 in a lot of jurisdictions, so it'll cover the cost of a PC you can't use for the purpose you bought it for.
Alternatively, if you have a lot of spare time and/or a desire to really make a mess while making your point, demand Best Buy give you a replacement, leave the store with it, take it to the parking lot, cut open the box, unwrap a few components, re-stuff the box (poorly), come back in, and return that unit also. Repeat until the store is out of new stock. Every item you do that to has to be refurbished, which costs Lenovo a lot of money that isn't in the margin of that unit. Then demand a refund from Best Buy, since they can't replace your defective item.
The article more accurately summarizes things than the biased snippet: "On first blush this seems to be an issue relating to how Lenovo has configured the systems. I can't find any evidence to suggest that Microsoft is trying to "lock" Signature Edition PCs to Windows 10, or making any moves to shut the door on Linux users" This seems to be about Lenovo's use of proprietary drivers for RAID, not MS system requirements. And a reminder that corporate tech support folks have no clue what they're talking about, so quoting a forum post by one does not establish insidious contractual obligations for Lenovo by Microsoft.
Which RAID level works best with a single drive?
Such clauses need to be tried in court as well - a lot of EULAs aren't worth the paper they are written on.
Was the EULA provided before purchase?
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
A reddit poster offered this, in his link Lenovo says the dev team is working on it:
""[–]0xFFFFFF 89 points 7 hours ago*
Levono is aware of the issue and fixing it: https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/L...
It is on hackernews, where people are being rational and theorizing that this is not microsofts fault. More like best-buy rep doesn't know what he talks about and the SSD doesn't have support drivers in linux kernal.. Or lenova messed up their bios implementation.
Luckily we have the reddit witchhunt in full force, so we can make uninformed rants!
Note: Every single previous similar scenario about linux being locked out has not been microsofts fault, which is why people are sceptical that this is the case this time..
I also have a Signature Edition laptop, it runs linux fine..""
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux...
The Lenovo link has an official post saying:
"Re: Yoga 900-13ISK2 - BIOS update for setting RAID mode for missing hard drive on linux install Options
07-27-2016 10:04 AM
Thank you for confirming it is still not possible to install Linux on Yoga 900-13ISK2 systems.
This issue has been escalated to the Development team. I am unable to offer a timeframe for fix at this stage in the investigation. With previous cases, BIOS fixes have been delivered anywhere from several weeks to several months.
I will post again when I have more information on the investigation."
https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/L...
Apparently, this Yoga ain't very flexible
I most often grab something quickly from Best Buy, Walmart, or Fry's. It would cost me money to delay.
When one of our laptops dies, I'm paying someone to work, but they don't have a proper computer work on. Until we get them a new machine, they are stuck on whatever POS is in closet. It's probably in the closet because it's half broken.
So I grab something that looks like it'll work from the closest store, boot it to be sure it's not completely defective, then run the Linux install script and they can get back to work. 95% of the time, that works fine.
One time, Walmart was the quickest store, so I grabbed a laptop there, took it back to the office, and booted it. Wifi didn't work. Windows said it didn't have the driver for the wifi card. The web site of the laptop manufacturer didn't have a wifi driver for that version of Windows. I tried the manufactuer of the wireless card - no driver for that version of Windows. Windows Update? Nope, probably a million of that laptop sold at Walmart, with a wifi card that does not work with the preloaded Windows. Well that's stupid. Screw it, we use wired ethernet anyway. I pop in a CentOS install disk and 30 minutes later she's up and running - with wifi. CentOS included a driver that "just works"; apparently no driver existed for the preloaded, current version of Windows.
It's competition and Microsoft would never openly say they love Linux even if they've made use of it for their datacenters.
That being said, I doubt Microsoft feels they need to shutdown the 1% of users that insist on Linux. There's definitively more to this story.
That's kind of what I was thinking.
The OP seems to be much like "Microsoft comes up with devious plan to make it impossible to install Linux" when the truth may be "Microsoft's Signature program involves keeping users from breaking RAID settings, but the new settings aren't supported by Linux yet."
For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
It's not just intentional sabatoge that can cause a lack of support. Newly release chipsets or other hardware often doesn't have initial Linux support. Sometimes it takes time for that to get incorporated into the kernel and make it's way up the pipeline. Moreover, each distro tends to incorporate new kernel changes at different paces, and it makes it hard to predict how soon support will arrive for new hardware.
I'm not sure if this is the case here. The story makes it sound like it was deliberate, which wouldn't be too surprising I guess, but it's hard to say.
In early December 2015 I built myself a Desktop using the latest Skylake Chipset (released 5th Aug 2015) and all I had to do was select "Other OS" and I installed Fedora 23 KDE spin without any problems. I did find an issue a short time later with my monitor which has two HDMI slots and DSUB slot. Basically, everything worked, however I also connected my PS4 to the spare HDMI port so I could switch between my PC and PS4 and this worked perfectly. Unfortunately switching back to the PC port dropped signal which required me to reset the PC.
The fix was for me to get the latest BIOS (the same day I found the problem) and this fixed the issue of toggling between PC and PS4 or my PS3 if I moved the HDMI cable across. I have been using this configuration ever since.
I can understand if graphics drivers are not available for a new graphics card but I would not be surprised if Microsoft is starting to pull tactics like what is mentioned in the article. Originally Microsoft wanted secure boot (to protect the users of course, cough! cough!) or UEFI. The problem with this is many major Linux distribution got UEFI certified as well which I would assume defeated the original purpose of having secure boot.
No, the issue is Microsoft is being Microsoft and nothing has changed.
There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
On desktop - 1.5%
Amongst developers - 20%
Of course, developers are a very influential set. If, for example, a developer writes an app using Electron because it works well on both Linux AND Windows... it works well on Linux. And software that works well on Linux makes it an attractive platform.
MS knows the best way to keep useful software exclusively on their platform is to get developers hooked on their toolchain.
Why are you siding with Microsoft and/or the vendors for this? Sure, they have a right to sell it however they like, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be criticized for it. The one thing that the PC has over other platforms is its open endedness.. These products deserve criticism for even getting the ball rolling to change that. The last thing I'd want is for the PC market to be more like cellphones.
GNU-Linux Evaluation
[Excellent] Stable platform for long-running server applications
[Excellent] Software development tool chains
[Excellent] FOSS software availability and variety
[Excellent] Support communities for FOSS software
[Excellent] Stable, smallish-footprint OS kernel + core services + APIs on which to build mobile device OS services and GUI
[Fail] Simple, Uniform, Highly Functional, Good UX GUI for desktop/laptop computing and entertainment hub
[Fail] Best-of-breed desktop productivity applications for everyday business and home computer users
Where are we going and why are we in a handbasket?