Microsoft Extends Free Windows 10 S-To-Pro Upgrade Deadline (betanews.com)

BrianFagioli shares a report from BetaNews: Windows 10 S is a really great idea in theory. By limiting the operating system to applications from the Windows Store, it could make users safer. After all, it should limit the potential of malware since users can't download and install questionable things from the web. Of course, this will only be successful if there is a good library of apps, and I am sorry to say, the Windows Store is a failure in that regard. The biggest selling point for Windows is legacy program compatibility. Once you take that away, there isn't much left. Thankfully, the company is giving complimentary upgrades from Windows 10 S to Windows 10 Pro until the end of 2017. This will allow a person or organization to easily recover from mistakenly buying into Windows 10 S if it doesn't meet their needs. Today, however, as a sign of weakness, Microsoft extends this deadline. Buried at the end of a blog post about Surface Laptop colors, Microsoft drops the following bombshell: "For those that find they need an application that isn't yet available in the Store and must be installed from another source, we're extending the ability to switch from Windows 10 S to Windows 10 Pro for free until March 31, 2018. We hope this provides increased flexibility for those people searching for the perfect back-to-school or holiday gift." Why do I say this is a sign of weakness? Well, if the Windows 10 S experiment was going well, Microsoft would have no need to extend the deadline. In other words, if users were truly buying into and enjoying the "S" experience, we wouldn't see such an announcement. The fact that the company seemingly tried to hide this news is quite telling too. Ultimately, it signals a lack of confidence in Windows 10 S.

Comments

"Microsoft extends blowing-it-out-its-ass period"

[Anonymous Coward]

Windows 10 Sucker edition ought to be good enough for anyone who enjoys being lightly screwed.

Upgrade!

[Zorro]

From an OS that sucks to one that sucks a little less.

Re:Upgrade!

[CastrTroy]

For me Windows is kind of like Democracy. It's said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time. Windows seems the same to me. It's the worst operating system, except for all the others I've tried from time to time.

Wild animals?

[DogDude]

"A sign of weakness"? Really? This is a decision by a multinational corporation, not a dog in heat. What kind of idiot wrote that?

Re:Wild animals?

[war4peace]

Extending a deadline for something that benefits the customer is NOT a sign of weakness. If anything, it's a positive measure, no matter the reasons behind it.
Yes, the Windows Store sucks donkey balls. I am using it (well, my kids are, I installed maybe 3 apps), it's a mess. So Microsoft knows this and offers customers a way out of that lock-in, because that way out means the customer is kept happy.
But if they didn't offer such free upgrade they would have been roasted for THAT reason.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Just make up your bloody mind and roast them for their bad parts only.

About phrasing and wording: the blog announcement is a "bombshell", "a sign of weakness", and Windows S was never "a great idea in theory", it was an experiment. The experiment has been concluded, participants are being offered cookies and the company hopefully learned something out of it.

Re:Wild animals?

[Anonymous Coward]

About phrasing and wording: the blog announcement is a "bombshell", "a sign of weakness", and Windows S was never "a great idea in theory", it was an experiment. The experiment has been concluded, participants are being offered cookies and the company hopefully learned something out of it.

Let's try a real experiment, Microsofties.

You offer Win10 Enterprise under Win7's upgrade model: All telemtery can be disabled by the Administrator, every update can be selectively accepted and/or rejected at the discretion of the Administrator. And every update is fully documented as it was 5 years ago. Consumer-tier crap like Cortana and the app store can be opted out of by GPO as configurable by the Administrator. Single licenses of this Win10 Experimental can be purchased for around $200 without the involvement of a VAR.

You wanna see what the consumer adoption of that would be? Or is Nadella still a fucking coward who refuses to sell users the right to control their own hardware?

Re:Wild animals?

[quakeroatz]

Good points but you can do that NOW by GPO and you can buy retail Win 10 pro, just sayin.

Re:Wild animals?

[Billly Gates]

FYI you can easily disable Cortana and excess data collection metrics upon installation of Windows 10 creators edition. Infact, you have to OPT IN with Cortana asking you for permission to do her job. No really I just installed it fresh on a tablet.

I do not understand the hate for the app store. Don't use it. I see what Microsoft was thinking as the appstore if properly supported can be a god send for children and even clueless users to install apps like Netflix, games, Hulu, and even VLC (yes it's on there) without them fucking up the machine or getting a virus (as apps there are secured and limited in acess). It is a royal PITA to make everyone a freaking local admin for those who standardize in laptops in the office! But if you lock them down you get calls at 9pm at night from a salesman asking why he can't print and install a driver for his airline itinerary. This is slashdot so if it is by MS it must be evil as we all know Linux is going to take over the desktop anyday now.

But regardless, Windows 10 is far from perfect. I hate the fact it installs candy crush and some little girls game with witches by default. You can uninstall it but why should I and why wasn't a GPO available to block it?

Re:Wild animals?

[JohnFen]

FYI you can easily disable Cortana and excess data collection metrics upon installation of Windows 10 creators edition.

You seem to be defining "excess data collection" differently than I do. I define it as "any data collection that I don't want to happen." The creator's update does not allow me to eliminate excess data collection.

Win98

[hackwrench]

I want functionality from Windows 98 back. Toolbars that actually worked and a more customizable File Manager.

Re:Win98

[93 Escort Wagon]

And Pinball!

Re:Win98

[Noishkel]

No, actually I say they really should look back at rolling back to the Windows 7 OS, at least in terms of over all function. Pretty much every single major change to the OS has been met with heavy resistance and little adoption. Few people like the new metro interface to the point entire new 3rd party shells are a bigger seller than most of the apps on the Windows store itself.

Re:Win98

[93 Escort Wagon]

I actually wasn't joking... I wasted a lot of time playing Microsoft Pinball, back when I was a Windows user.

Re:Win98

[SniffTheGlove]

In my eyes, maybe a bit of nostalgia Win98 SE was probably one of the best OS's I used.

Over the years Win has bloated badly but I can see what they are trying to do with 10S but it way to reliant on other people providing content into the store.

It is quite hard at times to run my compiled exe's with Win10 Pro moaning all the time about permissions for this and that and it's just way too expensive to get a cert to sign my own code.

Re:Win98

[JohnFen]

And a search tool that actually works.

Re:Win98

[hackwrench]

Agent Ransack works best for me.

The need for Win32 apps is too great

[Anonymous Coward]

The same reason Windows RT failed. People buy Windows for the large application install base. Even not being able to run Chrome and be forced to use Edge is enough to not use Windows 10 S.

Free Ebola too!

[Anonymous Coward]

Microsoft has generously decided to extend their offer of infecting you with Ebola until 2018, in order for laggards to get to experience the unique disease at no cost to themselves.

Few legs left on the chair

[Anonymous Coward]

With Windows 10 self destructing and thereby loosening their grip on the OS market, Microsoft's solid revenue drivers are down to Xbox, Office lock-in and cloud services. Not the end of the world but it has to be highly unsettling that they constantly get their asses kicked technically. The self-inflicted wounds are just salt on the cut.

What's the next thing they're going to screw up?

Captcha: predict

Re:Few legs left on the chair

[rtb61]

The next screw up is basically a continuation of the Windows anal probe 10 debacle and not releasing a Secure Edition that did not pry into the users privacy and only connected to the internet to serve the User not M$ at the users expense both in terms of privacy and cost, controlled windows update as in controlled by the user. Keeping that lame arse bing name going is also pretty stupid, always reminds of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?..., windows search, just like an annoying insurance salesman.

The thing that really kills M$ it's over weaning arrogance and lack of respect for the customer. They will not be missed.

Re:I've extended something free as well

[K. S. Kyosuke]

that's right, my DAMN balls for you to suck

On that note, "S-To-Pro" may have dangerous connotations for the Portuguese-speaking...

Re:Thankfully?

[exomondo]

Because, unlike the alternatives, it has the necessary hardware and software support people want/need to run to do things they want/need to do. Yes OSX, Linux, BSD, Solaris, etc are in many ways technically superior but users don't care about the operating system, they primarily care about the ability of their computer to do the tasks they need done. This is the same reason Android and iOS dominate mobile, many other mobile operating systems came along that have been just fine but lacked the ability to run the applications that users wanted/needed and so naturally they failed.

Surely this is lose lose?

[Shemmie]

The whole point, as I understood it, with Windows 10 S, was to bring Windows 10 to low spec hardware in an attempt to compete with Chromebooks?

If the only way of competing is to say "Yeah, the OS is crap cus our app store is crap. As a compromise, here's an OS that requires higher spec hardware than you have", surely all you end up with is a crap user experience?

With Windows 10 S hardware and software, you can either have a good Windows 10 S experience, and accept there's no software available (ultimately a crappy experience), or have a crap Windows 10 Pro experience...

Re: Surely this is lose lose?

[that this is not und]

The point was to compete with Chromebook in the education sector by selling a light notebook PC with restricted ability to install junk like games not approved by the school administration.

The point is to keep it an education tool and not an entertainment device.

Re: Surely this is lose lose?

[Billly Gates]

The point was to compete with Chromebook in the education sector by selling a light notebook PC with restricted ability to install junk like games not approved by the school administration.

The point is to keep it an education tool and not an entertainment device.

I know. It would be amazing if Microsoft invented some way to manage settings in a group environment. Perhaps call it a directory of services and use templates of registery settings as a policy or some sort to allow only store apps installation. Too bad nothing is available to do just that?

Re:Surely this is lose lose?

[Luthair]

Microsoft that wasn't the point - hence putting it on the fairly expensive Windows Laptop.

Re: Surely this is lose lose?

[tepples]

So how does a student taking AP Computer Science do his homework when there isn't a good selection of programming tools in Windows Store by design?

Re: Surely this is lose lose?

[jawtheshark]

Well, he gets a Raspberry Pi instead. That way he can use a real OS on a toy computer, instead of a toy OS on a real computer.

It's a poorly executed Failure

[Anonymous Coward]

Windows S should really just be an option at install for Win Pro, called "Locked down for businesses and schools", which lets you edit group policies and what not straight from the installer, that nobody will ever use since they will do one machine, ghost it and paste it on all their computers.
And really, it should allow the option to install softwares from outside the store through an administrative password, so that businesses and schools can still install their "proprietary" softwares. It shouldn't be a consumer OS at all.

Basically, it should not exist, because Windows S's locked down crap can already be done through group policies.

Re: It's a poorly executed Failure

[that this is not und]

Group policies requires domain membership, doesn't it? That means being connected to a Windows Domain Server and running the 'pro' version of the OS. Which are both substantial and unnecessary expenses for a lightweight notebook for school pupils.

Metro/Windows Store Apps

[aberglas]

Metro apps (a highly restricted sandboxed application) were renamed "Windows Store Apps". It is difficult to know from the marketing hype, but I think that the store only supports Metro except for the exceptions, which would make it largely useless.

Re:Metro/Windows Store Apps

[aberglas]

Thanks for the clarification.

Again, from the marketing docs it is hard to know whether Desktop Bridge is just an installer or a crude sandbox. If the latter, no wonder it is not used by MS products.

And how much effort does it really take to make a simple application conform. Their record with One Click and VSTO installers is not good.

Re: I've been using a bootleg Windows for 20 years

[hackwrench]

Just claim to have a disability.

Cost Will be an Issue

[Luthair]

While $50 isn't that much if you've bought a $1500 Windows Laptop, if for a user who purchases a $200 laptop and suddenly needs to pay another $50 in order to use the applications they need - that user isn't going to be happy.

Re:Cost Will be an Issue

[dunkelfalke]

There is no need to. A Windows 7 Pro key is very cheap and works just fine for the purpose of upgrading Windows 10 to Pro.

Re:Cost Will be an Issue

[Billly Gates]

This is 2017 and unless you have old win7 era hardware you will have problems. USB 3 ports, graphics, wifi /n or later, and even nVme will not work or BSOD. This reminds me of the XP holdouts the fact people are willing to install 8 year old software on new hardware doesn't make sense

Re:Cost Will be an Issue

[dunkelfalke]

Have you actually read what I have written or have you just reacted to a keyword, like a chatbot? Windows 10 Home and S accept Windows 7 Pro keys. That means you can force-upgrade a lower Windows 10 edition to Windows 10 Pro for a price of a unused Windows 7 (or 8, or 8.1, whatever floats your boat) Pro OEM key that can be bought on eBay for a couple of Euros and this license, once activated, will stay with the machine you have activated it on.

Not until Visu-app Studio

[tepples]

Except you can't app apps with Appdows 10 S. Currently, you need Visual Studio to app an app, and that isn't an app in Windows Store. This in fact makes macOS and Android appier than Appdows. Xcode is in Mac App Store, and AIDE is in Google Play Store.

Unless and until some sort of "Visu-app Studio" makes it up to Windows Store, AP Computer Science courses will continue to "need an application that isn't yet available in the Store and must be installed from another source."

Desktop Bridge exists

[tepples]

I think that the store only supports Metro except for the exceptions

Then I foresee a lot of exceptions. Windows Store supports both Universal Windows Platform (UWP) apps, which are the apps formerly associated with the "Metro" name, and Desktop Bridge apps, which use a safe subset of the Win32 API. Thus Win32 apps can be packaged for Windows Store using Desktop Bridge, provided they aren't a web browser, game emulator, programming tool, system utility, companion app for a custom peripheral, or other specialized apps that exceed Desktop Bridge's limits or violate Windows Store Policies.

Surprise surprise!

[XSportSeeker]

As if everyone who had any contact with the Windows Store didn't know this was comming.

I'll tell you why Microsoft is extending the deadline: because Windows Store is a piece of shit, horrible crappy experience that no one should be subjected to and it should've been euthanized together with Windows Phones and Surface RT a long loooong time ago.
Microsoft is trying to escape liability for selling an overpriced underpowered hardware that comes with a OS that makes the entire thing less useful than a smartphone.

I dunno who the shit for brains was that put the Windows 10S monstrosity in practice, but it's insisting on an error that had so much insisting in the past years that I frankly don't even know what to take from it anymore. It's downright cult-like fanatical brainwashed stuff.

If Microsoft went back to the drawing board, started developing an entire other OS from nothing, they'd still have something better today even if it also wasn't stellar by any modern metrics.

And I'm only saying this as someone who had a Windows Phone, and had to deal with that store in the past with a Windows tablet that came with Windows 8. It is worse than Apple Store and Google Play Store in almost everything. In fact, even for novice users I'd recomment Ubuntu over it. Sure, you'll be hard pressed to find some novice level support and help for Linux in general, but at least you'll find something. Windows Store doesn't even have that because no one uses it.

Oh, and that talk about the Store getting better overtime, about it offering a more secure environment, about devs eventually coming to make apps for it, and about it being the future? Microsoft has been preaching that crap for years and years now. Back when Nokia was still it's own company.

Re:Surprise surprise!

[thegarbz]

I actually like Windows 10, but the store is the biggest load of crap that I have ever seen. There is nothing useful in it, ... well the Netflix app, but other than that there's nothing useful in it.

Whoever came up with it should be shot in the face with a bucket of their own shit.

Re:Surprise surprise!

[Myrdos]

I dunno who the shit for brains was that put the Windows 10S monstrosity in practice

I think Microsoft still dreams about having complete control over all software running on every computer, and taking a cut whenever any software is sold. And being able to disable any software remotely, say if you didn't pay the monthly fee. And putting ads in any software they please, and simply not allowing you to install the tools to remove it. Not to mention banning Chrome for unspecified violations of Windows Store policies, which will continually change...

My pet goldfish,...

[easyTree]

... the only life form without a pro subscription may soon break.

So glad Microsoft approves me using my PC!

[Anonymous Coward]

Windows 10 S is a really great idea in theory.

I wasn't aware that Microsoft's approval dictating what software I can and cannot use on the hardware I am supposed to own was a good thing. Shall I outsource my critical thinking functions to Facebook, then?

You want windows 10 walled off aka 10 s

[Joe_Dragon]

You want windows 10 walled off aka 10 s

Last Windows (10) drop for me

[CustomSolvers2]

I am currently upgrading my main computer. Although I don't use too hardware-intensive software like new games and my usual memory/CPU requirements are acceptably low, I do spend a lot of time in front of the computer and perform a quite demanding job; so, I do want a responsive and reliable hardware. Long story short: I bought a quite powerful computer with Intel i7-7700. I have always been mostly using Windows and even develop on .NET; despite relying on Linux for secondary machines and my webservers, I was always planning to install Windows (at least, in one of the partitions) on this new computer, expected to become my main machine at work.

I got the hardware without OS, installed a paid Windows 7 Professional copy which I have been using for a while and got ready to notably improve my work conditions (I haven't upgraded my main computer in some years; my previous one was quite powerful though). But the whole process was completely different than what I was expecting: everything was behaving really weirdly since the very first moment (mouse/keyword not working properly, everything being too slow and similar weirdnesses; note that I have done tons of fresh installs on these lines with different Windows/Linux versions on different machines and never saw something on these lines) most of the attached drivers didn't work (some of them even provoked the brand-new computer to hang and forced me to unplug it!) by claiming that the expected hardware couldn't be found! I wasn't able to make the graphic card work and this entire process was done with the very-bothering 800*600 resolution in a pretty big monitor! I downloaded many different versions of drivers and hardware-recognising applications (-> the hardware was certainly there) from intel.com. I firstly got quite pissed with the guy selling me the hardware because of thinking that this wasn't what I bought. But then I realised about the problem: that new powerful CPU (including things like the graphic card) was only supporting Windows 10!! I confirmed that assumption firstly with a quick online research (even tried some of the suggestions given in some forums, but nothing worked) and definitively by installing a Linux distro where my new hardware was immediately working as expecting (= marvelously!).

This is the first time after having been using Windows for quite a few years when I cannot install a relatively-recent version of Windows on new hardware!! Technically, I can run that hardware with Windows 7, but it is extremely faulty, slow and with a horrible graphical experience (I could increase the 800*600 resolution but, for my monitor, the higher ones were even worse); so, I can actually not run that new hardware with Windows other than 10 without converting that powerful machine in pure crap. On the other hand, I was able to install any Linux distro and start enjoying all that hardware right away!! I made my decision in that same moment: moving to Linux as my first operation system, certainly the one installed on my main machine. I don't care about all my .NET work or about having gradually got used to relying on tons of Windows-only programs for performing virtually any action. I am still not even sure what I will be doing in all the fronts. I will certainly be relying on Windows, but only on secondary machines and when strictly required (e.g., having to develop something on a .NET language).

Note that I did install Windows 10 when it was firstly released. I tested it during some weeks and even got a pretty good first impression; but it still was too unreliable on exchange of minor visual enhancements and that's why I quickly decided to temporarily move back to Windows 7. Then, I started hearing about all these attempts at forcibly installing Windows 10 (I had to expressly disable the nagging updates on my Windows-7 computer!) and stopped considering the eventuality of trying it again within the short term. And now, I discover that they are trying to force me to use Windows 10 with all

Re:Last Windows (10) drop for me

[Billly Gates]

You can thank Intel, not Microsoft for the hardware support. It is in Intel's best interests to see apps only running on 10 as it encourages conservative businesses hanging on to 7 with old hardware to upgrade == more money.

I wrote a story last week here with Microsoft porting .NET core 2 0 to Linux. No it's not Mono but the real thing. Go to microsoft.com and download it?

You will find Windows 10 much improved if you must use it. Windows 10 creators edition you can disable spyware, Cortana, and other things and can even postpone updates and even go into the current business branch releases Debian style ( with pro version). If you turn on accessibility options on under 7 you can opt to upgrade. The professional version also has Hyper-V virtualization included which is sweet and much better than the crappy VMware Workstation as Hyper-V is a full bare metal type 1 Hypervisor. You can enable it in the add or remove features in the pro version? I have Freebsd, pfsense, and Ubuntu virtual machines under it.

Windows 7 is old now and getting towards EOL. If you're a developer 10 does have some sweet features with Android which uses it's Hyper-V technology requiring 10. It's ok now. Still not my favorite which is 7 but it has matured alot and fixed many of it's early quirks

Re:Last Windows (10) drop for me

[Billly Gates]

Correction visual studio 2017 has sweet features for Android under 10.

Also Ubuntu for Windows is interesting too if you use other languages. Python is now included in vs 2017 but if you need a Linux feature you can use sudo apt get install to use packages you want. Xorg still not natively supported yet but I got vim and clang.

Re:Last Windows (10) drop for me

[CustomSolvers2]

You can thank Intel, not Microsoft for the hardware support.

I am not sure which one is more interested in moving everyone to Windows 10 and which one can/is willing to do what. But well, I honestly don't know, just assumed what sounded as the most logical and compatible-with-last-events option. On the other hand, your nick doesn't seem to indicate that you are precisely an objective person on this front :)

porting .NET core 2 0 to Linux. No it's not Mono but the real thing.

I heard about that. I was also expecting something on these lines since long time ago on account of the Microsoft/.NET behaviour by trying to be as cross-compatible as possible. Although I haven't ever used it, I am reasonably sure about what to expect from the first versions of a so ambitious project, mainly by bearing in mind my experience on how .NET improvements are usually performed. It might become a reliable alternative at some point, but this moment is very unlikely to be any time soon. Personally, I will not start relying on it until after having fully confirmed its dependability. As said, I will be keeping a secondary Windows-based computer mostly to account for issues like .NET developments.

You will find Windows 10 much improved if you must use it.

To be completely honest, I do think that Windows 10 might be quite reliable already. The problem isn't reliability, its pretty good interface and reasonable-compatible-with-previous versions functionalities; for me, it isn't even all this fuzz about telemetry and systematic invasion of privacy (every big company is doing the same; I don't defend it and expect legislators to set some restrictions on this front, but do accept that reality). The real problem with Windows 10 has been this Microsoft bully-like attitude of trying to impose it to their customers. These attitudes are very stupid in every single context, but here it seems even worse: why doing that when you have virtually a monopoly and, presumably, also a good product?! This has been the most stupid and customer-scaring move which I have seen in quite long time. For me, this was the real deal-breaker. A company performing so damaging-to-everyone actions without consequences? No way! Here you have your consequences!

If you turn on accessibility options on under 7 you can opt to upgrade.

I know it. In fact, I have got lots of reminders about it. I had to expressly disable certain updates just avoid the Windows-10 nagging to continue appearing.

virtual machines under it

I use virtual machines too. They are fine for minor tests, mostly to get a feeling about the behaviour in a different OS. For more complex actions or when you spend a relevant amount of time/effort, having the real deal does make a difference. I do prefer to set side-by-side installations than virtual machines when doing something like performing a serious development on the given OS.

Re:Last Windows (10) drop for me

[CustomSolvers2]

Also Ubuntu

I am testing different distros and my experience on this front is still too limited to have a worthy opinion. But so far Ubuntu (also tested some of their limited flavours which were precisely that: limited) has shown a quite good behaviour on many fronts. I also got a good impression about CentOS and Debian.

Re: I've extended something free as well

[jarlsberg71]

Rape