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Kids Praised for Being Smart are More Likely to Cheat (ucsd.edu)

Posted by EditorDavid on from the performance-anxiety dept.

An anonymous reader quotes the University of California: An international team of researchers reports that when children are praised for being smart not only are they quicker to give up in the face of obstacles, they are also more likely to be dishonest and cheat. Kids as young as age 3 appear to behave differently when told "You are so smart" vs. "You did very well this time"...

The research builds on well-known work by Stanford's Carol Dweck, author of "Mindset," who has shown that praising a child's innate ability instead of the child's effort or a specific behavior has the unintended consequence of reducing their motivation to learn and their ability to deal with setbacks... In another study, published recently in Developmental Science, the same co-authors show that the consequences are similar even when children are not directly praised for their smarts but are merely told that they have a reputation for being smart.
Then again, another study found that students also performed better in school if you paid them to get good grades.

19 of 173 comments (clear)

  1. you are so beautiful by turkeydance · · Score: 4, Insightful

    same thing

    1. Re:you are so beautiful by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The cause and effect could be backwards. Maybe the kids were already cheating, and adults mistakenly believed they were doing well because they were smart.

      Disclaimer: Nobody ever told me I was smart.

    2. Re:you are so beautiful by Solandri · · Score: 4, Interesting

      If you read TFA (I know, I know) they controlled for this. Kids were randomly divided into 3 groups - one was praised for being smart, one praised for behavior, one not praised. The group praised for being smart had a higher incidence of cheating. So the cause and effect is correct.

      Summary then does a 180 by linking to a study which speculates praise for being smart reduces motivation to learn. That has cause and effect reversed in my experience. I breezed through high school with little effort, but college actually challenged me so I had a hard time. The study skills most kids had developed in high school to learn stuff which challenged them, I had to develop while in college. So it's not that praise for being smart reduced my motivation to learn. It's that being smart meant I (initially) sucked at learning stuff I found challenging.

      The original TFA speculates that praising kids for being smart puts them under the pressure of raised expectations. And the kids do whatever they can to meet those expectations - including cheating.

    3. Re:you are so beautiful by Opportunist · · Score: 2

      Pretty much this.

      What does "being smart" really mean? Know everything? Or know how to game the system?

      Nature would demand the second. Least input for optimal output. And that's where cheating comes into play. It's easier and requires less effort to cheat than to learn the bullshit you know you won't ever need again.

      Along those lines the law that applies to "illegal" activities comes into play. Anyone pondering an activity that is somehow disallowed will be done by the following law: G > E + C * P

      With G being the gain of the illegal activity, E the expended effort to pull it off, C the chance of being caught and P the punishment incurred if caught. And as long as G is greater than the other side, it is actually smarter to ignore the rules.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    4. Re:you are so beautiful by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      In my experience at least 50% of the difficulty level of a particular subject is down to how well it is taught. I think a lot of people assume they are bad at something when in fact they have just had bad teachers.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    5. Re:you are so beautiful by WhyMeWorry · · Score: 2

      It is not unusual for kids to be totally bored by how easy school work is and therefore not put any effort in to learning how to learn. I never needed to take notes, so I never learned how to. Now I need an ability that I should have developed many years ago.

    6. Re:you are so beautiful by Luthair · · Score: 2

      Kids were randomly divided into 3 groups - one was praised for being smart, one praised for behavior, one not praised. The group praised for being smart had a higher incidence of cheating. So the cause and effect is correct.

      So they told kids who may not be smart that they're smart? Doesn't that make the dumb kids feel like they need to live up to being smart?

    7. Re:you are so beautiful by computational+super · · Score: 2

      Nobody ever told me I was smart

      I was told the opposite - "And I better not hear any smart answers out of you!"

      --
      Proud neuron in the Slashdot hivemind since 2002.
  2. Sounds familiar by lucm · · Score: 3, Funny

    reducing their motivation to learn and their ability to deal with setbacks

    we got a bunch of these kids at the office.

    --
    lucm, indeed.
  3. Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And if you're a teenager reading this, don't do it to yourself!

    Here's what can happen:
    You get told you're smart and start to build your self-worth and identity around that.
    You avoid practicing activities that you aren't naturally good at, because it threatens your misguided self-image.
    You start assuming you just know the answers without checking them against reality, missing valuable feedback on "smart" activities that would improve you.
    If you go to university, you waste time with "Ps make degrees" (passes make degrees if the idiom isn't familiar) thinking, and waste that precious time that you could be learning coasting along on being "smart".
    You go out into a world full mostly of older people who are more talented than you in every dimension. Some of them were "smarter" than you even before gaining decades of experience. Gasp!
    Many of your peers who aren't as "smart" as you go on to be highly happy and successful in what they are good at by working at it. Egad!
    Some of your peers who weren't as "smart" as you studied and/or worked hard and _became_ "smarter" than you in the process. Zounds!
    You belatedly, as an adult, realise that you need a remedial class in putting effort in instead of coasting along on being naturally "smart", and have the added challenge of dealing with the insecurity you built up through years of having your inappropriately-defined self-worth eroded.

    The sooner you realise that "smart" isn't worth shit if you don't constantly work at self improvement, the better off you'll be.

    Feel free to share this with anyone you think is on a dangerous path due to being "smart".

    1. Re:Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by mentil · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No modpoints, so I'll just confirm that being told one is smart eventually harms one's self-esteem once they run into a problem they can't overcome, causing them to question if they're actually smart or just able to fool others into thinking they are.

      --
      Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
    2. Re:Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by snickers · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I had a good friend that was very smart. One of the two smartest people I've ever been friends with. He coasted through school and high school. Got an academic scholarship to a top high school. Once he really had to start to apply himself at university he was unable to. He didn't have that work ethic or drive. Has pretty much done nothing with his life.

    3. Re:Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Once he really had to start to apply himself at university he was unable to. He didn't have that work ethic or drive. Has pretty much done nothing with his life.

      Because he is too smart for that!

      What's the point of laboring like a slave through your life, when you can coast through it with just enough minimal effort?

      You may think he has "done nothing with his life", and yet, what have YOU done with your life? Consider your answer, then consider how that answer would be perceived by someone who didn't value what you considered as accomplishment? You would also have pretty much "done nothing" with your life.

      All life ends in death. What you choose to do in your life, your purpose, is your choice. Perhaps you friend just made a different choice, a choice too smart for you to understand.

    4. Re:Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by MiniMike · · Score: 2

      I knew a few people like that in college- very smart, so they coasted through engineering classes- until they couldn't anymore. Then it was like a speedboat hitting rocks. They didn't finish college and have shitty jobs that are well beneath their capabilities. I usually had to study for earlier classes, and learned in time that effort and persistence are required no matter how smart you are. When I got to the harder classes I persisted, and was able to finish college. My kids are in advanced classes, so I tell them that they're smart- but all that means is you have to work hard in the advanced class instead of a regular level class. No coasting allowed. I make it clear to them that intelligence is not enough, work is still required. I think one difference is I don't praise them for being smart, I just state it as how they are. I do praise effort, successful or not, and try to make it so they're not afraid to try and fail.

    5. Re:Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by david_thornley · · Score: 2

      I praised my son for working hard and getting through things. (I also sometimes told him, "You're smart. Figure it out.") It seemed to pay off. Fortunately, we had an advanced math program available that was challenging, so he got used to working at math much younger than I had.

      One good thing about being smart: when I hit the "gee, I've got to study this, it isn't embedding itself in my brain almost automatically" point, I was able to remember what people had said about studying and the like and put it to use.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    6. Re:Don't let kids think "smart" is important. by swillden · · Score: 2

      What's the point of laboring like a slave through your life, when you can coast through it with just enough minimal effort?

      The point is that putting in more effort will probably give you a better life, in at least two ways. One, you'll be rewarded in terms of career position, giving you more flexibility in what you do during your working hours, including opportunities to do work that is more intellectually and emotionally satisfying. Two, you'll be rewarded financially, giving you more flexibility in what you during your non-working hours, including the opportunity to spend less of your life working, if that's what you want.

      A third point is that coasting with minimal effort also tends to be pretty stressful, since it usually means that you're always on the edge of disaster, not having worked hard enough to build a cushion. That's not necessarily the case, but it's usually the case.

      --
      Note to ACs: I usually delete AC replies without reading them. If you want to talk to me, log in.
  4. How about... by dohzer · · Score: 2

    How about kids asked to cheat? Do they get more praise? You've got to do the reverse to check for dependence against correlation!

  5. Praise for trying hard, not for success by gurps_npc · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Over time, as I got better at various activities, I slowly realized the key to being the best. This applies to anything and anyone. Winning only means that that your competition wasn't up to snuff.

    Want to know how to be the best dancer in the room? Take one hour long class and hang out with people that haven't.

    How to be the best educated in the room? Teach elementary school.

    It took me a while to realize this. At first I thought it was depressing. But over time I realized it is merely what it means to be the best. It's natural and you can't stop it, unless you are the G.O.A.T (Rest in Peace, Muhammand Ali).

    When the second best baseball player in the world is winning, it means the very best is not on the field. When the Mayor is the most important person in the room, he wasn't invited to the Governor's Ball. When the Governor is the most important person in the room you know he's not in the White House.

    Winning isn't important. Trying your very best and demonstrating real skill is what's important.

    --
    excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
  6. Lucky you can handle this in a pedagocical manner by Dirk+Becher · · Score: 2

    Last week, my son approached me with a conclusive proof that P=NP. At first I thought it couldn't hurt to give him a little praise for that, but I luckily managed to get a hold of myself and instead told the little moron to fuck off. As a father you have to be an unpleasable demigod to your kids, an existential monument they can never even dream of catching up to, although they are obliged to try relentlessly, and the responsible parent I am I have no problem to embrace this role to its fullest. ...

    that and I don't like show offs.