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People's Egos Get Bigger After Meditation and Yoga, Says Study (qz.com)
An anonymous reader shares a study that finds contemporary meditation and yoga practices can actually inflate your ego. Quartz reports: In the paper, published online by University of Southampton and due to be published in the journal Psychological Science, researchers note that Buddhism's teachings that a meditation practice helps overcome the ego conflicts with U.S. psychologist William James's argument that practicing any skill breeds a sense of self-enhancement (the psychological term for inflated self-regard.) There was already a fair bit of evidence supporting William James's theory, broadly speaking, but a team of researchers from University Mannheim in Germany decided to test it specifically in the context of yoga and meditation.
They recruited yoga 93 students and, over a period of 15 weeks, regularly evaluated their sense of self-enhancement. They used several measures to do this. First, they assessed participants' level of self-enhancement by asking how they compared to the average yoga student in their class. (Comparisons to the average is the standard way of measuring self-enhancement.) Second, they had participants complete an inventory that assesses narcissistic tendencies, which asked participants to rate how deeply phrases like "I will be well-known for the good deeds I will have done" applied to them. And finally, they administered a self-esteem scale asking participants whether they agreed with statements like, "At the moment, I have high self-esteem." When students were evaluated in the hour after their yoga class, they showed significantly higher self-enhancement, according to all three measures, than when they hadn't done yoga in the previous 24 hours.
They recruited yoga 93 students and, over a period of 15 weeks, regularly evaluated their sense of self-enhancement. They used several measures to do this. First, they assessed participants' level of self-enhancement by asking how they compared to the average yoga student in their class. (Comparisons to the average is the standard way of measuring self-enhancement.) Second, they had participants complete an inventory that assesses narcissistic tendencies, which asked participants to rate how deeply phrases like "I will be well-known for the good deeds I will have done" applied to them. And finally, they administered a self-esteem scale asking participants whether they agreed with statements like, "At the moment, I have high self-esteem." When students were evaluated in the hour after their yoga class, they showed significantly higher self-enhancement, according to all three measures, than when they hadn't done yoga in the previous 24 hours.
...and you results are below me...
nothing to see here - move along
I mean, just like that.
Have a great...
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Hillary for KKK President!
Buddhists would have left their ego on the mat.
There is plenty of commentary in Buddhism on why serious meditative practice needs to be done with an proper teacher and inside a proper community to avoid these very issues. Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism is a great text that discusses this issue and how to approach it from a Tibetan Buddhist perspective. This is really nothing new, far from it.
And, yes, if you have a set of random people meditate with no or little guidance for four weeks, there will be a ego boost. Longer term, directed practice is required for real change.
It is much more likely that the people who are providing the meditation/yoga training are feeding the student's sense of entitlement with atta-boys and stroking them.
This is because all activities in America are commercial and 'normal' practices of Buddhism that are designed to eliminate the ego would not pad the bottom line. As a teen a worked for a (legit) Korean TKD master and he made certain that ego was minimized through hard work and confrontation. We lost some students because this offended them, but seeing an aged master fall to his knees to pick lint out of the out of the carpet (just one example out of dozens a day, and OH BOY you had better show contrition that there was lint there in the first place, and make certain that it was not there the next time he came through the door) served a lesson that I follow to this day.
It seems to me that you might be doing it wrong or for the wrong reasons.
Contrary to popular belief, yoga should not be classified as 'meditation'
True meditation means one is relaxed
The 'standing on your head' yoga is very very far away from relaxing
When one is relaxed, one can think more clearly
But when one practices yoga, one stressed oneself to the limit, with that 'superman syndrome' arrives, and the individual feels so accomplished that he or she could do anything and everything
In such condition, how can that individual think clearly?
You've just completed a supposedly beneficial task. It's no different to completing a task at work or even winning a competition that matter.
One would hope one is happy occasionally.
I've also read meditation appears to make people less ambitious. One might argue as long as it makes one content it doesn't matter. Being confident and lazy won't necessarily harm you and others.
I thought the main goal of meditation was achieving "inner" peace? If increased confidence provides that, then you arguably have gained inner peace.
Of course some people are over-confident, which often leads to jerk-hood, but it might also provide confidence to those who lacked it before. Thus, increased confidence in itself is not necessarily "bad". It may "fix" some and "break" others.
It may also have other benefits or changes that counter-act the problems of over-confidence. For example, if it does make one both over-confident and lazy, the person may be too lazy to rub in their greatness. Too lazy to say, "Neener neener, I'm better than you, loser!"
Table-ized A.I.
Buddhism is often called the 'middle path' because it has practices that are designed to pull you back from the self-congratulatory behaviors that arise from completing beneficial tasks like you describe.
In this context he is not evaluating Yoga as much as a gym based facsimile of the physical asana practice of yoga, with some token âsit still and catch your breathâ(TM) at the end.
Yoga is more than the physical exercises and some token âmeditationâ(TM). There is a philosophy of non-attachment, intention, internal âenergeticâ(TM) focus, mindful meditation, and a surrendering.
Comparing yourself to the person next to you is gym class, not yoga.
Itâ(TM)s like doing a study on Christianity (or any religion) and picking a single aspect/practice (eg. Meet in a hall for an hour on Sundayâ(TM)s, but no one talks about the bible) and missing the point.
There are some words that are so misunderstood and loaded with conflicting meaning in the western world that I avoid using them: god, yoga, tantra, and sin.
this was probably written by some loser who doesn't meditate.
Check out the book "How to Change Your Mind: What the New Science of Psychedelics Teaches Us About Consciousness, Dying, Addiction, Depression, and Transcendence" by Micheal Pollan. Psychedelics can show a person the world without the filter of the ego. Psychedelics are more successful are treating addictions to alcohol and nicotine than anything else, and by a huge margin, but only in a proper treatment setting. Research was so socially suppressed that new experts in the addiction field were unaware. Founder of AA beat alcoholism after a trip got his ego out of a rut. Psychedelics' temporary destruction of the ego is also helping terminally ill patients become fearless.
The book also discusses where the ego is in the brain (shown on fMRI), and how it's a network linking past memory (and the imagined future) to emotion. The book suggests that meditation, focusing on the immediate present and NOT the past or future, also suppresses this ego circuit... just not nearly as well or easily as psychedelics.
basically saying that meditation makes you less motivated to put your nose to the grindstone for The Man.
Too may flaws for any useful conclusions. The theory is "practicing any skill breeds a sense of self-enhancement." The news articles are "Egos Get Bigger After Meditation and Yoga.' The study was performed on a group of people performing one task and the people already wanted to perform that task. For it to be useful science, they would have needed for people to change to different tasks and selected some people who didn't already want to perform those tasks. Perhaps performing yoga doesn't increase the ego as much as playing a card game for the same amount of time. Perhaps people who dislike yoga have a decrease in ego when they do that sissy activity. The study wasn't designed properly so we can't know those things and since there isn't enough data to compare against, we shouldn't claim that yoga/meditation is the cause of the increase. Perhaps it occurs after doing anything which takes physical or mental effort regardless of the activity, such as sucking air through a straw for 30 minutes. Pointless but ego boosting, unless you were told you did a poor job at sucking?
surely not the meme meditation where they pay for yoga classes or read about it online for an hour
I'll happily hang on to my bytes of ego, thanks.
Meditation is good and useful practise for accessing different states of consciousness without drugs. There are many reasons why you want to do this. To say it reduces motivation and increases ego just indicates it is not being used properly. Brains are smart - minds are smarter and whilst you can fool the conscious mind fooling the unconscious mind is like trying to pretend gravity doesn't exist as you step off a cliff. Bottom line here - don't be fucking stupid, intent is everything.
In some cases though meditation is a form of spiritual bypassing of all the shit you've been through in your life. These things mess with your super ego, those little voices in your head that can give you constructive or destructive messages. If they are destructive you're going to have a crap opinion of yourself and meditation will expand any false reality you have constructed and turn you into a real asshole.
Bottom line: deal with your issues consciously first then meditation will be useful. Chances are you won't act like a dick either.
Have a nice day :)
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Did they make *any* attempt to distinguish between the two? If not, it's a worthless study.
Healthy self-esteem is based on a realistic and measured appreciation of your own good qualities ("I'm a good ukulele player"). Inflated self-esteem is, well, inflated ("I'm the greatest fucking ukulele player on earth"). Malignant narcissism, as seen for example in narcissistic personality disorder, also tends to include a competitive need to denigrate the positive qualities of others ("All other ukulele players are shit"), and tends to include the belief that you deserve special treatment because of your extraordinary qualities ("I should get my ukuleles sent to me for free, and I don't need to be nice to people because I'm such a genius at the ukulele").
how does one tell the difference between Ego and Smug?
Ego drives the Audi and Smug drives the Prius
list your own below....
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
What we've really determined is: Psychological Science isn't.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
As a practicing Buddhist for about 40 years, I would suggest that anyone who wants to know about meditation should not ask a psychologist. It's not a pill and it's not understandable to the outside observer. It's a practice and a way of life that changes the nature of experience.
The first teaching of the Buddha was that life is suffering, suffering is caused by the mistaken belief in a self, and that mistaken belief can be overcome. That's already well outside the purview of psychology. It only makes sense when you do it.
To put it another way, the path of meditation is about waking from a dream. Psychology is about trying to have a good dream.
Observational data suggests that regularly practising Yoga strongly correlates with elevated levels of douchebaggery.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
But it's all okay because it doesn't mention the G word.
God will smite you. Not the Christian God, but Dunning–Kruger himself.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Because silly dogma that gullible people fall for is just misunderstood? Got it.
I have some pamphlets you might be interested in.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Because silly dogma that gullible people fall for is just misunderstood? Got it.
It's not misunderstood, it's you in particular who doesn't understand it. The problem is you. You can't refute something you don't understand.
Or maybe you do understand it. Can you say something that shows you comprehend?
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
One rule of thumb I developed as a TA in three classes across two universities CS programs -- the 30-ish female wearing yoga pants to your classroom every day is not only cheating but she's the ring leader as well. She'll even brag about it to you once the semester is over and grades are filed.
But there's a downside. Consider the following thought experiment:
You're vegan, you practice yoga, and you "don't even own a television". You happen to be attending brunch at a trendy cafe with some friends; which of the three facts in the previous sentence do you mention first?
I've thought about this a bit, and I don't have a good answer.
Can you say something that shows you comprehend?
Mu.
Donald Trump kicked my dog! That NAZI bastard!
Trump, Trump, Trumpity Trump Trump TRUMP! Reeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!
Q: How do you know if someone is a vegetarian?
A: Don't worry, they'll let you know as soon as they can.
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
Why would you need to mention any of these at all? These people are your friends, they should already know these three things about you. If there was a stranger in the group, you would mention the one that first comes up in conversation.
"Did you happen to catch _____ on TV last night?" -- "No, I don't have a TV."
"What do you do for fun/relaxation/exercise?" -- "I practice yoga."
"Have you tried that new steak house over on 5th St?" -- "No, sorry, I'm vegan."
--- Keep the choice with the user..
Hurr durr, my pet belief is totally awesome! You just don't understand!
- every crank ever
No fucking wonder their ego is so goddamned big.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
No you are just gullible
- everyone who doesn't have the faintest clue
The Earth goes around the sun ! You just don't understand!
- nope you are a crank
Good, use your own words!
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
What's your belief?
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
That made me chuckle.
Sadly the "don't have a TV" thing is kind of dated. I don't have a TV in the traditional sense...
I do yoga oh shit!
I do eat meat and I mostly watch DVDs which I buy second hand since there's a great second hand shop where I live, a bit of youtube and a bit of paid streaming service TV. I don't have a "TV" because the latop+screen does more than well enough.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
No one claimed the ego itself is the problem. How could something illusory cause problems?
Oh, wise master, so you mean to say that it is our attachment to it that is the problem?
No, you do not understand. Yet.
Nuff said..
Jodoshinshu, the most widespread Buddhist "sect" in Japan rejects meditation altogether because of precisely the above.
It is not possible for a human being to meditate without intent. Therefore, meditation can not be practiced right and yield the results - being enlightened.
Therefore, why meditating at all?
They were already like that.
These are the types of folks who do anything to be better than others.
I tend to rant.
I haven't read the article obviously but a previous article on slashdot implied meditation was bad for you. Is this one agreeing? Is having an embiggened ego bad?
I did take Tae Kwon Do for years, and we had to meditate now and then. I mostly just recall it being helpful for sort of developing a better mind/muscle connection. More or less similar to just having good form and being aware of it when exercising though, nothing magical.
Buddhism is a religion. You believe that you can reach beneficial results over time. The methods employed in Buddhist practice are open to change, so maybe we could create the school of Scrum-Meditation with frequent stand-ups to keep the bodies conditioned and blood flowing.
Can you say something that shows you comprehend?
What is the next question.
Because silly dogma that gullible people fall for is just misunderstood? Got it.
It's not misunderstood, it's you in particular who doesn't understand it. The problem is you. You can't refute something you don't understand.
You're doing a great job of displaying the article's point. Well Done!
I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
It just is, man.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
Wait, you mean that dabbling in cherry picked pieces of other cultures' spiritual practices might be some sort of dilettante-ish thing??
Oh babe, you should have seen me before I meditated!
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Let it be, let it go.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
What do you want?
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Hurr durr, my pet belief is totally awesome! You just don't understand!
- every crank ever
The worst of those being those whose pet belief is that all beliefs are equally right or wrong.
Except, of course, their own belief that "all beliefs are equally right or wrong". That belief is awesome!
Second post by the same user against meditation practices in a short span of time... Hmm...
Yeah, sorry, I messed up the delivery. It should be your significant other's office party or some social event with people you don't know. It was a joke.
You can't measure ego. These people just feel better.
What would be interesting if just relaxing and e.g. listening to your favourite music for an hour would produce similar results.
I read "eggos".
So disappointed.
We practice things that are hard.
When we do this, we feel good about ourselves.
Testing people for self-esteem after they practice something yields higher scores for self regard.
How is this specific to yoga and mediation?
Donald Trump must meditate a lot.
If they are not practicing on the manta "I am nothing" they are doing it wrong.
It's all how you look at it. "Inflated ego" is a bad thing. "Confidence" and "self-esteem" are good things. But there often is little difference between them. This story is trying to spin it as a bad thing, but you could just as easily spin it as a good thing. So let's rewrite that headline.
People's Self-Esteem Increases After Meditation and Yoga, Says Study
Sounds like a good reason to meditate.
"I'm too busy to research this and form an educated opinion, but I do have time to tell everyone my uninformed opinion."
Meditation isn't a "skill" you can practice. Meditation is literally conservation of energy through non-action. You just sit around doing nothing. If you're doing something, you're not meditating. People who don't understand this are people who only have a cursory understanding of meditation, and why Buddhists meditate. All these newage monkeys with their yoga and their meditation workshops and shit, these people will never achieve anything because they don't understand why they're meditating in the first place. They just heard it was supposed to be this amazing thing and they jump on the band-wagon. Of course they're going to pump up their ego by thinking they're doing something incredibly amazing that all the other uninitialized muppets aren't doing.
My sister, a former stay at home mom, started meditating, going to ashrams in India, studying 'Healing Touch', etc. after her kids left for college.
She has become totally insufferable: pompous, arrogant, smug, demeaning, infantalizing, etc. towards all us unenlightened little people. Her 'meditations' are turning her into a Kardashian-level narcissist, yet she thinks she is becoming the Buddha. Is irony the correct term for that? I always misuse that word.
Some people need exactly this. I practice yoga, and as a person who practically permanently experiences imposter syndrome, having a small daily burst of "you don't suck" is a good thing. And I really don't care who has a problem with that - every small brick of sanity is part of the wall that keeps me alive and available for my autistic child.
Prove that there IS something to comprehend.
So far I only came across gobbledygook when I look up awakening, enlightenment, and so forth. Usually it's of the sort "you can't get it until you've got it, and until then, you're too dumb to understand what we could tell you, but actually there's no words for it anyway."
Riiight.
One hour early morning walk is better than any Yoga
Casteism
I haven't had any mod points all week but it's ok because even if chris manages to karma whore an early +5+ post he'll still only average one point of karma now that people are crushing his posts oldest first.
Oh cremer must be crying now.
So far I only came across gobbledygook when I look up awakening, enlightenment, and so forth.
I guess it depends where you are looking. The four noble truths make it clear what enlightenment is (non-buddhists have different ideas, though).
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
the bigger they get the closer they are to popping ;)