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Google May Face Another Record EU Fine, This Time Over Android (itwire.com)
troublemaker_23 shares a report from ITWire: The EU is contemplating another record fine against Google over how it pays and limits mobile phone providers who use the search company's Android mobile operating system and app store. Reuters reported that a decision could be expected by the end of the year if the opinion of a team of experts, set up by the EU to obtain a second opinion, agree with the decisions reached by the team that has worked on the case. The report quoted Richard Windsor, an independent financial analyst, as saying that the Android fine was likely to hurt Google more than the search fine or the verdict in a third EU probe over AdSense. "If Google was forced to unbundle Google Play from its other Digital Life services, handset makers and operators would be free to set whatever they like by default potentially triggering a decline in the usage of Google's services," he said.
In the chargesheet, issued on April 20, 2016, the European Commission said Google had breached EU anti-trust rules by:
-Requiring manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and Google's Chrome browser and requiring them to set Google Search as default search service on their devices, as a condition to license certain Google proprietary apps;
-Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code;
-Giving financial incentives to manufacturers and mobile network operators on condition that they exclusively pre-install Google Search on their devices.
In the chargesheet, issued on April 20, 2016, the European Commission said Google had breached EU anti-trust rules by:
-Requiring manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and Google's Chrome browser and requiring them to set Google Search as default search service on their devices, as a condition to license certain Google proprietary apps;
-Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code;
-Giving financial incentives to manufacturers and mobile network operators on condition that they exclusively pre-install Google Search on their devices.
Couldn't happen to a better company.
they aint paying shit
you will settle for an adwords giftcard
like when apple owed ireland eleventeen trillion dollars
remember when they payed that?
They have to make up the money they will lose when the UK leaves somehow.
How is that behaviour any different from the way Microsoft behaved with its' OS or IE? And it's apparently OK for them...
Seriously - Why no mention of apple - surely they should be going for apples jugular given they don't allow anyone else to use their devices, *OR* install competing stores on them
At least with googles system you can disable the bits you don't want, *AND* install other app stores. You can't do that on apple.
Lotsa rich kids corrupted Google and look at it now ...
If you want a phone that isn't a consumerist piece of trash that you'll throw in the garbage in two years, you need to go with Apple. I don't know why Google fanbois hate the environment so much, but they should get some ethics and some taste.
I believe that forcing manufacturers to include a pretty big number of Google apps if they want to include any of them (including some everyone essentially wants like the Play store, Gmail and Maps) is a bit abusive.
The agreement Google forces upon manufacturers that want to release Android phones also states that they can't release any device bearing an Android-derived OS. That is, Amazon can release their tablets with an Android-derived OS, bug Samsung can't do so since they do release devices with Google's apps.
Anyway, this is much worse for Google than the issue with unfair positioning of their shopping service since Android was essentially developed to promote their services and gather user data which, in turn, feeds Google's primary business of selling ads tailored to the user.
An alternative to the forced bundling of apps and services would be that the manufacturers paid for the privilege of using the closed source bits of Android and Google's apps.
Requiring manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and Google's Chrome browser and requiring them to set Google Search as default search service on their devices, as a condition to license certain Google proprietary apps;
Bundling. Naughty, naughty.
-Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code;
Really? I thought they were just denying them the use of their trademarks for the purpose.
-Giving financial incentives to manufacturers and mobile network operators on condition that they exclusively pre-install Google Search on their devices.
Exclusively? Really? Or just not on the home screen?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
"Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code; " Great. Let's just fragment Android OS even more. Idiots... The other items, I can maybe agree with.
Next up is Microsoft for their blatant abuse of W10 and leveraging their desktop monopoly into OS unrelated areas such as advertising, app store, Bing, Edge, OneDrive, Skype and all the other hActivex/metro app abuse (300MB candy crush anyone ?), unremovable apps, ie. xbox, cortana, edge,
Google's market abuse isn't the first and it certainly wont be the last, the EU wont stand for that nonsense and you shouldn't either.
-Requiring manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and Google's Chrome browser and requiring them to set Google Search as default search service on their devices, as a condition to license certain Google proprietary apps;
-Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code;
-Giving financial incentives to manufacturers and mobile network operators on condition that they exclusively pre-install Google Search on their devices.
This all sounds like Microsoft and the browser wars all over again. If this is indeed the case, Google should be punished "hard."
Here's a great article about why this makes no sense (basically, regulating a market that doesn't need it):
https://www.wired.com/2016/11/...
Isn't it obvious, the EU regulators are a bunch of Apple shills and fanbois.
EU should be ignored until they sort their own house out. They are currently in the process of pushing trough the Monsanto / Bayer mega-merger. An obvious monopoly. Until they can stop being so hypocritical they should be ignored. The only reason they are doing this? They need the money. Also what's happened with the VW scandal?
Just another EU money grab.
... but this is what is looks like when your government actually cares about protecting its citizens. Microsoft was first, now Google, other abusers to follow.
Forced bundling, undeletable apps, different pricing per region, forcing out competition, regional locking, all will be taken care of for EU citizens. As a result the capitalist model is working well causing competition which results for example in low prices for food, medication, insurance, internet, TV subscriptions, no caps on fixed line etc.
But please, don't believe me; there is already a considerable influx of American scientists and retirees, so don't come. It's horrible over here!
Posting as AC because I value my privacy.
Apple, which is a MUCH more closed ecosystem, is not being fined. The takeaway is that if you don't want to be fined by the EU, you should build a completely closed system, not letting users so much as install a different browser that's not just a reskin.
Do you want a totally closed up computing world, EU? Because this is how you get a totally closed up computing world.
> Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code;
how does Google enforce that ?
> Giving financial incentives to manufacturers and mobile network operators on condition that they exclusively pre-install Google Search on their devices
how is it different from windows 10s that is a discounted windows10 but with bing and Edge being mandatory
In Europe they're at least attempting to serve notice that the rights and interests of individual citizens outweigh those of the corporations. I find it interesting that Europe, with its long history of monarchies and empires, seems to be doing a better job of defending Joe Average's rights than is America, with its history of individualism and personal freedom.
'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
EU is in the Apple and Microsoft club where Apple and Microsoft can lock their phones and tablets are locked in to their stores without punishment
Excuse me, I'm ROFLing!!
Let's see the EU take on their own megacompanies--then your argument might have some sway.
But a number of other Countries exiting the EU or likely to.
So the Need that $$$$$ to sustain something that may very well be unsustainable,
It seems to me that in addition to Google, that the carriers were complicit in this and got benefit out of it as well. I would hope that the EU commission would go after them in addition to Google.
Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But then I repeat myself. -- Mark Twain
Does anyone think it is a coincidence all these huge fines in recent years are against American companies. EU wouldn't do this to their own companies like they do to Apple and Google and other American companies. Now they are going after a literally free product with a fine. That is amazing.
Do no evil?
The EU has stepped up its effort to recover the lost monies with the US pulling out of the Paris Climate Accord and they want it NOW!
The primary difference is there was next to zero (real) competition back then.
This is just the EU continuing to fine U.S. companies to deal with their own monetary issues and fiscal shortfalls.
Fuck off already, Europe. This suit is as stupid as the last.
I guess the EU has found another sugar daddy besides Microsoft. They must all own Apple stock in the EU because Apple seems virtually immune so far to the EU's penalties.
Oh well, I guess that what it takes to do business in the EU. Play by the rules, pay the correct taxes, and especially pay the right person. But if you think about it paying a €1B fine for making €100B is just the cost of doing business in those countries.
You'd think after Venezuela companies would learn that it's risky doing business in an area where a socialist government sees their earnings simply as a piggy-bank to be raided whenever their own shitty economic fallacies collapse? When the kleptocracy says "they have many billions, they won't miss a few" it's time to take your toys and go home.
Ultimately, such economies are going to have to face that either they play nice with the rest of the world, or the end result is that they're going to be shut out and have to depend on their local crappy replacements for the goods and services no longer available to them from better companies elsewhere in the world. Galileo: only 33 years after GPS! Quaero instead of Google. Nokia instead of iPhone or Samsung. Sailfish instead of Android? Enjoy.
-Styopa
Microsoft will be tested on how hard they're willing to defend the Win32 platform if ReactOS ever gets to be 'good enough'. Seems like at the moment they want to avoid the community backlash, while nudging people towards UWP.
Android is free. If they do not like, use something else. Or write their own OS.
Wonder what companies paid the EU off to go after Google.
By the way, I do not use Android. But I find the companies attacking Google in EU as pathetic leeches.
1) Apple makes their own hardware. They do not force other manufacturers into agreements.
2) Apple's market share is falling.
3) Apple and Microsoft are likely behind all of this anti-trust business.
The vast majority of people I know only use Word, with a large segment using Word + Excel. Yet the smallest version of Office you can get bundles (i.e. forces you to pay for) Powerpoint and OneNote to get those two.
Companies release their products as bundles all the time. If Google had been leveraging their search dominance to Android dominance, I could sorta understand this. But they're not - they're doing it the other way around. If you want the Play Store, you have to install the Google suite of Android apps which includes the Google search bar. Anyone who is already a user of Google search can continue to use it in a Google-free version of Android like Cyanogenmod in a browser, just like they do on the desktop. Google's version of Android is basically AOSP + their bundle.
The second charge doesn't even make sense. The EU is pretty much telling Google "you would have been better off if you hadn't released Android as open source." Way to destroy any incentive for any company to ever use or release anything as open source again. In the future companies will only release the absolute minimum source code as required by licensing, preferably not a fully functioning product (like AOSP) so no regulatory agency can ever blame them for a derivative product's failure.
The third charge has merit if true. No kickbacks putting a finger on the scales of the market's behavior.
That would be a hard sell because Microsoft has less of a monopoly on office suites than it ever has had since the rise of Microsoft Office.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
After a few months of having to go to the library (remember those?) and look things up on paper - or worse, using Bing, Europeans will be clamoring to have the government let Google back in.
They love refugees so much, let them sponsor part of this
Apart from the unpopular Motorola Rokr E1 and Slvr L7, Apple's iPhone was the only phone that could play iTunes purchases. iTunes Music Store didn't drop FairPlay DRM until a couple years after the iPhone was out.
it would have to be argued that they're successful in promoting Edge (IE is no longer their focus) and in turn making it difficult for other web browsers to gain market share.
Windows 10 S runs only applications from Windows Store, and Windows Store has only Edge and Edge reskins. I concede that Windows 10 S is not a monopoly as of third quarter 2017, as it's targeted to the education market and not yet dominant in that market.
But there are rumors that Microsoft plans to replace Windows 10 Home on mass-market laptops and desktops with Windows 10 S, requiring users to pay to upgrade to Windows 10 Pro in order to run any other browser. If Microsoft goes this rumored route, it should be straightforward to show that Microsoft is using its Windows monopoly to push Edge.
Seems like at the moment they want to avoid the community backlash, while nudging people towards UWP.
I'll believe that once Visual Studio goes UWP.
is how Google never gets rapped over for their privacy violations and secret data farming. Only through cartel laws.
Feels like Al Capone getting canned for tax evasion.
Yeah, that's probably never going to happen..
EU: "Google, we are fining you (arbitrary amount of) billion euros for some perceived injustice that we don't like."
G: "Yeah, you do that."
EU: "When will you pay?"
G: "Um, let's see... how about never? Is that good for you?"
EU: "And if you don't pay, we'll ban you from doing business in Europe 4 eva!"
G: "Ok, shall we switch everything Google off in Europe, say Monday? That works for us."
EU: *rioting ensues*
That fact is, that Google holds the cards here, even if they don't have the winning hand, they can bluff Europe and make them fold. The fuss is over the preference of Google services in search results. Google have every right to do that, for the FREE search engine they deliver that people use for FREE. Did I mention it was FREE, and awesome? The Android thing is equally stupid - as other have pointed out, are they going Apple for exclusively ensuring people use ONLY the App Store? They will try, and fail.
Fuck the EU - and they wonder why Brexit is happening? It's almost as funny as Windows N: "Hey, I have installed Windows! I'll just jump online and... download... a... web... browser. ... Bollocks."
It's not a coincidence because it is not true. The overwhelming majority of companies fined by the EU are European. Europe doesn't use foreign companies as a cash machine like the US does. It merely enforces the law consistently. US companies being fined are more likely to end up on Slashdot, which has a well-known American bias, and because a large number of major IT and Internet services companies are American.
-Requiring manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and Google's Chrome browser and requiring them to set Google Search as default search service on their devices, as a condition to license certain Google proprietary apps;
I don't care what's pre-installed, as long as I can remove it, or at least disable it. Defaults I could care even less about.
-Preventing manufacturers from selling smart mobile devices running on competing operating systems based on the Android open source code;
This one's ugly IMO.
-Giving financial incentives to manufacturers and mobile network operators on condition that they exclusively pre-install Google Search on their devices.
I don't see any issue with this. I can easily use Google Search to go set another search provider.
I was OK with MS installing IE by default. I used it one time to go download something else. The problem I had was that I couldn't remove it.
I refuse to sign
Android versions since KitKat have shipped without a browser at all, just WebView. It's up to OEMs which browser they want to install.
REF: Android 4.4+ KitKat ships without browser app. OEMs have to license Chrome or build their own
This is the only way the EU can fund themselves. Other than Germany and Great Britain and one other nation ( I forgot which minor country it was ) they are all broke and spending is out of control. The Wall Street Journal had a nice article on France's debt problems.
LLL - Left-wing Liberal Losers. Always in need to steal money from those who aren't liberal. You can't steal money from another liberal as they don't have any.
they deserve it just for the thousand of times pressing the home button for a split second opens the dammed Google search app, which is useless and impossible to disable.
We might see some good come out of this, if the ruling ends the safetynet anti-consumer nonsense from Google.
If they are forced to allow play store to run on AOSP derivatives, they should also be forced to drop restrictions on installing apps on custom ROMs, unlocked bootloaders and rooted devices. All of these are legal in Europe, so discriminating against them should be forbidden and fined.
I'm only afraid that this commissioner is setting her agenda more on Microsoft's wishes than on consumer needs...