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Microsoft Locks Ryzen, Kaby Lake Users Out of Updates On Windows 7, 8.1 (kitguru.net)
Artem Tashkinov writes: In a move that will shock a lot of people, someone at Microsoft decided to deny Windows 7/8.1 updates to the users of the following CPU architectures: Intel seventh (7th)-generation processors (Kaby Lake); AMD "Bristol Ridge" (Zen/Ryzen); Qualcomm "8996." It's impossible to find any justification for this decision to halt support for the x86 architectures listed above because you can perfectly run MS-DOS on them. Perhaps, Microsoft has decided that the process of foisting Windows 10 isn't running at full steam, so the company created this purely artificial limitation. I expect it to be cancelled soon after a wide backlash from corporate customers. KitGuru notes that users may encounter the following error message when they attempt to update their OS: "Your PC uses a processor that isn't supported on this version of Windows." The only resolution is to upgrade to Windows 10.
I'm sure someone will release a CPUID hack to pretend to be a lower end cpu, much like Agner Fog used when proving that Intel's compiler and the code it produced would shit on both AMD and VIA on purpose.
"His name was James Damore."
Why the hell are people shocked? Microsoft first said it was going to do this 14 months ago, way back in January 2016.
It's one thing to put up a disclaimer saying the chip is not supported and any trouble/bugs/crashes you run into are at your own risk, it's quite another to block the install completely.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
you have to move to W10 one day, so why not to-day?
No, that's the thing you see. You don't have to move to W10. Microsoft wants to FORCE you to move.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
Does anybody really think that everyone will "upgrade" to windows 10 because of this?
I will gladly run it unsupported. Just because Microsoft pulls support doesn't mean the OS suddenly stops working. In fact, I've been running with windows updates off for well over a year now so "support" for win 7 is irrelevant to me.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
OS support isn't the issue here. Some laptop manufacturers actually put checks in the BIOS to only boot if a preapproved wifi adapter is installed. Try to use an unapproved wifi adapter and the system refuses to run at all.
Wait, so I if switch to Win 7 I won't have to deal with windows unilaterally deciding to reboot on me to install updates? Sign me up!
Not having the sheep running spyware 10 costs them advertising revenue and must be blocked.
Backwards compatibility is what keeps windows as the default OS. If Microsoft takes that away you may as well run Linux.
REF: https://arstechnica.com/gadget...
No, I do not have to move to W10, ever. From this day, I am locking MS out. I realize some people can not do this for various reasons, but I can, and I will. MS has completely lost it, and I don't think they have as much power as they think. We will see. But I will never run Windows 10 on any machine of mine. I was an original 'Insider' from 10/14, and gave it every benefit of the doubt for two years, but it was never going to work for me. No, as far as I'm concerned, MS has just lost it.
No, that's NOT the only resolution.
Anyone who's the least bit tech-savvy can use WSUSOffline to draw down all the updates.
The only issue you have there is that Microsoft's update servers are randomly peppered with corrupted manifest files which prevent fresh WSUSOffline setups from downloading anything. So you have to do multiple attempts on multiple networks (sometimes) before getting a pristine manifest.
Once you have it, it's fine from there on out.
But yeah, this is major bullshit on Microsoft's part. And Nadella and his crew need to be drawn and quartered for this.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
In all seriousness, I believe these chipsets were sold in machines that originally came with Windows 10 (or not with Windows). This only affects people who bought new PCs, then manually installed an old OS because they liked it more. That's low volume stuff that is only overrepresented here on Slashdot. Most of the world doesn't even notice moves like this, because their PC came with Windows, whatever version, and it still works and updates.
--Jaborandy
How about until the agreed upon 1/14/2020 or whatever date in our fucking contracts?
They're blocking newer CPUs from accessing Windows Update and preventing them from downloading critical security patches. These patches do not require additional testing or development to work on PCs with the newer CPUs, and the newer CPUs do not magically make the gaping security holes go away.
You're one of several shills posting that bullshit here.
Windows 7 extended support (security patches) is guaranteed until January of 2020. They're pulling the plug on that early for anyone with a Ryzen or Kaby Lake CPU. This isn't about those CPUs not being supported - Windows 7 runs on them just fine. This isn't about the patches needing more testing or development - the patches don't care what CPU you're running and MS hasn't tested a patch before deploying it in 3 fucking years.
FUCK SATYA NADELLA!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Efficiency_Video_Coding
"HEVC is restricted by patents owned by various parties. Use of HEVC technologies requires the payment of royalties to licensors of HEVC patents, such as MPEG LA, HEVC Advance, and Technicolor SA."
All 3 of those working groups stated have strong ties to the MPAA, who doesn't like older Operating Systems used by pirates. The entire push for TPM modules on computers and Secureboot was primarily from the MPAA and RIAA effectively telling Microsoft "Either keep your users from pirating our stuff or we will revoke your Coded Licensing for Windows Media Player and ensure nobody can play DVD's on computers" in the late 00's. It wasn't until after those technologies were deployed that software companies began using them for security, e.g. using TPM modules to lock down disks or Secure Boot to lock down boot-code.
This is the same story replaying itself, but this time Intel is the victim. Pretty much all of the mid-sized and large web media companies are grouping together to build competing, free standards e.g. VP9. I expect HEVC to end up the same way many proprietary standards on video capture equipment ended up; obsolete in 3 years.
If you're looking to skip a processor generation, right now is the time.
Use Linux, no one forcing you to do anything ever again. Might learn something about how computers actually work too. It's not hard, just daunting at first glance. It's an awful lot easier than it used to be, when we where using dip switches and jumpers to configure hardware.
I guess you're used to talking to Joe Average who doesn't even know why he bought a computer. Maybe that would excuse you. But considering I've been around computers since punch-card days, can code in anything from ASM to LUA, have always built my own rig, have had several installs of linux from slackware through mint and I probably know a great deal more about computers than you do, I find you come off as a tad bit patronizing. Not everyone who uses Windows is a red neck hill-billy.
My statement stands. You however are full of shit. Keeping track of every little nuance of your linux distro is a full time job. If you DON'T stay current, then you have as little choice as to what happens to your linux kernel and distro as any Windows user has over their OS. apt-get update is not going to save you. Open source is all well and good if you're on the coding team for that particular project. No one has time to go through every single fucking line of code for every driver, utility, application, etc. So you end up "trusting" the open source community. Well guess what.....
Some of us would rather skip the illusion of safety and open-ness and get on with our lives without kidding ourselves.
And all of this argument doesn't change the fact that Microsoft is using its market position to force the consumers down a path they don't necessarily want to go.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
they block updates for Window 8.1 and it's only 2 years old
Same here. I've turned updates off for several years. Who wants a forced update to Windows 10?
Additionally, the updates just bog down my system. Some say it's for "security" but I haven't had an issue on any of my systems (I have 8 various PCs running at my house for various purposes).
I'll be on Win7 until it becomes unusable. Then it's over to Linux unless Microsoft starts behaving with civility.
> you have to move to W10 one day
I'm also going to die someday too, but that doesn't mean I want it today.
So, BZZZT, no, but thanks for playing! I _already_ have multiple boxes with Windows 7 that work perfectly fine thank-you-very-much. There is no software that runs "only" on Windows 10 that "I need."
I've already migrated my personal dev work to OSX and Linux, so no, Microshaft can go fuck themselves, because I don't want nor need their Spyware they mis-label as Windows 10.
Hell, even at my day job we've been using OSX for the past 5 years and we're a Fortune 50 company. I also know many devs who use Linux. Seriously, there are WAY more OSX and Linux machines then I would have thought possible.
The harder Microsoft tries to force customers to Windows 10, the harder the pushback will be. In Microsoft's quest to force everyone to use Windows 10 -- they forgot the most important thing:
Customers don't NEED it.
There is only 1 name for people who run Windows 10.
Idiots.
Because they sold themselves out. M$ has no respect for you. All they care about is exploiting you. For some of us, MS has stepped over the line.
Blocking Ryzen qualifies as a new feature update.
As it was, the OS had no knowledge of that architecture. Adding code to explicitly reject it, despite sharing a common instruction set is a "new feature." XP would probably run on it (with legacy boot enabled).
fully supported != updates blocked. Ignoring the CPU and just assuming it will work would be better than this. They don't actually need to add support for anything that isn't already in there.
Ryzen is a new feature
Ryzen has new features. It doesn't require ANY for it to work on Windows 7. Windows added a new feature to detect and block the architecture from updates - that's the only "new feature" that's relevant here.
Legally they can't stop after market support, including if I want to machine parts for my 25 year old truck (which is well supported by after market vendors) and I can do anything to it as long as it still street legal, whereas MS will use various laws (copyright, patents) to stop any after market support. Even worse is that these days you're not allowed to do stuff to the hardware/software that you bought after hearing the ads about "owning it". At least if they were honest about it being a lease or rental, people could make a more informed decision.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
They said 2020. I expect them to keep to that.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
Who? Please provide a list so we can know what brands to avoid.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
If you DON'T stay current, then you have as little choice as to what happens to your linux kernel and distro as any Windows user has over their OS.
Not quite true. I don't care about kernel release notes and distro package changes until they matter. That is, it either breaks something I care about, or adds something I care about. When it comes to things I care about, I have complete control over my own computer.
And that's all that matters to me. (By definition) If I can't configure one distro to suit my needs, there has always been another one available.
No one has time to go through every single fucking line of code for every driver, utility, application, etc. So you end up "trusting" the open source community.
Open source doesn't mean the code is perfect. I don't think anyone believes that. There will always be security holes, whether added maliciously or accidentally, in virtually every operating system I am aware of. But that's not the same as having the vendor introduce unwanted features, or deliberately degrade user experience, or preventing the user from modifying their own settings, or preventing them from running software that didn't come from an approved app store. ...all of which have been done in recent years. It's gotten to the point where it's debatable who actually owns the computer, you or the OS vendor.
I have not seen this to the same extent in open source OSes, even including Android.
Some of us would rather skip the illusion of safety and open-ness and get on with our lives without kidding ourselves.
Safety is never guaranteed with code of any significant complexity. Openness can be.
I agree. Incredible!
Windows 10 is possibly the worst spyware ever made. From that article: "Buried in the service agreement is permission to poke through everything on your PC."
My opinion: There should be far stronger protests, including legal action and laws against that kind of abuse.
You haven't had to compile for years. "pkg update; pkg install foo", as easy as Debian or Ubuntu.
How old is Windows 8.1?
Bonus question: when does the official support period end?
At least a part of this article is entirely indefensible.
Lenovo does it on some machines, as do HP and Dell. It depends on the model and the part of the world where the machine is sold.
It's because in some places they have to do it for regulatory reasons. If they install a high gain antenna than the maximum output power of the card has to be limited to prevent it exceeding the legal maximum. If you replace the card with a random one it might be too high power.
At least in the case of Thinkpads it is fairly easy to patch the BIOS.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
It can't be that, because Windows 10 supports lots of older CPUs and GPUs that are not capable of PlayReady 3.0.
I wonder what happens if you try to play back a Bluray on a non-PlayReady 3.0 system. I heard that they would limit you to inferior quality audio. Doesn't seem to stop the rippers.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Intel has been going along with what Microsoft has been doing here (Microsoft not building drivers for the last 2 gens of Intel x64 chips). AMD wrote Windows 7 drivers for their new Zen Ryzen architecture that just came out, specifically because Microsoft wouldn't - so AMD's customers could use Windows 7. Typical morally bankrupt choice by Microsoft executives, again...seems built into the corporate culture...and Intel wasn't writing drivers for Kaby Lake (and Skylake was a pain to get Win 7 to work on) so they were going along.
Makes me want to get an AMD system and use one of the non Microsoft update services (http://www.wsusoffline.net/), (http://www.autopatcher.net/forum/) just to give Microsoft the finger - although Linux with a Windows VM (for any Win32 have to have's) is probably the best way to give them the finger.