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Java EE Is Moving To the Eclipse Foundation (adtmag.com)
Oracle has chosen the Eclipse Foundation to be the new home of the Java Platform Enterprise Edition (Java EE), the company announced this week. Oracle made the decision in collaboration with IBM and Red Hat, the two other largest contributors to the platform. From a report: "The Eclipse Foundation has strong experience and involvement with Java EE and related technologies," wrote Oracle software evangelist David Delabassee in a blog post. This will help us transition Java EE rapidly, create community-friendly processes for evolving the platform, and leverage complementary projects such as MicroProfile. We look forward to this collaboration." Mike Milinkovich, executive director of the Eclipse Foundation, is optimistic about this move, which he said is exactly what the enterprise Java needs and what the community has been hoping for.
The article says that Oracle will continue to support its Weblogic server, but what about JBoss?
As Eclipse IDE user maybe I'm bias, but at least things are moving in the right direction
As a Jetbrains Professional subscription user, I don't see how this affects me one way or the other.
As a former NetBean IDE user, I find this development disturbing.
This is just the Java EE spec moving to the Eclipse Foundation, not Java SE or the standard Java SE implementation. So while it may slightly increase Eclipse IDE adoption, the decision won't have undo impact on NetBeans, IntelliJ or other IDEs.
A recursive sig
Can impart wisdom and truth
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Having tried both (althought not for a long time), I always remember NetBeans being much more polished and never understood why Eclipse was so popular.
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
Stupid auto-correct.
A recursive sig
Can impart wisdom and truth
Call proc signature()
I guess it has been a long time. Eclipse has WAY more useful functionality than Netbeans.
C/C++ just has compilers and libraries. There's no special "enterprise" version of the compiler (well, not on linux/unix, MS VC++ might be a different story) so why does java have to have these artificial demarcations other than as marketing device?
The version control plug in of Eclipse, especially abstracting away the conflicting wordings of the various SCC systems, is the best I have ever seen.
And don't forget: Eclipse has a vi/vim plug in, too.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Of Sun
Java is not just a language, it is also a platform (JVM, APIs, etc). The different editions are for the plaform not the language. So there is a platform for 'normal' usage (SE), a platform for long-running, network intensive applications (EE), and a platform for lightweight use (ME).
Java is not a compiler.
It is a huge set of specifications, a huge set of standard libraries, and a mountain of open source frameworks and platforms. And VMs ...
SE: standard edition, mainly for desktop apps, but the line to EE is blurry
EE: enter prise edition, defines standards for accessing DBs, do OR mapping (via annotations (*)), have annotation(*) based REST/SOAP services and build in tools to support development or out of the box deployment
In other words, if you want to run a C++ web service, you first need a web server (extra download and install) where you can deploy your *.so/*.dll to, then you configure something that the web server knows what requests to route to your plug in.
In Java EE, there is a build in web server, and you simply deploy the *.dll analogon (a *.war) and the server configures everything automatically, based on annotations (*)
(*) an annotation can be considered as a smart comment. The compiler puts it into the object code and the deployment environment interprets it (with framework support) and weaves the necessary missing code around it or uses reflection to orchestrate what ever the annotations are supposed to do.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Naming is stupid, geared to large business acceptance. Microsoft has the same .Net language, but with IDE differences instead of language differences. And they have a compact framework with a subset of language features like ME.
https://stackoverflow.com/ques...
Well, depending on when you were in college, Java's probably got a lot better since then. But we're not talking about Java. Java EE isn't a language; it's large framework written in Java for creating complex distributed systems, along with specifications for how to package and deploy software written in that framework.
Early versions of Java EE had serious design flaws, the most serious of which was that it used a kind of thin interface to theoretically remoteable objects that in practice seldom were. Under the covers simple method calls incurred massive overhead that made those parts of Java EE impractical. But Java EE has one cool property: it makes it easy to create objects with method calls that are atomic, even when implementation underneath calls on resources that are distributed across a network and may individually fail.
That's a pretty cool property, but here's the problem: not many projects actually *need* that. One thing that's become clear in the last ten years is that most of the time you can live with relaxed consistency. Global consistency always nice to have, but very seldom something you can't work around. But Java EE also came with a bunch of other stuff, unrelated stuff really, for packaging web applications, rendering HTML and so forth, and this is the bulk of most peoples' experience with Java EE. <carAnalogy: >That's like buying a car because it has a cool MP3 player, but you never actually listen to music.</carAnalogy:>
Here's the problem with the car appendage to that metaphorical MP3 player: it was never particularly pleasant or convenient to drive. Which is not to say it didn't have its positive points, but it introduced a lot of behavioral complexity in order to scale a style of application that wasn't very scalable. Today, if wanted to build say, a website, that had a lot of user by modern standards, you just wouldn't build it that way. Probably the worst thing about Java EE was the sheer amount of brainspace it took to be competent in it. I ran a small development team, most of whom had graduate degrees, and many of them were almost crippled with information overload. That's bad; a good developer isn't satisfied with just getting something running.
Java EE should always have been much smaller than it was; and the good bits probably should have been separate standards; and those standards should have been delivered as a specific, non-proprietary product (like Node.js) rather than an elaborate common blueprint for competing proprietary vendors. The fact that after all these years everyone's heard of Java EE but almost nobody really understands what it is shows there's a problem with the very concept of the thing. BUT, there are still important use cases for the good bits. Most of us will never be involved with those use cases, but they exist nonetheless.
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Its a framework on top of the Java language. It should have been called something else to prevent confusion, but Sun wanted to make sure the word Java was plastered everywhere.
I still have more fans than freaks. WTF is wrong with you people?
https://blogs.oracle.com/theaquarium/opening-up-ee-update
It removes his company from any resource expenditures associated with the maintenance of the widely used framework (themselves included). This should have been a no-brainer. Removing the maintenance costs, but retain the benefits. In addition, their attempts to monetize it pretty much has been exhausted.
IMO, I believe that had they continued to pursue the path of trying to monetize the entire framework or even portions of it, supporters would have just abandoned it, and in the long run hurt themselves even worse and brought quite a few other big companies with them.
So in answering your question, it freed up money so he COULD buy an even bigger yacht.
The less that I have to deal with Oracle, the better my life is.
Speaking for myself, I use Eclipse because I develop for a wide array of platforms, and using a number of different languages.
Eclipse can accommodate everything I need, so I can use the same IDE for all of my projects. That's a pretty huge win.
Naming things in an unclear and/or confusing manner is a time-honored tradition in the Java world.
"Java EE" is not the language, it's the platform/framework/API for web applications. It's more like Microsoft MFC or .net then C++ or C#
This should have been a no-brainer. Removing the maintenance costs, but retain the benefits.
I'm not sure I see how it removes the maintenance costs.
Unless the answer is no, it seems like this move will save a little personnel overhead but little else.
Breakfast served all day!
Reposting because I accidentally replied to the wrong comment:
I'm certain IBM was one of the main ones jockeying for this, and IBM seems to prefer the Eclipse Foundation for whatever reason.
Breakfast served all day!
And how exactly would you name a Java release/bundle/specification that is aimed for enterprices and business applications like Amazon or Twitter?
Enterprise Edition sounds fine dor me.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Using as many acronyms as possible all starting with/having a J is also a time-honored tradition. What with EJB, JAAS, JAX-WS, JAX-RS, JSP, JSF, JTA, JPA, JMS, JCA, and on and on and on the list goes.
You didn't answer the question. The question is, why can't the "platform" mumo jumbo just be furnished as add-on libraries?
Oh for Christ sake. It's Java. Period. The same goddam language syntax as any other "edition" of Java. Why do you have to try to make it sound grand? Linux is written in C, not "Super OS Developer's Edition C". So it includes a whole lot of functions. So what.
IBM chose the name "Eclipse" to fight against "Sun" and that was the primary reason for Sun to not join Eclipse. It was derogatory to them. Now it is Eclipse which forever going to hide Sun. With OpenOffice, Sparc and Solaris going away, Java was the only remnant of Sun under Oracle (which acquired Sun) and now that too is gone. Effectively, Oracle is now Sun free and will have Eclipse instead (it is not getting rid of J2EE from its products).
Yeah, and a CD is the same as a DVD is the same as a Blue Ray Disk ...
There are about 5 editions of Java:
Standard Edition
Enterprise Edition
Micro/mobile Editon
Inoffical real time Edition
Inofficial (several) embedded Edition
Deal with it.
No idea what you want to rant about.
So it includes a whole lot of functions. So what.
If you want to break it down to this level of ignorance: yes, Java EE has more functions than Java SE. Facepalm.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
I did answer the question. It is more than 'just libraries'. The JVM, for example, is not 'just a library'.
The 'editions' are just specifications. They are closer to something like POSIX than 'C'. The editions specify not only the libraries, but also things like how applications should be packaged, etc. If your Java installation meets the spec for the 'edition' that is required by an application, then you can run the application WITHOUT having to install a bunch of libraries, etc.
I guess it will have to be seen as to WHAT PARTS of the EE product will actually be moved outside of their company. But from the sounds of it, this move is to further development in the EE product as a whole at a more rapid pace without having to put cash infusions by themselves. The related costs for just maintaining a major project is not a drop in the bucket. Enhancing one costs even more. Now they want to enhance it more rapidly.
Do it by yourself? Or, release the project to a foundation with a record of successful management of large projects. I do not believe any large company does ANYTHING without looking at the money factor. Plus they gain the expertise of the Open Source community that is already part of the Eclipse foundation (e.g. IBM, RedHat, etc.). Added bonus.
What I am wondering is WHY now? Why only the EE product? Coincidence it coincide to a restructuring as they plan to drop the SPARC architecture and Solaris? What is next?
Anything without Java in the name, to decrease the level of confusion. Like every other framework in the world. It was an idiotic decision driven by morons and marketers.
I still have more fans than freaks. WTF is wrong with you people?
And what would be the alternative to power Amazon, Zalando, Google, Twitter?
Just to name a few?
C? Assembly?
Please go back under your rock, troll.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
They are also giving NetBeans to the Apache Foundation, the first donation just made it on git with another to come.
Same reasoning, more developers and faster development, less financial pain.
I have plenty of common sense, I just choose to ignore it. -- Calvin
I always did like NetBeans, but it seemed to fall behind in some of the support while ahead in others. Maybe now it can be a little more consistent.
JEE is a specification. It's a set of APIs and specifications for packaging applications. Typically, it is furnished as add-on libraries.
All I want is a secure system where it's easy to do anything I want. Is that too much to ask ~~ Randall Munroe
Amazon was more than 50% C++ when I worked there. And those services tended to be more reliable. But at any rate, I said the NAME of an enterprise framework shouldn't include Java, which a 2nd grade reading comprehension would have told you. That name has only ever caused confusion.
I still have more fans than freaks. WTF is wrong with you people?
And why should it not contain Java, when the inventor of Java thinks so?
After all it is a Java VM, with a javac compiler and Java enterprise specifications with reference implementations in the Java language?
And it is completely useless for C++ or other languages unless you want to interface those vi JNI with "Java"?
shouldn't include Java, which a 2nd grade reading comprehension would have told you. :D
Then you should perhaps use first grade writing skills, or have a clue about what you write. Why a Java Edition that contains the word "Enterprise" should drop the word "Java" is incomprehensible for me
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Because its not Java. Java is a language. J2EE is a framework on top of it. Once again, some lessons in reading comprehension would really help you out.
I still have more fans than freaks. WTF is wrong with you people?
Java is an island some where in the Pacific.
Java is a enterprise computing platform and frameworks.
Java is a programming language.
Feel free to run your 'J2EE' framework dependent applications on a backend without installing the Java Enterprise Edition.
I might have overseen an important statement you want to make, however you seem just to be a nitpicker.
No one really understands/grasps what you want to say.
Google around and install 'Java the language' on your computer, and see how fat that gets you.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.