Slashdot Mirror
CBC Threatens Podcast App Makers, Argues that RSS Readers Violate Copyright (boingboing.net)
Cory Doctorow, writing for BoingBoing (condensed):The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) publishes several excellent podcasts, and like every podcast in the world, these podcasts are available via any podcast app in the same way that all web pages can be fetched with all web browsers -- this being the entire point of podcasts. In a move of breathtaking, lawless ignorance, the CBC has begun to send legal threats to podcast app-makers, arguing that making an app that pulls down public RSS feeds is a "commercial use" and a violation of the public broadcaster's copyrights. This is a revival of an old, dark era in the web's history, when linking policies prevailed, through which publishes argued that they had the right to control who could make a link to their sites -- that is, who could state the public, true fact that "a page exists at this address." But the CBC is going one worse here: their argument is that making a tool that allows someone to load a public URL without permission is violating copyright law -- it's the same thing as saying, "Because Google is a for-profit corporation, any time a Chrome user loads a CBC page in the Chrome browser without the CBC's permission, Google is violating CBC's copyright."We hope it was all an accidental mistake from the CBC, because it seems like a very stupid thing to do otherwise.
Block all CBC podcasts. When someone enters, have a dialog box pop up explaining the reason CBC podcasts can't be accessed. See how they like it when their numbers tank. This is the only way some people will learn...
Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
Something something malice something something something stupidity
Seems like an ill-advised action that wasn't properly researched / thought through.
CBC publishes an RSS feed, then complains when someone uses it?
Just remove the feed.
Oh, what, now nobody is reading your site? Too bad.
I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
Seriously? Have they ever thought of not publishing the RSS feed then? They have to go out of their way to make one. It's not something a magical fairy does that they can't stop.
IS NOT COMMERCIAL thus you can ignore the letters , just dont charge for your app and they can get bent till they do it right
Yes, in Canada, I assure somewhere in the CBC there is a bilingual public servant that is absolutely this stupid.
---Up Up Down Down Left Right Left Right B A START
The CBC wants to make sure someone isn't reselling their freely available content (either through purchasing an app or through in-app ad revenue) without a license.
It's CBC content, they can set of terms for using it... without knowing what the app developer was trying to do, it's hard for me to fault CBC.
violating copyright law is better then hacking.
and hacking laws have been used under with cases where people where loading a public URL without permission
If the CBC doesn't want people to retrieve the content with readily available tools using protocols designed by independent or semi-independent standards-bodies for the express purpose of fostering open communication, then why are they publishing their content using protocols designed for this express purpose?
If they want to limit access to entirely within their control they are perfectly free to write an end-user application that retrieves encrypted content and displays it solely within their application. Indeed, before HTTP and Gopher this was a very common way to retrieve content. EBSCO and other Library Retrieval software was quite popular.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
the browser is free and has no way to be commercial ergo there are no popups or ads in the browser...thus browser itself is not commercial....sorry this is just a day a stupid, and one could even say you can get the source freely and make your own version
I don't see an example of the apps in question, but the only case where CBC's argument might be valid is if it's not actually an RSS app, but something that has pulled the feeds from RSS and is specifically distributing them for pay (e.g. a compilation on disk or some audio archive). Alternately, I suppose if they were selling access to CBC's feed when it should be free, it would be somewhat like hijacking a FOSS project.
The article is a bit light on details of the app in question and/or what it actually does. Certainly it shouldn't apply to a generic RSS browser.
At all levels the CBC is one of the most incompetent organizations in Canada (and it has some stiff competition). I am not surprised in the LEAST that they consider this some kind of copyright violation.
On this day when people look to the United States as filling the category "News of the Dumb", our friendly neighbors to the north sail in to our rescue.
APK voted for Lady Gaga, because he thought he could get laid by offering to plug her holes with a hosts file.
Seems like I'll be writing to the CBC Ombudsman after work as well as the supervising minister...
If CBC doesn't want people to access their content indirectly, they can configure their servers to prohibit such activity. The fact that they haven't means they aren't serious or they are idiots. In both cases, their words lack credibility.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
the scary thing is that they could prevail. stupid seems to win too often these days.
I know you've got your pitchforks our already, but this is all based on one reddit posting.
Not saying it's wrong, not happening or anything, but jesus, at least wait until two app makers have been impacted. We don't even know which app this is all about.
If CBC doesn't want just ANYONE downloading their podcasts, they already have an internet standard mechanism for restricting that. It's called "Authentication". CBC, the onus is on *YOU*.
This year in an effort to simply voting, please remember you now must pick the candidate you DO NOT want to win. For republicans, it is obviously the opposite-you pick who you want to win.
Please participate in our great democracy!
People keep forgetting this is a corporation reusing the feed to further its own interest and profit. They don't complain that joe blow is getting their feed they complain that google take it and republish it. Copyright is just about control of the copy of a work. Google is indeed copying a work (the feed) and redistributing. Like it or not , this is a valid complaint.
In some ways, the podcasts the CBC provides are a lifeline for Canadians who live abroad, but unlike the UK, they don't have a funding source.
That said, I can't see the Supreme Court of Canada agreeing with this motion by the CBC. It just doesn't pass the smell test.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Have suits without any clue in charge of these kind of things.
Ever use Stitcher for Podcasts? They grab another person's podcast, wrap it 2 or 4 or 6 additional ads (and don't share the revenue), and then replay the podcast. I don't like it.
The previous prime minister Stephen Harper appointed the new board for the CBC, and now that the conservatives are out of power their mandate has become destruction instead of control.
An example:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/opinion/opinion-donald-trump-groping-allegations-1.3834612
Jan Wong has violated section 319(2) of the Criminal Code of Canada by publishing this. (wilful promotion of hate against an identifiable group) Pre-Harper, the CBC would never have published such garbage.
The CBC has become very Fox Newsish. Radio survives mostly unscathed but the web and tv properties have been on a steady decline.
If you didn't add a pop-up agreement or a CAPTCHA then you've published information publicly.
If you have to click through to get to the content, that will stop around 100% of the podcast software out there.
The CBC argues in essence that web browsers are illegal, since anyone bookmark any link in their browser. It's just Canada though. The world won't notice their absence from the web :)
Supposedly CBC is OK with this if you don't add your own advertising. What hypocrites. CBC is the king of simulcasting. What's good for the goose apparently isn't good for the gander.
The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation is funded by the taxpayers (at least partially). They post their podcasts on their website without authentication or any special effort needed to access the raw mp4/3 files. In addition to creating RSS feeds. For example: Under the Influence is a great informative podcast about marketing history, challenges, and techniques.
I'm tentatively calling BS on this. FTA, some quotes from the warning that the CBC supposedly issued:
... you have agreed to our our Terms of Use located at ...
... I would ask to cease immediately the use of our unlicensed podcasts ...
... If you interested in CBC content and podcast, we can discuss a license fee model ...
... I would be happy to have a call to discuss further our content and services ...
This is a legal matter, and I very much doubt that the Ceeb would send out such a warning without first having its wording vetted by legal staff. It seems that this little missive wasn't even vetted by anyone whose first language is English. Somebody, (perhaps an insider), may be about to lose his or her job over this.
'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
Y'all need to understand: The CBC is what happens when you give a big bunch of leftists and ivory tower elitists a nearly unlimited budget and guaranteed constant airtime to preach their "we're smarter than you" crap 24/7. These are the prototype "social justice warriors" and there is no cause too left wing or expensive to the long-suffering Canadian taxpayer that they won't push. And they mindlessly worship every single lie spewed out of the "Liberal Party of Canada" spin machine.
They have the same level integrity and commitment to truth as Fox News. The difference is that Fox News is far more professional and better organized.
The fact they don't understand the freedoms of the Internet and how it works is not surprising to anyone in Canada: We are as badly served by our one-sided, manipulative, contemptuous and venal media in Canada as you Americans are served by the worst media channels in the USA.
This is the same public broadcaster that was releasing video for free via BitTorrent in 2008...
I assume they are considering this the same as using an image URL from another website in you website. Essentially stealing their bandwidth and using their photo. Now I don't know much about copyright so what I described be "illegal" or just immoral? Now this is the same but an RSS feed may be a different story.
I kid, I kid. Keep your stick on the ice.
At those levels there is no other kind.
Valérie ans, achète toujours des chaussures dans lesquelles elle se sent . bien, immédiatement .. Le jour de son mariage, elle a envisagé de quitter son statut de jeune femme solide, les pieds sur terre. Elle avait pensé se jucher sur des hauts talons, ce qui l’a considérablement fragilisée et déséquilibrée C’était l’angoisse. J’ai acheté deux paires d’escarpins : des rouges que j’ai essayé de “briser”, sur les conseils de la vendeuse. En vain. Et une autre, avec des talons différents, mais ?a n’allait pas non plus. Sa robe, se souvient-elle, avait été beaucoup plus simple à choisir. Après avoir couru partout, elle a finalement dit oui à plat, en ballerines, mais dorées. élisabeth, ans, à l’allure de femme enfant, se sent, elle, totalement libre en Converse blanches : C’est mon sésame. Je circule partout avec : tant dans le désert que dans les palaces parisiens. C’est un signe de peps, de jeunesse, de ressort, de facilité être à l’aise dans ses pompes ne va pas de soi. Explications de la psychiatre timberland pas cher. philosophe et psychanalyste Vannina Micheli-Rechtman, auteur de la La Psychanalyse face à ses détracteurs (Aubier, 2007) .
About three or four years ago they killed all but one of their CBC Radio 3 podcasts and pushed everything over to streaming. They explained that it was to get more accurate listening numbers because people could download the podcasts and not listen to them. I was a longtime listener to their podcasts and I'm still missing them because I found a lot of great musicians there. Radio 3 only played Canadian indie musicians. Last time I checked their website it still required Flash which I'm not putting on my computer. The podcasts were very convenient because they would just show up on my iPhone when I synced it.
I would guess that they are trying to only get their podcasts sent out on players that provide some feedback on playing statistics. It's just a guess because I don't know if that's possible with iTunes. Either that or they will be coming into budget season again soon and they will be able to say that they had to chop something popular due to a lack of funds.
One thing that drives me bonkers about CBC podcasts is that the crap advertising in the good ones clearly itemizes which of their shows have the most political influence. If I am listening to a podcast on a very specific topic, I don't want to hear out of date advertisements for their most popular general topic shows. I am 100% certain that they don't advertise the show that I am listening to during the intro to those shows favoured by the toronto psuedo intellectual elite that run the CBC.
Thus I love the podcast app that I use because it can be set to automatically eliminate the first X seconds of any podcast. For most CBC podcasts I have it kill the first 62 seconds as they are garage filler in nearly every case. Usually in those 62 seconds the various hosts say their own and each others' names at least 2-3 times
They aren't the worst. I have one tech podcast where I kill the first 3 minutes of a 22 minute podcast.
I am the developer of the app in this report. my app is called Podcast Republic app which runs on Android. I originally wanted to remain anonymous about the whole issue. But after reading the comments I feel I need to speak out for my app to clarify a few questions raised.
It is true that my app has ads displayed at the bottom of the screen. However, there's no change to any podcast content, no ads injected into any podcast content. My app is a general purpose podcast player and management app. There are no podcasts preloaded in my app. Users can use my app to search podcast online by keywords or copy and paste any podcast feed url directly into my app.
IIRC, in 2010 someone was claiming exactly this: All web browsers committed copyright infringement of a web page, that the author willfully loaded onto a web server. It was quickly forgotten since the idiocy of not publishing web pages is obvious.
Hello Americans. Don't move here. There is a lot of stupid crap here too. All media is Toronto-centric (to the point that Narcissus would be jealous), and have already embraced the all-consuming crapfest that is the Trans Pacific Partnership. Its a draconian hell when it comes to copyright. What the CBC is doing here is just a tiny taste. When a video game company sued a 85 year old grandmother for $5000 last week because someone used her open wifi to download a game, the government just threw up their hands and said "that's just the way it is now".
So all you f*ckhead who are getting all indignant without checking the facts, grow up.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
No one compels CBC to encode data in a publicly defined syndication format (RSS or Atom). However, if they do so, then I believe it is reasonable to imply that they accept that their data will be used in the manner which is normal and customary for data in such a format and in such manner as was clearly intended by those who created these formats. If CBC does not wish to syndicate their data, then they are free to use other formats for its encoding or use access control to prevent copying of the data. What CBC seems to be attempting to do is to "poison the stream" of syndicated data. They are entering a large and long-existing "ecosystem" of feeds, feed readers and feed aggregators and trying, via unilateral action, to force the system to work in ways that it was intentionally not intended to work. While CBC may be free to set up their own system, with it own standards and usage constraints, they cannot be permitted to impose their own ideas on others. Encoding data in a syndication format should be considered an implicit license to syndicate that data. However, such an implicit license should be considered a limited license --- limited to things traditionally associated with syndication apps. For instance, one should assume a license to copy, distributed and display the content of an item in a reader, however, that does not imply any license to copy or modify the content for any other use. In other words, the implicit license is limited only to those functions and purposes which are inherent to syndication itself.
They basically claim downloading any URL is a copyright violation. So lets stop any URL downloading from CBC. By that I mean lets have Firefox and Chrome show that stupid dialog that downloading form CBC is not allowed. See how they like that.