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Elon Musk Takes a Fatalistic View Toward AI (youtube.com)
Elon Musk sat down with California comedian Joe Rogan on Thursday evening for a 2 1/2-hour podcast [YouTube video] that touched upon everything from flamethrowers and artificial intelligence to the end of the universe. Talking about AI, a subject Musk has long been very vocal about, he said artificial intelligence could turn out to be terrible or it could end up being great, but one thing that is certain is that it will be beyond human's control. From a report: "You kind of have to be optimistic about the future. There's no point in being pessimistic," said the head of Tesla and SpaceX. "I rather be optimistic and wrong, than pessimistic and right. [...] It's not necessarily bad, but it's going to be outside of human control. It's going to be very tempting to use AI as a weapon, said Musk. "It will be used as a weapon. The on ramp to serious AI will be more humans using it against eachother. That will be the danger."
Musk says he has tried to convince people to slow down where AI is concerned and regulate it, but nobody listened. "The way that regulation works is slow. Usually there will be some new technology that will cause damage or death, there will be an outcry, there will be an investigation," said the Tesla CEO. "Years will pass, there will be some insight committee, then rule making and oversight and eventually regulations. This all takes many years. This is the normal course of things." Musk used the example that it took ten years for seatbelts to become required, even though the number of deaths were obvious. He says this time frame doesn't work for AI. "We can't wait ten years to the point where something is dangerous to do something about AI. It will be too late," said Musk.
Musk says he has tried to convince people to slow down where AI is concerned and regulate it, but nobody listened. "The way that regulation works is slow. Usually there will be some new technology that will cause damage or death, there will be an outcry, there will be an investigation," said the Tesla CEO. "Years will pass, there will be some insight committee, then rule making and oversight and eventually regulations. This all takes many years. This is the normal course of things." Musk used the example that it took ten years for seatbelts to become required, even though the number of deaths were obvious. He says this time frame doesn't work for AI. "We can't wait ten years to the point where something is dangerous to do something about AI. It will be too late," said Musk.
Alternative headline: Joker and Joe Rogan sit down for cerebral masturbation.
Quite seriously, don't get me wrong, but wake me when we ever come up with something we call AI that deserves the name. Just because we know what intelligence is doesn't mean we have any idea how to do it.
Everyone knows what a saxophone is. If someone points at a saxophone, you'll be able to say that yes, this is a saxophone. But tasked with drawing one, completely, with all the valves and holes and everything in place, usually it would take someone who actually builds such things to do it right.
Our problem is that nobody has built intelligence yet, so there ain't anyone to ask. Yes, we all know what intelligence is like. We can point to it if we see it. But building one is a completely different beast.
And so far, we failed miserably at it.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
But he's a billionaire so it's called "eccentric". Sort of like Elizabeth Holmes and her fraud.
Corporatism != Free Market
But he's a billionaire so it's called "eccentric". Sort of like Elizabeth Holmes and her fraud.
And he apparently smoked pot during the interview...
The newswires are all ablaze right now about Musk smoking pot in public(*), noting that the stock is down 5% in pre-market trading, and sure enough the stock is down 16 points today.
I admit that seems pretty stupid on his part.
(*) Which is apparently legal in the time and place where he did it, but still...
If you think that intelligence is based in material objects (no spirits and ghosts etc.) and if you think that evolution is a natural and unstoppable process "built into" any "materialistic", physical universe, than the conclusion can only be: Humans are just one step on the ladder of biological evolution, and very probably the last biological one. The next step will be "artificial" intelligence, evolving itself faster than we ever could, designing its material basis according to its needs (e.g., being a submarine, a space ship, a robot for different worlds out there to survive under conditions no human could ever survive etc.). It would not have to start to learn from the beginning, it would not have to carry its "biossphere" around with itself, it would be able to use any kind of energy source, not just "eatable" stuff etc. Why should modern humans be anything different than any earlier species in the evolution like Homo erectus or Neanderthals?
For the record:
* The whole sequence started out with Musk asking, "Is that a joint?" Just like your average hardcore pothead who doesn't know what a joint looks like, right?
* After a reminder that it's legal in California, Musk hesitantly takes it, examines it, then takes a tiny puff, then shakes his head no.
* Comments start filling up the Youtube thread from actual pot smokers complaining:
OZGUN ST-PIERRE: Dudeeee wtf he didn’t inhale
tg300050 he didnt inhale
Samuel Gobrecht +OZGUN ST-PIERRE some people just dont like how it makes them feel
Obviously he doesn't know how to smoke
NO T H O T S NOOOO ****ING WAY
Geo Hurtado Inhale!!!!
* Topic changes back to cars.
* Later, topic changes back to pot. The conversation is, to quote:
OMG, pillory him!
They carry weapons and they know if you've been bad or good. Not everybody's good, but everyone tries.
Can someone please explain to me why artificial intelligence is supposedly somehow any more terrifying than natural intelligence already is when the latter is applied to nefarious ends, and why it should ever be assumed that any general purpose AI would be somehow likely to have an agenda that we would actually consider to be corrupt or wrong?
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Yes, but the chief accountant of the company also just stepped down. That's a bad look for a company with a questionable financial outlook and that has been facing a steady stream of high-level departures. I'm guessing that investors care far more about that than they do whether a Silicon Valley executive tried cannabis.
Um no, he first called him a pedophile, THEN he waited a week, then apologized, then last week he suddenly started calling him a "child rapist". That isn't normal. It wasn't a one time thing. You fanboys are like Trump apologists. Completely nuts. You have any excuse for bad behavior. You are right about one thing: he has no knowledge of engineering or anything.
And the only thing the Independent deemed newsworthy was Elon Musk taking a single hit from a joint proffered by Rogan.
Elon Musk smokes cannabis during interview with Joe Rogan, before imagining what it's like to be a horse
At the risk of being called a Tesla shill again, I don't think most people are 'fanboys' or 'apologists'. Elon is heading some pretty great tech stuff - you know, the kind that get's most of the Slashdot audience excited. Space travel, electric vehicles that look very nice, tunnel boring. Ok, that last one is less exciting but the thought of underground tunnels and high-speed travel is still cool by tech standards
Does he say stuff that is unbecoming? Sure. I think most of us do. Should we expect more from someone in his position of authority and influence? Sure, it'd be nice but in the grand scheme of things, he's not tearing babies from parents or filling the coffers of his corrupt buddies so the Trump comparisons are weird on your part
It's also clear that he DOES, in fact, possess a lot of knowledge on engineering. He can talk pretty well on space travel, battery density etc. Much more so than the average layperson. He's surrounded by smart people, he's smart, I'm sure being in the company of genius' has led him to gaining engineering knowledge through osmosis.
You clearly don't like the guy, and that's fine but you need to be a bit more transparent as to why or maybe open yourself to the idea that he's not quite the monster you'd like him to be?
I listened to the interview and I gotta say, I've seen many people exhibit the same behavior/characteristics after having a severe lack of sleep. I work in an industry where sometimes people will only get an hour or two of sleep a day, for a few days straight. It is very bizarre listening to someone who is normally super intelligent and eloquent jump on a conference call and ramble incoherently. Most of us recognize it immediately (since it's happened to us) and jump in to continue the conversation but the person isn't even aware they're not making sense.
Speak to them afterwards and they feel they were completely lucid in their opinion but you still tell them, "No guy, you were mixing up your words and kept drifting topic to topic"
He's already admitted he's working long hours. It'd be nice if he got a break from the very people who probably identify with working crappy conditions and long hours.