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Comey, Who Investigated Hillary Clinton For Using Personal Email For Official Business, Used His Personal Email For Official Business (buzzfeed.com)
An anonymous reader shares a report: Former FBI Director James Comey, who led the investigation into Hillary Clinton's use of personal email while secretary of state, also used his personal email to conduct official business, according to a report from the Justice Department on Thursday. The report also found that while Comey was "insubordinate" in his handling of the email investigation, political bias did not play a role in the FBI's decision to clear Clinton of any criminal wrongdoing.
The report from the office of the inspector general "identified numerous instances in which Comey used a personal email account (a Gmail account) to conduct FBI business." In three of the five examples, investigators said Comey sent drafts he had written from his FBI email to his personal account. In one instance, he sent a "proposed post-election message for all FBI employees that was entitled 'Midyear thoughts,'" the report states. In another instance, Comey again "sent multiple drafts of a proposed year-end message to FBI employees" from his FBI account to his personal email account.
The report from the office of the inspector general "identified numerous instances in which Comey used a personal email account (a Gmail account) to conduct FBI business." In three of the five examples, investigators said Comey sent drafts he had written from his FBI email to his personal account. In one instance, he sent a "proposed post-election message for all FBI employees that was entitled 'Midyear thoughts,'" the report states. In another instance, Comey again "sent multiple drafts of a proposed year-end message to FBI employees" from his FBI account to his personal email account.
Well... I'll never! Color me shocked ... shocked, I TELL YOU!
What I don't understand about Comey is that he all but threw the election to Trump while panning Trump left and right.
That was the issue with Clinton. Handling classified material improperly. Bid difference.
I don't respond to or upvote ACs
Strzok and Page also used personal email to conduct FBI business. And yes, it was probably illegal - their work-related communications must be subject to FOIA’s disclosure provisions.
I do not belong to the church of the lowercase 'i'
Cybersecurity needs to be a real concern in Washington, for everyone, regardless of party. This tit for tat thing will only backfire since everyone is guilty.
Who the hell _cares_?
Can we maybe talk about how Trump's administration is moving to end protections for pre-existing conditions? That's kinda big news if you're a human being with a body.
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The OIG report also says Comey claims he didn't know Anthony Weiner was married to Clinton's chief of staff Huma Abedin...
Director of the FBI.
I've long suspected that use of personal email accounts is so rampant in government that if the FBI did prosecute, half of congress would be torn between destroying their own emails and trying to dig up anything the other party sent them from a person address. It's only a big deal with it can be turned into a political weapon.
Go back to the Bush administration and Colin Powell had a personal server too... and he too used it for business... .. but, but, but, but, but ..... HILLARY!!!!
1,2,3 the righties scream
Meanwhile the IG report drops and results in no new indictments, no firings... a big nothing burger... yawn.
But he's still subject to the same records retention laws that Clinton was willfully subverting.
so nothing confidential at all, just employee memo drafts?
But the scope and the scale matter.
But he's still subject to the same records retention laws that Clinton was willfully subverting.
And how would sending an email from his official FBI account to a personal Gmail account subvert any record retention laws? In one case there are no records retained in government servers, in the other case there are. This does not sound like the same thing. Possible leaking of secure information is another matter, but that is not the main problem from my understanding.
-- ssoorrrryy,, dduupplleexx sswwiittcchh oonn.. -Quote found on actual fortune cookie.
Ok
Clinton wasn't accused of using personal email for business. She was accused of transmitting top secret documents over unsecured personal email (very illegal), and using personal email to communicate state business secretly outside of officially logged and recorded channels (also illegal).
Is this what Comey is accused of? If not, everyone can fuck off with their "he did it too" shit.
"Prediction: within 10 years, Windows will be a Linux distribution." Me, 7-6-2016
You jest. But the discussion is already filled with ACs who'd just as soon see someone dead than be civil about their political opponents.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
(U) Comey was investigated former Secretary of State Clinton for her handling of classified materials.
(U) Unclassified materials were found on an insecure personal server that she had set up to work from home
(U) She claimed that she had no knowledge that any of the documents on that server were classified -- meaning some variety of confidential (C), secret (S), or (most likely at her level) top secret (TS). She believed it was all unclassified (U)
(U) Her claim is fucking ridiculous, because in classified documents every page, heading, sentence, and bullet point, and source reference is preceded by note just like this: (U) (FOUO) (C) (S) (TS)
(U) Is this painful to read? This is the sort of thing that she claims was missing from her documents.
(U) You can't get such documents off of the secure network. To get such documents on her private server, she or a lackey uploaded them.
(U) For her story to carry water, she would need someone with clearance level similar to hers to print, re-type, scan, and emailed her such documents, all while lying to her about doing so.
(U) She fucked up. Badly. It may have hurt her chance to become the de facto ruler of the world.
(U) Most people who get caught for lesser fuck-ups end up going to jail.
The rhetoric about this issue is highly partisan, including your post. However, I don't think this is a liberal/conservative issue, really.
As a state employee, I'm allowed to use my personal email address for official business. Once in awhile I do so, if I want to have a particular discussion outside of work hours while not checking my work email for other business. Nothing I'm doing is sensitive, and I'm allowed to do it provided the emails are sent to an official state email address reasonably soon.
If Comey is using a personal email address to send himself drafts of agency-wide letters, that doesn't seem problematic. Comey isn't going to be sending sensitive information to the entire FBI.
Comey did completely mishandle investigating Hillary Clinton's use of a private email server. Neither liberals nor conservatives approve of how Comey handled that investigation, so I don't think that's a controversial statement. Clinton was also incredibly reckless, to say the least, in using a personal email server for handling sensitive information. That is, indeed, problematic. As for there being a political bias, Mike Pence also used a personal email account to conduct official business while he was the Governor of Indiana. That email account was hacked, exposing sensitive information. Mike Pence didn't break Indiana law, and I'm not aware of him ever being investigated over the matter.
While both Clinton and Pence have been heavily criticized for using personal email for conducting work-related business, neither has faced serious consequences for doing so. I don't see a political bias here, for or against conservatives.
As for Comey, using a personal email address for a few emails that don't appear sensitive doesn't seem like a big deal to me. Comey's credibility is gone, but it doesn't have anything to do with this. This seems like a non-issue to me, especially compared with all of the other issues surrounding Comey.
What? Comey undermined Clinton _twice_. First when he publicly excoriated her for her personal email server use in June and then when he announced a new investigation just two weeks before the election.
If anything, he was Trump's tool.
Ok. Clinton wasn't accused of using personal email for business. She was accused of transmitting top secret documents over unsecured personal email
Classified, actually. Top Secret is considerably higher; "classified" is not the same as "top secret".
Amusingly, her server turns out to have been more secure than the State Department server. The State Department got hacked, but the Clintons didn't. https://securityintelligence.c...
(very illegal),
In fact, all she had to do was issue an exemption stating that her server was allowed for classified email. As Secretary of State, she had the authority to declare what server are secure!
Comey's a conservative, so is it illegal for him? A lot of Trump's team also say they are conservative so it's illegal for them too?
So? That's not illegal.
This is more FUD perpetrated by the media who are in collusion with the Russians to distract from Mueller actually finding something about TRUMP. Trust us, there is a LOT of dirt on TRUMP but there is so much it must be removed first with a steam shovel. Which. Takes. Time.
And on a side note, I'm available for side work if any you needs to pump up their YouTube channels.
Then how did those darn Russians get her emails? The alternative to badly secured server hacked by Russians is the Seth Rich conspiracy theory. Pick your poison carefully.
"Prediction: within 10 years, Windows will be a Linux distribution." Me, 7-6-2016
to her credit she didn't throw him under the bus for it.
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"Amusingly, her server turns out to have been more secure than the State Department server. The State Department got hacked, but the Clintons didn't. https://securityintelligence.c... [securityintelligence.com] "
The OIG report released today SAYS that foreign governments had at least one of her emails marked Secret - from her server.
Of course every foreign intelligence server had access to her server. That's what foreign intelligence agencies exist to do - not to mention it was Exchange 2010 with an internet-facing webmail login. Hell, I could've gotten into it.
Top Secret is a classification, as are Secret and Confidential. 'Classified' itself is not a classification at all.
The Trump administration wants you to see this, so that you will come away thinking Comey did a shitty job of prosecuting a terrible crime in the spirit of covering his own ass. Naturally conservative echo chambers like slashdot are happily sharing this breaking news with all of us because it's good for the Administration. Once sufficient doubt is sewn regarding the Clinton email matter, it can be opened up again and used as another giant distraction so we don't notice what other atrociously illegal things the Trump administration is doing this week.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
foreign intelligence server = foreign intelligence agency
Then how did those darn Russians get her emails? The alternative to badly secured server hacked by Russians is the Seth Rich conspiracy theory. Pick your poison carefully.
The DNC email leak was from the DNC, not the Clinton server (and was years after Hillary left the Secretary of State office). It was done by phishing John Podesta's account: https://www.apnews.com/dea73ef...
https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/03/ap-investigation-russia-hack-dnc-clinton-emails/
I like to see all politicians dead - how's that?
"I say we take off, nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."
That doesn't mean she wasn't hacked, it means that the state department detected their hack, while Hillary didn't.
Which has more power: the hammer, or the anvil?
"As Secretary of State, she had the authority to declare what server are secure!"
Not true. The Sec of State only has classification authority over documents originating with the Dept of State. The classified info they found originated in other agencies.
Clinton had her own email server in her bathroom. Comey probably used gmail/aol/yahoo. There's a difference.
It's the difference between a true geek and a luser. Who here doesn't have a server in every room?
Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
not from the Left. The right wing is way, way better at it. They rely heavily on authoritarianism, which naturally lends itself to violence.
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This is what a smear campaign looks like.
Sigh. Political games are not headlines, but I guess the morning show folks need something to cluck about.
You are being ripped off every second of every day, so that advertisers can help rip you off even more tomorrow.
There's many stories in the 500 page report though. Pointing out this detail seems more like a dedicated spin bot than anything else though- Hillary sent and received SCI data and TS data on her private server. Coney forwarded incomplete memos so he could work them during his evenings like the gray soulless minion that he is. Even lumping these two together is silly.
On top of which, doing government business using a personal account was, and AFAIK remains, perfectly legal. The only problem is a Government Records Act requirement that the messages be archived for public review. At the time that Clinton was Secretary of State, there was no time limit on how long she had to archive the messages. In fact Colin Powell has never quite gotten around to archiving his emails from the early 2000s.
My understanding is that since 2016 there has been a hard time limit for archiving. Something on the order of four weeks. One wonders how well the Trump administration is doing at complying.
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
Indeed. It seems to me that virtually EVERY government official is going to have a personal email account. After all you are not supposed to use your government account to transact personal business like scheduling a dental appointment or arranging for flowers to be sent to your spouses' mother on her birthday.
If you have a personal account, sooner or later, someone who knows your personal address, is going to send you an email about something governmental. Bingo, you have government business in your personal account. My understanding is that's not only unavoidable, but also OK. You just have to make sure that all the messages are archived in an appropriate fashion in a timely manner.
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
>Amusingly, her server turns out to have been more secure than the State Department server. The State Department got hacked, but the Clintons didn't.
Alternatively, they both got hacked, but only one was able to detect the hack.
Some people encrypt by using rot-13 twice. I prefer the more secure method of using rot-1 a total of twenty six times.
"so that Russians could access it.."
Citation? Actually, never mind.
Record unemployment. Greatest personal and business tax breaks in years. Manufacturing is coming back to the USA in record numbers. Lowest black unemployment ever. Republicans are doing a great job. I'm getting raises at work. Best foreign policy we've had since Reagan. I like how the country is moving right now. If Trump runs in 2020 he has my vote.
It will not be a blue wave. It will be a big chunk of blue ice, sliding off the wing of the DNC charter aircraft.
Those are helpful points.
In all the news about Hillary Clinton's email servers, I never saw ANYTHING that would indicate Hillary Clinton has any technical knowledge.
I think it is likely that technically-knowledgeable people like those who comment on Slashdot accidentally overestimate the technical knowledge of others. Possibilities:
1) Hillary plugged in her own email server and configured email accounts. (Makes me laugh.)
2) Someone arranged Hillary's office for her. Who has never been revealed, apparently.
I'm currently reading A Higher Loyalty: Truth, Lies, and Leadership by James Comey.
Many people think the October 28, 2016 message from James Comey about Hillary's emails was enough to cause people to avoid voting for her. See the bottom third of page 197 for the beginning of his discussion of that.
To me, Comey seems like someone who realizes the importance of social sophistication, struggles for greater social understanding, but often does not deal well with social issues.
How could it not be a shitty job? It involves running the government. The thing we can hope is that while running the government they can dismantle as much of it as possible.
On page XII in the report, the IG says the department “identified numerous FBI employees, at all levels of the organization and with no official reason to be in contact with the media, who were nevertheless in frequent contact with reporters.”
The IG expressed “profound concerns about the volume and extent of unauthorized media contacts by FBI personnel that we have uncovered our review.”
The contact between FBI agents and the media extended to receiving “improperly receiving benefits from reporters, including tickets to sporting events, golfing outings, drinks and meals, and admittance to nonpublic social events.”
“The harm caused by leaks, fear of potential leaks, and a culture of unauthorized media contacts is illustrated in Chapters Ten and Eleven of our report, where we detail the fact that these issues influenced FBI officials who were advising Comey on consequential investigative decisions in October 2016,” the report states.
The IG is forceful in its opinion that the problem with leaking is not “with the FBI’s policy, which we found to be clear and unambiguous.” Instead, the leaking phenomenon “appears to be a cultural attitude among many in the organization.”
According to charts provided in the IG report, one reporter had contact with 12 FBI officials, including an FBI executive and unit chief.
Another reporter contacted an assistant director 21 times and a special agent 23 times, according to the IG. Some FBI employees were in contact with multiple reporters, with one special agent contacting various journalists 32 times.
The question is, is what Comey did illegal too? What was the security classifications of the emails he used from his personal account? Not a rhetorical question I'm looking for the answer? I consider CNN too full of left wing bias and consider Fox too far right wing bias so I don't trust the mainstream media on either side.
Make SELinux enforcing again!
Ok
Clinton wasn't accused of using personal email for business. She was accused of transmitting top secret documents over unsecured personal email (very illegal), and using personal email to communicate state business secretly outside of officially logged and recorded channels (also illegal).
Is this what Comey is accused of? If not, everyone can fuck off with their "he did it too" shit.
No.
She was accused of two things:
1) She used personal email for official business. This was against department policy, but I don't think it was against the law as long as she turned over the work related emails for record keeping (which she did, though she had to be reminded).
This is incredibly common, it's what Comey is being accused of, it's human nature, if you talk to your friend about personal business and work business you're sometimes going to talk in the wrong channel. Clinton should certainly be criticized for looking at the grey area and disregarding the rule entirely, but it's not a fraction of the issue it was made out to be.
2) She inadvertently communicated a few classified things over an insecure channel (her personal email). This actually has nothing to do with her personal server as it would have been just as big a problem if she did it over her official State Dept email since that wasn't cleared for classified traffic either.
But it's even less a big deal than the personal server.
Stuff like that happens all the time, when people are constantly sending emails they sometimes include information they're not supposed to. No one gets charged for it because everybody does it, it's only when it's particularly egregious or deliberate that people get in serious trouble.
I stole this Sig
(U) Her claim is fucking ridiculous, because in classified documents every page, heading, sentence, and bullet point, and source reference is preceded by note just like this: (U) (FOUO) (C) (S) (TS)
(U) Is this painful to read? This is the sort of thing that she claims was missing from her documents.
It's also the thing the FBI claims was missing from her documents:
Three emails, out of 30,000, were found to be marked as classified, although they lacked classified headers and were only marked with a small "c" in parentheses, described as "portion markings" by Comey.
(U) You can't get such documents off of the secure network. To get such documents on her private server, she or a lackey uploaded them.
Or someone wrote up some information in an email, either not realizing it was classified or not realizing it shouldn't be sent over email, and clicked send.
(U) Most people who get caught for lesser fuck-ups end up going to jail.
No one doing what Clinton did would be sent to jail, all of the examples of people going to jail are for far more deliberate mishandling of classified data.
I stole this Sig
you wouldn't call it histrionic. One of the reasons everybody thought Trump would lose is his running mate is a bonefide Kool-Aid drinker. Seriously, look up some eps of his old radio show. That guys nuts, and he's the second most powerful man on earth right now.
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Stop. You are wrong.
Information is classified - every agency has a large document called a Classification Guide that describes what sort of information that agency considers worthy of classification.
Documents are supposed to be marked if they contain classified information, to allow people to know how to handle the document without reading it. Even if not marked, the information in the document is still classified; it just isn't labelled.
The phrase "classified at the time of sending" is a lie. The documents may not have been MARKED as containing classified information, but they did. There is no such thing as "classified after the fact".
Additionally, Clinton sent documents containing NRO imagery that was clearly labelled TOP SECRET at the time they were sent. They were classified, were correctly labelled, and were from an agency Clinton had no authority over. All of your BS excuses (even if they weren't lies) still wouldn't apply to those.
Clinton sent classified info, knew it, and told the FBI to fuck off - then got away with it because the highly-ambitious Mr Comey thought she would be his next boss.
Don't try to correct him, he's right - she was accused of all kinds of shit. According to somebody, she also murdered the cat of one of the staffers who displeased her. (I'm not making this up.)
It doesn't matter what she was accused of.
I swear, on Slashdot, Trump & Hillary have become Godwin's Law 2.0
It is nearly impossible NOT to find a reference to one or both of these idiots in every single topic. Every Damned One. O.o
Swamp dwellers protect their own.
Imagine a scenario in which YOU are hired by the federal government to do a job and you:
[1] Do all your work on a private account, that's not accessible to government archivists, investigators, and oversight comittees (contrary to law)
[2] Delete your content from that private account when you get a subpoena for it
[3] Have your underlings tell the courts and congress that there IS no such private account
[4] Go on national television and claim you do not know one of your peers is doing these things even though you yourself are sending them mail on that account.
Think YOU would get away with it?
The rule of law is gradually being destroyed, and has been since the Clinton administration back in the 1990s. We're all supposed to be subject to the same laws and treated the same when we run afoul of them - that's why the statues of Lady Justice always portray her as blindfolded.
Incidentally, Comey and Hillary both did #1, Hillary did #2 & #3, and Obama did #4
Neither liberals nor conservatives approve of how Comey handled that investigation, so I don't think that's a controversial statement.
The investigations were only covered in scrupulous breathless detail by the right-wing press. It's unlikely that most progressives have a terribly developed opinion on the way in which the investigations were handled. They're more likely to care about the number of investigations, the length, the results, the way in which the results were revealed to the public, etc.
It's pretty easy to identify your political affiliation here based on what you think everyone believes. Not just the above, but also your statement, "Comey's credibility is gone." That fact is a sad testament to how corrupted our press has become.
You aren't required to keep every draft of a document.
love is just extroverted narcissism
AS Secretary of State, as a former senator, HRC is responsible for determining what is and is. It classified (at any of the three levels) WITHOUT relying on 'markings'. That's like saying it was OK for her to rob a bank because no one told her it was illegal.
It's a childish defense for something that someone who was responsible to know better.
Ken
HRC used a personal server exclusively for 100% of her work-related emails while Secretary of State - she never, in her entire tenure as Secretary logged into a state Department email account.
Comey sent (3x) drafts of mass departmental emails he planned to send to everyone in the FBI to his private gmail account, presumably to work on them at home gonvieniently.
These are in no way comparable 'offenses'.
I find it hard to believe HRC's private server more secure than the state department email server she should have used - it is simply non-sensical, State had a full-time staff working round-clock to secure their servers, HRC bounced her server from part-time contractor to a web hosting firm.
The IG report clearly states that HRC's email server was accessed by foreign agents - is it only a problem if the Russians hacked her server? Is it OK if it was the Chinese or North Koreans?
Ken
It seems poor practice, as compared to using a VPN.
As Secretary of State, she had the authority to declare what server are secure!
Not saying you are lying, but that seems just a little hard to believe. The Secretary of State has final say on how secure software/hardware installations are?
The state department was continually hacked before and during this period. It was one of Hillary's stated reasons for wanting to run her own server.
Play Command HQ online
The DNC email leak was from the DNC, not the Clinton server (and was years after Hillary left the Secretary of State office). It was done by phishing John Podesta's account:
There were three distinct leaks: one from the Clinton server, one from the DNC and one from Podesta. The Podesta leak has nothing to do with the DNC leak and the phished Podesta account is on gmail.
So Hillary sent emails to foreigners when she was Secretary of State. You guys are priceless.
Play Command HQ online
Last March
CBS News senior White House correspondent Bill Plante asked Mr. Obama when he learned about her private email system after his Saturday appearance in Selma, Alabama.
"The same time everybody else learned it through news reports," the president told Plante.
Yesterday's IG report (footnote of page 89):
President Barack Obama was one of the 13 individuals with whom Clinton had direct contact using her clintonemail.com account.
Lying to the press might not be a crime, but it looks like he was in on it.
2) Someone arranged Hillary's office for her. Who has never been revealed, apparently.
My recollection (though I don't recall the details of this pointless story) is that Hillary paid a state dept tech to set up and maintain her system, and after she left office she paid people to remove and dispose of the system (which they did not do in a timely fashion). It was all revealed by the leaking congresscritters in the House, repeatedly and in great detail.
Her email server had NO SSL CERT for the first 3 months of operation. And it was running early-2000 Microsoft Server, with the email web interface enabled. Oh, AND she connected her unsecured Blackberry to it, and used her mobile device on the tarmac in China when she got out of her plane.
She might as well put a big, red target on her back.
"More secure than the State Department"? Don't make me laugh.
"We receive as friendly that which agrees with, we resist with dislike that which opposes us" - Faraday
You can of course provide proof that there was in fact a leak from the Clinton server, because you want to set the same high standard as the post you replied to. You just forgot to add it. Amiright?
I find it hard to believe HRC's private server more secure than the state department email server she should have used - it is simply non-sensical, State had a full-time staff working round-clock to secure their servers, HRC bounced her server from part-time contractor to a web hosting firm.
So, you are saying that a committee burdened by "helpful rules" is guaranteed to be more effective than a single skilled individual? And that you believe that government always does a competent job while "the market" doesn't?
More to the point, a well-configured email server with just a few logins gives you a lot less of an attack service than a complex system with thousands of users, some of which are careless or tempted by money. This part of the story seems very likely to me.
Even Comey stated in his July 2016 briefing that at least 8 of the email conversations contained information that was Classified as Top Secret, Top Secret is not Higher or lower than classified. Classified means one of the three main levels Confidential, Secret or Top Secret as well as any of the higher Caveat designated SCI classification groups.
No she did not have any such authority to declare her server secure. The requirements for handling classified information are set in law, She had the authority to review and alter the classification of State Dept materials. But not how such classified information is handled and stored. And Comey again stated that several items of classified information involved belonged to other agencies than the State Dept. thus she didn't even have declassification authority over the information.
Please don't speak about what you have so little real knowledge of. I spent 20 years in US Army Counterintelligence. Her server was illegal for avoiding the government networks and the mandatory storage of all official communications (classified and otherwise). And She violated the Espionage act by placing the classified information onto the unclassified server connected to the unclassified civilian internet. Classified information is processed and transmitted over separate networks for security reasons.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
So, when saluted you return the salute. It's common courtesy regardless of who salutes you. As an NCO in the Army I occasionally had a nervous young soldier salute me, I'd return the salute then correct him/her as to my rank and that I was enlisted not an officer and thus not worthy of a sniper check.
It would have been a problem if he hadn't returned the salute as it would have been an insult to ignore the salute.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
You have it exactly backwards. the 110 email conversations were all classified before the fact, they omitted conversations that were classified after the fact.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
In all the news about Hillary Clinton's email servers, I never saw ANYTHING that would indicate Hillary Clinton has any technical knowledge.
Maybe it's because how flippant she was about it? "Wipe the server" "You mean with a cloth?"
Maybe it's because she deleted so many emails before granting access to the FBI?
Maybe it's because she was head of the Department of State and should have asked somebody if she honestly had no technical knowledge?
Maybe it's because she has almost no credibility and the only ones voting for her were doing it of party reasons, anti-trump reasons, or for gender reasons>
Almost correct. There were a few conversations regarding her schedule that were later classified. But at the time of being sent they had not been classified. Prior Secretaries of state had similar accusations about similar emails send over unclassified networks where the schedule was later deemed to be worthy of classification but at the time they were transmitted were not classified yet.
But for the most part you are correct.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
How people feel about Jared and Ivanka using their own private server since before the campaign, and continuing to do so today?
Or trump using an unsecured phone after the inauguration, with rumors of that still happening?
Or Mike Pence using his AOL account email to discuss matters of homeland security while Governor and during the campaign?
Yes she did, and yes it does.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
Nevertheless, the State Department server was hacked. At the time it was described as the "worst ever" cyberattack intrusion against a federal agency.
of course this is non-story...
Anything of any value will be washed away because "narratives"
Is it really too much to want our Government and Journalists to have a shred of integrity?
End of Line.
The #1 rule is that accidents happen - and when reported honestly, will be forgiven. Deliberate violations and lying will ALWAYS result in prosecution.
Unless your name is 'Clinton'.
Except the point is she didn't deliberately expose the classified records, and if you believe she didn't realize classified information ended up on there then she didn't lie either.
I stole this Sig
Please don't speak about what you have so little real knowledge of.
And I would suggest you do likewise. Apparently your experience in the Army did not teach you civilian law. Fair enough: the military really does do things differently.
The requirement for handling classified information correctly may be set in law, but the actual details of what this entails and who has control authority are codified in Federal regulations, not law, and these regulations stem from executive order. When Hillary Clinton was secretary of state, the applicable executive order would have been Executive Order 13292 (2003). The relevant section is 4.1 (g):
(g) Consistent with law, directives, and regulation, each agency head or senior agency official shall establish controls to ensure that classified information is used, processed, stored, reproduced, transmitted, and destroyed under conditions that provide adequate protection and prevent access by unauthorized persons.
Clinton was the agency head, so she actually did have the ultimate authority to determine whether her server was secure.
She didn't do that, but she could have.
The classified is actually a big deal. People do get charged and prosecuted and even convicted of it. A one time incident no, but multiple instances including TOP SECRET (at least eight instances according to Comey's briefing in July 2016) does get prosecuted. A one time event is a slap on the wrist a second or even a third time the same, 100+ instances is a pattern of willful criminal negligence that does get prosecuted.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
Okay, I'm expressing the sentiment of pretty much the whole rest of the world outside of the US here, at the risk of hurting the feelings of some poor US Trump fans.
It's pretty obvious that he's neither a traitor nor a conservative. He's really just a narcissist asshat clown who was born into a rich family, there is otherwise nothing remarkable about this mostly harmless conspiracy theory nutter real estate guy. The most annoying thing about him is that the whole world is bombarded with news about him every day and has to endure his idiocy. It can only be described as a constant intellectual assault, like when you had to meet someone every day who makes outrageous and obviously false claims and ignores anyone who points out that he's wrong. It's mildly infuriating. Otherwise nobody gives a fuck about him. Nor should they.
He must be the most honest man in government.
I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
It boggles my mind how liberals are ok with this but are outraged by a possibly illegal payment to a woman Trump allegedly had sex with.
You know if boggles the mind of liberals that you care about a handful of emails out of thousands sent over 4 years that contained bits of classified information, and you don't care that the actual President of the United States ordered illegal hush money paid and threats delivered to his former mistresses to keep them from speaking out during an election, then lied about the payments, and then lied about the affairs.
You should be self-aware enough to recognize that if we swapped the Democrat and Republican in this scenario you'd be ever more outraged about the reverse situation. I doubt the liberals would still care about the emails, though. I'm basing that on the fact that liberals largely didn't care that much when Bush and Cheney were using a private email system to avoid presidential records requirements, but conservatives sure as hell cared about the President's sexual morality when Clinton was in office.
Fanatically anti-fanatical
The classified is actually a big deal. People do get charged and prosecuted and even convicted of it. A one time incident no, but multiple instances including TOP SECRET (at least eight instances according to Comey's briefing in July 2016) does get prosecuted. A one time event is a slap on the wrist a second or even a third time the same, 100+ instances is a pattern of willful criminal negligence that does get prosecuted.
Honestly, you only wish that things actually worked that way. You're projecting fantasies of perfection onto imperfect people.
Fanatically anti-fanatical
Neither liberals nor conservatives approve of how Comey handled that investigation... Really? Most of the liberals I know are thrilled with the investigation because it ended up with the results they wanted. Never mind the fact that the investigation was very badly mishandled and that he had no business deciding that nobody would be willing to prosecute, it ended up with Hillary safe, and that's all they care about.
See what this comment tells me is that you don't actually know any liberals...
Fanatically anti-fanatical
But if her server didn't get hacked how was it the Russians that gave her e-mails to wikileaks? I thought the official narrative was the Russians hacked her server and got them?
Clinton was using a private email server so her email was not susceptible to Freedom of Information requests. The same reason other government officials use personal email to conduct government business.
It looks like Comey used his to transfer information from account to account. Not especially smart, but not the same thing at all.
In no way does used gmail equate to used private email server in my closet.
I'm way more concerned with the obviously false lie about Comey not making decisions based on politics. It looks to me like the FBI covered for Clinton when they thought she would win and Comey got nervous when it became obvious to him she might lose. Had she won we wouldn't have found out about any of this.
See what this comment tells me is that you don't actually know any liberals...
Well, they call themselves liberals, and who am I to argue with them about it?
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I spent 20 years as Army Counterintelligence. I speak from experience not fantasy.
Try again.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
It is absolutely not factual that Clinton did not know what she was doing was illegal. She had her assistant Huma Abedin copy marked classified messages from a classified system to an unclassified system to her email account. These emails were discovered on Anthony Weiner's laptop. Weiner was Abedin's husband at the time. When the FBI found the emails during an investigation into Weiner Abedin was given immunity from prosecution by the FBI in return for, well nothing really.
Typically immunity from prosecution is given in return for testifying against a higher up in a criminal investigation. Best guess is Abedin was given immunity so she wouldn't testify against Clinton in an immunity deal with someone else.
Nope, there is still a process of declassification, including documentation and publication of the information being declassified.
I do speak from knowledge, and not just of the Army, Joint operations get you working with all the intelligence agencies and having to know how they function and how intelligence is classified and declassified has standards across the board that all agencies must follow, even up to the Dept. Secretaries.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
Sorry, there are other people who have better claims of experience who have already told me your interpretation is wrong.
Plus there's an actual investigation that we actually know comes from the FBI that explicitly disagrees with your claims...
Fanatically anti-fanatical
I'm way more concerned with the obviously false lie about Comey not making decisions based on politics. It looks to me like the FBI covered for Clinton when they thought she would win and Comey got nervous when it became obvious to him she might lose. Had she won we wouldn't have found out about any of this.
This! 100 times this! Comey's bi-polar actions make no sense under any other scenario.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
Once again, NOT illegal, just contrary to policy
And vice versa, you partison dolt.
*partisan
You aren't getting it. Declassification is irrelevant, as it wasn't needed.
As a head of a federal agency, the secretary of state has the right to declare whether or not their server was "secure". Information need not be classified. That law defers to the executive in handling of classified material, and only seeks to punish where someone violates the executive controls on said material. The executive (by executive order) had delegated the responsibility for that information to any department head that may handle such material.
I can't speak to your creds, but if you really do know what you're talking about, i'm finding it mind boggling that you don't actually understand the structure of authority with regard to classified information.
The Secretary of State is not the DNC. I'm curious where you got that notion? Was it a right-wing publication?
I've come to the conclusion that you're lying through your teeth.
If we're going to toss around whataboutism's, Trump was using an unsecured Android for at least a year.
Cheap storage VM.
Law enforcement exercises its own jurisdiction on deciding whether to send a case up to prosecutors every single day. That's literally how it works.
What I want to know, is did you really not know that, or are you so blinded by partisan hatred that you're willing to sacrifice your intellectual honesty to crank up your blood pressure a few more notches?
My understanding is that he made the decision based on the fact that he expected her to win and that nobody was going to be willing to press charges against the President Elect. My personal opinion is that that shouldn't have been his call. He should have passed the results of his investigation over to the proper people and let them decide. Then, if the decision was not to prosecute, his hands were clean. As it is, there are people who say that he closed the case for partisan reasons. Personally, I don't know his motives, but it does make me wonder.
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Sorry but the Clinton era helped usher in a new acceptance of sexual infidelity. And after hearing the whole thing trivialized for the next 15 years, it's hard to muster up the outrage for infidelity.
For 15 years we were told that we should understand why a husband would cover up an affair and use all his means to do so. It's funny now that the Clinton's don't matter, you are finally holding him accountable, but honestly, it's too late. Moral apathy is contagious.
If you want to go the partisan route, only one party has impeached their own president (twice).
Clinton didn't deserve to win.
Neither did Trump.
We are all fucked.
I agree. Fucked with the highest employment numbers in history. What a crap way to live.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
Except it was actually deliberate and Hillary Clinton clearly lied to the FBI about it:
"They say they've had issues sending secure fax. They're working on it."
Clinton responds "If they can't, turn into nonpaper [with] no identifying heading and send nonsecure."
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2016/01/08/boom-in-newlyreleased-email-hillary-orders-aide-to-strip-classified-marking-n2101680
Really isn't any reasonable way to accept Hillary Clinton's explanation that the "heading" was just the state department logo and not the classification markings in the context of a conversation about sending classified information.
Was the information in question actually classified or just inside a document that was classified due to the presence of other information?
Not saying it wasn't deliberate in this instance, but it's still not clear what the intent or result was.
I stole this Sig
Correct. There is no legal impediment to handing the data collected over to DoJ prosecutors (not Lorretta Lynch), and letting them indict Hillary.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
As far as optics are concerned, and given the fact that half the country now think he was part of a conspiracy to elect Clinton, which is, imho, one of the stupidest fucking things I've seen come out of the righty conspiracy theory mill, you're right. He could have saved himself a lot of trouble by punting it off his side of the field.
What's important though, is non-optically speaking- what he did was completely normal. He has discretion to decide of an alleged infraction is worthy of prosecution, or likely to be prosecuted, and according to the IG report- he was correct in his assertion that it wouldn't be, making claims of conspiracy seem kind of strange to me.
"Maybe it's because she has almost no credibility and the only ones voting for her were doing it of party reasons, anti-trump reasons, or for gender reasons."
Good points. It seemed to me that she was often surprisingly lacking in logical understanding.
However, look at this article: Hillary Clinton Jokes About Wiping Email Server 'With A Cloth Or Something'. Hillary: "What? Like with a cloth or something?" she asked, then laughed. "I don't know how it works digitally at all."
That was NOT "joking". Hillary is now 70 years old. Most people her age don't understand computer technology, and don't want to understand.
Not on the Federal level. Every Federal employee, Civil Servant or Contractor, they ALL have to go through what's allowed and what's not allowed. They have been clear on this even back in the 1990s - you don't use outside e-mail for department business. You also never say you represent an agency on any public media unless you really are a spokesman for the agency. You are not to use Government resources for personal use. It's ok to check your e-mail during lunch or a break, otherwise you're not allowed to. Official use only.
I've been a security guy for years. I've busted people using Government resources to do income taxes for people on the side, all kinds of other stuff including some that were very illegal. Things I can't un-see and wish I could.
Do yourself a favour AC. Never use your personal e-mail for stuff. Never use outside resources that you're not supposed to use for your job. Keep everything professional and where they're supposed to be. You'll never get into trouble for things like this. You just have to watch out for the SJW bullshit.
I said "Most people her age don't understand computer technology, and don't want to understand." Most people, not all.
I've known many people who responded like the stories say Hillary did.
My opinion: Hillary Clinton showed many, many times in many ways that she was not deeply logical. She exhibited the behavior of people I've known who didn't want to try to understand technology.
Did Hillary Clinton give any deeply insightful ideas when she was Secretary of State? None of which I am aware. It seemed to me that she lacked depth everywhere, not just concerning technology.
This story, Understanding Hillary, says she is admired by her co-workers, and only weak in elections. It has seemed to me that she is weak everywhere in public.
So you're the expert on what Putin wants?
No, blue ice metaphorically falls off the wings of the DNC plane. Mostly onto the voting public.
No, a prosecutor in the Justice Department decides if something is worthy of prosecution. The FBI investigates and gathers the facts that the prosecutor uses to make the determination.
You can say that as many times as you like, but it just doesn't make it true. I'm sorry.
HRC is the first-ever cabinet member to have a political-appointee in the IT department, but he didn't manage HRC's private email server, he apparently got the cushy Federal IT job as a reward from HRC.
Ken
So a server that bounced around from part-time contractor to web hosting company and do on is MORE secure than a gov't server?
Not the same, MORE.
Not similar, MORE.
You can invent all the facts you want to try and defend HRC and her 'highly-secure' web server, but the same people that protect POTUS, VPOTUS and other high-level security target's email accounts are, I have to believe, at least EQUALLY competent to 'the guy that set up bill's email server after he left office.'
Ken
She instructed one staffer in how to strip off classification markings and send classified work emails to her private account.
We know this because the email she wrote was released to the public last year.
Ken
Here is the email where HRC tells a staffer to delete markings and send classified material to her private email.
Ken
I think you're going to require some other source - that only details her statements that she asked for those portions that were unclassified to be sent to her via the unclassified system so she could work as much as possible while awaiting the full document via secure fax. And this is just a transcript of an interview with nothing damning in it.
The cesspool just got a check and balance.
Nothing in there explicitly states she sent any such email that originated from her. She did receive email from the gov system which had some classified info on it. Email that was classified after the fact is irrelevant. In fact, the whole thing even from politifact is rather light on specific details only stating aggregated numbers. This means there's no meaningful conclusions you can draw from the information presented, other than to answer "yes, there was some classified info on HRC's servers" Who originated said classified information can only be known by reviewing the specific emails, which obviously we cannot see.
The cesspool just got a check and balance.
Sorry but the Clinton era helped usher in a new acceptance of sexual infidelity.
I believe the Clinton era ushered in a new level of partisan rancor about sexual infidelity and attempted to use it as a tool to remove a relatively popular president. You need to go back to LBJ, JFK, Eisenhower, and Harding to see how open and accepted sexual infidelity was.
The cesspool just got a check and balance.
Proof? Only 10 were classified in the first review IIRC. It's been a while, but what I reviewed when I had this discussion in depth was that this entire email thing was a red herring as far as classification went, at least with what we the public had access to. The only thing that really should have been addressed is that private email accounts should not be used for government business. Various government agencies had such policies back in the 90s already and it's inexcusable IMNSHO that the State dept didn't have such policies and that a 4 star general (Powell) who was subject to those policies used non-government email providers for state dept business.
The cesspool just got a check and balance.
The emails that you are referring to are from the DNC hack. There have been no reports or evidence of Clinton's personal email server ever being hacked. In fact, an inspection by the FBI found that there was no evidence of any intrusion and the report cited for this article criticizes Comey for even suggesting in public statements that it could have been.
The main issues that were raised about Clinton's email server is that:
- She was running a personal email server with no archiving of government communication. However, this was allowed by an exception/loophole in the rules that has since been closed.
- It was being used for classified communication: About a dozen emails were classified after they were received. They were all sent by someone to Clinton. There hasn't been any evidence that she actually sent classified email herself using the mail server.
- Email Deletion: A bunch of emails were deleted. There was a request by Clinton to delete personal email (vs Government related) months earlier but the Email Admin didn't do it until after a subpoena was issued. Either he was simply lazy and had a "crap, I forgot to..." moment or was ordered to do it, depending on your perspective. In any case, there was no evidence of anyone on the Clinton team communicating with the Email Admin after the subpoena was issued.
While you or I may not like it, what Clinton did was actually legal under the rules. The rules have been fixed. The crappy part is that people only remember the accusations and hardly even revise their opinion when the facts come to light.
Summary is written as if Comey was engaging in hypocrisy - ignoring the fact that Comey bent over backwards to clear Hillary while at the same time the DOJ was prosecuting others for mishandling classified evidence. Using Dembot talking points like the emails weren't "marked as classified" which is asinine, as the information was 'born' classified. And that she didn't have intent to mishandle evidence, which 1) is crap given that she blasted the Bush administration for using private email 2) intent is irrelevant. It's like statutory rape: either it happened or it didn't. Doesn't matter what the person's intent was.
You no more need to be a prosecutor to see the double standards in play than you need to be a Supreme Court justice to see the five conservatives were full of shit on their back-to-back rulings on gay wedding cakes and Muslim travel bans. You only need not have your head planted deep in one's partisan ass.