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New Custom Linux Distro is Systemd-Free, Debian-Based, and Optimized for Windows 10 (mspoweruser.com)
An anonymous reader quotes MSPowerUser:
Nearly every Linux distro is already available in the Microsoft Store, allowing developers to use Linux scripting and other tools running on the Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL). Now another distro has popped up in the Store, and unlike the others it claims to be specifically optimised for WSL, meaning a smaller and more appropriate package with sane defaults which helps developers get up and running faster.
WLinux is based on Debian, and the developer, Whitewater Foundry, claims their custom distro will also allow faster patching of security and compatibility issues that appear from time to time between upstream distros and WSL... Popular development tools, including git and python3, are pre-installed. Additional packages can be easily installed via the apt package management system... A handful of unnecessary packages, such as systemd, have been removed to improve stability and security.
The distro also offers out of the box support for GUI apps with your choice of X client, according to the original submission.
WLinux is open source under the MIT license, and is available for free on GitHub. It can also be downloaded from Microsoft Store at a 50% discount, with the development company promising the revenue will be invested back into new features.
WLinux is based on Debian, and the developer, Whitewater Foundry, claims their custom distro will also allow faster patching of security and compatibility issues that appear from time to time between upstream distros and WSL... Popular development tools, including git and python3, are pre-installed. Additional packages can be easily installed via the apt package management system... A handful of unnecessary packages, such as systemd, have been removed to improve stability and security.
The distro also offers out of the box support for GUI apps with your choice of X client, according to the original submission.
WLinux is open source under the MIT license, and is available for free on GitHub. It can also be downloaded from Microsoft Store at a 50% discount, with the development company promising the revenue will be invested back into new features.
People actually use systemd?
Sign me up for stupidity!
When a distribution is configured to use systemd it takes the place of initd as the initializing process. It is not something you can simply uninstall. It runs as the first process in the kernel. You have to rebuild the entire distribution to go back to initd.
Because devuan has existed for 4-6 years now and does exactly that.
What was the point in replying to this?
th eunderside os spies on you while you use the non spyware one and think your safe rofl
ya this is like nsa dream
Have its developers adopted the Code of Conduct?
Because if not, SEXISM!!!!!
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
No thanks. Why install a neutered version on Windows when you can replace Windows itself with something better?
What the heck are MS trying to do?
The thing is GPL and available on GitHub...
What exctly are MS charging for?
Is that actually allowed onder GPL2?
windowsd?
Ubuntu on WSL is free. And it doesnâ(TM)t use systemd.
Running Linux in a Virtual machine under Windows is nothing new. In my opinion, if you're going to run two operating systems together in this fashion, this is the preferred direction to do it, because Linux traditionally runs waaaay better as a guest than Windows does.
But in the real world, at least my experience, there's not a lot of usefulness to this. It's not like there's anything Linux can do, that Windows cannot do natively. And for the somewhat rare circumstances that a Linux-like utility is needed, like, grep, or perl, or something like that, I've always found cygwin is the best solution for this sort of niche of Linux tools within Windows.
So is this actually more useful than cygwin?
How can it be under MIT license when gnu/Linux and most userland programs are GPL? I didn't read the whole article so maybe I missed something
Nobody cares! We see what you're doing! Go to some MCSE forum or something!
There is an outdated opensuse, and no fedora at all. How about a few distros?
but you never mentioned the CoC.
lol as if.
Nearly.
Or can you only think in extremes?
Yes, but there are systemd-free clones. Have Debian but hate systemd? You can "upgrade" to Devuan, which is mostly a straight copy of Debian but without systemd.
Or if you Arch is your thing, consider upgrading to Artix. Maintaining a distro where systemd is the only difference isn't that hard, You set up for sysvinit or one of the other fancy init programs - and simply import all the other software packages.
Linux Subsystem for Windows (LSW)??
They've been difficult to maintain, partly because systemd is now also replacing syslog and publishing logs in a binary, distinct format from the more easily read flat text formats.
Gentoo and Funtoo also officially support open-rc at install/build time. I've been perfectly happy with it this way using xfce and plasma.
One of the big things Linux zealots like to yell about is how you only install what you want. How about just don't install systemd? And if you did, just delete it? Seriously, I don't understand.
Right, you don't understand. The people who come to hate on systemd don't have the technical skills to choose for themselves, because it is OS functionality. And the distros, who employ people who understand that stuff, want the advantages of systemd because they do understand what it is and what it does.
... went like this:
- 'bladibla without systemd....'
- yeah! Awesome! No systemd! ...
- ' .... bladibla ... optimised for Windows 10 ...'
- 'Oh bummer. Oh well, nevermind.'
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
It's not the default in all of those.
It's not the default in Gentoo anyway. An actual Linux, not a macOS/Windows clone by people who havr forgotten the whole damn points of having a Linux/Unix system, to suck up to the Eternal September WhatWG iTards.
It is a binary format that is easy to parse from C, and also, there are existing command-line included that remove the formatting for you.
If easy things seem hard, you might be a systemd hater.
It’s almost as if the people that are experts in setting up init systems are choosing to use systemd based on its merits.
I was interested until I hit the part that said "optimized for Windows 10". Any interest that I had was lost at that point. Linux was never intended and should not ever be run in a VM or any other way with the Windows 10 Spy/Virus!
LOL. Yea, why didn't you tell us how to do it if it's so easy.
You are delusional. Systemd has rotted your mind calling everyone haters. You seem like a bitter old man. Maybe get checked out. This is what systemd has done to you.
They want it because it makes their jobs easier. They want it to be just like windows. You are a tool.
Microsoft police arrested this man. Let it be a warning to all you haters.
Systemd is like Windows... a virus.
You mean most of the other distros leave you running both Windows 10 and systemd at the same time?
So is this pretty much GNU / NT, maybe it shouldn't be called a linux distribution -- in order news where are the flying pigs? :)
WSL and this distro do not even have Linux, the kernel. It's a GNU system running on top of Windows, there is no Linux at all. Calling it "Linux" is wrong and misleading.
I believe you've missed my point. My point is that the upstream versions of these tools in most Linux operating systems have switched to systemd based logging, creating or maintaining a non-systemd based system is extra work. Switching away from systemd also means that monitoring tools designed to parse the distinct, binary, format means maintaining distinct, text based monitoring and log analysis tools. This all costs time and, for commercial projects, money.
"Easy things" that must be done repeatedly and customized, and kept compatible with the often unstable behavior of systemd, are additional work If I may say, one of the tasks that pays my salary is cleaning up after "simple matters of programming" that were badly done, did not report errors, did not catch edge cases, and which the author intended should simply be modified on the fly as needed. But then the author neglected to state what they were doing, and the API between one tool and another were never documented, and chaos occurred when those "simple matters of programming" interacted very badly. This has been occurring especially often lately with the Python 2 to Python 3 upgrades occurring in various operating systems. Stable tools, _including log analysis tools for systemd_, broke silently.
I'd especially like to see any code that would publish log reports to an analysis database, and how they handle logs with punctuation and MySQL commands embedded in them. I'm thinking of the XKCD cartoon titled "Exploits of a Mom", at https://xkcd.com/327/
They've been difficult to maintain, partly because systemd is now also replacing syslog and publishing logs in a binary, distinct format from the more easily read flat text formats.
Rsyslog replaced syslog about a decade ago and afaik there is no distro without it in the default install.
That is a good point. The configurations are still very similar, as is the format. My career predates rsyslogd by long enough that I still think "syslog" as the format, much as I think of "apache" rather than the technically correct "httpd" software name of the software.
Will that silly shutdown ritual then go away?
This routine sucks! Waiting for<ever>.... I resort to # init 0, which seems to go quicker.
Dunno which brainchild this was. When I am done, I am done and want to go - this thing takes forever, seemingly several minutes with countdown displayed.
Who originated this nonsense?
Artix make games. You probably meant antiX.
No nearly about it. Head over to distrowatch.com, and then count how many of the ones listed there (feel free to restrict it to actively developed ones) are available are available to run under WSL.
There is 0 Linux code involved in this. It's not Linux. It's some terrible Frankenstein thing that Microsoft and the ""Linux Foundation"" have colluded to let happen.
Embrace. Extend. Extinguish.
That is a good point. The configurations are still very similar, as is the format. My career predates rsyslogd by long enough that I still think "syslog" as the format, much as I think of "apache" rather than the technically correct "httpd" software name of the software.
Do you know of any distro that has removed flat text logs in favor of binary logs?
> The distro also offers out of the box support for GUI apps with your choice of X client
Sigh. After all these years, people still can't keep it straight. You'll need your choice of X *server*. . .
How is it under MIT? Linux is GPL. You can't just release another distro and change the license to MIT.
WFT?
Can't speak for the third fellow, but yes. It is great.
!Equality through palindromes semordnilap hguorht ytilauqE!
...svchost? I hear that's the superior process.
Having a non-default choice is more work?! Oh, noes!
It divides those that have a use case for the choice, and those that don't. The ones with a use case already chose something else, and did whatever small amount of work was required to make the move, and the people without a use case just made crude noises about it.
If you need long-term feature stability, choose a system that provides that. I hear none of the BSDs have systemd, and they're not known for changing things very often.
"Nearly every Linux distro is already available in the Microsoft Store"
None of which will run as full stand-alone distros. SuSE Linux, Kali & Debian does not count as nearly every Linux distro. Here's a real link to every Linix Distro
This seems like an excellent attempt at profiting from WSL off the back of Microsoft. His true profit model is having Microsoft buy him out if it gains popularity on the Microsoft Store.
I say good on him. All he needs to do is write a Win32 native Wayland compositor and he can have all the apps cleanly render high performance natively and one actually has a bridge to creating Microsoft Linux as a distro.
Not because it allows better tracking of processes, the ability to cleanly polyinstantiate things like /tmp and /var, removal of unnecessary privileges, offers the benefit of xinetd without drawbacks, prevents processes from hogging all system resources (e.g. fork bombs), allows for easier jailing of at risk daemons etc? Almost forgot to mention, it is also working to provide a trusted path method of elevating privileges without having to use SUID, thus eliminating the need for stuff like su to be SUID root.
Seriously, people need to learn WHY itâ(TM)s so damn good. Linux has a lot of neat APIs that when used properly crap all over the competition. We need to start using them.
"And the distros, who employ people who understand that stuff, want the advantages of systemd because they do understand what it is and what it does."
I don't think this is really a fair argument. Firstly, most distros don't "employ" anybody because most don't have paid employees.
Secondly, if you look at the background of each Systemd implementation it's never really the way you describe. For example with Debian the systemd vote was a 2 vs. 2 tie and had to be overruled by a single person. Hardly a landslide victory for systemd. Many people quit contributing to Debian just because of how this was handled internally.
Patrick Volkerding (founder, of Slackware infamy) was at least more or less against systemd but the last I read of his stance was basically "well, I don't really want to switch to systemd but it seems like the writing is already on the wall" that's the vibe. I think this is more or less how the switches have been happening.
I was an Arch user when their switch happened and if you read all the links on the Forum and wiki the answer basically is "we switched because of, well, reasons." Sort of like a movie that ends without closing the plot.
It is a clever move. Look at audio/video support, look at 3D graphics support etc. If it takes off among Windows users, it would allow for him to provide a distro that âoejust worksâ in terms of desktop Windows integration.
As long as his code doesnâ(TM)t pollute upstream projects itâ(TM)s a business model that will help people port/test/compile their traditionally Windows-only software for Linux - one day maybe even games...
One guy shit on all the work a huge number of others did and replaced an entire portion of the system, taking everything but the kitchen sink into one set of functionality, entirely contrary to design principles that Linux normally uses. That kid has no idea what he's doing.
Last time I ran Ubuntu under WSL it didn't use any init system at all. No upstart, no systemd. It's similar to how wine works. Wine does not actually go through a windows startup routine when you fire it up to run a program. Instead of creates an environment and spawns the executable.
Unless my Windows 10 install is hopelessly out of date (it could be), running a linux binary under WSL shows just 2 processes: init and the binary. And the init process is just something in the WSL emulation layer; it's not upstart or systemd.
So I guess I'm confused about this announcement. It's like how they advertise margarine as gluten free.
I am confused. Is not the MIT license MORE permissive than the one under which GNU licenses its tools, and under which the Linux kernel itself is licensed, which would seem, (and I confess I could be wrong about this,) to be at least one though probably MANY violations of the GPL? Or am I mistaken about the MIT license? Has some version of these tools been released under a more permissive license?
you can add your own... go for it!
probably more accurate to say 'the distros used by nearly all linux users are already available in the Microsoft Store".
Personally, I LIKE for my OS to be tailored to me and my computer. I'm, not sure why you think not having people use the exact same setup as me is somehow a strike against it.
Don't tell me, you're one of those mentally lazy/incompetent people who like pre-chewed, pre-fabricated, one-true-way products that everyone has, right? Choice is just a horrible thing.
Suse 15 does not install rsyslog by default.
If you think building something new "shits on" all of history simply by containing intended improvements, you're an idiot.
Even if I thought the software sucked, you'd still be a dumbfuck who doesn't know why they hate it, and lists reasons that are measurable and untrue.
If there's no sound then it's not any different than setting up any other Linux environment under Windows.
Hey, let's party like it's 1999!
I'll fire up some VMS, Tru-64, Solaris, hey - some BSD! Drive to the party in a Corvair. Let's get this party rolling!
In an era where people trying to air gap from Windows, why would you? I smell Microsoft money.
How can i get to Devuan from Mint?
So the WSL environment is more flexible in that regard as an end-user desktop system. Broader driver support, broader application support and the ability to run powerful UNIX-like tools. In a corporate environment where I'm not concerned about telemetry stuff it's great.
Are you being disingenuous or just stupid? On any client Linux distro that won't work because they are all so poorly put together that they end up with a bunch of dependencies on the init system. Go on, try and do that on Mint and see what happens.
because when you run linux on windows wsl your main concerns are stability and security!
i would say systemd should be nowhere on the top of your list of issues in that setup.
On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
I love everything in the title just not the Windows 10 part.
Here. Here! ;)
Gently reminds all of you about Devuan Linux, which uses SysV-style init and also supports openRC.