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Reddit Admits Russian Trolls Got Into Website During 2016 Election (vice.com)
An anonymous reader quotes a report from VICE News: Reddit says it has identified and removed hundreds of Russian propaganda accounts, a few days after reports revealed that Russian trolls were active on the platform during the 2016 U.S. presidential election. In a post Monday, Reddit co-founder Steve Huffman said his site operators had been investigating for awhile and had found a few hundred accounts suspected to be of Russian origin or linked to known sources of Russian propaganda. "Of course, every account we find expands our search a little more," he said, also claiming the "vast majority" of the suspicious accounts were banned back in 2015-2016. An even bigger challenge was the problem of "indirect propaganda," where content produced by accounts now known to be Russian trolls was enthusiastically shared by Trump supporters on subreddits such as r/The_Donald. Reddit's investigation followed a report from The Daily Beast, based on leaked internal data from Kremlin-backed troll farm the Internet Research Agency, that confirmed Russian trolls were active on the site, as well as Tumblr, in their mission to spread disinformation, divide Americans and disrupt U.S. politics. The Washington Post reports that congressional investigators looking into the Russian issue intend to question Reddit and Tumblr over their involvement.
I agree with you BTW. Let's not forget that America's CIA has been doing the same thing via different channels for decades. They are perhaps still doing this to this day.
Where's the media outrage? There is an article here affirming trolling by the USA.
USA complains because they can now be beaten [on the cheap] at their own game.
Damn, son, that kool aid taste good?
Denial is not a river in egypt. Trump is sketchy. Facts.
I was a lifelong straight ticket Democrat voter until 2016.
The Russians didn't make me vote for Trump.
Hillary Clinton, CNN, Jimmy Kimmel, HuffPo, WaPo, MSNBC, Madonna, etc, etc, etc made me vote for Trump.
They were so god damn smug, condescending, elitist, insulting, divisive, and arrogant... It made Trump's personality flaws look endearing in comparison, and voting for him was my big "fuck you".
No. The Russians didn't divide us. The Democrats and their media stooge propagandists did. Fuck them all to hell. I will never vote Democrat ever again, even though I disagree profoundly with the Republicans on most issues.
> On the first topic, ads, there is not much to share. We don’t see a lot of ads from Russia, either before or after the 2016 election, and what we do see are mostly ads promoting spam and ICOs. Presently, ads from Russia are blocked entirely, and all ads on Reddit are reviewed by humans. Moreover, our ad policies prohibit content that depicts intolerant or overly contentious political or cultural views.
> As for direct propaganda, that is, content from accounts we suspect are of Russian origin or content linking directly to known propaganda domains, we are doing our best to identify and remove it. We have found and removed a few hundred accounts, and of course, every account we find expands our search a little more. The vast majority of suspicious accounts we have found in the past months were banned back in 2015–2016 through our enhanced efforts to prevent abuse of the site generally.
That does not sound as sinister as what is being reported here this morning.
Yes, that would work really well on an international web site...
Seriously Russia, internet trolls & elections??
Clearly the more we hear about this the more false it is. After all, who has an interest to spread such lies? The west! -With their anti-Russian propoganda.
You see if the US/CIA blame Russia for Trump being elected then uhm...that means his election wasn;t meddling or collusion but an inside job by the intelligence community that seem to hate Trump...hmmm.
Maybe it isn't all Anti-Trump/Anti-Russia BS. Maybe we're just finding more EVEIDENCE.
But hey what does evidence have to do with anything? Just think who you support and make sure you have an explanation as to why your side of the argument is right.
Of course Obama was the real reason for all these issues...I won't even mention the orange baboon's porn star hush money, the multiple ex-wives, the unnamed children, the many days at the golf course, the multiple indictments or backchannel ties to Russia. It's all propoganda by Clinton to cleverly hide her emails.
Remember; Trump does not even know what "This Russia thing" is even about but he does state many times that "There is no collusion." & "There was no collusion."
But nevermind cause some dimmwitted fools and shills are gonna quickly label me as a gun hating SJW democratians. Which ironically even if true does not change evidence or truth. -Shooting the messenger is a Trump game. (Lying Ted, Crooked Hillary etc)
A 'singular oddity' is an event that cannot be explained and only happens when you are alone.
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Emboldened Russians will meddle even more in the next election.
Low turn out in the off year primaries in just a few states decides the fate of the whole nation.
Combine the Democratic and the Republican primaries and let the top two go for general election. In most red states two Republicans will run for the same seat. Though Democrats will suffer in the short term, there is some chance sanity will return and Republicans will stop fearing being primaried from the right.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Data disagrees with your assessment. For example, according to this poll http://cdn.cnn.com/cnn/2018/images/02/26/rel3c.-.russia.pdf approximately 58% of Americans don't think that the administration is taking Russian interference seriously enough. And a large fraction of Americans support the Mueller investigation to completion although curiously about 40% of Americans don't even know who he is https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/poll-most-americans-want-robert-mueller-to-complete-his-russia-probe. It is a mistake to think that because you and the people around you think something that that view must be universal.
We the public, hear the words.... Trump, Russia, Mueller.... We stop listening. Nobody cares. Move on... Seriously.
We the public choose to be mindless drones that don't give a fuck if our democratic institutions are manipulated, discredited, and which hostile governments are interfering in our system and using mass propaganda to sway public opinion, because we already have become mindless drones that click and share every link that confirms our preconceived notions. Who really cares if its fake or not, as long as it confirms my biases. As mindless drones, we only care about the dopamine kick, if Putin decides to sponsor it by sharing fresh news on Hillary's undies, who cares. Mindless drone needs more food, badly.
AND STOP BRINGING YOUR DAMN POLITICAL TROLLING TO SLASHDOT.
Stop trying to stir up trouble, we donâ(TM)t come here for politics,
Submitter, go back to reddit, shoo or twitter
The investigation will disappear in a puff of greasy smoke.
Eventually. After the pundits find something else interesting to hype.
And we presume, you speak for Anonymous Coward.
Are you a West Cost Troll, or an East Coast Troll? Which? We need to know so we can tabulate your group's infiltration of the discussion. Your nationality matters, you know....
We have it on record. All two or three of the Anonymous Cowards spamming this discussion care. Very much.
Trump continues trolling dems very successfully by trash-tweating them into distracting pointless investigations.
Completely invisible to public is a spectacular economy jumpstart in 2017 fueled solely by a Republican winning the WH and even more in 2018 (never mind market corrections, they happen all the time). Trump could go out as the worst president in history or he could go out as OK president.
I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
They love focusing on the bloody messenger (apparently) and not the message.
The democrats got trump elected, not the republicans.
Trump is obsessed with the Russia investigation and continually enraged by it, so I doubt he is intentionally pushing the investigation to continue.
I have visited the Official Reddit Forum for an online game. It is a forum moderated by employees of said online game. It's plain to anybody who observes that the whole function of operating that forum is to 'soak up all of the oxygen' of discussion surrounding that game. The discussion is vigorously steered by the mods of the forum.
Sure, unofficial subreddits could be formed, and people could have frank discussions of the game on other forums, but it's a PVP mmo and the people who care really don't have time to be out finding forums for the game. It's even more constrained on the actual official game forums, of course, where a 'female' mod flounces through from time to time being the 'soft' mod in the discussion.
I suspect the 'Official' subreddit is a sponsored operation. It's a game with that sort of people operating it.
What other nationalities would you like to exclude from discussion forums? Latvians? Spaniards? The British?
Should we establish an Americans Only Internet? Should we exclude any other classes of people? The handicapped can't participate in forums concerning wine and cigars? Women can't participate in forums about sports cars?
We the public choose to not allow the entire political agenda to be steered by the shrieking minority who lost the election.
Nobody cares about Hillary Clinton's underwear (esp. Bill, btw). We do care about rampant corruption. Which is being ignored during all this deflection about 'Russian collusion'. Also, because it doesn't matter, the foul Clinton Machine was defeated.
#EconomyGoingWell
#BlueStreakOnThePavement
Ah yes, the one thing that is a pretty sure bet whenever Russia comes up in the news in a none positive way is whataboutism.
Reddit is predominantly white and male. Trump's supporters are predominantly white and male. It stands to reason they would be highly active on reddit as they are on other forums like 4chan, and so on. Yet if you listen to Steve Huffman he seems to act like they are a minority on the site and any activity must be Russian Trolls. It just doesn't seem likely.
These CEOs want us to believe they have these brilliant investigative skills into this mythical army of russian trolls, yet they can't cover their own traces when they manipulate votes, edit people's posts or alter algorithms to favor political forums they agree with.
Here's what you don't get: there is an entire class of 'junior citizens' who believe every word of it. They and their ancestors have had little education other than what the federal government provides and are predisposed to believe anything they hear from an authority (such as the news media) says. They are a growing segment of the population, while your class is a shrinking segment.
They are going to replace your segment of the population with their sheer numbers and the lies they've been trained to believe will become a societal standard for your own belief and behavior, if not yours, then your descendants.
Nobody cares. Move on... Seriously.
Your attitude is unforgiveable. You see that lies are being spread wide and far by pervasive institutions...and your response is to IGNORE IT. As though it never entered into your imagination that lies breed conflict as their primary function. Have you grown up in a small box? You really believe you are so insulated from reality?
Well then you'll no doubt end up getting what you deserve. Hopefully the morons like you don't sink the ship for the rest of us who have the sense first to care, and then to realize what is going on here, and then to actually do something about it.
What was the point in banning the account when on Reddit you just create another username and you're away again? You don't even have to bother with all the hassle of creating another email address for verification. Bans on Reddit are as much use as a chocolate fireguard.
I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
We the public, hear the words.... Trump, Russia, Mueller.... We stop listening. Nobody cares. Move on... Seriously.
Wouldn't that be nice? Looks like you identified a new attack vector. Enough news about it and you will say I'm bored, so do what ever you want.
Your post has indicted that you are completely manipulable. I kinda hope you are at least a Russian troll, and not an American who will just accept anything because you are tired hearing about it.
Or perhaps just a Trumpster.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Where's the media outrage?
More like, WHERE'S THE PUBLIC OUTRAGE?
Where's the armed revolution?
Son, there are already guilty pleas. The fuck you smoking?
If anonymous troll posts on social media are all that's required to change votes, it doesn't sound like the electorate is terribly intelligent.
So the left is simply upset that the wrong type of propaganda is winning?
So every Russian user speaking English on twitter and reddit that has opinions that aren't "politically correct" is a government agent sent to disrupt American discourse....somehow.
Meanwhile our own government has a proven history of infiltrating any and all institutions they want to in order to spread propaganda and subvert "politically incorrect" groups and movements.
Meanwhile mass surveillance is proven: everything they can decrypt (not hard with broken implementations and backdoored hardware), everything unencrypted (such as locational metadata from your cell phone, credit card records, etc.) are collected and stored permanently for endless data mining.
1 + 1 = the government is spying on us in order to develop more effective models of propaganda, and that is the source of the divide in this country.
So sorry, life is not as comfy as you wish it was. Far past time to do something about this mess, from outside the bounds of law if necessary, as seems inevitable.
When will slashdot admit they have been overrun by Russian trolls?
Where is the "whataboutism"? This isn't "whataboutism", but a "pot, meet kettle" situation. You want the world to care about election meddling that allegedly happened in your country? Well, show us how you're different, uncover, stop and apologize for your own meddling and then we'll consider. Unless you do that, just shut up, you whiny bunch of hypocrites.
For collusion? So far I see a few admissions of guilt for failing to report overseas financial assets from 5+ years ago, and for stating a meeting happened in August when it happened in September. Other than that? Not much...
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
Foreigners interfering in elections isn't an 'act of war' though, otherwise Mexico would have declared war on the US each time a Mexican citizen illegally voted in a US election.
The individual foreigner voting is breaking US law, but the country they come from isn't declaring war on the US.
And before you say 'Non citizens voting doesn't happen, you racist!' yeah, it does
https://empowertexans.com/arou...
While the National Voter Registration Act (NVRA) requires local election officials to maintain accurate voter rolls, it also made it easier for non-citizens to get on the rolls by mandating that states offer voter registration by mail and at driver's license offices. Registering to vote is now an honor system, with no documentation required and no one verifying citizenship -- applicants merely check a box affirming they're U.S. citizens.
Birdwell asked Ingram what mechanisms the Secretary of State or county voter registration officials have to ensure that non-citizens aren't registering to vote. "Only the jury summons," Ingram responded. State law requires jury clerks to report to elections officials all individuals who claim an exemption to jury duty because they are not citizens.
"The Secretary of State's office's only way to ensure non-citizens aren't voting is the random sampling of a jury duty summons?" Birdwell asked.
"That is correct," Ingram replied.
If a non-citizen never gets summoned to jury duty or doesn't respond to a summons, Birdwell asked, "you have no mechanism to correct that wrong?"
"That's right," Ingram confirmed.
"We have no active method [to ensure non-citizens aren't registering to vote]. We depend on the self-reporting of the individual," Birdwell concluded. "That is a significant problem."
Texas Scorecard reported on those findings last month. A brief survey of four Texas counties found that in just the past two years, 165 unlawfully registered non-citizens were removed from those counties' voter rolls -- but only after they self-identified as non-citizens in the process of recusing themselves from jury duty. Those non-citizens cast 100 illegal votes.
Worse, the AG's investigators found that "the process for removing ineligible voters who self-report as non-citizens at jury duty is not being followed correctly, or even at all, in various counties."
Curious is it not how when a few Russians spend a few hundred thousand dollars in an election where the total spending was $6.5 billion that means Russia committed an 'act of war' against the US and anyone who disagrees is a traitor. When only 834,000 non citizens vote in a US election, that's not enough to explain Hillary's popular vote lead so we should ignore it. And that demanding people provide proof of citizenship before they buy Facebook ads is something the US must do to protect the integrity of its elections but trying to prevent hundreds of thousands of non citizens voting is racist.
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Voter ID would be a fine thing if it was really intended to prevent voter fraud and would work to do so. It's not. It's intended as a way to make it harder for poor people to vote, so that fewer votes are cast for the opponents of those who're promoting Voter ID.
It's not intended to be racist of course. It's intended to be a strike against those living in poor neighborhoods, who can't afford the expense of proving their citizenship and the time off work or away from family needed to jump through the Voter ID hoops.
It's easy to do something about people buying Facebook ads. Doing this will help improve election integrity. This is a good use of resources since it costs next to nothing and hurts no legitimate voters. Voter ID would be expensive, difficult, and would disenfranchise more valid voters than it would prevent illegal voters. It's a crap solution that breaks more than it fixes, and doesn't deserve the effort it would require.
far left leaning liberal progressive
I've followed The_Donald since early 2016 as a hostile observer and it is clear to me that they don't know what any of these words mean. Not in the political sense.
Almost the entire Democratic party is centrist. Google "new democrats". Bill Clinton set them on this path. The party has become both neoliberal (free-market capitalist) and neoconservative (American exceptionalism, interventionist foreign policy).
They are very much NOT leftist, NOT liberal, NOT progressive. Those words have all become meaningless, because people are still using them to describe the Democrats, when they are very much none of those things any more.
They didn't "get into" it, as per the headline. They just signed up, as anyone can, and posted. That's the whole point of Reddit.
Anyway, we all know that inside every Russian troll is another, slightly smaller, Russian troll.
systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
Thos are puoprposeful acts, and believe me brother I declare those acts of war.
Yeah but they're not. I realise that since you don't care about spelling and grammar you also probably don't care about legal niceties but everyone else does.
Awating your next howaboutism, tovarish.
It's whataboutism and tovarishch
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I come for the girls and the free food.
You are welcome on my lawn.
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Kind of seems like cause for action, no?
Are you just going to sit around as every aspect of discourse is conformed to the same model?
Bullshit. All the polls say that Hispanics are much more likely to vote Democrat than Republican. Which is why the Republicans want voter ID laws and Democrats say they're racist.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fac...
As Congress debates immigration reform, some political leaders and analysts have speculated that there will be "an electoral bonanza for Democrats" if the nation's estimated 11.1 million unauthorized immigrants -- three quarters of whom are Hispanics -- eventually are granted the right to vote.
While there's no way of knowing if these predictions are accurate, the data provide some insights. In 2012, the Pew Research Center's National Survey of Latinos found that among Latino immigrants who are not U.S. citizens or legal permanent residents (and therefore likely unauthorized immigrants), some 31% identify as Democrats and just 4% as Republicans. An additional 33% say they are political independents, 16% mention some other political party and 15% say they "don't know" or refuse to answer the question.
When one takes party "leaners" into account (i.e., those who don't say they identify with one of the major parties, but in a follow-up question say they feel closer to one party than the other), about half of unauthorized Hispanic immigrants either identify with (31%) or lean towards (23%) the Democratic Party, while about two-in-ten identify with (4%) or lean towards (15%) the Republican Party. About a quarter (27%) do not identify with or lean towards either party.
Comparing unauthorized immigrant Hispanics with other Hispanic subgroups suggests that as immigrants move closer towards citizenship, it is likely that a greater share of them will identify with one of the major political parties. Our survey found that most legal permanent residents (57%) and foreign-born U.S. citizens (65%) are affiliated with one of the major parties.
Our research has also found a correlation between the amount of time Hispanic immigrants (regardless of legal status) spend in the United States and the share that identifies with a political party. While nearly two-thirds (63%) of Hispanic immigrants who have been in the U.S. at least 15 years identify with one of the two major parties, that share falls to 38% among those who have been in the U.S. for fewer than 15 years.
The predictions about how unauthorized immigrants will vote stem from the fact that among all Latino immigrants who are eligible to vote (i.e. are U.S. citizens) many more identify as Democrats than as Republicans -- 54% versus 11%. And in the 2012 presidential election, according to the National Election Pool, Latino voters favored Democrat Barack Obama over Republican Mitt Romney by 71%-27%. While Democratic candidates have garnered a greater share of the Hispanic vote than Republican candidates in every election over the past three decades, the gap has been narrower in some elections than others. For example, in the 2004 election the gap among Hispanic votes between John Kerry and George W. Bush was only 18 percentage points (58% vs. 40%), compared with the 44 percentage point gap in the 2012 election.
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What can I say? Illegal voting is the only way Republicans can win in Texas.
Obviously you've never been to rural Texas before.
I have often thought that one category of Trump supporters is low information voters.
You are a classic example of that.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
Did you know there are quite a lot of Russian illegal immigrants in Texas? I'm serious. If you go to most construction sites in Houston, Dallas, Ft Worth, you will meet some of them.
How do you know the "100" illegal votes that were supposedly cast by immigrants according to your fake article weren't all cast by Russian immigrants voting Republican? You don't, and you know why? Because the State of Texas didn't prosecute those 100 for voting illegally. And by the way, did I mention that the "empowered texas" site is fake news?
The only person prosecuted in the recent past for voting illegally in Texas was a green card holder who supported Republicans and voted for Trump.
http://www.star-telegram.com/n...
You are welcome on my lawn.
I've lived in Texas. And the only immigrant who has been prosecuted for illegal voting in Texas has been a Trump supporting Republican.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/0...
You are welcome on my lawn.
Except there was no research involved. Nothing but a set of assumptions made by a person and then conclusions made based upon those assumptions with absolutely no data involved. Read your article again, Hal.
Even President Trump's much-vaunted super-special commission on illegal voting in the 2016 election which was headed by Kris Kobach was abruptly disbanded in shame when they found zero evidence that there had been any illegal voting.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/0...
You are welcome on my lawn.
The AC does have a point though. Voter ID laws on the face of it are a good idea. The problem is that it is easy to manipulate the ID requirements to disenfranchise chunks of the population.
Here in Canada, we've had voter ID laws for a long time. Generally they worked well until the last Federal election where the Conservatives were in power and getting coaching from the American Republican party on how to do it right.
Used to be that most ID was good enough, perhaps combined with some bills with your address and name on it and the ability to do an affidavit when the ID wasn't good enough. Last election, they limited the type of ID required and did a few other weird things. For example, my wife has always voted under her maiden name, partially due to her ID being in that name, and that is how she was registered. Went to the elections web site and double checked our registration, everything was fine, even the day before the election. Went to vote and mysteriously her registration had changed to my name. As this was expected due to her race, we showed up with marriage license, lots of ID and time. After a couple of hours on the phone to Ottawa, she did manage to vote. Meanwhile, I had no problem voting even though my ID just proved my residency, not my citizenship, unlike hers which was only available to citizens.
Voter ID laws are just easy to manipulate. Make it hard and ideally expensive to get ID (need to drive 40 miles here to pay $75 for ID), be really anal about the ID and disenfranchise people, especially the poor, university students who are resident somewhere but don't bother updating their ID, demand actual street addresses to remove those living in places without addresses such as Indian reservations and such and you limit voting to the correct people, including wealthier non-citizens.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
I wonder how much time Cheney spends kicking himself these days. Why go through all the trouble of faking evidence of Saddam's WMD's when he could have made a series of vague, ever-changing series of assertions and people would just suck that shit up with a straw?
Ah yes, when reminded that your sins are infinitely greater than the thing you criticize you whine like a bitch to deflect from your hypocrisy.
Prove it. Russiagate is real long on assertions and non-existent on facts. Like the whackjobs that insist to this day that Obama wasn't born in Hawaii and has a fake birth certificate.
FTFY. The notion that a few trolls swung an election with a few thousand dollars in ads, many of which were placed after the election and nothing to do with politics, in a race where one candidate spent over a billion dollars just proves the capacity of human beings to engage in willful dumbfuckery.
No collusion, no Russiagate. It doesn't matter if Putin himself came over and hacked voting machines to deny Hillary the vote, if there is no collusion with Trump then Mueller has no basis for his witch hunt.
So are the Clintons - that doesn't mean that they had Vince Foster murdered. It's amazing how Russiagate turns a bunch of otherwise rational people into a bunch of mouth breathers.
Ah yes, the one thing that is a pretty sure bet whenever Russia comes up in the news in a none positive way is whataboutism.
It is not just about whataboutism. It is also about setting a precedent for censorship and thought control. We have gone from "Congress shall make no law ..." to "Censorship is okay if the speaker is Russian". The next step is a prohibition on speech by other "bad people". Anyone who stands up to defend the scoundrels is obviously one of them.
Some people may be "fooled' by a troll, but with zero consequence..
It's like claiming that some people now crave pictures of assholes because they fell for a Goatse link on Slashdot.
I mean, really.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
So you tell me the DNC is centrist liberal. They stand for:
Open borders with no limits on immigration
Protecting felons/murders who are here illegaly so they don't have a chance to be deported
Preventing middle class from getting any possible relief on taxes
Promoting regulation and policies that destroy middle class jobs and lifestyle
Pay rogue nations developing nuclear weapons billions of dollars
Come down hard on nations like Israel who defend themselves from terrorist, while attempting to help the terrorists
Take millions and millions in bribes from countries like Russia to set State Department policy to help Russia
Abuse FISA warrants and intelligence to spy on US citizens illegally
This is what the DNC has stood for over the last few years. They are centerist? I take centerist to mean they have policies that the majority of the country would agree with. I literally don't know a SINGLE PERSON who supports DNC policies as they are enacted.
Yes there is research and I linked to it here
http://www.judicialwatch.org/w...
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Even the author of your research says that Judicial Watch's interpretation (and math) are wrong.
https://www.wired.com/2017/01/...
Also, remember this entire research is based on an opt-in online survey. In other words, as evidence of voter fraud, it's pretty much horseshit.
You are welcome on my lawn.
"Well, it's clear that Mr. Putin has a plan, and that plan includes not just the use of his military but also cyberattacks, disinformation, support for fringe political groups, the weaponization (ph) of energy resources, organized crime and corruption, all of that to compromise democratic institutions. His primary target is Europe. He's trying to influence countries particularly where there is Russian-speaking populations but also Western Europe. And he's also been interested in the United States, as we saw in the 2016 election."
- Ben Cardin of the US Senate Foreign Relations Committee
“So I have a very simple message for Russia. We know what you are doing. And you will not succeed,”
- Theresa May
So's the idea that the moon landings were faked. Lunar conspiracy theorists can also rattle off a long series of talking points that fail to withstand any degree of scrutiny.
Then you'll have no problem with laying off the McCarthyite dipshittery and proving your case, then.
Judicial Watch just linked to his original paper and even your article says this
Here's what the math should look like (that is, if Richman's initial study was accurate -- which many researchers doubt). If 6.4 percent of the estimated 20.3 million noncitizens in the US voted, and if just 81.8 percent of them voted for Clinton (the percentage who voted for Obama in his 2008 study), that's an added margin of a little more than 835,000 votes. In other words: Even with all of those supposedly fraudulent ballots, Clinton still would have won the popular vote by more than 2 million votes.
Exactly what I said. And Richman stands by his study and defended it here
https://www.washingtonpost.com...
It's true he wrote this article attacking the way his research has been used
https://fs.wp.odu.edu/jrichman...
This post is not intended to make a specific claim on my part concerning how many non-citizens voted in 2016. It has a much narrower aim. My goal was to show that an extrapolation from my coauthored work on the 2008 election to the 2016 election did not support the arguments some seemed to be making that the entire popular vote margin for Clinton was due to illegal votes by non-citizens. In this post I do my own calculation of that extrapolation for the purpose of demonstrating that this extrapolation would not support that claim.
So what he's saying is that if you use his estimate of 834,318 non citizen votes to claim that that was less than Clinton's 2,235,663 popular vote lead that's fine with him. If however you use his estimate of 834,318 non citizen votes to say that non citizen votes are significant problem with US elections that's not. Because the media and the Democrats - like there's any difference - have both dogpiled him to get him to stop publishing research with that inconvenient truth in it.
Also, remember this entire research is based on an opt-in online survey. In other words, as evidence of voter fraud, it's pretty much horseshit.
Bullshit. It's based on CCES. And he cross checked the CCES data against voter files. His 6.4% estimate is based on non citizens who claim they voted and who he'd actually checked did vote by looking at voter files.
https://www.washingtonpost.com...
In a forthcoming article in the journal Electoral Studies, we bring real data from big social science survey datasets to bear on the question of whether, to what extent, and for whom non-citizens vote in U.S. elections. Most non-citizens do not register, let alone vote. But enough do that their participation can change the outcome of close races.
Our data comes from the Cooperative Congressional Election Study (CCES). Its large number of observations (32,800 in 2008 and 55,400 in 2010) provide sufficient samples of the non-immigrant sub-population, with 339 non-citizen respondents in 2008 and 489 in 2010. For the 2008 CCES, we also attempted to match respondents to voter files so that we could verify whether they actually voted.
How many non-citizens participate in U.S. elections? More than 14 percent of non-citizens in both the 2008 and 2010 samples indicated that they were registered to vote. Furthermore, some of these non-citizens voted. Our best guess, based upon extrapolations from the portion of the sample with a verified vote, is that 6.4 percent of non-citizens voted in 2008 and 2.2 percent of non-citizens voted in 2010.
You need to stop consuming Democrat fake news mate!
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
I'm not going to convince him, but I might convince some of the people reading this thread that non citizen voting is a significant problem in the US.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
No. It was a choice between a somewhat corrupt but interesting and amusing clownish real estate developer and an extraordinarily and extremely corrupt but mind numbingly boring politician who just happened to be a woman. Both exist on,y through family inheritance. He was given tons of raw hard cash. She was married to a former president and stole tons of raw hard cash. Neither would be anyone on their own. Washing my dishes, if they're lucky, without those family connections.
What it came down to if he was different and she ran the dumbest campaign EVER.
There you are, trying to divide us into warring camps again. We are all Americans. We stand together, strong, against those who would divide us. You are either a paid shill or an unpaid agent of Moscow. Either way, you're the enemy of the American people, Ivan.
How did you guess my name?
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
3 or so years ago it was a running joke that Russian "infiltrators" were running around Slashdot, with obvious bias, trying to steer conversations around in the comments section. Suddenly, in 2018, that joke is seen is absurd, not happening, never ever, not on THIS website, and how dare you for suggesting!
One wonders if they actually won the Slashdot "battle" when no one was noticing.
Hail, Comrade. How is St. Petersburg this time of year?
hookers and grits.
What you provided was propaganda about Russian propaganda:
1) Russia had an existing base in Crimea. If moving troops through that base is an "invasion", then the United States invades the fuck out of Germany many times each year in its 20+ military bases in that country.
2) The US overthrew the elected government of Ukraine. Anyone who leaves that fact out of the discussion is a sophist of the highest order, spitting out propaganda.
3) After overthrowing the Ukrainian government, the U.S. started moving to give the junta weapons and eventually join NATO. If the USSR had overthrown Canada and brought it into the Warsaw Pact, it's not as if the US would sit around with its thumb up its ass.
The article is propaganda about propaganda. I copied and pasted a paragraph and responded to it directly - did you even look at your own link?
If the USSR had overthrown Canada and brought it into the Warsaw Pact, it's not as if the US would sit around with its thumb up its ass.
^ repeated for those engaging in so much willful dumbfuckery they can't see a straight up cause & effect scenario when it's in front of their face.
Card skimming and pestering people to buy flowers when they're trying to have a quiet drink.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
The occasional individual non-citizen voting isn't the problem. The problem is organized foreign groups trying to influence American politics. AIPAC is a much better example of what's wrong than the occasional mexican citizen voting.
They are very much NOT leftist, NOT liberal, NOT progressive. Those words have all become meaningless,
They were meaningless a century ago, if not more. Political parties are all about choosing a side and helping "your side" win. Partisans have a bad name for that reason.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Must have been Ivana, because it's pretty obvious Melania voted for Hillary.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
You are relentless. Trying to avoid getting nerve gassed like the guy in the UK?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
if there is no collusion with Trump then Mueller has no basis for his witch hunt.
So if there was only collusion with many of Trump's staffers that would be prefectly fine because there was no collusion with Trump? Really?
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Other nationalities shouldn't be allowed to make funny memes or comments about US politics either, as that would interfere in the same way as Russians.
Completely invisible to public is a spectacular economy jumpstart in 2017
You mean the economy jumpstart that looks exactly like following the trendlines from the past several years of Obama's presidency? Yes, good job Trump on not completely fucking up the economy yet. Give him time; he's working on it.
Major censorship. Absolutely horrendous. And you know it. Banning people for making statements that don't fit the leftists ideologies. The CEO of Reddit changing user posts. Banning groups. Allowing people to scream things like execute Trump and Jr. for treason while muting and banning people for pointing that very fact out. I've seen it all. Reddit has become a horrendous cesspool even if they are still allowing some controversy.
You can lead a man with reason but you can't make him think.
Does free speech cover Russian government paid for propaganda, done by people posing as ordinary Americans
If you can find an exception for Russians when the Constitution says "no law", please let me know.
... and spreading false information to influence an American election
You mean like how the Russians leaked info about the DNC colluding with Hillary to cheat Bernie out of the nomination? Except that turned out to be true.
The Bill of Rights doesn't apply to foreign citizens on foreign soil, so your slippery slope argument is misplaced.
Bullcrap. The Bill of Rights says Congress shall make NO LAW abridging freedom of speech. It says nothing about an exception for foreigners.
And there's as much evidence to suggest that as there is that one of the Clinton's staffers shot Vince Foster.
Really.
Trying to avoid human extinction brought on purely, utterly and entirely from Western Exceptionalist assholes. The evidence of the U.S. and its allies fucking with the rest of the world and Russia in particular could fill an encyclopedia set. As opposed to the evidence of Russian "meddling" in the US 2016 election, which thus far is non-existent.
Or the other 30 or so close associates just died from suicide by gun, random robbery gone bad, just plain murder.
I gotta admit, whoever writes your material is very good at it. They must have studied in a Western University.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Reddit is notorious for pervasive, aggressive Chinese-style censorship. They have zero credibility. Why does anyone believe a word they say?
Which would turn the US into a one party state with no borders and an economy like Venezuela.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
Your best arguemnt is "oh but Clinton!".
Read your own post. You argued that unless it was Trump himself colluding then there was no need for Meuller going about his "witch hunt". You are explicitly discounting any collusion from staffers as being important from a law enforcement point of view.
Oh but Clinton!
And that my man is why you're fucked.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Like the Russians don't already have that information.
SSN is not a private key!
You copy and paste that from a 2003 post, smearing an Iraq war skeptic as a Saddam supporter? And for that psyop they actually presented evidence - faked evidence, but they presented it at the UN. Now they aren't bothering with evidence at all, and people like you are eating their shit up with a spoon, and attacking anyone who doesn't join you for second and third helpings.
The invasion and occupation of Iraq has cost a million lives and trillions of dollars. Just WTF do you geniuses think the cost will be of a hot war with Russia?
Like the "Correct The Record" trolls spouting propaganda? That probably involved more money than what the Russians spent.
You first.
Uh, no. The point - which was clear enough the first time - that's there's as much evidence that Trump staffers colluded with Russia as there is that Clinton staffers shot Vince Foster. As in none. If you don't want to be compared to crazy nuts who believe asinine conspiracy theories without any evidence - then maybe you should find some evidence, eh?
FTFY. Everything Hillbots have accused Trump of Russia of doing, Hillary did, and did it first. From rigging an election (Democratic primary) to taking dirt on her opponent from Ukraine as well as Russia - even paying for it, unlike Trump.
Uh, no. The point - which was clear enough the first time - that's there's as much evidence t
That was the second post, ya numpty. Try reading the FIRST one I responded to. The one where you said:
The only criterion you gave was Trump's actions. Ergo, you consider the actions of the staffers unimportant. Don't try to fob me off with tangents, that is what you said: only Trump's actions matter.
Saying there's no evidence against staffers means you are admitting tacitly that their actions do matter, else why would evidence be relevant?
From rigging an election (Democratic primary)
Bernie lost fair and square. He's not a Democrat, he's an independent (always was) so it's not surprising that the Dem faithfuls voted for a long term Dem. Oh sorry I forgot you're a Trumpanzee conspiracy theorist. But that's a tautology, innit.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Eh. When you know as many people as the Clinton's have, the chances of a number of them having crazy deaths is pretty high. Kind of like the list of Power Ranger actors that have died at young ages from accidents, illnesses or even landed in prison for murder. There isn't a "curse" on the show, just a natural effect of a huge number of people being involved in a long running franchise.
That said, Russiagaters everywhere need to have this, Vince Foster, and the alleged heroin smuggling operation the Clintons ran thrown in their faces on a daily basis. They keep bringing out the "where there's smoke, there's fire" line on Russian collusion, but the Clintons have more smoke than Trump does.
None whatsoever, but that doesn't stop them. Curious, though, that they only whine about supposed interference to supposedly help Trump. They DGAF about the Hillary campaign engaging in all the same activities, or a single rich Chinese couple spending $1.3 million to get Jeb elected.
Yep - clickbait to lure people in and make money from ads. Same kind of business that sites from Raw Story to TMZ engage in.
The people who accepted that the election happened, and that one side won, and are carrying on with their lives are a large majority.
Wow. And in what other ways should these 'other nationalities' be prohibited from expressing public opinions?
While completely ignoring the fact that the Ukrainian government was overthrown by the United States or the fact that Russia already had a base in Crimea. Would you find a Japanese historian reasonable if he wrote a book bitching, moaning and crying about the American invasion of Iwo Jima while completely omitting Pearl Harbor?
If you choose to be willfully blind to support your narrative, that's your call, but you can't expect Russians (or anyone with a functioning cerebral cortex) to do the same on behalf of your propaganda.
Which of course they are.
If Russia is "invading" Crimea when moving troops through an existing base, then so too is the United States when moving troops through existing bases in Germany. Or the UK. Or Japan. Or Italy. Or Saudi Arabia. This isn't a hard subject to grasp - were you dropped on the head as a child, early and often?
Remedial cause and effect is the opposite of a red herring.
What's wrong about accepting a vote to succeed from a nation overthrown by literal Neo-Nazis?
Willful.
Dumbfuckery.
Hysterical pedantry. No collusion, no Russiagate. As there is nothing approaching even probable suspicion that there was collusion between Trump and Russia - or his staffers for the exceptionally retentive - then there is no Russiagate.
Laughable. Long before we knew about the Hillary Victory Fund money laundering, before union leaders ignored their membership and endorsed Mrs. Nafta, before we knew about the 200,000 voters illegally stripped from rolls in Brooklyn, before the "Bernie's so black" smear campaign, before we knew Hillary outright owned and ran the DNC or it argued in open court it had the right to rig primaries, we knew the slashed debate schedule was created to prevent a repeat of 2008. Where an unkown first-term senator beat the biggest name in Democratic politics like a rented mule. Because the more voters see Hillary Clinton, the less they like her. Everything the DNC did was to avoid a repeat of 2008, so HRC could coast to an easy coronation.
MAGA baby!
Good luck with that friend.
Whoosh.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Oh please you can do better than that. Dig deeper into the playbook.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
It's not about nationality, but foreign governments spreading propaganda aimed at subverting democracy, targetting communities which lap it up and spread it forward. This should be troubling to everyone.
When I lived in California, one of the senators attempted to pass a bill that would allow illegal aliens to vote. (This man has since passed away.) I remember thinking we should therefore allow absentee ballots to the Russians. Funny how the absurdity of one era gets more absurd over time.
No, instead we should just imprison anyone repeating known lies
Just so simple
No, they did not.
They said Hillary by 3%
And that is how much she WON BY!
"less propaganda"
So you didn't even read the article, about Russian PROPAGANDA flooding social media in favor of tRump.
No collusion, no Russiagate.
Basically you are refusing to state whether you do or do not think it's a crime if Trump staffers colluded with the Russians. IOW You think they did, are glad they did but don't want to admit it.
As there is nothing approaching even probable suspicion that there was collusion between Trump and Russia
Hysterical deflection. This has no relevance on whether or not his staffers colluding is a problem.
Laughable.
Of course, you would laugh at the truth, wouldn't you?
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Great, you'll have no problems listing them. Oh, you can't? Insert eye roll emoji here.
They most certainly can, given that they have nothing to do with Russia stealing the election or colluding with Trump to do so.
You sound like James Risen, who was in a debate with Greenwald who said about 15 times he wanted hard evidence for this conspiracy theory given the lies told in the past from the same people pushing Russiagate. Risen responded not with evidence, but haranguing Greenwald about what his personal beliefs were on Trump and Russia.
Like Greenwald, I'm an atheist and I don't have to believe anything. Belief is for religion - current events are matter of facts. So until Russian collusion is a proven fact, you may as well speculate what will happen if one of Trump's aids turns out to be a child molester or a cannibal. It's a free country, you can believe whatever you want, but it puts you in the same territory as people who speculate that the moon landings were faked or that Obama was born in Kenya.
tl;dr: put up the evidence or stfu until you do
The truth where Sanders can walk into a room full of Trump voters and have them cheering for free health care and higher education in a matter of minutes? He was a no-name senator from a tiny-assed state. Against the entire party establishment, against the biggest name in party politics, against the media, Bernie should have lasted as long as Jim Webb or Laurence Lessig in the primary and dropped out with 5% of the vote at most. Not by winning 23 states and 43% of the vote despite the election being rigged in favor of another candidate.
So your projection is noted.
And it's "possible" that Obama was born in Kenya. Whoop de freaking do. The thing here, AC, is that you're believing in a narrative, and I'm an atheist. I don't do belief, I do facts. And so far - how many posts are we into this thread now? - you don't have any.
Yes, you are a wall. Evidence. Evidence.
Eh.
Vi.
Dense.
If you have any, you would be presenting it instead of just blowing more smoke. Like if I'm debating an Obamabot who's claiming that Obama was really a great guy who was just held back by a hostile GOP Congress, I will burry his dumb ass in facts. Facts like the Dem supermajority from '09-'11, or that the worst policies during his time in office came from Obama, not Republicans. And then list them.
Annnnnd this is where I burry your dumb ass with facts. After promising Gorbachev that NATO wouldn't expand eastward (so Germany's reunification wouldn't be vetoed), the hostile military alliance has nearly doubled in size and expanded right to Russia's borders. If that wasn't enough, Dubbya erected "missile shields" in eastern Europe to make it easier for the U.S. to launch a first nuclear strike on Russia and survive the retaliatory launches. Sure, they claimed it was for Iran, but not even Ray Charles is blind enough to buy that one, and he's dead.
Then Bush invaded a country on Russia's border, Obama overthrew another, and in the biggest act of chutzpah in history, levied sanctions against Russia in response to said American overthrow. Obama also deployed the largest number of troops seen in eastern Europe since WWII and started a trillion-dollar upgrade of America's nuclear arsenal. Hillary campaigned on shooting down Russian planes in Syria, where Russia has been invited but where the US has no business being. And now, Trump is sending the U.S. Navy to the Black Sea, which is the equivalent to Putin sending a carrier group the Gulf of Mexico 'in response to American aggression.' Of course the United States is the aggressor here. The whole in your head would have to be measured in light years to claim otherwise.
^This is what it looks when you can back back up your shit with facts and citations. When you Russiagaters can do the same, by all means let us know.
You sound like James Risen
And you sound like every politician ever: fundamentally dishonest.
You made a stupid claim, I am holding you to account for that claim and you vigorously respond by pretending you said something you think is easier to defend.
It's slashdot: you can't edit posts so it's there in writing what you said.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
Probably fake eh? The Texas Attorney General reported the exact same thing
https://www.texasattorneygener...
Attorney General Ken Paxton today announced that his office sent a letter to state Senator Bryan Hughes, the chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Election Integrity, announcing a significant voter fraud initiative and addressing key problems and policy areas related to election law. The Office of the Attorney General (OAG) also stands ready to assist Starr County District Attorney Omar Escobar in the fight against voter fraud, and fully supports his efforts to educate the countyâ(TM)s citizens on existing and amended voting laws.
The letter to Senator Hughes highlights the lack of safeguards in the voting system to detect ineligible voters, discusses additional potential measures to address to mail-in ballot fraud, and addresses the use of public funds for political activity. The letter also discusses a specific investigation of four counties where 165 unlawfully registered non-citizens had been removed from the voter rolls after casting 100 illegal votes in Texas elections in the last two years. The OAG also discovered that the legal process for removing ineligible voters who self-report is not being followed correctly, if at all, in various counties. Several investigations into ineligible voting and voter fraud are ongoing.
And then there's this memo from Jennifer Palmieri saying that getting DACA recipients to vote is crucial for Democrats
http://www.newsweek.com/daca-m...
A memo from a liberal-leaning advocacy group warning Democrats that they could fail in the 2018 midterm races if they can't strike a deal to protect "Dreamer" children of undocumented immigrants has conservatives accusing the party of playing politics with the lives of migrants.
The memo from Jennifer Palmieri, Hillary Clintonâ(TM)s former top aide and executive vice president for communications and advocacy for the Center for American Progress Action Fund, called on Democrats to make the fight for DACA recipients a âoemoral imperativeâ or else risk jeopardizing their chances in 2018.
âoeThe fight to protect Dreamers is not only a moral imperative, it is also a critical component of the Democratic Partyâ(TM)s future electoral success,â the memo reads
Or you believe Pope Ratho that the only non citizens voting are Russians voting for Trump.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
Yes ISIS and the Taliban are shaking in their boots. Let us know if you ever win Korea too.
You do realize the difference between total war and the Republican economy stimulous version of war don't you?
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
I see we reached the part of the conversation where you start blathering incoherently. If you could argue with any facts or reasoning, you would do so. But you can't, so you wont. Remember this when you're talking history with your grandkids and they ask you how people could be so unbelievably dumb as to by the Russiagate conspiracy theory, and you lie to them.