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Reporter Shares Experience of Visiting a Flat Earth Convention (vice.com)
Tom Usher, reporting for Vice: I arrived at the venue -- a Jurys Inn hotel -- on a wet Saturday morning, to discover that the event was essentially a small carpeted convention room boasting a few cameras, some stalls selling merchandise, and 70 or so attendees watching PowerPoint presentations beamed onto a wall. As I entered, I was offered a gift of "fluoride-free" toothpaste. This made perfect sense, given the location. A popular conspiracy theory states that governments across the world have been putting fluoride in our water supply to tranquilize the masses, despite the fact the only piece of "evidence" for this theory -- which involves both the Nazis and the Communists -- has been widely discredited. With the tone set for the day, I sat down to watch some speeches.
The speakers all seemed well aware of how "globe-earthers" view the idea of a flat Earth, i.e. ludicrous, and their talk of the current scientific establishment felt very "us versus them" -- a nice bit of truther tribalism. One speaker talked at length about the moon, and how its orbit proved the Earth couldn't be spherical, which seemed a little counterintuitive. Another talked about how the Egyptian pyramid structure points toward clues that the Earth is a flat diamond shape, supported by pillars. Between sounding off about the Vatican and the fact that the establishment has indoctrinated us to believe all sorts of things, including that the Earth is a sphere, a third speaker suggested that cancer is caused by negative emotions and argued that dinosaurs didn't exist. The story also explores why some people still believe these long-debunked theories. Further reading: The bizarre tale of the flat-Earth convention that fell apart (CNET).
The speakers all seemed well aware of how "globe-earthers" view the idea of a flat Earth, i.e. ludicrous, and their talk of the current scientific establishment felt very "us versus them" -- a nice bit of truther tribalism. One speaker talked at length about the moon, and how its orbit proved the Earth couldn't be spherical, which seemed a little counterintuitive. Another talked about how the Egyptian pyramid structure points toward clues that the Earth is a flat diamond shape, supported by pillars. Between sounding off about the Vatican and the fact that the establishment has indoctrinated us to believe all sorts of things, including that the Earth is a sphere, a third speaker suggested that cancer is caused by negative emotions and argued that dinosaurs didn't exist. The story also explores why some people still believe these long-debunked theories. Further reading: The bizarre tale of the flat-Earth convention that fell apart (CNET).
I'd say that anytime there is a duality of opinion, no matter how much evidence there is, you'll always find people on both sides.
I think we should be more concerned with the People Against Washing Hands Society.
Just like religions.
It's bizarre, isn't it?
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
Until they elect a gameshow host as president, start banning research, and screwing over everyone that doesn't kowtow.
I wonder how Trump is going to be remembered, once it isn't seen as important for half the population that he be seen as somehow respectable. In retrospect, most conservatives see George W. Bush as a big mistake... it'll be interesting to see how that pans out.
Why do we have to keep switching to these idiotic reactionary anti-science folks so often? What ideals does it serve? It always seems like such madness - madness yelling that it deserves respect as it disrespects everything else.
A popular conspiracy theory states that governments across the world have been putting fluoride in our water supply to tranquilize the masses,
I thought that was solved by television.
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
C'mon, I thought it was common knowledge that the whole "movement" is a giant troll-job aimed at getting just this kind of hand-wringing attention.
Stupidity combined with arrogance ("We know better!") will always be with the human race. There are far to many stupid people that do not understand what a "fact" is. Of course, cults of stupid depend on a majority that is a lot less stupid, or they do not survive. If they reach a certain size (e.g. the US as of today), they eventually self-destruct as ignoring reality is not sustainable on that scale.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
You see the great delusion is at work. Satan has tricked you into thinking that facts, evidence and thought are good things when we all know that that evidence and those facts have been created by Satan to deceive us. Now excuse me as I have to step onto the patio and wait for the goose that lays the golden eggs.
I'd say that anytime there is a duality of opinion, no matter how much evidence there is, you'll always find people on both sides.
Because otherwise there wouldn't be a duality of opinion?
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
The "Earth is a flat diamond shape, supported by pillars", is it? So what supports the pillars?
Garry Knight
Don't make conclusions until they are done with their jobs.
I like how you wrote that 2 sentences after you concluded:
There is however, clear evidence that Russia tried to influence the US election, and that people in the Trump campaign were involved in that.
Tautological assertions are true if tautologies.
It is the by-product of many industries and is toxic. Whatever research this OP is citing (source?) is horribly wrong. The CDC even acknowledges it is toxic. $5 says my comment gets deleted. Slashdot used to be full of smart people, what happened? Oh, a large news company bought it...
Anyone who doesn't understand flat-earth theory has never read Einstein. Of course, you have to read him in the original Hebrew before NASA censored the translation.
If the Earth were really flat, cats would have pushed everything off of the edge.
No, no one pled guilty to colluding with Russians about the election. Or anything close to that. No one has been charged with foreign influence of the election. There are specific laws against that, but no one has been charged under those laws.
Could we please stop celebrating and tolerating ignorance?
Thanks.
P.S. Just... literally... get a boat. Pick a direction - any direction. And keep going. Whether or not the Earth is flat will be proven within less than 80 days (and that was a long time ago, you can do it much quicker now).
If something's flat, it either has an edge, or it's infinite. You'll find out, to within a certain margin or error, in a couple of months of travelling, and have some great experiences along the way.
Either you'll never see the same place twice, or you'll fall off an end. Note: If you come back where you started, you're crap at navigation or the Earth is round. Both of which give you a pretty big hint that you shouldn't be formulating flat-Earth theories.
Or are we honestly claiming an infinitely long and wide self-repeating tiled plane?
Back when Galileo was talking about "orbits" and such, I'm sure he had the same pushback -- "you IDIOT, how stupid ARE you?". Enough so that the church kept him under house arrest until his death.
My point isn't that they're right, but they have an idea. Just like WE have an idea about spherical planets. So just like MOND vs dark matter, there's a debate (at least on their side.)
FINE. That's fine. *I* think the world is literally a cube from Superman's Bizarro World. So let's ALL make some predictions and observations and see what works. If you don't like an observation, fine, explain how it's wrong or produce a repeatable different one. But the more things a theory explains the "better" it is, right?
Spontaneous generation might still be proven right, but you'd better have everything absolutely perfect and repeatable to be accepted. I want the galaxies closer together -- AND a pony -- but wishing doesn't make it so. (So I guess I'll have to use astral projection to visit them instead of in person -- have to get the help of "expert" Shirley MaClaine for that one. Anyone have her phone number, or is she Out of Office / Body for awhile?)
Or is Flat Earth an unsupported belief AKA religion? "I don't care what you say, I know what's right." What, are they going to take their ball with an ant on top and go home?
If the universe is someone's simulation -- does that mean the stars are just stuck pixels?
No, no one was indicted under 52 U.S.C. 30121, which covers “meddling” in U.S. elections by foreign nationals.
There really are also modern concave Earthers, too...who no doubt tonight think they are looking up at China...
Fiona continued: "I think, being African Caribbean, you tend to live to a certain extent on the outskirts of mainstream society. It's something the majority of white people don't experience,"........That was probably the most reasonable thing I'd heard all day: If you've been marginalized and feel like you've been lied to by institutions and people you're supposed to automatically trust for much of your life, why should you trust what any of them have to say?
So to some of these people, it doesn't matter so much whether the earth is flat or round. They are there more to have a community of people they can relax with and feel good with. The science is secondary (or in this case, non-existent).
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
My point isn't that they're right, but they have an idea.
It's an idea which has been disproven. That makes clinging to it dumb.
So let's ALL make some predictions and observations and see what works. [...] Spontaneous generation might still be proven right,
Yeah, if your experiment was dumb enough. That's the problem with listening to EVERYONE. Some people you clearly don't listen to about anything. For example, if they think the earth is flat, you clearly don't need to listen to their theories on fluoridation. Even if fluoridation did turn out to be a commie plot, they wouldn't have been saying so for any logical reasons. They would have been accidentally right, and it still would have been dumb to listen to them. And god forbid ;) that you should get into the habit of listening to them because they were accidentally right, because then just imagine how far down the rabbit hole you could get!
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I'd say that anytime there is a duality of opinion, no matter how much evidence there is, you'll always find people on both sides.
Because otherwise there wouldn't be a duality of opinion?
Scientists have also determined if your parents did not have children, you probably won't either.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
So how do people come to believe this stuff?..... it was after watching some YouTube videos and realizing that "with all this movement, water stays flat, calm, and reflective to the point of being a perfect mirror, something that is not possible on a curve."
If someone said that to me, I would say, "Great! You are thinking outside the box, you are questioning Why?" That is how science starts. Then we would start doing experiments, showing that water can be flat in a curved dish, or discussing momentum in thought experiments (or even going out on a flatbed truck). Asking these kinds of questions is great, but you need to go beyond questioning and start experimenting. That is when your questions turn into discoveries and understanding.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
My point isn't that they're right, but they have an idea.
It's an idea which has been disproven. That makes clinging to it dumb.
So let's ALL make some predictions and observations and see what works. [...] Spontaneous generation might still be proven right,
Yeah, if your experiment was dumb enough. That's the problem with listening to EVERYONE. Some people you clearly don't listen to about anything.
There is an internet philosophy that has people bringing up disproven or dipshit theories, and screaming that other people have to disprove them. A really warped idea if "If you don't disprove me to my satisfaction, you prove that I am right!"
Well, I suppose these modern day Neanderthals paid zero attention in science class, but I remember ancient concepts like spontaneous generation and flat earth being discussed in class, and unless a person wasn't capable of critical thinking, they would catch on real early and quickly that the earth was spherical, and that animals don't pop out of nowhere. Note yes - we now know that the earth was an oblate spheroid and a little chunky at the center.
The biggest problem with the idea that we must exhaustively explain every debunked idea over and overandoverandover again for people who have exactly no intention of taking the telling is that we'll be stuck forever explaining things like say, the phlogiston theory, when in fact we've moved so far beyond that that it would be a waste of time. Read it in a book, and move on.
Especially in the age of the internet, a skeptic could set up an experiment with say 50 others of like mind across the globe. Do the old Erastothenes experiment but around a meridian line describing a circle.
But who am I fooling.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
There are some good quotes in the article, explaining the viewpoints of the people involved. This one:
Fiona continued: "I think, being African Caribbean, you tend to live to a certain extent on the outskirts of mainstream society. It's something the majority of white people don't experience,"........That was probably the most reasonable thing I'd heard all day: If you've been marginalized and feel like you've been lied to by institutions and people you're supposed to automatically trust for much of your life, why should you trust what any of them have to say?
So to some of these people, it doesn't matter so much whether the earth is flat or round. They are there more to have a community of people they can relax with and feel good with. The science is secondary (or in this case, non-existent).
I also read the implicit connotation that the oblate spheroid that the earth is claimed to be is to be consider a racist white concept? Who knew?
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
What religion were the Byzantines?
Since I actually have a clue what I'm talking about, I'll give you a hint: not Buddhists.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
That's not necessarily a bad thing. I used to be a member of a drinking club with a rugby problem.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
The part that I find funny is that it is simple to test the flat Earth theory... If the Earth is flat, then it must have edges right? It would be enough for one of these guys to get a boat and then navigate to find one of those edges. Or would they have some "fail-safe" theory to explain how a supposed flat Earth would have no edges?
If the world was flat, cats would have pushed everything off the edge by now.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.