Moving To a Chromebook (avc.com)

VC Fred Wilson writes: I've been thinking about moving from a Mac to a Chromebook as my primary computing device. I have not used desktop software for probably a decade now. The browser is how I do all of my desktop computing. Paying up for a full blown computer when all I need is a browser seems like a waste. And there are some security things that appeal to me about a Chromebook. I like the ability to do two factor authentication on signing into the device, for example. I am curious what advice those of you who use Chromebooks have for me. In the comments section, Kevin C Tofel, a long time journalist and an ex-Googler writes: I'm all on in Chromebooks, currently using a Pixelbook. Base model is fine for my needs, which sound very similar. I am taking some CompSci classes but even from a programming standpoint, the addition of Linux running in containers -- available in Dev and Beta channels now, coming to Stable v. 69 in the coming weeks -- fills that need easily and securely. I don't do a bunch of video editing but I can do audio edits in Audacity for Linux once audio support arrives for Linux on Chrome OS.

I actually use Google for my password management. It's built in to Chrome / Chrome OS and syncs to all devices. Plus, you can always log in and look up passwords at passwords.google.com. Sure if Google is hacked, someone has my passwords, but same can be said for any cloud-based password manager or (if you run 1Password, etc... locally) if someone gains access to your device. I use Google's 2FA to log in to my Google account and even to log in to my Pixelbook - can be done with an authenticator app, SMS or -- my preferred method -- a Yubikey. I'l be buying a Google Titan Security key to replace my Yubikey once they go on sale.

Comments

"Well respected"

[Anonymous Coward]

The summary begins with the words 'well respected' but the river of garbage immediately below leads me to believe that they're only respected by Google's sales department, and that's only the kind of fawning service a whale receives rather than respect.

Re:"Well respected"

[Anonymous Coward]

On Facebook's censorship of conservative views which Slashdot will not cover because it was purchased by the same big group of political interests.

Or it's not covered because it's not interesting, not news for nerds, and not stuff that matters.

If you don't like it you're free to take your business elsewhere.

There are no articles on non-liberal shadowbanning here and never will be.

No articles on pixie dust here. Sometimes we talk about unicorns though, so you got us there.

ZIP

Re: "Well respected"

[Anonymous Coward]

Fox News is the largest news outlet yet you are far more likely to see CNN content on Google.

You idiots are sleepwalking into Nazism.

Re:"Well respected"

[ShanghaiBill]

not news for nerds, and not stuff that matters.

TFA is not news for nerds either. A Chromebook is fine if all you want is a browser-in-a-box. But it is inappropriate for almost anyone who wants to create anything digital.

Also, how dense do you have to be to need 10 years to figure out that a computer at a tenth the price of a MacBook is good enough to meet all your needs?

Disclaimer: I bought a Chromebook for my kid. When he breaks it, I am only out $149.

Re:"Well respected"

[ShanghaiBill]

Actually, if you think there were more than two viable candidates ...

You refuse to vote for them because they are not viable, yet they are not viable because people like you refuse to vote for them. Ergo, you are the problem.

It is silly to vote for what you don't want, and then complain when you get it.

Spyware by default

[johnsie]

If you want to use a data collection tool as your main computer then be my guest.

My views have changed recently

[CastrTroy]

My views on Chomebooks have changed recently. My oldest kid starts middle school this Septermber, and the school recommends that every student gets a Chromebook. They have a deal where you can get a Chromebook and a comprehensive warranty for a good deal, so we got one. I'm a software developer, and I'm pretty impressed with how well it runs. 4GB of RAM and 32 GB of storage plus room for an SD card makes it a reasonably capable machine for most computing tasks.Add to this the news that you'll be able to run full Linux applications on the Chromebook, and I can see this being a very enticing offer for many people. I'm strongly considering getting one when my tablet finally bites the dust. I don' have a laptop, because I still prefer an actual desktop for development and other heavy computing tasks. I think I could meet all my computing needs with just a desktop and a chromebook. I'd never give up a desktop with a real keyboard and large screen, but getting stuff done on the small screen of a laptop, even if it's 17 inches feels like there is never enough space. So I might as well use my desktop for anything that's programming or requires a large screen and then just use a Chromebook with a 11 or 13 inch screen for the basic web browsing and media consumption.

Re:My views have changed recently

[Bongo]

The PC era (one personal computer) is over and we can all afford multiple devices and cloud services. These questions around, “is device X a real computer” died like all the arguments about whether iPads were or weren’t for real serious work, also died.

Every device is potentially useful and it is just a question of one’s life and work habits. For example, I have no interest in wearables. But I do love my little projects in high-end-ish 3D modelling software (and these days a decent desktop with large screen is fine for my small projects). I also sit on the sofa a lot and the desktop is in another room, so a tablet is essential, but I never take it out of the house as, essentially, I do not commute on trains, but if I did, I would take it out a lot. And all work is on a laptop, again, because various reasons.

IOW, lots of little lifestyle quirks. Every device has potential, and we are way past the day when a computer has to do everything in order to succeed in the market.

Re:Apples and Oranges

[volodymyrbiryuk]

I thought you could install Arch Linux on a Chromebook. Which could indeed be a replacement for a MacBook or WIndows Laptop.

I use Chromebook for 90% of my needs

[randomErr]

Personally almost all I use is Chromebook. Occasionally I need to tweak a graphic or Word document which I can do via tVNC on my old desktop.

For work I use Citrix to get into my desktop. My storage is 95% in Google Docs. When the Linux windows come out I'll be set there.

The only things I really want beyond quality desktop office and graphic apps that don't have a huge monthly cost (I'm looking at you Microsoft and Adobe) is better Android support. There's a few apps and games I really wish ran better on my system. Maybe a better gamepad interface. But that's more on the game producers.

Re:I use Chromebook for 90% of my needs

[sdinfoserv]

What you're really saying is there are 2 kinds of users/ processes... Consumers and Producers. Consumers sit back and consume data via browsing, watching videos, reading....etc.
However when you actually need to produce something, be non-passive, be a creator, you need something more than a chrome book. By you're own admission, a 20 year old PC running windows 95 is better than a Chromebook when it comes to being a producer..

The only reason to do it is to save money

[captbollocks]

I did it 4 years ago when my macbook air died and I didn't really have the money to buy a new one. So I switched to a chromebook, and an android phone.

If you remember that Apple builds computers/phones/systems to profit from and Google builds computers/phones/systems to run more of their ads to profit from, you won't be too shocked by how rough google tech is.

I lasted 3 years on an android phone before going back to an iphone, I am not sure I want to spend the money on a new macbook, so I will probably get a cheap linux laptop when my chromebook dies and keep everything in the cloud (probably MS with MS office, which is still 10 times better than google apps).

There is nothing that a Chromebook does better than a mac, it is just a lot cheaper.

Re:The only reason to do it is to save money

[houstonbofh]

Save money? I am writing this comment on a 10 year old laptop that still works fine. (Admittedly, it was an expensive laptop, and now performs like a average laptop) But a 5 year old Pixel is EOL? https://www.reddit.com/r/chrom... Does not seem like a savings to me.

Accidental powerwash

[tepples]

If you don't want to accidentally powerwash your Arch Linux installation off your Chromebook, you'll need to install replacement firmware that lacks the "Press Space then Enter to powerwash" prompt on every boot. This requires, among other things, opening the case and turning a screw. Does firmware replacement void the warranty on the screen, keyboard, power jack, and other parts in the Chromebook?

Oxymoron?

[sjbe]

Wait two months to see what the "low cost MacBook Air replacement" rumours are about.

Isn't "low cost macbook" an oxymoron?

Low cost and value are overlapping on a Venn diagram but are not the same thing. Macbooks are valuable to many people but it's hard to argue they are low cost unless you are merely talking relative cost to their even higher priced offerings. Conversely just because something is low cost doesn't mean it is valuable. Chromebooks are obviously inexpensive but since they don't solve any problems I currently have they aren't valuable to me.

Re:Oxymoron?

[StuartHankins]

If you consider an employee making $x output per hour, and compare that to 97% $x because someone wanted to save a few dollars, it doesn't take long before the cost of the laptop is a rounding error.

Take a developer making only $75K per year. Let's say they work 40 hour weeks, 49 weeks per year, that's 1960 work hours at $38.27 per hour ($75000 / 1960).

Say you shave 10 minutes a day by using a Mac. That's .17 hours at $38.27 per hour, or $6.38 per day. Taking that 49 weeks and assuming 5 days per week that's 245 work days... which totals up to $1563 a year saved. That should pretty much pay for the Mac by itself, especially if you consider a 3-5 year replacement cycle ($4689-$7816).

It makes even more sense if your salary is higher. At $100K per year, that is $51.02 per hour and $8.50 per day, or $2083 per year saved by buying the Mac. Over the 3-5 year replacement cycle that's $6248-10413.

It's a 'Web Browser In A Box'

[Spinlock_1977]

I picked up a Asus Chromebook a couple of years ago, and it's been a solid champ up until last month, when the screen started flickering.

If all you need is a browser in a box, the chromebook is the way to go. For programming tasks I still use my windows and linux desktops. But with Linux coming to Chromebook more fully soon, this need may disappear too.

I have wished from time to time that my Chromebook had a free Windows Remote Desktop client, a decent free editor, and a few other things. But on the other hand, never worrying about losing your data (it's mostly stored in the cloud), makes it worry-free to take it along with you where ever you go.

Re:Voiding warranties

[tepples]

I become more comfortable swapping hardware once the warranty has actually expired. Until then, I want the manufacturer to cover screen, keyboard, and power jack problems for the first 24 months, and I don't want the manufacturer to treat installation of a general-purpose operating system as an excuse to refuse me the service that I had paid for.

Chrome with Debian

[houghi]

I use a Chromebook. It is a HP. I run Debian on it using Crouton
That way I can easily find things I want and know, like terminals and bash and what not.
As an added bonus I can run it on an encrypted file and if somebody asks to look at my PC and I log in, there will be not much for them to see, unless they know to do CTRL-SHIFT-T, then shell (or pgdwn) and then "sudo startxfce4". And there I can use any browser that I desire with anything that I desire.

e.g. I use LastPass for logins, but not on the one on Chromebook. That user is not even the same as my 'normal' user that I use. I use Chromium and not Chrome on Linux.

The device is fast enough for browsing and the price is low enough to make it interesting. More here on various ones

If I would buy one now, I probably would go for the Acer. That said, I use it as a secondary PC and I absolutely need ssh to servers.

Re: Why pay to loose your privacy

[jellomizer]

Data on my laptop on the other hand hasn't been compromised pretty much ever. That you know about.

You are always one bad URL click, one malicious email, one zero day vulnerability to a compromise. Even if you are using OS X, Linux, even Open BSD.

Expensive to VNC from public transit

[tepples]

Occasionally I need to tweak a graphic or Word document which I can do via tVNC on my old desktop.

For work I use Citrix to get into my desktop.

But can you work through these remote access methods on your bus/train commute, where you don't have Wi-Fi? If not, then you'd have to include a mobile broadband subscription in the total cost of owning a Chromebook. Furthermore, if all home ISPs in your area use carrier-grade NAT, as Bert64 mentioned is the case in Myanmar, you'll also have to subscribe to a VPN tunnel so your desktop can receive VNC connections while you're away from home.

I thought the same

[Cid Highwind]

...but after about 2 weeks of dealing with the limitations of vanilla ChromeOS, and then another 2 weeks working around the limitations of ChromeOS + crouton, I wanted a real OS again. So my advice is to pick a Chromebook with the biggest SSD and best hardware support in the mainline kernel you can, that way when living 100% in the cloud doesn't really work you can put a full GNU/Linux distro on it.

Buy Cheap

[Deathlizard]

Chromebooks are great if all you want to do is browse the web. Just don't spend a lot of money on it.

Simply put, stay away from the Pixelbook unless you enjoy lighting money on fire. It's over $1000 and you'll get 5 years tops out of it guaranteed, even with the crazy specs it has. If you're going to spend that much you might as well stick with a Mac. At least you'll get at minimum 7-10 year use out of it. After the Pixel EOL, The only way I would even consider a Pixelbook right now is if Google flat out announces a commitment to a 7-10 year software support strategy for it.

The HP Chromebook X2 or the Samsung Chromebook Pro would be the highest I would pay for one and only if I was going to use it daily. There are also cheaper alternatives out there. Personally, I wouldn't spend more than $200 for one.

Printer wise, you need a cloud print enabled printer. Epson's are cheap, are very easy to setup, and their scanners can scan directly to Google Drive out of the box, but it is an inkjet so if you don't print often it will dry up and then it's toss the printer time, so buy an Epson XP-440 all in one for $50 and only if you really need to print. HP and Canon's also have printers that are cloud print capable, but tend to be harder to setup and can be more expensive.

Annualized price if it breaks 2 weeks in

[tepples]

Do you really care on a cheap Chromebook? If it's a several thousand dollar piece of kit and/or you are on a tight budget I get it

If, say, the power jack breaks two weeks in, then I've paid $200 for a computer that lasted two weeks. How can I prevent its $200 replacement from having, say, a keyboard problem two weeks later? In the limiting case, that is an annualized price of $5,200 per year to own a computer. Does that qualify as "several thousand dollar piece of kit"?

Does anyone actually offer a 2 year warranty on a Chromebook?

I don't know whether that's offered for Chromebooks in third quarter 2018. I was referring to the 2-year Dell extended warranty that I bought in March 2010 along with a non-Chromebook netbook. I ended up getting its power jack fixed under warranty.

Re:Annualized price if it breaks 2 weeks in

[PCM2]

If, say, the power jack breaks two weeks in, then I've paid $200 for a computer that lasted two weeks.

Coincidentally, the only machine I've owned where the power jack broke was a Chromebook. Cheap plastic case cracked at the same time.

Otherwise, while it worked, it was a perfectly pleasant device to use. I was expecting it to piss me off with the things it couldn't do, but it turns out that while I'm drinking my coffee in the morning, there's very little that I want to do that doesn't involve a browser.

Re:Why pay to loose your privacy

[Oswald McWeany]

As he says in the article, there are security aspects that appeal to him. You get tired after a while of hearing about all the Microsoft and Linux vulns.

My kids all got Chromebooks as their first laptop for that very reason; I don't want them getting spyware and viruses, and whereas that is still possible with a chromebook, it is less likely.

Re:Why pay to loose your privacy

[Oswald McWeany]

But the guy is already on a freakin' Mac, thus he should be using macOS - why are you bringing up Windows and Linux?

There's about a $1000 difference between a good Mac and a good Chromebook laptop. He would certainly be more familiar with macOS having a Max; and a Mac could certainly do a lot more things. But $1000 is a lot of overhead if you don't need to do those extra things.

Chromebooks are not for everyone; they can't do everything; but I suspect they do enough for 90% of the population.

Blatantly incorrect information

[ilsaloving]

I stopped reading when it talked about having your passwords exposed if someone got to your local copy of 1password. He clearly has no idea what he's talking about.

Having Google manage your passwords is like having a fox guard the henhouse. 1Password encrypts everything at rest, and you have to put in your master password to access your database. By default it auto-locks again after just a few minutes. The only way someone would be able to get into your 1Password vault would be if you set your master password the same as a previously hacked account. And if you did that, then you missed the entire point of having a password manager.

If a Chromebook servers the author's needs, then all the power to him. I just can't wait to see him melt down when his internet connection goes down.

(How the heck do you develop on the web anyway? Unless he works exclusively in Javascript I don't see how that would work)

Re:Why pay to loose your privacy

[Oswald McWeany]

It never made any sense to me why you would pay for hardware just to loose your privacy. I do all my computing on my local machine. I'd gladly pay extra to control my data. Now if Google were to pay people to use the Chromebooks, that would be another thing. Then you would go into it with open eyes and as a somewhat equal business partner.

Microsoft- logs all sorts of information about you and invades your privacy.
Google- logs all sorts of information about you and invades your privacy.
Apple- logs all sorts of information about you and invades your privacy.

They're all doing it; pick who you trust raping your privacy the most, or acknowledge there isn't really a safe choice between those three and use some other factor to decide your laptop.

Re:Why pay to loose your privacy

[Attila Dimedici]

I don't want them getting spyware

So, you bought them a computer which comes with spyware preinstalled.

Why Linux inside Chrome when you can have Linux

[freq301]

Do you really need a computer that signs you into a corporate social network every time you want to read the news or talk to friends? Do you really trust companies that keep getting caught for not enforcing the privacy that their Terms promise? Using a Chromebook as your main machine is like trusting your brother with your girlfriend; you might be okay and then again, you might never know what really happened.

Re:Why pay to loose your privacy

[SisterFister]

There is a big difference between those three.

Microsoft and Apple sell a lot of shit, information is not their primary source of income.
Googles primary source of income is your information.

They are not all doing the same thing, not even close. Try requesting the information they have collected about you from those 3, the one from Google will be substantially longer and more detailed than the other 2 combined.

Re:Why pay to loose your privacy

[TheFakeTimCook]

Microsoft- logs all sorts of information about you and invades your privacy.
Google- logs all sorts of information about you and invades your privacy.
Apple- logs all sorts of information about you and invades your privacy.

But there's a BIG difference:
Microsoft: Does ALL sorts of trickery to keep you from "opting out" of Privacy-Stealing and "Telemetry".

Google: Logs your entire life, EVEN WHEN YOU TELL IT NOT TO!

Apple: Only DISSEMINATES Differentially-Anonymized Data, states CLEARLY what Data they collect, and ALLOWS YOU TO OPT-OUT.

https://www.apple.com/legal/pr...

Don't do it

[discowriter]

I had a first-generation Chromebook for five years. Google did not honour its promise for "Fast Web" when it changed to the Aura desktop interface, which seemed to cut the performance in half. I've also been using a variety of Chromebooks at Best Buys, but mostly the Pixelbook, which is very overpriced for what you get. I know the typical laptop or desktop computer has its annoyances, especially with Windows updates or just a lot of extra stuff you might not think you need, and there are some obvious advantages with Chromebooks like quick updates, great security, and simplicity of the operating system... but you shouldn't trust Google with everything. Nor should you be stuck with the Chrome web browser as your central operating system. Just run Linux, run whatever browser you want, and stay in control of your own computer. You should be more concerned with privacy than you are with convenience. Chromebooks are okay, don't get me wrong. I just wouldn't want to use one as my primary computing device again. I'd rather get a cheap, used laptop, install Linux, and have it my way... NOT Google's.

You can have my Chromebook

[Proudrooster]

Hi...
I have all six devices:
1. iPhone
2. iPad
3. Yoga Laptop Running Win10
4. MacBook Pro
5. Chromebook
6. Multibook Desktop WIndows or OS/X

Out of all the devices, the Chromebook is the most useless device. It reminds me of the modern dumb terminal that needs to connect back to the mainframe to get any work done. I seldom use it.

If you are just a consumer user: surf the web, use web services, and have a good WIFI connection, the Chromebook could be the device for you. If you are planning to create, possibly make a video, music, program, or do anything CPU intensive, it is a lost cause. Working as a school consultant, the #1 request I get every year is how do to shoot and edit video on a Chromebook, short answer is, you don't.

Ranking my computing devices in order of usefulness:
1. Desktop
2. MacBook Pro (love the retina display and trackpad, best, period, not in love with the keyboard)
3. Yoga (Whoever designed this keyboard should never be allowed to design again, trackpad ok, lacking useful ports, touchscreen and tablet mode are mostly useless)
4. iPad (I can use it as a computer in a pinch, it is just harder)
5. iPhone (Like an iPad only smaller)
6. Chromebook (In your right hand you have nothing, in your left hand you have a Chromebook, the Chromebook is slightly better than nothing)

The only time I ever use the Chromebook is when I have to train others how to use a Chromebook. Usually the limitations of the device surface quickly.