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Will The Death of the PC Bring 'An End To Openness'? (infoworld.com)

Slashdot reader snydeq shared "11 Predictions For the Future of Programming" by InfoWorld's contributing editor -- and one prediction was particularly dire: The passing of the PC isn't only the slow death of a particular form factor. It;s the dying of a particularly open and welcoming marketplace... Consoles are tightly locked down. No one gets into that marketplace without an investment of capital. The app stores are a bit more open, but they're still walled gardens that limit what we can do. Sure, they are still open to programmers who jump through the right hoops but anyone who makes a false move can be tossed...

For now, most of the people reading this probably have a decent desktop that can compile and run code, but that's slowly changing. Fewer people have the opportunity to write code and share it. For all of the talk about the need to teach the next generation to program, there are fewer practical vectors for open code to be distributed.

31 of 501 comments (clear)

  1. False premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The PC isn't dying. Not at all. Despite tablets and mobile devices, there's a lot of work that can't easily be done on them. There are lots of jobs that still require or are much easier when done on a PC. This question is built upon a premise that is false. As long as there's work that requires a PC, and there will be for the foreseeable future, the PC sure isn't going to die.

    1. Re:False premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm a Graphic designer. Work is only increasing, who do you think makes all the GFX for the console's/tablet's? a tablet just isn't powerful enough yet to design on, nor give up the screen real estate of a pc ( I work with x3 50inch screens) I work in an office with other's who code, I dont see them switching either, never see a console you can code on or a tablet suitable.

      Maybe one day the consumer base will switch but those of us use that build for a living Pc's wont be going away anytime soon.

    2. Re:False premise by Bruinwar · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Agreed. With all the phones & tablets & the apparent attitude that PCs are dying, everyone still uses them. My stepson lives in a co-op with a ton of other 20somethings & not all of the own a PC but they sure like to use his when they have a need. Our local library's machines are almost always in use with people waiting. I sure as hell can't do any real work without a PC.

      The demise of the PC is desire of the the greedy men that rule the world. Lock them down, no more of this wild west internet stuff. They've been telling us the PC is dying for years now & iOS, Android & now windows fucking 10 (still mostly open though) IS THE FUTURE. I wonder if some day using regular PC on a public network will be outlawed.

      A 7+ year old PC is fast enough for most. This is the only reason PC sales are not what they once where.

      --
      SLOWER TRAFFIC KEEP RIGHT
    3. Re:False premise by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Consider this: what demographic is most likely to tinker and experiment? I'd say it's older children. But parents are giving kids tablets instead of fully-fledged PCs, so they won't have the same access to tinkering tools. Also, as the kids grow up in Tabletspace, they'll most likely become accustomed to tablet-like ways of working. And OK, being honest, a lot of tablet workflows are better than PC workflows, but mostly because they're not part of a continuum of change. Most major music and photo packages are still heavily-hacked versions of an analogue to the analogue world, and tablet workflows are designed not for people who know the task, but for people who know tablets. There's no reason we couldn't make similar workflows for PCs, but for wordprocessing, coding and the like, the PC workflow can't be replicated on the tablet.

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    4. Re: False premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Well maybe for your candy crush saga simulation. Try stuffing 10+ GB of data and 64 GB+ ram to run a two week simulation under windows 10 home and get back to me how that went.

      PC is just going back to being a workstation, and tablets are the new calculators.

    5. Re:False premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      ok then explain to me why I don't use a laptop currently? oh because they are not powerful enough, try creating a animated Television commercial on a laptop - it takes too long to render without dedicated custom build hardware to handle this task, time is valuable.

      walk into a design agency, do you see laptops as primary workspace?.. no, always PC/mac. Laptops are there usually as concept/storyboarding tools when doing client consultation but the workhorse is a Pc/mac

      How about Rip's for printing or secondary processing, again pc's there are niches that pc's perform so much better than any other device are going to find it very hard to replace, the customizability is the defining feature, something that laptop are not great at.

    6. Re: False premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Laptops ARE PCs...

    7. Re:False premise by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The reason they're seeing a decline in sales is PC has plateaued performance wise. 3-4 old generation Intel chips are still competitive. I'll *never* realize the energy savings with how much I use my desktop. My laptop has a 3940XM that is still very competitive speed wise and is 4 years old.

      In the same amount of time I've upgraded my GPU on my desktop 3 times because of advances in CUDA.

    8. Re:False premise by mlts · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The PC isn't dead. There are just a bunch of people in marketing divisions which -want- it dead, because they want to replace the commodity priced item with free OS choices and privacy settings that the user can choose with a device that has to be tossed in 1-2 years, dumps telemetry data 24/7 with the user unable to a single thing about it, and requiring all transactions to go through some type of gateway, where they guard it, and do their best to monetize every transaction. This is a damn good deal for the tablet maker. It doesn't do much for the consumer.

      This type of lockdown isn't new. About 12-13 years ago when Windows Mobile smartphones were used, Sprint only allowed signed applications on their devices, and one had to pay several thousand dollars to play in their ecosystem.

      PCs are not going away anytime soon. I doubt there will be a tablet that has decent GPU performance that can handle two 4k monitors. In the PC world, $350 gets you a card that can easily handle this task.

    9. Re:False premise by Ritz_Just_Ritz · · Score: 5, Interesting

      +1000

      With the exception of the video card and a relatively cheap 512GB SSD, I also haven't seen the need to buy a new PC until it outright fails. It's still humming along on the i7-2600K processor and 16GB of RAM that it came with 5 years ago. While I'm sure there are workloads that can benefit from the latest and greatest, for most people there just isn't any compelling reason to upgrade. We're starting to see the same phenomenon in the cell phone ecosystem as well.

    10. Re:False premise by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 4, Informative

      I'm a Graphic designer. Work is only increasing, who do you think makes all the GFX for the console's/tablet's?

      This! Because someone actually has to make the consumer's stuff.

      This death of the PC and other stuff keeps coming up, and the sycophants of it are always lacking in some basics. They are the same people who said that our smartphones crappy cameras made DSLR's redundant.

      What has happened is that tablets and smartphones have allowed the computer challenged to join in the fun, but those folk are pretty much consumption only. Somebody has to make what they consume.

      And I've found that there is absolutely no replacement for real estate. So my iMac is serving me up with 2-27 inch screens, and my HP laptop is routinely connected to a 27 inch monitor as well. So it is functioning as a desktop except when I need to take it with me. Usually to present to people what I have produced.

      Now, the market is changing. Since consumption only folks are performing the vast majority of computing device activities, such as using Facebook or other look at something, then type a few words, then look at something else - the market for the desktop and it's inherent power is going to shrink.

      But go away? nope, nope nope.

      ( I work with x3 50inch screens) I work in an office with other's who code, I dont see them switching either, never see a console you can code on or a tablet suitable.

      Ohh yeah, now that's some serious real estate! I drool - I work out of home now, and am running out of wall space, or else I'd join you in that much view.

      Part of my work is similar to yours, I do video work and photography and graphics. So the need for a lot to look at is there. But I also do a lot of work with spreadsheets, relational databases, and pdf's and web development - and all of those programs are running at the same time. Trying to do that on one small screen is doable but slow as molasses, and my extra screens and real estate they provide have long since paid for their money outlay.

      Maybe one day the consumer base will switch but those of us use that build for a living Pc's wont be going away anytime soon.

      I think that the consumers have already switched. And they are on a platform and form factor that works for them. I do wonder however, what the young folks are going to do when they age a little and presbyopia kicks in. At that point, even the PeeWee Herman smartphones of today will be kinda small for them.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    11. Re: False premise by tepples · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Fully update Windows 10 before the start of the simulation and then disconnect it from the Internet during execution, or build in checkpointing to disk. Both should avoid data loss due to forced restarts after kernel security updates.

    12. Re: False premise by Lumpy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      or do what us professionals do. Refuse to use windows 10. Hell most of the engineering computers are still running 7 because it is massively more stable than 10.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    13. Re: False premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Oh yeah the COBOL guys that still have high paying jobs after your hip new language jobs are out sourced.

    14. Re: False premise by slazzy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Switch to Linux.

      --
      Website Just Down For Me? Find out
    15. Re: False premise by amiga3D · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you have to type more than a few sentences a tablet gets very tedious. The screen is less of a limitation. We're talking stuff that most laptops are used for which is mobile computing tasks such as social media and e-mail or general web surfing. Trying to do actual work is of course very annoying on a tablet.

    16. Re: False premise by Lehk228 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      either the next version of windows will be more suitable for industry or 7 will continue getting support like XP did.

      if MS pushes the issue, they will lose industry to linux, and they know it.

      --
      Snowden and Manning are heroes.
    17. Re: False premise by dgatwood · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Computing as a service is taking over. Why do your processing on a slow machine when you can have access to a remote rendering farm. This is the future.

      Call me when I can push those 70 megabyte image files to the cloud for processing quickly enough and pull the resulting full-screen rendering quickly enough (without any compression artifacts) for that extra CPU speed in the cloud to beat the performance of local processing. Basically, the round-trip speed would need to be double-digit milliseconds, so on the order of 100 gigabit speeds... wirelessly... and full duplex.

      At the current rate of progress, my great grandkids will be on Social Security before the cloud can replace local CPU horsepower, and I don't even have kids yet. The cloud might be the future, but from my perspective, it is the very, very distant future except in the context of software with very limited resource needs.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

  2. Why can't there be an open phone? by Billly+Gates · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Back when I was more of an GNU zealot a decade ago I predicted open platforms would kill dumb phones as we saw the beginings of the smart phone starting.

    Reason being is the PC won over the Mac because it was open. You did not have to go to the mighty Jobs and beg to be compliant and certified. Of course DOS the 8086 and most of the PC programs/DOS were absolute crap! But hey, coders loved it with it's limitations because of the low barriers of entry and DOS allowing assembly and low access to system calls.

    Atari almost died in 1982 because they tried to control everything.

    Boy, I was wrong :-( Android we all hoped would be a GNU OS with all rooted phones and terminals and hacks back in 2009 when we read about it. Nope. Is it too late and why won't Google be more open? Apple too. If they make barriers low and allow more with their phones more apps will come to Apple even if they lose out on iMac sales temporarily.

    1. Re:Why can't there be an open phone? by Hognoxious · · Score: 3, Funny

      I knew you'd say that.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  3. Raspberry Pi by HuskyDog · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Even more need for platforms like the Raspberry Pi then!

    1. Re:Raspberry Pi by Lisias · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Oh dear god no! Please! I'd rather use a Mac!

      Not so fast. These little bastards can be amazingly useful. If you can manage to use a Gnu/Linux box, you can use a Raspberry PI 3 as a (very) capable Graphic terminal for your cloud appliances without worries.

      I'm using a bunch of crap, I mean, Raspberry Pi Models B (that one with 512Mb) in a little cluster for miscellaneous tasks, and the damned things work fine. I built a web radio for my home with two of them, and they still have a lot of juice to spare.

      Banana Pi and Orange Pi are also capable machines, but lack the support Raspberry Pi has. But other than that, there's some interesting applications for a small computer (smaller than a 3.5" sata HD") with sata ports.

      --
      Lisias@Earth.SolarSystem.OrionArm.MilkyWay.Local.Virgo.Universe.org
    2. Re:Raspberry Pi by HuskyDog · · Score: 4, Insightful

      OK, my comment was too short for many people to grasp the point, for which I apologise (my wife had just yelled "Lunch!").

      I was trying to suggest that as big manufacturers attempt to lock down their platforms, there will be an increasing need for those interested in software openness to create their own platforms which don't have this problem. When I wrote "like the Raspberry Pi" I didn't necessarily mean like it in power (although my Pi3 is capable of a lot of useful stuff) but like it in being produced by a manufacturer with a strong interest in it being readily programmable.

  4. Versatility will keep it going by GeekWithAKnife · · Score: 4, Interesting


    the death of the PC has been a thing for a while...and yet it's not dead, not even close.

    With general computing power and even decent graphics becoming ever cheaper and integrated even into some monitors at a fair cost the CapEx of a PC compared favourably with consoles.

    Where a PC currently wins is versatility. I can Skype, Administer, Game, Code, Design, View and FB on one platform with ease and more importantly I can do this in almost any way I want on various software platform/s stacks.

    Let's not forget I can typically expect to extend the life of the platform or change it's usability case with hardware upgrades.

    No walled garden, console, smartphone or the like comes even close. all they do, if used at all, is complement my PC usage.

    I'll not bother to list the amount of useful activities that are obviously inferior (to the layman) on other platforms.

    Restriction to a person's freedom always results in that person seeking a way to circumvent or resist that restriction and learning to avoid restriction in the future...

    Death of the PC they say? -tell uswhat genuinely better replacement is coming along and I'll agree...

    --
    A 'singular oddity' is an event that cannot be explained and only happens when you are alone.
  5. User convenience is what is being asked for by sanf780 · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The thing is, most people ask for convenience. A PC is a very sofisticated tool, and nobody is RTFM anymore. Desktops and laptops are prone to get infected with viruses, and OS and software updates are seen as cumbersome to most people. The fact that just installing Adobe Flash might lead to ransomware being installed because of one shitty advertisiment network tells you a lot. The public thinks that tablets and mobiles are less prone to viruses, and for some walled garden it might be more true than on the other.

    And by the way, the article is wrong. The first PCs were not easy to code for. Sure, MSDOS 3.3 did include gwbasic, but for anything complex you had to license compiler software from somebody else. TurboC and the like were not free, you know. Or you could always code in assembly.

    'Member GWbasic? 'Member shareware? 'Member BBS? I 'member. (South Park reference)

  6. No and no by wjcofkc · · Score: 4, Insightful
    First, enterprise and industry are wholly dependent on Open Source. This kind of snuck up over time, and with big corporation supporting the Open Source software they need. So if all the programmers go because we can't teach elementary kids to "code" because they have no "real computer" to "code" on. First off, the desktop and laptop class computers *will* still be there. Second, the kids still won't learn programming in a classroom led by a teacher with no programming experience and who is regurgitating material from a book and doesn't have the foggiest notion of how to handle something that goes wrong.

    Open Source is not taught, it is encountered and embraced. Open Source programming is community. Those people who have oh so specialized cognitive abilities will naturally gravitate into the Open Source world. Not everyone belongs there and the idea of introducing this into curriculum is a waste of time when they should be learning something else. Of the Open Source programmers I know and have otherwise met, not a single one of them were taught about it in school. However, many got started in programming at a pre-teen age.

    You can cite figures of slumping PC sales for sure. But what about the balancing figure that shows people aren't buying new desktops because the one they bought five-years ago is still blazing fast. Right now I am writing this on a Windows 10 tablet. It's a great device but the quad-core Cherry Trail and four gigs of ram are nothing to write home about... oh, a Bluetooth keyboard and I can code away on this tablet. Next room over I have the desktop I built when I need serious horsepower for something or need my nerd fix. It is 6-core AMD machine with 16 gigs of ram, a 120 gigabyte SSD and, integrated video. That is straight of 2011 and I call that my fast machine.

    I could get back into carrying on about Open Source, but this statement:

    Fewer people have the opportunity to write code and share it.

    Reveals the depth to which you have no clue whatsoever what you are talking about. There are plenty of people around here who might take the time to write a small book about it for you, but I am not one of them.

    --
    Brought to you by Carl's Junior.
  7. Free / share ware was a reaction to a need by petes_PoV · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Early software was written because the author needed to perform a function that existing software didn't address: either in terms of utility or quality.

    The PC magnified this need, with millions being sold but only crappy commercial software to run on it. Whether the free/share-ware in question was a Windows app or a different O/S, the same voids were filled for the same reasons. (If Windows software had started out as low-cost and high quality, would freeware have become so popular? Discuss.)

    The argument now is whether that phase is over. Do we have enough apps? Can we (users) do all the things that we wish to, with the software that is available to us, now? Do we prefer to spend 99 on an app that has "star" ratings, user feedback, integrated installation is (almost) guaranteed not to make our hardware die, send SPAM or steal our data - or do we prefer to download something for zero cost and then spend hours trying to configure it and bend it to our will?

    --
    politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
  8. Same thing different decade. by Charcharodon · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Huh? This is no difference a decade or two ago with most people with PCs using them with services like AOL. They didn't us the "open" hardware or software, they just used what ever locked down crap peddled to them by the gatekeepers. Same goes for 99% of Apple users.

    The only difference now is they use a smartphone or a laptop rather than a desktop.

    The difference now is you can buy a computer for a few hundred dollars, even less if you just need hardware connected to the internet, along with a firehose of an internet connection, and can pretty much do what ever you want. That is as open as it gets.

    The real heart of the matter is that most people could give a flip less about coding up their own solutions, any more than they are willing to change the oil on their car. They never will. The minority that is willing to do that will be the ones selling them solutions.

  9. I suspect numbers are stable by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I can't really back this up with any data, but it's my speculation that all the people that NEED PCs are still getting them. What we're seeing in the area is that people that never actually needed everything a normal PC offers have migrated to phones and tablets. If you're just doing email and Facebook, a desktop machine is overkill, but there was no other choice for a long time.

    There will always be programmers working on these sorts of "open" machines. We need them for academic and industry work and there's not any way that's going to change. Apple itself will always be a maker or a purchaser of those sorts of machines themselvesâ"OSes can't be made on heavily restricted machines.

  10. Utter utter utter utter utter utter utter shit by Hognoxious · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Fewer people have the opportunity to write code and share it. For all of the talk about the need to teach the next generation to program, there are fewer practical vectors for open code to be distributed.

    Sure, modern machines don't boot up into BASIC (though I have two that start up in bash). But there's eclipse, Code::blocks, various QT things, and if you hold your nose even community editions of Visual Poodio that you can get with a few clicks for exactly zero of Her Germanic Majesty's finest pounds.

    I want to know what this person is smoking, so I can go get some.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  11. Future of various form factors by unixisc · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I have all the toys in question - 2 laptops, 2 tablets and 3 cellphones. Here is how each of them is used:

    1. This laptop I'm working on (w/ TrueOS) is where I do the bulk of my stuff - my shopping, banking, slashdot and a few other sites I participate in

    2. My Wintel laptop, which is what I use for work, as well as anything where I need something that's only available on Windows

    3. My iPad, which I use to listen to Sirius XM when I am at home and not driving, as well as some games

    4. My Ellipsis, which I use to check stuff in my various accounts. While I use the laptop to do things like money transfers and stuff, I use the tablet to make payments, or check the status of a transaction. I also use it when I'm travelling - to carry my e-ticket and so on

    5. My iPhone, which I use to FaceTime and WhatsApp w/ family members, and also play games while I'm waiting for something at a restaurant, or in a clinic, or at the movies

    6. My Moto X, which I use as a work phone, and separate from my personal phone. If any employer were to ask for a BYOD, that would be it

    7. My Lumia, which I use as a travel phone whenever I'm out of the US and in exclusively GSM territory

    Of the things I listed above, granted - a lot of them can be consolidated to 2 or 3 devices. But while I have a wireless keyboard for my iOS and Android tablets, I've found that a lot less convenient than a laptop. OTOH, I can't use my laptop if I need to call Lyft for any reason, like if my car is in service.

    The reason everybody has sold production to China is that previously, everything was merely outsourced to the likes of Gigabyte, Asustech, Acer, Compal, Quanta, et al, and slowly, everybody realized that they were only paying extra for the brand, but otherwise getting the same shit from an HP or a Dell. Which is why it makes more sense to buy from a Lenovo or an Acer. But end result is that the only thing the IBMs or Dells are now making are the high end boxes. As far as Apple goes, it does make more sense for them to switch to A10s and beyond for their laptops: OS X is already iOS-ized, and that would also save them from Hackintosh undercutting their Mac sales, to the extent it happens at all. There ain't a strong reason for Apple to base its computing infrastructure on x64. Even for Mac Pro, Apple can introduce multiple A8 cores or something to match the throughput, since the underlying OS is perfectly SMP capable