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Reporter Shares Experience of Visiting a Flat Earth Convention (vice.com)
Tom Usher, reporting for Vice: I arrived at the venue -- a Jurys Inn hotel -- on a wet Saturday morning, to discover that the event was essentially a small carpeted convention room boasting a few cameras, some stalls selling merchandise, and 70 or so attendees watching PowerPoint presentations beamed onto a wall. As I entered, I was offered a gift of "fluoride-free" toothpaste. This made perfect sense, given the location. A popular conspiracy theory states that governments across the world have been putting fluoride in our water supply to tranquilize the masses, despite the fact the only piece of "evidence" for this theory -- which involves both the Nazis and the Communists -- has been widely discredited. With the tone set for the day, I sat down to watch some speeches.
The speakers all seemed well aware of how "globe-earthers" view the idea of a flat Earth, i.e. ludicrous, and their talk of the current scientific establishment felt very "us versus them" -- a nice bit of truther tribalism. One speaker talked at length about the moon, and how its orbit proved the Earth couldn't be spherical, which seemed a little counterintuitive. Another talked about how the Egyptian pyramid structure points toward clues that the Earth is a flat diamond shape, supported by pillars. Between sounding off about the Vatican and the fact that the establishment has indoctrinated us to believe all sorts of things, including that the Earth is a sphere, a third speaker suggested that cancer is caused by negative emotions and argued that dinosaurs didn't exist. The story also explores why some people still believe these long-debunked theories. Further reading: The bizarre tale of the flat-Earth convention that fell apart (CNET).
The speakers all seemed well aware of how "globe-earthers" view the idea of a flat Earth, i.e. ludicrous, and their talk of the current scientific establishment felt very "us versus them" -- a nice bit of truther tribalism. One speaker talked at length about the moon, and how its orbit proved the Earth couldn't be spherical, which seemed a little counterintuitive. Another talked about how the Egyptian pyramid structure points toward clues that the Earth is a flat diamond shape, supported by pillars. Between sounding off about the Vatican and the fact that the establishment has indoctrinated us to believe all sorts of things, including that the Earth is a sphere, a third speaker suggested that cancer is caused by negative emotions and argued that dinosaurs didn't exist. The story also explores why some people still believe these long-debunked theories. Further reading: The bizarre tale of the flat-Earth convention that fell apart (CNET).
A popular conspiracy theory states that governments across the world have been putting fluoride in our water supply to tranquilize the masses,
I thought that was solved by television.
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
C'mon, I thought it was common knowledge that the whole "movement" is a giant troll-job aimed at getting just this kind of hand-wringing attention.
Of course it's a delusion. The article tries to convince me that the convention took place in this mythical country that is supposedly upside down. But since there's no such thing, 'cause the Earth is flat, it couldn't have happened. Duh!
Ezekiel 23:20
I would call it instructive. It shows that most people do not manage to understand what Science is and what it can and cannot do, because they lack the mental capabilities to do so. It explains a few things about why so many things on this planet are so fucked up.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
The worst religion inspired violence in the world today is the ongoing genocide of the Rohingya. The perpetrators are Buddhist, not Muslim.
I'd say that anytime there is a duality of opinion, no matter how much evidence there is, you'll always find people on both sides.
Because otherwise there wouldn't be a duality of opinion?
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Were they shouting "Save the unborn" and bombing abortion clinics, because that's what the religious zealots do here. Before that, they shouted "Die Ni**er" and bombed black churches and neighborhoods.
Never seen a Muslim do either of those.
** Lameness Filter is Lame.
What planet you been on? Cuz the color of your sky ain't blue.
Here are the 10 countries where homosexuality may be punished by death
Here are the 10 countries where homosexuality may be punishable by death:
Yemen: According to the 1994 penal code, married men can be sentenced to death by stoning for homosexual intercourse. Unmarried men face whipping or one year in prison. Women face up to seven years in prison.
Iran: In accordance with sharia law, homosexual intercourse between men can be punished by death, and men can be flogged for lesser acts such as kissing. Women may be flogged.
Mauritania: Muslim men engaging in homosexual sex can be stoned to death, according to a 1984 law, though none have been executed so far. Women face prison.
Nigeria: Federal law classifies homosexual behavior as a felony punishable by imprisonment, but several states have adopted sharia law and imposed a death penalty for men. A law signed in early January makes it illegal for gay people countrywide to hold a meeting or form clubs.
Qatar: Sharia law in Qatar applies only to Muslims, who can be put to death for extramarital sex, regardless of sexual orientation.
Saudi Arabia: Under the country’s interpretation of sharia law, a married man engaging in sodomy or any non-Muslim who commits sodomy with a Muslim can be stoned to death. All sex outside of marriage is illegal.
Afghanistan: The Afghan Penal Code does not refer to homosexual acts, but Article 130 of the Constitution allows recourse to be made to sharia law, which prohibits same-sex sexual activity in general. Afghanistan’s sharia law criminalizes same-sex sexual acts with a maximum of the death penalty. No known cases of death sentences have been meted out since the end of Taliban rule in 2001.
Somalia: The penal code stipulates prison, but in some southern regions, Islamic courts have imposed sharia law and the death penalty.
Sudan: Three-time offenders under the sodomy law can be put to death; first and second convictions result in flogging and imprisonment. Southern parts of the country have adopted more lenient laws.
United Arab Emirates: Lawyers in the country and other experts disagree on whether federal law prescribes the death penalty for consensual homosexual sex or only for rape. In a recent Amnesty International report, the organization said it was not aware of any death sentences for homosexual acts. All sexual acts outside of marriage are banned.
Notice anything in common among those countries?
You have the balls to answer? I'm guessing no.
You're a fool. A stupid fucking fool. Was elementary school the best decade of your life.
Don't make conclusions until they are done with their jobs.
I like how you wrote that 2 sentences after you concluded:
There is however, clear evidence that Russia tried to influence the US election, and that people in the Trump campaign were involved in that.
Salem Witch Trials? Violence against interracial couples, same sex couples, anti-abortion bombings & shootings.... The only difference is that in western countries religions no longer control the government.
Don't know what you are talking about. Christians did wholesale mass-murder in the crusades, for example, in pretty much the mode you describe. There is no larger religion that has not done atrocities and justified them afterwards.
Because some group of murderous bastards did something 800 years ago you think we shouldn't be denouncing any current group of murderous bastards who does it now?
What most people fail to realise is that multiple and repeated surveys found that the majority of muslims *worldwide* support Sharia law.
When you refer to "moderate muslims" you are still talking about people who would ban gay relationships and use the force of law to punish homosexuals. The number of christians who support those sorts of laws is vanshingly small.
Stop apologising for homophobia. You should examine why you need to go back hundreds of years to find anything comparative in primitiveness to Islam.
I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
If the Earth were really flat, cats would have pushed everything off of the edge.
Nobody expects -- oops, sorry.
Back when Galileo was talking about "orbits" and such, I'm sure he had the same pushback -- "you IDIOT, how stupid ARE you?". Enough so that the church kept him under house arrest until his death.
My point isn't that they're right, but they have an idea. Just like WE have an idea about spherical planets. So just like MOND vs dark matter, there's a debate (at least on their side.)
FINE. That's fine. *I* think the world is literally a cube from Superman's Bizarro World. So let's ALL make some predictions and observations and see what works. If you don't like an observation, fine, explain how it's wrong or produce a repeatable different one. But the more things a theory explains the "better" it is, right?
Spontaneous generation might still be proven right, but you'd better have everything absolutely perfect and repeatable to be accepted. I want the galaxies closer together -- AND a pony -- but wishing doesn't make it so. (So I guess I'll have to use astral projection to visit them instead of in person -- have to get the help of "expert" Shirley MaClaine for that one. Anyone have her phone number, or is she Out of Office / Body for awhile?)
Or is Flat Earth an unsupported belief AKA religion? "I don't care what you say, I know what's right." What, are they going to take their ball with an ant on top and go home?
If the universe is someone's simulation -- does that mean the stars are just stuck pixels?
Don't know what you are talking about. Christians did wholesale mass-murder in the crusades, for example, in pretty much the mode you describe. There is no larger religion that has not done atrocities and justified them afterwards.
Totes adorbs, TODAY'S Islam:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation
You need to grow a brain.
FGM isn't a problem with Islam, it's a problem with a specific region of Africa. It's true there's a fairly high correlation between Muslim Africa and FGM Africa, but it's not perfect. In Nigeria it's actually the Christians, not the Muslims, who are the problem.
That's really the problem when trying to generalize religions, even among people who claim the same label you find a whole bunch of different groups with wildly different beliefs, especially with things like religion where there's not a lot of evidence to rally people around certain foundations.
That's also the reason things like Flat Earth Conventions end up so chaotic, when you're so detached from reality that you're a Flat Earther it's almost random the collection of beliefs that you end up grabbing. Gather a bunch together in one place you're bound to get some equally wild ideas on other subjects that aren't shared by all present, in-fighting is almost inevitable.
I stole this Sig
The difference is the teachings of Christianity don't support those things.
Pick up The Holy Bible and read it. Once that Jesus guy turns up, things change.
My point isn't that they're right, but they have an idea.
It's an idea which has been disproven. That makes clinging to it dumb.
So let's ALL make some predictions and observations and see what works. [...] Spontaneous generation might still be proven right,
Yeah, if your experiment was dumb enough. That's the problem with listening to EVERYONE. Some people you clearly don't listen to about anything.
There is an internet philosophy that has people bringing up disproven or dipshit theories, and screaming that other people have to disprove them. A really warped idea if "If you don't disprove me to my satisfaction, you prove that I am right!"
Well, I suppose these modern day Neanderthals paid zero attention in science class, but I remember ancient concepts like spontaneous generation and flat earth being discussed in class, and unless a person wasn't capable of critical thinking, they would catch on real early and quickly that the earth was spherical, and that animals don't pop out of nowhere. Note yes - we now know that the earth was an oblate spheroid and a little chunky at the center.
The biggest problem with the idea that we must exhaustively explain every debunked idea over and overandoverandover again for people who have exactly no intention of taking the telling is that we'll be stuck forever explaining things like say, the phlogiston theory, when in fact we've moved so far beyond that that it would be a waste of time. Read it in a book, and move on.
Especially in the age of the internet, a skeptic could set up an experiment with say 50 others of like mind across the globe. Do the old Erastothenes experiment but around a meridian line describing a circle.
But who am I fooling.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
There are some good quotes in the article, explaining the viewpoints of the people involved. This one:
Fiona continued: "I think, being African Caribbean, you tend to live to a certain extent on the outskirts of mainstream society. It's something the majority of white people don't experience,"........That was probably the most reasonable thing I'd heard all day: If you've been marginalized and feel like you've been lied to by institutions and people you're supposed to automatically trust for much of your life, why should you trust what any of them have to say?
So to some of these people, it doesn't matter so much whether the earth is flat or round. They are there more to have a community of people they can relax with and feel good with. The science is secondary (or in this case, non-existent).
I also read the implicit connotation that the oblate spheroid that the earth is claimed to be is to be consider a racist white concept? Who knew?
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
That's not necessarily a bad thing. I used to be a member of a drinking club with a rugby problem.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."